sr20det engine rattle/noise identification - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

s14kozenki · 08-17-2009, 06:05 PM

*** UPDATE AT BOTTOM OF POST ***

Hey just installed my s13 sr20 and upon startup there is a ratting/clanking noise coming from the engine. Guy before me said engine ran fine, perhaps it just has to let oil flow for a while? (engine was drained before shipment).

Also : I installed rocker arm stoppers, could those have any affect on engine noise?

youtube link: YouTube - MVI 0174

One other question: apparently my throttle body cable isn't long enough, because when hooked up the throttle is opened ever so slightly, and will not shut. yes i have adjusted it as far as the two nuts can go, but it is still like permanently open. Any way to remedy this situation? I have a s14 with an s13 sr20 in it btw.

thanks for the help all.
kevin

**** UPDATE ON NOISE ****

The problem was this: piston #1 was completely FUBAR. After bleeding lifters (keeping shims in order) the sound persisted. Took car to shop, they listened to head with stethoscope, dialed it in on cylinder #1. They took off head, looked for less than .4 seconds and were like ...wtf. We were able to bevel the piston while it was inside the block at tdc, as in you can push the piston up and down on the sides. Dont exactly know what the noise was but after replacing pistons and rings and putting it all back together noise went away and pulled good compression & ran excellent. Mechanic said might have melted the piston at the top and when the momentum of engine was rotating it yanked it loose or something like that. Don't know, but lesson learned: rotate/check engine before paying $$$.

s14kozenki · 08-18-2009, 06:33 PM

Come on guys I know someone here knows what's up. I just took off the rocker arm stoppers and made sure all the cam bolts were torqued down in sequence and to the exact fsm specifications... any ideas? The sound did get quieter after, but is still pretty noticeable.

kevin

Sileighty_85 · 08-18-2009, 07:03 PM

either low/no oil pressure or lifters have air in them, bleed the air out. directions are in the FSM

Verify your oil pump works

for the TB cable you need to make an extension for the bracket to move it closer to the pully

Homer_Simpson · 08-18-2009, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sileighty_85

either low/no oil pressure or lifters have air in them, bleed the air out. directions are in the FSM

Verify your oil pump works

for the TB cable you need to make an extension for the bracket to move it closer to the pully

^^^Did you ever lay the engine on its side before the swap?

stealthsr20 · 08-18-2009, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Homer_Simpson

^^^Did you ever lay the engine on its side before the swap?

Shit!!! what will this do, i did this for a couple of days while storing my new motor.

Homer_Simpson · 08-18-2009, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stealthsr20

Shit!!! what will this do, i did this for a couple of days while storing my new motor.

The oil in your lifters leaked out. You will now have to bleed those lifters to get rid of the noise.

s14kozenki · 08-18-2009, 09:18 PM

engine was definately not on its side... looking up on bleeding the lifters, anyone else have any insight on this? or perhaps a confirmation of the problem?
thanks for the help!

LeeS13 · 08-19-2009, 12:24 AM

check the timing chain.. sometimes the chain gets stretched due to wear, also check the chain tensioner, correct me someone if i am wrong but i was told from frsport that the newer chain tensioners extend a bit further?.. but if its the lifters bleed them by taking them out and submerge them completely in oil and take a small tool "allen , or a pick " and compress then " up and down" till there are no more bubbles

s14kozenki · 08-19-2009, 02:23 AM

I have been looking around for a write-up or guide for taking out the lifters but to no avail... I know the procedure in text, but does anyone know of a link or a place that has a picture guide perhaps? I love visuals. and thanks again for the info.
kevin

LeeS13 · 08-19-2009, 03:42 PM

hey kevin i found a link .. Technical Articles: How To: Build a 9000rpm SR20DET Head
i hope this helps you out.. its an easy process to remove the lifters if you would like pm me yout phone number and i can walk you through it step by step.
good luck ..
lee

teamsprock · 08-19-2009, 04:07 PM

Removing the lifters is very easy. I'll give you some simple tips and if you need help PM me I'd be more than happy to help. This will definitely cause the sound you are hearing and is why you don't want to lay an SR on its side or upside down. But you should also always bleed the HLA's if its sat for a while too as they need to be fully bled for proper operation.

