Is this the real J-spec Integra type-R

[luey02]

http://communities.msn.com/Lucious....toID=11 (http://communities.msn.com/LuciousLips/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=11)
http://communities.msn.com/Lucious....toID=12 (http://communities.msn.com/LuciousLips/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=12)
http://communities.msn.com/Lucious....toID=13 (http://communities.msn.com/LuciousLips/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=13)

This car is parked outside my office and everything looks like stock type R.  It has embroidered seats and other interior features..  no pics on interior cuz can't take pics thru glass.  
can anyone confirm this??

[sspikey]

its lhd!

[AceInHole]

The ITR has been available in the US for a while.... at first in very limited production, although after a while I think they started making more.  
In Japan, the ITR is made by Honda, and it would be RHD, as has already been stated (vaguely).

[luey02]

oops.. why didn't I think of that rhd thing..

[boosteds14]

i have been a fan for type-r since 97 so i know them like the back of my hand:

usdm because:
not lhd
rims are not jdm
headlights are not jdm
exhaust tip needs to be a little bigger
the bumper and fenders are not jdm

[twofortysx]

It is a USDM Type-R.  The Type-R first came across in 1997. It was available in 97 and 98 in "Championship White" and was the only car that came in this variation of white.  It's effing beautiful.  The Type-R came back in 2000, 2001 in two colors: Phoenix Yellow and a Pearl Black.  The motor and outputs always stayed the same, the '00/'01 models were a bit more refined because unlike the '97/'98 models they came with power windows/doors, A/C and I think a sunroof too.  

The Type-R is a sweet car but there is too much theft on them, and consequently the insurance is far too expensive.

[AceInHole]

yeah... the original ITR is a true track car.  Who the hell needs A/C and power accessories anyways???  If only Nissan caught on.....

[saga240]

was there ever a sunroof in a type R?.. no way.. i dont think so..  right?..

[boosteds14]

there was never a sunroof in any type-r

[twofortysx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (twofortysx @ Mar. 07 2002,10:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">.....and I think a sunroof too. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I wasn't sure, that's why I said "I think..."

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (AceInHole @ Mar. 07 2002,1:14)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">yeah... the original ITR is a true track car. Who the hell needs A/C and power accessories anyways??? If only Nissan caught on.....</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Don't tell Honda that the ITR was a track car... they'll void your warranty &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/nervous.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':nervous:'>

It's a nice minimalist car, to be sure (although not as minimalist in USDM trim). &nbsp;It handles superbly and is reasonably fast (for an NA 1.8) - but I never think of it as a factory race car or anything like that. &nbsp;And it is not. &nbsp;At the same price, I would have taken it over the same year 240sx, but honestly, if I lived in a country with the option, I'd take an s14 K's any day.

[Ni5mo180SX]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HippoSleek @ Mar. 06 2002,4:00)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (AceInHole @ Mar. 07 2002,1:14)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">yeah... the original ITR is a true track car. Who the hell needs A/C and power accessories anyways??? If only Nissan caught on.....</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Don't tell Honda that the ITR was a track car... they'll void your warranty <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/nervous.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':nervous:'>

It's a nice minimalist car, to be sure (although not as minimalist in USDM trim). It handles superbly and is reasonably fast (for an NA 1.8) - but I never think of it as a factory race car or anything like that. And it is not. At the same price, I would have taken it over the same year 240sx, but honestly, if I lived in a country with the option, I'd take an s14 K's any day.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
What is your interpretation of "factory race car". I think the ITR was one of the best factory track cars sold in the US for its price range. Ever been to an SCCA event and noticed how many ITR's are there? Its for a reason.

[AceInHole]

LoL.... if the ITR isn't as "race ready" as it gets from the factory.... I'm not quite sure what is....
(Aside from maybe the old S13 Silvia J's Race Spec{?? I remember seeing something like this??) which I recall being a stripped S13 Silvia with an SR20DET.... &nbsp;)

[AmericanBornSilvia]

Actually, in Japan, the NSX Type-R is completely stripped (No A.C. etc IIRC.) as well as some of the other Type-R's The newest one should have a crapload of Carbonfiber parts. Blah, not that it should matter, prolly we wont ever see one here stateside.

Edit: Omg I still cant believe I'm a n00b. &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'>

[Tuck&Poke]

the usdm itr has only 195 becaues of emissions regulations. &nbsp;my friend has one in yellow. &nbsp;that thing books. &nbsp;we hit 150 in it once. &nbsp;we gtech'ed it at 174hp at the wheels with minor mods

[HippoSleek]

Like I said, I think the ITR is a great out of the box car - but factory race car or race ready are not terms I would apply to it. &nbsp;I agree that in the US, for its price it is as much fun as you can probably buy. &nbsp;But it's NOT a race car by any strech! &nbsp;

My first line is a true story - I know a guy who tracked his ITR, his LSD broke in the warranty period, he took it to the shop, they denied coverage, AND they called American Honda and voided his warranty nationwide <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('> &nbsp;If you track the car (he didn't even compete, just competition schools) Honda will not cover ANY problems with the car under warranty).

Is that what a company does with its race cars? &nbsp;NO! &nbsp;Does it meet SCCA specs out of the box? &nbsp;NO! &nbsp;Comparatively, does it need any less equipment to be put into competitive racing than any other car? &nbsp;NO! &nbsp;Is it the fastest? &nbsp;NO! &nbsp;Stiffest? &nbsp;NO! &nbsp;My point is that it is not race ready or anything else like that - or no more so than many other cars.

I'm not trying to take anything away from the ITR - like I said, it is probably the most fun new car for the money in the US, BUT it is NOT A RACE CAR or race ready or anything like that. &nbsp;It's just a good handling quick car. &nbsp;It will still lose to many faster cars on course (given equal drivers). &nbsp;And yes, I've been to one or two track events &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/dozingoff.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':zzz:'> &nbsp; The last one I was at had 21 ITRs in a roughly 120 car field. &nbsp;So? &nbsp;There are still just as many Miatas and nearly as many c5's... doesn't make them factory race cars either.

[Grant]

I would take the S15 over the type-r but you have to hand it to them.In a best motoring video I saw back in 99, the type-r put up a hell of a fight on the track against the s15. i think it held first place until the last lap, where the s15 overtook it and won. unfortunately the s14 did not beat the type-r.

[XylathaneGTR]

Type R's? only in Japan?
its a USDM Type R.
Way shittier then a JDM one,
Some of the main differences are small Engine Diffs, the Lights, and the Seats (those 1,800 dolla each recaros are SOOOOO sexy)
that ones a 2001...
I wanted a 98, Those baby's are so...perfect, for a fwd, its the best money can buy...maybe an fto gpx too...
I would rather have an s15/hybrid s14 over a Type R,
And if my current plan of buying a 98 240 don't work out right, im getting Type R. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>
I loved type R's...altho the engine isin't that great for Turboing, its still an amazing car...

[Takumi]

Integra Type R = hottest car for fools to steal

Those things get stolen once ever week and there's always some dude online sharing his/her sob story about their rides getting messed with or stolen. Integra Type R is a nice car, but it's too much riceboy eye candy that owning it is asking for trouble. &nbsp;damn, people just can't have nice things and nice rides these days without some haters messing with it. =/

[Ni5mo180SX]

Ok, so you're using your one friend as an example for all ITR warrenty cases?? If one example changes everything then heres one for you. My friend blew the motor on his ITR when he misshifted and Acura had a new motor in there in about a week and a half. Big deal, its just a case by case thing. Does it meet SCCA specs? you said no, but SCCAs has many different series you can compete in, ever heard of showroom stock?? Is it the stiffest, fastest, most equipment? Thats not the point, its very well rounded in all catagories, and THATS what makes a great race car, not dominating in one area. And im just curious about this one, what car meets your strict regulations as a factory racer? Fact of the matter is the ITR is an excellent track car from the factory and im sure a majority of us here will agree on that point. And USDM is way shittier huh? Based on your points its way shittier because of
A) small engine differences
B) the lights (OMG!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>
C) the seats
Doesnt seem to really make a difference to the actual car, does it? As far as I know, the only engine diff's are the exhaust manifold, higher comp. pistons in Japan, and some ECU tweaking to meet US smog standards. If this alone makes the car shittier from the US version, I wonder how you'd describe the difference between JDM 240 and USDM 240?

