Do Japanese Cars Suck? - Page 3 - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

S14kouki805 · 03-28-2017, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dizzariot

Just apply USDM S-Chassis logic to the FRS:

1.) Buy it stock
2.) Say the lack of power doesn't bother you
3.) Cave and finally SR swap it (in this case turbo kit, GReddy is CARB legal)

The same logic applies. I'm honestly disheartened that I sold mine. It would've been awesome by now. I'm in fucking Japan and That car is still on my shortlist of cars to own.

It was said before that the FRS is the next 240, I makes perfect sense considering an S14 was priced at the price point of the FRS l, adjusted for inflation.

dizzariot · 03-29-2017, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S14kouki805

It was said before that the FRS is the next 240, I makes perfect sense considering an S14 was priced at the price point of the FRS l, adjusted for inflation.

This is common knowledge to me. That's my point: people always compare the ZN6 to turbo'd cars.

If you and I get it I don't know why everyone is still bitching.

zenkicpe · 03-29-2017, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malik

its all good bro, its just the internet

You two guys give me hope

*2_Liter_Turbo* · 03-29-2017, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e1_griego

I think a header and tune fixes up about 75% of the complaints.

The community isn't great, but there are enough people who are building semi-serious track/autox cars that there are some decent parts getting developed and ok knowledge sharing.

Mine rattles a bit but that's after I've added poly inserts everywhere and stiffer motor mounts.

Most people are playing playskool my first sports car with their zn6 so there's tons of cringe and doing it wrong.

As far as the rest of the article, it's spot on.

All I see down here in AZ are hoards of those "playing playskool my first sports car" kids, it sucks. Luckily, with literally millions of people in the area, there are enough actual knowledgeable car guys in the area that I'm not alone, ha ha. I've found that the local R32 and G20 groups are the most down to earth crowd when it comes to single chassis ownership. A handful of good S Chassis dudes, but the rest are the typical kids. There's like 2 or 3 good ZN6 dudes, ha ha.

*e1_griego* · 03-29-2017, 08:29 AM

That's every <25 'car guy' right now, though. The people buying r32s and g20s are old.

There is a good group of 86 guys around here who do track days, etc., but it's <5% of the owners. Tons and tons of them at autocross nationally (also not <25 kids) so that helps.

Really it's a matter of being into a specific car or marque vs. being into cars generally. Not a lot of 'car guys' left, period.

But why would there be? As we've determined, all the new japanese cars suck, and the old stuff is either all ruined (s13s, older civics) or way too expensive to get into (FD, mkIV supra, etc).

*2_Liter_Turbo* · 03-29-2017, 08:41 AM

Very true. Although a good number of the G20 guys are mid 20's, but they all hang out with older dudes like myself, so they learn, ha ha. The G20 guys are the ones who go karting too, which is funny.

Dolph_KYAS13 · 03-29-2017, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilya

Do you think it was a fear tactic that drove the mass population to buy shitty safe cars?
- law that requites all cars to have airbags(you are likely to die from an airbag or from the firefighters not being able to cut you out of a car in time due to one of the airbags not going off)

- law that requires all cars to have abs (because every American drives on ice and wet roads every day and they need to be able to stop on ice from 70mph -0mph safely....here is an idea, don't drive like an idiot in hazardous conditions)

- law that requires all cars to have vehicle stability control (it's not a matter of if, but when the Toyota Corolla will lose control, you need computers to keep you safe)

- law that requires trunks to have release hinges (because every person at least once in their life will be abducted via trunk)

I don't know how a s13 got away with no airbags, no abs, no stability control, no lsd...

lets not forget mandated reverse cameras. because people need a tv to reverse these days....

FormulaDz92 · 03-29-2017, 09:55 AM

A quick summary of this thread so far;

Japanese Cars Suck -> No they don't -> Yes they do american cars are better -> All new cars suck -> Electric Cars Suck -> Self-driving Electric cars suck even more -> Electric self-drivers will take over the world -> The ZN6 isn't that bad though. Haha what a funny thread to browse.

