rb vs sr install

[lostincompton]

I was told that you can get mounts for the rb engine, for a s13, and it is just as easy/difficult to install as the sr20? I would just like some of your professional oppinions on this topic, to find if it is indeed true.

[ez1286]

i've heard that its a lot harder and more expensive cause some stuff needs to be custom fabricated there is an issue of sport compact that gives a lot of info on the swap, some things that have to be done are you need to have the drive shaft shortened and you need the wire harness spliced with the old one (i've heard you can SCIP that if you put all the components from the rb in)

[ez1286]

by the way september 2003 issue of sport compact car

[steve shadows]

rb20 or rb25det is pointless for s chasis, rb26 is ok for high speed and drag racing, but still the chasis is so light and flexable compared to r chasis.

save yourself the money yes the 4cyl wont idle or rev quite as smooth but the 25 and sr20 have equal bottom end strengths (granted bad tuning will pop sr pistons a little quicker)

just not worth the money

if you want to be different the rb isnt diff its just a way for rice boys to brag honestly.

you can make an sr faster easier with more parts availablilty for cheaper and god forbid to fuc up and destroy somthing on the rb your going to be out some dough.

i dunno i just dont see the point.

i think an RB26 would be a better option but shove it in somthing more stout and stable like a 300zx z31 or z32 thats what i am planning .

[Kid Zelda]

Originally posted by rpsports

if you want to be different the rb isnt diff its just a way for rice boys to brag honestly.



Ohh man ... why must you always have to mention rice, rice boy .. hmm ? give it a rest

Stop trying to deny you use to be the people you now hate
:p

[93rps13]

Originally posted by rpsports
rb20 or rb25det is pointless for s chasis, rb26 is ok for high speed and drag racing, but still the chasis is so light and flexable compared to r chasis.


are you implying that the S13 chassis isnt strong?? on automotiveforums.com their was a person with a Rb26DETT powered 240sx that ran 11.2 without and LSD, so what wrong with a person that has a RB25DET it runs like around 13s, the chassis i believe should be able to hold more then 400hp

[steve shadows]

its not that the chasis cannot accept massive amounts of hp, its more an issue of wieght of the motor, the design of the car around the sr20det and ka24e/de wieghts and balances and the way nissan in general designed everything.

ive never heard of any stock 240sx runing 11.2s with just a stock rb26dett.

there is a fully built car yellow that dynoed 600 in the states that is a fully built rb25det

and there is a mckinney motorsports s13 coupe with newly dropped rb26dett vs the old rb25det(one wonders why they took the 25 out!!! they never even timed the car!! or tested it at any length just did some photo shoots, i think the only time i heard for the car was a 12.6 at carsbad downhill or somthing like that).

i have seen a 11.2 sec 240Z rb powered but no 240sx here in the states with consistant times

im just saying i did 12.20s at 3k ft elevation under crappy conditions wtih a 100% stock sr20det redtop engine a top mount t3/t4 injectors, fp, z32 maf and a couple other goodies. just an afc for tuning

this whole setup is cheaper than a rb25
clip properly installed with gauges and some minor upgrades and my car will definitly run in the 11s at sea level with the new tuning ive done on it.

this car is daily driven:coolugh: :boink:

[Ludeykrus]

ya'll think too small....

I know personally of two guys around town w/ some nice Nissans.....one is a 89 240sx w/ a VG30et thrown in (totally made from scratch; it's pretty much mid-engined from where the motor sits) and a 280z w/ a built 404 dropped in.

I wouldn't mess w/ the SR, personally.

[anotherblusi]

wow rpsports, better get that flame suit on, cause your gonna be in for some heat. Let me just ask you some questions... Can you give me some exact weights on the sr, ka and rb? Also can you give me the corner weights of a 240 with an sr and an rb? stock and lightened? Also could you be more specific when you say the rb and sr and have equal bottom end strengths... What exactly are the strengths and possible weaknesses... Also I too would interested to know why mckinney decided to pull the 25 for the 26, so a statement from them would be great.

It seems you have made some pretty strong claims against the RB swap and I would simply like some hard facts to back your claims.

Also have you ever drifted, autocrossed, dragged an RB powered 240? Because if you have I would like to hear about your experience... Thanks...:)

[93rps13]

Originally posted by rpsports
its not that the chasis cannot accept massive amounts of hp, its more an issue of wieght of the motor, the design of the car around the sr20det and ka24e/de wieghts and balances and the way nissan in general designed everything.

there is a fully built car yellow that dynoed 600 in the states that is a fully built rb25det

and there is a mckinney motorsports s13 coupe with newly dropped rb26dett vs the old rb25det(one wonders why they took the 25 out!!! they never even timed the car!! or tested it at any length just did some photo shoots, i think the only time i heard for the car was a 12.6 at carsbad downhill or somthing like that).

ive never heard of any stock 240sx runing 11.2s with just a stock rb26dett.



i believe that the KA engine is heavier then the SR20, because of the extra .4 and iron block, also the you said that nissan design the for that engine, will the SR engine a alumium block alloy which is lighter then iron, so that would mess up the weight distrabution, then also the left and right weight distrubtion(which no one really thanks about),

That yellow 240SX hatch was in florida, it was nice, and also it was in January issue of SuperStreet page 146 top right

http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43421 -pics of their car, also wouldnt you put in let say a S15 engine if you were able to get it, they had a RB25DET, and got their hands a RB26DETT so i guess they took the better engine

i take back what i said about 11.2, i was wrong, but the car should run faster now, it did run 12.3 http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37885

Damn! i wish i had that car

[steve shadows]

Originally posted by anotherblusi
wow rpsports, better get that flame suit on, cause your gonna be in for some heat. Let me just ask you some questions... Can you give me some exact weights on the sr, ka and rb? Also can you give me the corner weights of a 240 with an sr and an rb? stock and lightened? Also could you be more specific when you say the rb and sr and have equal bottom end strengths... What exactly are the strengths and possible weaknesses... Also I too would interested to know why mckinney decided to pull the 25 for the 26, so a statement from them would be great.

