400hp long distance SR20

[Simrem]

Always loved silvias and the SR20 but i'm finally getting to build my own engine now. my plan is to get 400hp and then i'm going to drive it from washington to virginia. since i'm new to this I just wanna know what mods and precautions should i take since i'll be driving it long distances and for long periods of times. i dont want anything to blow or over heat and i know theres gonna be some days where i just open it up.

[Chaluska]

big radiator, Gteck fan blade on a new fan clutch with the complete fan shroud. a big aero bumper to allow more airflow to the radiator. make sure you run a normal OEM t-stat for better fuel economy (versus a low temp nismo stat).. make sure your tune is leaner on part throttle / light throttle for better cruise AFR's..

with all of the above, i'd say drive the car for at least 500 miles before attempting a hardcore cross country run.. give it some daily action, and then give it a good 70-100 mile one way trip.. if it makes it 100 miles with zero overheating / issues, it should be able to make it 1000

[Simrem]

big radiator, Gteck fan blade on a new fan clutch with the complete fan shroud. a big aero bumper to allow more airflow to the radiator. make sure you run a normal OEM t-stat for better fuel economy (versus a low temp nismo stat).. make sure your tune is leaner on part throttle / light throttle for better cruise AFR's..

with all of the above, i'd say drive the car for at least 500 miles before attempting a hardcore cross country run.. give it some daily action, and then give it a good 70-100 mile one way trip.. if it makes it 100 miles with zero overheating / issues, it should be able to make it 1000

OEM would be better than nismo? i know the nismo mainly for how it responded at lower temps than oem

[OrangeVirus1]

Dude if it drives fine, and doesn't overheat, it will drive like a stock car if you are out of boost. It's probably like 130HP when the turbo isn't in action.

I'd say if you can drive 50 miles no heating issues when it's hot outside, you're good.

[Sileighty_85]

Its funny how almost every new person to Nissans thinks J-Spec engine are not ment for DD.

Believe it or not but Nissan designed these cars/Engines as DD's Not drift/Track cars.

as long as you use QUALITY parts then you shouldn't have any reliability issues.

A good radiator/Fan and a Nismo Thermo and you'll be golden for temp wise


When your engine can produce 400hp, if your cruising in 5th in Neg boost the engine is not making 400hp.
So durring that operation HP is not a factor of concern.

[aga]

just change everything related to cooling, hoses etc, all vacuum hoses, all hoses in general! check your steering boots, your driveshaft boots, alignment, always carry a spare, oil, gearbox oil, coolant, jack, tools etc. oh and a fire extinguisher! you never know! (i may say all that but i just did a 500km trip on a brand new engine with nothing!...and as i was up on the mountain i said to myself, shit, i ve taken nothing with me!)

[S12 Drifter]

Save your money and go FJ20

it's a better engine in every possible way, you dont need to build a fj to hold 400hp IT WILL hold 400hp for a VERY VERY long time.

[zombiewolf513]

Break it in well first before going on a long drive, only takes a few days of driving in traffic for about 500-1000 miles

[S12 Drifter]

Break it in well first before going on a long drive, only takes a few days of driving in traffic for about 500-1000 miles
why are you seating rings per FSM?


i let engine warm up, take it to the race track and LOAD the engine because when you load the engine rings FULLY expand a pull in 1st 2nd 3rd and 4th will get it done for 25 miles. drain oil drive soft the rest of the 75 miles break in's done, enjoy.

i promise it does NOT take 1,000 miles to break in a engine.

[zombiewolf513]

Because the FSM has yet to steer me wrong.

I didnt say dont load it, but im in the middle of a break in right now. Boost around, just domt bounce it off the rev limiter or hold it at the same rpm for hours on end, and rev match downshift everytime you stop

[OrangeVirus1]

When your engine can produce 400hp, if your cruising in 5th in Neg boost the engine is not making 400hp.
So durring that operation HP is not a factor of concern.

for some reason nobody understands this lol. for some reason everyone believes just cuz an engine makes xxx power, that means it's xxx power right off idle lol

[pacotaco345]

for some reason nobody understands this lol. for some reason everyone believes just cuz an engine makes xxx power, that means it's xxx power right off idle lol

I'm driving my stock ka (minus a header and exhaust) 240 back from Texas to California for the fourth time on Saturday, haven't really had any problems before besides the ignition coil overheating. I put a koyo in it a couple days ago just to be safe.. Anyways I'm going to build a ~300 whp ish sr this summer and will be driving that back at the end of summer. I'm looking forward to the better mileage and smoother running engine lol.

[redss]

big radiator, Gteck fan blade on a new fan clutch with the complete fan shroud. a big aero bumper to allow more airflow to the radiator. make sure you run a normal OEM t-stat for better fuel economy (versus a low temp nismo stat).. make sure your tune is leaner on part throttle / light throttle for better cruise AFR's..

with all of the above, i'd say drive the car for at least 500 miles before attempting a hardcore cross country run.. give it some daily action, and then give it a good 70-100 mile one way trip.. if it makes it 100 miles with zero overheating / issues, it should be able to make it 1000

sssssssssssssssss13CHUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Tom N]

I have driven my 98 S14 w/S15 swap from where I live in SW Florida to Kansas City and back, Seaside Hts NJ and back, Little Rock and back. All over the last few months. I don't see why people are scared to drive these cars long distance.

[songgsan]

Dude if it drives fine, and doesn't overheat, it will drive like a stock car if you are out of boosthttp://www.glpp.info/hu5a.jpg

[S12 Drifter]

Because the FSM has yet to steer me wrong.

