Help! Low vacuum/all plugs wet from gas

[mtxfrk2k1]

OK so here is a list of events up to the problem

Drove car 4 hours flawlessly.
parked car for maybe 1 hour.
Got back in car to run down to the store and it started running weird(breaking up in boost) After the first time it did it when i got into boost i tried 1 other time and it the results stayed the same so i kind of limped it back home.
Got it to the driveway and at idle the vacuum was between 5-10 In/Mg.
i checked all the couplers and sprayed starting fluid around the couplers to see if i could find a boost leak. ran my hands around all the couplers and fittings and the actual pipe itself and found nothing.

Im running stock coils with NGK Bkr7e plugs that i just cleaned back up and gapped to .7mm

You can smell it dumping the fuel as soon as it starts, idling really rough and not wanting to move out of its own way.

where would you guys start looking?

[mtxfrk2k1]

fuel pressure is 40 at key on and 50-55psi at idle

[KiLLeR2001]

I'm assuming this is an SR20DET? Stock gap is 0.9144mm or 0.036".

[mtxfrk2k1]

its built RB25 S1

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/mtxfrk2k1/IMG_3332.jpg

[Walperstyle]

What do you have for a tune, and please tell me you can read AFRs

[Chrischeezer]

a boost leak wouldn't read as low vacuum on your gauge..
fuel system specs?
management?
what do the plugs look like?

[mtxfrk2k1]

Apexi power fc, SARD fuel rail, stainless lines all the way back. z32 fuel filter, venom FPR, deno 800cc injectors and if an intercooler coupler ripped or pipe cracked came undone i would have no vacuum or very little depending on how bad it is. plugs are solid black and wet with fuel within 10-20 seconds of the car running.

as soon as i unplug maf it dies.

[statickx991]

i cant stop looking at that engine lol. how bad are the afr's of you have a gauge. there has got to be a huge vacuum leak. but still doesnt make sence for breaking up and loading it with fuel

[Chrischeezer]

at idle your throttle plate is closed no vac. is generated in front of the throttle plate. that reading is everything in the manifold.

are you running a blow though MAF? because i do not see one in that pic.

sounds like you have a huge leak BEHIND the throttle plate.. but it can be anything at this point.

please dont take this the wrong way.. but
something doesn't add up here... that is a very impressive build, and for you to ask for "beginner" help doesn't makes sense. Has this problem been haunting you for a long period of time?

[ledippen]

isn't fuel pressure normally 36 at idle ? fpr probably?

[Chrischeezer]

43 for an rb engine

[Pro ViZIon]

Check for a vacuum leak around the manifold where it connects to the head.

[mtxfrk2k1]

no it has only been haunting me for a couple days. yes it sounds like a noob question. but the fact i have checked for all huge leaks and with boost leak tester it can hold 20psi for a good amount of time before it very very slowly starts to leak off, it stumping me and making me think it is spark related.
fuel pressure sits at 40 with key on and around 50-60 at idle.

[mtxfrk2k1]

yes the MAF is located on the intercooler pipe coming up right before the throttle body.

[Chrischeezer]

if you have a leak after the throttle body a boost leak test won't find it.

preforming a boost leak test with the TB open?

[mtxfrk2k1]

so should i try starting fluid all over the intake manifold?

what about injector o-ring?

[Chrischeezer]

just do a boost leak check with the TB open
If it's really a leak..and its making your engine run like that! its going to be pretty big, like an open hose or blown out gasket, or a really bad o-ring on the manifold side of the injector. its not going to be a small pin hole.

[mtxfrk2k1]

ive checked all hoses and checked throttle body. i looked at the injectors but didnt concentrate on them.

ok so please correct me. if its after the MAF and the air has already been metered. the car shouldnt recognize the added air correct? im guessing the o2 sensor would detect it and say its running to lean to dump fuel but in open loop it is set of standard values anyway correct?

[Chrischeezer]

i know it might be a Pain in the ass but... to avoid alot of guess work boost leak check with the throttle body open.

If its sucking in unmetered air at idle... it could cause so many different problems.

[Chrischeezer]

If its a leak to this extent it will leak right out, and shouldn't hold any pressure at all.

[mtxfrk2k1]

you would think this is something that could be heard.. no weird whistling or any sounds out of the ordinary. the hood was all the way off the car and was feeling around and listening for anything drastic. i know that it can also not make any noise ( just stating from what ive checked so far)

[Chrischeezer]

your absolutely right, but i have herd of weirder things.

but in stead of playing the guessing game i would fill the whole manifold up with pressure.

[a7olyte]

I don't know much about RB25's, but theoretically your Fuel Pressure Regulator may be bad. They operate at a 1:1 rising fuel pressure per pound. You stated 40 psi at key and 50-55psi at idle, meaning your Fuel pressure regulator is seeing pressure (which can't happen at idle).

Unless Venom designed their fuel pressure regulator differently, your fuel pressure shouldn't increase at key than at vacuum. It should have decreased.

