S13 SR20DET Weird Noises - Lifters/ Bearing/ Rods? **VIDEO** [Archive] - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

Dorifto Machine

03-22-2013, 10:19 PM

Short History: Bought a S13 SR20 Blacktop from a Zilvia member May of 2012.
Properly installed it over the last couple months. As of last month the car was running , had a high idle . Idle was corrected (Timing, TPS, IACV ) and car has been running for last couple weeks some what fine. All vitals and fluids were being checked periodically/topped off .

Problem: I noticed the water pump has been leaking out of the weap hole, so I ordered a new water pump. . During that time, this weird noise was presented intermittently after driving the car a little harder than normal (noise sounds like a door stopper being played with a rattle ) . Figured it was related to the water pump, maybe the bearings were shot or broken blade . So stopped driving it, replaced the water pump. Previous one was rusted to hell, no broken blades, no play in it, just leaky. Today , I went to crank the car and same noise is present if not louder / more consistent with also a squeaky/tick sound..
The car has oil in it and all other fluids are good.

Car is running at stock boost.
These are the specs of what the previous owner said is in the engine as far as under the valve cover;

HKS 256 cams
Rocker arm stoppers
BC valves and retainers

Here is the video of the sound. Watch from beginning to end. The noise is super evident around the 1:00 minute mark.

Video: http://youtu.be/qjcOfeW4cYc

Tomorrow, I will be opening the valve cover to check and see whats going on underneath. Maybe this will be good for anyone with a similar issue in the future.

What do you guys think it could possibly be before I tear things apart? Any suggestions?

Ive got a couple opinions from friends familiar with this motor, some saying it sounds like a lifter is bad to another saying it sounds like a rod knock or timing chain related...

Thanks for any and all help!

ISSUE FIXED 3/30/2013. Investigated and found a Loose Flywheel was the issue. Read Thread !

codyace

03-22-2013, 11:07 PM

You're link doesn't work

Hard to say without hearing sound, could be a few things.

Dorifto Machine

03-22-2013, 11:29 PM

Thanks Cody, My link is live now. Try again , please.
Make sure you set it to 720p for highest quality.

Dorifto Machine

03-23-2013, 09:49 AM

Anyone have an idea on what the sound/issue is in the video?

codyace

03-23-2013, 11:58 AM

Wow that's some racket for sure.

That sounds like it's something in the top end of the engine, or in the tensioning system for sure. I'd be pulling the valve cover to inspect for sure. Collapsed lifters don't usually sound like that.

Rod knock usually happens at a certain RPM (which can be different in each case) and is easily repeatable...your's obviously makes sounds, but it seems to varry

Here is a great video of an SR with rod knock SR20 GTiR rod knock - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW8tFnZqzGs) just to give you an idea of how it sounds.

Good luck, hopefully it's a simple procedure and not long term surgery!

Dorifto Machine

03-23-2013, 01:24 PM

Here is what it looks like: From what I can tell I do not see anything broken.
Spun the crank by hand a few times and no sounds while I was doing so.

http://imageshack.us/a/img545/4786/95588258.png

http://imageshack.us/a/img811/9015/15440472.png

http://imageshack.us/a/img545/7191/36885743.png

http://imageshack.us/a/img163/4306/13142781.png

http://imageshack.us/a/img6/4208/31858300.png

http://imageshack.us/a/img845/6981/69130134.png

KiLLeR2001

03-23-2013, 01:44 PM

Cam lobes don't look too healthy. The oil tubes are either clogged or the tiny holes that drip oil are. Also the gold baffle should be removed (since you have RAS installed) and you need a spacer on the intake side to help position it better, heres a picture of my engine right after I installed the Tomei Rocker Arm Stoppers...

http://tehl33tsite.com/240sxdd/black240/restoration/engine/IMAG0197.jpg

Sorry its blurry but you get the idea.

edit:

Refer to this post of my build thread for more pictures...

http://zilvia.net/f/builds-builds-only/378665-s13-5-daily-driver-build-thread-2.html#post4248274

Dorifto Machine

03-23-2013, 04:35 PM

Thanks Steven, I'll take note .