I didnt say dont load it, but im in the middle of a break in right now. Boost around, just domt bounce it off the rev limiter or hold it at the same rpm for hours on end, and rev match downshift everytime you stop
the FSM IS WRONG when it come to engine break in.

since the late 70's nissan and a bunch of other people dyno break in their cars before they release it. they go WOT on the dyno 1st, till redline! 2nd!, 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th, (if there is one)

they give it to a test driver to make sure it is a properly functioning car. EVEN HARLEY breaks in their engines the same way. and people who dont know anything about cars by new cars, the motor is already broken in.. they need to do break in this way because a defective engine will not make it past the dyno, a engine with improper clearances will not make it past 25 miles.

I have broken my all my engines the hard way and HAVE ALWAYS had a STRONG sealing very healthy engine. my last VG30ET was broken in this way and everyone tells me it's extremely torquey and very drivable for the mods i have (which it should be laggy). motor pulls a constant 170psi across all the cylinder.

[santasnowman]

Drove my 360whp sr from Florida to Tennessee and back. No problems other than a minor coolant leak from the stupid throttle body loop.

[Tom N]

why are you seating rings per FSM?


i let engine warm up, take it to the race track and LOAD the engine because when you load the engine rings FULLY expand a pull in 1st 2nd 3rd and 4th will get it done for 25 miles. drain oil drive soft the rest of the 75 miles break in's done, enjoy.

i promise it does NOT take 1,000 miles to break in a engine.

Agreed.
How do you think we break in motors for track only cars. I can tell you it's not by putting around in it for a 1000 miles.

[chiboy002]

^ yes but breaking in a race motor is different from breaking in an everyday use motor...

[S12 Drifter]

^ yes but breaking in a race motor is different from breaking in an everyday use motor...

how is it different please explain to me. if you break in a race motor and use it on the street daily drive it how will it be unreliable if it's only using 70hp out of the 800 or 900hp is can make when taken to the extreme? as a matter of fact it will be more reliable on the street because it does not see the stresses it's suppose to see.

if you fully build a engine and just street drive it that motor will last a VERY long time because it never sees stress it's suppose to in other words the MOTOR WILL NEVER be the problem.

your argument about soft break in is nil.

ford, chevy, harley dyno break in their engines now, EVERYONE does before it leaves the factory.

how does the GT-R get broken in? GOING AND REDLINING through every gear before it leaves the factory...

OH NO YOUR SUPPOSE TO DO A SOFT BREAK IT! YOUR GOING TO DECREASE THE LIFE OF YOUR MOTOR NOW?!?!?!
please know what your talking about before you open your mouth, it would be nice to not deal with dumbasses on a daily basis.

[zombiewolf513]

So whats wrong with driving 600 miles in stop and go again?

[oni jake]

I drove a few SR's cross country with no problems. 30+mpg is rad as fuck. I don't dick around with the car when I'm in the middle of no where because just like any motor ever, they can break. Just do you simple maintenance stuff on it, make sure its not leaking anywhere, and watch out for pot holes.

SRs are good to go!

[Tom N]

^ yes but breaking in a race motor is different from breaking in an everyday use motor...

You're wrong. Clearances may be different depending on your race goals but break in is the same. You have a very small window to break in a motor and set those rings. If its not done in the first 15-20 miles it won't ever be done. Don't be fooled by old fashion thinking.

[S12 Drifter]

So whats wrong with driving 600 miles in stop and go again?
this

If its not done in the first 15-20 miles it won't ever be done. Don't be fooled by old fashion thinking.

learn to ACTUALLY build a engine.. dont follow blind sheep.

[S12 Drifter]

I think you people ARE GETTING clutch break in procedure mixed with engine break in procedure (race clutch and street clutch are different and have different break in methods. )

clutch is stop and go for about 500-1,000 miles depending on clutch but you can rag on it a little bit to break in the engine.

[Tom N]

Best way to break in a motor on the street is hard bursts of acceleration and very important deceleration in 2nd and 3rd. Seeing as you typically can't just run through gears to red line on the street like you can on the dyno just do short bursts.
You don't want to cruise around for a few hundred miles with no load on the engine which in turn puts no pressure on the rings. This is completely wrong.

[Tom N]

If you build your shit right you can drive it anywhere. I have driven my Gvr4 from SW Florida to Norwalk Ohio for the DSM shoot out. Raced it all weekend and drove it home all while getting alittle over 30 mpg. Car was making mid 400awhp at the time. Used to drive it to organized street races all over Fl years ago even when it was at 650 awhp. Don't skimp on the maintenance and it will be fine. Any car can have a alternator go out at any time so have AAA.

[zombiewolf513]

Okay dude, i never said anything about the first 20 or so miles not being the most important. Nor did I say anything else contrary to what you're saying. I was referring to driving a lot of local miles as a precaution so shit like this doesnt go unchecked while you hypnotize out on the highway over a 1000 mile road trip:

Drove my 360whp sr from Florida to Tennessee and back. No problems other than a minor coolant leak from the stupid throttle body loop.

Go look at my build thread.

[S12 Drifter]

Best way to break in a motor on the street is hard bursts of acceleration and very important deceleration in 2nd and 3rd. Seeing as you typically can't just run through gears to red line on the street like you can on the dyno just do short bursts.
You don't want to cruise around for a few hundred miles with no load on the engine which in turn puts no pressure on the rings. This is completely wrong.

you sir know what you are talking about. i would not hesitate to buy a engine from you if i had a need.

[Tom N]

you sir know what you are talking about. i would not hesitate to buy a engine from you if i had a need.

Thank you. I have been playing with cars for 20 years. There's always more to learn about this hobby and newer and better ways to do things. I hate wiring but engines and tuning are something I thoroughly enjoy.

[S12 Drifter]

Thank you. I have been playing with cars for 20 years. There's always more to learn about this hobby and newer and better ways to do things. I hate wiring but engines and tuning are something I thoroughly enjoy.

I've only been playing with them for 8 years but I have LEARNED a lot. there's a lot of misconceptions out there.

[Mikester]

^^Yep, and this thread is full of them.