[Tuck&Poke]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Ni5mo180SX @ Mar. 07 2002,7:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ok, so you're using your one friend as an example for all ITR warrenty cases?? If one example changes everything then heres one for you. My friend blew the motor on his ITR when he misshifted and Acura had a new motor in there in about a week and a half. Big deal, its just a case by case thing. Does it meet SCCA specs? you said no, but SCCAs has many different series you can compete in, ever heard of showroom stock?? Is it the stiffest, fastest, most equipment? Thats not the point, its very well rounded in all catagories, and THATS what makes a great race car, not dominating in one area. And im just curious about this one, what car meets your strict regulations as a factory racer? Fact of the matter is the ITR is an excellent track car from the factory and im sure a majority of us here will agree on that point. And USDM is way shittier huh? Based on your points its way shittier because of
A) small engine differences
B) the lights (OMG!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>
C) the seats
Doesnt seem to really make a difference to the actual car, does it? As far as I know, the only engine diff's are the exhaust manifold, higher comp. pistons in Japan, and some ECU tweaking to meet US smog standards. If this alone makes the car shittier from the US version, I wonder how you'd describe the difference between JDM 240 and USDM 240?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
no just cat. differences. &nbsp;we got the more potent ones. &nbsp;and yeh the only difference is front and rear bumpers (5mph unlike japan) and the seats. &nbsp;no major engine changes like diff. compression. &nbsp;fast car though. pulls like .88g's on verticle accelaration. &nbsp;we beat an old school supra with my "superior" driving skills.

[Ni5mo180SX]

The compression is different between US and JDM models. They have higher octane fuel in Japan so they could go with higher comp. and had to lower it when it was brought here to prevent knocking. Im also fairly sure the exhaust manifold on the ITR is different between USDM and JDM models.

[Tuck&Poke]

whats the difference cause im pretty sure usdm has like 10.5:1 and wouldnt rasing it give a lot more hp?

[XylathaneGTR]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Ni5mo180SX @ Mar. 07 2002,7:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ok, so you're using your one friend as an example for all ITR warrenty cases?? If one example changes everything then heres one for you. My friend blew the motor on his ITR when he misshifted and Acura had a new motor in there in about a week and a half. Big deal, its just a case by case thing. Does it meet SCCA specs? you said no, but SCCAs has many different series you can compete in, ever heard of showroom stock?? Is it the stiffest, fastest, most equipment? Thats not the point, its very well rounded in all catagories, and THATS what makes a great race car, not dominating in one area. And im just curious about this one, what car meets your strict regulations as a factory racer? Fact of the matter is the ITR is an excellent track car from the factory and im sure a majority of us here will agree on that point. And USDM is way shittier huh? Based on your points its way shittier because of
A) small engine differences
B) the lights (OMG!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>
C) the seats
Doesnt seem to really make a difference to the actual car, does it? As far as I know, the only engine diff's are the exhaust manifold, higher comp. pistons in Japan, and some ECU tweaking to meet US smog standards. If this alone makes the car shittier from the US version, I wonder how you'd describe the difference between JDM 240 and USDM 240?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
lol, sorry
I got your point...what i said is riceboyish, and i take it back <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('>
No, the USDM Type R is NOT shittier, Cause i would kill to have either of them, seriously...
Altho i want an s14 now more then ever, a sexy Type R is a close second.
But yeah...sry about saying a USDM tR is shittier cause of lights, small engine diffs, and the seats,

[XylathaneGTR]

the USDM spec b18c5 does have 10:5:1 as i know...
Pumping out 195 hp from a 1.8L is damn good...108.51 to be exact...
raising it any higher would have significant strain on the engine, and cause a lot of damage to it, if not blowing it.
thats why a b18c5 is not the best engine for Turbocharging, Nitros injections, or high psi supercharging amounts.
the b18c1 (integra GS-R) has lower compression ratios, making it more popular for forced induction, and a popular Civic Swap <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

[Ni5mo180SX]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (minime686 @ Mar. 06 2002,9:06)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">whats the difference cause im pretty sure usdm has like 10.5:1 and wouldnt rasing it give a lot more hp?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yea USDM's is 10:5 I think, but JDMs is higher. Raising it alone wont give it huge power but would give it a bit more power and make the engine seemingly more responsive.

[Ni5mo180SX]

ha, its ok GTR, I just thought you were taking Hippos position on it and attacking the ITR for no reason.

[jdm togue]

It is a USDM Type R <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>

[Tuck&Poke]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (XylathaneGTR @ Mar. 07 2002,8:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">the USDM spec b18c5 does have 10:5:1 as i know...
Pumping out 195 hp from a 1.8L is damn good...108.51 to be exact...
raising it any higher would have significant strain on the engine, and cause a lot of damage to it, if not blowing it.
thats why a b18c5 is not the best engine for Turbocharging, Nitros injections, or high psi supercharging amounts.
the b18c1 (integra GS-R) has lower compression ratios, making it more popular for forced induction, and a popular Civic Swap <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
yeh you deff. gotta get new pistons but the good thing is that since theyre factory forged you can boost like 10psi max on stock internals. &nbsp;my friend with the itr got a turbo kit and hes gonna boost 8 on stock internals. &nbsp;even the gsr has high compression 10.0:1 i think is the number or it could be 9.8:1 not quite sure now

[XylathaneGTR]

attacking type R for no reason? DUDE I LOVE TYPE R's...
Every time i see one...shit its orgasmic...
Once, i saw one with the nicest lowering ever...it was a sunny day, i was in parents Lexus, getting a ride down to my friends house, and i see it comming down a hill...A white one, 99 (500 99's were released in CANADA only...ahhahaha) it had some massive interior work done, u could hear it from across the street in my parents car...
i literally told my dad, who was driving, to pull over so i could gock at the car...
Unfourtnatly, type R's are way to expensive...
28k Canadian for a 98 with 15k kilometers on it? damn...that's a lot yo...and think of the insurance.
The GSR does have some high compression too, but it can handle induction better then a b18c5 can...b18c5 is best run Naturally Asperated, altho it can take mods like Turbo and Nitroz, its not meant for it.
heh, the other day...i saw this like, Old civic hatchback, not the newer ones, the OLD kind, whats on it? 'CIVIC TYPE R.' so sad...hehe
But seriously tho...I wuv type R's with all my heart...i wuv a silvia more...but damn, Type Rs are still amazing.

[Ni5mo180SX]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (XylathaneGTR @ Mar. 07 2002,01:26)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">attacking type R for no reason? DUDE I LOVE TYPE R's...
Every time i see one...shit its orgasmic...
Once, i saw one with the nicest lowering ever...it was a sunny day, i was in parents Lexus, getting a ride down to my friends house, and i see it comming down a hill...A white one, 99 (500 99's were released in CANADA only...ahhahaha) it had some massive interior work done, u could hear it from across the street in my parents car...
i literally told my dad, who was driving, to pull over so i could gock at the car...
Unfourtnatly, type R's are way to expensive...
28k Canadian for a 98 with 15k kilometers on it? damn...that's a lot yo...and think of the insurance.
The GSR does have some high compression too, but it can handle induction better then a b18c5 can...b18c5 is best run Naturally Asperated, altho it can take mods like Turbo and Nitroz, its not meant for it.
heh, the other day...i saw this like, Old civic hatchback, not the newer ones, the OLD kind, whats on it? 'CIVIC TYPE R.' so sad...hehe
But seriously tho...I wuv type R's with all my heart...i wuv a silvia more...but damn, Type Rs are still amazing.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yea having my 240 at the "all motor" level that it was, I see now what all the fuss about NA is. Its sick when your NA car is passing by some dudes turbo car while its turbo is spinning its heart out. The Type-R (DC2) I think was an excellent example of FF/NA (if not the best) and think it would be lame to see that car not get its due credit.

