GT2871 USERS. SR motor - Page 91 - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

EsChassisLove · 09-11-2012, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usdm180sx

This might be obvious to some and it took me twice to learn it. If you have an sr swap the motor is at least 13 years old with who knows how many miles. The OEM bearings are weak and most likely on the way out. If you're going to boost up do yourself a favor and build the bottom end as well. Save yourself time and money. Don't ask me jow I know lol.

I just had my head built with all top end parts: Greddy IM, Tomei 740cc injectors, Tomei 260 procams, Greddy valve springs, Crower retainers, 5 angle valve job, ARP head studs, Greddy RAS, Apexi 1.1mm HG, HKS turbo manifold, HKS GT-RS turbo (Similar to a gt2871r .64), HKS EVC boost controler and HKS Knock Amp for tuning. I used NGK BKR8EIX spark plugs. I had a VERY GOOD tuner street tune the motor on the HKS FCon VPro (Uses a MAP sensor) and timing, afr's and everything was spot on or even a bit conservative. Before the head was built I had a Tomei fuel pump and Blitz FMIC. Of course when it was done I drove it hard because the car was so much fun. My butt dyno estimate is at 350whp. With dyno time he said I can get another 20-30whp out of the tune.

Well, after racing a 550whp r32 GT-R (We did 5 rolling start 3rd gear runs from 50mph) I spun a rod. (I kept up and actually pulled on him in 3rd =P) My mechanic checked the plugs, oil and coolant. He said that the tune was good and there was NO detonation. The motor blew because it was 18 years old and stock bearings SUCK, especially after who knows how many miles and adding another 150whp to the 200 it was already pushing. So now I have to build the bottom end. This time I might as well build a 600whp bottom end lol going with CP pistons, Carillo rods and Power Enterprise bearings. Jus sayin'

Sleeve it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cotbu

Oh and what does a 600hp bottom end consist of?
Care of devil's advocate!

600whp capable engine? Reliability is the number one right there.

Sleeve it, forged pistons and rods, stock crank (polished and knife edged if you want) completely blue printed and balanced.

Then build the head. Bottom end is nothing without a strong, high flowing head to go with it.

EsChassisLove · 09-11-2012, 03:18 AM

Cody, I hope my set up breaks 400whp lol. If it doesnt, then something is seriously wrong haha.

codyace · 09-13-2012, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EsChassisLove

Cody, I hope my set up breaks 400whp lol. If it doesnt, then something is seriously wrong haha.

Keep cranking the boost until it does

EsChassisLove · 09-14-2012, 08:14 AM

I'm hoping it doesnt take more than 20psi lol.

s13Kurt · 09-14-2012, 08:41 AM

^ What does a certain psi matter. Airflow is airflow. No boost leaks, and the tune is correct keep cranking until it does what you want. This is coming from someone that trapped 120 on a jdm s14 t28 on 22 psi (still running) and DD'd a stock longblock 2860 car at 22 psi forever (still running). Also I see people blow these turbos up using way to thin of an oil. I only use Valvoline vr1 20-50 or Shell Rotella 15-50.

jaysgottaredtop · 09-14-2012, 09:22 AM

^ huh? psi makes a huge difference as compressor size varies. i'm not entirely sure what point you're trying to make.

Seraphim38 · 09-14-2012, 09:41 AM

psi matters since the higher pressure a turbo is pushing, it is likely to push air temps higher which drives timing out of the tune. Eventally you run out of incremental power.

When we were professionally custom tuning my GT2871R setup with external wastegate housing, going from 18 psi to 20 psi of boost only added a quarter of a hp because the turbo was heat soaked.

s13Kurt · 09-14-2012, 01:03 PM

I'm saying everybody's setup is different and his setup could need more than 20 to make the power he wants. That statement was focused on just the gt28 compressors. I just see guys so hell Bent on making a certain number on a certain psi of boost and that shouldn't be the case in my experience. There's a lot of factors that come into making power so why say I need "x" amount of whp at "x" psi?