[fliprayzin240sx]

Make sure you replace every coolant line hose under the intake manifold with new ones, then do the usual maintenance stuff before you toss the engine in (new water pump, thermostat, belts, spark plugs, o2 sensor). Then drive it around for a couple of days locally just to make sure you wont have any surprises of leaking couplers, hoses or fittings.

[S12 Drifter]

^^Yep, and this forum is full of them.


fixed it for you. :barfkiss:

[Mikester]

^^HAHAHAHA

fair enough :)

[Croustibat]

why are you seating rings per FSM?


i let engine warm up, take it to the race track and LOAD the engine because when you load the engine rings FULLY expand a pull in 1st 2nd 3rd and 4th will get it done for 25 miles. drain oil drive soft the rest of the 75 miles break in's done, enjoy.

i promise it does NOT take 1,000 miles to break in a engine.

Fact is, your method is good to seat rings.

The reason an FSM tells not to do that is simple: on a brand new engine, there are not only rings to break in. Transmission comes to mind too, and all other bits like pumps.

Drive it hard is a good way to break in seals, but is not a good way to break in a whole engine, let alone a whole car.

An guess what ? The FSM is about the whole car.


Now lets talk race engines.

As far as i can see them around, ALL of them gets a full rebuild after the end season, or at least a full stripping out and check everything. How much miles on them ? Not much.

So yes, when durability is not a concern and all that matters is power, pushing hard is a way to go.

On the other hand, some people enjoy driving their car more than twice a month for 10 months without having it thoroughly checked. These people should NOT do it the way you say is good.

Simple as that.

[S12 Drifter]

Fact is, your method is good to seat rings.

The reason an FSM tells not to do that is simple: on a brand new engine, there are not only rings to break in. Transmission comes to mind too, and all other bits like pumps.

Drive it hard is a good way to break in seals, but is not a good way to break in a whole engine, let alone a whole car.

An guess what ? The FSM is about the whole car.


Now lets talk race engines.

As far as i can see them around, ALL of them gets a full rebuild after the end season, or at least a full stripping out and check everything. How much miles on them ? Not much.

So yes, when durability is not a concern and all that matters is power, pushing hard is a way to go.

On the other hand, some people enjoy driving their car more than twice a month for 10 months without having it thoroughly checked. These people should NOT do it the way you say is good.

Simple as that.

you clearly did not read the entire thread. come back when you do because I'm not repeating my self again.

[Tom N]

http://zilvia.net/f/attachment.php?attachmentid=54658&stc=1&d=1368042209

[Mikester]

Its funny how almost every new person to Nissans thinks J-Spec engine are not ment for DD.

Believe it or not but Nissan designed these cars/Engines as DD's Not drift/Track cars.

as long as you use QUALITY parts then you shouldn't have any reliability issues.




^^Truth^^


Dude if it drives fine, and doesn't overheat, it will drive like a stock car if you are out of boosthttp://www.glpp.info/hu5a.jpg

^^True^^

I drove a few SR's cross country with no problems. 30+mpg is rad as fuck. I don't dick around with the car when I'm in the middle of no where because just like any motor ever, they can break. Just do you simple maintenance stuff on it, make sure its not leaking anywhere, and watch out for pot holes.

SRs are good to go!

True...

Best way to break in a motor on the street is hard bursts of acceleration and very important deceleration in 2nd and 3rd. Seeing as you typically can't just run through gears to red line on the street like you can on the dyno just do short bursts.
You don't want to cruise around for a few hundred miles with no load on the engine which in turn puts no pressure on the rings. This is completely wrong.

^^Absolutely True^^ You don't just want to bang out to redline in every gear, you need to make sure that target accel/decel rpm ranges (loads) are met and sustained in the first 15-20 HOURS of engine life, or they will never be met; resulting in a poochy car. Very well articulated, sir. However I am sure you will agree that unlike old muscle cars, the phrase 'break-in' is a bit of a misconception in and of itself these days. Unlike the oldies where moving parts had to physically wear into one another, modern tolerances and machining techniques have made that a thing of the past... For instance, If you change the oil in an SR after running it up and find metal shavings, you are in deep #$it lol.

Next-

Croustibat is absolutely correct. Not everybody is a race enthusiast... Some people will never beat the crap out of their cars to seat rings... even after their motor gets rebuilt... Because when you beat the engine, you beat the rest of the car. When you beat the car, other shit breaks. Hopefully, whoever rebuilds an engine for this type of person would take the time to ensure the correct loads are met on a dyno or on a long, straight country road prior to informing the customer their car is ready for pickup.

All that said, what I can't figure out is:

Always loved silvias and the SR20 but i'm finally getting to build my own engine now. my plan is to get 400hp and then i'm going to drive it from washington to virginia. since i'm new to this I just wanna know what mods and precautions should i take since i'll be driving it long distances and for long periods of times. i dont want anything to blow or over heat and i know theres gonna be some days where i just open it up.


Where exactly did this guy ask for break-in advice? He was just saying he wants to make 400hp and have his setup to be reilable enough to make cross-country trips.

Simrem, all you need for a reliable 400hp is fresh OEM pisotns/rods, bearings, valvetrain, gaskets & seals; ARP head studs, good cooling & fuel systems, good turbine & manifold, FMIC & exhaust, injectors, a good standalone, use good fluids and most of all GET A GOOD TUNE.

Also the advice above assumes proper machine work & measurements are done during the course of the rebuild. There are always other things that a good machinist/builder will recommend you replace as they turn up.

Words to the wise- all that GO is useless and dangerous with out the ability to control and STOP the car. Brakes, suspension and tires are key here as well- especially if you plan to spend lots of time on the freeways where things can get unpredictable between road conditions and other drivers.

Best of luck to ya.

[Chaluska]

My reasoning behind suggesting an OEM stat, is so the engine operates at a higher temperature (using less gas) for miles per gallon... if the engine runs cooler, it will burn more gas.

