Disco potato on stock redtop?

[EccentricBro]

info: s13 hatch, fmic, efans, big radiator, recirc'd tial QR, straight pipe, walbro

Alright so i'm pretty sure my t25's turbo seals are going. I could go through the trouble of taking it off and replacing them, but i planned on getting the GT28RS down the line anyway (after injectors and ecu) so i think i might just get it now, earlier than expected. my question is this...obviously running stock injectors on the stock ECU i'm not going to be able to push any kind of decent boost yet, so if i get it and just run it at 8 psi like i am with the t25, it shouldn't make a difference whether the other stuff is stock or not, correct? as long as i don't raise boost it should be virtually the same...which leads me to a similar concern about the ECU. i've got a NEO in there that came with the car, but i'm probably just gonna sell it, get a standalone and do a MAP conversion. i'm thinking the AEM one (can't remember name)..but opinions on which standalone is best?

tl;dr running a disco potato at same PSI as t25 shouldn't cause problems using stock injectors/ecu, correct?

[slideslidegnarslide]

Wrong. You might be able to get away with it but a larger turbo flows more air at the same psi level. So your tune will be off.

Aem ems is a good ecu.

[mmakam2]

u should be ok running haltech, aem, motec, proefi

[EccentricBro]

alright. so definitely need at least the ecu to run it. I'll get injectors eventually, but I can at least tune the ecu for the stock injectors temporarily. are there upgrade injectors that are direct bolt on?

also, not trying to make huge power, only looking for around 300hp or so. just a streetable fun car lol

[mmakam2]

i think the stockers are 270cc, they are the side feeds, u can upgrade injectors but dont buy any of the drilled ones or ebay ones, buy oem bolt ins, or get a fuel rail and some ID750s. the IDs will give u way better tuneabilty and gas mileage and idle

[fliprayzin240sx]

i think the stockers are 270cc, they are the side feeds, u can upgrade injectors but dont buy any of the drilled ones or ebay ones, buy oem bolt ins, or get a fuel rail and some ID750s. the IDs will give u way better tuneabilty and gas mileage and idle

Ooooooooreeeeaaaallly? 270cc? Its an SR, not a KA...

[mmakam2]

370cc??

lol

[Twiglet240]

I used to have a FWD DET with a dicso, I miss that car.. If I were you I'd just wait and get the correct ecu, injectors, mafs and disco all at once.

[mmakam2]

get the standalone first.

then any mods you get can easily be adjusted for in the tune.

[EccentricBro]

i was gonna wait and get everything set up for the new turbo first, but like i said my t25 blew a seal i'm pretty sure, so i don't wanna put effort into taking it apart and fixing it just to replace it soon anyway, which is why i made this thread.. to see if i could safely just buy it now. the answer seems yes, just get ECU first.

[mmakam2]

pretty much man, the thing is if u get a different turbo, you can get the car to run, but its never safe to run an untuned car.

be safe, run the turbo burning oil if u have to, get the ecu, then change out the turbo

[MedHat240sx]

im running a stock sr20 with a GT2871r and have no problems A/F ratio is 14.7 at idle only thing is i dont richen up at WOT at cruising im 13.8 A/F no tune

[EccentricBro]

for sure, that's the plan. i'm no master tech but i've got a little common sense haha thanks. you think doing the standalone/MAP conversion is worth it? i'm not to sure i like the idea of a piggyback, especially the NEO. i know the NEO basically tricks the MAF and ends up messing with timing..definitely not keeping that, i'm not sure if other piggybacks are similar. i know standalone and MAP is the best option, but after that and tune alone is a big chunk of money. i'm not cheap, i don't skimp out on stuff, but if there is a reliable piggyback option i'm okay with it.

[mmakam2]

i would not ever run a piggy back, i had a greddy emanage ultimate for a little while, its a nightmare to tune with and its not safe.

not sure what the neo does, but the emanage intercepts the sensor inputs and modifies the signals to trick the stock ecu into outputting different values based on the modified inputs.

when you get a standalone like a haltech/aem/motec, u can immediately delete the maf, and the car will run off the internal map sensor in the ecu. as long as u have no vacuum/boost leaks, itll read correctly. i have the haltech, and it came with a decent base map, and its really easy to tweak and log anyways. ultimately tho u want to get it dyno tuned.

