radupanait

Finally my pistons and rods are here and i guess thats the last of what i need to my engine rebuild. now for the little set back, its my first engine build, first off which rod goes on what piston, eagle rods wiseco pistons, does it matter the order, the only thing i see on them is the direction they need to be in. Also I will need the torque specs or a website that has them. Thanks zilvia. looking forward to one fast sr

renegade_ewok

Look up the FSM, its all over the internet

radupanait

OH and the ring gap. Whats FSM

Firestorm

FSM = Factory service manual

i suggest you weigh every piston and rod and combine them so their weights are pretty much equal on every cylinder.

radupanait

Ok, that clear one question, what about the orientation of the rods, with the inscription on the passager or drivers side. thanks

Mangudai

You sure you know what your doing? I mean..I know there's a first time for everything but I'd hate to see you come back saying you messed your engine up.

S14DB

Please take it to an engine builder if you don't know what you're doing. If they are nice they will let you watch and you will learn something.

Get an FSM for the clearances and Tq specs.

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radupanait

I love the faith but im not 16 and its not the like this is my first car, yes this is my first bottom end build, EVER but everything else i know, pistons rods ring gap this is all new, I have a garage full of everything I need and with all this money spent on tools id have to be pretty damn stupid to take it to some other guy to put it together. plus i live in alabama chances are they will mess it up before I will. So please dont put me down here. Forums are supposed to help people not tell them to go to the shop to get it done it defeats the purpose.

Mangudai

Lol why you getting upset for? No one is putting you down..

CrazyKoukiS14

no ones puttign you down, but with the amount of questions you have it doesnt seem like you know what your doing (bottom end wise) like the guy said take it to a engine builder and ask them if you can watch them do it, so that next time you have a general idea of what to do and you can do it yourself

radupanait

I just hate it when people say take it to the shop. HATE IT I mean ... a forget it. But it seems like its a fairly easy to answer one was weight match makes sense, second i think its orientation then thats it right i dont need anything else i guess ill look at the fsm for gap and torque specs, ive never worked on a engine that dosent have a manual in the US.

S14DB

Just cause you have the tools doesn't mean you can do it.

I spent a day at a machine shop and watched them rebuild an SR. I would still take it to them to size the rings, wrist pins, bearings. Check the balance of the crank against the weight of the rod/piston combo.

The reason the SR was at the shop is cause the owner had decked it with a belt sander and honed it with a cordless drill small engine hone. He ratcheted down the ARPs enough to get a seal. But he didn't size the wrist pins and the pistons dragged on the cylinder walls. Finally he was blowing by so much oil he brought it in to a pro.

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radupanait

Checked everything, checked the crank, will take it to the shop to get it hot tanked and honed, will let them do my rings and bearings i guess but i want to make sure everything is alright. EXAMPLE my friends took it to one of the more import oriented places around there and not only did they not torques the head bolts in sequence and warp the head but the rebuild the motor with mismatched pistons and its not the only story that i have that makes me think twice before i go to a mechanic.

S14DB

Fuck Import or Domestic only shops. If they can do one right they can do the other. Doesn't matter if they want to work in Inches or MM, Converts easily. Hell the shop I went to does mostly circle track engines but has built some high power 2JZ, RB and EJ's.

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codyace

Exactly. A good machine shop is a good machine shop.

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renegade_ewok

Dont let them bead blast your head!! My friend had his head bead blasted and the glass bead shrapnel got stuck in the tiny tiny oil passages in the head and eventually chewed up his cams. Its like sand. We are pretty sure this is what happened, but the engine is being diagnosed as we speak - but from what it looks like, this is what happened.

GSXRJJordan

To the OP - good idea on taking it to a builder to have the bearings done. It's just like a differential - sure you might get it right yourself, but a diff shop is going to make it perfect in 1/2 the time. I have a garage full of tools also (literally every hand tool there is, a press, etc) but don't mind taking things to the pros like that when it's complicated and I'm inexperienced. Watching them do it is a great idea, but most automotive machine shops I've been to aren't cool with that, and it's crazy crowded anyway.