[S12 Drifter]

My reasoning behind suggesting an OEM stat, is so the engine operates at a higher temperature (using less gas) for miles per gallon... if the engine runs cooler, it will burn more gas.

On point. :wavey:

the engineers are smarter then this entire forum, engine was made with certain materials and pistons made of certain materials they figured out the expansion rate of these materials made a thermostat to keep expansion at a certain temperature, if you run colder like everyone does the engine will wear out faster and it might run into problems with ECU.

also rings are fully expanded as is the crank etc etc.

[aga]

On point. :wavey:
also rings are fully expanded as is the crank etc etc.

exhaust gas is what expands the rings.

[Sileighty_85]

The way I see it with the break in period.

Nissan broke these engines using the FSM method. These engines are still putting around 20 years later still rocking 150psi in the cylinders and can still put down 400hp stock bottom end.

So clearly the FSM method works.

When I fully built my SR I drove to Dallas and back conservatively until I started beating on it. Been 5 years since then of drifting and DD everyday, Never had an issue.

[OrangeVirus1]

from my personal experience, Either 1 of 2 things is going to happen.

The rings are going to set or the rings are not going to set.

Driving various different ways, WOT, cruise, Redline slamming etc, either it's gonna happen or it's not,
It depends a lot on how much quality control you put into it, and not just slapping shit together without measurements.

Nissan engineers built their engines with their eyes closed.. my stock RB20 pistons look like hexagons.. no joke lol.

[Croustibat]

you clearly did not read the entire thread. come back when you do because I'm not repeating my self again.

I did read the thread. I cant help but seeing how you get overly agressive with everyone that does not agree with you, while also posting useless messages.

On another note, you clearly did not read what i wrote, because it does not ask for any answer. You might have learned a lot and blah blah blah, as far as i am concerned, you are just an internet nickname; and on the internet, anyone can be a dog.

Fact is, your messages here are either authority argument or a blind copy/paste of an old article that has been opening can of worms since it was published. Dont deny it. I think most people here have read that article about breaking in rings.

Now, another fact *again* : this is a good way to break in rings, but it is not a good way to break in a car, which is what the FSM is about.

Now if you want to prove you know what you are talking about and not just copy/paste from an old article, get your calc out and find how much pressure is needed to correctly break in rings, how much pressure is put on the rings by the burning gasses when thrashing the engine, and how much when not.

Then we can talk.

[OrangeVirus1]

I've never heard of "breaking in a car."

breaking in the engine, clutch, yeah.

I have a 2011 Mazda 3 that I bought with 2 miles on it. brand new. I stomped it from the start, slammed redline every single day, Maxed it out (120mph) spun tires, launched etc, All within the first 1500 miles.
The engine and entire car is still strong as a horse.
Compression test straight across.
not only that, but it is NA, and @ 5k miles I Boosted it. I've got 35k miles on it now and not a SINGLE issue. I've creeped my way up to 15psi on a GT2871R before calling it quits. engine still shines, I drive the car everyday, The only problem i've ever had is a plastic piece fell off when I pulled off a really stupid steep curb.

So I think breaking in a car, isn't required anymore.

you want to break in an engine, start the car and hold it at redline for 5 minutes..

[RedTopKA-T]

I've never heard of "breaking in a car."

breaking in the engine, clutch, yeah.

I have a 2011 Mazda 3 that I bought with 2 miles on it. brand new. I stomped it from the start, slammed redline every single day, Maxed it out (120mph) spun tires, launched etc, All within the first 1500 miles.
The engine and entire car is still strong as a horse.
Compression test straight across.
not only that, but it is NA, and @ 5k miles I Boosted it. I've got 35k miles on it now and not a SINGLE issue. I've creeped my way up to 15psi on a GT2871R before calling it quits. engine still shines, I drive the car everyday, The only problem i've ever had is a plastic piece fell off when I pulled off a really stupid steep curb.

So I think breaking in a car, isn't required anymore.

you want to break in an engine, start the car and hold it at redline for 5 minutes..

That's funny, my buddy just got a mazdaspeed 6 and he blew the motor 3 times in 8 months and keeps snapping the shifter cable, all paid for by warranty, I guess their NA motors are stronger the the turbo one or its just a lemon..I have heard of "breaking in" the engine ,especially a built one just to be sure all the rings and gaskets get seated correctly..but there is no such thing as "breaking the car in" ,besides my ritual(bake it out with weed smoke!) LoL works for me! :D

[S12 Drifter]

exhaust gas is what expands the rings.


no, if you APPLY heat to rings they WILL expend a very small amount maybe less then .5mm but THEY DO expend, have you ever heard of the laws od expansion? I'm sure you have

everything will expend with heat, cams, gears, pistons, even cast iron expands with heat. what does this mean?

clearances between a hot engine and cold engine are very different. yes cast iron expands, not as fast as aluminum, and a very SMALL amount but IT STILL expends because of HEAT not exhaust gasses.

piston rings SEAL with exhaust gasses, there's a difference.

[OrangeVirus1]

That's funny, my buddy just got a mazdaspeed 6 and he blew the motor 3 times in 8 months and keeps snapping the shifter cable, all paid for by warranty, I guess their NA motors are stronger the the turbo one or its just a lemon..I have heard of "breaking in" the engine ,especially a built one just to be sure all the rings and gaskets get seated correctly..but there is no such thing as "breaking the car in" ,besides my ritual(bake it out with weed smoke!) LoL works for me! :D

The mazdaspeed 6 engine is a Generation 1 DISI engine, that is why, they were built and tuned so aggresively that they are prone to blowing up by just WOT'ing under 3k rpm BONE STOCK.
tell your friend if he wants his MS6 to stop blowing up, stop flooring it under 3k RPM. and if he has mods, he MUST HAVE AN AP. like if he has a Downpipe, he WILL 100% FOR sure no doubt SPIKE boost to 19-20psi, which the stock tune will say "nope" and bye bye engine.
He can get away with a a intake at most, without tune. anything else, like exhaust + intake, or downpipe, bigger intercooler, etc you have to tune it, or you are playing a game of russian roulet with 5/6 rounds lol

Mazda fixed this with the gen 2's with a new tune, and better suited pistons for DI.