It seems you have made some pretty strong claims against the RB swap and I would simply like some hard facts to back your claims.

Also have you ever drifted, autocrossed, dragged an RB powered 240? Because if you have I would like to hear about your experience... Thanks...:)
(sorry s15, and s14 vtc is crapola to work with once a real standalone and big turbo get bolted on i like my keep it simple stupid s13 motors)

have you?

ive ridden in seen them , know friends who have them, and drifted them etc.

they have personally not let me drive their rb powered 240 on a course.

dont ask me why mckinney pulled the 25 you ask them they never answer my questions at the nissan festival so i just walked off.

the facts are 500whp on stock bottom end on sr is do-able, 539 whp has been driving around daily in florida for about 8 months straight now. these are real world examples on us soil.

rb25det advice from friends overseas is as i have stated. I personally havent wieghed the cars or corner wieghed them, why dont you ask mckinney for the wieght sheet. i bet they dont have one or lost it. What i have heard from an australian source and a source in okinawa is the rb25 bottom end is not as strong as the rb26 bottom end and the head design of the rb25 and rb20 leave much to be desired.

i honestly think the only rb motor worth the trouble is the 26. but the 26 is a lot of freakin trouble.

ill be gathering more detailed info on the rb powered 240 as well as myself and the owner of a well known socal shop will be racing each other modded rb25 vs. modded sr20det at the stripp for bragging rights. hes goin to be dumping twice as much money into his setup as mine...

the truth is do what you like yeah you can shove all kinds of crap into all kinds of chasis and be "differerent" or "cool"

personally i like the way the nissan engineer's designed their cars.

honestly shove the rb26 in a z32 or z31 that would be cool .

I would like to do this swap in another year when i get some more money.

but i prefer the lightwieght, bolt in, part available , power capibilities of the sr20det.

doesnt mean i wont respect an rb swap nor does it mean i wont do an rb swap for a customer or friend for the right reasonable price, just not my preference and mostly has been simply hyped up thru the roof thru puplications and sources who know nothing of mechanical engineering, with no conversing with actual nissan engineers and who are simply star struck and have just traded in their eks for s chasis...Cough scc cough drag sport cough....

the rb is a good motor

the s13 is a good car

i like my rb served wit the r chasis and my sr served with my s chasis

-steve

[misnomer]

Who cares what other people get out of their engines? Your car is still slow :P

Seriously guys, these "which engine is better" debates never prove useful in the least.

To try and get back on topic, McKinney Motorsports makes motormounts to install RB motors in s-chassis. It is definitely a more complex swap than an SR, but if you get the right mounts it shouldn't be too bad.

[Ghettokracker71]

Its all about what you want ! Depending on your budget of course,but heres the thing......

RB's do weight more than SR's(say what the fuck you want about this topic of weight,but it is a fact, small I-6 vs. much smaller I4)

For the $$ of a stock RB engine into an S chassis,you could do an SR swap and build it considerably,therefore being faster

If you break ANYTHING on that RB,your shit outta luck (close enough)

Its all about what you want that your wallet will allow.

[anotherblusi]

The point of my post is to prove that people that talk bad about the RB really have no hard evidence against the swap. Its all things they've heard from people. If you have personal experience with an RB swapped 240, more props to you... then your arguments will tend to have more validity. There are just too many factors into determining which motor swapped 240 is better than the other. Yet people still try and claim one is better than the other. IMO the ca,ka,sr,rb are all strong in IMO, and each of them have there own weaknesses... and it all comes down to personal opinion. But the motor alone is not the deciding factor on whether or not one 240 is better than another.

Another thing, just because nissan decided to put the sr in an s-chassis, doesn't necessarily mean that an rb swapped s-chassis can't be better. Yes completely stock for stock... the sr would be the better choice, I can admit that. But who here ever compares stock to stock... I sure has hell am not going to keep my swapped 240 stock...

And finally (yes I know this is long), the sr is obviously the tried and true method. And I too wish to own an sr-swapped 240 also in the future. But the RB swap is still fairly new, and there is not enough information out there to really see how it performs in the 240... Hey who knows... it might even be the worst swap for the 240, but you won't really know until enough people do the swap and track their cars.... Until then I urge everyone to just keep an open mind and stop bashing the RB!!!:D

[93rps13]

Originally posted by misnomer
Who cares what other people get out of their engines? Your car is still slow :P

Seriously guys, these "which engine is better" debates never prove useful in the least.

To try and get back on topic, McKinney Motorsports makes motormounts to install RB motors in s-chassis. It is definitely a more complex swap than an SR, but if you get the right mounts it shouldn't be too bad.

its alittle more complex, thats it the R33 GTST xmember bolts up, install the engine as any other engine, engine sits alittle high and alittle far forward, the fan shroud cand be used so you need a push-type fan for the radiator, and wiring as any engine swap you'll need to do...but if you use the stock KA xcross the motor mount make it look alot cleaner like you domt have to cut the hood, and sits back so the shifter sits in the stock position

QUOTE]Originally posted by Ghettokracker71
Its all about what you want ! Depending on your budget of course,but heres the thing......

