RB25DET or Built KA-T?

[SimpleS14]

Just want to see which one they prefer and maybe you can post to why you prefer that setup.

[s13irdie2]

id take a built ka-t. better for weight balance and will make plenty of power for what i do.

[evo6011]

i dont know my friend had an rb25 in his 91 and it made a shit ton of power even at low boost, but for the cost i dont think its worth it. you have to buy a crossmember, new wiring harness, motor mounts and have custom coilovers to support the weights. i say either built the ka or go with an sr

[FRpilot]

rb25.. if money isnt an issue.. boost the rb25 higher.. plenty of torque downlow. will make the power pretty quickly too.. rb valvetrain.. no brainer decision.

[RUTH'LESSDET]

RB25 no matter what take that truck motor out I hate Ka's im sorry :madfawk:

[Champster]

i dont know my friend had an rb25 in his 91 and it made a shit ton of power even at low boost, but for the cost i dont think its worth it. you have to buy a crossmember, new wiring harness, motor mounts and have custom coilovers to support the weights. i say either built the ka or go with an sr

The proper motor mounts from either Mckinney or JGY customs will set the motor where it needs to be. You will not be able to tell a difference between the stock motor or RB weight difference. Custom Coilovers will not be needed.

There are a few companies available that will do the wiring for you. The price range from $250 to $450.

Its a matter of preference and what you will be doing with your car. Are you conservative or money isn't a factor for you. I know a few that are running the RB motor as a daily driver and to date do not have any problems. I have a friend that has a KA-T. Its day'm fast. You can't go wrong either way IMO.

If you are looking for a low hassle, quick boost fix. Turbo your KA. You will not be disappointed. A built KA? You will take a RB to the cleaners.

[PANGES]

I have an R34 RB25 in my 89 f/b and I daily drive it and I've never had a problem with it and it runs 100 times better than my KA ever did. You dont need a new cross member... I just used Mckinney mounts/driveshaft/downpipe and everything fit just right... I'm just using Tein SS coilovers... same coilovers I've always had and I dont have any problems. I'd say an RB running the same boost as a built KA-T should make the same power/more power but in the long run an RB will cost less and is simply more reliable with alot less effort... Just my input..

[Siizzzoooo]

but for $9k!??!..lol

i dunno if i can justify the extra 3k is worth the reliability, i do agree on the aspect of not having to fool with the engine

$6k can get you a built KA w/ a nice turbo setup and run reliably w/ a good tune 350-420 reliable whp, save the $3k incase your KA go KAboom...haha

KA's go for next to nothing, so u can rack up on motors as well

[Silverbullet]

if your just looking for some fun power on the streets... there is no replacement for displacement. 6cyl >4 banger. Plus you get to say you have a motor from the Nissan flagship car: Skyline.

[Siizzzoooo]

so a 2.5 vs a 2.4...HUGE difference huh

[veilside180sx]

RB25 no matter what take that truck motor out I hate Ka's im sorry :madfawk:

Sounds like someone is having spouts with that beat him.=) hatred or jealousy...we'll never know.

[SimpleS14]

Man, I forgot I even made this thread. I decided to go with bulit KA-T, just because its "cheaper" when it comes to fixing parts and also getting new parts. Remember, four injectors are cheaper than six. Also I can get a Enthalpy tuned ecu to help out with the tuning, and I can keep the A/C for the ladies. ;)

Alot more parts and options have come out for both motors, but unless a RB swap can compare close in price to a bulit KA-T....I'm going to stick with the 2.4L inline-4.

[TheSnail]

Paying 9k for a NEO is silly. But I would go with a nice $3500 rb25 rather then a $3500 ka.

[Angel]

Paying 9k for a NEO is silly. But I would go with a nice $3500 rb25 rather then a $3500 ka.


Not that it matters anymore... but the thing I like most about the rb's and most inline 6's is the sound, they sound so much better than a 4. Also very smooth because they are very well balanced naturally.

[deep in silvia]

rb25 all the way..

i got it in mine and love it.
and nothing feels better when you drive by and your bolw off valve goes off and people say "that does not sound like a sr20"

but thats just my 2 cents

[drift freaq]

well , right now RB clips can be had for 2500-3500 add our install kit or someone elses install kit in and thats a extra 1k.To do it yourself with the extras, your not going to spend more than 5-6k . At that point you have a stock engine, that with a boost controller will put out somewhere in the area of 250-270 RWHP all day. Put a bigger turbo on with injectors and a computer and your going to get in the high 300's with the engine still being stock and completely reliable. Try that with a KAT.

[NemeGuero]

that's easily done with 6k on a KA.. to lay down 300s?

and upgrading turbo and injectors and computer on RB is going to cost even more...
5-6k+ those upgrades = way more than a built KA boosting like mad.. and it's lighter too

[Siizzzoooo]

oh snaps, the KA can do 300whp all day for under 2500...EASY

[drift freaq]

oh snaps, the KA can do 300whp all day for under 2500...EASY
you still will not have the torque or the smoothness of the RB. If you can do 300 whp all day on a KA for under $2500 I want you to document your build and prove it. I think you will wind up spending a lot more than $2500 to get 300 whp from a KA for a all day daily driver situation.
P.S. slizzzoo I do not think you can comment, till you have driven a RB powered car. There is no 4 cylinder that can compare its a whole different ballpark.

[PANGES]

well my rb is 280 crank hp i suppose so i'd say it's safe to assume around 250rwhp? on the stock turbo and stock injectors... everything is supposed to handle 14psi just fine... how much hp do u think that will gain you? I'm sure that's plently over 300rwhp

[drift freaq]

that's easily done with 6k on a KA.. to lay down 300s?

and upgrading turbo and injectors and computer on RB is going to cost even more...
5-6k+ those upgrades = way more than a built KA boosting like mad.. and it's lighter too
well let me lay it down more tightly for you. Average RB clip price( crossmember comes with clip!!!) right now for the informed is $2500+1000 for the kit. Add $650 for a Greddy Manifold. Add $100 for Q45 throttle boddy. Add $200 for a boost controller. $100 for an intake. $80 for your Walbro fuel pump. $600 for a front mount intercooler setup since its going to be custom which means your cooler itself is not going to cost more than $250-300 plus piping.
Damn, now since most of you KA guys that are debating this, are backyard do it yourselfers, your not paying for wiring, but lets say you do that would be another $300. Man that setup I just outlined comes in at $4880 doing it yourself not paying anyone. Hey I have an idea lets also throw in a 3 inch exhaust. Buddy club spec II $350 so that pushes us just over 5k and guess what screw that baby up to 11lbs of boost which is perfectly safe for a RB and your going to be very close to 300 whp .
Now add a SAFC for $300 and injectors for $500 and a bigger turbo $700 well ya know your around $6.5k but guess what you have a setup that can handle high 300's whp and is still quite drivable for a daily basis.

Sorry, but I know you love your KA, but it just does not run like a RB and in the end, having driven KA's, SR's and RB's, all I can say is a KA does not compare torque wise, smoothness wise or revability wise to a RB!!

Now I debating this from your perspective not the average consumers perspective . My first post was much more consumer side pictured. If the average consumer were do to a Turbo KA they would spend 4k on the Turbo kit alone. That kit would not gurantee close to 300 whp without further upgrades.

Backyard boys doing it homespun will save money but thats not the average joe. Again I post from the average person spending you guys post from a do it yourself I am not buying a kit perspective. Which makes your arguement even less valid and mine much more so.
I also should add that the engine is already factory setup turbo wise so there is much less time wasted tuning the damn thing. Time is money and if any of you argue that your still in school and have not stepped into the real world.

Oh ya and for those pushing the weight myth i.e. it affecting the cars handling or drivability it pretty much does not, especially if you run the proper suspension , (which is not by the way custom coilovers, but just coilovers running 8kg-10kg springs) your fine. Face it 6 cylinders rule!!! :P :D hehehehehhehehe

[SochBAT]

SOHC KA-T!!! 770whp achieved by Ventura Racing!!

Whats the highest HP recorded on the RB? (not to be a dick or whatever asking, genuine question)

[s13s13s13]

i havent been able to find any info about that ka24e with 700whp. ive been looking though. as far as hp records rb25 doesnt have a real advantage when compared to turbo ka's. i believe the record for pump gas on a 25 is 587whp and a few ive seen with 600whp. ive seen similar numbers with kat's.

[NemeGuero]

well over 770hp.. RB's are beasts.. they're built to handle power and there are more than a handful easily breaking 1000hp.

[veilside180sx]

SOHC KA-T!!! 770whp achieved by Ventura Racing!!

Whats the highest HP recorded on the RB? (not to be a dick or whatever asking, genuine question)

Ventura Racing was 703.8 whp in their SOHC. Although the motor was in a Toyota Starlet. There will be at least 3 of us in the 5oo-600 whp this year though(SOHC guys) from ka-t.org. They Toyota ran a 8.1 it's first time at the track and hit the wall out of the hole when they went back for 7's.

I have pictures of the motor, and know quite a few guys that spent time with it. The owner didn't have the heart to rebuild it after it wrecked.

[drift freaq]

i havent been able to find any info about that ka24e with 700whp. ive been looking though. as far as hp records rb25 doesnt have a real advantage when compared to turbo ka's. i believe the record for pump gas on a 25 is 587whp and a few ive seen with 600whp. ive seen similar numbers with kat's.
hahahahaha , First off in Japan there are several 700-1000HP RB's. Second off Now you guys are starting to talk about dyno queens. I.E. engines that for the most part, do not maintain those hp figures, beyond a 10 minute dyno run. Which is veering completely off target from the pole. Again,I will say it and any person that has not had time to drive a RB, does not qualify to comment.
RB's have more torque, are capable of more HP and rev higher and smoother than any KA ever will. Now thats a mathmetical fact due to engine design. Until you have driven a RB you really have no room to comment. Though breaking it down just to paper the RB is a far superior engine to the KA. HMMMM do you think Nissan would have thrown a SR or a KA in their Flagship cars.
You guys fail to realize something , I don't hate KA's , I do realize though the limit of their ability and potential VS the ability and potential of the RB and the RB is just superior. Now if you can't see that you A: have to get your eyes checked or B: need someone to pound you over the head with a friggin baseball bat to beat some common sense into you.
The only arguement that you have that comes even close to winning is your beloved weight arguement and you know what that one is all wet too.