It's not the NA vs turbo factor, it's just the fact that the Gen 1 DISI mazda engines ( speed 6, early speed 3 ) were prone to blowing the F up from a super aggresive tune ( like 10+ counts of knock was *normal* day operation) and flat top pistons that did not adequately spread the direct injected fuel. All that on Weak stock Connecting rods.

[S12 Drifter]

The way I see it with the break in period.

Nissan broke these engines using the FSM method. These engines are still putting around 20 years later still rocking 150psi in the cylinders and can still put down 400hp stock bottom end.

So clearly the FSM method works.

When I fully built my SR I drove to Dallas and back conservatively until I started beating on it. Been 5 years since then of drifting and DD everyday, Never had an issue.

so nissan drove their cars for 1000 miles... and gave it to the customer as a new car with 1,001 miles....

their dyno broken in engines.

[OrangeVirus1]

so nissan drove their cars for 1000 miles... and gave it to the customer as a new car with 1,001 miles....

their dyno broken in engines.

I doubt they put the whole car, probably like most manufactures, just put the engine on an engine dyno, and test it. but every single engine, I doubt it.


From what I have learned, companies build the engine, and run it on a engine dyno @ WOT maximum RPM for 100 hours non stop, and if the engine breaks before the 100 hours, they lower the max RPM / tune and or HP ( from tune ) until the engine can last 100 hours at that max RPM without issues.

I do not know from personal experience though, just what I have read / been told by people.

[Sileighty_85]

so nissan drove their cars for 1000 miles... and gave it to the customer as a new car with 1,001 miles....

their dyno broken in engines.

I don't know the ins and out of Nissans operations back in 1990, as Im sure you do not as well. Maybe they put it on a engine dyno for a bit. They are not gonna drop in a freshly built engine without testing it first. It'd be a waste of time if they did that the Find out the bearing clearances were incorrect and the engine seized

im fairly certain not ever person that bought a 180 or Silvia back then was clutch dumping and redlining the engine right off the lot.

I'm almost sure they informed new owners not to ride the engine too hard until a few hundred miles.

1k miles is not nesseary to break in an engnine, I only waited 300.

[S12 Drifter]

I did read the thread. I cant help but seeing how you get overly agressive with everyone that does not agree with you, while also posting useless messages.

On another note, you clearly did not read what i wrote, because it does not ask for any answer. You might have learned a lot and blah blah blah, as far as i am concerned, you are just an internet nickname; and on the internet, anyone can be a dog.

Fact is, your messages here are either authority argument or a blind copy/paste of an old article that has been opening can of worms since it was published. Dont deny it. I think most people here have read that article about breaking in rings.

Now, another fact *again* : this is a good way to break in rings, but it is not a good way to break in a car, which is what the FSM is about.

Now if you want to prove you know what you are talking about and not just copy/paste from an old article, get your calc out and find how much pressure is needed to correctly break in rings, how much pressure is put on the rings by the burning gasses when thrashing the engine, and how much when not.

Then we can talk.


indeed i did read moto mans break in method your RIGHT! I have broken ALL my engines that way since. never had a problem with a engine, the last VGi built is in my car makes so much torque i recently shattered my 1st and 2nd CLEAN along with a broken shift fork and all sorts of surprises. it's a STRONG healthy engine. I rebuilt my RB and will use moto mans method to break it in BECAUSE it works.

I compression tested my VG two weeks ago 175psi across all cylinders on a 7.8:1 compression engine. and i beat the crap out of my engines. thats not bad at all. no change since rebuild. my idle is always around 21 inches of mercury around 22. it's a retarded strong engine.

nothing i have said is copy and paste it has been from my own words, I'm not some hot shot engine builder I don't claim to know everything but what i know is from experience from what works for me, or WHAT i know works or does not work.

YOU DO NOT break in a car you break in the drive-line theres a difference. :D

I broke my differential in by doing a sick burnout and a 500 mile drive with agresssive driving (broke in my VG this way too.) pulled the diff apart not to long ago and everything is wearing beautifully.

It's about knowledge knowledge is POWER! i have learned a lot thought out my life of working on cars, AND I'M STILL LEARNING!!! you never stop learning with cars, theres always something new out there! maybe you think im a wanna be hot shot but realistically I'm not any smarter then the techs working at the dealers i know what I know because i love to read up on how things actually work.

if the FSM told you to throw your bearings in dog shit would you do it? :ughd:

[OrangeVirus1]

I compression tested my VG two weeks ago 175psi across all cylinders on a 7.8:1 compression engine.

are you high? smoky smoky weed weed?

and you probably broke your gears not because your engine makes more torque than a dyno can read, it's because you probably can't drive, or you thought " wonder what happens when I shift to 1rst on the highway"




I broke my differential in by doing a sick burnout


this is something like a 16 year old would say.

[Sileighty_85]

if the FSM told you to throw your bearings in dog shit would you do it? :ughd:

If Moto man told you to would you?

I would if that's how Nissan was able to make SRs last 20 years and handle 400+ HP after 20 years

[OrangeVirus1]

If Moto man told you to would you?

I would if that's how Nissan was able to make SRs last 20 years and handle 400+ HP after 20 years

We all know the only reason they can handle 400hp in the first place is because like all late 80- early 90's turbo cars, the rods were beefed to the max, Drop forged diesel sized rods.

not because they have some super awesome design...

[zombiewolf513]

if the FSM told you to throw your bearings in dog shit would you do it? :ughd:

...

Yeah.

...