*e1_griego* · 03-29-2017, 10:28 AM

Hi, welcome to forums.

FormulaDz92 · 03-29-2017, 11:14 AM

Hello.

I just wanted to add that while boring electric cars will likely take over the world, boring cars are already everywhere and have been for a while. Self drivers will cause the real problem because they will eventually lead to government mandated zones where you will not be allowed to have control of your own car for 'safety reasons'. This will lead to self-drivers being the only available option with non-self-drivers being too much to insure and that will be the end of nearly all car culture. Motorcycle culture will be one of the last to go. I give this all about 40 years to go down.

JrDarknes · 03-29-2017, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dizzariot

I went with the turbo metaphor because the complaint always seems to revolve around forced induction.

The majority of dudes bitching about the ZN6 wouldn't be happy with 240WHP. Everything is excess nowadays.

There are so many idiots here buying GTRs, Supras, and Chasers. The first two are normally the only two Japanese cars these guys have ever heard of. The last one is the 'new cool thing' on base. Plenty of people are touching 800HP+ but when asked why they always say "just to have it." Excess. Same shit with the ZN6. How many horses can you really use before you're eating shit or getting multiple tickets.

+1, I Agree.

Its funny, people want more horsepower for it but I see plenty of people my age wrecking the shit with the 200 it comes with.

Highway Riding · 03-29-2017, 12:09 PM

I have to say the new generation of Japanese cars should impress. We have boosted Nissans, Infinities, Honda's and Subbies etc.. What is not to like? Once these cars drop in price over the years the tuning market will just grow!

Malik · 03-29-2017, 01:55 PM

here's a nice infiniti... just an example of a modern car done right.

its all about how creative and passionate you are.

*2_Liter_Turbo* · 03-29-2017, 02:06 PM

I had a G35 Coupe 6MT Sport. While it looked good, I sold it within a year, because it didn't excite me enough to keep making payments on it. It was heavy, it didn't handle like how I would've liked, and if you put test pipes on them, they sound like dog shit.

*e1_griego* · 03-29-2017, 02:27 PM

Every car being discussed and reminisced about here was an involved driving experience. A stancy g35 has nothing to do with that.

Malik · 03-29-2017, 02:48 PM

I give up on this thread.

*e1_griego* · 03-29-2017, 02:59 PM

The original post is from Mike Kojima and posted on motoiq....

Ilya · 03-29-2017, 03:48 PM

Do Japanese car manufacturers go to the same guy to get their oem wheel design? Because I cannot believe that multiple companies can make such ugly wheels.

ixfxi · 03-29-2017, 04:12 PM

I dont understand the reason for the article, let alone the purpose of this thread.

I have nothing against Mike Kojima, but after reading that article he's sound like an old cry baby thats bitching about the past. I'm not as old as Mike (but close enough), and I love a lot of the older cars he mentioned in his article. But whats the fucking point? Are we supposed to praise the tin-can-cars of yesterday? Are manufacturers supposed to stick to a formula of cheap-and-good... forever? Car manufacturers progress and they need to cater to the masses. Meanwhile, they need to comply with the shit ton of newly proposed regulations.

So kiss your 2000lb Sentra SE-R out the fucking window, because our government isnt having it.

The new Miata and the 86 are the closest thing to cheap and good thats being offered, and guess what... they're not profiting hand over fist over it. They sell a few thousand and life goes on.

*e1_griego* · 03-29-2017, 04:51 PM

But nostalgia is fun!

There's a guy on seattle CL asking $8k for a b13 SE-R right now lol.

Malik · 03-29-2017, 04:59 PM

this thread does sound like a giant whining rant.

Ilya · 03-29-2017, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malik

this thread does sound like a giant whining rant.

'Tiss true that car manufacturers listen to the public opinion as much as the US government does to the presidential votes.

collegekid · 03-30-2017, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spooled240

By that time, AI would not only control cars, but the majority of human life. Skynet would then begin to be self aware begin to control these cars eliminate people against their own self interests.

