joe645733

hey what's going on.

recently purchased a 1jz sc300 which is putting out 560whp.

i'm putting out roughly 26psi on WOT and i have a vacuum of...i want to say -20 inches at idle?

the HKS BOV never goes off and i am getting some surge on my brand new borg warner S363 turbo. reason i replaced the turbo was because of an oil leak from inside of the turbo. currently rebuilding the turbo. i believe this particular BOV is not adjustable, but is it possible the internals can just be seized/locked up?

anyways, because it's a brand new turbo, i'd like to address the issue to extend the longevity of this fresh turbo.

thanks, guys/gals

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E85 1j SC300

KAT-PWR

...Do you have it connected properly?

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MRP Manufacturing

fatduece

Thats not surge.

Frank_Jaeger

The flutter you're hearing is good for you and your turbo. BOVs are for making noise only.

derass

Is it real? There are a lot of fake ones out there, one of which came on a car I bought. It was crap, didn't work either. I changed it for a TiAL.

joe645733

appreciate the responses.

I bought the car as is, for the most part. As far as I can see, the hoses are hooked up accordingly. The car was tuned by megasquirt, from someone named, Jordan, who seems to be a reputable tuner. I'm assuming he would have looked or noticed something like that, but I understand people make mistakes.
Is it possible that a BOV can just be bad?

I know 100% the sound of an HKS BOV, as it makes that "chirp" sound, which personally I'm not a fan of, but aside from that, I haven't heard it once out of the month that I've owned the car. I know for a fact the sound I hear after full throttle is from the turbo. It's pretty noticeable.
I'll be goofy via text, but the turbo makes a pretty harsh "BEW BEW" noise after heavy acceleration, haha

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E85 1j SC300

joe645733

Just wish it were something where I can check with a multimeter or something. Which is why I'm asking you guys: is it possible that a BOV can just be bad? Cuz I can just replace it, as it's pretty cheap. Just wanted to confirm some opinions from others.

Thanks

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E85 1j SC300

jr_ss

I'm assuming it's an SSQV? You haven't really given any details other than it being an HKS BOV and it makes a chirp.

If it's an SSQV, it needs to see pressure change to function properly. Hook up the vac hose as close to the throttle body as possible.

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My SR20VET

joe645733

You know what, I figured BOVs were completely useless

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E85 1j SC300

Kingtal0n

they arn't he was trolling you. Dont believe anything anyone says on this site unless you have done your own research.

While that horrible noise you hear is happening, the shaft is being slamming into the CHRA as the wheel tries to rip free of it's housing. The tiny clearances set by the turbo manufacturer are taken up by that sight movement (that gradually becomes more and more as you keep doing this) and bit and pieces of your wheels will start to contact the housing and turn to dust, the edges of your wheel will start to look like shredded cheese. Even with no contact, the force of air molecules is enough to damage the tips of the wheel, as they get an 'ultra sonic cleaning' (high pressure fast moving air molecules squeezing between tight space in the reverse direction they are intended to flow will gradually weaken/bend/disintegrate the tips of the compressor wheel)

You need a properly functioning bypass valve if you expect the turbo to live a long life.

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5.3/4l80e/turbo 240sx playthrough:
https://tinyurl.com/turbo240

KAT-PWR

"But drifters in japan where oem turbos are close to free don't run bov's"
....Think about it
Save the turbos.
No BOV will put your turbo in a box like houdini.

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MRP Manufacturing

bansheeracer2003

^This is Correct
OK this might sound weird but it worked for me
Try sparying some wd40 in the bov and the line that goes into it
and if it starts working a little bit then your valve is probably bad
it loosed mine up and made it work but i was never perfect.

spools420a

take it apart and see if diaphragm tore or if vacuum line is broke going into bov

joe645733

Yeah, dude, I was just playing around, hah.

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E85 1j SC300

joe645733

Thanks for the responses, everyone, minus the tool, Frank.

This isn't my first turbo car, but I never did put in research with what I'm dealing with. The car is new to me and was mainly just wondering if a BOV can just simply break, internally.

But again, thanks and look into it later today

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E85 1j SC300

joe645733

Thanks for explaining

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E85 1j SC300

Croustibat

I'd say 90% second hand HKS SSQV bovs are fake, so chances are, yours too.

Even then, they are mechanical items so they can wear.

joe645733

Okay so I took that part of the intercooler piping apart with the BOV flanged.

As far as seeing if it's fake, it does say HKS imprinted on the top of it, the back has an engraving, and the front where if pushes in and out says sequential blow off valve. Now, I don't know how indepth knockoffs get to making their fake products look new, but it seems legit? The flange also had a serial/part number on it.
So first thing I did was put negative pressure to where the hose hooks up, and no air passed through, which id imagine is good.

Then in the front, I pushed the disc, (or whatever it's called), in, and I did feel like it was stuck. So I pushed it in and out to exercise it a bit.
Took apart all the little nuts/bolts, which then revealed the diaphram and spring. No tears on it. Cleaned it up a bit and threw some WD40 in the front of the valve, where I found it stuck.

Assembled everything back together and under boost I'm still not hearing it...the BOV is mounted roughly 2ft from the throttle body.

Still possible it can just be bad? I'm not sure if there's more parts to pay attention to in the valve?

Side note- at idle I'm at -30" and under boost I'm at 27psi.

Car is an e85 tune and running a fresh new turbo.
About you guys saying I'm affecting the longevity of the turbo, (which I'm aware of), what length in time are we talking about with premature failure?

We talking within say, a matter of week(s) I can ruin the turbo?

Thanks!