Who do you think writes the FSMs? Mechanics? Fuck no. Mechanical Engineers, Electrical Engineers, Metrologists, and everyone that designed the car (metallurgists, Manufacturing Engineers, Industrial Engineers, Technologists, etc.)

If theyre saying "hey, this is the proper way to do this" they probably know what theyre talking about.

You act like the FSM is a Haynes Service Book from Autozone.

[Sileighty_85]

We all know the only reason they can handle 400hp in the first place is because like all late 80- early 90's turbo cars, the rods were beefed to the max, Drop forged diesel sized rods.

not because they have some super awesome design...

Clearly it was because of an "awesome design" since the engine was DESIGNED to have those internal parts, and it's not just the rods

[OrangeVirus1]

Clearly it was because of an "awesome design" since the engine was DESIGNED to have those internal parts, and it's not just the rods

yeah but the SR20 is not alone with that ability.

Rb20, Rb25, RB26, 4G63, SR20, VG30ET,VG30DET, 1JZ/2JZ, L28ET ( is that correct? ) 4AGET, etc etc.

they all have one thing in common, excessively big drop forged rods. ( especially the 6 bolt 4g63 lol 700+ whp on stock rods )

From what I read, car Man. did not know how strong the rods would need to be to hold the power over a long period of time, so they made them 3-4x stronger than what was already adequate.

Something that does not happen anymore :(

[zombiewolf513]

From what I read, car Man. did not know how strong the rods would need to be to hold the power over a long period of time, so they made them 3-4x stronger than what was already adequate.

Something that does not happen anymore :(

Its called a factor of safety. Nearly everything designed by professional engineers is still made with it.

[Sileighty_85]

I never said it was just the SR

[S12 Drifter]

lol Nissan makes strong rods, i have heard of people using the rod RB rods in 700hp applications with ARP rod bolts though. but yea nissan makes their rods really strong, I suppose it works out in the end.

[S12 Drifter]

yeah but the SR20 is not alone with that ability.

Rb20, Rb25, RB26, 4G63, SR20, VG30ET,VG30DET, 1JZ/2JZ, L28ET ( is that correct? ) 4AGET, etc etc.

they all have one thing in common, excessively big drop forged rods. ( especially the 6 bolt 4g63 lol 700+ whp on stock rods )

From what I read, car Man. did not know how strong the rods would need to be to hold the power over a long period of time, so they made them 3-4x stronger than what was already adequate.

Something that does not happen anymore :(

FJ, CA, KA ETC but as far as i know since the 1970's L24 all of nissan's rods have been forged. even the VR/VQ has forged rods i believe as do the VK and VH.

[casperiv]

:tweak:
I'm just going to jump in here and point out that over engineering of engines is not exclusive to the 80's and early 90's. Those are just the components that are cheap enough for the average person to use currently. There are modern engines just as over engineered if not more so. You have companies like Full Blown Motorsports figuring out that engines like the 4U-GSE/FA20 from the FT86/BRZ/FR-S can run over 600HP with just the addition of boost and that is a high comp engine not intended to be boosted (12.5:1 compression :naughty:). This trend is all over the place. Look at Audi straight 5 cylinder engines, they may only push 300HP from the factory in many applications but the internals are good for nearly 1000HP.

Companies over engineer when the money managers allow. It's good for their reputations, both from a reliability as well as a tuning perspective. Companies with who build engines with no head room do so because the accountants and lawyers sucked up their manufacturing budgets.

*******************************************

Now, to the topic at hand: driving a 400HP car across country is no different than driving a 200HP car, so long as it's not done in boost the whole way. I bought a used motorcycle, did some basic maintenance, and rode over 2,200 miles in a bit over a week with it (ended up piling on 20,000 miles in a year and trading it in). If a vehicle is sound, it's sound. If a part is going to fail, the odds of it failing in a convenient place are next to nil. Basic maintenance before the trip will give you the best indications of the health of the vehicle. Assuming I can get my SR back in my car in time, I will be doing the same trip with it this year (driving from Oregon to Las Vegas and Lake Havasu before looping back). I may also be driving it down to Hot August Nights in Reno if we other relatives want to take their classics down. If I can't trust my car to drive like a normal car, why would I trust it to go fast?

[codyace]

What does top end WHP have to do with anything? When you're driving it, it probably makes 200whp at best.

[S12 Drifter]

What does top end WHP have to do with anything? When you're driving it, it probably makes 200whp at best.

not even more like 60 or 50hp at the most depending on rpm i mean.

[Kingtal0n]

Oooo How did I miss this. Can I join the flame... er I meant fun?

Flame me flame me! wait let me think of something stupid to say so I can get flamed. hang on.

Oh! I know! Dont Drive your (engine) long distances at constant 3600RPM+ or else you will put excessive wear and tear on your engine!! That may wind up wearing out your engine bearings sooner!

oh shucks that... that actually sounds kind of true. hmm. well flame me anyways.



Tuned a supra recently.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/draglarry/P1130291.jpg

2J are so easy to tune. I just have never met one that was difficult. Actually, its the PFC that makes life easy. TBH.

[Croustibat]

Upping a 20 day old thread to say just nothing. You high again ?

Seeing as a 2J is approx the same age as an SR, would you also say he should not drive past 3500rpm, or above 65mph, in order to avoid overheating, like you said to the guy you sold your previous piece of crap ?

[Kingtal0n]

Upping a 20 day old thread to say just nothing. You high again ?

Seeing as a 2J is approx the same age as an SR, would you also say he should not drive past 3500rpm, or above 65mph, in order to avoid overheating, like you said to the guy you sold your previous piece of crap ?

thanks for the flames! Still need moar though.

And to answer you questions, Toyota saw that one coming and the gearing in 6th on the highway is such that 3500+ rpms is over 80MPH, plenty fast enough.

