SimpleS14

Ok guys, here's the place to discuss what you think about either situation.


Make sure to follow forum rules.

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zylvia213

what about them 2 places????

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Agamemnon

Sheets of glass.

MisawaJason

I wish we were already finished in that part of the world

driftking777

sucks i totally understand why where there still. However i think we need to give them a date for our pull out. And just hold them to it. If the people dont stand up for themselves, we'll be there forever. And i like to think its not our problem (to an extent)

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JrockS13

Well I dont know much about Afganistan but I'v been in Iraq for the last 11 months and 15 days (leaving in 3 days) and I belive we are at the point where we can finnaly give full control back to the Iraqi Government. With the 8 years we've put into training their Army and helping them form a positive political structure. It's time to let them take the wheel, and hopefully they won't F*** it up b/c that place sucks and I dont care to go back.

AznDrftr.

im actually tryin to go oversea for contract work between the two, but my friends dad is in Iraq, said that was the safer place than Afghan.

ronmcdon

Well I'm certainly not optimistic about Afghanistan (nor the region in general).
Wish we could gtfo, but that's not going to happen anytime soon.

HalveBlue

Our biggest problem in Afghanistan currently, and in Iraq previously, has been an inadequate and inappropriate strategy for the task at hand.

We're not fighting a war in these parts of the world, we're conducting a nation building exercises.

Unfortunately, our Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, and Marines are not properly trained for this type of mission. It's impossible to win "hearts and minds" (I know that term has become despised by now) through kinetic, direct action means.

While those means have made the US military probably the best military in the world when it comes to fighting conventional wars, it has done and absolutely dismal job in creating a trusting populace that will accept American assistance to build a stable nation.

Security is a key requirement before any sort of stability can be achieved.

Creating ROE that serve to both neutralize the threat at hand while not disillusioning the civilian populace is a very difficult task.

It's also the most important.

S14_Kouki

Dont know if anyone else seen or heard this. But Odama just put the word in to send 30,000 more troops over seas.

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ronmcdon

Well it might help if you were a bit more specific about where the troops were sent, lol
Iraq? North Korea? Disneyland?

Afghan isn't going to be a walk in the park.
Either you get out, or you commit fully.
If you've decided to stay, it's hard to do well without a large force.

HalveBlue

Well, considering the title of this thread (Iraq / Afghanistan) and the fact that this has been in the news for weeks now, I think it's safe to assume that S_14 Kouki was talking about Afghanistan.

ESmorz

Exxon-Led Consortium Wins Iraq Oil Contract - WSJ.com

As for Afghanistan... I don't even care anymore. Send those blank checks to re-structure our education system (1 in 5 San Diegans cannot read), health care, alternative energy... but that would seem to defeat the point, wouldn't it?

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Vision Garage

I thought we were suppose to pull out a while back. Before obama came into office. By the way, any military people care to chime in about what are we trying to accomplish out there?

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Sergio180sx

My dad goes back to Afghan this sat and he said iraq is so chill now but afghan is still really bad

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ronmcdon

Could be a couple thousand here, couple thousand there.
We aren't out of Iraq yet and it's not like Iran isn't a concern.
I'm not assuming anything without legit sources.

HalveBlue

Well, here's a link to the full-length speech:

C-SPAN Video Player - Pres. Obama Address on Afghanistan

Here's a link to the White House Press Release.

http://c-span.com/pdf/wh120109_obama3.pdf

Here's a link to an Army Times article:

Obama: 30,000 to Afghanistan by summer - Army News, news from Iraq, - Army Times

I doubt you'll find an exact breakdown of how those 30,000 additional troops will be comprised and deployed online; OPSEC.

From what I've been able to gather the majority of troops will consist of combat arms troops directly deployed to areas deemed as volatile and important by GEN McChrystal.

This will be concurrent with an influx in trainers for the ANA and ANSF training missions headed by CSTC-A.