First remove valve cover.
Remove CAS.
Then zip tie timing chain unless you are familiar with cam timing on SR's. Also make sure its a TDC when doing this.
Remove tensioner.
Remove cam caps following FSM sequence for the bolts so you don't break the cam. If your new to this stuff do one cam at a time and leave the other until you put this one back in place.
Lift cam but you don't have to remove it all the way out of the engine.
Remove rockers, make sure you keep everything in order and put it back where it came from.
Pull out HLA's and get a cup/glass/jar of clean oil.
Bleed HLA's using allen wrench, paper clip whatever.
Reinstall HLA's, then rocker arms, then cam/cam caps.
Do next cam.
Install tensioner at TDC and rotate 2 full turns. Make sure tensioner pops out and cams return to the correct position for TDC.
Reinstall CAS
Put on valve cover and start up your quieter engine!

s14kozenki · 08-20-2009, 01:50 AM

thanks for the awesome info guys. Will be taking pictures as I go along to hopefully clarify the procedure for those after me. assuming I do it right, of course...
will keep you updated!
kevin

robfx · 08-20-2009, 01:18 PM

Where is the noise coming from? Top or bottom?

I bought a SR20DET redtop swap from a sponsor on here, and upon start up it had a rod knock.

Using an engine hanger I was able to drop the oil pan and remove the rod bearings and inspect.

Sure enough the bearings were worn. Luckily the bearings didn't spin.

Put in new bearings and presto! No more rod knock.

s14kozenki · 08-20-2009, 01:36 PM

The noise seems to be coming from the valvetrain / upper head area. I have heard severe rod knock before and this sounds nothing like it (to me).

One more quick question - do I need to reshim when I reinstall the rocker arms and such? or just keep everything in order when taking out and put it back in the same way?
kevin

BTW: throttle body problem solved, just made a bracket for it to work. Can do this for others too if you really need. Perhaps all s14's with s13 sr20's need a bracket here?

Sileighty_85 · 08-20-2009, 04:09 PM

its not rod knock

KEEP ALL SHIM IN ORDER FOR EACH VALVE.

s14kozenki · 08-24-2009, 01:19 AM

thanks for all of the help everyone. i successfully bled the lifters and it was really a simple task when you get right down to it. just take you time, alot of time, and dont lose any washers/rocker guides inside your engine.
The noise is now considerably lower, almost inaudible when inside the car. I was hoping it would go away with letting the car idle.. but now I realized that the car is overheating at idle (with a new water pump + thermostat..?) .. so on to troubleshooting the next problem...

240sxracer15 · 08-19-2014, 10:36 AM

Let me start off by apologizing for bumping an old thread. I have this same noise, just doesn't sound as bad as this video. Is the sound anything serious or if I'm okay with it for a while can I just leave it? Should I let the car warm up before driving or is it good?

voiddweller · 10-13-2014, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 240sxracer15

Let me start off by apologizing for bumping an old thread. I have this same noise, just doesn't sound as bad as this video. Is the sound anything serious or if I'm okay with it for a while can I just leave it? Should I let the car warm up before driving or is it good?

Sounds like the lifters. Nothing serious. I have the same thing when I run Royal Purple 5w-30.

If you rev the engine slightly a few times, does it go away? If so, it's not serious. Try a different oil. After switching to Mobile 1 5w-30, the sound went away.

I've been told that adding Zinc to the oil will fix it.

If the noise doesn't go away, you'll need to take off the valve cover and prime the lifters to get the air out.

Again, it's not serious and you won't do damage unless you are really revving the engine. Personally, it annoyed the crap out of me and I was ready to take off the valve cover if switching oil didn't fix the problem.