So after inspecting everything I decided to Prime the engine with the cover off to see whats going on with Oil....

It seems like nothing is squirting out of the oil tubes. Took them off and cleaned them / blew some air in it and I felt air come out of the holes, put them back on and still same thing. Oil comes out of of the back but not out of tubes. Again, Oil Dipstick says full. Could they still be clogged?

Video of Priming without Valve- Cover:

Faris Xero SR20DET Clear view of OIL Priming Side view - YouTube (http://youtu.be/UYiaGrYeczk)

Faris Xero SR20DET Clear View of Rear OIL Priming - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy16-smMHlg&feature=youtu.be)

What do you guys think, Possible Weak or Bad Oil pump or something else? Never seen this before.

cotbu

03-23-2013, 05:36 PM

Dorifto Machine

03-23-2013, 05:46 PM

clogged port, or misaligned cam cap. Idk why its squirting from there though with the cap on, maybe the bolt is stripped and not torqued properly. Take the last cap off on both sides there a little hole, snake something through it or blow it out with compressed air. if the bolts are stripped you do have options!

Good point. I will check tomorrow in the day.
When you say clogged port, the port (hole) underneath the cam cap or ports on the tube?
Also to note, I noticed when it was running their was a small chirp/squeak sound like a loose belt however it was not, I'm beginning to think it could of been because of the cams being dry.

Here is a rear shot so you can see where the oil is coming from better.

Faris Xero SR20DET Clear View of Rear OIL Priming - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy16-smMHlg&feature=youtu.be)

Now a friend keeps suggesting the weird sound could be timing chain related, Before I dive into that are we determining this is most likely an oil problem for sure? Can someone clarify for me that indeed the oil not squirting is for sure an issue.. I was under impression oil should squirt out of the holes on the tube for sure when priming.

codyace

03-23-2013, 08:25 PM

cotbu

03-23-2013, 09:09 PM

Good point. I will check tomorrow in the day.
When you say clogged port, the port (hole) underneath the cam cap or ports on the tube?
Also to note, I noticed when it was running their was a small chirp/squeak sound like a loose belt however it was not, I'm beginning to think it could of been because of the cams being dry.

Here is a rear shot so you can see where the oil is coming from better.

Faris Xero SR20DET Clear View of Rear OIL Priming - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy16-smMHlg&feature=youtu.be)

Now a friend keeps suggesting the weird sound could be timing chain related, Before I dive into that are we determining this is most likely an oil problem for sure? Can someone clarify for me that indeed the oil not squirting is for sure an issue.. I was under impression oil should squirt out of the holes on the tube for sure when priming.

The port on the cam cap, I think you don't have them torqued right, but they could be clogged or misaligned.

It's a lil hole next to the bolt hole, it runs diagonal to the bolt hole then shoots oil out of the banjo to the squirters.
The sound in the first video sounds like symptoms of loose cam bolts sort of. You have to rev yours the last time i heard that it was at idle speeds

Dorifto Machine

03-23-2013, 11:21 PM

Oh man that's certainly an oil supply issue then. Take the squrters off, soak them, and blow compressed air through them to sort it out.

I still do doubt it's a rod bearing, check that top end. Also pull the tensioner out to see if it's got oil in it.

Precisely, thanks. I thought the same about it not being rod related as the sound is mostly coming from the top and side of valve cover, but who knows. I will clean the oil squirter tubes up a little more intense and then see if its the same thing.

The port on the cam cap, I think you don't have them torqued right, but they could be clogged or misaligned.

It's a lil hole next to the bolt hole, it runs diagonal to the bolt hole then shoots oil out of the banjo to the squirters.
The sound in the first video sounds like symptoms of loose cam bolts sort of. You have to rev yours the last time i heard that it was at idle speeds

Roger that, I will check this in Morning and see if any screws are loose on the cam caps and such.

Also found these for torque specs :

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c375/DJ_Treble/Untitled-2-3.jpg

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 04:48 PM

Update:
Same thing, Oil only comes out of the oil holes behind the Cam caps closest to the firewall..
Cleaned the oil tubes best I could. Soaked them in water, Sprayed Cleaner in them, Sprayed air in them. Reinstalled the oil tubes and torqued all caps to specs (none seemed super loose really). These tubes should atleast drip oil if anything!