Werd. Historically, machine shops do way more domestic stuff, because that's where the market is for that type of work, but any good shop will love working on an import motor's bottom end - it's half the work! Lol @ 8 cyl vs 4.

The media (that's what you call the "sand") should blow out of all the passages with compressed air. I've never heard of "shrapnel" getting stuck in there, but it's an interesting question - has anyone else heard of that?

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renegade_ewok

There were multiple failures in the motor at the same time.

Oil viscosity broke down, spun bearing on #3. Motor was taken apart and head put on a new shortblock - started it up to some terrible, terrible noise in the head (yes, it was primed right). Valve cover was taken off after that and the cams were chewed up and it looks like sand just ground at the cams. I haven't seen them yet (not my motor, its my roomates), but the head was bead blasted before being re-assembled and residue was found in the small oil passages. This is really the only viable assumption as I doubt oil breakdown could cause this or bearing shrapnel got to the head.

The motor was on for no more than a minute total after the bearing spun and after the re-assembly. The shop which looked at the head mentioned to us they saw a failure in the head like this previously and it too was bead blasted, but it is being analyzed right now so we know exactly what happened. The cams were HKS Step 2s and are now, to the best of my knowledge, fucked.

radupanait

"To the OP - good idea on taking it to a builder to have the bearings done. It's just like a differential - sure you might get it right yourself, but a diff shop is going to make it perfect in 1/2 the time." Half the time and 10 times the cost of you doing it yoursealf. Its alright guess ill get no info here, im used to dsm forums where i get straight up answers ill do it myself ill post pictures and videos maybe do a diy thread peace

Thanks

GSXRJJordan

Haha you know what we hate more than people that aren't prepared for a project and don't ask pros what to do, they just ask the forum?

People that do what the fuck they want and then come back to bitch about how the fucked their engine/diff/tranny/life up, and then ask us for help at that point.

We're just saving ourselves the trouble, so that when/if you do try and put the engine together yourself with no skills and no FSM (dude you didnt even know what the service manual WAS, much less HAVING one), we can say "I told you so", or at the very least "I bet you'll listen next time".


I've done absolutely everything on my S14 myself, and am very proud of that - but this isn't the first car that I've built. I learned about doing each job (engine swap, paint prep/paint, welding, etc) from the forum and from people who do it for a living, and then tried it myself... didn't just go to Sears, buy a tool, and expect to know all the nuances of the process. And BTW, not having enough money to do it right is a horrible reason do fuck your car up. Just look at 3/4 of the 240s you see.

Have a good one.

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radupanait

Cool how many build have you guys had. But forget it i much rather argue with my redneck mechanics then with you fine people.

radupanait

PS. I have the manual. And today I stoped by the machine shop and they sayd they dont have time to mess with my engine since they dont know what it is and dont have it in the books. NO LIE. I am a foreign student in the woops TROY, Al.

Sileighty_85

Tell them is an SR20 out of a Sentra SER Same exact engine just different Compression Ratio and crank has more counter weights.

When i built My engine in Mobile AL, I just had a shop Bore/hone, Balance internals, balance the crank, Hot tank block, leak check head and assemble only the Piston and rods.

These guys built funny cars and boat/tanker Engines Only charged me $300

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radupanait

Hmmm, I just dont have people like that over here, Montgomery is overpriced and poor work and I donno, I just have little trust in them. Dothan, al has some people but like I said i just cant find any people that built something that I can see. I just wanted to do it myself, I have several blocks pistons and rods have warranty I mean im just not the type to watch.

deadghost

I wish I can tell the dude that started the thread to join a engine overhaul/ performance engine class at my college for $180 for the units and a $20.00 lab fee, get your SR fully rebuilt, polished, bore your cylinders, honed,etc and have some serous old timers help and instruct you on your build. You do all the work, get all the help, and all the tools you would find at any other machine shop, Its what I am doing this coming January to my red top. Too bad though you have to take a fundamental class for 4 month and the next semester is the last before the college takes down the program for a couple of months.

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ManoNegra

taking an engine class at community college is a pretty good idea
thing they usually have other requirements before they allow you to take it

Best way to learn is to work with someone that has done it before.