D2 and Koni... - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

*HaLo* · 03-31-2005, 06:48 PM

I wonder...

Do you think you can fit a Koni race insert (http://www.koniracing.com/8611.html) in the D2 coilover housing???

I plan to do it.

Double adjustment, 1000lbs+ springrate valving... That would kick some serious ass...

hurleyboi514 · 03-31-2005, 07:32 PM

ive thought about it

*HaLo* · 03-31-2005, 07:57 PM

Hey... I knew you'd read this...
I am getting replacement D2 dampers in the next few weeks... And I will be seriously measuring them to have the inserts fitted in. If it works out, I'll let you know. I plan on doing this next winter. Think about the possibilities...

PS: I ordered myself a front lip... Now people will be even more confused when looking at pictures of our cars...

Blues13 · 03-31-2005, 08:45 PM

That really does look interesting. How does the insert "stay" in the bracket? How do you thread the outside of the insert to fit the brackets?

hurleyboi514 · 04-01-2005, 07:43 AM

very cool... i hope the results are in our favor! id love to put some koni's in. btw, glad to hear your getting your replacement shocks. ive run 3 track events ALREADY this year, and those D2's handle great. im only on the 7/5 rates, and i have a set of 8's as well. ill probably got 8/7 soon. if the koni thing works out, i may end up emptying my bank account!

i still need to get a cage, at least a 4 point, and my clutch is getting weak, but other than that, the car is driving great!! i may change up some aero as well. i hope to add a nice splitter to my lip (so we stand out, eh) and maybe change the rear wing for a GT style. my friend with an SER improved his lap times by more than 2 seconds by only adding a splitter and GT wing!! what type of lip did you get? the PDM/Bomex lip? im sure it'll look hot, just post pics when you can. btw, here are some shots from the last event...

nlzmo400r · 04-01-2005, 07:56 AM

thats a damn good idea. I'll be selling my d2s soon and probably going with either silk roads or kts. I like teh silk roads, but those are like $300 more. ^ ^ Your pictures kick ass

*HaLo* · 04-01-2005, 08:39 AM

I am actually getting the Veilside lip:

If Koni race inserts work out in D2 coilover housings, trust me, NOTHING (Silk Road, KTS, Tein, JIC, Kei Office) will impress me anymore. I believe I will have one of the best setups you could ever get.. I have 9 kg/mm springs in spare, so I would go 9/7. The only problem I could see is on the rear damper. Since bump are rebound are adjustable from the top/bottom, the rear housing won't allow adjustement on one of those settings without taking the bottom sleeve OFF the coilover... We could do that, or get some single adjustment race inserts for the rear.

Pricing is not that bad either. I got quoted around 350$cdn for double adjustables, and 200$ for single adjustables..

hurleyboi514 · 04-01-2005, 10:21 AM

nice... i think i like the veilside better...

*HaLo* · 04-01-2005, 12:54 PM

It's simpler.. that's all.

*HaLo* · 04-21-2005, 06:15 PM

Hey, sorry for the bump..

I just measured my D2 housings... seems the shortest Konin insert is 1.4" too long for the front housings ans 0.4" too long for the rear housings... got any ideas on a "make-it-fit" solution?

***S14DB*** · 04-21-2005, 06:53 PM

Explane too long. Not following.

*HaLo* · 04-21-2005, 07:17 PM

Well, according to the Koni catalog (http://www.koni-na.com/pdfcatalogs/K...ortCatalog.pdf), the shortest 8611/8610 inserts are 11.42" long. The S13 D2 coilover housing is 10" long in front and 11" long in back. I wonder if there is a way we can lengthen the D2 coilover housings...

Rennen · 04-21-2005, 10:54 PM

When you cut/install konis into stock struts They stick out the top anyway right? As I recall, they attach at the bottom with a bolt. There really isn't any reason you can't do the same for the D2s, and since konis work the same anywhere in the stroke, it wouldn't matter if they were 1" closer bottoming out, you'd just have slightly less travel.