[NemeGuero]

yah.. I love my KA-T but dude... (s13s13s13).. RB's will ALWAYS put more power down than any KA.. especially at max potential.. RB=race breed

I just think it's cheaper DIY(ka-t).. I'll be spending about... oh 4.5k and laying down a consistent 300whp (turbo + mildly built motor) which is just fine for me.. that's after a crank balance and blue print to improve the revving ability, stronger internals, port n polish, valves n springs, and you get the idea

and the motor was designed for the car. there are more factors involved than just the weight of the motor. it 'fits'.. I know the RB has it's great mounts and all that but a KA looks so at home in a 240sx engine bay

[PANGES]

yah.. I love my KA-T but dude... (s13s13s13).. RB's will ALWAYS put more power down than any KA.. especially at max potential.. RB=race breed

I just think it's cheaper DIY(ka-t).. I'll be spending about... oh 4.5k and laying down a consistent 300whp (turbo + mildly built motor) which is just fine for me.. that's after a crank balance and blue print to improve the revving ability, stronger internals, port n polish, valves n springs, and you get the idea

and the motor was designed for the car. there are more factors involved than just the weight of the motor. it 'fits'.. I know the RB has it's great mounts and all that but a KA looks so at home in a 240sx engine bay

my RB looks plenty at home in MY engine bay... :wtf:

[PANGES]

and yeah... about the weight thing with RB's in 240s... there IS a pretty noticable difference in weight up front... BUT not to the extent as to where your car handles like shit like everyone thinks... it just makes enough of a difference for you to just have to adapt to the weight... my car still handles great... just took a few hard turns to get used to the weight balance.

[drift freaq]

yah.. I love my KA-T but dude... (s13s13s13).. RB's will ALWAYS put more power down than any KA.. especially at max potential.. RB=race breed

I just think it's cheaper DIY(ka-t).. I'll be spending about... oh 4.5k and laying down a consistent 300whp (turbo + mildly built motor) which is just fine for me.. that's after a crank balance and blue print to improve the revving ability, stronger internals, port n polish, valves n springs, and you get the idea

and the motor was designed for the car. there are more factors involved than just the weight of the motor. it 'fits'.. I know the RB has it's great mounts and all that but a KA looks so at home in a 240sx engine bay

I respect you neme but I still don't think your going to to stay in that $4500 ballpark your talking about and pull 300whp out of your KAT and for just a bit more than that price tag I can gurantee almost if not 300whp out of the RB with nothing internal touched.
As far as how the KA looks in the engine bay vs how the RB looks my RB looks like it belongs there.
contrary to Panges I do not think the weight difference feels that noticable and it definitely does not overly affect the handling in a negative way.
when

[NemeGuero]

I know what I know and when I don't know I don't act like I do.. hahaha
yah.. i originally wanted to go RB so I researched it alot.. I would love to have one but it seemed a little out of my price range and 2 years ago parts weren't so available to me for the RB as they are now, so KA was my choice and turbo fell into my lap.

I'll keep you posted on my build and give you a build-cost tally ;) you may be right.. I sometimes get overzealous on finishing deadlines and costs.. we shall see

and dude.. I'd love to ride in your RB someday..

[MaD1337M3DRiV3r]

Personally i think the RB isnt worth a crap, it weighs more than a small block chevy. The KA is great if you do your own work and know what you are doing. I say forget both of them.. get this:
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=513199&prmenbr=361

or you could just get a junkyard 350 sbc and make way more power for less

[ALTRNTV]

Personally i think the RB isnt worth a crap


This coming from someone with 1337 in their username.. :doh:

[MaD1337M3DRiV3r]

This coming from someone with 1337 in their username.. :doh:
and this is coming from someone who claims to be an “academic”, but cant spell.

[ALTRNTV]

Nice comeback. :keke:

The topic asked for KA-T or RB25, not any of the engines you posted. :duh:

[MaD1337M3DRiV3r]

Nice comeback. :keke:

The topic asked for KA-T or RB25, not any of the engines you posted. :duh:
RB25DET 20 46.51%
Built KA24DE-T 20 46.51%
Other (make a post about it) 3 6.98%

:mrmeph:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v193/mad1337m3driv3r/owned49.jpg

[ALTRNTV]

PWNED.

You don't really think he's gonna go with an LS7 do you. He's already made his mind and went with a KA-T. Inline 6 turbo > junkyard 350 sbc (as you said).

I'd go with an RB25DET myself. KA-T's are great and all, but you get 2 more liters and the torque and powerband is greater with the I6.

[MaD1337M3DRiV3r]

PWNED.

You don't really think he's gonna go with an LS7 do you. He's already made his mind and went with a KA-T. Inline 6 turbo > junkyard 350 sbc (as you said).

I'd go with an RB25DET myself. KA-T's are great and all, but you get 2 more liters and the torque and powerband is greater with the I6.

- I suggested the LS7 because the poll requested suggestions.
- He can have a KA-T and still get a LS7 later on, no one is bound to one motor
- Please re-read my post, i stated that the junkyard 350 will make more power for less
- You would rather go with a rb25, so you dont have either...
- 2 more liters? The KA is a 2.4 liter engine, the RB25DET is a 2.5 liter engine.
- torque + powerband... it depends on a lot of variables

[ALTRNTV]

Woops. Got me there. I meant 2 more cylinders, not liters. Haha

I've ridden in my friends 300rwhp SOHC KA-T and boy did that puppy pull, HARD. A week after that, my long time friend Jon visits me with a surprise under his hood. RB20DET. He showed me his dyno sheet and it was 305rwhp and something like 320tq @12psi, or close to that. He took me for a drive. RB hands down. Mind you that his was an RB20, I've yet to feel how an RB25 feels like. I'm waiting for my friend to finish his RB25 install.

[SimpleS14]

drift freaq - When you say "RB"...you mean "RB25DET" right? Because I drove a RB20DET...but I think that's different...or am I wrong? I was browsing some Skyline forums and I read or skimpped over threads where guys blow piston rings on the RB25 when they crank up the boost. Why is this?...does the drivetrain layout have something to do with it? (longer driveshaft = more work) How much can the RB25 handle on stock internals?

[MaD1337M3DRiV3r]

drift freaq - When you say "RB"...you mean "RB25DET" right? Because I drove a RB20DET...but I think that's different...or am I wrong? I was browsing some Skyline forums and I read or skimpped over threads where guys blow piston rings on the RB25 when they crank up the boost. Why is this?...does the drivetrain layout have something to do with it? (longer driveshaft = more work) How much can the RB25 handle on stock internals?

"poor ringlandings" is what i read was the problem. I too have seen those threads where people pull out a piston and it crumbles.

[ALTRNTV]

drift freaq - When you say "RB"...you mean "RB25DET" right?

Yes. He means the 25. He has one in his car and is currently making install kits for it.

[vinhisbored]

Back on topic, I say the built KA-T, just because 'to me' it's more affordable, and it's going to be in my daily driver, I don't have the time, money, and I need it to get around. [Well, speaking with a basic turbo kit first, then working up to having it built.] My friend is going through a RB25 swap as we speak, and he's spent alot.. I think in the end, around 9k, but then that's with 'custom fabrication' done, but very clean work.

[drift freaq]

drift freaq - When you say "RB"...you mean "RB25DET" right? Because I drove a RB20DET...but I think that's different...or am I wrong? I was browsing some Skyline forums and I read or skimpped over threads where guys blow piston rings on the RB25 when they crank up the boost. Why is this?...does the drivetrain layout have something to do with it? (longer driveshaft = more work) How much can the RB25 handle on stock internals?

I think those guys might have been pushing it real hard. basically you can run a RB25 all day at 11lbs of boost without a problem. Also stock internals can handle large numbers. Without changing the oil pump you can run up to 400-500 HP change your oil pump and you won't run into the ringland problem they are talking about.

Now to address vinhisbored. The whole point of us designing the kit was to take all the expensive fabrication stuff your talking about out of the picture. I outlined it before, I will outline it again $2500 for a clip. $1000 for a kit . $3500 then if you wire yourself you save $300 but otherwise $300 for wiring . We are also developing a FMIC kit.
Now you could run that with the stock manifold and the sidemount intercooler with a boost controller and your probably going to get close to 250 whp. Bolt on a few upgrades like the Greddy intake, Q45 throttle body, fmic and your going to get into the 300 whp range at 11lb's. thats still at the $4800 mark. Now thats a reliable daily driver as well.
You will spend that much or more to get the KAT there, and in the end with the RB you still have a better engine.
Go ahead, go with the KAT because its cheap in the beginning, but once you start going for the HP, its going to add up quickly.
If your poor, you should not be entering this discussion to begin with, because basically, either setup KAT or RB, is going to cost you somewhere in the 4-5k range, to get those HP figures we have been talking about.

I just feel if your going to spend that money, do it on a engine that is nice to start. Not one that was built for the American car buyer, who does not care about smooth and high revving, they just want torque.

[TheSnail]

The run down of what driftfreaq is saying is: HP is addictive, There is no such thing as enough. While there may be a difference in initial costs, down the road hp for the 25 will be pennies to the dollar. My old boss was like some of you guys. Kept telling me "Why would you get a rb25 when you can build a sr with more hp for the same price as a stock 25" and my response was always "Then what".

[drift freaq]

The run down of what driftfreaq is saying is: HP is addictive, There is no such thing as enough. While there may be a difference in initial costs, down the road hp for the 25 will be pennies to the dollar. My old boss was like some of you guys. Kept telling me "Why would you get a rb25 when you can build a sr with more hp for the same price as a stock 25" and my response was always "Then what".
A fitting finish!!! I do not think there needs to be anymore debate in this thread, its pretty much game over!! RB wins!! If you KA guys cannot see the logic behind this, then..... :ughd:

[vinhisbored]

Yes, I did read the first outline, and I understand completely where you are coming from, there's power, and the internals are pretty fine for a while. In the beginning, I was also planning about the whole RB25 thing (like exactly a year ago) but then after researching about how much money I'd have to come up with, that just died. For now, when I get my basic turbo kit running, I hope to be sufficient until I can slowly work my way up. It'll be fun either way.. and who knows.. maybe the second project will be RB25 and up.. ;)

[240SeXy!]