EsChassisLove · 09-14-2012, 01:31 PM

I shouldn't need more than 18psi to break 400. The oversized valves, S3 cams and ISIS manifold should make a huge difference in airflow.

Kingtal0n · 09-17-2012, 04:31 PM

I like to keep the pressure a slow as possible. That bad day, bad gas, going uphill on the highway, fries in your mouth hands covered with grease, you dont downshift from fifth... it happens and the engine chews small pits out of your head and deck.

Dont be greasy going uphill in fifth gear with 22psi on 93 octane.

Kingtal0n · 09-17-2012, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EsChassisLove

I shouldn't need more than 18psi to break 400. The oversized valves, S3 cams and ISIS manifold should make a huge difference in airflow.

it all depends on RPM, if you spin only to 5k there is no way you can make 400whp with any turbo at 18psi on any 2L engine in existence...

likewise, if you could spin 9k you might be able to make 400whp with only 10psi.
hang on let me check...
Using a garbage quicky math equation for rough estimates on any engine displacement:

(122 x 9000 / 3456 = 317CFM * 1.75 * .069 = 38lb/min )

Ah, yes, 11~psi and 9k rpm will get you very close to 400

You are actually in hope of this:

(122 x 7200 / 3456 = 250cfm * 2.24 * .069 = 38lb/min)

There is a 2L @ 7200rpm and 18psi producing 380

These numbers include compressor losses, and I do not factor drivetrain loss because most of the time the intercooler (airpath) tends to help recover some of that compressor efficiency which makes up for the drivetrain loss in the math. The turbocharger constant, iirc, includes adiabatic efficiency, which means no heat transfer to the environment, which is clearly not our case. From a thermodynamic perspective, what happens between the compressor and the intake manifold can vary GREATLY due to the varying availability of low and high quality intercoolers, and length/size of pipe.

s13Kurt · 09-17-2012, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingtal0n

I like to keep the pressure a slow as possible. That bad day, bad gas, going uphill on the highway, fries in your mouth hands covered with grease, you dont downshift from fifth... it happens and the engine chews small pits out of your head and deck.

Dont be greasy going uphill in fifth gear with 22psi on 93 octane.

That's why people should learn how to drive and how to make pulls properly as to not put too much load on a motor.......or use meth or ethanol and do whatever you feel lol.

Kingtal0n · 09-17-2012, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by s13Kurt

That's why people should learn how to drive and how to make pulls properly as to not put too much load on a motor.......or use meth or ethanol and do whatever you feel lol.

Some of us cant resist

That civic is gonna pass my redtop? I think not! I step down in fifth and the wastegate source falls off... well, at least my shifter doesnt get any grease on it.
I look back with fries hanging outa my mouth

codyace · 09-17-2012, 10:01 PM

18psi on a perfect engine would have a hard time making 400whp. It simply doesn't push enough air.

S13 curtis · 09-18-2012, 11:11 AM

I dont think 20+ psi is alot for these turbos.... On a T2 housing i think its alot because of the backpressure, which will create more heat and it becomes less effecient. Its almost like taking a deep breath then blowing out with a straw. An external wastegate helps out alot with backpressure and boost control. which is what I highly recommend on the t2 setups with this turbo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by codyace

18psi on a perfect engine would have a hard time making 400whp. It simply doesn't push enough air.

Agreed, but it is possiable. On a bigger turbo its really easy but not an effecient set up due to lag. Back when I had my evo and I was getting it tuned at AWD motorsports it made 386whp at 16 psi on the wastegate spring (Pump Gas) when they started tuning which would feel like crap since it didnt get full boost until 4900, but that was with a HTA3586R turbo. Ended up finishing with 600+ at 33psi.

610whp Stock Block HTA86!!!!! AWD Motorsports Diiirk Tuned - evolutionm.net

Kingtal0n · 09-18-2012, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codyace

18psi on a perfect engine would have a hard time making 400whp. It simply doesn't push enough air.