RB's do weight more than SR's(say what the fuck you want about this topic of weight,but it is a fact, small I-6 vs. much smaller I4)

For the $$ of a stock RB engine into an S chassis,you could do an SR swap and build it considerably,therefore being faster

If you break ANYTHING on that RB,your shit outta luck (close enough)

Its all about what you want that your wallet will allow.[/QUOTE]

not trying to burn you but they weight it...check it out http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/0309scc_hybrid/index.html -third pic down

Also your can buy replacment parts ar motorex.net , rbmotoring.com , mckinneymotorsports.com , night7racing.com , phase2motortrend.com and other places



QUOTE]Originally posted by rpsports
honestly shove the rb26 in a z32 or z31 that would be cool .

but i prefer the lightwieght, bolt in, part available , power capibilities of the sr20det.

i like my rb served wit the r chasis and my sr served with my s chasis

-steve.[/QUOTE]


i can see a RB20DET in a Z31 but that cames stock, please explain yourself you said that the engine was made specfic for a car but you say would like to though a GTR engine in a 300zx

their are bolt-in parts for a RB25DET, and 500HP is achievable on a RB25DET too

i best thing i like about he RB 's are you have a bullet-proof block

also just read the www.night7racing.com FAQ section
:D

[steve shadows]

[/B][/QUOTE]

not trying to burn you but they weight it...check it out http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/0309scc_hybrid/index.html -third pic down


:D [/B][/QUOTE]

i give up:bash:

[Ghettokracker71]

"Be prepared to accept more weight with the RB25DET. Fully dressed with both crossmembers and the steering rack attached (but no A/C), the KA24DE weighs about 540 pounds. With two more cylinders, a much beefier transmission and a turbocharger, the RB25DET weighs about 720 pounds. That's an extra 180 pounds to accelerate, stop and turn."

hmmm....

To me,of course that doesn't sound like a shitton of weight,if you did C-F hood,and lightweight front fenders,I've never seen C-F ones,but PFR or something, super lightweight wheels,and plenty of suspension upgrades,it doesn't sound too bad for the added power,the thing I would be concerned about is how the weight sits on the chassis,the balance of it all

[RBSileighty]

Well, as my tag name suggests, guess what motor I prefer.

It does come down to personal pref. in the end. RB's are incredible motors. The straight six is a naturally balanced motor, and Nissan did a great job at utilizing what they had. I'm personally familiar with the RB20. I have done two swaps with this motor, and loved both of them. One was my old S13 (did the swap last october), which I parted out and sold because I wanted a non red shell. It's cool that S13's are about the same price a good paint job.

The other is my buddy's S14. The two of us did his swap about 2 or so months ago. His used UH mounts, but we are in the process of making our own x-member.

His car has JIC FLT-A2 suspension, JIC carbon strut tower bars front and rear, JIC Stainless 80mm catback, custom DP (my buddy made), 2 12" push fans, cone filter, and some other non go faster parts like Sparco seats and such.

Short story long, his car handles and drives like a dream. He had the FLT-A2's on there before we did the swap, and it handles the same as it did with the KA under the hood. I did a lot of the wiring myself, and it really is not hard at all (typically the hard part). I've never done a SR swap myself, but if it really is easier than this, I can't wait to make some easy money.

I've never driven a S13 or 14 with a SR, but I'm sure they are good motors. As long as it's not a KA turbo, I have no problems with it. The RB is a sweet sounding, driving motor, and I highly recommend looking into them. With more of them in the country we might be able to pull some support from the aftermarket in the states. Who knows, if they catch on like the SR has there may be some parts/service help from dealers.

My friend's car is his daily driver.

Here is a link for you to his car with pics and vids:

http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42642&perpage=35&pagenumber=1

There is another vid on page two as well. Enjoy.

My new S13 is waiting for it's new motor. It's KA should come out sometime in the spring. I want to do suspension first, so we will see.

[DSC]

Hrm...93rps13

How much does 0.4L of displacement weigh exactly?

[93rps13]

dont know...but i think the important part is that the SR20DET block is an alumium(sp?) alloy, and the KA24DE is and iron block

in this album of an other persons there should be a video clip of the car drifting, remember this is a RB20DET, not even a RB25DET
http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4290466361

Also for people that thing there is no aftermarket support, check out www.skylinesaustralia.com most of these people have GTST's not GTR's, GTR's i believe are not that common in Australia and Japan...correct me if i am wrong

[misnomer]

I hate to just pass along heresay, but I recall reading the KA24DE was about 100lbs heaver than the SR20, while the KA24E was about 12lbs heavier (that's not a typo, twelve pounds). . . Anybody know these figures for sure?

[PROJECTRB240SX]

THIS THREAD IS AS BIASED AS ALL OTHERS.....

