i don't see the benefit of me doing my own work anymore. - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

gundamzeta · 06-13-2005, 03:48 AM

I've been looking around, and the market price for an S13 with a SR20DET and/ or other mods goes for around 6-8 thousand dollars.

I'll probably be spending that much if I decide to start another project S13 agian, but starting a project and doing my own work will come at a great cost of time and and even greater opportunity cost-- I make a decent wage at my stable job, I make more money with my own business and I'm pursuing a Doctorate in economics.
Doing my own work doesn't make sense anymore.
I'd rather be driving my car into the ground than working on it anyways.

Sil Beer S13 · 06-13-2005, 03:51 AM

^ Weak!

The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters

gundamzeta · 06-13-2005, 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sil Beer S13

^ Weak!

realizing that time and resources are scarce and limited is a sign of weakness?

I can do my own work, but I don't find any pleasure in doing it, and when i had my old CA18DET fastback, I only did my own work because I couldn't afford it.

I like driving. I like drifting. I like going to auto-x, and I like driving around the Central valley's many touge-like mount passes.

What I don't like to do is pull my car apart and figuring out what's wrong, or WORKING on it hours. it's not hard for to do, I just hate doing it.

I'm a better at driving than I am at mechanics, and I think it's best to specialize in not only what i'm better at but what I enjoy more.

kandyflip445 · 06-13-2005, 04:16 AM

If you can afford it and don't like working on the car then by all means get a good shop to work on it. Screw people that tell you it's weak. Why the fuck would you wrench on your car if you didn't enjoy it or feel any satisfaction? Take it to a shop and then get out and drive.

broken_s13 · 06-13-2005, 04:53 AM

I personally feel like every car person should work on on their own cars. How can you say you actually built the car if all you did was pay some guy at a shop to do all the work. There isnt any sence of accomplishment or joy when u drive around a car that you havent put hard work, sweat, and time into.

sw20>>s14 · 06-13-2005, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundamzeta

realizing that time and resources are scarce and limited is a sign of weakness?

I can do my own work, but I don't find any pleasure in doing it, and when i had my old CA18DET fastback, I only did my own work because I couldn't afford it.

I like driving. I like drifting. I like going to auto-x, and I like driving around the Central valley's many touge-like mount passes.

What I don't like to do is pull my car apart and figuring out what's wrong, or WORKING on it hours. it's not hard for to do, I just hate doing it.

I'm a better at driving than I am at mechanics, and I think it's best to specialize in not only what i'm better at but what I enjoy more.

i understand what your saying, but it just wont feel the same...when you work on your own car, you have the benefit of having piece of mind...i work on my own car, i might take an hour for a half an hour job, but i do it right and i do it thouroughly. no one can be as meticulous as the owner. not even the best mechanic...if something goes wrong, i most likely will know what exactly it is and who to blame: me. so i wont have to stress about feeling i got jacked from a shop...there are plenty of good shops that do good work...but it just wont be the same...too impersonal for me IMO. im the laziest bum in the world and i somehow get my shit done...if i could do it you definitely can...just my 2

*revat619* · 06-13-2005, 05:14 AM

^^^

I see your point, but i understand where gundamzeta is coming from as well. I think it just depends on the person. As long as the person really drives (i.e. has a reason behind buying the mods the have and not just to be "cool"), thats all that really matters to me. I dont know all the ends and outs of a 240, so if i dont how to do something exactly, i always have my more knowledgeable friends help me out with the install.

For example, I readily admit that i HATE wiring. I wont even waste my time with it cuz i know i dont have the patience for it. Plus, i dont know enough about electrical anyways. I dont trust myself not to screw it up. So i always have somebody else do that crap.

420sx · 06-13-2005, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundamzeta

blah blah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahbl ahblahblahblah blahblah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

you do realize YOU sound like those porshe, vette and ferrari drivers now? the true "car enthusiasts".....

even when i have my degree finished i will do my own work. u never know what is done to the car if its not YOU. you break something - oh well! you learn from that experience. time? eveyone has time, its like saying "i got no time to work out". bullshit.

420sx · 06-13-2005, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revat619

^^^

For example, I readily admit that i HATE wiring. crap.

i do agree with you on things that i hate to. BUt i learned how to do it anyway.

the way i handle shit i cant do since i never done it before... i let it sit, since i refuse, since im so stuborn, to take it to some shop to let them fuck it up even more. so i let it sit and sit, dont do shit, till it has to be done or i finally decided to do it. and i will do it. will take me time, and parts, since i break shit quite often - impatience and muscle. but i will get it done. i will finish it. and learn from it. well thats all to say about working on the car yourself.

