bardabe
01-25-2016, 12:15 AM
Hey guys,
so there is not a whole lot of documentation on this swap. I ran into an issue that has very little feedback and support among a swap growing in popularity. I am doing an S14 SR20 swap and at the same time i am installing a Z33 transmission to avoid having any drivetrain problems in the future. (stock SR20 transmissions suck balls let's be real here)
anyway, I haven't made an actual valuable contribution of data to the Automotive industry in almost 8 years now. I've been learning and keeping things to myself but this i feel is important and needs to be known. so let's get to it!
I did my Swap using the Maverick Motorsports adapter plate that is 3/8" thick (9.188mm). being that i was using an ATS clutch that has the big center clutch spline. Like pictured bellow.
http://www.ppi-ats.com/images/ats_new_metal-clutch_2013.jpg
instructed by George I had my bell housing milled 1/2" and put the release bearing sleeve & release bearing recommended for the clutch by ATS. I put everything together and ran into this little problem where the clutch fork would travel a good 60-70% of the way on the window before the release bearing (TOB) would touch the pressure plate. I'm almost sure that the slave cylinder was probably at least 80% maxed out so i doubted I would have enough room to have full clutch release.
here is a small breakdown of what i had to work with.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/6944F741-6A68-4496-8321-B6AC9CB0E61B.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/6944F741-6A68-4496-8321-B6AC9CB0E61B.jpg.html)
pictured from left to right.
Z33 release bearing sleeve & release bearing. (18MM)
Z32 release bearing sleeve & release bearing. (22MM)
S14 release bearing sleeve & release bearing. (24MM)
D40 release bearing sleeve & ATS / OSGiken / ORC release bearing. (32MM)
as you can see the S14 & Z33 release bearing have almost identical height. (probably the reason Nissan superseded them both to the same part number)
where the Z32 and ATS release bearing have almost the same height. (ATS / OSgiken release bearing has a much MUCH smaller diameter though). DO NOT USE Z32 / Z33 / SR release bearing on your twin disk.
Here is the S14 release bearing sleeve next to the D40 frontier sleeve
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/E678BFA2-606A-4AB3-8326-A68BD2C20F35.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/E678BFA2-606A-4AB3-8326-A68BD2C20F35.jpg.html)
here is the Z33 vs the Z32 sleeve
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/4F984CD5-715A-42F4-935B-E6F33B0CDD7C.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/4F984CD5-715A-42F4-935B-E6F33B0CDD7C.jpg.html)
and finally Z32, S14 & D40
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/B2E231F3-5C09-4543-9FE1-E933B47AAB3B.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/B2E231F3-5C09-4543-9FE1-E933B47AAB3B.jpg.html)
part number for the D40 sleeve
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/2625B698-599C-4D71-A117-6D092D4109AB.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/2625B698-599C-4D71-A117-6D092D4109AB.jpg.html)
I re assembled my entire clutch assembly and transmission using the Z33 Pivot ball (04+), Z33 Cast Steel Clutch fork. Z33 release bearing retainer spring, D40 Frontier Release bearing sleeve & ATS Release bearing.
this was my winning combination [URL=http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/39F0B856-5ACD-4EAC-AFCB-EF5DBBC00B9F.jpg.html]http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/39F0B856-5ACD-4EAC-AFCB-EF5DBBC00B9F.jpg[/
this combination leaves me with all the room for the OE Z33 slave cylinder to travel like factory. leaving me with all the room to adjust the hydraulics to give the fork the 13.5mm of travel required to fully disengage the clutch while being able to adjust the clutch pedal height to each drivers liking. now remember this is using an ATS clutch, i know that ATS, OSGiken, ORC, & Orgura & Clutch masters share very similar twin disk heights. However depending on the actual twin disk that you use you might have to machine more from your bell housing. to have your transmission splines line up with your twin & triple plates. if you machine more from your transmission i would start off using the 24mm sleeve and measure how much free travel you have. on the clutch fork before touching the pressure plate (this also applies to single disk clutches) the clutch fork ratio from what i measured it was around a 2:1 ratio. (for every 2mm traveled by the fork little under 1mm was traveled by the release bearing)
I shaved 1/2" off mine (12.25mm) so i used a 32mm sleeve. so say for example someone using the OSGiken Twin disk that shaved off 3/4" off their bell housing. (18.38mm) would run a 26mm sleeve. to have the same travel as I do. [12.25mm - 18.28mm = -6.13mm] [32mm - 6.13 = 25.87mm] this is because you have pushed the entire transmission 6.13mm closer to the flywheel compared to my setup and based on the assumption that the pressure plate heights are the same the 26mm is the closest to our actual number.