A perfect engine would have zero friction and would easily produce 400 horsepower... CODY!!!

lol

ctsedan · 09-20-2012, 08:02 PM

I havent posted on this tread but I just finished my car. Overall im very happy with the results.
List
95 240sx s14 sr
gt2871r .64
S3 cams
Nistune
740cc injectors
OEM mani polished ported and coated
38mm external gate
greddy intake
stock bottom end, changed bearings and oem rings
Numbers
384 hp 347tq at 21psi, still running high flow cat

I had tomei mani with internal gate same setup could only mange 357hp at 21psi spiking.

This is the final run, sorry for crappy pix, I dont have print out.

jaysgottaredtop · 09-20-2012, 08:04 PM

^ dyno graph? when are you hitting full boost? out of curiosity. sounds like great numbers though.

EsChassisLove · 09-28-2012, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingtal0n

I like to keep the pressure a slow as possible. That bad day, bad gas, going uphill on the highway, fries in your mouth hands covered with grease, you dont downshift from fifth... it happens and the engine chews small pits out of your head and deck.

Dont be greasy going uphill in fifth gear with 22psi on 93 octane.

That's what an AEM water/meth setup is for

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingtal0n

A perfect engine would have zero friction and would easily produce 400 horsepower... CODY!!!

lol

True that lol

Sek23 · 09-28-2012, 08:37 AM

Stock SR20 stock pistons stock rods everything is stock

How to be safe pressure above engine ?

and i'm thinking get GT2871r .64 is this make sense with that engine or do I need any other parts ?

This is my first message so I hope you will understand

boniomario · 09-28-2012, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sek23

Stock SR20 stock pistons stock rods everything is stock

How to be safe pressure above engine ?

and i'm thinking get GT2871r .64 is this make sense with that engine or do I need any other parts ?

This is my first message so I hope you will understand

Check your PM my Turkish buddy

On a stock block I would not push beyond 16-18 PSI this is of course with a built head, with the whole engine stock I would stick at 12-14 PSI with a good tune ... Remember these engines are OLD !!!

rbs14kouki · 10-04-2012, 09:04 AM

Im looking into building a sr right now ! My friend have a sr that is fucked , I thought of picking it up and doing a 2.2 with the bottom end ! 90mm piston with sleeve

Would it be that much better then a 2.0l ? (looking for 400/450 whp , is it possible with the gt2871r and a 2.2L or i should just go tonthe gt30 trim ) !?!? Your thought please

nash-singapore · 10-04-2012, 09:21 AM

U may consider the gtx2867r too ,never read a bad review on them compared to the 2871r , well look up on codyace he broke the 400whp with the 2871r with stock bottom end but a reliably done up head.

Seraphim38 · 10-04-2012, 10:04 AM

the financial investment to get to 2.2L far exceeds the value it represents. Spend the money going to a twin scroll top mount GTX3067R and spin up faster than any GT2871R while making more than 400+rwhp. Done.

rbs14kouki · 10-04-2012, 10:10 AM

i have the sr for what ! 500$

I have Darton sleeve instaled for around 750$ localy here in montreal , canada

And i was forging the bottom end anyway!!!

Or keep that money and build a vvl head with the 2.0L bottom end but i know me and the vvl is going to rape me $$$$

Synergy · 10-04-2012, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbs14kouki

i have the sr for what ! 500$

I have Darton sleeve instaled for around 750$ localy here in montreal , canada

And i was forging the bottom end anyway!!!

Or keep that money and build a vvl head with the 2.0L bottom end but i know me and the vvl is going to rape me $$$$

Can i send you money so you can sleeve my SR block? Not kidding 750? I pay 3,000 at my shop for sleeves.

rbs14kouki · 10-04-2012, 11:43 AM

I just talked with my tuner and he had is sr sleeved there !!!

Two of the sleeve moved in is block ! I wont go that route for sure !