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Ni5mo180SX @ Mar. 07 2002,7:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ok, so you're using your one friend as an example for all ITR warrenty cases?? If one example changes everything then heres one for you. My friend blew the motor on his ITR when he misshifted and Acura had a new motor in there in about a week and a half. Big deal, its just a case by case thing. Does it meet SCCA specs? you said no, but SCCAs has many different series you can compete in, ever heard of showroom stock?? Is it the stiffest, fastest, most equipment? Thats not the point, its very well rounded in all catagories, and THATS what makes a great race car, not dominating in one area. And im just curious about this one, what car meets your strict regulations as a factory racer? Fact of the matter is the ITR is an excellent track car from the factory and im sure a majority of us here will agree on that point. And USDM is way shittier huh? Based on your points its way shittier because of
A) small engine differences
B) the lights (OMG!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>
C) the seats
Doesnt seem to really make a difference to the actual car, does it? As far as I know, the only engine diff's are the exhaust manifold, higher comp. pistons in Japan, and some ECU tweaking to meet US smog standards. If this alone makes the car shittier from the US version, I wonder how you'd describe the difference between JDM 240 and USDM 240?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Ni5mo - I think you've got me all wrong. &nbsp;Like I said, I appreciate the ITR and agree it is the best value for the money. &nbsp;MY POINT is that it is NOT A FACTORY RACE CAR!! &nbsp;

1) &nbsp;Warranty issue: &nbsp;the dealer and H-America said that any use of the car in (I forget the exact words) *off road events* voids the warranty. &nbsp;PERIOD. &nbsp;It is not a case by case basis, it is if they catch you. &nbsp;Bad shifts are not off road events and have nothing to do with racing. &nbsp;Being unaware of the warranty exclusion provision, this individual happened to have his logbook in the console - which they *accidentally* opened. &nbsp;The tech who found the book (who I am familiar with) mentioned it to the writer, who mentioned it to the manager, who called Mid-Atl. regional, and finally national... just to make sure that there was no where in the country the car could be repaired under warranty. &nbsp;That is systematic - not case by case. &nbsp;If it were sold as a RACE CAR, there would be no voiding of warranties for using it as such.

2) &nbsp;SCCA specs: &nbsp;http://www.scca.org/amateur/club_racing/classes/
Does the ITR come with a rollcage and associated safety equipment? &nbsp;NO! &nbsp;I also agree that no mass produced car does. &nbsp;Again, the point is not that the ITR is not a great car, just that it is NOT A RACE CAR. &nbsp;(BTW: the ITR is NOT ELIGIBLE for SSB!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>

3) &nbsp;Stiffest/fastest/etc. - ITR is a well rounded, great car, especially for the money. &nbsp;I'd still rather have an M3, c5, etc. &nbsp;(even a 240 w/ more power b/c of RWD). &nbsp;Each of these cars, ITR included, is capable of being a great track car - given certain upgrades. &nbsp;Why? -like you said, because they are well rounded. &nbsp;You will note there are no Mustangs on here - just cars that have great balance and prowess. &nbsp;However, being a balanced, capable car does NOT mean it is a RACE CAR. &nbsp;With the exception of cars produced by a manufacturer with the sole purpose of being used for racing, I don't think there is any such thing as a factory racer. &nbsp;Race cars are built by teams/drivers.

Agian, with the hopes that you get it - I really like the ITR! &nbsp;I think it is the best FWD car made. &nbsp;I have nothing but respect for those that track their ITRs - these people are among my friends. &nbsp;BUT, I hate it when people claim its a race car! &nbsp;It's not. &nbsp;It's a street car - it performs well on a track, along with a host of other cars that no one would dare call race cars (an M5 will roll an ITR - race car?). &nbsp;Now, if you were to say that the ITR is as close as you can get to a race car for the money, I'd agree. &nbsp;But no matter what else, it begins as a street car.

And yes, the exhaust manifold is different - larger, differently crafted collector. &nbsp;Yes, too on the pistons (b/c of dirty US gas).

[Tuck&Poke]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HippoSleek @ Mar. 08 2002,09:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ni5mo - I think you've got me all wrong. Like I said, I appreciate the ITR and agree it is the best value for the money. MY POINT is that it is NOT A FACTORY RACE CAR!!

1) Warranty issue: the dealer and H-America said that any use of the car in (I forget the exact words) *off road events* voids the warranty. PERIOD. It is not a case by case basis, it is if they catch you. Bad shifts are not off road events and have nothing to do with racing. Being unaware of the warranty exclusion provision, this individual happened to have his logbook in the console - which they *accidentally* opened. The tech who found the book (who I am familiar with) mentioned it to the writer, who mentioned it to the manager, who called Mid-Atl. regional, and finally national... just to make sure that there was no where in the country the car could be repaired under warranty. That is systematic - not case by case. If it were sold as a RACE CAR, there would be no voiding of warranties for using it as such.

2) SCCA specs: http://www.scca.org/amateur/club_racing/classes/
Does the ITR come with a rollcage and associated safety equipment? NO! I also agree that no mass produced car does. Again, the point is not that the ITR is not a great car, just that it is NOT A RACE CAR. (BTW: the ITR is NOT ELIGIBLE for SSB!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>

3) Stiffest/fastest/etc. - ITR is a well rounded, great car, especially for the money. I'd still rather have an M3, c5, etc. (even a 240 w/ more power b/c of RWD). Each of these cars, ITR included, is capable of being a great track car - given certain upgrades. Why? -like you said, because they are well rounded. You will note there are no Mustangs on here - just cars that have great balance and prowess. However, being a balanced, capable car does NOT mean it is a RACE CAR. With the exception of cars produced by a manufacturer with the sole purpose of being used for racing, I don't think there is any such thing as a factory racer. Race cars are built by teams/drivers.

Agian, with the hopes that you get it - I really like the ITR! I think it is the best FWD car made. I have nothing but respect for those that track their ITRs - these people are among my friends. BUT, I hate it when people claim its a race car! It's not. It's a street car - it performs well on a track, along with a host of other cars that no one would dare call race cars (an M5 will roll an ITR - race car?). Now, if you were to say that the ITR is as close as you can get to a race car for the money, I'd agree. But no matter what else, it begins as a street car.

And yes, the exhaust manifold is different - larger, differently crafted collector. Yes, too on the pistons (b/c of dirty US gas).</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
just cause it doesnt have a roll cage and cause of the warranty your gonna say its not a track car? &nbsp;i would classify it was a track car/daily driver. &nbsp;like the kind of car you can go race in and then drive it home to go to work tomorrow morning. &nbsp;but there are factory racers though. &nbsp;i mean its not like there arent ANY. &nbsp;M3 GTR, Mercedes CLK-GTR, Porsche GT-1. &nbsp;obviously they are cars we will never own. &nbsp;if you look at all track cars...no let me put that a diff way. &nbsp;if you look at other cars that are on the track racing they are modified. &nbsp;most of them have just a roll cage if not all because scca doesnt want the cars to be modified to race. IMO the itr is a track car and really theres no right and wrong. &nbsp;its how you interpret it

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (minime686 @ Mar. 08 2002,10:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">just cause it doesnt have a roll cage and cause of the warranty your gonna say its not a track car? i would classify it was a track car/daily driver. like the kind of car you can go race in and then drive it home to go to work tomorrow morning. but there are factory racers though. i mean its not like there arent ANY. M3 GTR, Mercedes CLK-GTR, Porsche GT-1. obviously they are cars we will never own. if you look at all track cars...no let me put that a diff way. if you look at other cars that are on the track racing they are modified. most of them have just a roll cage if not all because scca doesnt want the cars to be modified to race. IMO the itr is a track car and really theres no right and wrong. its how you interpret it</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
First, all cars that are on the track racing MUST have a roll cage. &nbsp;I know of no sanctioning body that will allow wheel-to-wheel racing w/o a cage. &nbsp;You may do time trials or track days w/o one.