Disclaimer: never installed konis, and don't have D2s, just talking out my ass.

-Matt

*HaLo* · 04-21-2005, 11:51 PM

Actually, if you checked the manual, you'd notice that the shock housing has to be longuer than the insert... I'm not talking about the total lenght of the shock (including the shaft).

GhostFace · 04-22-2005, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HaLo

Actually, if you checked the manual, you'd notice that the shock housing has to be longuer than the insert... I'm not talking about the total lenght of the shock (including the shaft).

hey, where did you get that front lip for your car? shit looks sweet

nlzmo400r · 04-22-2005, 06:58 AM

its a veilside lip. Bump, tried it yet Halo?

Rennen · 04-22-2005, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HaLo

Actually, if you checked the manual, you'd notice that the shock housing has to be longuer than the insert... I'm not talking about the total lenght of the shock (including the shaft).

pfft, instructions! How could the engineer who designed the part possibly know more than me?

Ok, I think I got confused and was picturing a different Koni. All the Koni installs I have ever witnessed were the cut-strut kind. Like this: http://www.roadraceengineering.com/3...3gkoniinfo.htm Where the damper is secured to the bottom of the strut hosing with a bolt and there is just a plastic washer to keep dirt out on top. I guess the double adjustable inserts are a bit different since there is an adjustment knob down there.

...wait now that I read the destructions, Does it get secured at the top or with the lock nut at the bottom? If it's still the bottom, I think my idea would work. Koni's instructions for measuring say to take out the shocks/springs and lower the car till a wheel touches the fender or something else bottoms out... so as long as that distance is shorter than Lmin, I would say just install them anyway and make a dust boot for the top to keep dirt out.

Are the D2's threaded all the way up the shock housing? if so you could have just about any machine shop make a cap that threads on there to hold it in place.

Let me know if I am making any sense. I'd really like to try this too if it works out.

-Matt

*HaLo* · 04-22-2005, 06:19 PM

Actually, it does make a lot of sense.. I'd need a D2 spare damper to try this out...

D2 housings are sleeved all the way to the top.

GhostFace · 04-22-2005, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nlzmo400r

its a veilside lip. Bump, tried it yet Halo?

yeah, but i been lookin all over for it and didnt see it on the veilside site either

where could i find one?

i apologize for freepostin in your thread halo

Mikes14240sx · 04-23-2005, 05:51 AM

I have been thinking about using the koni 8610 insert with the d2's as well. I'm still waiting on replacement d2 struts to get some definite measurements though.

I've thought about using a threaded piece of tubing for the insert housing if the d2 strut was to short.

Anyone now the lenght of the d2 struts for s14?

98sr20ve · 04-23-2005, 08:09 AM

I have actually built up 8611 setups for a SER before. The 8611 is a double adjustable low pressure gas, twin tube setup. It is not digressive valving, it is not Monotube. Silkroad are Monotube, digressive valving (almost all monotube are). Basically, the 8611 is a fancy Koni red with double adjustability and much firmer dampening. The compression dampening is too stiff for a strut car in most setups so you run it full soft in compression on a strut car (we have struts up front). They attach from the top and you use a threaded collar to hold it in place. You thread the inside of the tube you are attaching it to in most installs. Most people use steel for this tube for safety reasons. In the near future (rumor has it) Koni is going to make a digressive valving setup 8611. Mike Kojima has been pushing Koni to do that for the SE-R cup people. They would fix the over aggressive compression dampening at the same time. So unless you have a 11.5 inch tube with at least a 45mm (going from memory) I.D. you are not installing 8611's in the D2's. If they are steel then you could just weld an extension on the bottom of the front tube. No big deal more then likely. Rears should be fine as the length is longer in back. To say the 8611 is better then Silkroad and others is a bit of a stretch. It is double adjustable but other then that it is old technology. It works but its not the best out. Unless you need rates higher then 9/7 or so the Silkroads would probably work great. I have them on my car and I am very pleased. I dropped my rates to 6 up front and 300# in the back. Dampening is set 1 set up from full soft.