THE RB20DET IS 60LBS HEAVIER THAN MY KA24E
THE RB25 IS ABOUT 170LBS HEAVIER (BUT MOST OF IT IS IN THE TRANSMISSION SO WEIGHT IS CENTERED
THE RB SERIES ENGINES ARE JUST AS GOOD OF AN OPTION AS THE SR FOR ALL ASPECTS OF DRIVING.... YES INCLUDING DRIFTING (IF YOU GUYS VENTURE OUT OF YOUR BOXES AND CHECK OTHER FORUMS THERE ARE QUITE A FEW PEOPLE WHO DRIFT RBS).
THE RB IS MUCH MORE RELIABLE THAN AN SR AND ITS REBUILDABLE TOO UNLIKE THE CRAPTASTIC CAST ALUMINUM SRS.
RB PART AVAILABILITY IS GROWING MORE EVERYDAY AND OVERNIGHTING PARTS IS GETTING CHEAPER AND CHEAPER.
THE RB SERIES MOTORS HAVE BEEN TOLERANCE TESTED TO OVER 800 HP FOR THE RB20 AND OVER 1000HP FOR THE 25 AND 26.

YOUR ENGINE DECISION SHOULD BE BASED ON YOUR PROJECT TARGET AND DON'T LET ANYONE SWAY YOU EITHER WAY, BECAUSE IT IS ALL PREFERENCE. REMEMBER THESE CHASSIS ARE VERY STRONG AND VERSATILE, AND CHASSIS PRODUCTS ARE ABUNDANT NOW. I CAN HELP YOU WITH ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE ABOUT RBS. IF YOU WANT A VAST BASE OF KNOWLEDGE CHECK INTO THE NICO RB SECTION OR EVEN SKYLINES DOWNUNDER.

P.S. I KNOW ITS ALL IN CAPS AND BEFORE ANYONE ASKS, ITS BECAUSE I'M AT WORK AND I HAVE ABSOLUTLEY NO CONTROL OVER MY CAPS LOCK.

[Steeles]

:Owned: preach on man preach on. I've driven 2 RB powered S cars (S13 with RB20 and S14 with RB25) and I'd take either one. if I had to do my swap again the RB25 would be tops on my list. cant beat a straight 6, with boost

[PROJECTRB240SX]

DON'T TAKE MY POST THE WRONG WAY, I LOVE ALL THE NISSAN MOTORS.... BUT I DON'T LIKE PEOPLE BIASED OPINIONS (I HAVE QUITE A FEW OF MY OWN TOO), THE RB IS JUST AS GREAT OF AN OPTION AS THE SR. THE SR IS A GREAT MOTOR, BUT I'M FROM THE OLD SKOOL AND I BELIEVE IN THE POWER OF IRON AND THE SIMPLE FACT THAT IF YOU BLOW IT UP?....... REBUILD IT! ANYWAY THE SR WILL LIGHTEN YOUR CAR SIGNIFICANTLY BUT THE RB WILL GIVE YOU SMOOTH REVOLUTIONS, HIGHER REVS, EQUAL OR GREATER POTENTIAL, AND A COMPLETELY BALANCED ROTATIONAL ASSEMBLY...... ALL OF THIS SACRIFICED TO ADDED WEIGHT.

[steve shadows]

"THE RB IS MUCH MORE RELIABLE THAN AN SR AND ITS REBUILDABLE TOO UNLIKE THE CRAPTASTIC CAST ALUMINUM SRS."

what the hell?

yeah the sr is such a pile!!! so weak!!! such crap!!!

tuning is everything

ask secret services cough scot cough cough


:bash: :bash: :bash:

[PROJECTRB240SX]

WELL YOU WANT A RELIABILITY TEST?
YOU DONATE AN SR AND I'LL PUT UP ONE OF MY RB20S. WE'LL RUN THE ENGINES AT A CONSTANT 5500 RPM UNTIL ONE BLOWS UP...... REMEMBER I'M OFFERING UP A 89 RB20DET. THEN YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER WHEN THE RB BLOWS UP, I CAN REBUILD IT.... WHEN YOUR SR BLOWS ITS SHOT AND TIME TO BUY A NEW BLOCK.

GRANTED TUNING IS EVERYTHING.
I NEVER ONCE SAID THE SRS ARE WEAK, I SAID CAST ALUMINUM SUCKS. FOR THE FACT THAT IT CAN'T BE REBUILT, ITS DEXTERITY, ITS TOLERANCES..... BUT ITS HEAT DISSAPATION IS WHAT SAVES IT IN MOST CASES AND REDUCES THE HEAT STRESS ON THE METAL WHICH IS THE #1 CAUSE IN CATASTROPHIC ENGINE FAILURE.

[RBSileighty]

I am a RB guy, but I think to rebuild a SR you would just need to resleeve it at most (plus the other usual rebuild items). It shouldn't need a new block. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Steeles]

am I the only one getting deja vu about KA vs SR arguments from like a year ago with this thread? :lol:

[Var]

Originally posted by RBSileighty
As long as it's not a KA turbo, I have no problems with it.

I know this is kinda bringing a new arguement to the table but...The whole point of us chossing different engine setups from eachother is preference and curiousity. Sr20det being probably the easiest and most efficient swap available. For the price to get a Ka24E block and head race prepped, you can get a whole sr swap. But why badmouth the KA? Ya it costs a little more money to build, but so does the RB series. And i'd rather build my KA's internals and have a fresh motor that only i've raped rather than an engine from Japan that supposedly has 40K km on it. I think it's hypocritical to say it's ok to do an RB swap but to totally dis the KA. what's the deal?

edit: Let me add this maybe going against what i said about being open minded. I think it's kinda ignorant to build a KA turbo without an overhaul and racing rods, bearing and stuff and a race prepped head.