I agree there ARE track cars, but also agree they were not mass produced and widely available (note b/c BMW didn't sell any M3 GTRs as required, they are no longer eligable for that series), and irrelevant to this. &nbsp;But never say never &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'> on ownership!

Finally, any car can go on the track for a time trial or a track day -cage or no. &nbsp;Some are highly modified, others not at all. &nbsp;I've seen rent-a-cars at track days (his regular race car was broken). &nbsp;Both uuninja and myself have put our basically bone stock 240s on the track for these - drove them down, ran, drove them home, drove them to work the next day. &nbsp;During our runs we both passed and were passed by ITRs.

I agree it is something of a matter of perception, when I hear "race car" or "track car" I think of a car that is able to be raced, as is. &nbsp;That the ITR is not and cannot be. &nbsp;(A stock ITR will cook the factory pads and boil the fluid, just like a stock Kia.) &nbsp;

When I hear "car that can be tracked or raced," that is every car - it just depends how much you want/need to do to it. &nbsp;The Honda CRX is one of the most popular track cars in America - more so than the ITR - do you consider it a track car from the factory?

[Ni5mo180SX]

Hippo, I see your point, but I dont know why we keep going between the terms factory race car (I still dont know what your definition of one is) and factory track car (ive already told you what I consider one to be) so its hard to speak clearly on the same level. As far as the issue with warrentys, how would they catch you? With SCCA, you dont need a roll cage for solo events. So you'd rather have an M3, C5 etc?? dude you're talking about in a entire different price range, yea id rather have a Skyline, F50, Murcielago, the list goes on but we're talking about in its price range. I dont know why your still arguing really, the Type R is not a full bred race car, I agree and I never said it was and I dont think anyone ever said it was. Track car, yes I believe its an excellent track car for the money. So what are you arguing or what are you trying to say? No one said its a race car, so what are you trying to get across other then argue pointlessly?

[XylathaneGTR]

Dude....
Anything baring the Type R logo is Designed for the track...
First, the NSX-R...Amazing fucking car...
then the Civic Type R...and both the ITR dc2 and ITR dc5...Amazing peices of work...They are designed for Track...Its not a factory race car...but its main purpose was high performance track shit...the Accord R and Accord Euro R...2 other fine examples of Honda tuning...

Type R is built and designed for track use...hands down.

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (XylathaneGTR @ Mar. 08 2002,1:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Dude....
Anything baring the Type R logo is Designed for the track...
First, the NSX-R...Amazing fucking car...
then the Civic Type R...and both the ITR dc2 and ITR dc5...Amazing peices of work...They are designed for Track...Its not a factory race car...but its main purpose was high performance track shit...the Accord R and Accord Euro R...2 other fine examples of Honda tuning...

Type R is built and designed for track use...hands down.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
That's what I'm arguing against. &nbsp;I've just heard one too many people claim the ITR is a bred and built race car - as if Honda never expected one to be titled and driven on the streets. &nbsp;It's a street car first, built off an economy car platform that was tuned well enough to rise above it's heritage. &nbsp;I agree it's all semantics - but my point is that the ITR is a great car to take to the track - the best in its price range. &nbsp;But it was designed as a street car, not a race or exclusively as a track car. &nbsp;

If "track car" is a great car to take to the track, I agree, but don't think the category is limited to the ITR (even in its price range). &nbsp;Again, you can take anything to the track and run it - ITR or Lanos. &nbsp;I think we're on the same page for "race car" - factory or otherwise. &nbsp;Either way, I'm done.

Xyalenretehre - you should own an "R" not a Nissan if that's where your sun rises and sets.

Peace, out

[XylathaneGTR]

heh.
Yes, the Type R is a street car...but its designed to be a track car as well...

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Xyalenretehre - you should own an "R" not a Nissan if that's where your sun rises and sets.
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

I used to be a big fan of Type R's...i even wanted to order a Mugen Type R Leather bomber jacket...altho i couldn't get my hands on one...I wanted a type R for the longest time...But i have drifted over to the Nissan side of the spectrum, and even tho my current plan is a 240 s15 sr20det vtc Swap...i still have a soft spot for an authentic Type R.

Besides....is &nbsp;XY-LA-THANE-GTR that hard to spell?
You think i should own a Type R just because i confessed a liking for them? &nbsp;hell, Even the biggest Nismo enthusiast would still like some aspects of the competition...meh, maybe anyways.
Sorry for arguing with you...but i just think Type R is a track capable street car...maybe you don't.

[s15dude]

All of the Type-R's were cars that you could at your local club racing series one the weekends and drive to work on Monday without having to make any modifications. &nbsp;Also the chassis on the Integra Type-R is stiffer than the GSR chassis. &nbsp;Type-R's also have thinner window glass. &nbsp;It is a true enthousiaist(spelling?) car. &nbsp;Just like the E30 BMW M3, it comes from the factory with better all around equipment for the track and less creature comforts. &nbsp;And how would the shop or manufacturer know if you tracked the car? By the way, in Japan DC5 ITR's are killing the competetion. There is no doubt about it but they are probably the funnest and best handling front drive car in the world.

The difference in the manifold is the JDM has a 2.5" collector...the jdm airbox is less restrictive too(i think). &nbsp;and some other junk everyone else has already mentioned.

I guess people claim that R is a track car because it sacrifice all comfort for performance.

No AC
No Sound Deafening
No Sunroof
No leather seats
Lightened flywheel (makes it harder to launch)

R is awesome at the track, but extremely terrible when drivien on a street. &nbsp;No one will like to drive this car on a trip. &nbsp;It's just too painful. &nbsp;Most R owners have 2 cars and the R is mainly for track and the other car is for daily driving.

However, it's still a handicap because it's FF....

[will]

I used to own a Type R and I gotta admit that thing could handle very well for an FF. &nbsp;I tracked it one weekend @ TWS and pushed it so hard. &nbsp;A very fun car. &nbsp;Deffinetely not a straight line racer. &nbsp;And yes long road trips sucked, road noise is high, and when you get an AEM CAI your MPG go down cuz all you wanna do is play in VTEC. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'> &nbsp;
-will

[uuninja]

Wow Hippo looks like you touched a nerve! But I gotta back you on this. First MY deffenition of a "Factory Race Car". This is important because several people have clamed that the Type R is exactly that.

Factory Race Car - A car built to specifically to meet homologation requirements for a factory race team. Case in point, the never produced M3 GTR, that was to satisfy the homologation requirements for the American Le Mans Series. The second consideration would be a car the is sold with the expressed intent of the manufacturer that the car be used as an off road "Race Car". This means that wear and failure of warrantable items as a result of race use, is covered under the terms of the warrantee.

Was the ITR produced to satisfy homologation requirements for any race series? No.

Dose Honda of America cover under warrantee mechanical failure of the ITR as a result of on track use? No.

I also know the same Honda Tech as well as the owner of the previously mentioned ITR. The Type R, who's warrantee was void nationally after it was discovered he had used it for occasional track events. If you still have any question, call you local Honda dealer. Tell them that you cooked your ITR's differential at last weeks NASA HPDE event and see what they say.

Is the ITR a "Factory Race Car"? No.

Second term that I want to define. Track Car....simple, any car you take to the track.

There is no question that the ITR is a potent car. With out a doubt the most potent FWD car on the USDM market. As a track car there is no question that the ITR is the best bang for the buck going. But the fact is, the ITR is still just an economy car that is pretty quick, very balanced and handles really, really well.