I mean, you wouldnt downshift and run it in 5th or 4th right? Why not? Is it because:
A. You will reduce fuel economy because it takes more horsepower to turn the engine at a higher rpm
B: you will increase the wear and tear on the engine bearings/internals
C: you will increase the amount of heat due to friction that the engine oil must experience and deal with
D: All of the above

the bore and stroke is the same as the sr20det, 86mm iirc. Lets use calculus to calculate the piston speed when the angle of the crankshaft is 45* and 90* at 3000rpm and 3500rpm.

[Mikester]

Seriously???

[Croustibat]

i wont bother answering, just looking at his posts today is enough to know i would be wasting my time.

this guy really has a mental problem (and / or a drug addiction)

[Kingtal0n]

Seriously???

this was not an effective flame. Why not post up that loser gif from before? I really liked that.



this guy really has a mental problem (and / or a drug addiction)


I take drugs seriously and you should not joke about it. If my mental health is in question because I am so good at what I do, then fine. I let pictures and videos do the "talking" because most of what you see these days is just... talking. Especially on forums.
A/F curves dont lie and neither do uncorrected 0 smooth dynojet graphs. Just sayin'

[Kingtal0n]

Answer: D: All of the above

the bore and stroke is the same as the sr20det, 86mm iirc. Lets use calculus to calculate the piston speed when the angle of the crankshaft is 45* and 90* at 3000rpm and 3500rpm.


Because, I just couldnt let you guys down.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/draglarry/P1140912_zpsaccbbb2f.jpg

that didnt take long. what took long was the software I wrote tonight that takes the work out of the calculations.

[AdamR]

how is it different please explain to me. if you break in a race motor and use it on the street daily drive it how will it be unreliable if it's only using 70hp out of the 800 or 900hp is can make when taken to the extreme? as a matter of fact it will be more reliable on the street because it does not see the stresses it's suppose to see.

if you fully build a engine and just street drive it that motor will last a VERY long time because it never sees stress it's suppose to in other words the MOTOR WILL NEVER be the problem.

your argument about soft break in is nil.

ford, chevy, harley dyno break in their engines now, EVERYONE does before it leaves the factory.

how does the GT-R get broken in? GOING AND REDLINING through every gear before it leaves the factory...

OH NO YOUR SUPPOSE TO DO A SOFT BREAK IT! YOUR GOING TO DECREASE THE LIFE OF YOUR MOTOR NOW?!?!?!
please know what your talking about before you open your mouth, it would be nice to not deal with dumbasses on a daily basis.

Citation needed.

[Kingtal0n]

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/draglarry/pistons_zps0a320035.jpg


http://rapidshare.com/files/337532810/pistons.exe

[AdamR]

I take drugs seriously and you should not joke about it. If my mental health is in question because I am so good at what I do

The thing is, nobody cares you take drugs for whatever condition you have. It is a crass thing to say, but it is true.
You aren't good at anything besides going on tangents about minutia that is only barely on topic. Everyone sees it as a pretentious attention-grab. Just stop.

[Kingtal0n]

The thing is, nobody cares you take drugs for whatever condition you have. It is a crass thing to say, but it is true.
You aren't good at anything besides going on tangents about minutia that is only barely on topic. Everyone sees it as a pretentious attention-grab. Just stop.

Thats not a flame. please try again. Crusti is way better at it...

I just posted up a useful software utility for the community complete with source code. Where are your contributions?

[S12 Drifter]

the 2jz is a better motor then that shitty sr20. I'd rather take a 4g63 or a 20B then the craptasic SR.

[S12 Drifter]

Citation needed.

:cops::cops::cops:

lmao

[Sileighty_85]

Because, I just couldnt let you guys down.
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/draglarry/P1140912_zpsaccbbb2f.jpg

that didnt take long. what took long was the software I wrote tonight that takes the work out of the calculations.

Dude I dont even wanna start on everything that wrong with your formula here.

[Kingtal0n]

Dude I dont even wanna start on everything that wrong with your formula here.

Lol ill take that as a compliment. You have any idea what you are looking at?

be careful because I have some pretty solid math background. I did this in my spare time for fun. Its calc 1 so, easy stuff.

[Sileighty_85]

Lol ill take that as a compliment. You have any idea what you are looking at?

be careful because I have some pretty solid math background. I did this in my spare time for fun. Its calc 1 so, easy stuff.


Pshhh yeah bro

http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/0/8/2/0824edb0e64c135279d4f2e1f642dee2.pnghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/math/8/8/c/88c5b048d1d95fe2ae3d49cfeca245bd.pnghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/math/5/1/b/51be3c81cb4918d3107d8e8309e1a3c6.pnghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/math/4/7/7/4771478ab55882e34adf745604fdb35a.pnghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/math/3/2/1/321a94c0b83875431d08e4ad4aa38627.pnghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/math/8/8/3/883809a46e0ed320270e5090901c2f66.png

[Kingtal0n]

Hmm the formula you posted is actually used for determining the feed rate of cattle in a cylindrical tube spinning 2 miles above earth's atmosphere. nice find.

[Sileighty_85]

It's cool brah I had a feeling you didn't know what you were looking at

[S12 Drifter]

http://i.qkme.me/3r27v4.jpg

http://i.qkme.me/3s5m2z.jpg

http://www.easymemes.com/uploads/memes/24834_2z32BvV5yTgWn70.jpg

[AdamR]

:cops::cops::cops:

lmao

So you were just talking out of your ass again?
Duly noted.

[Croustibat]

I just posted up a useful software utility for the community complete with source code. Where are your contributions?

It is a shame you refuse to acknowledge other people could have done it better or faster before you did.

2 seconds on google would have given you a fast answer and many other calculators.

That and the exact piston speed ? Really ? No one needs that ... use stroke x rpm /6 and you get a very good approximation of the maximum piston speed, which is what matter. Simple is better.

Now if you excuse me, would you care to explain how you disconnect a turbine on your turbo cars so that you dont overheat driving more than 65mph ?

[S12 Drifter]

It is a shame you refuse to acknowledge other people could have done it better or faster before you did.