Replicant_S14 · 06-13-2005, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundamzeta

realizing that time and resources are scarce and limited is a sign of weakness?.

No. When you get to the point where you can put a specific dollar amount on your time then it's entirely reasonable.

420sx · 06-13-2005, 08:45 AM

^ like $5.15 an hour?

MakotoS13 · 06-13-2005, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 420sx

impatience and muscle. but i will get it done. i will finish it. and learn from it.

correct. i've broken many a bolt due to my sheer manliness.

*Yuri* · 06-13-2005, 09:03 AM

If you can afford to have a good shop work on it, and most of the work you do on the car is no longer enjoyable, then by all means let someone else do your work. Some stuff on my car I love to do, other stuff I hate. I think a big turning point for me was when I had to change the head gasket on my supra. Since then, I have graduated college, and have a nice job, but would rather spend the weekends driving or with my friends than changing my turbo gaskets again or figuring out a shorting wiring harness. By eliminating the "busy work" on my car, it makes it that more enjoyable when I do work on my car, putting on or repairing something that's much more fun to do. It becomes something I can set aside time for, rather than having to make time for. It is also more fun to make it a social event, working on my s13 with all my s13 owning friends than spending until the early hours of the morning on a work night covered in oil or transmission fluid. Just because you pay a reputable shop to do work that you would not look forward to doing does not mean you aren't capable of doing that work.

the head · 06-13-2005, 09:35 AM

It all depends on your view on working on cars i prefer working on more simplistic cars or ones that have been stripped down for ease of work
I am a car collector and I have my own shop to maintain my vehciles but some shit i hate working on and there are some jobs i don't like to do

I hate changing oil so i dont do it anymore
and some of the other cars are such a bitch to work on that i dont get any pleasure from it. the 240 though is great and really easy to work on I love fixing it as much as i love breaking it.

ZK · 06-13-2005, 10:04 AM

I totally agree. What is your time worth to you? Basically when you pay to have someone else do it is what you are paying for - their expertise and time. My friends and I have all wrenched on our cars before either because of lack of money or just to learn how to do something.

Now I'd rather spend my time driving and hanging out with friends than underneath my car. I can afford to pay someone who knows a lot more about the car than myself to work on it and it saves me time to do other things I like as well. I spent 2 years waiting to drive my car because I didn't have the money to do it right the 1st time and tinkered around with it myself. Now I can drive it and I don't want to worry about little things anymore that will stop me from driving it whenever I have time to go drive.

I still enjoy doing things like changing the oil or brakes/suspension - the stuff that I can set aside time for and not have to do immediately. The engine and electrical work I leave to the experts.

sepulchral · 06-13-2005, 10:13 AM

the simple satisfaction of knowing how your cars were built and what corners were/weren't cut is why i build my own

infinitexsound · 06-13-2005, 12:33 PM

wow i think its time to upgrade, why do u still own "the poor mans ferrari?" if your seriously making alot of money like u say u are....... buy a new car.. so you wouldnt have to fix things so much...

Yoshi · 06-13-2005, 01:49 PM

Wow. what's with all the haters?

Let's look from a different perspective. Barring rally (cuz there are different rules there, those guys have to know how to fix stuff mid-race on their own til help arrives... all of which means lost time), pretty much EVERY professional motorsport doesn't have their driver as the head of their pit crew. It just makes sense. Less time wrenching = more time for practice/racing. F1, NASCAR, enduro, doesn't really matter. Does Jeff Gordon work on his car? No way, he has ppl for that. Could he do it himself, of course! But that's not the most efficient way to run a team.

If he's got the money, more power to him.
Maybe he doesn't like Ferrari people...
Maybe he can afford the work done to a 240 vs. something more expensive.... makes sense doesn't it?

You haters shouldn't be mad just because he has the spare cash to save himself some skinned knuckles and wrench time. If I spent less time wrenching and more time doing other things (like my wife? hahaha), my lil woman would be much happier... she'd rather ride around than watch me cuss at my car anyhow

It's all about where your priorities are.
Spend accordingly.

justinhustle · 06-13-2005, 02:10 PM

to me, knowing i can do it is enough sometimes

however lately i dont trust anyone, so ive been working on my cars, my girls, and my familys

which leaves the 240 last =/

i should charge for my time!

MakotoS13 · 06-13-2005, 02:14 PM

correct, if i had the finances i'd pay a shop to put an ls2 in my car. however, since i'm not rich i dont. i just happen to enjoy working on my car as well as driving it.

different strokes for different folks. deal.

holisticbeatz · 06-13-2005, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundamzeta

i don't see the benefit of me doing my own work anymore.

