jzr

If you're running at a SP or especially an SM level of prep, you're probably going to have to flare the fenders.

If I were to build the car for DSP, I'd run 285/30-18's all around on at least 10" wide wheels, 11" being better. I've done the measurements on my S13, and the most I think it'll fit is 9's up front and 10's or 10.5's in the back. You might be able to fit more in the rear on a non-HICAS car.

In Street Mod I'd go to a 315 or 335 rear tire with at least a 12" wide wheel, depending on power level.

The V710 is faster than the A3S05 for most cars in most cases - I definitely would anticipate an improvement moving to a 245 V710 from a 225 A3S05. This is assuming though, that you have proper wheel width to support the 245 tire.

kapower

JZR... I would run a 17X9 + 20 offset 5zygen @17 lbs each, They are about 3 lbs heavier then my current setup, the tires are also 3-4 lbs heavier =6-7lbs per corner, and my center of gravity would be higher. The taller gear ratio, and extra 20mm of the finest DOT rubber available would be nice though...

I ended up in third place overall at the last auto X. The competition was pretty slim, but I did end up beating Scotty White and his new 505hp viper with triple adjustable moton's and super wide V710's... He hit atleast one cone on each of his runs .

That was my second time auto X'ing a turbocharged Car, and the first highspeed course of the season. I had ton's of inner wheel spin almost everywhere, even with stock boost. I'am now running with a Blitz boost controller (maybe 40-50 more HP), set to about 14 PSI, and an S15 HLSD.

The car seems to pull much harder now, and act's much differently with the HLSD. I'am going to have to Re-learn to drive the Car once again...

I'am only running with 3.7 deg neg camber up front, soon I'll see how 4.5-5 deg's will perform. I here that an extremely fast ITA 240 (I.E. Bob Stretch) was running an abnormal amount of camber.

I have been comparing my times to Kevin Deitz in his E stock (Zebra) MR2, He is fast and very consistent. I will post up the difference in times from before and after the BC, and LSD.

Since Deitz was just at the SanDiago NT, I can also compare times With the extremely well built STS 240 driven Buy JZR. I know thats not an extremely accurate way of comparing, with all of the variables, (Track setup, weather, ect...) but close enough for me... The Zebra is well driven, fully built, and very consistent... -JM

jzr

The SD Tour might not be the best comparison, since I was doing some tire experimentation and didn't have a clean run on Sunday.

At the Fontana Pro, I was a second off the ES winner, Dietz's codriver Mark Coleman (80.7 vs. 79.7). Our STS and ES PAX times were very close, so that's about where I need to be performance-wise.

By comparison, SM winner Vic Sias ran a 73.4, and DSP winner Toby Larsson a 76.4. Therefore, you need to be about 3 seconds faster than Kevin Dietz/ES on an 80 second course to be competitive in DSP, and about 6 seconds faster to be competitive in SM.

kapower

hhhmmm.... normally Deitz is faster then Karl Coleman. JZR... Your times look good, when considering you are on street tires.

The autoX on Sunday went ok, the course was the tightest, slowest course, I had ever been on. The car is much different, but faster now with the lsd and extra boost. The extra seat time on such a chalenging course was great, It's hard to flog a car at it's limits when you constantly make drastic changes. I learned a lot about the car.

I ended up in either 3rd or 4th overall - .060 off fast time of the day, set by a SM2 Turbo miata. I know it's not SM competitive, the tires are too small, but it is still going to be very quick, once I start driving the Car like I know I'am capable of.

zads

http://www.scca.com/Solo/Solo.asp?Id...0&x=050|010&~=

Interesting. I am running an open diff right now, and getting the same inside wheel spin.
I have a S15 HLSD sitting in my room, and I was hoping that it would help solve my traction issues, but I guess maybe it won't.
Are you running the 245/45/17's with the HLSD when you get the wheelspin?
Are you running stock or aftermarket swaybars, subframe spacers?


My car falls most closely into STX category, so that's what I've been running in this season.
My footing setup:

Z33 wheels and stock tires (just something to burn):
Front: 17x7.5 +30, (23.3 lbs ) 225/50R17 Potenza RE040;
Rear: 17x8.0 +33, (24.1 lbs ) 235/50R17 Potenza RE040;

KTS Coilovers (8kg/mm front, 6kg/mm rear)
Front camber plates almost maxed out (~-3.5 degrees)
Stock sway bars
Open Diff

jmauld

I won DSP at our local club last year as well, and usually place in the Top Ten Raw and Pax. However, the local guys that do nationals generally pax ahead of me by 1-2 seconds, depending on how good of a day I'm having or how bad of day they are having.