[Begin sarcasm]
Hey man, we humans need to stop doing all the menial shit and focus on more beneficial and creative work. Once robots start doing all the hard work, then we will get a nice universal income that will totally pay MORE than what we get now, since my my special snowflake life is worth so much to the government.

We also shouldn't ever have opinions that are contrary to what the government tells us to think, you wouldn't want to be like those tinfoil hat wearing psychos who are always wrong and don't know what they're talking about.

[End sarcasm]

RalliartRsX · 03-30-2017, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ixfxi

The new Miata and the 86 are the closest thing to cheap and good thats being offered, and guess what... they're not profiting hand over fist over it. They sell a few thousand and life goes on.

The Miata sold it's 1,000,000th Miata April 22nd 2016. Yeah, not making a profit, but damn! Best selling roadster of all time by far

spooled240 · 03-30-2017, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dizzariot

I went with the turbo metaphor because the complaint always seems to revolve around forced induction.

I was on the verge of headers/OFT when I ultimately decided to pull the plug and start out.

The majority of dudes bitching about the ZN6 wouldn't be happy with 240WHP. Everything is excess nowadays.

There are so many idiots here buying GTRs, Supras, and Chasers. The first two are normally the only two Japanese cars these guys have ever heard of. The last one is the 'new cool thing' on base. Plenty of people are touching 800HP+ but when asked why they always say "just to have it." Excess. Same shit with the ZN6. How many horses can you really use before you're eating shit or getting multiple tickets.

Ehh, I don't think it's so much how much horsepower the car would have, but more so the fact that it would have had forced induction stock. Hell, it could have had 20 more horsepower but with a quick spooling turbo that gave it 200 ft lbs of torque and the car would have been that much more exciting and marketable. There's nothing wrong with having a n/a base model zn6, but I think they could have made the car more appealing if they had offered a version with more hp/tq...especially since subaru already has blueprints of turbo boxers from their wrx/sti lineup. Most people that buy turbo cars just leave it stock and if they do mod it, they just do bolt ons and turbo charms like BOV's and turbo timers. They just like the fact that it's turbo even if it's just a bit faster than stock.

LockOn! · 03-30-2017, 11:20 AM

^^^

The thing is, throwing a bunch of bolt-ons on a factory NA car nets you basically fuck all in terms of power. Sure you can increase response and change the curve a bit, but really all you end up doing is making the thing louder.

Toss the same basic bolt-ons on a factory turbo car and you'll actually see measurable gains.

Even if the ZN6 had a little more power, say 225, your ceiling with bolt ons would still be only like 15ish hp higher if we're being realistic.

I'd much rather have a factory turbo pushing just around 200, which I could throw some big pipes on and some sort of re-flash tune to get to mid 200's. Plus turbo noises are sweet.

IMO between 250 and 300 is the butter zone for fun and reliability seeing as you can keep the engine relatively stock given you chose a correct platform. Last few cars I tracked were:

1J Cressida ~280
HR 350z ~280
RB25 s14 ~240

~200hp is too low for NA. If I need to add FI, or crack the block/head open to make any real power, I'm just not interested. Too much work for my ass and it's more prone to catastrophic failure.

On topic now: Yes. All cars suck.

S14kouki805 · 03-30-2017, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by collegekid

[Begin sarcasm]
Hey man, we humans need to stop doing all the menial shit and focus on more beneficial and creative work. Once robots start doing all the hard work, then we will get a nice universal income that will totally pay MORE than what we get now, since my my special snowflake life is worth so much to the government.

We also shouldn't ever have opinions that are contrary to what the government tells us to think, you wouldn't want to be like those tinfoil hat wearing psychos who are always wrong and don't know what they're talking about.

[End sarcasm]

Wait did you just try to make this political?

Take that shit to Facebook where it belongs

collegekid · 03-30-2017, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S14kouki805

Wait did you just try to make this political?

