SR Owners... More HP Easy Mod... Catch Can Setup - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 04:48 PM

Updated 1st post with Pictures.

How you ask.... Negative Crankcase pressure.... Seals rings better for better compression.... HP from Negative Crank Pressure is known to make 5WHP or More....

Ok this is probably the best way and cheapest and easiest way is to hook up to vac source which true your little intake PCV does have some, but your Turbo has the most. So hook your valve cover back to your intake. Now you have blowby and most people put a catch in the front of the T and into the Intake. But you still you get oil into the intake, why you ask? Because that front T is crap design.

Ok Fine... Most SR slanted valve covers can do this no problem, why? Because their baffling in the valve cover is better than or flat tops and their valve covers ARE that little black air oil separator cans if you look up slant top pics... So what do you do?

Blu808 (Manjiparts.com) and I are working on some things for my track car to work this out on flat top valve covers. 2 Goals, Increase Vacuum and suck those pressures out of the crank to ultimately negative crankcase pressure and reduce to 0 blowby.

On my redtop with a GT2871R fully built motor and seeing constant 18PSI, I was getting blowby because that STUPID "T" on the valve cover is basically useless. So we are coming up with two products that can increase horsepower and help you save your motor.

This SRT Forums thread was THE best thing I have seen technically to read. They have a solution, so Blu808 and I are also in development for a solution

Thes engines need vacuum all of the time... - SRT Forums - SRT4, SRT6, SRT8, SRT10 & Dodge Forum

Long Story Short...

Why Flat Tops Suck. The "T" on the valve cover has baffles in the Valve cover but you get blowby from the pressurization of the crankcase (bad) and also oil is getting sucked out of the valve cover under boost. The valve cover does have baffles, but its in sufficient. In stock form the front of the "T" is hooked to the intake tube which IS the best internal source of vacuum, but that means oil gets into your intake from both the valve cover and the crankcase.

So far, Blue808 and I have managed to reduce blowby to 0 on my car. History is, I did a trackday and I was filling my can 3-4 laps around the track. Sucks! So we have gotten that to 0 for the entire day which is about 30+ Laps. Keep in mind this course has a lot of elevation changes so it will through your crank oil upwards for sure.

Pics of the solution will be up soon as well, but I have searched for like 3 months on zilvia and there has been 0 real solutions.... Nothing really has been developed for you guys, so Blu808 and I are working on it.

Just service annoucement hahaha!

Silviaoneday · 01-21-2009, 04:55 PM

Im interested myself!!

YoungGun · 01-21-2009, 04:56 PM

Write up plz.

mysharonna · 01-21-2009, 04:57 PM

Sounds awesome! I have been debating a solution to this myself. Catch can here? In between there? I dunno.

Post those pics!

simplistek · 01-21-2009, 05:01 PM

just add one of these.

the better S14 baffling on an S13 SR.

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 05:10 PM

^^^ Yah that is great for Slant Tops, but a lot of people have flat tops like I said.... In that picture, the only problem is you gain nothing from that except only exiting crank pressure. There are still 2 issues, you are increasing pollution (not that I care) and 2 is have MAYBE 0 out your crank pressure, but your system I will call it isn't "actively" evacuating the crank pressure which leads to more HP and better response....

Yah we are working on the system as we speak and should have more results next week... Hopefully I can do a dyno session with everything.

Also not everyone has that setup S13.4 (MA-Motorsports style) valve cover that costs $400 big ones... which I don't have on a racers budget...

I am hopeful our solution is $200 or less.... Depending on setup...

Exas Spec D · 01-21-2009, 05:17 PM

I can't wait to see the "solution".

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 05:35 PM

I am currently also gathering parts. If you guys know what krank vents are.... F... that I ain't paying 110 for some PCV check valves.... So this is with budget in mind guys...

timlush · 01-21-2009, 05:50 PM

This is how I am doing it.

(not my car)

Dj Ryderz · 01-21-2009, 05:59 PM

That sound very nice ..... I cant way to see it finished

$nicklefritz · 01-21-2009, 06:16 PM

well the cheapest way to do it is by
getting 2 covers 14 &13 cut and paste it ur self ...
or send both out to get fabbed up ...
buy evry thin used shouldnt be more than mabe 200 beaners.

smelly240 · 01-21-2009, 06:20 PM

no oil in my pipes... and the turbo inlet pipe only doesnt have vacuum when the turbo compressor surges

***S14DB*** · 01-21-2009, 06:31 PM

You guys do realize the PCV is on the other side of the VC right?

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 07:05 PM

Yah the PCV is on the passenger side on a USDM. The turbo is another good source of vacuum, you stop pressure on surge you can install a pcv there too. Another good vacuum source is the exhaust too...