If you don't mind sharing, what have you done to your car to prep it for DSP? How do you plan on getting 170hp to the wheels? I've done some of the basic bolt-ons and have dyno'd 156 to the wheels. I can send you the dyno if you like.

I don't mind sharing the things I've done and what I plan on doing to improve it in the future, if you're interested.

Last year I had issues with inside wheel spin with a VLSD. The plan for this year is to go with a bigger front swaybar to see if that helps, and I have reduced the rear spring rate to 350lb springs.

Previously, I ran 550lb rear springs and no rear swaybar and there were times when I was lifting the inside rear tire completely off of the ground, which I believe will cause wheelspin regardless of which LSD you have. Maybe some of the clutch diffs could hold up to that?

__________________
Jason
'95 240sx SE

zads

I'm curious what bolt-ons you have, that have gotten you to 156whp?

As for squeezing even more power out of the KA, one recommendation I would make is to try a standalone ECU.. the 30-1600 AEM EMS unit is a plug and play unit (to the harness), so you can easily install it, or swap back to your stock ECU in about 3 minutes.
Here's a dyno chart from stock car to stock car + AEM:


Are you running the 350lb rear springs with swaybar or without? Still having problems with the inside rear unloading?

jmauld

I have the following power mods (this is on a S14):

- CFDF Clutch
- Fidanza Flywheel
- Short Ram Intake
- Hotshot Header
- 3" catback
- Unorthodox Pullies
- S-AFC

However, a large % of my hp gain came from playing with the timing. My distributor is advanced as far as it will go without taking it out and offsetting it a tooth. I've been watching the standalone guys, but have reservations about it. I think a large part of their power increase is coming from ignition timing. I think I saw a total of a 2hp increase by playing with the fuel. Of course, I was running out of dyno time so I didn't get to try everything I would've liked to try.

On my rear suspension, I am running the 350lb rear springs with the ST swaybar. I have only done one event with this setup and it was on last year's tires. My initial impressions are that the car has a lot more initial push, but does have an easier time putting down power. I think the real solution is going to be a combination of going with a bigger front swaybar, and tender springs on the rear to take over during those times that I'm fully extending the main spring.

__________________
Jason
'95 240sx SE

Mikes14240sx

zads, kapower said he HAD inner wheel spin before he had the s15 hlsd.

Mikes14240sx

What spring rate are you running on the front? If the rear shock is fully extending with the main spring while cornering now then a helper spring won't keep the tire on the ground.

jmauld

450 on the front.

I'm not talking about using a helper spring. Those are only used for keeping the coils in place.

http://e30m3performance.com/tech_art...ings/index.htm

__________________
Jason
'95 240sx SE

AceInHole

:P Halo

Daddio's car weighed as much as mine did, and mine has full A/C and sheet metal. Also, Nelson Antunnes (who trophied last year in Travis' Civic) wanted to co-drive my car at a few events... too bad it wasn't running reliably enough to ever have that happen

I'd like to someday come back to the 240sx but it's actually for sale now . For a while I think I had what was close to being one of the best SM prepped 240's:
1995 S14
275 front 315 rear Hoosiers (which were stolen last Fall off my race trailer )
KA24DE with an S15 turbo on an equal length bottom mount manifold (dyno'ed the S13 turbo to 275rwhp 311rwtq, was hoping to make 300 flat on less boost with the new setup).

I think with lighter wheels (mine weighed what.. like 30-35lbs per? MASSIVE AND HEAVY), a better suspension (great sways/ bracing, shitty D2 shocks), a reliable engine (built block threw a bearing before I broke it in) and fuel (would've liked to go standalone), I would've had a small shot at Nats. Milk the turbo for as much power as it could get, lighten the car with some carbon-fiber fenders/ hood (weigh in at under 2600lbs maybe...).