03-31-2005, 06:48 PM	#1
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	D2 and Koni... I wonder... Do you think you can fit a Koni race insert (http://www.koniracing.com/8611.html) in the D2 coilover housing??? I plan to do it. Double adjustment, 1000lbs+ springrate valving... That would kick some serious ass... __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

03-31-2005, 07:32 PM	#2
hurleyboi514 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: The Fort Posts: 905 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	ive thought about it __________________ HighTach Motorsports

03-31-2005, 07:57 PM	#3
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hey... I knew you'd read this... I am getting replacement D2 dampers in the next few weeks... And I will be seriously measuring them to have the inserts fitted in. If it works out, I'll let you know. I plan on doing this next winter. Think about the possibilities... PS: I ordered myself a front lip... Now people will be even more confused when looking at pictures of our cars... __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-01-2005, 07:43 AM	#5
hurleyboi514 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: The Fort Posts: 905 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	very cool... i hope the results are in our favor! id love to put some koni's in. btw, glad to hear your getting your replacement shocks. ive run 3 track events ALREADY this year, and those D2's handle great. im only on the 7/5 rates, and i have a set of 8's as well. ill probably got 8/7 soon. if the koni thing works out, i may end up emptying my bank account! i still need to get a cage, at least a 4 point, and my clutch is getting weak, but other than that, the car is driving great!! i may change up some aero as well. i hope to add a nice splitter to my lip (so we stand out, eh) and maybe change the rear wing for a GT style. my friend with an SER improved his lap times by more than 2 seconds by only adding a splitter and GT wing!! what type of lip did you get? the PDM/Bomex lip? im sure it'll look hot, just post pics when you can. btw, here are some shots from the last event... __________________ HighTach Motorsports

04-01-2005, 07:56 AM	#6
nlzmo400r Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: louisiana Posts: 1,248 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	thats a damn good idea. I'll be selling my d2s soon and probably going with either silk roads or kts. I like teh silk roads, but those are like $300 more. ^ ^ Your pictures kick ass __________________ 'my drinking team has a racing problem' [email protected] - gt32 .6bar

03-31-2005, 08:45 PM	#4
Blues13 Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: OC Posts: 435 Trader Rating: (2) Feedback Score: 2 reviews	That really does look interesting. How does the insert "stay" in the bracket? How do you thread the outside of the insert to fit the brackets?

04-01-2005, 08:39 AM	#7
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I am actually getting the Veilside lip: If Koni race inserts work out in D2 coilover housings, trust me, NOTHING (Silk Road, KTS, Tein, JIC, Kei Office) will impress me anymore. I believe I will have one of the best setups you could ever get.. I have 9 kg/mm springs in spare, so I would go 9/7. The only problem I could see is on the rear damper. Since bump are rebound are adjustable from the top/bottom, the rear housing won't allow adjustement on one of those settings without taking the bottom sleeve OFF the coilover... We could do that, or get some single adjustment race inserts for the rear. Pricing is not that bad either. I got quoted around 350$cdn for double adjustables, and 200$ for single adjustables.. __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-01-2005, 10:21 AM	#8
hurleyboi514 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: The Fort Posts: 905 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	nice... i think i like the veilside better... __________________ HighTach Motorsports

04-01-2005, 12:54 PM	#9
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	It's simpler.. that's all. __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-21-2005, 06:15 PM	#10
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hey, sorry for the bump.. I just measured my D2 housings... seems the shortest Konin insert is 1.4" too long for the front housings ans 0.4" too long for the rear housings... got any ideas on a "make-it-fit" solution? __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-21-2005, 06:53 PM	#11
*S14DB* AFC #1 Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 昨晩あなたのお母さんの家 Posts: 20,181 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	Explane too long. Not following.