S14_Kouki

Thats what I heard Bush was talking about it like 2 years ago or so. But we all should know we cant count on the government to tell us the truth.

thank you for the reply/links

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HalveBlue

For anyone that's interested:



PBS Frontline: The Return of the Taliban (2006)

FRONTLINE: return of the taliban: watch the full program | PBS


VBS.TV: Inside Afghanistan (Part1 of 2) (2008)

Inside Afghanistan 1 of 2 - VBS NEWS | VBS.TV


VBS.TV: Inside Afghanistan (Part 2 of 2)

Inside Afghanistan 2 of 2 - VBS NEWS | VBS.TV


PBS Frontline: The War Briefing (2008)

FRONTLINE: the war briefing: watch the full program | PBS


VBS.TV: Obama's War (2009)

Obama's War - VBS NEWS | VBS.TV


PBS Frontline: Obama's War (2009)

FRONTLINE: obama's war: watch the full program online | PBS

thrax

Iraq: Will likely split up with Kurdistan becoming a separate state.
Afghanistan: US will eventually pull out with nothing gained as did all the other empires the last couple of centuries. US missed a good opportunity to improve the area after the CIA helped defeat the soviets. If they just spent a fraction of the coin developing the place back then Afghanistan might of been a non issue today.

s13_redSILVIA

Fuck afghan..got homies up there now

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HalveBlue

I largely agree with this - however, the issue (and solution) isn't as simple as that.

The biggest hindrance to development initiatives is a lack of stability and security.

It does you no good to build a marketplace for the people, if they're not going to use it for fear of getting blown up or shot.

Schools get built that no one uses, because after construction is finished and Coalition troops move on to another location leaving the place undefended. Inevitably, the Taliban (who watches our troops movements constantly) will show up after we leave and occupy or destroy the school building, doing various bad things to the people who attended or taught at the school.

Hell, we can't even use what passes as roads in Afghanistan, because their either mined or prone to ambushes.

army240

I've been to Afghanistan(Kandahar) as a mechanics from august 07 to end of february 08, and I'm suppose to go back there at the end of 2010.

As long as you don't go on the road, you're safe... I also been to Kabul one month, and it was a different game...

Anyway, I'm not really into politics...

Frank

HalveBlue

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RowdyU21

I been here since February and I really don't know why we're still here...once we leave it's going to end up turning into the same shit it was before...For the most part they're killing themselves lately they still try and fuck with us but most of it is sectarian violence, a clear case of we'll go blow they're church up and tomorrow they'll come blow up ours...it's never gunna end they been fighting forever....

Walperstyle

Outside perspective; I never understood why you guys went into Iraq at all. At least with Afghanistan, it was already messed up with no real order, thus anything you do is an improvement.

I am glad to see human rights, schools starting to appear, and women rights in parts of Afghanistan. This is what I've heard from some Canadian friends there anyway.

Iraq at least had a dictator to create some kind of order. Now its Chaotic with everyone trying to get power.

Yeah thats great in theory, but there is far too many opinions on the internet. We need better people in politics. People that worked for a living.

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HAWAII

i want my friends back here at home. Why are we spending too much money with this stupid wars? How about use that money to fix our borders and our economy. Why to we have to police the world? I do not see Switzerland policing the world. They have different views and we have a diffirent view with life, let's respect each other's view.

KA24DESOneThree

I want the US out of both countries now. I do not care about the consequences or that "everything we fought for would be lost."

I do not care about any American in uniform who dies in either country during armed engagement.

I think some "terrorists" are really freedom fighters fighting for their countries back and I would support them if I gave a shit about their countries, which I don't.

First post in a few months. It'll do.

lewisfk

!REALLY THAT'S HOW U FEEL! So fuck the dead, fuck U! You don't know what I will do to you for your ignorant statements! Regardless of your opinion about the war and its outcome! It takes courage to put on a uniform and go to a foreign country and die for your beliefs!

fliprayzin240sx

Yup, all these fucking terrorists are freedom fighters that like to blow up their own people...

Your the same idiot that I wanna take with me into a fox hole so I can shoot you myself...

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