2 seconds on google would have given you a fast answer and many other calculators.

That and the exact piston speed ? Really ? No one needs that ... use stroke x rpm /6 and you get a very good approximation of the maximum piston speed, which is what matter. Simple is better.

Now if you excuse me, would you care to explain how you disconnect a turbine on your turbo cars so that you dont overheat driving more than 65mph ?

you sir are stupid. :smash:



when building a motor for performance EVERYTHING matters, piston speed, bore to stroke ratio, rod to stro ratio, harmonic balances,

PORT velocity (i dont believe in polishing, nor porting, porting should be don under CERTAIN conditions.) throttle body size, exhaust port diameter etc etc. maximium pistion expansion, maximum bore expansion, maximum ring expansion, all under operating temp, piston ring gap plays so much of a role on how reliable a engine makes power you have no idea. of course all tolerances are extremely important, some more then others. on engines like F1 or nascar when finding top dead center they heat the motors to 550 degrees F because all tolerances are at operating temperature it is easier to find a TRUE TDC that way.

I can promise you nor I am smarter then the people who engineered these engines on a piece of paper and brought them to life.

you port the shit out of your SR throw on the BIGGEST throttle body on the market, what 90mm? throw on a bigger exhaust manifold and go with a freddy intake manifold? hey your a home made engineer!!! props!!! for fucking up a design that worked prior to you touching it.

YEA some wicked drivablity your going to have, have fun with not making torque under 4,600.

no better then supra owners, they throw on the biggest turbo they can find, exhaust, intake ect ect expect to have the WIDE powerband and only end up having a powerband from 6,500-8k LMAO dyno queens.

[S12 Drifter]

delete post.

[AdamR]

you sir are stupid. :smash:



when building a motor for performance EVERYTHING matters, piston speed, bore to stroke ratio, rod to stro ratio, harmonic balances,

PORT velocity (i dont believe in polishing, nor porting, porting should be don under CERTAIN conditions.) throttle body size, exhaust port diameter etc etc. maximium pistion expansion, maximum bore expansion, maximum ring expansion, all under operating temp, piston ring gap plays so much of a role on how reliable a engine makes power you have no idea. of course all tolerances are extremely important, some more then others. on engines like F1 or nascar when finding top dead center they heat the motors to 550 degrees F because all tolerances are at operating temperature it is easier to find a TRUE TDC that way.

I can promise you nor I am smarter then the people who engineered these engines on a piece of paper and brought them to life.

you port the shit out of your SR throw on the BIGGEST throttle body on the market, what 90mm? throw on a bigger exhaust manifold and go with a freddy intake manifold? hey your a home made engineer!!! props!!! for fucking up a design that worked prior to you touching it.

YEA some wicked drivablity your going to have, have fun with not making torque under 4,600.

no better then supra owners, they throw on the biggest turbo they can find, exhaust, intake ect ect expect to have the WIDE powerband and only end up having a powerband from 6,500-8k LMAO dyno queens.

Brilliant.
Did you do all that math on the RB you built?

[Trap Star]

Bring a truck and a trailer.

[Matej]

What is the reasoning behind modding a vehicle in such a manner that causes the owner not to trust it to transport oneself from point A to point B?

[fliprayzin240sx]

Man, OV1 goes away, S12 Drifter replaces him and KingTalon goes straight Bizarro.

[codyace]

What is the reasoning behind modding a vehicle in such a manner that causes the owner not to trust it to transport oneself from point A to point B?

Only on the forums will people fap over a big dollar setup that goes 2000 miles a year.

Screw that. I see that on track a year.

[Croustibat]

you sir are stupid. :smash:



when building a motor for performance EVERYTHING matters, piston speed, bore to stroke ratio, rod to stro ratio, harmonic balances,

PORT velocity (i dont believe in polishing, nor porting, porting should be don under CERTAIN conditions.) throttle body size, exhaust port diameter etc etc. maximium pistion expansion, maximum bore expansion, maximum ring expansion, all under operating temp, piston ring gap plays so much of a role on how reliable a engine makes power you have no idea. of course all tolerances are extremely important, some more then others. on engines like F1 or nascar when finding top dead center they heat the motors to 550 degrees F because all tolerances are at operating temperature it is easier to find a TRUE TDC that way.

I can promise you nor I am smarter then the people who engineered these engines on a piece of paper and brought them to life.

you port the shit out of your SR throw on the BIGGEST throttle body on the market, what 90mm? throw on a bigger exhaust manifold and go with a freddy intake manifold? hey your a home made engineer!!! props!!! for fucking up a design that worked prior to you touching it.

YEA some wicked drivablity your going to have, have fun with not making torque under 4,600.

no better then supra owners, they throw on the biggest turbo they can find, exhaust, intake ect ect expect to have the WIDE powerband and only end up having a powerband from 6,500-8k LMAO dyno queens.

DAFUQ did i just read there ?

I am going to write it down again. We dont care about EXACT piston speed, we are not building F1 engines. All we need is MAXIMUM piston speed, and this is given by a freaking simple formulae.

As far as the other stuff you wrote, i highly suggest you first learn who people are and what they do before making any comment. I am one of the few posters on zilvia that keeps repeating the damn same thing you wrote, so dont ever write that BS to me ...

[mantas]

Fuck. You people are relentless, just stop with the bickering. Im sure OP is long gone but ive seen this thread and it went sour from the get go when i read it a few days ago. Either way, to the OP - if its not too late yet - driving a car at a constant speed for long periods of time is much better than driving it in stop and go traffic. I say go for it, ive taken my rb s14 for some long drives and never had a problem.

[Trap Star]

^^HAHAHAHA

fair enough :)

What is the reasoning behind modding a vehicle in such a manner that causes the owner not to trust it to transport oneself from point A to point B?

Its not necessarily the mods. 240s are old cars, shits going to break.