Please anyone can chime in here. Oil Pump not providing enough pressure? I shot another video after cleaning and re-tightening just for visuals.

Video Update: Faris Xero SR20DET Oil Tubes Not Squirting - YouTube (http://youtu.be/FkMSpQ6kAgE)

KiLLeR2001

03-24-2013, 05:01 PM

ROFL. Sorry to laugh but I wasn't expecting the oil to just burst out like that at the end!

Where exactly is the oil coming out from? It looks like the cam caps aren't tight enough and its shooting out where the cap meets the head OR that bolt is stripped. Try cleaning off those bolts and inside the holes and using red loctite. Follow the specified torque specs which is 8.7 ft/lbs final. I think when I did mine I just rounded up to 9 ft/lbs tq.

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 05:01 PM

Haha , I know it does sound and look weird when it burst out.

A buddy who works on SR's just informed me that it is normal for it to shoot oil from those back holes , but should also shoot from the squirts at same time . Unless their is an Oil pressure issue. Can anyone verify?

If you look its not coming from the bolt, their is a little tiny oil hole on each side that the cam cap is sitting next to but not covering .

army240

03-24-2013, 05:06 PM

Maybe the camshaft clearance with the caps is not correct (maybe worn out because of oil starvation???) and it's too loose so all the oil flow goes out from there? Also, take off your tensionner and check if oil is coming out when you compress it like Codyace said... your sound could be a chain rattling somewhere in the cover because the chain is too loose.

di-devol

03-24-2013, 05:47 PM

That's crazy!

Just for the hell of it, take off your RAS.

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 06:21 PM

Unless you guys know exactly what it looks like when it squirts oil with the valve cover off then shhh lol . I tried finding a video online with such thing and no avail.

The cam caps both sit perfect on it and the stud screws in just fine.

Here is a close view video I just filmed of where it shoots out so you know. There's an oil hole on each side...

Faris Xero SR20DET CLOSE VIEW OF OIL SQUIRTING FROM ONLY BACK OF CAM CAP - YouTube (http://youtu.be/rr1pDCFAYmE)

cotbu

03-24-2013, 08:04 PM

LOL it's not supposed to do that! Like i said there's a little hole on the cam cap that meet the head and oil flows up that hole through the banjo and out the squirters. For you it's not making it up through the hole to the cam cap. You can clearly see that in all your videos, but this one it's like the cap isn't even on. That hole you pointed out is clearly the issue.

FkMSpQ6kAgE

Here's what you should be seeing!

coLjUcA4Jlk

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 08:11 PM

Right I know that. You might be getting confused, There is 2 different holes , The hole next to the cap (looks like a vent hole) is suppose to have a small flow not a burst like that. Then you have another oil hole which sits under the cap and sends oil to the Oil tube , the one your talking about (banjo ). Its definitely being blocked and shooting it out of secondary hole because it has no where to go. I have an idea of what it possibly could be. Investigating now.

Perfect! That video is exactly what I needed to see.

Thanks for your input btw.

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 09:02 PM

What I'm trying confirm is the type of bolt that is required to hold the banjo part of the squirters to the block. Reason why is is the bolt that is going through the banjo has no holes in it at all like a bolt would that is connected to a banjo.

Wouldn't that essentially block the passage? How is oil going to travel through the hole , then through the cam cap, and then out of the banjo bolt to the oil tube if its a solid stud?

When I took the cam caps off I only saw 2 holes.. one for each stud to hold it to the block .

Here is a picture I took of both studs that are currently going through each banjo.

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/3895/img0030rr.jpg

cotbu

03-24-2013, 09:29 PM

take off the cam cap and post picture of the bottom
i told you the, the oil travels up the little hole through the cam cap, not the bolt. So there no banjo bolt.

http://www.nicoclub.com/articles/images/IMG_0378.jpg

Right I know that. You might be getting confused, There is 2 different holes , The hole next to the cap (looks like a vent hole) is suppose to have a small flow not a burst like that.
This is the supply for the oil squirters

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 10:23 PM

take off the cam cap and post picture of the bottom
i told you the, the oil travels up the little hole through the cam cap, not the bolt. So there no banjo bolt.