[EccentricBro]

well my problem just got worse. here's a thread i posted a few days ago http://zilvia.net/f/s-chassis/524012-white-smoke-idle.html#post5318416

smoke clearly comes out of my exhaust at idle. yesterday it was only when it first warmed up in the morning then it stopped, so i figured something is leaking slowly and it just burnt all of the shit that leaked out. didn't happen again yesterday. same thing happened this morning then it stopped...now on my way home i smelt burning oil, and sure enough when i pulled up to my house and parked it, it started pouring out.

not gonna explain things, just read my other thread...point is there is no visible oil leaks anywhere which leads me to believe its the turbo seals, the previous owner said they were on their way out anyway. i figured if it only happened once a day, fuck it i can live with it for a bit. but it's getting worse.

i think i'm gonna have to end up replacing the seal because i've gotta fix a wheel bearing and an axle as it is, don't have too much extra money to drop on an ECU and turbo. this blows. the thought passed by in my head that maybe i dented the oil pan, but that would most likely visibly leak and definitely not end up in the exhaust. what else would cause oil to burn in exhaust?

[mmakam2]

burnt oil is blue, burnt coolant is white, it doesn't necessarily smell sweet if its coming through the exhaust.

do a compression test.

take off the downpipe and check for oil in there

[rich280zx]

at least when you sell the turbo it will be relatively fresh. Make a little more money back on it and it'll be an easier sell.

[EccentricBro]

I'm 95% sure its oil. if you dumped oil on top of your engine and let it run...that's the smell.. lol when it got thick today it did have a blue tint. I'll be able to test tomorrow. I'm out atm

[TheRealSy90]

Since when is the map sensor inside the ecu... Some fail in this thread.

[mmakam2]

Since when is the map sensor inside the ecu... Some fail in this thread.

my haltech has a vacuum port with the map sensor built into the ems housing, it is good for 20psi.

i am fairly sure the aem ems has the same thing

noobs gtfo.....

[mmakam2]

obviously not all ems will have an internal map, in my case i had one.

[EccentricBro]

that actually sounds like a good idea. how reliable is the MAP built in as apposed to a normal mount? 20 PSI sounds like it would be fine for the numbers i'm trying to make (don't quote me though, have no clue tbh)

[rich280zx]

Megasquirt also has an internal map sensor

[Mile High Silvia]

I'm running stock sr with a disco on aem ems map sensor tune. Runs amazing. Running 17psi hi and 11 lo, awesome in the canyons.

Post some pics of your Tial bov I'm getting rid of my greddy and going Tial qr.

[EccentricBro]

I'm running stock sr with a disco on aem ems map sensor tune. Runs amazing. Running 17psi hi and 11 lo, awesome in the canyons.

Post some pics of your Tial bov I'm getting rid of my greddy and going Tial qr.

for the short time i ran it venting it sounded awesome i miss it. i got it recirc'd now.

Photo Album - Imgur (http://imgur.com/a/izECD#0)

[Mile High Silvia]

Recircd is much better for the turbo tho! :) can't wait to get my Tial on.

[EccentricBro]

if you're running a MAF and don't have it recirc'd the car will run like shit...now MAP on the other hand..you get to enjoy bov noises all day

[codyace]

Don't put anything different turbo wise on there until you get a good tune/ecu setup, and the proper fueling.

Even at 8psi, a 28RS will push the OEM injectors/maf/fuel pump to their limits and maybe even exceed them. This will only cause more headache for you when the engine fouls up.

[EccentricBro]

Don't put anything different turbo wise on there until you get a good tune/ecu setup, and the proper fueling.