I laugh becouse I got a complete front clip for 1,000 bucks.. :duh:

and yes it will be better than sr's and wastefull Ls1-7. For this price, how could i not buy it, When i start putting it in my s14 ill keep you guys updated..

:P :D :w00t: cheerz

[drift freaq]

I laugh becouse I got a complete front clip for 1,000 bucks.. :duh:

and yes it will be better than sr's and wastefull Ls1-7. For this price, how could i not buy it, When i start putting it in my s14 ill keep you guys updated..

:P :D :w00t: cheerz
congrats , now you can come buy the best install kit on the market from us. email me for pics and info. shameless self promotion here :D

[vinhisbored]

Where did you get one for $1000? I want one now :( . Someone go buy my KA-T KIT! Haha!

[drift freaq]

Where did you get one for $1000? I want one now :( . Someone go buy my KA-T KIT! Haha!
I don't know, but he has been posting in peoples for sale threads, about how he got the same part they are selling for cheaper and parading it. Its like ok we got the point you got a hookup. I get hookups on stuff too, but I don't go shouting to the world about it. That as we know breeds resentment.

[SimpleS14]

I guess I will just wait until this install kit comes out. I fear prices for the RB will increase though....so who knows.

[haggards13]

I guess I will just wait until this install kit comes out. I fear prices for the RB will increase though....so who knows.
I hate that you're right.
Hopefully I can get mine within the next 2 months. :hs:

[drift freaq]

guys, the install kit is out for the S13 and being tested on a S14 sometime in the next month. email me for more info [email protected]
P.S. We just have not done an official product announcement of the install kit as of yet.

[kouki_s14]

i am also considering both options as of now and ka-t is winning for one main reason
i would LOVE to have the RB in my car, but im in so cali and i get scared that a cop will pull me over and will ask me to pop my hood, im not sure what will happen, but the chance of it getting towed away is there and i dont want to risk spending all that money on the RB and get it taken away. yes turbo KA is also illegal but it's a lot less eye catching, maybe i can hide the turbo with a heat shield or something. theres nothing that can hide a huge 6 banger

if anyone has ideas of how to help me get through that then please inform all of us, im sure there are a lot of people on the forums that would like to know, otherwise i think i may just have to stick with the KA

[drift freaq]

Face it , if your going to go KA turbo the cop is going to see. They are no longer that ignorant. If your that scared about getting pulled over and losing it, you should not be doing anything performance wise. Just sell your car and buy something powerful new and legal.
Fact is I live in L.A. just like you do and unless your down in Culver City or out drag racing in the San Fernando Valley or driving stupidly out in Industry you really do not have to worry. My friends and I have driven modded engine cars here for years. The trick to not getting pulled over is not being stupid. Also don't run an exhaust that screams pull me over. The RB with the right exhaust is so quit you cannot hear it. With my exhaust it has a throaty healthy six sound but guess what ? I drove by no less than 5 cops in Torrance/Gardena yesterday afternoon on tuning runs never once did they look at me.
Oh ya my exhaust is a Buddy Club Spec II with a high flow cat.

[lucky7]

I guess I will just wait until this install kit comes out. I fear prices for the RB will increase though....so who knows.

curious as to why you feel that prices for RB's will increase. there are a billions +1 more 25/20's than 26's. just wondering.

[drift freaq]

curious as to why you feel that prices for RB's will increase. there are a billions +1 more 25/20's than 26's. just wondering.
one word , Popularity.
As popularity increases importers raise prices. a few years ago a RB25 clip could be had for as cheap as $1500 because most importers could not sell them. Everyone wanted a SR and no one had really publicly addressed the install. Mckinney was just showing their install kit at the National convention and it looked ugly . hahahhahhahhahha
It took a few years for people to realize that for around a 1k more difference over the SR install they could have a engine in their car that already put out 250hp stock and with a boost controller and some minor bolt ons could be pushed to 300whp on a completely stock engine. Ya you could do it with the SR but the cost of the bolts on the SR would wind up costing you the same amount to do the RB.
The reason the RB has started to get popular is because unlike a SR the RB has gobs of torque stock. Plus a very smooth revving linear torque and power band that is broad and flat . From idle to redline the engine pulls like a freight train. The SR is like a wild horse calm at the bottom with nothing there and then all of sudden bucking and pulling . I can roll down the street in 5th gear at legal speeds because of the torque and power I have . I was on the freeway yesterday and I went to shift out of 5th to another gear because it felt like it was in third. SR does not do that.

[SimpleS14]

Yea, as mentioned before...I fear price increases due to popularity and eventually scarity on good motors. Heck...the new Fast and Furious movie is suppose to have a RB-powered Mustang. If this holds true, who knows what kind of price gouging were going to see.

Okay...so I'm interested in this install kit...and I will e-mail you later about it drift freq, but I have one more question....

tuning...how do you go about tuning this motor?

[NemeGuero]

use the rb ECU, don't need to tune right away

[drift freaq]

Yea, as mentioned before...I fear price increases due to popularity and eventually scarity on good motors. Heck...the new Fast and Furious movie is suppose to have a RB-powered Mustang. If this holds true, who knows what kind of price gouging were going to see.

Okay...so I'm interested in this install kit...and I will e-mail you later about it drift freq, but I have one more question....

tuning...how do you go about tuning this motor?
tuning is no different than any other engine. There are shops out there that have been tuning Skyline engines for years. Any reputable tuner can handle it.

[kouki_s14]

Face it , if your going to go KA turbo the cop is going to see. They are no longer that ignorant. If your that scared about getting pulled over and losing it, you should not be doing anything performance wise. Just sell your car and by something powerful new and legal.
Fact is I live in L.A. just like you do and unless your down in Culver City or out drag racing in the San Fernando Valley or driving stupidly out in Industry you really do not have to worry. My friends and I have driven modded engine cars here for years. The trick to not getting pulled over is not being stupid. Also don't run an exhaust that screams pull me over. The RB with the right exhaust is so quit you cannot hear it. With my exhaust it has a throaty healthy six sound but guess what ? I drove by no less than 5 cops in Torrance/Gardena yesterday afternoon on tuning runs never once did they look at me.
Oh ya my exhaust is a Buddy Club Spec II with a high flow cat.

thats actually pretty convincing to me, i think im gonna stick with the original plan of the RB, thanks and keep us updated on how the mounts fit in the s14

[ramblux]

Fact is I live in L.A. just like you do and unless your down in Culver City or out drag racing in the San Fernando Valley or driving stupidly out in Industry you really do not have to worry.

I live in Culver City and I've never been hassled. And I've been driving a bright yellow AE86 with CF drop vent hood and CF trunk, 20-valve with quad throttle bodies, high-rise header, and no cat!

Back on topic, you guys are certainly giving me some things to think about for my S14... I may have to take a closer look at the RB25.

[drift freaq]

I live in Culver City and I've never been hassled. And I've been driving a bright yellow AE86 with CF drop vent hood and CF trunk, 20-valve with quad throttle bodies, high-rise header, and no cat!

Back on topic, you guys are certainly giving me some things to think about for my S14... I may have to take a closer look at the RB25.
I was going by what some friends had told from west la and their experiences in Culver City. I am glad to here its not that bad there as well. You should take a closer look at the RB, its dope! :D

P.S.posting from Chicago

[sweet89s13]

i have a sohc ka and i beat my buddies dohc ka with complete exhaust, intake, maf but i would still go for the rb just because of the shitloads of power to come within that block. power support is insane but it will cost you more but then again you pay for what you get
that and the price will be around the same ball park give or take a few k's demand for rb's are low

[abuC]

I'd forget both and go with a 1jz-gte.

[drift freaq]

I'd forget both and go with a 1jz-gte.
traitor, hahhahahhahahaha J/k

[HolyShiznit]

Ok this is all preference but whatever. I made 310 rwhp on my KA-T with my 4200 dollar set-up. That's 4200 dollars with the expansion built inside, IE big injectors, turbo, etc. That was stock cams, stock TB, stock intake manifold, stock unopened motor. I understand it could be done for cheaper, I understand people will flame me for spending that much anyways, but whatever.

I personally say go with whatever is cheapest to YOU at the time. I found good deals on all my stuff so *shrug*. Also after having ridden in and played with a couple RB25's I don't know where this "amazing torque" comes from. 90% of the torque curves I have seen from them have LESS low end than a KA. They rev higher but I wouldn't say they create more torque, my KA is evident of that. Dont' get me wrong I like both motors, so I refused to vote.

So ya, I guess my post has no relevance cause I like both of them, but oh well.

[drift freaq]

Ok this is all preference but whatever. I made 310 rwhp on my KA-T with my 4200 dollar set-up. That's 4200 dollars with the expansion built inside, IE big injectors, turbo, etc. That was stock cams, stock TB, stock intake manifold, stock unopened motor. I understand it could be done for cheaper, I understand people will flame me for spending that much anyways, but whatever.

I personally say go with whatever is cheapest to YOU at the time. I found good deals on all my stuff so *shrug*. Also after having ridden in and played with a couple RB25's I don't know where this "amazing torque" comes from. 90% of the torque curves I have seen from them have LESS low end than a KA. They rev higher but I wouldn't say they create more torque, my KA is evident of that. Dont' get me wrong I like both motors, so I refused to vote.

So ya, I guess my post has no relevance cause I like both of them, but oh well.
Less low end than a KA? Out of a RB ? you shure you did not ride in a RB20 powered car? Are you sure your have ridden in cars with engines that were tuned properly i.e. running right? I can personally attest to the hands down difference of a RB over a SR or a stock KA. Now if your trying to compare your 310rwhp KAT it would probably be closer to the stock RB if not slightly better on low end for one reason. A stock RB install is not going to give its owner 310rwhp. More like somewhere in the range of 250rwhp.
Unless the RB's had the bolts I have done on my RB along with a boost controller, you cannot compare the two. Its like stock vs modified. If you came here and rode in my S13 I think you would be surprised.