There's a small chance it might be the timing chain guide, which can be removed without harm to the motor.

Good luck!

08-18-2009, 07:03 PM	#3
Sileighty_85 Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Misawa, Japan Posts: 6,815 Trader Rating: (8) Feedback Score: 8 reviews	either low/no oil pressure or lifters have air in them, bleed the air out. directions are in the FSM Verify your oil pump works for the TB cable you need to make an extension for the bracket to move it closer to the pully __________________ 後輪駆動車１番 1989 Built SR GT2871R -363whp 1998 S14 W/RB25- 250ish (For Now) 1986 SR86 - 200ish 1990 R32 GTR - 320hp Don't Buy Engines from JDM-Online http://zilvia.net/f/businesses/207457-jdm-online.html Don't Buy XS-Power or SSAC Shit

08-19-2009, 02:23 AM	#9
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	more more I have been looking around for a write-up or guide for taking out the lifters but to no avail... I know the procedure in text, but does anyone know of a link or a place that has a picture guide perhaps? I love visuals. and thanks again for the info. kevin

08-20-2009, 01:36 PM	#14
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	The noise seems to be coming from the valvetrain / upper head area. I have heard severe rod knock before and this sounds nothing like it (to me). One more quick question - do I need to reshim when I reinstall the rocker arms and such? or just keep everything in order when taking out and put it back in the same way? kevin BTW: throttle body problem solved, just made a bracket for it to work. Can do this for others too if you really need. Perhaps all s14's with s13 sr20's need a bracket here? Last edited by s14kozenki; 08-20-2009 at 01:59 PM..

08-20-2009, 04:09 PM	#15
Sileighty_85 Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Misawa, Japan Posts: 6,815 Trader Rating: (8) Feedback Score: 8 reviews	its not rod knock KEEP ALL SHIM IN ORDER FOR EACH VALVE. __________________ 後輪駆動車１番 1989 Built SR GT2871R -363whp 1998 S14 W/RB25- 250ish (For Now) 1986 SR86 - 200ish 1990 R32 GTR - 320hp Don't Buy Engines from JDM-Online http://zilvia.net/f/businesses/207457-jdm-online.html Don't Buy XS-Power or SSAC Shit

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08-17-2009, 06:05 PM	#1
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	sr20det engine rattle/noise identification * UPDATE AT BOTTOM OF POST * Hey just installed my s13 sr20 and upon startup there is a ratting/clanking noise coming from the engine. Guy before me said engine ran fine, perhaps it just has to let oil flow for a while? (engine was drained before shipment). Also : I installed rocker arm stoppers, could those have any affect on engine noise? youtube link: YouTube - MVI 0174 One other question: apparently my throttle body cable isn't long enough, because when hooked up the throttle is opened ever so slightly, and will not shut. yes i have adjusted it as far as the two nuts can go, but it is still like permanently open. Any way to remedy this situation? I have a s14 with an s13 sr20 in it btw. thanks for the help all. kevin ** UPDATE ON NOISE ** The problem was this: piston #1 was completely FUBAR. After bleeding lifters (keeping shims in order) the sound persisted. Took car to shop, they listened to head with stethoscope, dialed it in on cylinder #1. They took off head, looked for less than .4 seconds and were like ...wtf. We were able to bevel the piston while it was inside the block at tdc, as in you can push the piston up and down on the sides. Dont exactly know what the noise was but after replacing pistons and rings and putting it all back together noise went away and pulled good compression & ran excellent. Mechanic said might have melted the piston at the top and when the momentum of engine was rotating it yanked it loose or something like that. Don't know, but lesson learned: rotate/check engine before paying $$$. Last edited by s14kozenki; 11-03-2014 at 04:43 PM.. Reason: reason found 6 years ago -__-

08-18-2009, 06:33 PM	#2
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	Come on guys I know someone here knows what's up. I just took off the rocker arm stoppers and made sure all the cam bolts were torqued down in sequence and to the exact fsm specifications... any ideas? The sound did get quieter after, but is still pretty noticeable. kevin

08-18-2009, 09:18 PM	#7
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	engine was definately not on its side... looking up on bleeding the lifters, anyone else have any insight on this? or perhaps a confirmation of the problem? thanks for the help!