The other way to do it is say you have a single disk with the proper release bearing you on a factory S13/S14 sleeve (24mm). You install your slave and your slave is at the furthest back position plus 4mm. you are able to move the fork by hand an additional 8mm before touching the pressure plate. Using the 2:1 ratio calculation you would need an additional 4mm release bearing height to have proper slave cylinder travel. (slave cylinder needs to have free play between itself and the fork before touching the pressure plate) so you SHOULD be able to install a 28mm sleeve and have perfect travel.
now another option is if you need to add less than 6mm of release bearing height to your clutch throw out bearing clutch masters sells a release bearing spacer kit. (a variety of different thickness washers to that go on the sleeve before you press on the bearing) that way you can get a sleeve slightly thinner than what you need and add washers to make your release bearing the perfect height.
here is also a list of Nissan Clutch release bearing sleeves with heights and part numbers
30501-A3800 12mm
30501-N1601 14mm
30501-U0200 16mm
30501-S0200 18mm Z33
30501-B6000 20mm Datsun 910 (DISCONTINUED NO LONGER AVAILABLE)
30501-S0160 22mm Z32
30501-K0404 24mm S13/S14
30501-K0510 26mm D21 Frontier / Xterra
30501-N1600 28mm D22 Frontier / Z31 Turbo (07/83 - 09/86)
30501-N8400 30mm S110 Z20E (DISCONTINUED NO LONGER AVAILABLE)
30501-U8584 32mm D40
also bonus, here is the Nissan Part number for the release bearing used on OSGiken, ATS & ORC Clutch kits. as far as i know, only the Genuine Nissan bearing has the exact dimensions as the bearing sold by ATS / OSGiken / ORC.
Nissan Release Bearing 30502-14601
please feel free to contribute to this, I made this solely on my knowledge and experience doing my swap with an ATS clutch & a Maverick Motorsports adapter. I cannot speak for a Collins or any other kit. however with the method and information i have provided i have no doubt that by doing some simple math this can be applied to any kit out there in the market. I will do my best to answer any questions. if anyone has anymore information please feel free to share.
so there is not a whole lot of documentation on this swap. I ran into an issue that has very little feedback and support among a swap growing in popularity. I am doing an S14 SR20 swap and at the same time i am installing a Z33 transmission to avoid having any drivetrain problems in the future. (stock SR20 transmissions suck balls let's be real here)
anyway, I haven't made an actual valuable contribution of data to the Automotive industry in almost 8 years now. I've been learning and keeping things to myself but this i feel is important and needs to be known. so let's get to it!
I did my Swap using the Maverick Motorsports adapter plate that is 3/8" thick (9.188mm). being that i was using an ATS clutch that has the big center clutch spline. Like pictured bellow.
http://www.ppi-ats.com/images/ats_new_metal-clutch_2013.jpg
instructed by George I had my bell housing milled 1/2" and put the release bearing sleeve & release bearing recommended for the clutch by ATS. I put everything together and ran into this little problem where the clutch fork would travel a good 60-70% of the way on the window before the release bearing (TOB) would touch the pressure plate. I'm almost sure that the slave cylinder was probably at least 80% maxed out so i doubted I would have enough room to have full clutch release.
here is a small breakdown of what i had to work with.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/6944F741-6A68-4496-8321-B6AC9CB0E61B.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/6944F741-6A68-4496-8321-B6AC9CB0E61B.jpg.html)
pictured from left to right.
Z33 release bearing sleeve & release bearing. (18MM)
Z32 release bearing sleeve & release bearing. (22MM)
S14 release bearing sleeve & release bearing. (24MM)
D40 release bearing sleeve & ATS / OSGiken / ORC release bearing. (32MM)
as you can see the S14 & Z33 release bearing have almost identical height. (probably the reason Nissan superseded them both to the same part number)
where the Z32 and ATS release bearing have almost the same height. (ATS / OSgiken release bearing has a much MUCH smaller diameter though). DO NOT USE Z32 / Z33 / SR release bearing on your twin disk.