[crazycuban]

The ITR is simply a well-tuned Civic chassis. &nbsp;It's the only FF car I would ever want, but its not any more of a "track car" than any other car. &nbsp;There are plenty of cars that would do and do well on the track - Miatas are an example in the ITR's price range. &nbsp;Does this mean the Miata is a "race car", or a "track car"? &nbsp;

I could give Hippo the keys to a Ford Escort, and race him around the track in a 240SX, and chances are he would destroy me. &nbsp;There's no such thing as a "track car", because any car is a "track car". &nbsp;Hippo, uuninja, and I are not bashing your sacred Type R (god music plays here), I'm sure we'd all love to have one. &nbsp;

The Type R is a street car, that does relatively well on the track compared to most other street cars. &nbsp;It's a great car for what it is. &nbsp;You won't, however, get into factory produced "track cars" or "race cars" until the $90,000...mmmm...Viper ACR...GT3R...

And lack of A/C doesn't make a car a track car. &nbsp;It's a street car with a niche market - the performance market - and therefore has things to help performance. &nbsp;Performance, however, does not equal race. &nbsp;To many, including myself, the joy of a performance car is found on backcountry roads and long straights...though I'm sure that will change as soon as I get my car to the track.

[citanest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Guest @ Mar. 10 2002,07:51)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I guess people claim that R is a track car because it sacrifice all comfort for performance.

No AC
No Sound Deafening
No Sunroof
No leather seats
Lightened flywheel (makes it harder to launch)

R is awesome at the track, but extremely terrible when drivien on a street. No one will like to drive this car on a trip. It's just too painful. Most R owners have 2 cars and the R is mainly for track and the other car is for daily driving.

However, it's still a handicap because it's FF....</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Seriously, for those who have never driven an R, drive one before you comment on whether it's a race car or a street car. &nbsp;I think different people have different perspective on the words "race car". &nbsp; R is a closer track car then many other cars out there. &nbsp;The main difference is that R SACRIFICEs ALL COMFORT FOR PERFORMANCE. &nbsp;I don't see many other cars will do that, NSX won't, Viper won't, M3 won't, Miata won't, Porche won't, Lamborghini won't, Corvette won't, should I go on? &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'> &nbsp;I think that's where people are getting at. &nbsp;R is terrible to drive on a street, I don't think any of the above cars are like that. &nbsp;All these cars compromise performance and comfort. &nbsp;R doesn't, it sacrifices comfort for performance... &nbsp;NSX type R is the same... &nbsp;I personally own a type R, a RSX type S and an AE86 GTS.... &nbsp;I don't drive the R a whole lot because it's terrible on the street, I drive it only at the track...

[uuninja]

No offence but what is your point? The question is is the Type R a factory race car? The answer is no.

It is great that Honda wanted to make it an all out performance car by giving up any and all comfort options. But the fact is....none of the cars you named are "factory race cars". Are they all great cars? Sure. Sports cars? I will give you that. Is the Type are the best value? maybe for most budgets. But dose that make it a race car? No.

-None of them are homologation models of any factory backed race car.

-They all require the same preparation to race in any organized wheel to wheel event. &nbsp;

-None of the manufactures will cover your ass if you break it on a race track.*

Want an example of a "factory race car"?

The corvette C5-R, no not the C5 not even the Z06. But the actual Homologation car that they had to make to compete in the American Lamans Series. The Carrera GT2, Saleen s7, also IIRC were made to meet such requirements.

I also have to take you to task on the ascertain that Honda will go where no other manufacturer will to make true race cars.....

The fact is that the way Honda makes small displacement N/A
motors go fast and make power is by squeezing every last bit of HP out of the motor. This means that they cannot afford luxuries such as AC...on their performance models. The Type R only makes 20 more HP then the GSR...5 can be accounted for on the AC alone. Though notice that they did bring back the rear window wiper in 00 on the type R so they are not totally unyielding when it comes to weight savings.

I for one think that the Type R is a great track car and will do better than just about any thing in it's price range. But a factory Race car it ain't.

[luey02]

As the oringinator of this topic, I think I'll speak! &nbsp; Is Honda stupid for marketing a no a/c "track ready" (as they call it)car?? &nbsp;hell yeah of course they are stupid! &nbsp; Think about the amount of people that would actually purchase one!? &nbsp;and it's not even that fast. &nbsp; If anything, the Type R only creates an image for Honda that it has performance in mind, and not sales. &nbsp;Adn it worked, look how many ricer out there with hondas. &nbsp;

If you really want a track car for weekend fun, you would do everything yourself like we are all doing, and not buying a generic piece of shit type R. YEAH I SAID IT. &nbsp;

the car doesn't worth us talk about.

[Ni5mo180SX]

Several people have referred to the Type R as a race car? Who would that be? I always referred to it as a "track car". This arguments way besides the point by now, the only fact im trying to get across is that the type r is an awesome track car. Im just trying to make sure the car gets credit for what it can do.

[uuninja]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (AceInHole @ Mar. 07 2002,4:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">LoL.... if the ITR isn't as "race ready" as it gets from the factory.... I'm not quite sure what is....</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Ni5mo180SX,

Well there is one..(sorry Ace not trying to point fingers)..and the fact is by and large Type R = Race car/Race ready, &nbsp;is the attitude that prevails.

No one with half a brain is going to say that the Type R is not a great car or a great car to make a race car out of......But the fact still remains that the Type R is no race car out of the box.....and is no better prepared to be driven on track than anything else.

-Matt

[Ni5mo180SX]

The fact that you say its no better prepared to be driven on the track than anything else is what I disagree with. The fact that it has 8400RPM (9k to the limiter), 195hp, stiffened suspension, LSD, light weight chassis, light weight wheels, stiffened chassis, shorter gearing, etc. is what makes it VERY well prepared to be driven on the track compared to anything else in in its price range coming from the factory. Since we're being so critical and all mighty judges of the Type R, why dont we analyze our own cars stock from the factory? Ive (I)owned my 240 for 3 years and love everything about it and am not trying to bash on 240s but why are we analyzing and criticzing the ITR when our cars werent even nearly as spec'd from the factory.

[uuninja]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Ni5mo180SX @ Mar. 11 2002,4:04)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The fact that you say its no better prepared to be driven on the track than anything else is what I disagree with. The fact that it has 8400RPM (9k to the limiter), 195hp, stiffened suspension, LSD, light weight chassis, light weight wheels, stiffened chassis, shorter gearing, etc. is what makes it VERY well prepared to be driven on the track compared to anything else in in its price range coming from the factory. Since we're being so critical and all mighty judges of the Type R, why dont we analyze our own cars stock from the factory? Ive (I)owned my 240 for 3 years and love everything about it and am not trying to bash on 240s but why are we analyzing and criticzing the ITR when our cars werent even nearly as spec'd from the factory.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Congratulations you missed the point! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'> I don't care if the type R had a flux capacitor and could do mach 12.

Every thing you named makes a car faster on the track.....but faster on the track has nothing to do with being ready for the track.

Need an example?

Here we go...who cares how fast you can go if you can't stop? With out at the very least carbon metallic pads and racing fluid the Type R will have no brakes just like a Corvette c5 or a Toyota tercel or a civic DX. In fact the tercel has the best chance since at having it's brakes last more than 10 laps, as it is the lightest and slowest of them all. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'> So are we to say that the tercel is a track ready car?

That is just for starters.....how many Type R owners run the stock tires on track? Not one of the 20 some type r's that came out to speedtrial at VIR.

The bottom line and my point all along is the type r is a great car and faster than most if not all in it's price range, faster than either of my cars stock.....But it is not show room track ready or a factory race car. You still have to make the same preparations for the track with a type r....that you would with any other car. Once you get to the track....the type r will be faster than many other cars.....given equal drivers.....my point this whole time.