It's a shame I crashed my first S14, which for some reason was never down for more than a week and put out way too much power for way longer than a stock block should've . Like I said tho, someday I'll come back to the S-chassis, probably after I finish paying for my G35

EDIT for not reading all posts before posting:
275's will fit with major fender puling in front. I ran 275/ 40/ R17 and it eventually cleared with the car lowered to race height. The fenders were bent to hell though, and it's FAR from pretty. 315's will fit the rear with a lot of pulling as well, although I've heard stories of people pulling too far and popping welds, ruining the chassis. If I ever got back to it: I'd cut the fenders, as much as I could up to the 1lb max, and possibly a bit more :-P. Fender flares = weight. Who needs weight on a full blown race car?

My thoughts on SR vs KA: The KA dominates for autocross. Ask Halo, who's seen my car in action back when it was in form (even while I was driving badly in a mental rut :-P ). Instant boost and linear response is king. The weight factor? Minimal in my opinion. I'd actually like to see how an RB would do.

Last thing real quick: I ran 9kg springs up front, 7kg in rear, with whiteline bars and an assortment of Cusco braces. If I did it again I might actually go stiffer, although it might've just been the spring lengths I had.... and I'd definitely invest in better dampeners.

Before I forget: Invest in a REALLY GOOD LSD.

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jzr

A DSP car should be running the EMS, ITB's, a lightweight flywheel and clutch, all the emissions crap removed, be overbored .040" and have the head port matched. One should use an early (lightest) coupe with the aforementioned DOHC motor. Weight would be under 2600lbs.

Fender flaring is an SP allowance, you can cut as much out of the fenders and quarterpanels as you need to make your tires fit, there is no 1lb. limit there.

The SR can be legally bored/stroked out to 2.2+ liters in Street Mod, no advantage to the much-heavier KA. You want the car as light as you can get in SM, and getting the power you need is only a matter of money. In SM trim I could see an S13 coupe being comfortably under 2500lbs.

240 OR DIE

Hey Ace what size rims were you running to get the 275s under the fronts. Im running 17x9 17 offset, and Im looking to get 265s all around. Id think Id be ok with 265/40s on that size wheel in the front without alot of rub? Any thoughts??? Right now Im on 245/40s and I still think I got the room for the 265s before I have to get to some serious fender bangin!

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Signature Exceeds 400x200 Maximum Limits set by the User Agreement!!

AceInHole

I ran 17x9 front and 17x10.5 rear. I needed a LOT of fender pulling to clear, especially with how low my car was. You should also take into account what kind of tires you'll be running. I think my Hoosiers may have been a bit wider than some other similar sized tires from other manufacturers.

__________________

turtl631

Also, have you actually looked for tires? 265/40/17 is a REALLY rare size. 255/40 and 275/40 are far more common.

zads

Ran in a club autocross this last sunday,
I got there at 11am, but still got about 16 runs in through the day.

Enough runs to test/break in the new S15 HLSD diff, and dial in some new shock settings (a one click change on my front shocks was totally changing the response of the car; the adjustment range on the KTS coilovers is awesome).

I ran without the rear swaybar; I'm struggling for rear traction as it is. Will probably keep it off for the time being.
The HLSD was very nice- no more smoking the inside tire on corner exits. Felt a little strange to get accustomed to. A healthy amount of oversteer on corner exits.


Also got to test out the lateral accelerometer today, got some decent datalogs.
Here's one of my last run of the day. The guy controlling the lane staging told me, "Last run of the day, go and hang it out there".. and I did- right into a wall of cones. Oops.



The graphs shown are:
-Vehicle speed and engine speed (see where they diverge in the middle of the run? yeeeeah...
-Throttle position
-Accelerometer, the dashed bars are +/- 1G. The graph limits are +/- 1.5G (Positive is right turn, Negative is left)

-Accelerometer Histogram of my last run (bottom of graph is in G's)
-Accelerometer Histogram of my 2nd or 3rd run

Hopefully by the next event, I'll have the Longitudinal Accelerometer hooked up.

fuzzy_tanit

i ran my car in sts part of the season last year.
my engine is pretty stock with normal with only an intake.
but there is a lot of work going into my suspension.
i ran with falken azenis on my stock wheel.

so far
i was able to beat the champion in my both of kentucky region. i was on the way to taken 1st for the year end points until i install my kaaz.

then i was kicked out of sts with 3 race left missing 1st place but still coming in 2nd.

when i was in stx i am up against fast wrx. i mean fast. it make me work so much harder. especially on bigger coarse where 3rd gear come in to play since i dont have power. but so far i can win one of the two region for sure.

so overall i believe 240sx is a well balanced car. but like they say the car is willing to go as fast as the driver can push it.