[PROJECTRB240SX]

THE KA IS ANOTHER UNDERSTATED MOTOR: WITH ALITTLE FINE TUNING GREAT THINGS HAVE BEEN ACHIEVED.

THE COMMENT ABOUT THE SR BEING CHEAPEST AND EASIER IS COMPLETELY FALSE: I'LL PUT AN RB20DET SWAP UP AGAINST IT IN PRICE AND EASE. HELL I'LL PUT A RB25DET SWAP UP AGAINST IT IN EASE.

I'M PLANNING A FEW SWAPS HERE SOON I'LL VIDEO TAPE THEM AND TIME IT TOO. I'LL COMPILE A RECIPT/TOTAL COST LIST TOO.

[steve shadows]

then we can compare track times and reciepts

no no

screw it bring the car out to idrc season opener in march at palmdale CA. race it againt me in pro am class! that would be a much better display of similar cost proejcts heads up at a strip.

:bow: friendly nissan competiton is always welcome

[RBSileighty]

The only reason I don't like KA's is that they are not built to be race motors from the start, nor did Nissan seem to have the intention for them to be race motors (SRs and RBs have oil squirters and such).

I've ridden in a D16 turbo that can run a 12.5 in the 1/4 mile. The thing is crazy fast. I don't think it was worth the money b/c he could have bought a few B series motors and tuned them very well with the same or less amount of money.

It all comes down to preference. What other people do with their money is their business.

I won't take part in a pissing contest, so have fun if that's what you are going for. I know what I like, so that works. I am more than happy to share what I know about my motors, and I am glad other people like theirs. If we all liked the same thing it'd be boring. So leave the, "bring it on I'll race you any day" stuff at home. Enjoy your car, make it faster. That's what it's about... be it KA, RB, SR... man even a yugo with a B18C or something. Just have fun... leave the drama at home.

[DSC]

Originally posted by RBSileighty
The only reason I don't like KA's is that they are not built to be race motors from the start, nor did Nissan seem to have the intention for them to be race motors (SRs and RBs have oil squirters and such).
I've never opened up a KA myself, but I'm pretty sure they have oil squirters.


Originally posted by RBSileighty
Enjoy your car, make it faster. That's what it's about... be it KA, RB, SR... man even a yugo with a B18C or something. Just have fun... leave the drama at home.
:aw:

[Var]

THE COMMENT ABOUT THE SR BEING CHEAPEST AND EASIER IS COMPLETELY FALSE: I'LL PUT AN RB20DET SWAP UP AGAINST IT IN PRICE AND EASE. HELL I'LL PUT A RB25DET SWAP UP AGAINST IT IN EASE.


Maybe cheaper for you but who else in the general public can get parts and labor done for 3 grand?

[PROJECTRB240SX]

ANYONE CAN, I DIDN'T GET ANY SPECIAL TREATMENT.

VENUS CLIP = $1560 SHIPPED
LABOR = $0.00 (DID MYSELF)
CAR = $700 + 180 (TOWING)
PARTS = $200
SATISFACTION = PRICELESS

[mrmephistopheles]

DUDE.
CAPS LOCK.

Seriously..

[PROJECTRB240SX]

DUDE I CAN'T SERIOUSLY


I ALREADY EXPLAINED IT...... SCROLL UP AND READ THE ENTIRE TOPIC :mrmeph:

[steve shadows]

no pissing contest, thats all any kind of racing is whether its striaght around a turn in a high speed circle or towing a load or even motor x jesus

until i see a heads up comparision on different types of tracks, wieght slips, hp read outs and price comparisions all rolled into one article published by a magazine that i could trust i just wont fall for the bs and hype.


rb25 guys do what you like thats fine with me

rb26 guys wow you have mind that thinks, you have a little bit of common sense (because this motor is sooo much better especially in head design) but i need proof of the setups durability Mckinney

ka24 once again good way to recycle garbage, people who make reliable power with these i respcet although i personallly will never own a ka turbo unless its free.

sr20det, i like it the best, parts avaiablility, ease of maintnace, smaller, lighter, easier to put on an engine stand, can mooch off my sentra buddies for extra crap. It will make 500 hp on stock bottom end and if you blow it up (which only stupididty and bad tuning normally leads to in sr) you can get another short block or long block for cheap compared to rb, especially as the demand for rb balloons.

yeah you can put all kinds of crap under the hood of any car with enough welding and custom crap and hook ups from friends but when it comes down to heads up comparison and "pissing contests" no one wants to face the results head on or even consider this possibilitis. and if this did happen and the rb won out amazingly i would be happy to bow down and admit the sr is a pile of crap compared to its fatass older cousin.



:bow:

[PROJECTRB240SX]

I'LL PUT MY CAR UP TO AGAINST YOUR STOCK SR POWERED CAR!

WE CAN'T DRIVE THEM, WE'LL HAVE PROFESSIONALS DO IT. GETTING SERIOUS RACERS OPINIONS WILL BE THE BEST.

ANYWAY...... THAT WAS THE MOST BIASED STATEMENT MADE IN THIS THREAD BUT WHATEVER.