Here is the S14 release bearing sleeve next to the D40 frontier sleeve
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/E678BFA2-606A-4AB3-8326-A68BD2C20F35.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/E678BFA2-606A-4AB3-8326-A68BD2C20F35.jpg.html)
here is the Z33 vs the Z32 sleeve
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/4F984CD5-715A-42F4-935B-E6F33B0CDD7C.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/4F984CD5-715A-42F4-935B-E6F33B0CDD7C.jpg.html)
and finally Z32, S14 & D40
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/B2E231F3-5C09-4543-9FE1-E933B47AAB3B.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/B2E231F3-5C09-4543-9FE1-E933B47AAB3B.jpg.html)
part number for the D40 sleeve
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/2625B698-599C-4D71-A117-6D092D4109AB.jpg (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/2625B698-599C-4D71-A117-6D092D4109AB.jpg.html)
I re assembled my entire clutch assembly and transmission using the Z33 Pivot ball (04+), Z33 Cast Steel Clutch fork. Z33 release bearing retainer spring, D40 Frontier Release bearing sleeve & ATS Release bearing.
this was my winning combination [URL=http://s5.photobucket.com/user/FairladyZ32/media/39F0B856-5ACD-4EAC-AFCB-EF5DBBC00B9F.jpg.html]http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/39F0B856-5ACD-4EAC-AFCB-EF5DBBC00B9F.jpg[/
this combination leaves me with all the room for the OE Z33 slave cylinder to travel like factory. leaving me with all the room to adjust the hydraulics to give the fork the 13.5mm of travel required to fully disengage the clutch while being able to adjust the clutch pedal height to each drivers liking. now remember this is using an ATS clutch, i know that ATS, OSGiken, ORC, & Orgura & Clutch masters share very similar twin disk heights. However depending on the actual twin disk that you use you might have to machine more from your bell housing. to have your transmission splines line up with your twin & triple plates. if you machine more from your transmission i would start off using the 24mm sleeve and measure how much free travel you have. on the clutch fork before touching the pressure plate (this also applies to single disk clutches) the clutch fork ratio from what i measured it was around a 2:1 ratio. (for every 2mm traveled by the fork little under 1mm was traveled by the release bearing)
I shaved 1/2" off mine (12.25mm) so i used a 32mm sleeve. so say for example someone using the OSGiken Twin disk that shaved off 3/4" off their bell housing. (18.38mm) would run a 26mm sleeve. to have the same travel as I do. [12.25mm - 18.28mm = -6.13mm] [32mm - 6.13 = 25.87mm] this is because you have pushed the entire transmission 6.13mm closer to the flywheel compared to my setup and based on the assumption that the pressure plate heights are the same the 26mm is the closest to our actual number.
The other way to do it is say you have a single disk with the proper release bearing you on a factory S13/S14 sleeve (24mm). You install your slave and your slave is at the furthest back position plus 4mm. you are able to move the fork by hand an additional 8mm before touching the pressure plate. Using the 2:1 ratio calculation you would need an additional 4mm release bearing height to have proper slave cylinder travel. (slave cylinder needs to have free play between itself and the fork before touching the pressure plate) so you SHOULD be able to install a 28mm sleeve and have perfect travel.
now another option is if you need to add less than 6mm of release bearing height to your clutch throw out bearing clutch masters sells a release bearing spacer kit. (a variety of different thickness washers to that go on the sleeve before you press on the bearing) that way you can get a sleeve slightly thinner than what you need and add washers to make your release bearing the perfect height.
here is also a list of Nissan Clutch release bearing sleeves with heights and part numbers
30501-A3800 12mm
30501-N1601 14mm
30501-U0200 16mm
30501-S0200 18mm Z33
30501-B6000 20mm Datsun 910 (DISCONTINUED NO LONGER AVAILABLE)
30501-S0160 22mm Z32
30501-K0404 24mm S13/S14
30501-K0510 26mm D21 Frontier / Xterra
30501-N1600 28mm D22 Frontier / Z31 Turbo (07/83 - 09/86)
30501-N8400 30mm S110 Z20E (DISCONTINUED NO LONGER AVAILABLE)
30501-U8584 32mm D40
also bonus, here is the Nissan Part number for the release bearing used on OSGiken, ATS & ORC Clutch kits. as far as i know, only the Genuine Nissan bearing has the exact dimensions as the bearing sold by ATS / OSGiken / ORC.
Nissan Release Bearing 30502-14601
please feel free to contribute to this, I made this solely on my knowledge and experience doing my swap with an ATS clutch & a Maverick Motorsports adapter. I cannot speak for a Collins or any other kit. however with the method and information i have provided i have no doubt that by doing some simple math this can be applied to any kit out there in the market. I will do my best to answer any questions. if anyone has anymore information please feel free to share.