This is the supply for the oil squirters

Ahhhh, I see what your saying now..

Here is some pictures of it...

Did he install the the cam cap in the wrong spot??. Because now that I look at it , the Cam cap closest to the Front is bigger than all the other cam caps, should that be in the cam cap spot closest to the firewall ?

Here is some pictures:

Cam Cap under OIL TUBE banjo (by itself)
http://imageshack.us/a/img404/6184/rearcamcaponly.png

Cam Cap in place, Notice how it doesn't cover the little hole
http://imageshack.us/a/img26/6499/rearcamcap.png

Cam Cap OFF, oil hole visible
http://imageshack.us/a/img339/8523/camcapoff.png

Cam Cap Closest to timing chain, notice how its bigger
http://imageshack.us/a/img820/1492/camcapinthefront.png

KiLLeR2001

03-24-2013, 11:07 PM

Holy crap I'd be scared of that engine if the previous owner didn't even install the caps back in order... :(

Dorifto Machine

03-24-2013, 11:35 PM

Holy crap I'd be scared of that engine if the previous owner didn't even install the caps back in order... :(

LOL, Steve thanks for the enlightenment, its mine now and I'm going to take care of it . hell you came over and heard it run good minus the idle issue! ;) . :bash:

Someone rebuilt the motor, then the kid picked it up and who knows what he did. But I'm staying optimistic it sounded very healthy minus this oil issue so who knows how the hell its been running without the noise, I know the bottom end was atleast getting oil.

But holy moly, thats unfreaking believable that he would install them wrong.....

cotbu

03-24-2013, 11:47 PM

Good job, now an oil change should complete your half brokenness! :cool:

Wait what about the other side?

Sent from my De-bloated, & Turbocharged SIII

Dorifto Machine

03-25-2013, 12:18 AM

Good job, now an oil change should complete your half brokenness! :cool:

Wait what about the other side?

Sent from my De-bloated, & Turbocharged SIII

Thanks, I hope all goes well we shall see.
:aw:

Um, both sides have small cam caps. The big caps are both closest to the tensioner.... So both will need to be switched.

Dorifto Machine

03-25-2013, 02:04 AM

Now it makes me wonder if the rest are in the proper sequence.

There's dots on them instead of numbers. Anyone have anything to reference for the proper cam cap sequence? Or should I just switch these caps around making sure it sits right and call it a day?

Dorifto Machine

03-25-2013, 12:49 PM

UPDATE: Well guys and gals, the oil squiters are priming as they should now. Everything's assembled /torqued properly .

However, we are back to point A. That weird sound is still present....

Any other ideas? Help this demon back to life.

I'm uploading a 5 minute test drive video so you can hear it from the engine bay to driving . Video on next Page 2

Dorifto Machine

03-25-2013, 02:04 PM

So took it for a test drive , after doing everything we went over. Weird thing is it drives perfect and doesn't have any power loss but sound still present at around 3,000 RPM.

codyace

03-25-2013, 07:20 PM

army240

03-25-2013, 07:45 PM

Does it happen repeatably at that RPM?

It could also be rod knock then. I was hoping not, but it is a known 'failure type' on these engines. If someone didn't put the caps back on correctly I can only imagine the bottom end not being properly assembled either.

What you can do, is disconnect one coil pack at a time. Sure it will run rough, but disregard. Rev the engine up and see if the rattle gets quieter or even disappears completely. If so it's time to open that bottom end up and investigate.

If it's rod knock... it looks to be doing it on more than one piston... If you listen at the end of the video when it stalls (1:50ish) the knock is too fast for only one piston... Or could this be 2 or 3 main bearing? I heard a lot of rod bearing knock as it's a common problem as you said but I don't remember hearing main bearing "knock" or noise.