[steve shadows]

we cant drive our own cars? why not? haha i know how to drag race my car better than anyone, i mean ill guarentee its the only s13 with exacty that much curb wieght, clutch setup and wieght transfer characteristics...

whats your great idea have dave coleman drive it (rofl) great my car will be doing 13s whoopie thanks dave coleman for all your crap spewing over the years...and great coined phrases like "dave point."

what the hell are you talking about

im saying bring your car out to the season opener in palmdale in march and we can drag race each other in our own cars compare total expenditures on the cars and see who is faster in a freindly nissan race.

and plus i would rather see a comparison around the twisties of a stock rb25det and a stock sr20det swap into the same s chasis.

i still dont know why scc hasnt done it yet, im sure they will eventually when they get tierd of posting 4 door accords with aem intakes and 19 inch rims in their readers ride section next month :hammer:

and plus i dont want anyones opinion, i want heads up competiton. have rys millen get in a rb powerd stock setup s13 with the same exact suspension as an sr powered stock setup s13, run them down the 1/4 run them around willow springs, run them on a skid pad, run them up to top speed, run them on a dyno for 30 min straight.... then lets see what the results are. my ugly blown out suspension ghetto drag racing s13 isnt a road racing car and it still needs a lot of new suspension to make it turn worth which i will be doing once i get some more cash.

but im just saying for the fuc of it bring your car out lets see it in a drag race why not?

[PROJECTRB240SX]

WHY DO YOU WANT TO COMPARE A RB25 TO A SR20? WHY NOT A RB20? IS IT TOO CLOSE OF A PLAYING FIELD FOR YOU.... DO YOU REALLY HAVE TO HAVE A 200+ POUND ADVANTAGE?

I'M SAYING GET TWO PROFESSIONALS TO RACE ARE CARS...... AND HELL NO IS DAVE COLEMAN EVER TOUCHING MY CAR (HE'S A FRIGGEN IDIOT!). THAT WHY ITS BETWEEN TWO IDIVIDUALS THAT DO IT FOR A LIVING, BECAUSE FOR ONE WILL ADMIT I CAN'T DRAG FOR CRAP, BUT I'VE BEEN ROAD RACING FOR YEARS IN FORMULA FORDS AND RACE KARTS. ANYWAY ITS AN IDEA THAT KEEPS THINGS FAIR.

WE CAN ALSO SET A PRICE CAP ON THE CARS FOR "IMPROVEMENTS" AND STRICT STANDARDS FOR TYPES OF MODS.

[Var]

Originally posted by PROJECTRB240SX
ANYONE CAN, I DIDN'T GET ANY SPECIAL TREATMENT.


LABOR = $0.00 (DID MYSELF)


ya that was my whole point. The whole general public cant do their own swap. It would have cost you at least 1500 bucks to get it put in. So i was right about the SR being the cheapest swap. It's a known fact.

[RBSileighty]

Originally posted by DSC
I've never opened up a KA myself, but I'm pretty sure they have oil squirters.





You were right about the oil squirters.
http://home.austin.rr.com/puls/pages/240sx-taking_apart.htm

I can hold my own with SR's and RB's, but I don't know a whole lot about that motor other than I hate the one in my 92. It drives like a truck...

Again, to each his own... my thing with the whole end comment before is that I'm tired of hearing the same old same old. I do agree with RPS that someone/some magazine should take the same car and swap in all three motors with the motor being the only change. That would be very interesting.

Even if the SR or the KA turned out to pull better numbers, I would still prefer the RB. Straight sixes are just sweet motors, but again this is personal pref.

[steve shadows]

yeah im sorry if i came off an ass or even a :mrmeph: i get worked up about this stuff a lot especially when noobs post and quote scc. but the point is i love and respect the sr and the rb, the 25 and the 26. And yes six cyl motors are awesome, i just want some raw proof of the durability of a rb swap in an s chasis before i go trading my sr in.

[93rps13]

you dont even fucking know me, i was point so stuff so that that person can make a choice, also your the fucking idiot that wants to compare inline 4 to a inline 6, i believe that PROJECTRB240SX, and RBSileighty have seen me on the NICO on the RB forum all the time,

PLEASE RBSileighty and PROJECTRB240SX please correct all the false info i have in this thread I am just i fucking newbie that hasnt been look at RB info, threads, and 2 + years of research, and havent been on skyline forums.

:fawk2:

[93rps13]

http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=480366#post480366 now what do you say, that right shut the fuck up

[PROJECTRB240SX]

RPSPORTS: I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU AR COMMING FROM..... IT'S LIKE I SAID EARLIER, I RESPECT ALL ENGINES, I JUST DON'T LIKE ALL THE MISINFORMATION GIVEN BY PEOPLE WHO HAVE NO EXPERIENCE WITH WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT.

93RPS13: I HAVE SEEN NO MISINFORMATION COMING FROM YOU. YOU DO KNOW ALOT ABOUT WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT AND HAVE BEEN AROUND LONGER THAN EVEN ME, JUST KEEP ON INFORMING THE IGNORANT AND THIS WORLD WILL BE A BETTER PLACE!

WESTBOROUGHPIMP: UMM HOW MUCH IS AN SR CLIP? HOW MUCH IS AN SR INSTALL? NOW HOW MUCH IS A RB20 CLIP? HOW MUCH IS A RB20 INSTALL? THATS RIGHT THEY ARE THE SAME OR THE RB IS CHEAPER.

THIS ARGUEMENT IS ALL ON PREFERENCE.... YOU SHOULD BASE YOUR MOTOR CHOICE ON WHAT YOU WANT TO ACHIEVE. EVERYTHING CAN BE HAD WITH A PLAN AND A POCKETBOOK. GOOD LUCK ON YOUR CHOICE, I'M SATISFIED WITH MINE.