Dominic Axelson

Dude I think u will do good with that. but if you get a vlsd ud do beter

vw_nissan

I hoped you dropped your jaw if you found out what happened in the 2006 Nationals. It's funny how you just said it, and someone proved you wrong right away.

HaLo

Sure did!

I can't wait to see what he'll do in SM this year...

__________________
-> HaLo
Race Car: '98 E36 BMW M3
Daily Driver: '08 Fiji Blue Honda Civic Si
SOLD: 01 GPW Honda S2000
PARTED: 93 Pearl White 240SX LE Fastback w/SR20DET
SOLD: 93 Super White 240SX SE Convertible w/Silvia Front

jzr

I predict I'll get smoked pretty good through most of '07 - not so much because the car doesn't have the potential, but because there's a ton of stuff that's new/different that needs to get sorted. Plus I'm sure to have other problems like stuff catching fire, wheels falling off, control arms folding up, blown motors, and grenaded transmissions. Doesn't help that I'm way behind schedule in getting the car together, a NT should never be a car's first event after even small changes, much less a complete rebirth. We should pretty much discount my Tour results (unless they're good ) but if I don't at least do sorta okay by the Pro the following weekend, that's a problem.

AceInHole

Dude, so far a 240sx has won 100% of the SM class races for this year's National Tour series (all of 1!). Keep the streak alive!!!

This is an old frickin post!! I guess my update starts with that I'm back in the game with the S14 in SM.

I'm running an HLSD atm, and it wasn't too bad. My rear end is a bit bouncy due to a lack of proper damping, and my roll-centers are fucked. I'm hoping with new front LCA's I'll get a bit more rear end traction through sweepers. I ran the car with just about 300rwhp after finding a boost leak that was causing me to trail off on the dyno (only hit about 250 on it at about 8-9psi). We were severely underpowered at that level, in my opinion, but it was still enough to make the rear get squirrely with 315's in back. Right now my plans are: new injectors, new front LCA's, and new shocks/ struts. After that it's all gonna be getting down to minimum weight. I was over by like 200 lbs (full A/C and sheet metal still).

2007 Dixie Tour win, barely by a cone:


We did get outpaxed hardcore, though. SS beat us RAW, hard, although they were also running later in the day.

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nevaland9

i ran with a stock 91 fastback with coilovers and a J30 LSD and got second in the novice class when i was 16...then i broke my hand

this summer i plan to go hard tho SR20 with a GT2871r, HKS step ones etc etc...anyone who races on long island watch out!

__________________
CEO @ Sticky Garage 516-993-7315 -Jason
Check out my warehouse!

kapower

I'am going to try some Koni yellows all around, (maybe some 8611's up front?) and ground control coilovers 600f, 500r. I need to cazll those guy's and find out what the hot ticket is for ITA these days... Those will be assisted by whiteline sways f/r. Eventually I will have 100% shperical bearings.

The rear of the 240 has a lot of suspension bind. Which is one of the reasons I rhink it does'nt put the power down very well to the ground through the corners. Hiem joint's should help a lot. Bob Stretch says they are a must to get the rear suspension to work properly.

Don Nimi (PDM) told me that the suspension geometry is terrible, and can't be properly fixed with SM rules. He says it's a roll center problem. He would not tell exactly what was wrong. I guess becuase he spent a lot of money plotting out hiw suspension...

I think the difference between the front and rear roll center (IIRC Roll axis) is the problem. either the rear is to high or the front is to low. I alos think the roll center can be changed within SM rules, using the SPL front and lower control arms, or the custom control arms that I built using circle track/stock car parts...

If we raise the front roll center, it should help get more power down through/out of the corners, aswell as hadding more grip in front becuase of the improved geometry.

I won SM last year in the NWR SCCA, ya! I know it's just a local thing but, it still was'nt easy...

I'am racing a kart this year... Next year my megasquirted KA-t powered S13 should be in full force, at the local level, anyways.

My ka-t responds soo much quicker then the SR that I Auto X'd last year. The SR is a huge dog coming out of the turn arounds! Ka all the way... forget about the weight...

I can't wait to activate Launch control mode next to the starter, my backfires are soo loud! It spits out flames and smoke right behind the front tire on the driver side, right towards where the starter normally stands!

Good luck guy's.

-JM