Anyway, I would not take any chance and I think the only thing for you to do is open it and check everything...

codyace

03-25-2013, 08:43 PM

If it's rod knock... it looks to be doing it on more than one piston... If you listen at the end of the video when it stalls (1:50ish) the knock is too fast for only one piston... Or could this be 2 or 3 main bearing? I heard a lot of rod bearing knock as it's a common problem as you said but I don't remember hearing main bearing "knock" or noise.

Anyway, I would not take any chance and I think the only thing for you to do is open it and check everything...

Those videos were before he sorted his oil squirting issue, so I'm certainly in for the next video to really know. Sure you can loose the bearings on multiple holes, but usually it's only one that eats itself up on these engines.

As far as main bearings knocking, I've never ever heard of an SR ruining a main bearing, this side of no oil...and even then I've never ever heard of an SR taking out a main this side of castrophic failure, as they are almost ALWAYS getting fresh oil supply.

KiLLeR2001

03-25-2013, 10:41 PM

Loose flywheel.

cotbu

03-25-2013, 11:11 PM

I don't see the new 5min video, but if it's the same sound? it could be from the cam wear on the rockers.
If you're not frustrated yet you will be, but I'm hoping it's still in the head. I'd like you too examine your cam lobes and rocker arms for excessive wear. Even if you had to replace all the rockers and cams it's still better than a full tear down and rebuild.

Dorifto Machine

03-26-2013, 03:53 AM

I had someone prime the engine for me while I went under the car and the knock sound happens every time I crank it. I listened and the sound seems to be coming from where the transmission meets the block. I put my ear up against it and a knock sound is very apparent... So me and steven (killer) are thinking it could be the flywheel. But while driving their was no clutch slipping, then again I was shifting under 4 grand.

Dorifto Machine

03-26-2013, 03:58 AM

*..Double Post

KiLLeR2001

03-26-2013, 06:32 AM

If you didn't install the flywheel yourself and the previous owner touched it (judging by the cam cap fiasco), I can almost bet you any amount of money that sucker is loose. It's amazing how many similarities between our builds keep popping up...

Here is my initial post about the problem:
http://zilvia.net/f/builds-builds-only/378665-s13-5-daily-driver-build-thread.html#post4119491

And then the aftermath pictures shown here:
http://zilvia.net/f/builds-builds-only/378665-s13-5-daily-driver-build-thread-2.html#post4128480

Wasn't that bad because I caught it quickly, but I'd stop driving it if I were you at this point.

Dorifto Machine

03-26-2013, 09:44 AM

Lucky no, I actually installed the flywheel, clutch and tightened it down pretty well!
However... I cant remember if I put loctite on the bolts. Here was a picture while I was installing it

http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/4517/fxclutch.jpg

Here is a video I looked up on youtube and this sounds just like my issue!

3nBPRIowm5c

KiLLeR2001

03-26-2013, 09:55 AM

Dorifto Machine

03-26-2013, 10:11 AM

Yep. Tightening it down "well" or "good enough" is not sufficient for the flywheel. You need to get a big boy torque wrench and torque that sucker to 110ft/lbs tq. with loctite. I would also recommend getting new flywheel bolts if you didn't the last time.

Always use a torque wrench dude! I used new bolts.

Is the blue loctite fine?

Debating on pulling the transmission today. Just want closure.

KiLLeR2001

03-26-2013, 10:17 AM

I always use red. Never tried blue.

di-devol

03-26-2013, 10:22 AM

I always use red. Never tried blue.

I use blue loctite, I thought the red needed heat to remove lol.

My FW bolts backed out, that's the sound of your clutch hitting the bolts. FW might not necessarily be loose, just bolts backed out.

Try listening at the bell housing with the camera as well.

Dolby109

03-26-2013, 02:24 PM

I am wondering if since the top end was half starved of oil for a while the hydrolic lifters (or whatever they are called that the rocker arms sit on) could be deflated, causing valve noise? Might be worth soking them in oil, or at least checking a few to make sure they have the normal feel (spongy I think).
Although your problem does sound exactly like the other video with loose flywheel bolts. I cant understand how that can make such a sound.