I agree.. somewhat.

If I can do it myself while saving a lot of $$ and I have all the tools I need for the job, then I would do it. Otherwise, I'd rather someone do it for me.

I don't even do my own oil changes anymore. Its too much trouble.

I change my oil with not a wrench but with a credit card.

TheSnail · 06-13-2005, 03:12 PM

It takes 8hrs to install a sr, and it would cost you 1200 for a shop to install it. You have failed econ if you cant see its the same as you making $150per hour if you do it your self. Im sure you dont make half of that perhour. Maybe not even a fourth.

420sx · 06-13-2005, 04:07 PM

i can guarantee my second sr swap wont take more than a day. including prep and pulling old engine out. once u "know-how" its a piece of cake. now harness is different, no need to rush there

infinitexsound · 06-13-2005, 04:14 PM

Engine Swaps Are EASY, I just hate wiring

ZK · 06-13-2005, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSnail

It takes 8hrs to install a sr, and it would cost you 1200 for a shop to install it. You have failed econ if you cant see its the same as you making $150per hour if you do it your self. Im sure you dont make half of that perhour. Maybe not even a fourth.

That's assuming you knew how to do it in the first place. You don't count the time it takes to learn how to swap a motor + the headaches when it doesn't run if you don't know what to do and troubleshoot. Then you end up wasting hours and it ends up at the shop anyway. That's downtime some people can't afford as a daily driver.

thx247 · 06-13-2005, 05:41 PM

Sounds good to me, my time is more important than learning/doing certian things.

420sx · 06-13-2005, 08:08 PM

yea i dont think i will make same mistake twice on my second swap. will be alot faster. plus my first swap was a hybrid s14/13

TurDz · 06-13-2005, 08:38 PM

Yup, it really is a matter of preference, and we should all respect that if someone has a greater opportunity with his time elsewhere, and feels its a larger priority, by all means go for it.

My vehicle stability professor said to us once,

"I may have friends who know how to wrench better than me, who can weld better than me, and who can cut metal and build great race cars better than me, but in the end, all of it is based around the the typical fundamental designs of today. Once technology improves, those people will fall behind and have to re-learn a whole new way of working with cars, go to another technical college to learn the current technology, while we [engineers] are always looking forward to improve and innovate."

What he said (not in exact quotes) struck me pretty hard with the reasoning behind wanting to becoming a mechanical engineer since I was losing some motivation. And it's a prime example of what people may want to do besides wrenching/fixing cars but still stay 100% within the automotive field. His words mean a lot because he's a really intelligent professor who is very qualified in his field.

SochBAT · 06-13-2005, 09:05 PM

I don't personally trust the butthead mechs around my area, so DIY mechanics is a must.

And, i know everythin that goes into my car, and leaves it. What if you had a mech do all the work, and your car broke down in the boondocks, and can't reach a tower?

TheSnail · 06-13-2005, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurDz

Yup, it really is a matter of preference, and we should all respect that if someone has a greater opportunity with his time elsewhere, and feels its a larger priority, by all means go for it.

My vehicle stability professor said to us once,

"I may have friends who know how to wrench better than me, who can weld better than me, and who can cut metal and build great race cars better than me, but in the end, all of it is based around the the typical fundamental designs of today. Once technology improves, those people will fall behind and have to re-learn a whole new way of working with cars, go to another technical college to learn the current technology, while we [engineers] are always looking forward to improve and innovate."

What he said (not in exact quotes) struck me pretty hard with the reasoning behind wanting to becoming a mechanical engineer since I was losing some motivation. And it's a prime example of what people may want to do besides wrenching/fixing cars but still stay 100% within the automotive field. His words mean a lot because he's a really intelligent professor who is very qualified in his field.

What if your a Mechanical Engineer at GT, and since you dont have a job since HOPE pays for everything, you spend all your free time wrenchin, doing swaps, making money, doing every type of swap, and making a bunch of innovative things for the 240. Its very simple once you get the concept of what makes a car or 240 in this case. It then becomes like lego's. I dont see how wrenchin on your own car would affect your future career. In fact, for us engineers, wrenching now, will better our career in the future.

06-13-2005, 03:48 AM	#1
gundamzeta BANNED Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: stockton CA Posts: 31 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	i don't see the benefit of me doing my own work anymore. I've been looking around, and the market price for an S13 with a SR20DET and/ or other mods goes for around 6-8 thousand dollars. I'll probably be spending that much if I decide to start another project S13 agian, but starting a project and doing my own work will come at a great cost of time and and even greater opportunity cost-- I make a decent wage at my stable job, I make more money with my own business and I'm pursuing a Doctorate in economics. Doing my own work doesn't make sense anymore. I'd rather be driving my car into the ground than working on it anyways.