Take that shit to Facebook where it belongs

First statement was in reference to autonomous anything. Second statement was a little more political but the point was more to show how people will just accept things as how they are and not do shit to change it besides whine about it(kinda like this thread)

It's not just Zilvia, many car forums/enthusiasts have just turned into "politicians" speculating topics such as
-young/new owners of a chassis vs OGs
-Millenials
-prices of anything and everything
-Carlos Ghosn

FormulaDz92 · 03-30-2017, 12:44 PM

Here's a peak of the possible future.

http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/7/148...eva-motor-show

I realize this is conceptual but I think it illustrates the direction in which the industry is going and what those industry leaders think people want or should have. The post-industrialized world will look very different is another 20 or 30 years I think.

*2_Liter_Turbo* · 03-30-2017, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FormulaDz92

Here's a peak of the possible future.

http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/7/148...eva-motor-show

I realize this is conceptual but I think it illustrates the direction in which the industry is going and what those industry leaders think people want or should have. The post-industrialized world will look very different is another 20 or 30 years I think.

No thank you! That is not a future that I'd be compatible with...

03-29-2017, 08:41 AM	#66
2_Liter_Turbo Premium Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Arizona Age: 37 Posts: 798 Trader Rating: (28) Feedback Score: 28 reviews	Very true. Although a good number of the G20 guys are mid 20's, but they all hang out with older dudes like myself, so they learn, ha ha. The G20 guys are the ones who go karting too, which is funny. __________________ 96 S14: Grip Track Car 90 R32: Bucket List Car 92 S13: Just for Fun Car Instagram: @SS.Maxey

03-29-2017, 12:09 PM	#72
Highway Riding Zilvia Addict Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Out on the Highway! Posts: 602 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	I have to say the new generation of Japanese cars should impress. We have boosted Nissans, Infinities, Honda's and Subbies etc.. What is not to like? Once these cars drop in price over the years the tuning market will just grow! __________________ The Sun Rises in the East!

03-29-2017, 02:06 PM	#74
2_Liter_Turbo Premium Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Arizona Age: 37 Posts: 798 Trader Rating: (28) Feedback Score: 28 reviews	I had a G35 Coupe 6MT Sport. While it looked good, I sold it within a year, because it didn't excite me enough to keep making payments on it. It was heavy, it didn't handle like how I would've liked, and if you put test pipes on them, they sound like dog shit. __________________ 96 S14: Grip Track Car 90 R32: Bucket List Car 92 S13: Just for Fun Car Instagram: @SS.Maxey Last edited by 2_Liter_Turbo; 03-29-2017 at 02:46 PM..

03-30-2017, 11:20 AM	#86
LockOn! Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: MAPLE BLOCC Posts: 1,070 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	^^^ The thing is, throwing a bunch of bolt-ons on a factory NA car nets you basically fuck all in terms of power. Sure you can increase response and change the curve a bit, but really all you end up doing is making the thing louder. Toss the same basic bolt-ons on a factory turbo car and you'll actually see measurable gains. Even if the ZN6 had a little more power, say 225, your ceiling with bolt ons would still be only like 15ish hp higher if we're being realistic. I'd much rather have a factory turbo pushing just around 200, which I could throw some big pipes on and some sort of re-flash tune to get to mid 200's. Plus turbo noises are sweet. IMO between 250 and 300 is the butter zone for fun and reliability seeing as you can keep the engine relatively stock given you chose a correct platform. Last few cars I tracked were: 1J Cressida ~280 HR 350z ~280 RB25 s14 ~240 ~200hp is too low for NA. If I need to add FI, or crack the block/head open to make any real power, I'm just not interested. Too much work for my ass and it's more prone to catastrophic failure. On topic now: Yes. All cars suck. __________________

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03-29-2017, 08:29 AM	#65
e1_griego Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Independence, Ore. Age: 36 Posts: 2,642 Trader Rating: (24) Feedback Score: 24 reviews	That's every <25 'car guy' right now, though. The people buying r32s and g20s are old. There is a good group of 86 guys around here who do track days, etc., but it's <5% of the owners. Tons and tons of them at autocross nationally (also not <25 kids) so that helps. Really it's a matter of being into a specific car or marque vs. being into cars generally. Not a lot of 'car guys' left, period. But why would there be? As we've determined, all the new japanese cars suck, and the old stuff is either all ruined (s13s, older civics) or way too expensive to get into (FD, mkIV supra, etc).