Even at 8psi, a 28RS will push the OEM injectors/maf/fuel pump to their limits and maybe even exceed them. This will only cause more headache for you when the engine fouls up.

yeah for sure. i don't have spare money to dump into it atm anyway. ordered a rebuild kit for t25 and just gonna do that next week. i'm not trying to push numbers, which is making me reconsider getting rid of a piggyback. i just want to get AFR's correct so i can get the stock motor running properly. it's definitely running way too lean, nasty gurgling on decel. i figure as long as i stay at 300hp or below a piggyback will be good enough for now

[godsmack]

the only issue with running it not recirculated is when you are coming to a stop immediately after boosting. unless i'm the only sr non recirculated owner to not have problems.

if you're running a MAF and don't have it recirc'd the car will run like shit...now MAP on the other hand..you get to enjoy bov noises all day

[EccentricBro]

the only issue with running it not recirculated is when you are coming to a stop immediately after boosting. unless i'm the only sr non recirculated owner to not have problems.

when mine was venting it couldn't even idle. idle would fluctuate between 300-1300 just bouncing back and forth. after boost or not, my car would ALWAYS stall. every single stop sign i either had to pop the clutch or restart the engine. driving it was fine, but if my foot wasn't on the gas pedal it would almost stall every second, catch itself at 200 or so RPM, then go back to 1300, rinse and repeat

edit: found an old vid of idle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l50m3M2ydHE&feature=youtu.be

[godsmack]

I would have to say then that your bov was leaking. My car idles great and just dips a little bit after a pull and goes right back to a good idle again.

when mine was venting it couldn't even idle. idle would fluctuate between 300-1300 just bouncing back and forth. after boost or not, my car would ALWAYS stall. every single stop sign i either had to pop the clutch or restart the engine. driving it was fine, but if my foot wasn't on the gas pedal it would almost stall every second, catch itself at 200 or so RPM, then go back to 1300, rinse and repeat

edit: found an old vid of idle IMG 0413 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l50m3M2ydHE&feature=youtu.be)

[EccentricBro]

I would have to say then that your bov was leaking. My car idles great and just dips a little bit after a pull and goes right back to a good idle again.

I had a Tial Q which we thought was leaking, but was just staying open slightly. Because we thought it was a bad BoV i replaced with tial QR, but the same shit happened. Maybe it is because of where they mounted it, how it was tuned, or some other random shit..point is it kept itself cracked open all the time and recirculation cured the issue.

[Mile High Silvia]

Yea recirculated is better, map or Maf, it's just better to have a closed system.

[codyace]

yeah for sure. i don't have spare money to dump into it atm anyway. ordered a rebuild kit for t25 and just gonna do that next week. i'm not trying to push numbers, which is making me reconsider getting rid of a piggyback. i just want to get AFR's correct so i can get the stock motor running properly. it's definitely running way too lean, nasty gurgling on decel. i figure as long as i stay at 300hp or below a piggyback will be good enough for now

With the 'stock stuff' I wouldn't push it much past 12ish PSI on the stock T25...at that rate you'll already max the injectors/maf/fuel system.

Piggybacks are a funny thing - to me they are not worth the cost when a JWT or Enthalpy ECU are equally as afordable, tuned better, and much less hassel to install.


when mine was venting it couldn't even idle. idle would fluctuate between 300-1300 just bouncing back and forth. after boost or not, my car would ALWAYS stall. every single stop sign i either had to pop the clutch or restart the engine. driving it was fine, but if my foot wasn't on the gas pedal it would almost stall every second, catch itself at 200 or so RPM, then go back to 1300, rinse and repeat

You still have a vacuum leak someplace, regardless of the recirculated BOV.

[EccentricBro]

With the 'stock stuff' I wouldn't push it much past 12ish PSI on the stock T25...at that rate you'll already max the injectors/maf/fuel system.

Piggybacks are a funny thing - to me they are not worth the cost when a JWT or Enthalpy ECU are equally as afordable, tuned better, and much less hassel to install.


You still have a vacuum leak someplace, regardless of the recirculated BOV.

wasn't gonna push the t25 past 10psi. but yeah i'd much rather an ECU and tune. maybe i'll just spend the money on that after i fix a few suspension issues. t25 will be freshly rebuilt so it should be good to last a while haha. i'm pretty sure there aren't vacc leaks anymore, but i'll double check when i get it apart

[Mile High Silvia]

If he has a maf tune and the bov is venting to atmosphere then he is releasing metered air which will cause it to run rich and have stumbling issues as described. Very possible to have some leaks but a recirc will help for sure.