P.S. most people are not going to be able to put together a 310rwhp KAT for $4200 either. Thats not expensive thats cheap for that amount of HP.

[patrick10]

4200 isnt expensive for 300 hp on a ka. people are just used to the prices of a turbo kit which are mostly rediculous. you could easily get 300 whp for a little over 3000.

[HolyShiznit]

At 8 psi my 240 was trapping 110 consecutively. I have never EVER been within more than a 10 wheel torque difference from horsepower on any of my set-ups. I have ridden in RB25 cars that were properly "stock" with simple intercooler/downpipe/exhaust changes. I was also judging it by the dyno graphs (so few exist) of S13's with RB25's. 90% of the time the RB25 makes a much greater variance of HP as compared to low end. Then again any number of things could change this.

http://forums.nicoclub.com/zerothread?id=133806

In my town it's the two KA-T's, three RB25's (one NEO), and one RB20. I like both engines, I think the RB25 sounds sexier hands down. But I don't think I would be pissed if I had either in my engine bay, they are both really good engines.

[drift freaq]

At 8 psi my 240 was trapping 110 consecutively. I have never EVER been within more than a 10 wheel torque difference from horsepower on any of my set-ups. I have ridden in RB25 cars that were properly "stock" with simple intercooler/downpipe/exhaust changes. I was also judging it by the dyno graphs (so few exist) of S13's with RB25's. 90% of the time the RB25 makes a much greater variance of HP as compared to low end. Then again any number of things could change this.

http://forums.nicoclub.com/zerothread?id=133806

In my town it's the two KA-T's, three RB25's (one NEO), and one RB20. I like both engines, I think the RB25 sounds sexier hands down. But I don't think I would be pissed if I had either in my engine bay, they are both really good engines.
Nor would I, though I do prefer the RB because of the way it runs. I will be interested to get my setup on the dyno. My current setup is using the Greddy Manifold with a Q45 throttle body,FMIC, complete elbow through down pipe 3 inch piping with a buddy club spec II exhaust and a Power FC. I need to get a boost controller for it.

[HolyShiznit]

That should breathe a lot better than, get that thing on the dyno. PM me the details of it when you do! :bite:

[evrae205b]

ka-t is more practical as far as replacement parts and is cheaper to install and build. good enough reason fro me. there are other differences such as wieght distribusion, torque band ect. but thats all up to your personal preference.

[Tenchuu]

i Auctually am looking at both, to get 300+HP our of both the RB25 is thousands cheaper than a KA-T kit. RB25=$2500 for a front clip, 1K for the install kit and then i have 250+/- HP add a FMIC, Greddy intake manafold, and a decent exhaust manifold, SAFC and AVCR the RB is going to be 300-350

For a 300+/- kit for the KA is is$ 4000+/- plus ECU tuneing plus if i go mutch higher i really need to gut the engine and get the internals good. then adding the other items i mentioned earler, the are auctually more expensive for the KA-tT intake/exhause manifolds/FMIC ki. the AVCR won't work so i would probibbly have to dump the SAFC that i have and get a system that plays nice togather.

RB is cheaper, more complete kit, has more potential and cheaper aftermarket performance parts.
So tell me again how the KA-T is better?

[HolyShiznit]

i Auctually am looking at both, to get 300+HP our of both the RB25 is thousands cheaper than a KA-T kit. RB25=$2500 for a front clip, 1K for the install kit and then i have 250+/- HP add a FMIC, Greddy intake manafold, and a decent exhaust manifold, SAFC and AVCR the RB is going to be 300-350

For a 300+/- kit for the KA is is$ 4000+/- plus ECU tuneing plus if i go mutch higher i really need to gut the engine and get the internals good. then adding the other items i mentioned earler, the are auctually more expensive for the KA-tT intake/exhause manifolds/FMIC ki. the AVCR won't work so i would probibbly have to dump the SAFC that i have and get a system that plays nice togather.

RB is cheaper, more complete kit, has more potential and cheaper aftermarket performance parts.
So tell me again how the KA-T is better?

Okiedoke, *cracks knuckles*.

JGS manifold 250
T3/T4 Used 300 New 500
52lb injectors 200
Z32 MAF 100
JWT ECU Used 400 New 500
FMIC 100-300
Tial 38mm wastegate w/ 1 bar spring 200 (I think...)
Fuel Rail 100
Intercooler Piping 300 w/ couplers/t bolts
Clutch 250
BOV 80ish
Downpipe (random cost, depends on a lot)

Total 2,780 (brand new prices). 14psi on a stock bottom end is easily 300whp minimum on a properly sized T3/t4. So that's assuming you don't get any deals on anything.

Onto address some other points. How in god's name is an exhaust manifold for a 4 cyl MORE expensive than a 6 cyl? How in god's name would the SAFC NOT work with the AVCR? I happen to use a JWT, SAFC II, AND an AVCR.

Bottom line is, the power numbers come out even. Next round of upgrades for the KA would be a bottom end, boost controller. The next round of upgrades for the RB would be turbo, manifold, intake manifold, ETC. Both would be around 400+ easily at this point. Past that point so many things start to add up that the numbers get cloudy. So once AGAIN. It will end up costing the SAME. Let's not even mention would you rather bolt on parts or swap a motor/wire. Both are awesome choices. Pick what you want and what's most PRACTICAL. I know countless people that importing a motor, re-wiring, and swapping it just can't be done without a shop at their disposal.

Either way KA or RB you win.

[drift freaq]

i Auctually am looking at both, to get 300+HP our of both the RB25 is thousands cheaper than a KA-T kit. RB25=$2500 for a front clip, 1K for the install kit and then i have 250+/- HP add a FMIC, Greddy intake manafold, and a decent exhaust manifold, SAFC and AVCR the RB is going to be 300-350

For a 300+/- kit for the KA is is$ 4000+/- plus ECU tuneing plus if i go mutch higher i really need to gut the engine and get the internals good. then adding the other items i mentioned earler, the are auctually more expensive for the KA-tT intake/exhause manifolds/FMIC ki. the AVCR won't work so i would probibbly have to dump the SAFC that i have and get a system that plays nice togather.

RB is cheaper, more complete kit, has more potential and cheaper aftermarket performance parts.
So tell me again how the KA-T is better?
well I can attest to a few things here, first off you could use the SAFC without the AVCR and get in the ballpark with a greddy intake, Q45 throttle body, and a boost controller. You do not need to change your exhaust manifold unless your planning a turbo upgrade.
Now given that people have put down 262 whp with stock boost theoretically you should be in the 300 range. You will top out in the 300whp range with the stock turbo, but the minute you change the turbo you open a lot of doors power wise.

[drift freaq]

Okiedoke, *cracks knuckles*.

JGS manifold 250
T3/T4 Used 300 New 500
52lb injectors 200
Z32 MAF 100
JWT ECU Used 400 New 500
FMIC 100-300
Tial 38mm wastegate w/ 1 bar spring 200 (I think...)
Fuel Rail 100
Intercooler Piping 300 w/ couplers/t bolts
Clutch 250
BOV 80ish
Downpipe (random cost, depends on a lot)

Total 2,780 (brand new prices). 14psi on a stock bottom end is easily 300whp minimum on a properly sized T3/t4. So that's assuming you don't get any deals on anything.

snip happens..........
Either way KA or RB you win.
Shiznit, I do respect your opinion, but you know and I know some of those prices you have listed, are very hookup!! Thats really not a fair comparision.

Also like I stated earlier in this thread and other threads where this debate has raged the only KAT guys argueing the KAT being cheaper are back yard guys who piece there own kits together. Basically for a lot of people thats not fair. A lot of these guys do not put their own kits together and would not want to start to go that way. They would prefer to buy a kit.
People that go for SR and RB installs do so, because they do not want to try to piece something together.
Fact is, also I have not seen anyone do a KAT daily driver that runs 14lb's continously, unless T.Y. has been very busy these last couple of years. Last I heard daily driven KAT's were reliable at 11lbs which basically puttingA out 310rwhp. Now I know your claiming more shiznit, but I would like to see how long your engine will last if its stock.
Again I am not stating these things for the fact of who is better, just to bring clarity to the picture.

In the end its totally up to the person which way they want to go . I prefer a 6 cylinder, I am biased and I admit it.
Do I think its the ultimate engine? No. Do I feel it rules over a 4 cylinder? Yes. Do I feel eight cylinders are superior to 6 ? Depending on the engine, Yes!! Do I feel 12 cylinders are awesome? Yes. Sorry guys but the more cylinders a engine has the smoother it runs. Why do you think they call 4 cylinder engines 4 bangers? Because they do not run as smooth and tend to vibrate. Does it mean I hate them no. They have their purpose.
I just prefer sixs and this goes all the way back to my days of 510's and 240z's, once I gradauted out of 510's into 240z's I never looked back. I loved the L series 6 in those days. Now I feel its an ancient engine that needs to be laid to rest. Modern 6's just put the L series six to shame. Its called technoligical advancement.
I made a venture back into 4 cylinders for awhile with 240sx's but the minute I got my teeth back into a 6 in our cars, again I can't look back. A SR in a Datsun roadster or 510 sure, but car that has room for a 6?ヘッッlイェア!!

[HolyShiznit]

I think we are arguing for the same thing, however. If someone is not willing to piece together a turbo kit then I doubt they will have the mechanical and technical know-how to wire an engine and install it. That adds cost, because that is meaning that someone is going to be billed for the work. My motor lasted for 2 years unopened bottom end, lots of track/street racing/auto-xing. Not saying EVERYONE'S will last that long but hey, it happens more often than you think. Also my friends NEO RB25 developed rod knock within 2 weeks of it being up and running. Does that mean all RB25's are crap? Not at all! Shit happens. For the last time, either way it's gonna be a PITA. KA-T is definitely not the way to go if you are a n00b about modding cars. Importing an RB25 and having a shop professionally install it would put a smile much faster on your face than carefully selecting pieces and developing a kit for the KA.

Personally I think both engines are dumb. As soon as I blow up my KA-T I want an LS1. :hitit: Also those prices I quoted are available to 90% of the regular customers out there on various different sites. And they were the prices of my original pieces of equipment when I pieced my kit together 3 years ago. BTW: Get your car on the dyno Drift Freaq!