06-13-2005, 04:16 AM	#4
kandyflip445 Post Whore! Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Arden, NC Age: 36 Posts: 4,460 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: kandyflip445 Feedback Score: 1 reviews	If you can afford it and don't like working on the car then by all means get a good shop to work on it. Screw people that tell you it's weak. Why the fuck would you wrench on your car if you didn't enjoy it or feel any satisfaction? Take it to a shop and then get out and drive. __________________ My 240 vBgarage

06-13-2005, 04:53 AM	#5
broken_s13 Zilvia Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: pomona CA Posts: 186 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I personally feel like every car person should work on on their own cars. How can you say you actually built the car if all you did was pay some guy at a shop to do all the work. There isnt any sence of accomplishment or joy when u drive around a car that you havent put hard work, sweat, and time into. __________________

06-13-2005, 05:14 AM	#7
revat619 Retired General Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Diego Posts: 4,672 Trader Rating: (7) Feedback Score: 7 reviews	^^^ I see your point, but i understand where gundamzeta is coming from as well. I think it just depends on the person. As long as the person really drives (i.e. has a reason behind buying the mods the have and not just to be "cool"), thats all that really matters to me. I dont know all the ends and outs of a 240, so if i dont how to do something exactly, i always have my more knowledgeable friends help me out with the install. For example, I readily admit that i HATE wiring. I wont even waste my time with it cuz i know i dont have the patience for it. Plus, i dont know enough about electrical anyways. I dont trust myself not to screw it up. So i always have somebody else do that crap. __________________ www.Jspec.com www.SpeedAlliance.com www.PoweredByMax.net Instagram: @rjsladerade

06-13-2005, 08:45 AM	#11
420sx Post Whore! Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Age: 38 Posts: 3,960 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: 420sx Feedback Score: 0 reviews	^ like $5.15 an hour? __________________ hydropgrahics! ls1......

06-13-2005, 03:51 AM	#2
Sil Beer S13 Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Chino!...NOT CHINO HILLS! Age: 39 Posts: 1,117 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	^ Weak! The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters

06-13-2005, 09:35 AM	#14
the head Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: in a dark room mastering the art of typing with one hand Posts: 2,164 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	It all depends on your view on working on cars i prefer working on more simplistic cars or ones that have been stripped down for ease of work I am a car collector and I have my own shop to maintain my vehciles but some shit i hate working on and there are some jobs i don't like to do I hate changing oil so i dont do it anymore and some of the other cars are such a bitch to work on that i dont get any pleasure from it. the 240 though is great and really easy to work on I love fixing it as much as i love breaking it. __________________ I never knew you could do that with an eggplant

06-13-2005, 10:04 AM	#15
ZK Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: May 2003 Location: North Cal Posts: 1,068 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I totally agree. What is your time worth to you? Basically when you pay to have someone else do it is what you are paying for - their expertise and time. My friends and I have all wrenched on our cars before either because of lack of money or just to learn how to do something. Now I'd rather spend my time driving and hanging out with friends than underneath my car. I can afford to pay someone who knows a lot more about the car than myself to work on it and it saves me time to do other things I like as well. I spent 2 years waiting to drive my car because I didn't have the money to do it right the 1st time and tinkered around with it myself. Now I can drive it and I don't want to worry about little things anymore that will stop me from driving it whenever I have time to go drive. I still enjoy doing things like changing the oil or brakes/suspension - the stuff that I can set aside time for and not have to do immediately. The engine and electrical work I leave to the experts. __________________ SOLD: 91 240SX Coupe SR20DET, 05 Evolution 8 NEW: 08 Evoluton 10

06-13-2005, 10:13 AM	#16
sepulchral BANNED Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Midlothian. VA Posts: 2,050 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	the simple satisfaction of knowing how your cars were built and what corners were/weren't cut is why i build my own

06-13-2005, 12:33 PM	#17
infinitexsound Post Whore! Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: INtraweb Age: 39 Posts: 3,522 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	wow i think its time to upgrade, why do u still own "the poor mans ferrari?" if your seriously making alot of money like u say u are....... buy a new car.. so you wouldnt have to fix things so much... __________________ S14 TrackSlut coming to a raceway near you... 510 TimeAttack on its way...