[RedlineRacer]

Everyone always overlooks the CA18DET. If I ever swap my KA, I'll probably throw in a CA. I just wish they had more support here in the states. Those things are becoming dirt cheap. Like $1,000 for a front clip shipped to your door. And you can't dis that engine for what you get and pay.

[PROJECTRB240SX]

THE CA IS A GREAT MOTOR WITH TONS OF POTENTIAL BUT IN MY HONEST OPINION I WOULD JUST KEEP THE DOHC KA IF I HAD IT AND TURBO THE CRAP OUT OF IT, A 15HP DIFFERENCE ISN'T SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH FOR ME TO SWAP ENIGNES.

[93rps13]

I believe that CA can rev higher than the SR but the SR can be modified to rev just as high

[RBSileighty]

This is my last post on this topic.

I would consider a CA if I was you. I have heard good things about this motor, and I am sure it can pull reasonable power out of it. If you are worried about parts on the motor breaking buy two of them. Since the clips seem to be cheap, I'm sure the motor by itself would be rediculously inexpensive. Buy them at the same time and save some cash on shipping.

Again and again, it all comes down to what you want, and how much you want to spend (this comment is not directed towards anyone).

[Var]

Originally posted by PROJECTRB240SX
WESTBOROUGHPIMP: UMM HOW MUCH IS AN SR CLIP? HOW MUCH IS AN SR INSTALL? NOW HOW MUCH IS A RB20 CLIP? HOW MUCH IS A RB20 INSTALL? THATS RIGHT THEY ARE THE SAME OR THE RB IS CHEAPER.

An SR motor set is 2 grand. An install is 700.(for the public no hook-ups)
I dont know how much the RB's are and everywhere i know of charges 1500 bucks for the install with wiring. Plus i dont even know if you need a driveshaft mod or x-member or anything else. I guess i should have researched it more before i said the SR was cheaper, but shops around here charge a handful for any RB install. One question...do they still make the RB20? if not when was the last year it was made?

THIS ARGUEMENT IS ALL ON PREFERENCE.... YOU SHOULD BASE YOUR MOTOR CHOICE ON WHAT YOU WANT TO ACHIEVE. EVERYTHING CAN BE HAD WITH A PLAN AND A POCKETBOOK. GOOD LUCK ON YOUR CHOICE, I'M SATISFIED WITH MINE.

Absolutely agreed. I will go with neither setup. I will keep the 2.4L. Bottom line is(IMO) displacement gives more power if all else is equal...IE you have to race prep the KA block and head and turbo it which is what i will do. I hope that when i'm done i will be as content with it as you seem to be with the RB series. Plus the advantage to me is having a fresh motor.

[93rps13]

no i dont think they make RB20DET anymore but it came in the R32 GTST, make shore that the R32 is not a GTS4 because the tranny is AWD, Also if you dont use a mounting kit for the RB20DET the oil pan will hit the front sway bar so you got to upgrade to the Whiteline sway bars found at www.pdm-racing.com , or you can do it the ghetto way dent the pan ( not sugguested(sp?)), also you got the cut the hood bracing to clear either the front valve cover or the intake mani, if you dont want to cut the hood bracing, you can get the custom intake mani from www.unstable-hybrids.com (i think thats the link), but then you need custom intercooler plumbing, also you gotta shave alittle metal off the downpipe because the steering rack will hit it, also i believe that the KA driveshaft can be used but you need to change splen(i dont know whats i called forgot) to a NA Z32's

What i like about the RB20DET is with the tomei solid lifter kit the RB20DET will make power all the way up to 12k RPM's :D

[93rps13]

o i forgot the wiring i hear is extremely easy...

[NoLimit]

wow, .... you guys sure argue a lot over here ... :eek: ;)

anyhow, the point seems to be beaten into the ground, but again, ... it really all comes down to personal preference and availability (of parts and know-how). The RB swaps will be common as more shops learn how to do it. Right now, it's done (for the most part) by people who can do some things for themselves.

anyhow, the thread I posted on NICO was already pointed out, ... but here it is again. ;) http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45754

I love the RB swap. the torque is insane! ;) :D We beat the dog sh!t out of my friends car, ... at track days, autoX, drift events, and daily driving. There aren't many cars that can touch it. ;) and this is with basic bolt-on's and stock turbo. It'll be a bit more exciting when we put on hs upgraded turbo (basically T3 super 60).

But I love CA's and SR's too, ... but they can't dream of touching the RB's power down low (in a Completely streetable form). The drift team we're a member of has 'oogles' of 240's with every combination you could dream, ... and I like 'em all! ;) :cool: :D But for my 2 240's, I'm going with an RB26 and turbo KA (or CA, ....... or RB25, .......... or maybe SR, .... i dunno. ;) )

I think you get my point. :)

We'll be weighing as many possible combinations as possible, and I'll be sure to post our results.
cheers,
Sean

[2fastparts]

Just courious, Anyone have dyno sheets on a all stock rb20 in a s13 verses an all stock sr20? I drove both swaps and was really impressed with the rb, dont get me wrong I've owned 2 240's with sr swaps and i love em. The car i drove was a 90 240 coupe with a rb20 and it was awsome, it had a really clean and smooth power band unlike the sr that is always rev happy kinda like a chain saw. the rb just felt like a v8 or something its kinda hard to explaine.