[big-byrd]

RB's are obviously better engines - designed to handle boost, the KA's weren't. RB > KA-T, however if money is an issue, a ka-t setup may be a bit more practical.

[BigVinnie]

Just want to see which one they prefer and maybe you can post to why you prefer that setup.

I would say a KA24det. It is cheap to forge the internals with eagle rods and wiseco pistons (under a $1000 for rods and pistons). You have a stroker crank with the KA so it will rev faster and produce more power at lower rpms being a 4cylinder, rather than an inline 6 cylinder.
Being that it is 4 cylinder engine it makes a better balance of front to rear chassi weight distribution. The inline 6 RB's weigh a bit more.
The KA has an abundance of after market support, most parts can be commonly found at your local wrecking yard.
There is a wide selection of engine management for the KA (AEM EMS, Biki ROM, Mega Squirt, even retunes from enthalapy)

Best reason why: KA performance will always be slightly more affordable due to the fact that you pay for 2 less cylinders than getting an RB..........
Shit it's 2 more of everything when you invest into RB, from injectors, to spark plugs, that stuff really starts to add up!!!!!!!!

Plus I enjoy the convenience of the USDM, knowing that I can go to my local kragen to pick up your basic bolt on's (water pump's, hoses, ETC.)

[big-byrd]

I would say a KA24det. It is cheap to forge the internals with eagle rods and wiseco pistons (under a $1000 for rods and pistons). You have a stroker crank with the KA so it will rev faster and produce more power at lower rpms being a 4cylinder, rather than an inline 6 cylinder.
Being that it is 4 cylinder engine it makes a better balance of front to rear chassi weight distribution. The inline 6 RB's weigh a bit more.
The KA has an abundance of after market support, most parts can be commonly found at your local wrecking yard.
There is a wide selection of engine management for the KA (AEM EMS, Biki ROM, Mega Squirt, even retunes from enthalapy)

Best reason why: KA performance will always be slightly more affordable due to the fact that you pay for 2 less cylinders than getting an RB..........
Shit it's 2 more of everything when you invest into RB, from injectors, to spark plugs, that stuff really starts to add up!!!!!!!!

Plus I enjoy the convenience of the USDM, knowing that I can go to my local kragen to pick up your basic bolt on's (water pump's, hoses, ETC.)
i said rb > ka-t. i still stand by this, however that's GENERALLY speaking of course. a build ka-t should outperform a stock rb, but if you level the playing field and both are either stock or built, the rb will win no holds barred.

i voted ka-t anyways just because it's the route i'm planning on taking.

[drift freaq]

I would say a KA24det. It is cheap to forge the internals with eagle rods and wiseco pistons (under a $1000 for rods and pistons). You have a stroker crank with the KA so it will rev faster and produce more power at lower rpms being a 4cylinder, rather than an inline 6 cylinder.
Being that it is 4 cylinder engine it makes a better balance of front to rear chassi weight distribution. The inline 6 RB's weigh a bit more.
The KA has an abundance of after market support, most parts can be commonly found at your local wrecking yard.
There is a wide selection of engine management for the KA (AEM EMS, Biki ROM, Mega Squirt, even retunes from enthalapy)

Best reason why: KA performance will always be slightly more affordable due to the fact that you pay for 2 less cylinders than getting an RB..........
Shit it's 2 more of everything when you invest into RB, from injectors, to spark plugs, that stuff really starts to add up!!!!!!!!

Plus I enjoy the convenience of the USDM, knowing that I can go to my local kragen to pick up your basic bolt on's (water pump's, hoses, ETC.)

Heh you don't read much do you Vinnie, If you had read the whole debate in this thread you would realize several of us have proved the weight different was not an issue car balance wise. You go on spouting the myth based on what you have heard and not experienced or read. Plus you do not even have correct info about the KA , stock KA rods are forged! A KA will rev faster? Do you even have any experience here? Stroker cranks rev slower not faster hahhahahhahha and they rev less!! I mean you sound like your reading off of other peoples posts that have not even done the work. If you so much as read you would realize KAT's are not cheaper. EVen a KAT proponent admitted that and he has done it.
Please do your homework before you come in here spouting stuff with no real knowledge to back it up besides conjecture.

[BigVinnie]

Heh you don't read much do you Vinnie, If you had read the whole debate in this thread you would realize several of us have proved the weight different was not an issue car balance wise. You go on spouting the myth based on what you have heard and not experienced or read. Plus you do not even have correct info about the KA , stock KA rods are forged! A KA will rev faster? Do you even have any experience here? Stroker cranks rev slower not faster hahhahahhahha and they rev less!! I mean you sound like your reading off of other peoples posts that have not even done the work. If you so much as read you would realize KAT's are not cheaper. EVen a KAT proponent admitted that and he has done it.
Please do your homework before you come in here spouting stuff with no real knowledge to back it up besides conjecture.


It is still added curb weight. It may not be that much when you are pulling over 300CHP in a straight line. But it will defenitely increase lateral G force.
Any 4 banger will rev faster than an inline 6, you obviously werent paying attention to what I wrote spilner, it also makes power earlier.......
You need to put your tiny cock away.......

[drift freaq]

It is still added curb weight. It may not be that much when you are pulling over 300CHP in a straight line. But it will defenitely increase lateral G force.
Any 4 banger will rev faster than an inline 6, you obviously werent paying attention to what I wrote spilner, it also makes power earlier.......
You need to put your tiny cock away.......
you are really showing maturity here, how old are you ? It does not affect the handling of the car adversely, in fact Slide Squad Mark has been drifting a RB powered coupe for over a year. No front end plow!! Until you have real world experience with both of these engines for a real world comparison , you need to stop talking. I read your statement , you said and I quote: "You have a stroker crank with the KA so it will rev faster and produce more power at lower rpms being a 4cylinder," end quote. That is implieing , that the long stroke crank of the KA is going to rev faster. Do you even know how to build and engine for revving? The whole industry knows long stroke cranks rev slower and not as high!
The KA is notorious non fast revving engine , nor is it high revving.
The RB is not only smooth revving but is high revving. It was also put out a lot more torque and HP at any rev than a KA will when built to the same configuration , cam , intake, turbo size etc....
Funny how when proven wrong you resort to insults and name calling .

[HolyShiznit]

Hey Vinnie, if you had read this thread you would have realized that both Drift Freaq and myself have DONE the work on both of these engines. You are coming on here and not bringing hard facts about either engines. The KA does rev slower. Take a ride in my built KA, it revs slower than most other cars I am around INCLUDING the NEO RB25 I rode in. However, just because it "revs slower" does NOT mean that it won't obliterate cars that do. Case in point my car absolutely RAPED a supercharged S2000 from a roll on my high boost and low boost setting. Also the weight difference is negligible when you use proper dampened coilovers/springs. Also most mount kits put the motor close as is possible to the firewall. You ARE correct in saying that it DOES add more weight regardless. Which is true. So even if the RB made 20 more HP than a KA-T it would still have to lug around 150ish+ more pounds. Whether this would have a huge impact on handling has yet to be proven because NO ONE has skidpad numbers so it DOESN'T make any sense to argue this.

When it comes down to it the RB25 WILL MAKE THE MOST peak power. If you calculate the area under the curve however they end up being pretty close (KA vs RB).

Drift Freaq you know where I stand on this one. I think that people should just go with what is affordable to them at the time. If I had a single cam motor I wouldn't hesitate to swap to an RB25. If I had a good condition KADE I wouldn't hesitate to turbo that. It's all a matter of your choice and circumstance.

Kids are we done yet? :mepoke:

[BigVinnie]

you are really showing maturity here, how old are you ? It does not affect the handling of the car adversely, in fact Slide Squad Mark has been drifting a RB powered coupe for over a year. No front end plow!! Until you have real world experience with both of these engines for a real world comparison , you need to stop talking. I read your statement , you said and I quote: "You have a stroker crank with the KA so it will rev faster and produce more power at lower rpms being a 4cylinder," end quote. That is implieing , that the long stroke crank of the KA is going to rev faster. Do you even know how to build and engine for revving? The whole industry knows long stroke cranks rev slower and not as high!
The KA is notorious non fast revving engine , nor is it high revving.
The RB is not only smooth revving but is high revving. It was also put out a lot more torque and HP at any rev than a KA will when built to the same configuration , cam , intake, turbo size etc....
Funny how when proven wrong you resort to insults and name calling .

You are acting as if I'm gonna spend 10grand on my $2000 (bucket 240). That defenitely wont happen unless I am a millionaire. Fact is if you have that additional 180lb.s with the RB it does matter if you are riding on a suspension that has a spring rate lets say under 7KG front, 6kg rear. Well I mention this because most economy suspensions offer a spring rate for the under $1000( for people with a budget). Tghe point is any guy you know that has done the rb swap has defenitely made there suspension a little more rigid, I'm not at all saying that the 240 chassis cant handle the additional weight. The weight of the RB really isn't that bad as you stated, but it still remains instead of riding on a cheaper budget suspension you will still need to step up on the springs.
Other guys that stick with the SR or KA understand the that the level of difficulty isn't as hard as an RB. Besides Nissan designed the silvia/240 to utilize a 4cylinder for better control, and an almost equal weight distribution.

I appoligize if you are still reading the sentence wrong, but I will make it simple for you to understand..... 4 CYLINDERS REV FASTER THAN INLINE 6'S.
THE KA HAS AN ADVANTAGE HAVING A STROKER CRANK IT WILL PRODUCE POWER EARLIER THAN A HIGH REV CRANK...... I don't know why that is so hard for you to understand. Besides I like to shift early, I don't care too much for the loss in top speed due to it's low limiting redline, that doesn't bother me at all. Especially since alot of the KA24DET guy's are spankin the RB guys in 1/4 mile times, and at a fraction of the cost it took in parts.

[BigVinnie]

When it comes down to it the RB25 WILL MAKE THE MOST peak power. If you calculate the area under the curve however they end up being pretty close (KA vs RB).

YES that is all I agree with and nothing else, a 6 BANGER will inevitably make more peak power......