To sum:
Type r stock, better car than all in it's price range? Yes
Type r stock, ready to race? No more than any other car.

That is it I have made my point. I am putting down the bat and stepping away from Mr ED. Thanks for playing. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>

[Ni5mo180SX]

ok, you've missed the point of my argument this whole time. I never said it was race ready. You said its not better prepared to be driven on the track and I showed that it was. No those things I listed doesnt only help the car go faster in a straightline. Dude, do you know anything about how things wear and tear on the track. Just cause the Tercel is slowest and lightest doesnt mean its gonna have the least brake wear. It has a lower handling limit, which means it needs to brake MORE to get to the appropriate speed to enter a turn. It has drum rear brakes, putting more stress on the front. In case you were implying the Type R lacks in brake capabilities, yes it does have uprated brakes. If your gonna factor shit in, like wear, Id like to see your mighty tercels tires after 10 laps. After spinning that one front left tire with all its force in the corners, hows it gonna handle then? Your arguments total BS trying to catch me on the little details of things. Yes the Type R is closer to the range of ready to race then most cars in its price range. Argue all you want about the technicalities but my main point stands.

[Ni5mo180SX]

And hey genious, about the Tercel having the best chance, using both their times running on Laguna Seca, the Tercel would be lapped on lap 9. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'> <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>

[Anubis]

didn't the type R's come with the 5 lug wheels only? on integras that is.

[XylathaneGTR]

NO ONE FUCKING CALLS TYPE r's PEICE OF SHIT TYPE R's!
I WILL FUCKING KILL YOU!
Type R was trying to be the Raciest (is that a word?) Car in its class...while being at a cheap price...
and it is THE BEST handeling FF, better then the FTO GPX. (u should know what taht is...) Yes, its not the most conveint (spelling?) car made...but it is damnnnnnn nice.
Sure i know this is a Nissan Tuning website...but i would still love to have a Type R.

To the guy who said C5-R vettes and Saleen sr7 or wtv are True Factory Track cars...notice how their at least double the type R's cost? (most cases)... Sure honda could have made a Car that cost about 50-60k, and made it outpreform those cars...but they didn't.
The Type R can outpreform almost any FF car, (note. ALMOST...not every) &nbsp;and is a fine example of Naturally Asperated Tuning.
Will you guys please stop trashing that car?


*the above was my oppinion...Don't like it? Deal with it*

[XylathaneGTR]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (luey02 @ Mar. 11 2002,2:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As the oringinator of this topic, I think I'll speak! Is Honda stupid for marketing a no a/c "track ready" (as they call it)car?? hell yeah of course they are stupid! Think about the amount of people that would actually purchase one!? and it's not even that fast. If anything, the Type R only creates an image for Honda that it has performance in mind, and not sales. Adn it worked, look how many ricer out there with hondas.

If you really want a track car for weekend fun, you would do everything yourself like we are all doing, and not buying a generic piece of shit type R. YEAH I SAID IT.

the car doesn't worth us talk about.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
-The reason it has no Ac is to lower the weight (which its 93-95ish pounds lighter then the GS-R)
-There are only around..5000 in NorthAmerica...spread over 5 years (97 debuet, till 2001/02 end) and yes, LOTS of people have wanted to buy one...including Me.
-Yes, It is fast...a STOCK top speed is 141 MPH on a Flat Surface. &nbsp;that's with the stock chip removed...so it doesn't cut accel at like, 100mph like in most cars
-the reason there are so many 'ricer out there with honda.' is cause they are Cheap, Easy to build up, and the parts are widely avalible...Ive seen a LOT of riced out nissan's too, but im not trashing Nissan am i? (i never would <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/inlove.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':love:'>)
- Honda didn't DO anything to the Type R...there's no 3 Inch Factory Exhaust and 4-2-1 Headers and shit...Just stock parts...The only thing they did was tune the b18c5 Engine to give it 108.
51 hp/liter, for a strong performance (for its size/class)\
-Generic peice of shit? &nbsp;Do you actually know what Generic means? i don't think so.
A type R is a unique design...just cause its made from honda...don't mean its a generic peice of shit. &nbsp; OBVIOUSLY...you are TOO NARROW FUCKING MINDED to appriecate other cars besides a 240Sx/Silvia.

people like that just piss me off.

[luey02]

5000 sold in NorthAmerica in 5 yrs? &nbsp;Exactly my point, not too many sold. &nbsp;240sx has sold almost that much in 1991 I believe, in 1 year. &nbsp;

Fast? &nbsp;sure, 195hp in a light N/A car is fast, in its CLASS. &nbsp;But when you get burn on the streets by a stock 300zx (yes I am comparing to a V6), not so fast anymore! &nbsp;lol.. &nbsp;Not a fair race? &nbsp;yeah, cry to yourself to sleep on that. &nbsp;I would rather beat v8's and feel good about my car than having a type R "ONLY" racing it's class. &nbsp;

Honda parts are cheap??? &nbsp;let me ask you this, do the honda parts get cheap first, or are there lots of honda cars on the streets first?? &nbsp;sorry but it's the consumers who determine demand, then prices. &nbsp; thank you. &nbsp;supply/demand, real easy. &nbsp;

108.5hp/liter??? &nbsp;hey, pretty good. &nbsp;But I'm proud of &nbsp;how you work so hard to pay for the car, not that you've done anything towards it. &nbsp;Wouldn't you think it would more fun tune your own car?? &nbsp;yeah, I would too. &nbsp;A/C is not that hard to take it off yourself.. lol... &nbsp;if you're a girl, I'll take this back. &nbsp;

Generic?? Yes, your Type R is the same car as 5000 other Type R's &nbsp;and that's what I mean by generic. &nbsp;Got dictionary?? &nbsp;www.dictionary.com

I didn't say I dont appreciate it, I jsut like my 240sx.. &nbsp;I would've gotten a type R if I liked it more.

Yeah, my mind is so damn narron.. &nbsp;
dont hate, congradulate

the car doesnt worth us to talk about, like I said.

[XylathaneGTR]

Dude. Fuck off.
Its sold in limted numbers cause its a LIMITED EDITION.
and 240's sold way more in a year actually (350z making 5000 a MONTH.)
And when your turbo 240sx gets Burned on the street by a bpu s2000, or hell, even a stock s2000 how you feel?
Yes...I learned about a Market system in JR High School too...a Supply and Demand sets the Equilibrium.(spelling?)
Type R's can kill v8's...at teh l0c4l races...Ive seen a Type R beat a 5.0...was NA but still...

Its the Cheapness of honda parts that More And More and more people go for Civic SiR's then Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX's.
IF they were expensive...more people would drift to other area's of the market.

Yes, it would be more fun to tune my own car...but Honda hasn't added any extra shit to a Type R...no fancy Jun Camshafts or anything...just beefing up the power in the 1.8l
and valve timing and shit...
So the car is still easily tuneable with the fun enjoyment included
So? a 240 SX is just as generic as the 9532049 thousand other's out there...a CRX is just as generic as all the shitloads made....a Mustang, a GTR, a Supra...their all generic to each other. &nbsp; you say MY type R? &nbsp;i don't have one you Nincompoop....my current plans are for a Generic Ol 240, and swapping in an s15 sr20det. &nbsp;and jamming in a t66 turbo (lol, not likly it would fit &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sigh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':rolleyes:'> &nbsp;)

You sure acted like you didn't appriecate it...
Not very good at speaking Engrish either are you? ...is it just me, or does "the car doesnt worth us to talk about" not make much sence. better take some more Grade7 Basic ESL there bucko
Don't Hate...congraTulate? &nbsp; Your the one that started the hating on Type R's

[crazycuban]

For real, I fucking hate it when people bring grammar into arguments about cars...anyways...

The Supra is fast - faster than the type R.
The Supra has bigger brakes than the type R.
7000 TT Supras were made, as opposed to 5000 type R's.