08-19-2009, 12:24 AM	#8
LeeS13 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: NW Age: 35 Posts: 18 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	check the timing chain.. sometimes the chain gets stretched due to wear, also check the chain tensioner, correct me someone if i am wrong but i was told from frsport that the newer chain tensioners extend a bit further?.. but if its the lifters bleed them by taking them out and submerge them completely in oil and take a small tool "allen , or a pick " and compress then " up and down" till there are no more bubbles

08-19-2009, 03:42 PM	#10
LeeS13 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: NW Age: 35 Posts: 18 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	hey kevin i found a link .. Technical Articles: How To: Build a 9000rpm SR20DET Head i hope this helps you out.. its an easy process to remove the lifters if you would like pm me yout phone number and i can walk you through it step by step. good luck .. lee

08-19-2009, 04:07 PM	#11
teamsprock Zilvia Addict Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Billings Age: 38 Posts: 636 Trader Rating: (8) Feedback Score: 8 reviews	Removing the lifters is very easy. I'll give you some simple tips and if you need help PM me I'd be more than happy to help. This will definitely cause the sound you are hearing and is why you don't want to lay an SR on its side or upside down. But you should also always bleed the HLA's if its sat for a while too as they need to be fully bled for proper operation. First remove valve cover. Remove CAS. Then zip tie timing chain unless you are familiar with cam timing on SR's. Also make sure its a TDC when doing this. Remove tensioner. Remove cam caps following FSM sequence for the bolts so you don't break the cam. If your new to this stuff do one cam at a time and leave the other until you put this one back in place. Lift cam but you don't have to remove it all the way out of the engine. Remove rockers, make sure you keep everything in order and put it back where it came from. Pull out HLA's and get a cup/glass/jar of clean oil. Bleed HLA's using allen wrench, paper clip whatever. Reinstall HLA's, then rocker arms, then cam/cam caps. Do next cam. Install tensioner at TDC and rotate 2 full turns. Make sure tensioner pops out and cams return to the correct position for TDC. Reinstall CAS Put on valve cover and start up your quieter engine!

08-20-2009, 01:50 AM	#12
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	thanks for the awesome info guys. Will be taking pictures as I go along to hopefully clarify the procedure for those after me. assuming I do it right, of course... will keep you updated! kevin

08-20-2009, 01:18 PM	#13
robfx Join Date: May 2008 Location: FL Posts: 46 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Where is the noise coming from? Top or bottom? I bought a SR20DET redtop swap from a sponsor on here, and upon start up it had a rod knock. Using an engine hanger I was able to drop the oil pan and remove the rod bearings and inspect. Sure enough the bearings were worn. Luckily the bearings didn't spin. Put in new bearings and presto! No more rod knock.

08-24-2009, 01:19 AM	#16
s14kozenki Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SOCAL Posts: 496 Trader Rating: (26) Feedback Score: 26 reviews	thanks for all of the help everyone. i successfully bled the lifters and it was really a simple task when you get right down to it. just take you time, alot of time, and dont lose any washers/rocker guides inside your engine. The noise is now considerably lower, almost inaudible when inside the car. I was hoping it would go away with letting the car idle.. but now I realized that the car is overheating at idle (with a new water pump + thermostat..?) .. so on to troubleshooting the next problem...

08-19-2014, 10:36 AM	#17
240sxracer15 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma Age: 35 Posts: 49 Trader Rating: (2) Feedback Score: 2 reviews	Let me start off by apologizing for bumping an old thread. I have this same noise, just doesn't sound as bad as this video. Is the sound anything serious or if I'm okay with it for a while can I just leave it? Should I let the car warm up before driving or is it good?