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by $nicklefritz

well the cheapest way to do it is by
getting 2 covers 14 &13 cut and paste it ur self ...
or send both out to get fabbed up ...
buy evry thin used shouldnt be more than mabe 200 beaners.

Ergh you sure when one cover is about 80 bux? How much welding and machine work you think its going to take to do that? Think about it...

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 07:08 PM

The solution we hav is very close to that, except in that picture, he is going to get oil in there when you doing drift or grip...

Side note, that is a RB, and their baffling is NOT the same as SR.

Quote:

Originally Posted by timlush

This is how I am doing it.

(not my car)

Mister.E · 01-21-2009, 07:31 PM

im really waiting to see how this turns out. you and me have been going back and forth trying to figure this out for some time now. i ended up having to put the oil separation tank back on, which totally sucks balls, and id love to have a better fix for this problem

jakethesnake · 01-21-2009, 07:43 PM

im very interested in what your coming up with

silviakid2790 · 01-21-2009, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slider2828

The solution we hav is very close to that, except in that picture, he is going to get oil in there when you doing drift or grip...

Side note, that is a RB, and their baffling is NOT the same as SR.

...........thats deff not a rb.......

blu808 · 01-21-2009, 09:25 PM

Yea that is a Toyota engine Ken.

Anyways. It is actually a really simple solution.

Monooxide · 01-21-2009, 09:32 PM

The real solution to this is to run an external vacuum pump like NASCAR.

.

***S14DB*** · 01-21-2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slider2828

Yah the PCV is on the passenger side on a USDM. The turbo is another good source of vacuum, you stop pressure on surge you can install a pcv there too. Another good vacuum source is the exhaust too...

Manifold vacuum is much higher then turbo intake. The line from the intake to the T is mainly for the intake of clean metered air to the crankcase. All the shit comes out the PCV into the Intake Manifold.

Best solution is to put a Catch Can between the PCV valve and the Intake Manifold. If your are really anal, another one between the VC and the intake tube.

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 09:59 PM

I ahve a read a couple of different sites like 3000GT, 300zx, and SRT's and they all suggest the turbo is a good source of vacuum too.... and this increases overall vacuum from the valve cover and ultimately crankcase.... But remember the exhaust system is vacuum as welll....

Def · 01-21-2009, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S14DB

Manifold vacuum is much higher then turbo intake. The line from the intake to the T is mainly for the intake of clean metered air to the crankcase. All the shit comes out the PCV into the Intake Manifold.

Best solution is to put a Catch Can between the PCV valve and the Intake Manifold. If your are really anal, another one between the VC and the intake tube.

But when you really need vacuum pulled on the crankcase is when the intake manifold is under boost. Exactly why the stock PCV valve is basically a check valve which prevents boost in the intake manifold from going to the valve cover.

The turbo inlet is the best source of vacuum at WOT.

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silviakid2790

...........thats deff not a rb.......

Woops that is a 2JZ.... lol...

steve shadows · 01-21-2009, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Def

But when you really need vacuum pulled on the crankcase is when the intake manifold is under boost. Exactly why the stock PCV valve is basically a check valve which prevents boost in the intake manifold from going to the valve cover.

The turbo inlet is the best source of vacuum at WOT.

Exactly.

This is SR20 101 - not some miraculous discovery.

All of you should be good little turbo car owners and should still have your crank cases hooked up to vacuum already...

I don't know why anyone would have ever removed the stock setup- Nissan did that, if not anything else on the (T) series motors for a reason.

At higher boost and HP threshold/levels you can see gains of 25-70 whp...cough

*slider2828* · 01-21-2009, 10:10 PM

Thanks Steve... But that T is shit if you get some blowby... so monday ima get one more thing welded and the setup complete.... WIll take pics of course...

***S14DB*** · 01-21-2009, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Def

But when you really need vacuum pulled on the crankcase is when the intake manifold is under boost. Exactly why the stock PCV valve is basically a check valve which prevents boost in the intake manifold from going to the valve cover.

The turbo inlet is the best source of vacuum at WOT.

How long are you staying at WOT? You are going to build up some gases at WOT from blow by. But you are going to suck them right up once you let off.

I do not understand why you guys are trying to re-invent the wheel. Quality Rings and modern piston clearance. I don't see how you are going to have major blow by.

Only gain I can see is an extended oil change intervals. Yes you can increase power by installing a PCV system. But, the motor already has one.

Splitting hairs IMHO.

blu808 · 01-21-2009, 11:18 PM

3 mile long road course.

s14db. You have a valid point. but his shit was really filling up every 3-4 laps. If he was sucking oil into his intake manifold through his pvc, then we would do a catch can and more work there.

We are simply helping out the stock system without having to use a vac pump.