It doesnt sound like rod knock really, unless all 4 rod bearings are missing, and it would still be present at idle. I spun a single rod bearing and it was a very loud and distinct knock at idle. Its extra loud on SR's because, with no bearing, the piston hits the head.

codyace

03-26-2013, 02:38 PM

It doesnt sound like rod knock really, unless all 4 rod bearings are missing, and it would still be present at idle. I spun a single rod bearing and it was a very loud and distinct knock at idle. Its extra loud on SR's because, with no bearing, the piston hits the head.

Rod knock isn't always present at idle in these cars. My good friends beater car only knocked above 3500 rpm in his sentra. Drove the car that way for over a year until he became unlazy, dropped the cross memeber and pan, and rolled new bearings in.

Lucky no, I actually installed the flywheel, clutch and tightened it down pretty well!
However... I cant remember if I put loctite on the bolts. Here was a picture while I was installing it

If you go under the car you'll see a little inspection plate on the oil pan held in by two 10 mm headed bolts. Take it out and see if you can jiggle it all.

Those flywheel bolts also shouldn't be reused, and always thread locker and proper torque.

nickauger

03-26-2013, 03:02 PM

Its clearly a rod knock...

fliprayzin240sx

03-26-2013, 03:18 PM

Somebody who's blown 8 SRs, I say rod knock. It comes on when you lift off the throttle. I bet if you slowly rev it up and hold it, itll be audible like fuck around 3-3.5k. I'd drop the oil pan and check the pan for rod bearings.

I'm curious about something tho, do you have an oil pressure gauge? Considering the engine was rebuilt and who ever put it together couldnt even put the cam retainer on right, I wouldnt be surprised if the rod and main bearings are fucked on the install.

Dorifto Machine

03-26-2013, 06:26 PM

Update:
Today I got as far as unbolting all the transmission bolts . I also removed the starter.

Instead of testing with the inspection plate, I just reached my hand in the starter hole. Not alot of room obviously but it did feel like the flywheel had slight play in it, though nothing crazy to say its very loose. I don't think ill know till I pop the transmission. Then will move to the bottom end.

fliprayzin240sx: I do have an Oil Pressure gauge, I just re-wired it up yesterday.

I don't know what to say honestly but super exhausted process. So much preparation went into this build, I trusted the buyer so if this is the case and it does turn out to be a busted motor, he ripped me off knowingly or knew something was going on. Trying to stay optimistic but realistic as well.

Future_gohan

03-26-2013, 06:33 PM

Its clearly a rod knock...

This^

Doesn't sound like a flywheel to me, sounds like the bottom end is gone, drop the bottom pan and look for gold colored shavings.

KiLLeR2001

03-26-2013, 10:52 PM

Check the timing chain tensioner if you haven't already, I've seen these things break apart before and a loose chain can also produce this noise.

Dorifto Machine

03-28-2013, 06:26 PM

codyace

03-28-2013, 10:03 PM

KiLLEr2001 and Myself are assessing the situation right now.

From what we can tell, it appears the flywheel might have come loose, transmission is about 70% off, trying to get it to clear the chassis right now with some pain. Will update shortly with the verdict!

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/8788/steveandfx240sxs.png

Unbolt it, unbolt exhaust/loose throttle body coupler, lower front cross member bolts. Spin transmission upside down once you pull it back a little, and it'll slide right out.

Dorifto Machine

03-28-2013, 10:50 PM

Unbolt it, unbolt exhaust/loose throttle body coupler, lower front cross member bolts. Spin transmission upside down once you pull it back a little, and it'll slide right out.

Hey man , didn't see this till just now , but we did end up getting it off by undoing the downpipe from the test pipe and with some force we got it off.

Update:Confirmation , the flywheel bolts were indeed loose!
It looks like 1 bolt was holding it on tight !

Tomorrow will be the reassembly of everything with torquing and thread locker! We shall see if this corrects the issue. I'll keep you guys posted.

Dorifto Machine

03-30-2013, 09:15 PM

Update: ISSUE RESOLVED!

Such a relief has been lifted from my shoulders!!! I want to thank everyone for their time and input. Those that thought the worst , I hope your mind has expanded on possibilities. The issue was indeed the flywheel being loose. Car was tested and drove for a good 15 minutes on the road. No more knocking sound.