Drift Freaq you know where I stand on this one. I think that people should just go with what is affordable to them at the time.

DING DING DING DING...... That was the only point I was trying to bring accross for the price it is the biggest bang for your buck in displacement. It all comes CHEAP for the KA.....

[drift freaq]

You are acting as if I'm gonna spend 10grand on my $2000 (bucket 240). That defenitely wont happen unless I am a millionaire. Fact is if you have that additional 180lb.s with the RB it does matter if you are riding on a suspension that has a spring rate lets say under 7KG front, 6kg rear. Well I mention this because most economy suspensions offer a spring rate for the under $1000( for people with a budget). Tghe point is any guy you know that has done the rb swap has defenitely made there suspension a little more rigid, I'm not at all saying that the 240 chassis cant handle the additional weight. The weight of the RB really isn't that bad as you stated, but it still remains instead of riding on a cheaper budget suspension you will still need to step up on the springs.
Other guys that stick with the SR or KA understand the that the level of difficulty isn't as hard as an RB. Besides Nissan designed the silvia/240 to utilize a 4cylinder for better control, and an almost equal weight distribution.

I appoligize if you are still reading the sentence wrong, but I will make it simple for you to understand..... 4 CYLINDERS REV FASTER THAN INLINE 6'S.
THE KA HAS AN ADVANTAGE HAVING A STROKER CRANK IT WILL PRODUCE POWER EARLIER THAN A HIGH REV CRANK...... I don't know why that is so hard for you to understand. Besides I like to shift early, I don't care too much for the loss in top speed due to it's low limiting redline, that doesn't bother me at all. Especially since alot of the KA24DET guy's are spankin the RB guys in 1/4 mile times, and at a fraction of the cost it took in parts.

Vinnie, in the first place I understood your sentence , what you did not understand was your basing it on a theory of your own own conjecture. Some 4 cylinders do rev faster than a inline 6. The KA is not one of them. plus you have no actual experience with a RB. Where do you get the idea that a KAT puts out more bottom end power than a RB. Do you have comparitive dyno sheets of equally set up engines to prove it? I don't think so.
Where do you get your facts for KA guys spanking RB guys in the quarter mile? Hmmm I think you need to do a lot more reading. I do not see any 1000HP KA's running the quarter.Funny how there are 1000 hp Skylines.
People who setup their suspension for RB powered cars are using the same spring rates that most coilovers for our cars are sold with. No added expenses or differences there.
Also there is a KAT guy in this very thread who states the costs are the same not cheaper by going KAT. Again I think you base your arguement on your conjecture not backed up by real world experience.
I am not trying to convince you to spend any money here. I am just counterpointing your arguement with facts, based on my own real world experiences. I have run SR's I have run KA's, I own and run a RB , It did not cost 10k to setup. In fact I stated earlier in the thread the do it your self guy could get the clip for $2500 get a install kit for $1000 plus a pre wired harness for $300 that pretty much makes it a plug and play situation add another 1-2k for extras and your looking at $5500 do it yourself or $7500-8000 for a shop to do it for you. Not 10k and at that stated price you will be looking at close to if not 300WHP not crank but wheel HP.
Now I have experience behind all of this . Do you?

[BigVinnie]

Now I have experience behind all of this . Do you?

Well if you want to know about me here we go....
First off I've been building/rebuilding NAPS-z/KA for about 4 years... been building engines in general as a hobby since I was 19, I am now 26. I have prior knowledge and experience mostly with datsun 510's, and swapping in KA's and SR's (I'm mostly Old School). I do understand the power the KA produces and so do most of the people in this forum. Or else this wouldn't of been a thread to begin with.
There is no beef as you would think there is with me in this thread, and at some point in my life I would love to drive an RB powered car, personally my opinion is Nissan didn't design the silvia/240 that way, then maybe it shouldn't be.....
I defenitely don't oppose the power output that the RB makes, and at the same time you shouldn't discredit the engineering that goes into the KA either. There are plenty of guy's in the KAT forums that have presented slips of 600WHP KA's and reaching the mid to low 10seconds.... That which would be comparitive to a guy running boost on his RB. Although the worlds fastest 200sx with the RB26det is runnin a 8.98 in the 1/4mile, ( I have the VID just need to find it). Vision Boy productions isn't falling to far behind with there estimated 9second KADET either, (since they've already built one that hit's low 10's.)
As far as comparing PEAK Horse Power Output there is no denying, the RB having 2 additional cylinders will infact make more peak power, but that doesn't mean that you can't allow other engines (KA24 or even the SR22) to compete, especially since all engines make power at different points in the power band (RPM range). In all means of competition you can't just label a specific engine that it is the best suited for all applications, that just isn't the case with the RB, or for any engine for that matter.
I was implying that for the money @ about $3500 I can build a KA24det that can infact compete with an imported rb25det.
No question about it the KA parts are much cheaper, and I specialize in KA, I think I know what I'm talking about.............. RB has it's advantages, but as far as KA being a USDM and having parts readily available, I'de rather chose something that is an easy fix, rather than waiting on downtime for some parts for an RB.

[drift freaq]

Well if you want to know about me here we go....
First off I've been building/rebuilding NAPS-z/KA for about 4 years... been building engines in general as a hobby since I was 19, I am now 26. I have prior knowledge and experience mostly with datsun 510's, and swapping in KA's and SR's (I'm mostly Old School). I do understand the power the KA produces and so do most of the people in this forum. Or else this wouldn't of been a thread to begin with.
There is no beef as you would think there is with me in this thread, and at some point in my life I would love to drive an RB powered car, personally my opinion is Nissan didn't design the silvia/240 that way, then maybe it shouldn't be.....
I defenitely don't oppose the power output that the RB makes, and at the same time you shouldn't discredit the engineering that goes into the KA either. There are plenty of guy's in the KAT forums that have presented slips of 600WHP KA's and reaching the mid to low 10seconds.... That which would be comparitive to a guy running boost on his RB. Although the worlds fastest 200sx with the RB26det is runnin a 8.98 in the 1/4mile, ( I have the VID just need to find it). Vision Boy productions isn't falling to far behind with there estimated 9second KADET either, (since they've already built one that hit's low 10's.)
As far as comparing PEAK Horse Power Output there is no denying, the RB having 2 additional cylinders will infact make more peak power, but that doesn't mean that you can't allow other engines (KA24 or even the SR22) to compete, especially since all engines make power at different points in the power band (RPM range). In all means of competition you can't just label a specific engine that it is the best suited for all applications, that just isn't the case with the RB, or for any engine for that matter.
I was implying that for the money @ about $3500 I can build a KA24det that can infact compete with an imported rb25det.
No question about it the KA parts are much cheaper, and I specialize in KA, I think I know what I'm talking about.............. RB has it's advantages, but as far as KA being a USDM and having parts readily available, I'de rather chose something that is an easy fix, rather than waiting on downtime for some parts for an RB.
Well know your showing points of info about where your coming from. I should tell you I am not discounting the KA as an engine per se. Nor any other engine. This thread is a poll and thread based on the merits of one or the other though. I am on the side of the RB so I am going to back it. I have a vested interest in doing that.
This also does not mean I hate the KA or discount it. It only means I will point out, what I feel are its weak points and the superior points of the RB. In that sense all my points have been very factual and valid.
I also feel the engine compartment of the S13/S14 is very well suited to the 6 cylinder engine and it is not at all out of place there. Nissan did not put a 6 in the car due to the fact that it would have crowded the market for the Fairlady Z and the Skyline . Sure the Silvia and 180sx did not come with Sixes but the chassis was large enough and well designed enough to handle it.

For all your experience you made some bold statements not rooted in fact but in your belief and conjecture. I called you on these and you did not like it. I am sorry if you took it personally. To me it was a factual debate.
I guess since you took the position of KA and I took the position of RB we got to a point of assuming the other side preached the engine as a sole thing. I do not and have actually said in many threads claim the RB to end all.

On to a little background about me just so you know were I am coming from , funny indeed. I started with Datsun 510's in high school. I was part of Norcal 510 and UFO. I was responsible for the facts in Triple S engine articles in the newsletter. Yes I know Rex Jennett, though I have not talk to him in Years. I built my first pumped L16( 240z flattop pistons, Balanced bottom end, ported and polished 1800 head , Delong Cam,Triple S distrubutor , Weber 40DCOE sidedraft with Hooker headers, at the end of High school in Palo Alto. I also owned a Japanese engine and transmission business Sun Performance Imports. I sold Triple S engines as well as 2TG's and FJ20's among others. In the early eighties I moved on to 240z's. I have owned and played with 10 240z's. I went to De Anza Auto tech at the time I attended it was the third best Auto Technologies school in the nation. I have been involved with 240sx's for over 6 years now. Yes in the early Nineties I took a hiatus from the Automotive world . I am also in the Music Business. In the late nineties I returned to building and modding cars with the 240sx.Why you may ask, because its a world class , low cost sports car platform to start from. If you search here on Zilvia you will see the facts that uphold that statement, as I have stated them before. Do not let someone tell you otherwise our cars are some of the most underrated sports in the U.S. today.

I too have played with KA's as well as SR's . I prefer sixes, I have since the early eighties. Though again the facts I have reiterated throughout this thread are true .
You have been the only person who with no RB experience has taken it upon yourself to state things you know nothing about. The KA is a slow revving engine, if you have SR experience you know thats true. To use the KA's low revving , slow revving long stroke as arguement in favor of it shows you have really not checked out a RB yourself. To claim it makes more bottom end HP earlier on because of it shows your lack of RB experience.
Fact is the RB has an extremely broad flat torque and HP band. Much broader than a KA. There is a reason the RB line in Skylines got christened Godzilla.
To compare a KA to RB is actually a insult to a RB and if you told any Skyline owners that the KA was as good, they would have a real hard laugh and tell your crazy. I am more open minded, but I do agree with the Skyline owners. Overall stock for stock the RB is a vastly superior engine.
If you drove a RB I think you would eat your words on the KA for the sake of the silky smoothness of how they rev.There is no comparing a KA to it in this area, KA's just don't rev that way.