Luke

Def · 01-22-2009, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S14DB

How long are you staying at WOT? You are going to build up some gases at WOT from blow by. But you are going to suck them right up once you let off.

I do not understand why you guys are trying to re-invent the wheel. Quality Rings and modern piston clearance. I don't see how you are going to have major blow by.

Only gain I can see is an extended oil change intervals. Yes you can increase power by installing a PCV system. But, the motor already has one.

Splitting hairs IMHO.

You're missing the point of my post. The PCV valve is designed to generate a small vacuum on the crankcase under low load conditions. You build boost and the turbo inlet pressure drops and the PCV valve doesn't flow either way, and the hose coming off the valve cover starts really flowing to pull a vacuum on the crankcase, which is where the majority of your blow by will happen due to simple physics.

I personally don't have my stock PCV valve hooked up to anything due to the crap that gets in the intake manifold even with a small catch can and haven't noticed any negative effects. I do have a catch can between the valve cover and intake tube with -8 AN lines which is enough flow given the diameter of a 3/8" NPT fitting that threads into the valve cover is the same ID.

01-21-2009, 04:48 PM	#1
slider2828 Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 5,824 Trader Rating: (13) Feedback Score: 13 reviews	SR Owners... More HP Easy Mod... Catch Can Setup Updated 1st post with Pictures. How you ask.... Negative Crankcase pressure.... Seals rings better for better compression.... HP from Negative Crank Pressure is known to make 5WHP or More.... Ok this is probably the best way and cheapest and easiest way is to hook up to vac source which true your little intake PCV does have some, but your Turbo has the most. So hook your valve cover back to your intake. Now you have blowby and most people put a catch in the front of the T and into the Intake. But you still you get oil into the intake, why you ask? Because that front T is crap design. Ok Fine... Most SR slanted valve covers can do this no problem, why? Because their baffling in the valve cover is better than or flat tops and their valve covers ARE that little black air oil separator cans if you look up slant top pics... So what do you do? Blu808 (Manjiparts.com) and I are working on some things for my track car to work this out on flat top valve covers. 2 Goals, Increase Vacuum and suck those pressures out of the crank to ultimately negative crankcase pressure and reduce to 0 blowby. On my redtop with a GT2871R fully built motor and seeing constant 18PSI, I was getting blowby because that STUPID "T" on the valve cover is basically useless. So we are coming up with two products that can increase horsepower and help you save your motor. This SRT Forums thread was THE best thing I have seen technically to read. They have a solution, so Blu808 and I are also in development for a solution Thes engines need vacuum all of the time... - SRT Forums - SRT4, SRT6, SRT8, SRT10 & Dodge Forum Long Story Short... Why Flat Tops Suck. The "T" on the valve cover has baffles in the Valve cover but you get blowby from the pressurization of the crankcase (bad) and also oil is getting sucked out of the valve cover under boost. The valve cover does have baffles, but its in sufficient. In stock form the front of the "T" is hooked to the intake tube which IS the best internal source of vacuum, but that means oil gets into your intake from both the valve cover and the crankcase. So far, Blue808 and I have managed to reduce blowby to 0 on my car. History is, I did a trackday and I was filling my can 3-4 laps around the track. Sucks! So we have gotten that to 0 for the entire day which is about 30+ Laps. Keep in mind this course has a lot of elevation changes so it will through your crank oil upwards for sure. Pics of the solution will be up soon as well, but I have searched for like 3 months on zilvia and there has been 0 real solutions.... Nothing really has been developed for you guys, so Blu808 and I are working on it. Just service annoucement hahaha! __________________ Turn and Burn! Last edited by slider2828; 08-13-2020 at 06:40 PM..

01-21-2009, 05:01 PM	#5
simplistek Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: San Diego Posts: 463 Trader Rating: (7) Feedback Score: 7 reviews	just add one of these. the better S14 baffling on an S13 SR. __________________ v e r t e x - u s a . c o m

01-21-2009, 05:10 PM	#6
slider2828 Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 5,824 Trader Rating: (13) Feedback Score: 13 reviews	^^^ Yah that is great for Slant Tops, but a lot of people have flat tops like I said.... In that picture, the only problem is you gain nothing from that except only exiting crank pressure. There are still 2 issues, you are increasing pollution (not that I care) and 2 is have MAYBE 0 out your crank pressure, but your system I will call it isn't "actively" evacuating the crank pressure which leads to more HP and better response.... Yah we are working on the system as we speak and should have more results next week... Hopefully I can do a dyno session with everything. Also not everyone has that setup S13.4 (MA-Motorsports style) valve cover that costs $400 big ones... which I don't have on a racers budget... I am hopeful our solution is $200 or less.... Depending on setup... __________________ Turn and Burn!