AtReYu72 · 10-04-2012, 12:20 PM

Glad to hear you're going back to Sr engines RBs14 ! I have some blocks and heads I could bring to you this week end for really cheap

SlideOrDie831 · 10-04-2012, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamg

what size injectors, at minimum, are needed?

i wouldn't go smaller then 550's. just get some 740's

zurud · 10-06-2012, 03:44 AM

I don't know why people think this turbo will get them to 400whp. It won't. Save yourself some money , time and headache go straight to T3 with 60mm turbine . The cost is the same. Look at the compressor max, hp at 2PR is 450. 15% drivetain loss put you at 382.5whp. Now I have to sell this turbo, manifold, lines and elbow.

09-11-2012, 03:18 AM	#2702
EsChassisLove Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: San Diego Age: 32 Posts: 2,090 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	Cody, I hope my set up breaks 400whp lol. If it doesnt, then something is seriously wrong haha. __________________ IG/TikTok-ThatS14_Z06guy

09-14-2012, 08:14 AM	#2704
EsChassisLove Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: San Diego Age: 32 Posts: 2,090 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	I'm hoping it doesnt take more than 20psi lol. __________________ IG/TikTok-ThatS14_Z06guy

09-14-2012, 09:22 AM	#2706
jaysgottaredtop Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 950 Trader Rating: (7) Feedback Score: 7 reviews	^ huh? psi makes a huge difference as compressor size varies. i'm not entirely sure what point you're trying to make. __________________

09-14-2012, 01:31 PM	#2709
EsChassisLove Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: San Diego Age: 32 Posts: 2,090 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	I shouldn't need more than 18psi to break 400. The oversized valves, S3 cams and ISIS manifold should make a huge difference in airflow. __________________ IG/TikTok-ThatS14_Z06guy

09-17-2012, 04:31 PM	#2710
Kingtal0n Post Whore! Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Florida Age: 38 Posts: 4,649 Trader Rating: (17) Feedback Score: 17 reviews	I like to keep the pressure a slow as possible. That bad day, bad gas, going uphill on the highway, fries in your mouth hands covered with grease, you dont downshift from fifth... it happens and the engine chews small pits out of your head and deck. Dont be greasy going uphill in fifth gear with 22psi on 93 octane. __________________ 5.3/4l80e/turbo 240sx playthrough: https://tinyurl.com/turbo240

09-14-2012, 08:41 AM	#2705
s13Kurt Zilvia Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: georgia Posts: 224 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	^ What does a certain psi matter. Airflow is airflow. No boost leaks, and the tune is correct keep cranking until it does what you want. This is coming from someone that trapped 120 on a jdm s14 t28 on 22 psi (still running) and DD'd a stock longblock 2860 car at 22 psi forever (still running). Also I see people blow these turbos up using way to thin of an oil. I only use Valvoline vr1 20-50 or Shell Rotella 15-50.

09-14-2012, 09:41 AM	#2707
Seraphim38 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Washington Posts: 810 Trader Rating: (6) Feedback Score: 6 reviews	psi matters since the higher pressure a turbo is pushing, it is likely to push air temps higher which drives timing out of the tune. Eventally you run out of incremental power. When we were professionally custom tuning my GT2871R setup with external wastegate housing, going from 18 psi to 20 psi of boost only added a quarter of a hp because the turbo was heat soaked.

09-14-2012, 01:03 PM	#2708
s13Kurt Zilvia Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: georgia Posts: 224 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	I'm saying everybody's setup is different and his setup could need more than 20 to make the power he wants. That statement was focused on just the gt28 compressors. I just see guys so hell Bent on making a certain number on a certain psi of boost and that shouldn't be the case in my experience. There's a lot of factors that come into making power so why say I need "x" amount of whp at "x" psi?