P.S. I think when you resorted to insults it severly weakened your arguement.
We are having a civil discussion and debate here, calling people names and deriding a persons sexual organs of which you know nothing of is immature.

[SimpleS14]

Good posts to most of you....lengthy, but good.

drift freq - A/C....is it possible to get it to work?

[drift freaq]

Good posts to most of you....lengthy, but good.

drift freq - A/C....is it possible to get it to work?
it is indeed. not really that hard either, main thing is you have to retain the fittings with the lines sticking off them on the RB AC compressor. We can wire the AC no problem. Once you take those fittings to a good AC that has a welder , they can then extend your stock lines to those fittings. I have done this with SR compressors its really not all that different.

[EchoOfSilence]

it is indeed. not really that hard either, main thing is you have to retain the fittings with the lines sticking off them on the RB AC compressor. We can wire the AC no problem. Once you take those fittings to a good AC that has a welder , they can then extend your stock lines to those fittings. I have done this with SR compressors its really not all that different.
When I go home to LA during my next break, can I get a ride in your car?? haha I'd love to be converted :hsdance:

[Tenchuu]

I was implying that for the money @ about $3500 I can build a KA24det that can infact compete with an imported rb25det.


link to the $3500 KAT complete kit (includeing ECU tune) producing 300+ WHP and this arguemt will bet better supported. no SS autocrome specials either. OEM quality.

[HolyShiznit]

Tenchu it can be done quite easily. All it consists of is a T3/T4 running around 12-14 psi, utilizing a JWT ECU. Really not that big of a deal but its more a matter of what shape the KA is in.


Also if it hadn't been the gay ass tuning charges I incurred prior to getting a JWT Ecu then yes for 3500 dollars I made 310 whp.

[BigVinnie]

utilizing a JWT ECU.

Actually I was thinking Mega Biki all the way.... Turn your OEM into a standalone for $300, you can't beat such a bargain..........
Leaves more room to buy better QUALITY parts for the KA......

OH wait did I also fail to mention that there is a fully counterweighed crank in the works for the KA??????? Guess not, all you suckers will have to wait for the truth...... Since I guess...... Nothing I say is truthful or factual....LOL

[drift freaq]

Actually I was thinking Mega Biki all the way.... Turn your OEM into a standalone for $300, you can't beat such a bargain..........
Leaves more room to buy better QUALITY parts for the KA......

OH wait did I also fail to mention that there is a fully counterweighed crank in the works for the KA??????? Guess not, all you suckers will have to wait for the truth...... Since I guess...... Nothing I say is truthful or factual....LOL
Vinnie , Vinnie , Vinnie , once again you take words out of context. man you seem to be defensive. I have really touched a nerve with you. hahhahhahha , read what I wrote carefully Vinnie.
What I said, is the arguements you were trying to give, to prove me wrong were not rooted in actual fact, just conjecture on your part. You seem to be pretty tweaked about it, since you have to find a way to ridicule the debate or I .
You have some knowledge Vinnie, but your not all knowing like you would like to think you are.
Tell you what Vinnie, why don't you just quit now , before you make yourelf look any worse.

[smokeybear]

ive done research on all the motor swaps, the RB is the best of the best. performance (redline, they have great, way better than a KA, even with a balanced crank) the aftermarket on the KA is tiny compared to the RB, most companies that make performance parts are not too interested in the KA. the weight of the RB is in the tranny, which is more to the center of the car than the front, not changing the driving dynamics very much at all. (your gonna pick up extra weight with your intercooler, turbo, lines, fittings, etc etc when you do a KA-T, maybe not 180 lbs as someone said earlier about the RB vs KA weight difference, but youll be picking up more weight just the same) the KA is an iron block, RB is aluminum. the cost of the KA build is comparable to how much a RB25det stock and installed (mount kit, DIY wiring, etc etc) id be more likely to do a sr20det build because of the aftermarket, but my dreams/plans are all RB powered.

[BigVinnie]

[QUOTE=drift freaq]You have some knowledge Vinnie, but your not all knowing like you would like to think you are.
[QUOTE]

Not one person in the forums is ALL knowledgable. The design of the forum was so that we can all bring what ever knowledge we do have and learn from it together. I understand that your opinion is that the KA is dogshit compared to RB, that is fine with me. I have always bet on the underdogs, and I don't have a problem with that. Guys that actually use there intellegence to build an underdog engine that can compete well should be praised and admired, for building something other than average. But if you read what you wrote, you were implying that I don't know any facts. So whatever...........

RB swap is instant gratification, kinda like masturbating. Any one can swap and be happy.
KA building is like having sex with a hot bitch, you remember the orgasm for a life time.........
That is the difference and that is why I entered the poll weither I drove an RB powered ride or not.....

[HolyShiznit]

Why would you use the Biki-rom? That would add so much time and pain in the ass to the KA-T set-up. We are talking about the easiest way to make HP. A JWT ECU would be cheaper, less problems. Because with the Biki rom you would have to also buy a wideband to tune it, OR go to a dyno. Either of which would put it well over the cost of a JWT ECU. Biki isn't a bad idea but in terms of n00b and cost effectiveness to 300whp it is a little excessive.

[drift freaq]

I understand that your opinion is that the KA is dogshit compared to RB, that is fine with me. I have always bet on the underdogs, and I don't have a problem with that. Guys that actually use there intellegence to build an underdog engine that can compete well should be praised and admired, for building something other than average. But if you read what you wrote, you were implying that I don't know any facts. So whatever...........

RB swap is instant gratification, kinda like masturbating. Any one can swap and be happy.
KA building is like having sex with a hot bitch, you remember the orgasm for a life time.........
That is the difference and that is why I entered the poll weither I drove an RB powered ride or not.....

once again Vinnie, you draw conjecture and result to using profanity to explain a position. I do not hate the KA, nor do I look on it as in your own words"dogshit". You would be putting words in my mouth at best if you were to say that. Do I feel the RB is superior yes. Does that make the KA dogshit? No, its has its place. Your own arguements, bringing out the KA's weaknesses, which you felt were actually strong points, is what made the KA look worse, than I had ever stated. I knew this stuff, but it was not the gist of the discussion.
To say that putting in a RB, is instant gratification is oversimplification at best.
Funny how you relate engine building to having sex, hahahhahhaha. Nothing sexy about building an engine. Do you build your girlfriend? hahhahhaha.
Plus a RB is a much sexier acronym for a girl than a KA would ever be from a tech standpoint . hahhahahhahha
Now driving a car with a hot engine can be like an orgasm and if we are going to use that analogy, than I can gurantee hands down the RB orgasm last s longers and feels better. I like girls that can keep on going. I guess you just don't have that kind of stamina. hahahhahhahhahaha :rofl:

[BigVinnie]

Why would you use the Biki-rom? That would add so much time and pain in the ass to the KA-T set-up. We are talking about the easiest way to make HP. A JWT ECU would be cheaper, less problems. Because with the Biki rom you would have to also buy a wideband to tune it, OR go to a dyno. Either of which would put it well over the cost of a JWT ECU. Biki isn't a bad idea but in terms of n00b and cost effectiveness to 300whp it is a little excessive.


I don't think you know how the new mega biki works.......
Besides JWT tunes cost $600.
You don't need a dyno tune, at the biki forums they have programs ready for use on the Mega Biki. JWT doesn't dyno before sending you there ecu do they????????? JWT ecu's usually run rich and you end up buying an SAFC to lean out anyways, it's just more equipment also. Shure tuning an ecu is a hassle, but a standalone that would cost you $1200~$2000, Mega biki offers as a unit to the OEM for $300. You can't beat that price.
Screw Jim Wolfe on any level too expensive by any means no matter how convenient.... Do you know DSM swapping???? For $200 (well maybe $300 depending on where you get it) in parts you can get a used ecu, 1G sensor, CAS, and wide band o2, it is self programming with knock input responce. KA guys are using these ecu's with no programming required to run upto 400CHP on stock internals (about 380WHP). I believe ABEL Racing is using these set up's. Pretty archaic with the wire splicing, but it does a good job.
In my personal opinion Jim Wolfe is a rip off, and there tunes run richer than leaner.

[SimpleS14]

Vinnie - Don't ruin this thread, your taking stuff out of context....its funny but yea :hahano:


I might go KA-T because I'm going to be more of a DIYer and I'm not looking for a high HP goal since traffic sucks and so do the cops in most areas around me. I can also pass visual emissions inspection with the KA unlike the RB (no EGR, etc.) Another factor is cost, if I was making just a tad bit more and lived in a more suitable area, I'd def go RB. Besides financial cost, there will be cost of downtime. I'm tight on available time and no matter how well I plan things I still have to give myself a cushion time and how I'm planning things out...I'll have more downtime with the RB25.


But remember....I might go KA-T. This is a good thread (and poll), thanks for the responses.

[Tenchuu]

it seems like this has turned into an opinion match between big vinnie and Drift freq. what has facutually been staed so far is:
~RB weighs more, but really isn't a big deal due to the balance of the weight
~RB is more expensive than a DIY KA-t but less expensive than a KA-T kit
~more factory replacement parts/easier to get parts for the KA-T
~More aftermarked parts, but harder to get for the RB
~both can be built up to a reasonable level, but KA-Ts have not had eough support/time in he tuneing scene to tun into the 1000+HP dyno queens that the RBs have, witch means nothing to us drivrs that drive daily for fun.

and that is about this whole thread. did i leave any facts out???

[drift freaq]

it seems like this has turned into an opinion match between big vinnie and Drift freq. what has facutually been staed so far is:
~RB weighs more, but really isn't a big deal due to the balance of the weight
~RB is more expensive than a DIY KA-t but less expensive than a KA-T kit
~more factory replacement parts/easier to get parts for the KA-T
~More aftermarked parts, but harder to get for the RB
~both can be built up to a reasonable level, but KA-Ts have not had eough support/time in he tuneing scene to tun into the 1000+HP dyno queens that the RBs have, witch means nothing to us drivrs that drive daily for fun.

and that is about this whole thread. did i leave any facts out???

It has only turned into a opinion match, because big vinnie decided to take it that way by posting conjecture as facts. Of course me stating this once again is sure to piss him off. hahhahhahha, but its true.

