ka-titties

Man, so happy you updated! I was thinking about your build this last weekend, wondering if you'd ever get back into the car. Congrats!

RalliartRsX

Yes! The update is LIT!!!

jr_ss

Yeah it was! An old co-worker almost ruined it. He saw my car on a trailer down the road from his house. A buddy of mine had to go tell him to shut his mouth!

Thank you! It’s nice to be able to get back into it. I too was wondering if I was ever going to get a chance to start working on it again. I had my doubts, that’s for sure.

Haha! Well, I surely didn’t want to disappoint. Still pissed at myself for the freeze plug, if that’s what it is. I ran 60-70% water in Fl and the rest coolant. Forgot about that until I saw the puddle under my car. It didn’t have that distinct coolant smell. Ultimately, I think I loosened a plug up and popped it on the last pull I did. I’ll end up checking the HG as well.

You mentioned something about tuning over by Harrisburg? Is there a specific reason you don’t use MA-motorsports in Glen Arm?

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My SR20VET

RalliartRsX

If its only the freeze plug, then considering how long the car sat, thats a win!

Yeah, as JKTuning is the one that did the initial tuning (and is VERY capable) hence why I mentioned him/them

jr_ss

Let me know when you plan on heading over there. I may tag along. I could use some dyno time to sort out some drivability issues.

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My SR20VET

jr_ss

I started tearing down the car tonight. My main goal was to get the car in the air and supported well. The down pipe and wastegate recirculation pipe have been removed. I forgot how much of a pain in the ass it is to remove those pieces. I cannot wait to put them back in ����*♂️. Tomorrow, I?ll remove the remaining items to get the trans out. I?ll most likely pull the intake manifold in preparation for lowering the cross member or un-cradling the motor to get a better angle for trans removal.

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My SR20VET

jr_ss

I got the remaining peripheral parts off today and the trans removed. It was pretty uneventful. However, upon removing my clutch/flywheel, things got interesting. A piece fell out that I didn’t recognize. Let’s play name that part and go!

https://www.flickr.com/photos/188543.../shares/681o84

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My SR20VET

srh666

A chewed up freeze plug?

jr_ss

Sure is! My twin disk has stanchions bolted to the flywheel for the floating plates. I can only surmise that it must have popped out under load and the flywheel mangled it. Which doesn?t give me a good feeling and after speaking with Mark at Mazworx, almost confirms I?ll be needing a sleeved bottom end.

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My SR20VET

RalliartRsX

Damn.......

Who did the block initially?? And how does a freeze plug popping out = sleeved block?? Did the block overheat to the point of warpage??

jr_ss

The block was assembled by a local machine shop in Florida. Nothing needed special attention when it was assembled and it?s survived two iterations of setups. One at 360whp and this one at 485whp. I?ve beat the hell out of this motor and it?s taken every lick I?ve given it. It is also 10-11yrs old.

The only thing I can surmise, is that I cracked a cylinder liner and the added pressure blew the weakest link. My boost did spike to 26psi and that would put me closer to 550whp or pretty much the limits of a factory sleeved motor. I haven?t pulled the head yet, but I?m expecting a crack at the thinnest portions of the block between cylinders. A conversation with Mark at Mazworx kind of confirmed what I was thinking, but I won?t know until I tear the motor down.

With that said, I?ve priced a sleeved motor out from Mazworx. I?ll supply some of my already stocked components, but that is going to have to wait for awhile. 4-5k sleeved bottom-end isn?t in the budget right now.

Once I figure out Imgur or Flickr, I?ll get some photos up on this page.

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My SR20VET

RedSled

don't think 550hp is the limit of the stock bottom end ,it all comes down to the tuning, I've got a bone stock bottom end ,stock rods ,pistons ,sleeves and it was on 565hp on constant nitrous ,28lbs of boost and drag racing event after event for two complete years ,hammering it every event to the max and its perfectly fine with no signs of damage ,my tuner even had a stock bottom end sr20 on 600hp also ,but the owner ended scrapping it .

RedSled

i could have pushed for more hp but decided to scrap it cause basically it was living on the edge with those piston and rods ,got a couple guys around doing 700hp on stock sleeves but with proper well engineered parts.

jr_ss

I think there are limits on everything and most SR’s start having issues around the power level we’re speaking of. I’m not saying my overboost was the main factor. I did relocated from FL to PA where the climates and air densities are vastly different. Could my tune have been off, absolutely. My point was, at the power level I’m at, not having a sleeved motor, there is very little margin for error. If my tune was off, it could’ve been the last nail in the coffin for this motor.