09-17-2012, 10:01 PM	#2714
codyace Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poconos, PA Age: 36 Posts: 8,030 Trader Rating: (58) Feedback Score: 58 reviews	18psi on a perfect engine would have a hard time making 400whp. It simply doesn't push enough air. __________________ *Want Air Conditioning in your SR20 Swapped car? Check out www.sr20acbrackets.com for more information! Quest Alternator Conversions for SR20!* Check my Group Buy! Tired of lousy internal gates? Go external wastegate with one of my manifolds, Check out my group buy

09-20-2012, 08:02 PM	#2717
ctsedan Zilvia Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Wallyworld, CT Posts: 251 Trader Rating: (17) Feedback Score: 17 reviews	I havent posted on this tread but I just finished my car. Overall im very happy with the results. List 95 240sx s14 sr gt2871r .64 S3 cams Nistune 740cc injectors OEM mani polished ported and coated 38mm external gate greddy intake stock bottom end, changed bearings and oem rings Numbers 384 hp 347tq at 21psi, still running high flow cat I had tomei mani with internal gate same setup could only mange 357hp at 21psi spiking. This is the final run, sorry for crappy pix, I dont have print out.

09-20-2012, 08:04 PM	#2718
jaysgottaredtop Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 950 Trader Rating: (7) Feedback Score: 7 reviews	^ dyno graph? when are you hitting full boost? out of curiosity. sounds like great numbers though. __________________

09-28-2012, 08:37 AM	#2720
Sek23 Join Date: May 2011 Location: Turkey , Istanbul Age: 32 Posts: 3 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Stock SR20 stock pistons stock rods everything is stock How to be safe pressure above engine ? and i'm thinking get GT2871r .64 is this make sense with that engine or do I need any other parts ? This is my first message so I hope you will understand

10-04-2012, 09:04 AM	#2722
rbs14kouki Zilvia Addict Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Montreal , Canada Age: 35 Posts: 817 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Im looking into building a sr right now ! My friend have a sr that is fucked , I thought of picking it up and doing a 2.2 with the bottom end ! 90mm piston with sleeve Would it be that much better then a 2.0l ? (looking for 400/450 whp , is it possible with the gt2871r and a 2.2L or i should just go tonthe gt30 trim ) !?!? Your thought please __________________ AV FABRICATION Built thread sr20vet s14 http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=535574

10-04-2012, 09:21 AM	#2723
nash-singapore Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Asia-Singapore Age: 30 Posts: 28 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	U may consider the gtx2867r too ,never read a bad review on them compared to the 2871r , well look up on codyace he broke the 400whp with the 2871r with stock bottom end but a reliably done up head.

10-04-2012, 10:04 AM	#2724
Seraphim38 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Washington Posts: 810 Trader Rating: (6) Feedback Score: 6 reviews	the financial investment to get to 2.2L far exceeds the value it represents. Spend the money going to a twin scroll top mount GTX3067R and spin up faster than any GT2871R while making more than 400+rwhp. Done.

10-04-2012, 10:10 AM	#2725
rbs14kouki Zilvia Addict Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Montreal , Canada Age: 35 Posts: 817 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	i have the sr for what ! 500$ I have Darton sleeve instaled for around 750$ localy here in montreal , canada And i was forging the bottom end anyway!!! Or keep that money and build a vvl head with the 2.0L bottom end but i know me and the vvl is going to rape me $$$$ __________________ AV FABRICATION Built thread sr20vet s14 http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=535574

10-04-2012, 11:43 AM	#2727
rbs14kouki Zilvia Addict Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Montreal , Canada Age: 35 Posts: 817 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	I just talked with my tuner and he had is sr sleeved there !!! Two of the sleeve moved in is block ! I wont go that route for sure ! __________________ AV FABRICATION Built thread sr20vet s14 http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=535574

10-04-2012, 12:20 PM	#2728
AtReYu72 Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Québec , Canada Age: 32 Posts: 12 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Glad to hear you're going back to Sr engines RBs14 ! I have some blocks and heads I could bring to you this week end for really cheap

10-06-2012, 03:44 AM	#2730
zurud Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: evansville, in Posts: 391 Trader Rating: (4) Feedback Score: 4 reviews	I don't know why people think this turbo will get them to 400whp. It won't. Save yourself some money , time and headache go straight to T3 with 60mm turbine . The cost is the same. Look at the compressor max, hp at 2PR is 450. 15% drivetain loss put you at 382.5whp. Now I have to sell this turbo, manifold, lines and elbow.

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