Hmmmm...the Supra must be a track car.

The ITR is a performance car. &nbsp;Great. &nbsp;Any performance car would do better on a track than a non-performance car. &nbsp;What's your fucking point? &nbsp;What makes the ITR so special? &nbsp;I could take an S2000 on the track, a Celica on the track, TONS of cars on the track - and they'd all do great with minor mods. &nbsp;Why? &nbsp;Not because they're meant to be track cars, or they're unique in that they're great track cars. &nbsp;They're just more performance oriented cars than most cars out there.

[luey02]

you're the one with the messed up head..dont tell me to fuck off. &nbsp;Stop writing mindless shit if I'm right, just admit it or stop posting (I take it as same). &nbsp;

If I get burn by a s2000, I'll crank up the boost at the next light, not a big deal, really. &nbsp;

Seriously man, N/A cars can only get so far. &nbsp;Even if you turbo it, you have to detune it. &nbsp;lowering compression building bottom/top end... &nbsp;What's the point?? &nbsp;I dont care how fast around a track it can go, it's just discouraging knowing that it would be faster being a turbo car. &nbsp;

Sorry man, but I truly believe Type R's, &nbsp;Si's, and Vtec are what that took over the import scene, then the parts got cheaper, so it's still my point that type R only served as an image, not for making sales. &nbsp;Why are there limited editions to cars?? &nbsp;I never understood that, if it's gonna sell, it's gonna sell. &nbsp;

how much faster can a type R get after stock?? &nbsp;it's already got like 11.5:1 compression.. or som' like that.. &nbsp;

Generic mean to have a car that's same to lotta other cars. &nbsp;(I know you dont got a type R, just makin an example) &nbsp;As soon as you tune it, it becomes not generic.. &nbsp; got it, hotshot?

I thought I give you some to make fun off.. &nbsp;cuz nothing really I said you could...

So I conclude again:
ITR is not worth talking about, samething to any other stock car, who cares, we could all look them up on the internet! &nbsp;god damn it!

yeah, stick to N/A dude since you like that so much.. &nbsp;maybe you could just stay in the same CLASS and compete with a type R!!! &nbsp;lol... &nbsp;why sr?? &nbsp;sorry, I'm gett'n carried away. &nbsp;

K. Lu

[Ni5mo180SX]

Just for the record, NA can be very competitive with turbo cars.

[tnord]

luey-you're really diggin a hole for yourself, i advise you to stop.

"If I get burn by a s2000, I'll crank up the boost at the next light, not a big deal, really"

-you can't always crank up the boost, there is a point where the car just can't take anymore

"Seriously man, N/A cars can only get so far. &nbsp;Even if you turbo it, you have to detune it. &nbsp;lowering compression building bottom/top end... &nbsp;What's the point?? &nbsp;I dont care how fast around a track it can go, it's just discouraging knowing that it would be faster being a turbo car."

-one of the worst comments i've ever heard. are you saying that at a point an engine becomes perfect? you're extremely ignorant if you think something cannot be improved upon. and what do you mean you don't care how fast around a track it goes? that is the ultimate measure of performance. &nbsp;BMW's don't seem to need turbo's. in a way, turbo's are an archaic way of increasing power. &nbsp;

"Why are there limited editions to cars?? &nbsp;I never understood that, if it's gonna sell, it's gonna sell."

-you don't have a very good understanding of basic economics do you? &nbsp;

"how much faster can a type R get after stock??"

-watch speedvision once in a while and you'll see

i suppose i'll just leave it at that and see what happens.

[luey02]

I'll take you both on and back up my comments! &nbsp;lol

Give me a 400hp s2000 n/a and I'll shut up. &nbsp;(I'm taking a chance here, is there one?<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>) &nbsp;If I can't crank shit up anymore, I'll upgrade internals first, then boost up.. how's that? &nbsp;That is really the point, tuning a turbo car is lot more fun than tuning a n/a car, why? &nbsp;you can get more power with the money you spend.. in the end. &nbsp;(I know there's a limit too, do I have to say everything? &nbsp;you can assume that I know those obvious things)

turbo being archaic? &nbsp;Yeah, if you mindlessly follow the current trend, sure, turbo is archaic.. &nbsp;Give me a good reason youself that you think bigger engines are better than turboing.. &nbsp;that matters to us, reliability isn't really a issue to us and things of that sort. because then we'll buy new parts.

limited edition?? &nbsp;that's why I asked, I dont know why.. &nbsp;like car companies really care about the value of these cars. &nbsp;

I'm sure type R's can get faster after stock, and a lot, comparing to other n/a cars sure. &nbsp;How you gonna sit there and tell me to watch speedvision when you know you can make a lot more power by turboin.. &nbsp;

Disregard what I said above and answer this, are you turboing or staying in your pitiful little n/a class??? &nbsp; I rest my case....

hey, nismo, give me a hand here..

my point: my car with a new shiftnob deserve more talk than the ITR. &nbsp;

stay tight

[uuninja]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Ni5mo180SX @ Mar. 11 2002,5:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And hey genious, about the Tercel having the best chance, using both their times running on Laguna Seca, the Tercel would be lapped on lap 9. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'> <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Fine..:angry:..since you are going to make it personal I will respond......Now who is jumping to conclusions? I never said any thing about "faster in a straight line".

Did I?

No.

You assumed. Just like you are assuming that I think that the Type R is slow on the track. The point is you haven't bothered to read a damn thing cause you are champing at the bit trying to make your point.

Go back and read my posts.

The tercel comment was obvious sarcasm.....get a clue and quit acting like you are 12. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'>

[tnord]

i have no idea about a 400hp S2000, but i think there was a 400hp civic in SCC a month or two back. i'll look it up when i get home.

"that matters to us, reliability isn't really a issue to us and things of that sort. because then we'll buy new parts."

are you made of money? even in F1 where budgets are 10's of millions of dollars, maybe even billions, reliability is an issue. saying reliability isn't an issue is like saying, "i don't care if my kidney stops working, i'll just get a new one."

"are you turboing or staying in your pitiful little n/a class???"

i'm staying in my "pitiful" NA class. i apologize if i'm in college and don't have thousands of dollars lying around to take on such a task.

"my car with a new shiftnob deserve more talk than the ITR."

how old are you that you are this arrogant? 9? you really deserve a good punch in the mouth. and by the way, why in the hell is your car so special?

[luey02]

hey man, take a good shot at the screen, maybe it would hurt... &nbsp;lol.. &nbsp;People can't hold back on a little forum, how do you deal with life.. &nbsp;

reliability isn't a issue, like I said, as in we could sacrifice that to have turbo.. lose some you gain some, just like everything else.. &nbsp;

from your response to my questions, you dont really try to prove your point so I think I'll stop right here. &nbsp;like "no money for turbo?" yeah so you think goin turbo is better?? &nbsp;AIGHT then. &nbsp;shut the hell up about the ITR being a great car. (it is, but a turbo 240 is better) &nbsp;

I said my new shift knobs deserves more attention since ITR are not that big of a deal.. &nbsp; &nbsp;can't read sarcasm from a 9 yr old? &nbsp;lol. YOu really set me up on that one..

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/notify.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':notify:'> <-- take yo best shot...

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (XylathaneGTR @ Mar. 11 2002,7:57)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Dude. Fuck off.
Its sold in limted numbers cause its a LIMITED EDITION.
and 240's sold way more in a year actually (350z making 5000 a MONTH.)
And when your turbo 240sx gets Burned on the street by a bpu s2000, or hell, even a stock s2000 how you feel?
Yes...I learned about a Market system in JR High School too...a Supply and Demand sets the Equilibrium.(spelling?)
Type R's can kill v8's...at teh l0c4l races...Ive seen a Type R beat a 5.0...was NA but still...

Its the Cheapness of honda parts that More And More and more people go for Civic SiR's then Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX's.
IF they were expensive...more people would drift to other area's of the market.