03-29-2017, 09:55 AM	#68
FormulaDz92 Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: New Jersey Posts: 77 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	A quick summary of this thread so far; Japanese Cars Suck -> No they don't -> Yes they do american cars are better -> All new cars suck -> Electric Cars Suck -> Self-driving Electric cars suck even more -> Electric self-drivers will take over the world -> The ZN6 isn't that bad though. Haha what a funny thread to browse.

03-29-2017, 10:28 AM	#69
e1_griego Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Independence, Ore. Age: 36 Posts: 2,642 Trader Rating: (24) Feedback Score: 24 reviews	Hi, welcome to forums.

03-29-2017, 11:14 AM	#70
FormulaDz92 Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: New Jersey Posts: 77 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hello. I just wanted to add that while boring electric cars will likely take over the world, boring cars are already everywhere and have been for a while. Self drivers will cause the real problem because they will eventually lead to government mandated zones where you will not be allowed to have control of your own car for 'safety reasons'. This will lead to self-drivers being the only available option with non-self-drivers being too much to insure and that will be the end of nearly all car culture. Motorcycle culture will be one of the last to go. I give this all about 40 years to go down.

03-29-2017, 01:55 PM	#73
Malik Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 1,796 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	here's a nice infiniti... just an example of a modern car done right. its all about how creative and passionate you are.

03-29-2017, 02:27 PM	#75
e1_griego Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Independence, Ore. Age: 36 Posts: 2,642 Trader Rating: (24) Feedback Score: 24 reviews	Every car being discussed and reminisced about here was an involved driving experience. A stancy g35 has nothing to do with that.

03-29-2017, 02:48 PM	#76
Malik Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 1,796 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I give up on this thread.

03-29-2017, 02:59 PM	#77
e1_griego Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Independence, Ore. Age: 36 Posts: 2,642 Trader Rating: (24) Feedback Score: 24 reviews	The original post is from Mike Kojima and posted on motoiq....

03-29-2017, 03:48 PM	#78
Ilya Zilvia Addict Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: San Diego Age: 31 Posts: 712 Trader Rating: (2) Feedback Score: 2 reviews	Do Japanese car manufacturers go to the same guy to get their oem wheel design? Because I cannot believe that multiple companies can make such ugly wheels.

03-29-2017, 04:12 PM	#79
ixfxi Post Whore! Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: bangin on my chest Account: BANNED #fucksupreme Age: 79 Posts: 5,923 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	I dont understand the reason for the article, let alone the purpose of this thread. I have nothing against Mike Kojima, but after reading that article he's sound like an old cry baby thats bitching about the past. I'm not as old as Mike (but close enough), and I love a lot of the older cars he mentioned in his article. But whats the fucking point? Are we supposed to praise the tin-can-cars of yesterday? Are manufacturers supposed to stick to a formula of cheap-and-good... forever? Car manufacturers progress and they need to cater to the masses. Meanwhile, they need to comply with the shit ton of newly proposed regulations. So kiss your 2000lb Sentra SE-R out the fucking window, because our government isnt having it. The new Miata and the 86 are the closest thing to cheap and good thats being offered, and guess what... they're not profiting hand over fist over it. They sell a few thousand and life goes on.

03-29-2017, 04:51 PM	#80
e1_griego Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Independence, Ore. Age: 36 Posts: 2,642 Trader Rating: (24) Feedback Score: 24 reviews	But nostalgia is fun! There's a guy on seattle CL asking $8k for a b13 SE-R right now lol.

03-29-2017, 04:59 PM	#81
Malik Nissanaholic! Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 1,796 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	this thread does sound like a giant whining rant.

03-30-2017, 12:44 PM	#89
FormulaDz92 Leaky Injector Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: New Jersey Posts: 77 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Here's a peak of the possible future. http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/7/148...eva-motor-show I realize this is conceptual but I think it illustrates the direction in which the industry is going and what those industry leaders think people want or should have. The post-industrialized world will look very different is another 20 or 30 years I think.