[Chrischeezer]

If he has a vac. leak his pressure will be all over the place...

[mtxfrk2k1]

ok chrischeezer! boost leak test with throttle plate all the way open. still holds 25psi. there is no vac leak.

still loads up on fuel, idles like hell...

[mtxfrk2k1]

Put a mist of water on outside of coils in pitch black dark to see if anything was leaving the coils.. nothing.. put brand new bkr6e plugs in gapped to .8 just to see if any difference. also have brkr7e's gapped to .8

[mxexux]

check the ECT!!!

[mtxfrk2k1]

that would keep it from basically driving? it does it on cold start all the way up to temp where my aftermarket gauge holds 160* perfect.

[jacobs13]

Did you check the injector or rings? One of mine got a little rip in it and leaked and my car did the same thing yours is doing.

[mtxfrk2k1]

i havent actually pulled them out. but you would think that doing a boost leak test with throttle plate open would push air back up through there...?

[Chrischeezer]

yeah, 25psi is more then enough to make anything leak.. esp if your problem isn't even in boost.

well... at least you 100% know its not a vacuum leak right? and you don't have to play the guessing game with a can of carb cleaner. and you can focus on other elements.
any codes on ur ECU?

[jacobs13]

Mine ran fine in boost but shitty in vacuum or low boost idk its worth a try just to rull it out. Mine was a little rip on the bottom so if pressure were to push the o ring up it would probably seal.

[Chrischeezer]

^worth a shot

Does the Power FC have a fault codes or error code ability?

[matts13vert]

im with jacob, check the o-rings. I also had the same problem, lube the rings on reinstall.

[mtxfrk2k1]

im researching the apexi powerFC right now. im not sure how to test the fault codes. the stock ECU had blinking LED's with 2 series of blinks.. not sure about this one. nothing at all on the hand held controller...

[mtxfrk2k1]

other than checking voltages on sensors i think there are no other ways.. should i try gapping my plugs smaller than .8? i was going to say that if its not making good spark at .8 it probably wont help if i go to .65 or something like that. .8 is already decently small. TPS, ECT, MAF are all in range... would CAS, Camshaft position, or crankshaft position have anything to do with it?

[Chrischeezer]

this is going to be a big pain in the ass but at this rate, if this was my car...

Id put factory injectors back in and a stock ECU and MAF. at least you can run codes off of it, and at the same time remove the management out of the equation.

I know its probably the last thing you wana do. but you will cover lots of ground doing this.

[Chrischeezer]

^ just realized you have a pretty serious fuel system...maybe this will be the last resort

[mtxfrk2k1]

yeah twin walbro's, fuel rail, FPR, injectors, stainless lines all the way back, etc. besides i sold the stock parts from the vehicle. the tune is still locked on where it should be. i dont have dataloggit . everything is on handheld which blows. vacuum is stable around 10 in/mg right now. which is still really low but more stable. replaced all vacuum lines before the open TB boost leak test. im going to liquid tape and clean the spring pockets on the coils. along with making new grounds for them including the ignitor. going to see if that does anything.

any more ideas Chris??

[Chrischeezer]

If it was individual coils, i would think you would see that when u look at the plugs.
In your case all the plugs look the same, carbon & fuel filled. so this problem is effecting all your cylinders equally.
hmm...
igniter could be...
since the FC has no self diagnostic. you'll have to resort to good old fashion mutimeter testing.

[herbieS13]

when did u get the car tuned?

[Chrischeezer]

^
Drove the car 4 hours flawlessly.

[herbieS13]

how aggressive was the air compensation map made? its possible its just to agressive if you dont find anything else wrong try going to settings-injectors- and lower the injector % by 4%

[Chrischeezer]

what would cause this setting to change itself after 4 hours of driving?

[herbieS13]

not so much changes to settings but air intake temp and running temp as it gets cooler outside. the air compensation map is to compensate for the change in air temp. if it was made to aggressive it'll run overly rich the colder it gets, and depending on how aggressive it was made the richer it'll run

edit::: also after u get off the dyno everything is just hotter period for awhile, so in those hours it prolly didnt effect the map much if at all, if u cant find anything else wrong it, then try giving it a shot lower it 4% each injector to start and then lower it even more as it needs, also if it is the air compensation map u'll see afrs bounce around abit (after uve found a good injector %) the main thing u wanna get right is a good idle AFR/cruising AFR that doesnt get into boost AFRs, and a solid and steady AFR when your WOT full boost

[mtxfrk2k1]

it been tuned for quite awhile now. it is actually warmer here now. it has to be something im looking over. i will have pics and volt testing results tomorrow of all the major sensors. im hoping ignitor, or ground somewhere.

all coils have individual ground correct? any pics of diagrams on here of the harness grounds to ignitor. or where all the ignitor grounds are?

[herbieS13]

ok i was under the impression he just got it tuned earlier that day or something