Fact is for a nice smooth torque machine that can turn in good mileage at low boost the RB cannot be beat.
Fact, I have driven down the street in a 35 mph zone in 5th gear!! revving at 2k!!! The engine was not lugging, in fact if I hit the gas it would just pull.
That spells excellent gas mileage for a 6 cylinder.
Panges, has reported 20 miles to the gallon city driving at 4lbs boost with his RB25 Neo.
If a person is looking for a nice 250whp engine with those mileage figures it can be done for roughly $2500 for the clip $1000 for the install kit $300 for wiring =$3800 plus extras add $1000 for cushion. Mind you Panges is running sidemount not FMIC like me. Nor is he using a Greddy Intake Manifold.
This is doing the install yourself not paying someone to do it.
I have taken people for drives in my car and the first thing they say is wow its really smooth . They are totally expecting a crazy wheel burning machine the minute I let out the clutch.
Fact is, it can be that way, if I wind it up and dump the clutch , but it can also be a completely quite civilized beast, that the cops will not even hear.
I passed no less than 6 cop cars on test runs in Torrance, they never looked at me . Try that with a KAT or SR.

[BigVinnie]

It has only turned into a opinion match, because big vinnie decided to take it that way by posting conjecture as facts. Of course me stating this once again is sure to piss him off. hahhahhahha, but its true.



Actually your not pissing me off. I'm laughing on the other side of this monitor...
You look like a jerk to everyone else........ Overall a good thread, over the bickering and B.S.......

[drift freaq]

Actually your not pissing me off. I'm laughing on the other side of this monitor...
You look like a jerk to everyone else........ Overall a good thread, over the bickering and B.S.......
actually Vinnie , you look like the jerk , you have cussed you have made unfactual posts, you have resorted to trying to insult me. I have not done that in the whole thread. HHHHMMM that looks and sounds like your the jerk and you know what thats what people have been saying to me. Plus you are bickering and spouting B.S, not I .

[Tenchuu]

still waiting for that link to the 3500 complete kit ( to in clude a 1 peice lighter driveshaft and better mounts that you are getting in the 1K included in the RB swap. all i want is facts because i am debating these 2 myself but all the 300+WHP KA kits i saw were 4K + tuneing

[Phlip]

(I AM A TOPIC) <--- please stick to this.

This is a poll, please keep this poll to a simple vote, then you will comment on the merits of one engine versus the other. This will not, any further, become a blanket statement of opinion or insult of any individual's sexual ability or preference, lest I will delete posts and pink people if it continues.
Try me, I have had a rough week

[drift freaq]

well I have stated facts. I have nothing more to say.

[BigVinnie]

actually Vinnie , you look like the jerk , you have cussed you have made unfactual posts, you have resorted to trying to insult me. I have not done that in the whole thread. HHHHMMM that looks and sounds like your the jerk and you know what thats what people have been saying to me. Plus you are bickering and spouting B.S, not I .

What age are you again resorting to my level then, like I said I'm 26. You have been into inline sixies since the 80's. Why are you pickin on younger guy's. Ever hear the expression.... Pick on someone your own size, (it should be your own age).......LOL
What do you resort too, when I present the foul mouth.....LOL....

[BigVinnie]

(I AM A TOPIC) <--- please stick to this.

This is a poll, please keep this poll to a simple vote, then you will comment on the merits of one engine versus the other. This will not, any further, become a blanket statement of opinion or insult of any individual's sexual ability or preference, lest I will delete posts and pink people if it continues.
Try me, I have had a rough week

I agree you should close this thread when people older than me act like fools as well....

[BigVinnie]

still waiting for that link to the 3500 complete kit ( to in clude a 1 peice lighter driveshaft and better mounts that you are getting in the 1K included in the RB swap. all i want is facts because i am debating these 2 myself but all the 300+WHP KA kits i saw were 4K + tuneing

Research..........
Good parts don't come in a (kit) I presented this info to you in another forum....

[SimpleS14]

Vinnie - W.T.F mate?

Phlip - Please don't lock this thread, but delete post if needed.

[Phlip]

I agree you should close this thread when people older than me act like fools as well....
Vinnie, I was talking to you as too, my suggestion is that EVERYONE back it off with the personal attacks and bickering in this thread, because my decision has been made to not lock the thread, but I am full willing to read back through every post in the thread and pink the first combatant in this pissing contest for a month, if the arguing continues, I promise to do it.

[brunswick240]

great thread, great arguments, and great facts/whatever everything else was...now i dont know which one to go with lol helped me out a lot :)

[BigVinnie]

HAHA the votes are tied!!!!!

[andrewmp6]

vote isnt tied anymore im gonna run a rb just to be different besides i could build my own rb30det or even a rb30dett cheap rb30 blocks are like 200 us in aus just slap on a rb25 or rb26 head and have a torque monter

[ONYX S-13]

I picked Built KA just cause parts wouldn't be that expensive or hard to find compared to the RB.

[meangreen240]

i just sold my 97 ka-t and it was making 263 whp on 9lbs of boost, you can read about it in the archives section at www.projectcarmagazine.com if you want more info. it was pretty damn fast but it was like an on off switch very lttle drivability if your daily driving. all i can say is i sold it and am now having jgy put a rb25det into my 90 coupe, and im shure with what they are doing to it, i.e manifold,downpipe,exhuast,boost controller,front mount,throttle body. that it will easily out perform my old kat no problem.

[Nofinelines]

Hi, i know i'm not part of this discussion but listening to you all made me think about the rb engine. previously i wanted to turbo my ka-e in my 90 coupe for reasons of ac and p/s and to keep it close to stock for longevity without going to crazy modifying. planning on the jgs turbo kit for around 300hp with final cost of around 4k. (not rich) which route would be better keeping p/s and a/c option 1) ka24et. or option 2)almighty RB? i love my ka, easy to work on curious about RB's(no experience). have a friend with is300 and love the smootheness of inline 6's. will be doing more research about rb swaps but just curious on all of your opinions.

[fullthrottlehpower]

um, well if you have lots of money like 6k then do the rb25det if you have more like 2k then turbo the ka-t or just save up and get the beast.

[lucky7]

believe me man. once you get on a roll buying/replacing parts for an RB. your total is WAY more than 6k.

[drift freaq]

believe me man. once you get on a roll buying/replacing parts for an RB. your total is WAY more than 6k.
you should not need to replace or buy a bunch. If your going stock install. then your looking at $2500 for a clip $1100 install kit and $335-375 for wiring. plus a extra 1k for misc. Now if you pay someone to install it you can add another $1500-2k. Now yes if you stick the Greddy intake on and go front mount it will cost more. Though those are upgrades and those kind of things will increase the price of the KAT as well.

[az_240]

As far as KA-T vs RB25 I think it just depends on your position in life.

I plan on starting out with KA-T since I already own a KA and I want to get the basics down before diving into an RB install... My car is a 97 240sx so im not sure how I would be able to pass emissions being OBDII having an RB. I know it can be done with the KA-T. Also im a poor college student so I simply dont have the money to go RB. A mostly stock KA-T should be able to achieve 250rwhp without dropping too much dough.
I plan on getting an RB25 when I get a real job.
If money was not an issue RB25 vs built KA-T... RB25 hands down

[mhsz34]

anybody on the east coast in NY with an RB?

[onesickskyline]

yeah if you have the money go for the rb, DUH lol

[azndummie]

ka't are cheaper while rb25 is pretty crazy and probably better stock, id probably do a ka't just becuase im a cheapass

[ViZion Zs]

forget them both. ka sucks plain and simple. its not made for performance even if you throw a turbo on it.. just get over it. you would go turbo a nissan truck would you? why? just to do it? lame.. its just not relialbe wihtout major building.. for what spend a buncha money on a built block? the sr will cost the same. rb.. nice .. heavy. difficult to maintain.. too hard of an install for the average shadetree mechnic or noob in general. mounts are expensive to do it RIGHT, i dunno personal preference.. just keep it KA if it your daily and just throw some light mods on it.. whatever use different motors.. my car is more of a touge grip car so iwnet with CA beter revs. more responsive.. cheap, easy to get parts megasquirt friendly! plus it doesnt yell at cops HEY IM AN SR20 and you can technically play it off as a 200sx turbo motor.. i dunno its all personal or (FANBOY) choice.

[insanequickness]

what kind of question is this?
duh RB25DET plain and simple.

your question is 6k on swap or 2500 for a nice ka-t build

[lucky7]

you should not need to replace or buy a bunch. If your going stock install. then your looking at $2500 for a clip $1100 install kit and $335-375 for wiring. plus a extra 1k for misc. Now if you pay someone to install it you can add another $1500-2k. Now yes if you stick the Greddy intake on and go front mount it will cost more. Though those are upgrades and those kind of things will increase the price of the KAT as well.

thats true, but myself. i couldnt for some reason have stock.

[Destructo]

Im just gonna drop my 2 cents cause hell i got both, and all i got to say is ive complete negilected my Ka s13 ever since i got my rb s14 kicking. But i will agree its all about whats in your Budget. If i could do it all over again i would have never dumped any money into my KA.

[idiot goes sideways]

ive no experience with both engines but,
what i belive is basicly that you need about 4 to 6k for 300whp+ with BOTH, rb and ka.
If you want a ka performe nearly like a rb you need the same amount of money (probaly even more),
sorry but thats my option

that brings us to the point, wich would you take?

6pot vs. 4pot???
2,5litre vs. 2,4litre????
more rev. vs. less rev.?????

NOT TO MENTION THAT DAMN FUCKING SCREAMING BAD ASS
6 POT SOUND OF A RB ENGINE!!
only for this i would spend more bugs.......IM SERIOUS!

one of japanese hottest race engine built until now vs. a boosted ka...
(are you serious?)

thats how i see this.

p.s. i think there both heavy in the front so it doesn`t matter anyway

sorry i never drove any of these engines, but im still dreaming about an rb...........................

sorry for my bad english

[Tenchuu]

you do realize that this thread was started 2 years ago everyone right?

[fohahz]

RB's are monsters. Go KA if money plays a factor in your build

[S14DB]

you do realize that this thread was started 2 years ago everyone right?
Doesn't look like it...