06-13-2005, 01:49 PM	#18
Yoshi Post Whore! Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Washington Age: 44 Posts: 3,000 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: Yoshi Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Wow. what's with all the haters? Let's look from a different perspective. Barring rally (cuz there are different rules there, those guys have to know how to fix stuff mid-race on their own til help arrives... all of which means lost time), pretty much EVERY professional motorsport doesn't have their driver as the head of their pit crew. It just makes sense. Less time wrenching = more time for practice/racing. F1, NASCAR, enduro, doesn't really matter. Does Jeff Gordon work on his car? No way, he has ppl for that. Could he do it himself, of course! But that's not the most efficient way to run a team. If he's got the money, more power to him. Maybe he doesn't like Ferrari people... Maybe he can afford the work done to a 240 vs. something more expensive.... makes sense doesn't it? You haters shouldn't be mad just because he has the spare cash to save himself some skinned knuckles and wrench time. If I spent less time wrenching and more time doing other things (like my wife? hahaha), my lil woman would be much happier... she'd rather ride around than watch me cuss at my car anyhow It's all about where your priorities are. Spend accordingly. __________________ www.360realms.com/S13-S15

06-13-2005, 02:10 PM	#19
justinhustle Nissanaholic! Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ohio Age: 41 Posts: 1,693 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: justinhustle Feedback Score: 0 reviews	to me, knowing i can do it is enough sometimes however lately i dont trust anyone, so ive been working on my cars, my girls, and my familys which leaves the 240 last =/ i should charge for my time!

06-13-2005, 02:14 PM	#20
MakotoS13 BANNED Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Texas Age: 38 Posts: 4,205 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	correct, if i had the finances i'd pay a shop to put an ls2 in my car. however, since i'm not rich i dont. i just happen to enjoy working on my car as well as driving it. different strokes for different folks. deal.

06-13-2005, 03:12 PM	#22
TheSnail Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Marietta Georgia Age: 39 Posts: 2,434 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	It takes 8hrs to install a sr, and it would cost you 1200 for a shop to install it. You have failed econ if you cant see its the same as you making $150per hour if you do it your self. Im sure you dont make half of that perhour. Maybe not even a fourth.

06-13-2005, 04:07 PM	#23
420sx Post Whore! Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Age: 38 Posts: 3,960 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: 420sx Feedback Score: 0 reviews	i can guarantee my second sr swap wont take more than a day. including prep and pulling old engine out. once u "know-how" its a piece of cake. now harness is different, no need to rush there __________________ hydropgrahics! ls1......

06-13-2005, 04:14 PM	#24
infinitexsound Post Whore! Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: INtraweb Age: 39 Posts: 3,522 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Engine Swaps Are EASY, I just hate wiring __________________ S14 TrackSlut coming to a raceway near you... 510 TimeAttack on its way...

06-13-2005, 05:41 PM	#26
thx247 Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: bay area Posts: 1,455 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Sounds good to me, my time is more important than learning/doing certian things. __________________ Finally down to 1 car again. Thank god.

06-13-2005, 08:08 PM	#27
420sx Post Whore! Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Age: 38 Posts: 3,960 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: 420sx Feedback Score: 0 reviews	yea i dont think i will make same mistake twice on my second swap. will be alot faster. plus my first swap was a hybrid s14/13 __________________ hydropgrahics! ls1......

06-13-2005, 08:38 PM	#28
TurDz Nissanaholic! Join Date: May 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 1,618 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Yup, it really is a matter of preference, and we should all respect that if someone has a greater opportunity with his time elsewhere, and feels its a larger priority, by all means go for it. My vehicle stability professor said to us once, "I may have friends who know how to wrench better than me, who can weld better than me, and who can cut metal and build great race cars better than me, but in the end, all of it is based around the the typical fundamental designs of today. Once technology improves, those people will fall behind and have to re-learn a whole new way of working with cars, go to another technical college to learn the current technology, while we [engineers] are always looking forward to improve and innovate." What he said (not in exact quotes) struck me pretty hard with the reasoning behind wanting to becoming a mechanical engineer since I was losing some motivation. And it's a prime example of what people may want to do besides wrenching/fixing cars but still stay 100% within the automotive field. His words mean a lot because he's a really intelligent professor who is very qualified in his field.

06-13-2005, 09:05 PM	#29
SochBAT Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Abilene, TX Age: 35 Posts: 6,428 Trader Rating: (9) Rides Gallery: SochBAT Feedback Score: 9 reviews	I don't personally trust the butthead mechs around my area, so DIY mechanics is a must. And, i know everythin that goes into my car, and leaves it. What if you had a mech do all the work, and your car broke down in the boondocks, and can't reach a tower?

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