04-21-2005, 07:17 PM	#12
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Well, according to the Koni catalog (http://www.koni-na.com/pdfcatalogs/K...ortCatalog.pdf), the shortest 8611/8610 inserts are 11.42" long. The S13 D2 coilover housing is 10" long in front and 11" long in back. I wonder if there is a way we can lengthen the D2 coilover housings... __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-21-2005, 10:54 PM	#13
Rennen Zilvia Addict Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: WichitAr, KS Age: 38 Posts: 877 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: Rennen Feedback Score: 0 reviews	When you cut/install konis into stock struts They stick out the top anyway right? As I recall, they attach at the bottom with a bolt. There really isn't any reason you can't do the same for the D2s, and since konis work the same anywhere in the stroke, it wouldn't matter if they were 1" closer bottoming out, you'd just have slightly less travel. Disclaimer: never installed konis, and don't have D2s, just talking out my ass. -Matt __________________ '89 Nissan 240SX fastback: #23 DSP/RallyMod2/Track Slut '95 BMW 540i 6 speed: Ultimate Commuting Machine PFM Racing www.solo2.org www.midwest240sx.com

04-21-2005, 11:51 PM	#14
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Actually, if you checked the manual, you'd notice that the shock housing has to be longuer than the insert... I'm not talking about the total lenght of the shock (including the shaft). __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-22-2005, 06:58 AM	#16
nlzmo400r Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: louisiana Posts: 1,248 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	its a veilside lip. Bump, tried it yet Halo? __________________ 'my drinking team has a racing problem' [email protected] - gt32 .6bar

04-22-2005, 06:19 PM	#18
HaLo from Canada, eh! Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Montreal, Quebec Age: 42 Posts: 5,199 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: HaLo Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Actually, it does make a lot of sense.. I'd need a D2 spare damper to try this out... D2 housings are sleeved all the way to the top. __________________ -> HaLo Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3 Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000 PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

04-23-2005, 05:51 AM	#20
Mikes14240sx Leaky Injector Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brevard, FL Age: 38 Posts: 107 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I have been thinking about using the koni 8610 insert with the d2's as well. I'm still waiting on replacement d2 struts to get some definite measurements though. I've thought about using a threaded piece of tubing for the insert housing if the d2 strut was to short. Anyone now the lenght of the d2 struts for s14? Last edited by Mikes14240sx; 04-23-2005 at 06:34 AM..

04-23-2005, 08:09 AM	#21
98sr20ve Zilvia Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Hampton Posts: 156 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I have actually built up 8611 setups for a SER before. The 8611 is a double adjustable low pressure gas, twin tube setup. It is not digressive valving, it is not Monotube. Silkroad are Monotube, digressive valving (almost all monotube are). Basically, the 8611 is a fancy Koni red with double adjustability and much firmer dampening. The compression dampening is too stiff for a strut car in most setups so you run it full soft in compression on a strut car (we have struts up front). They attach from the top and you use a threaded collar to hold it in place. You thread the inside of the tube you are attaching it to in most installs. Most people use steel for this tube for safety reasons. In the near future (rumor has it) Koni is going to make a digressive valving setup 8611. Mike Kojima has been pushing Koni to do that for the SE-R cup people. They would fix the over aggressive compression dampening at the same time. So unless you have a 11.5 inch tube with at least a 45mm (going from memory) I.D. you are not installing 8611's in the D2's. If they are steel then you could just weld an extension on the bottom of the front tube. No big deal more then likely. Rears should be fine as the length is longer in back. To say the 8611 is better then Silkroad and others is a bit of a stretch. It is double adjustable but other then that it is old technology. It works but its not the best out. Unless you need rates higher then 9/7 or so the Silkroads would probably work great. I have them on my car and I am very pleased. I dropped my rates to 6 up front and 300# in the back. Dampening is set 1 set up from full soft.

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