Yes, it would be more fun to tune my own car...but Honda hasn't added any extra shit to a Type R...no fancy Jun Camshafts or anything...just beefing up the power in the 1.8l
and valve timing and shit...
So the car is still easily tuneable with the fun enjoyment included
So? a 240 SX is just as generic as the 9532049 thousand other's out there...a CRX is just as generic as all the shitloads made....a Mustang, a GTR, a Supra...their all generic to each other. you say MY type R? i don't have one you Nincompoop....my current plans are for a Generic Ol 240, and swapping in an s15 sr20det. and jamming in a t66 turbo (lol, not likly it would fit <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sigh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':rolleyes:'> )

You sure acted like you didn't appriecate it...
Not very good at speaking Engrish either are you? ...is it just me, or does "the car doesnt worth us to talk about" not make much sence. better take some more Grade7 Basic ESL there bucko
Don't Hate...congraTulate? Your the one that started the hating on Type R's</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Boy, I didn't want to come back to this, but this is just too much... &nbsp;Name calling and swearing ruin the ability of this forum to effectively communicate and drag us down to the levels of morons the world (and www) over.

XylewraseraGTR - you ignortant cock-jockey, ass-monkey, rice fvck. &nbsp;Do you think that you are above discussion? &nbsp;That you need to be able to swear at, threaten, and shout down other members of this forum? &nbsp;That you have an opinion is great - but I'm sure you know they are like a$$holes (which you can shove your precious ITR right up).

Limited edition - so what? &nbsp;Here's a supply and demand economics question for you: &nbsp;If its the car that no one can live without, why wouldn't H/A NA want to sell more? &nbsp;Do they make no profit on it? &nbsp;Do they not want to sell more units? &nbsp;Do they want to keep an artificially inflated price on a car that can be replicated (and handed its ass) for 1/2 the money? &nbsp;(EG + B18C5 + ITR brakes + bars + suspension upgrades = a fast economy car = ITR roller) &nbsp;Gee, ass-clown - which do you think it is?

Honda race cars: &nbsp;You claim that Honda could build a 50-60K car that could compete w/ factory race cars... HUH? &nbsp;Have you looked at the sticker price of an NSX (which will get killed by any of those other cars b/c of its antiquated platform). &nbsp;An NSX-R at twice the price might be able to compete. &nbsp;The ITR is an entry level sporty car (again, probably the best in its class).

I refuse to indulge in the crap about turbo vs. NA, but I will say that I've never seen an s2k hand anyone in a half-decent car their ass. &nbsp;You can take your 100chp/l w/ a 2L power plant and I'll take an FI motor or a larger displacement (V8) and you know what - you'll lose for a$$ (which would leave your "crew" no where to stick their cocks). &nbsp;Hp is the goal, not hp/l.

Riced out Hondas - this has no bearing on the ITR or any other car.

Generic POS: &nbsp;How much more generic do you get than a Honda Civic (remember - that is the chassis of your beloved supercar)? &nbsp;Okay, a slightly reinforced Honda Civic chassis that shares the same body panels as another class leader in sales, the Integra. &nbsp;Honestly, I don't know what could be more generic than a FF econo-box chassis w/ body panels that come off a car that has a sedan model. &nbsp;If that's your idea of originality, I can understand why you come off as being so fvcking stupid.

Narrow minded: &nbsp;Of the people "bashing" the ITR, we've said it is a great value, the best FF car made, and a leader in its class. &nbsp;My guess would be that, since you spend your days fantasizing about sucking on an ITR shift knob instead of thinking about the options available with other platforms, you are the narrow minded one. &nbsp;Expand your mind - just b/c all the kids who read import tuner told you it's a racecar doesn't mean you have to believe them.

Maket share/cheap parts: &nbsp;First, where are you getting a Civic SiR - are you one of those brain freeze Canadians or do you just believe everything you see on the badge on the back of a car (oops - I guess we already know the answer to that one!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>. &nbsp;Your example of how the ITR has been beefed up, however, is about as bad as you can get. &nbsp;Even 14 year old ricers dreaming about Skylines and other non-imported cars (FTO) know that any "R" parts are coveted in the US (e.g., cams, exhaust and the JDM ex. man.). &nbsp;While this type of statement destroys your whole argument about the ITR being special - fortunately - you are wrong again. &nbsp;While I'd prefer to limit this bashing to ITRs, I'd be curious why you find one of a handful of sporty RWD coupes to be generic and the ITR to be unique? &nbsp;Is the 85% stranglehold FF cars have on the market not enough to convince you?

GO BACK TO NICO (I recently found a link to that board here and I think you would be an excellent fit there!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>. &nbsp;Here, your BS conclusory answers, blind worship of all things import tuner, inability to understand the concepts of automotive (not HONDA) enthusiasm, and your lack of respect for members of this forum are not appreciated. &nbsp;Besides what do you do - post like 20 times a day? &nbsp;You are on every rice topic I look in to laugh at... &nbsp;Actually, I bet you are a real playa on SuperHonda. &nbsp;It seems that every question you have asked has only yeilded responses that would be appropriate to those forums - if the shoe fits!

Now, eat a d!ck and sod off

<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hmmm.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hmmm:'>

Okay, now that the kids are put to bed...

For the rest, I think uu and I are on the same page. &nbsp;(except that I think the c5 will work best on a track b/c his brakes will be fine b/c of the GIANT rotors and multi-pot calipers which will resist heat/fade). &nbsp;

I think the ITR is a great car. &nbsp;Sure, you can track it on the weekend and drive it during the week, bone stock. &nbsp;But you can do that with a lot of cars (I've done it with a Honda and a Nissan). &nbsp;The bigger point, however, is that no one does. &nbsp;People who are serious about driving start tweaking ITRs just like they do any other car. &nbsp;If its such a factory winner, why is it that I rarely see an ITR on course w/ factory wheels? &nbsp;Or shocks? &nbsp;Or brakes? &nbsp;Or tires? &nbsp;Because these are the things that everyone who tracks their car seriously upgrades ASAP. &nbsp;Show me a bone stock ITR at a track event and I'll show you a guy w/ too thin a wallet to work on it. &nbsp;Ditto this for Civic Si's, hybrids, 240s, Miatas, Corvettes, etc. &nbsp;Make of it what you will, but I don't get the hype.

[Ni5mo180SX]

Im the one acting like a 12 year old while your sitting there taking things on a forum board personal? Why dont you stop picking tiny details out to argue againist. The only point ive been trying to get across is that its an excellent track car for the price. But theres always one person like you sitting there waiting to throw a technicality in there.

[uuninja]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (uuninja @ Mar. 10 2002,10:07)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">There is no question that the ITR is a potent car. With out a doubt the most potent FWD car on the USDM market. As a track car there is no question that the ITR is the best bang for the buck going.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Ni5mo180SX, there is a quote of mine several pages ago.

Did you read a thing I wrote? No, you didn't. Now shut your mouth and open your eyes. You are just proving my point every time you post.

[luey02]

How did everything come to this?? &nbsp;All I asked was if the pictures I took were the real ITR.. &nbsp;

I think I need to stop my smart remarks, it's makeing people curse left and right and wanna punch the screen..

Hipposleek, it was wrong about what you said about the honda crew.. &nbsp;lol... you should get locked up for that..

[Ni5mo180SX]

Hey dumbass, then why the hell are you arguing with me?? You said it wasn't prepared for the track and havent given a single example of how its not.

[ca18guy]

ITR=Good track car
ITR=! Race car from factory

There, now settle down your all argueing over different subjects. As for XalathaneGTR, GO AWAY. &nbsp;You obviously missed something (like alot of people) in this thread. But you took it upon yourself to bitch out everyone and start awhole nother page of flames. Which now withered down to just name calling.

For the computer illiterate =! means "doe's not equal" or was it != hell I can't even remember.