I bought some mounts from a well known company, but the welding job sucked!!! Maybe they should stick to the R&D and leave the fabrication to qualified people. As far as the placement of everything it worked out pretty good, the sway bar is really close but it dosent hit. I had a buddy of mine make some more mounts and weld them the right way, and with better material. He even offered to design a CAD program and cut them in one peice out of some billett material. Needless to say i didnt want to spend that kind of money. I dont know what the market price is for a mount kit these days, I do know i paid 500 + for the ones i bought and they were crap. The people that made the new ones for me said that the material didnt cost more than 20.00 on the orignal set ( they got me didnt they) He built me another set for 300.00 and it came with an exhaust flange too.

If you take the cost of the RB20 motor set 1000.00. Motor mounts 300.00. Your stock drive shaft will work, we had a sohc 240. The wiring is easier than tha sr, the harness was long enough on mine so nothing was shortened or lengthened . Just had to add a couple wires. Oh yeah the fuel pump relays are near the ecu on the rb. And some local muffler shop to make a down pipe, you've got roughly 1500.00 in the whole thing, dont a sr motor/tranny and ecu cost that?? One other thing the rb intercooler would work with out a lot of work so a sr side mount intercooler was used

There's alot of bad info and swap parts out there be carefull and do lots of research, dont jump in head first like i did ! I love both motors, so i say to each his own. Gotta love the japanese and Jarco inc for bringing us this great stuff!!!

[Nismo241]

I'm not going to bother reading all these posts, read most o fthem on the first page and what I got out of it is, RB's cost more than SR, and is slower, is that not the jist of it???

Well, I'll go up against ANY SR swapped car that has the same amount of money into the swap as I do, and I would guarentee I would blow it's doors off, why.....cause you can't realisticly complete an SR swap for under 2K. I paid a total of 1964 for my swap, thats front clip, shipping, walbro fuel pump, and full exhuast with cat. The way it is now, I have Blitz ECU, T3 turbo, intake and full exhaust, I walked away hard from a similar modded SR 240. And I KNOW he spent alot more on his than I did on mine, being that the clip came with the ECU, and the intake.

I"ve done numerous RB swaps. I could complete this swap in a couple of days if not same day if I actually worked on it the whole time(ADD sucks). But comparing the two is stupid, it's like apples to oranges.

[Nismo241]

Originally posted by 2fastparts


One other thing the rb intercooler would work with out a lot of work so a sr side mount intercooler was used



OH and FYI, the RB intercooler bolts right up no problems, I have it in my car and in the other cars I have swapped.

[Var]

Wow you guys get your motor sets pretty cheap. 1000 bucks for an RB20. Well considering it's several years old i guess it's possible.

[2fastparts]

Sorry, I didnt mean it wouldnt work I ment it was just easier. It just seemed like alot of unnessary work, it kind looked like the intercooler would have to sit inside the fenderwell sideways. Doe you have any pics of the intercooler in the car? Love to see what it looks like.

[2fastparts]

Originally posted by westboroughpimp
Wow you guys get your motor sets pretty cheap. 1000 bucks for an RB20. Well considering it's several years old i guess it's possible. Ive got a really good distrubitor, this guy actually owns the recycling yard in Japan, as you know most of the time yards like his pay nothing for cars. So he passes the savings on to us.

[Spec_v5150]

Wow alot of bench racers in here and some misguided souls. Same as Nismo 241, I spent about $2200 on my swaps. That was the front clip shipped, dual electric fans, walbro fuel pump, boost gauge x2 (dropped one), water temp gauge, jack and jack stands, fluids, absorbent to pick up the tranny fluid and gettign the clip hauled off. Most people havent even gotten enough money to buy their SR20's with that. Alot of people speak about the weight distribution without having drove a RB powered 240. They just ass-u-me that it will be waay off because of the difference in weight. I noticed zero effects of the swap after I put the rb20 in as far as handling. The only real difference in the in the RB20 vs SR20 swap is he electric fans that required. Wiring was easy (thanks to Nismo241 on that:bowdown: ). Everything else bolted up. And to whomever said the Sr20 is the cheapest swap, where are you gettign your motors from. I RARELY see SR20's go for under 2K. Unless it is on ebay and has a bunch of shit missing. If peopel are charging more for RB20 installs over SR20 installs, they are raping people plain and simple.

[PROJECTRB240SX]

RB20DET WAS MADE ALL THE WAY THROUGH 1993 AT THE LATEST (COULD BE LATER BUT I SEE NO NEW CARS WITH IT). IT CAN BE FOUND IN 200ZR, CEFIRO, R32, STAGEA, AND FEW MORE CARS.

AS FOR INSTALLS THE R32 CHASSIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE S13, THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS LONGER WHEEL BASE AND BODY STRUCTURE. THE STOCK SMIC WORKS WITH OUT MUCH MODS. THE COST OF THE INSTALL IS BASED ONT HE SHOP BUT TECHNICALLY THEY SHOULD CHARGE LESS THAN A SR SWAP AS IT IS LESS WORK UNLESS YOU GO WITH A RB25 OR 26.

WIRING IS ABOUT 7-10 WIRES FOR A COMPLETE SWAP (THE RANGE IS BASED ON IF YOU ARE GOING TO BE USING THE RB TACH, WATER TEMP GAUGE, ETC.)

IF I HAD A DOHC KA24 I WOULD HAVE TURBO'ED IT BUT I HAD A SOHC AND IT WOULD COST AS MUCH FOR MY SWAP AS WOULD TURBO PREP WORK SO I WENT WITH THE RB.