I’m not going to cry boo boo or anything. This motor has been great, but moving forward, I was going to need a more robust setup. Does it suck the car is going to be down again? Fuck yeah it does. I enjoy driving this thing. It’s raw, and purely exhilarating to drive. How cars were suppose to be. Not the tamed, calculating, forgiving machines they have turned into. But I digress. The car will be back on the road and it will be sporting either a new freeze plug or sleeved bottomend.

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My SR20VET

jr_ss

Well, I have some great news and some eh news...

Let’s go with Eh news first. Before I yanked my head off I thought to do a leak down test to see if I could one, find the cylinder/s that could’ve been the cause for a freeze plug failure and two, determine if it was the cylinder liner. Most leak down tests are done with the piston at TDC to check rings, valves and gasket integrity. To check the entire cylinder I set the piston at BDC. My results from TDC to BDC varied roughly 1psi. However, what I did find was I had some leakage from the valves on most of the cylinders. Mind you, this head was purchased from a used engine, slapped on a factory DET bottom-end and sent. As far as I know, the PO didn’t perform any service work to the head. When I purchased it, I threw new valve stem seals and Supertech valve springs in it for good measure. I also asked the machine shop to check it. They threw a vac pump on all the ports and everything checked out ok, so no serious work was required. 6years later, countless dyno pulls, drag strip passes, 3rd and 4th gear blasts and multiple limiter excursions, it sounds like the abuse has finally taken its toll.

With that comes some benefits. I’ll finally be throwing the N1 cams in and getting the head shimmed for even crazier VET shenanigans.

On to the good news...

I finally got the cylinder head off the motor this afternoon. It is an extremely huge pain in the ass to remove the head, turbo manifold and turbo as a unit. I couldn’t get the two inner manifold nuts loose when it was in the car, so I had no choice.

Anyway, I found no damage to the cylinders, in-fact, everything looks great except for a few vertical scuff lines accustomed to most engines. Nothing can be grabbed by a finger nail. No damage has been found on the deck either, which is great considering cylinder number 2 lost a fire ring, which I can only assume was under WOT and 20psi. There is a slight indent on cylinder number 2’s piston, more like a nick/deep scratches from where the piston contacted the ring and pushed up on it. Remains of said ring can be seen on the faces of the exhaust valves. I haven’t pulled my turbo from the exhaust housing to see if there was any wheel damage, but it’s probably a good idea.

I DO NOT need to purchase a sleeved bottom-end right now, which is a huge monkey off my back. I didn’t want my car sitting down for another 2 years until I could get the funds rounded up to purchased a stage 2 or 3 bottom-end. Being the sole provider for the family is difficult, it doesn’t always leave a lot of extra funds for unnecessary purchases, but that is the hand I was dealt almost 4years ago now (remember we had twins).

So moving forward, there are a few shops semi local I can take the head to and have it gone through. I really only want to clean it up and replace items where necessary. I do not think I’ll be doing any port work while it’s off, perhaps a spare head at a later date.

Once again, when I can figure out these stupid Imgur and Flickr accounts, I’ll get some pictures up.

As always, thanks for taking the time to read my nonsense.

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My SR20VET

babillaracing

dang bro i see you still working on this

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618 whp tuned by alpha

jr_ss

Yep, still playing around with it. Too much time and money invested to get rid of it.

What are you toying with these days?

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My SR20VET

babillaracing

not much just this toy

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618 whp tuned by alpha

jr_ss

FD3S? Or...?

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My SR20VET

babillaracing

fd3 twin turbo 6766's lsx engine proefi ecu magnum t56 8.8 rear end

if you want to check the build this is the link
https://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=13533.0

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618 whp tuned by alpha

jr_ss

So, I ordered a couple of tools to measure block distortion and other various components of my engine. Since I really didn’t want to send my block out to be decked, I thought it was at least a good decision to measure it for flatness. Another thing that prompted me to do this, I couldn’t find any one specific reason why my head gasket failed. In fact, I still struggle to wrap my head around what the mechanism was that blew my fire ring and ultimately a freeze plug. I think, or what seems most likely, it was a perfect storm that caused it. Vastly different air density, a boost spike and potentially one large knock that caused it to let go. I’m fortunate and glad it happened close to home vs down range somewhere.