Only thing that is acting weird is the car occasionally dies when I put it in Neutral. It seems to lower its idle way below 500.
On regular idle its around 800-1,000 rpm .

KiLLeR2001

03-30-2013, 10:20 PM

[B][COLOR="Red"]
Only thing that is acting weird is the car occasionally dies when I put it in Neutral. It seems to lower its idle way below 500.
On regular idle its around 800-1,000 rpm .

Clean MAF with MAF cleaner, check all your grounds. Is BOV recirculating? Can't remember. Make sure you have absolutely no vacuum leaks anywhere. If all of these check out it could be an IACV issue.

[email protected]

03-31-2013, 12:48 AM

Thank god you didnt get to drive that shit hard. if that flywheel would of come loose at 7000 RPM, forget about ever walking again.

codyace

03-31-2013, 07:51 PM

cotbu

03-31-2013, 09:23 PM

Update: ISSUE RESOLVED!
good shyt!!

fliprayzin240sx

03-31-2013, 09:47 PM

Well consider yourself lucky, sure as hell sounded like rod knock to me. But then again, its always hard to diagnose something thats not in front of you. Hard to base stuff on a video and sounds that may not be the true representation of whats actually being recorded.

You used loctite red and step torqued those flywheel bolts to atleast 90 ft lbs right?

Dorifto Machine

03-31-2013, 10:56 PM

Thank god you didnt get to drive that shit hard. if that flywheel would of come loose at 7000 RPM, forget about ever walking again.

Trust me, as soon as I heard the sound I didn't rev over 4,000 rpm. But yes very thankful there was no blood shed. Well there was minor blood shed that comes with owning a 240sx ;)

Dorifto Machine

03-31-2013, 11:03 PM

Awesome that you found the issue!

I know it sucks that you have to be the example,but this thread should serve as a reminder to EVERYONE that following the proper FSM torque procedure is crucial. THis could have ended much worse!

No doubt man! I have no problem being the example , everyone needs a good lesson. Im thankful to have gotten off with much less damage. But I highly agree Torque wrench and Loctite are imperative.

Well consider yourself lucky, sure as hell sounded like rod knock to me. But then again, its always hard to diagnose something thats not in front of you. Hard to base stuff on a video and sounds that may not be the true representation of whats actually being recorded.

You used loctite red and step torqued those flywheel bolts to atleast 90 ft lbs right?

Yes very much so. I tried to be as descriptive and visually informative as possible via video analyzes but I understand sometimes they are skewed or exaggerated . :o

good shyt!!

:fruit:

Dorifto Machine

04-01-2013, 02:02 PM

So TPS was set to .16 . I adjusted it to .50 and the car does not die when shifted into neutral anymore. However, now the idle is between 1,000 -1,200.

cotbu

04-01-2013, 02:25 PM

.50v and tps is probably not registering closed at idle.
set to .45v and adjust idle via iacv.

Dorifto Machine

04-01-2013, 02:33 PM

.50v and tps is probably not registering closed at idle.
set to .45v and adjust idle via iacv.

I set it to .45 at first and the idle was sporadic and kept fluctuating non stop between 1,000 to 1,500

The IACV is tightened all the way, which should be the lowest idle, correct? The previous owner stripped the plastic IACV screw pretty bad so its a pain

cotbu

04-01-2013, 02:48 PM

set it back and drive it for a few temps cycles.

After everything you've been through, I suggest you check base timing and set idle. You could fix this issue right then, or Do this.... set it to .45v let the temp reach 80 deg C, drive maybe 10mins, your idle should be found and stable but probably too low, if the screw is all the way down. move it up to stop the stalling.

When I fix this issue, I use temps, but you could use time if you can't control the engine fan

The IACV screw should never be all the way up or down. when everything is set and working properly.

codyace

04-01-2013, 08:46 PM

Dorifto Machine

04-16-2013, 12:09 AM

Another update here :

The car has been driving fantastic minus the car dieing on Neutral randomly or when letting off the gas.

Idles after warmed up around 1,000 to 700 . TPS is set to .45
Timing is spot on.
I unscrewed the IACV about two quarters of a turn and its still dieing. Should I keep turning it ?