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E85 1j SC300

joe645733

How the hose diagram goes:
Out of the manifold, there a hose that splits to a T. One of the hoses goes directly to the external wastegate and the other goes right to the BOV. I've verified there's no leaks

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E85 1j SC300

Kingtal0n

okay. first of all the HKS bypass barely qualifies as a bypass. By this I mean it barely gets the job done in small horsepower applications i.e. 300 horsepower and less. For anything 400+ you want a real bypass, a fancy tial or an HKS race or something.

Second of all, no bypass is going to work great on the cold side (near the throttle body). Think about the mass of air in the intercooler that needs to evacuate before any kind of pressure drop can be detected in the hot-pipe, by which time it is too late. Your effort trying to run the tiny HKS bypass on the wrong side is futile. It will never give your turbo the relief it needs under all situations.

Many turbo manufacturers are now integrating a bypass on the compressor itself- the proper location. They need to be as close to the compressor as possible.

Here is an example from my car

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5.3/4l80e/turbo 240sx playthrough:
https://tinyurl.com/turbo240

joe645733

bought the car as is. but thanks for your help.

and it sucks there's so much different advise out there. for example, most posts i see say the BOV needs to be close to the throttle body.

so you're saying i should have the BOV as close to the compressor, in that case, close to the external wastegate? i'm surprised the MegaSquirt shop didn't know this.

and i am currently in the 570whp region
it's weird - a lot of the people with my platform seem to have them WELDED to the throttle body, hah

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E85 1j SC300

R3b

Its all a matter of preference where the bov sits. Im not a jdm tuning god but it shouldn't really matter which pipe your bov is on.

Another thing is how did you get a hold of the 560 something hp car?? There is no way thats some craiglist find and you shelled out 10k plus unless you have loads saved up.

I got my hatch with a ka-t and the previous owner used cheapish parts mainly a china charger turbo, going to replace that soon with this new PT I have laying around and this knockoff hks. For me mine stays open at idle but it doesnt affect me much since im on a blow through setup, and the other thing was when I got on it I never herd the typical PSHHHH sound when you rev on idle which for some reason some engines can or cant make unless your two stepping, never understood that about bov's and I never really got the sound when I was in actual boost. So I ended up taking it apart and it ended up having a stick between the diaphragm.

If it wasn't for my blow through setup the car would have had a massive leak. The next thing is I put it back together cleaned it up and it was finally working, still open idle. So I took it apart again and put a washer to push to spring and diaphragm more forward I think my vac is -25 to -27. Still open on idle... took it apart again and stretched it a bit. Still open on idle, I just said fuck it and left it. Now when im driving normal I hear the very typical pshhhh noise but very long and obnoxious but when I get on it then I get the normal flutter noise from the bov. Ironically im only running around 5psi of boost since im babying the motor till a rebuild so I dont think I could have surge on such low boost.

Thats my experience with hks knockoff bov. They arent really bad but for you since your in high HP range i'd get the race version or get a tail with another spring. If you get the chance to get on a dyno ask a buddy to look at your bov or turbo. Maybe the flutter noise you are hearing is the bov which opens and closes really fast getting the TUtutu sound and not the long PSHHH.

joe645733

money, i guess, hah.

and disregard all of this...i'm facing another issue.

i found a 2nd BOV in the intercooler piping circuit...it's a tial BOV that i found burried in the engine bay.

my apologies; again, this is a new car i bought from someone who wasn't sure what was done to the car, himself. he bought the car as-is, as well.

i'll take the tial BOV apart tomorrow and see what's going on.

what a twist to this awesome story

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E85 1j SC300

jr_ss

No, it's not. Your means of reading this is wrong. Fix your gauge or buy a quality one. 22-23" is the highest you should see on a healthy motor at idle.

As stated above, it's not possible. Please check, fix and/or replace your gauge or means of reading that data point.

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My SR20VET

R3b

I dont drive the car everyday but my vac is pretty high, maybe I over exaggerated a bit but its at least 20-25. Motor isnt really the healthiest so thats why im babying till I go nuts with a rebuild. One day is just randomly started missing and checked my full rail and 1st and 2nd injector just would open up. Replaced them and car is running amazing, had other issues with idle and afrs but was small stuff because the last owner didnt know what he was doing. Compression is 140-155-160-150, the first cylinder is a bit concerning but recently. Luckily I dont drive it much, maybe only 250 miles so a tank and a bit since im on corn. Maybe the rings are finished from the first injector not spraying nicely and leaning out. When I got the car I herd a small tiny little miss but got better after redoing the idle and timing.

R3b

Where exactly was it, kinda strange for it to have two? Exspecially since the hks seems to be a knockoff?

Does the tial have any hoses to it? Tials work a bit differently but there easy to take apart, maybe you could get a flange plate for the hks and just run the tial, it should hold up fine with a new spring.

Frank_Jaeger

There's your problem. You have two BOVs when you should have none.

Kingtal0n

Whatever you wind up doing, pressure the system when its done to 15 or 20psi. The engine from Throttle body to compressor wheel should hold that pressure for a few moments.

joe645733

Yeah but what if I bought a third

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E85 1j SC300

Croustibat

27psi without a bov may be a bit too much, 10-15 is kind of ok.
You won't ruin your turbo in a matter of weeks bacause of a lack of blow off valve. It may take some days/ weeks off its life, but if it is not a chinabay special, its life can be counted in years.

Free information dictated by "common sense" and posted on zilvia ... What could go wrong really ? Don't hold your breath too much. You need to realize businesses rely on their information being correct AND no common knowledge to work. They don't give that information away, because they may as well close their business. Meaning your only source of information is the people who actually aren't in the know, so take free informations with a pinch of salt. I doubt anyone answering the BOV position can of worm is actually working in R&D in that domain.

Anyway the megasquirt shop as you call it makes tunes. They don't need to know where to place a BOV, or if it matters.