After measuring various points on the block with a straight edge, spec’d within .00047” flatness and .0009” parallelism, I found that between cylinders I had a deviation of .0015” or .038mm. Factory standard spec is less than .0012” or .03mm, with a max of .0038” or .1mm. Accuracy of my feeler gauges may play a role in these measurements as well. How much is hard to say.

With all that being said, if I were to run a factory gasket or something more forgiving than an MLS, this would not be an issue. However, since I am pushing 3x the power limits of the factory motor, .0015” is not good enough. Based on my measurements, the specific area where the gasket failed, has a “dip” or low point and it is referred to by some as “trenching”. It is the most difficult place to seal because it is the farthest away from the head studs. It also doesn’t help that aluminum is a soft material, hence why a lot of people at or near my power levels sleeve the motor. Not only does it provide a strong, structural wall to add much needed rigidity to the block, but it also provides a solid foundation for clamping the head gasket and limiting leakage.

After a couple phone calls, in depth conversations with Nick Hunter @ 5523 and Chris @ A.H.M. Performance and a thorough review of my goals, I have decided to tear down my block and send it in to be decked. This will give me the opportunity to audit my built bottom end and see where, if any, the deficiencies lie. I’ll inspect all bearings and bearing surfaces, piston wrist pins, etc. I am also thinking about having my rotating assembly checked for balance, as I do get an odd vibration in the 4-5k rpm range.

Anyway, I’m going to attempt to figure this picture thing out and get some shots uploaded. Have a good evening, deuces.

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My SR20VET

PoorMans180SX

I'd say the most common thing I see that does this is a dirty injector.

Also, not a bad idea to check balance on your clutch and driveshaft.

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RalliartRsX

Blah Blah blah

Na man. Dyno graphs, gibberish and some other shit about VE

If you have the extra dough, have Chris do the pre and post machining measuring and when it gets back to you, confirm with your equipment. That way, in the future, you know your equipment is calibrated and accurate.

Looking forward to this build!

jr_ss

I agree and have pulled the injectors to send out for cleaning services. It’s $50, why not? I’ll also send my clutch down with my rotating assembly so it can all be balanced or at least checked. I’m pretty sure they are balanced from factory.

Oh man, I’m going to make all the torques with this 2L!

That’s a great idea to have Chris do this and I can check when it comes back! I still have a few components to buy to complete my bottom end measurement tool kit.

Yeah, this might take some time, but I’m in no rush at this point. Thanks guys

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My SR20VET

RalliartRsX

awith kid #2 on the way, I will have plenty of time to live vicariously through you

jr_ss

Congratulations! That’s exciting! The car will take a backseat for a couple years if it hasn’t already. How did the track session go?

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My SR20VET

RalliartRsX

Terrible.....will send you a pm

jr_ss

You can text me too, you have my number I believe.

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My SR20VET

jr_ss

Wow, almost a whole year had gone by at this point.

Where are we. Oh yeah, COVID didn’t go away in a few months, Trump was impeached a few times and now Grandpa Joe is in the White House.

Ok seriously though, some things have change with my plans too. I was just going to do a refresh on the head and bottom end. Time stewing and giving it thought has changed my mind multiple times.

* my motor is still at the machine shop. I have Darton sleeves to install, no rush
* I’m doing a pretty trick thing with the head, I will release deets when I have more parts ready.
* I picked up a Full-Race TS manifold and down-pipe and sold my PeakBoost setup. I converted the GTX3076R to TS with a .83 housing.
* Picked up some VET cams for the exhaust cam for better low lift/duration combination to help in turbo spool.
* I also sold my Mazworx Z32 trans setup and grabbed a Mazworx JK41 trans adapter and transmission from RalliartRsX.
* Adding a Haltech TC4 for individual cylinder EGT data

So yeah, pretty much has turned into a new build with some old components. I am photo journaling all of this and will post photos and updates when I have the time.

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My SR20VET

speedingmofa

Good to see you back buddy!
I haven't gone through you entire build/setup, but whats been done to the head so far?

I'm also curious why you went from Z32 to Z33 trans. I have a Z32 conversion kit sitting in the garage waiting to go in when my block is ready and put it all in in one go.

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