I recall before the Flywheel I had a friend who is familiar with SR20's come over and fixed the timing/ idle. The only way he could get the idle as low as it is no matter what was by adjusting what I guess is the Throttle Stop Screw. He was adjusting that and ever since then I'm pretty that's when the car started dieing in neutral.
Is there anyway to adjust that specifically in sync with the TPS or proper procedure ?

Thanks

di-devol

04-16-2013, 09:34 AM

Vented BOV?

cotbu

04-16-2013, 11:42 AM

You can either crack the throttle body back open, then set the tps to register closed and .45v, then set base idle.

or set the throttle body fully closed and then set the tps to .45v, then set base idle

With the throttle body cracked open, it's easier to get back to a stable idle and you just have to remember the throttle is always open for, tuning and maintenance.

Our engines are designed to idle with the throttle closed, but you can cheat if you need to. I haven't seen any ill affects from people doing this, but it does mask other symptoms like leaking injectors and vacuum leaks.

Dorifto Machine

04-16-2013, 03:03 PM

Vented BOV?

Re-circulated - HKS BOV and no difference.

You can either crack the throttle body back open, then set the tps to register closed and .45v, then set base idle.

or set the throttle body fully closed and then set the tps to .45v, then set base idle

With the throttle body cracked open, it's easier to get back to a stable idle and you just have to remember the throttle is always open for, tuning and maintenance.

Our engines are designed to idle with the throttle closed, but you can cheat if you need to. I haven't seen any ill affects from people doing this, but it does mask other symptoms like leaking injectors and vacuum leaks.

I lost you at cracking the throttle back open. How open?

So adjust the screw so throttle is semi open then re-adjust tps back to .45 ?

Every-time the throttle screw is messed with it changes the values on the TPS correct?

cotbu

04-16-2013, 04:03 PM

Sorry, your looking for idle! so crack open the throttle plate until you have a stable idle. I don't know what else to tell you. Yes the voltage for the TPS will change as the throttle opens, once you have a stable idle, set the tps to .45v. This is what should happen when you're almost finished. You go for a test drive come to a stop you idle will probably be high 1200rpm maybe, if so take a screwdriver and adjust the IACV to lower that rpm
I prefer under 1000rpm, once you do that you should be done, but i would go all he way back to checking base timing and idle, but you shouldn't have to.

Dorifto Machine

04-16-2013, 06:27 PM

ShadowMan

04-16-2013, 07:09 PM

You know, it's a good thing your flywheel came loose, or you might not have found that oil squirter problem until it was way too late.haha How long after you put the flywheel on until it came loose? Just curious because I don't think I used loctite when I put my flywheel on. I have had the car running for a year or so now so I would think I'm in the clear and I followed all the torque specs, just no loctite.
Hopefully, people will read this thread and use it as an example on how to properly explain your problems with as much info and videos needed for others to help.

cotbu

04-16-2013, 07:17 PM

Roger that. So adjust Throttle plate then TPS then IACV. I'll mess with it some tommorow . Should the throttle plate be adjusted while the TPS is plugged in or out ?

Good question..., tps disconnect and rev to above 3krpm 3 times. Cant believe i forgot that!:hide:

Dorifto Machine

04-18-2013, 12:38 AM

Update: Dieing in neutral / decel RESOLVED!

It was definitely related to the throttle stop screw being opened a little too much.
Being that the stop screw was set , then tps was set based off the incorrect position it was causing the IACV to essentially overwork.

Based of my own study and multiple tests I resolved the Idle issue and Dieing in Neutral or Deceleration in this manner:

-Removed the Coupler from the throttle body to expose the throttle butterfly
- Unscrewed the 8mm nut on that locks the throttle stop screw
-Used appropriate allen key to
First, loosen stop screw completely
Second, tighten stop screw until it starts to move the butterfly which means its compressed against it.
-You will then verify TPS is set , I set mine to .45
--Cranked the car, let it get to 180 degrees then adjusted the idle with my IACV
-Take it for another drive and adjust IACV as needed for higher idle

So far I drove it for a couple hours and it hasn't died once.

Hope this helps someone else!