01-21-2009, 05:35 PM	#8
slider2828 Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 5,824 Trader Rating: (13) Feedback Score: 13 reviews	I am currently also gathering parts. If you guys know what krank vents are.... F... that I ain't paying 110 for some PCV check valves.... So this is with budget in mind guys... __________________ Turn and Burn!

01-21-2009, 06:20 PM	#12
smelly240 Nissanaholic! Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Philaburbia Age: 43 Posts: 2,137 Trader Rating: (4) Feedback Score: 4 reviews	no oil in my pipes... and the turbo inlet pipe only doesnt have vacuum when the turbo compressor surges __________________ HREs on a S13 - check, 6262 - check, Girlfriend.... - nope

01-21-2009, 04:55 PM	#2
Silviaoneday Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: So Cal Posts: 471 Trader Rating: (9) Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Im interested myself!!

01-21-2009, 04:56 PM	#3
YoungGun Post Whore! Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: 818-951 SoCal Posts: 3,961 Trader Rating: (23) Feedback Score: 23 reviews	Write up plz.

01-21-2009, 04:57 PM	#4
mysharonna Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Waldo, OH Age: 37 Posts: 528 Trader Rating: (14) Feedback Score: 14 reviews	Sounds awesome! I have been debating a solution to this myself. Catch can here? In between there? I dunno. Post those pics!

01-21-2009, 05:17 PM	#7
Exas Spec D Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Union City, CA Age: 34 Posts: 449 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I can't wait to see the "solution".

01-21-2009, 05:50 PM	#9
timlush Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Louisville, KY Age: 36 Posts: 1,169 Trader Rating: (12) Feedback Score: 12 reviews	This is how I am doing it. (not my car)

01-21-2009, 05:59 PM	#10
Dj Ryderz Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Canada Age: 33 Posts: 40 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	That sound very nice ..... I cant way to see it finished

01-21-2009, 06:16 PM	#11
$nicklefritz Leaky Injector Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: new york Age: 36 Posts: 107 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	well the cheapest way to do it is by getting 2 covers 14 &13 cut and paste it ur self ... or send both out to get fabbed up ... buy evry thin used shouldnt be more than mabe 200 beaners.

01-21-2009, 06:31 PM	#13
*S14DB* AFC #1 Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 昨晩あなたのお母さんの家 Posts: 20,181 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	You guys do realize the PCV is on the other side of the VC right? __________________ Comments should be taken as Opinions not as Statements of Fact

01-21-2009, 07:05 PM	#14
slider2828 Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 5,824 Trader Rating: (13) Feedback Score: 13 reviews	Yah the PCV is on the passenger side on a USDM. The turbo is another good source of vacuum, you stop pressure on surge you can install a pcv there too. Another good vacuum source is the exhaust too... __________________ Turn and Burn!

01-21-2009, 07:31 PM	#17
Mister.E Post Whore! Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Las Vegas Age: 36 Posts: 4,590 Trader Rating: (53) Feedback Score: 53 reviews	im really waiting to see how this turns out. you and me have been going back and forth trying to figure this out for some time now. i ended up having to put the oil separation tank back on, which totally sucks balls, and id love to have a better fix for this problem

01-21-2009, 07:43 PM	#18
jakethesnake Zilvia Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: somewhere Posts: 205 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	im very interested in what your coming up with

01-21-2009, 09:25 PM	#20
blu808 Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Campbell, Ca Age: 38 Posts: 5,010 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	Yea that is a Toyota engine Ken. Anyways. It is actually a really simple solution. __________________

01-21-2009, 09:32 PM	#21
Monooxide Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Farmington/Flint, MI Age: 33 Posts: 675 Trader Rating: (8) Feedback Score: 8 reviews	The real solution to this is to run an external vacuum pump like NASCAR. .

01-21-2009, 09:59 PM	#23
slider2828 Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 5,824 Trader Rating: (13) Feedback Score: 13 reviews	I ahve a read a couple of different sites like 3000GT, 300zx, and SRT's and they all suggest the turbo is a good source of vacuum too.... and this increases overall vacuum from the valve cover and ultimately crankcase.... But remember the exhaust system is vacuum as welll.... __________________ Turn and Burn!

01-21-2009, 10:10 PM	#27
slider2828 Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 5,824 Trader Rating: (13) Feedback Score: 13 reviews	Thanks Steve... But that T is shit if you get some blowby... so monday ima get one more thing welded and the setup complete.... WIll take pics of course... __________________ Turn and Burn!

01-21-2009, 11:18 PM	#29
blu808 Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Campbell, Ca Age: 38 Posts: 5,010 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	3 mile long road course. s14db. You have a valid point. but his shit was really filling up every 3-4 laps. If he was sucking oil into his intake manifold through his pvc, then we would do a catch can and more work there. We are simply helping out the stock system without having to use a vac pump. Luke __________________

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