drivinsidewayz86

Hey guys im on the verge of finishing my engine and i have my stock s15 head and im on the fence about doing.a ve head vs building my head with solid lifters ive read all of the threads an keep seeing that you have to reshim solid.lifters if i did tomei lifters is it worth it to do the solid lifters or should i.just buy a p12 head i plan to have 600+hp

e5s4y

subscribed.

I'm not too knowledgeable about this specific subject, but i know my bike has solid lifters, and i have to check the valve clearances every 15k miles or so. Not too big of a deal to check, but can be a pain to change out shims. not sure if this kind of thing applies here or not.

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jr_ss

VE will make more power all day long. Sure power can be had out of the DET head, just takes more work and boost. Solid lifters only prevent you from throwing rocker arms at high RPMs, it doesn't increase your overall power potential. You still need the supporting mods to get it to spin that high. You'll also need to buy the corresponding cams from Tomei for the solid lifters and you will have to check tolerances every 5k or so and swap out to the correct shims if necessary. If that's not a big deal for you, save yourself some money and do the rocker upgrade. If you want nothing to do with floating rockers, go VE.

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Hashiriya415

VE head. No reason to build up old technology head when you have all new redesigned better head that will outperform the old built head in every way.

STR8E180

Ve head will stil rev harder then a solid lifter det cylinder head
Ve head will also be more responsive and make more power

ForeignMuscle

I think the answer to your question is how much coin do you want to drop? Of course VE will flow better but that is not as simple as throwing solid lifters in. You need a VE oil pump, the complete head, solenoid kit, a hole in your firewall or a Hall effect sensor, and of course your manifolds will have to be for VE or reflanged. I say VE all the way if you have the money.

SlideOrDie831

VE head. theres more then just swapping the head though.

jr_ss

DET manifolds will work, you just need to oblong the bolt holes...

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Hashiriya415

VE oil pump is needed regardless. Higher RPM screams for that extra oil.
Solenoids are not needed if you don't want the little bit of extra power at lower RPM, just keep the high lobe cam engaged all the time.

ForeignMuscle

Sure you can skimp and not do this and cheat on that. Doing things right the first time makes all the difference. And look at the size of the intake and exhaust ports on the VE head compared to the det head.. Just using det manifolds will be restrictive. Of course you can port the manifolds and all that. You should be doing your homework for a while before just jumping into this. There is going to be a huge price difference between these two options, but with money comes performance.

STR8E180

My p12 crank angle sensor clears the firewall, no need to chop a hole in the firewall

You dont nee a solenoid kit if your using a p12 head as well

STR8E180

All Ve cylinder heads share the same size exhaust ports As the de/det
Exhaust Ports are the same only difference is the flange
The Ve bolt holes are off set but the exhaust ports them self flow the same
It's only the intake port which is bigger on the Ve heads

jr_ss

That depends on the chassis you have. If I'm not mistaken you have an S13. The S14 firewall/bulkhead is different and there is less room to fit the CAS, hence why I had to use the Mazworx trigger wheel setup.

Exactly, and this is what I was implying when I stated that the DET manifold works.

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ForeignMuscle

I've also heard motor mounts can make a difference. And I learned something new today. Sorry guys, I thought exhaust ports were larger as well. Either way I think I made my point on price difference. If you have the cash then of course go VE.

[email protected]

what is your overall goal of your set up?
VVL isnt cheap and 95% of the people who do it do it for the wrong reason and spend lots of $ for something that could be been done for far cheaper

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MunkyW3rkz Racing

jr_ss

What exactly would you call the right reason? And what is your idea of the wrong?

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kuz people seem to be doing it for the bling factor,
yes we all know the VE head is in a different league then the DET no question there but if your looking to be in the 500-600 range
is the cost of going VE worth it when the DET will do the job and you can put that $ elsewhere

if i could go VE i would on mine but my set up is built differently then those built here for sideways action

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hobbs

Because ya know, oil pressure activating the intake and exhaust cams have nothing to do with the higher flowing VE pump, it's just because they rev higher.


Fuck, the stupid shit people say these days...


They are larger than the DE/DET ports, not by much but they are indeed bigger. They share the same bolt pattern as the DE/DET so manifolds bolt right up but will need to be ported to match the VE.

ForeignMuscle

So I was right? I'm just confused now. I thought they were larger too. I know the intake ports are a lot larger.

autotechmotoring

Intake ports are larger from the factory on a ve head than a max porter det head. The shaft mounted rockers are definetly a plus. The factory valves are slightly larger in head diameter than the det head. Increased air flow to the head helps the engine breathe better and will definetly help get your turbo to come on alot sooner. Yes there is alot involved in doing the ve head swap, but it's benefits weigh well over doing a det head worked over.

If you do decide to do solid pivot setup, you will need to occasionally shim the head. This is not a fail safe to broken rockers. There is also dual guide conversion that can be done to help also prevent broken rockers. And no rOcker arm stoppers will not help either. The damages I've seen with exploding and broken rockers is not pretty.

Oh yes also in the conversion, you will need to modify the oil pickup also.

STR8E180

We recently put a Ve head setup into a s15 and the crank angle sense also cleared the firewall and I'm pretty sure s15 and s14 share the same engine bay firewall

STR8E180

this is SR20DET exhaust manifold flange placed on a SR20ve cylinder head

ports are the same just the bolt holes are offset

STR8E180

DIFFERENCE BETWEEN P11 AND P12 INTAKE PORTS

ForeignMuscle

Cool man. I'm at work or I would have searched myself. This is interesting because eventually I will go this route. So keep the info coming. Anyone care to share how much money they have in their conversion??

MadScientist

If I didn't already have a built S14 SR head... I would have went P12 SR head.

Cost wise P12 will still cost less.

Est. about $3k in parts and machine work on the S14 SR head as I have it right now.

Parts:
Tomei Solid 270 in/ex
Tomei cam gears
Tomei solid pivots
Tomei shims (test and actual)
Tomei bronze valve guides
Tomei valve seats
Tomei RAS (because)
SuperTech valves
SuperTech retainers
SuperTech 110lb twin springs

Machine work:
Port n Polished
3 angle valves (valves and head)
30 deg. port flair
Shiming
Hot Tank
Guides removed & replaced
Assembly

I have more than just that done, I can't think of it all... shit wasn't cheep!!

ForeignMuscle

Yea I know building s13/14 heads is outrageous. I will definitely go VE before I fully build a 52f head.

STR8E180

if cost isnt an issue then a VE head is the way to go
its got a much more reliable valve train design

jr_ss

What engine mounts are being used? Do they have a Z32 trans behind them?

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STR8E180

My s13 has a rb25 PPG dog box behind it
Engine and gearbox mounts are nismo items

The s15 I posted above as a powerglide auto behind it
Engine mounts are nismo items
Gearbox cross member is custom made but using nismo gearbox mount

jr_ss

That's interesting. I'm running a Mazworx Z32 trans kit and Nismo mounts all around and I have 1.5-2" behind my head. Not enough for a P12 CAS.

The S15 does have the same firewall/bulkhead, but I'm curious if LHD vs RHD has anything to do with that. I'm guessing it does.

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