Might piss some people off but oh well.

[Otto347]

What is the most popular solution to an animal/species problem when it either outgrows its habitat, over eats and destroys its habitat or becomes a general nuisance?

We setup hunting seasons, issue hunting licenses and just find out ways to exterminate (solve) the problem.

Why cant this be done with people? I mean lots of people fit these same categorys, and we can justify killing lots and lots of animals to solve a problem so why cant it be done with people?

And please dont give me the obvious "we're the top of the food chain" crap or "we're human and they're just animals", even within humans there is a pecking order like strongest/weakest, smartest/dumbest.

Also please take this question with a grain of salt, its a hypothetical question I though about while watching the pig bomb documentary (if thats what you call it) on history or discovery.....I cant remember.

[ryguy]

I sort of agree with you, but in a slightly different way. I don't believe in sending aid to third world countries, because the only solution is for some of those people to die off.

However, I did donate to Haiti, because I believe that was out of their control, unless you believe Pat Roberts and they actually had made a pact with the devil.

[jorge1190]

I really think that society today has destroyed the basic human concept of survival of the fittest by trying to make thing equal for everyone.
I'm sure that lots of people think about this but no one would dare to bring it up or do it first in fear of being "flamed" for lack of a better word.

[shiftdrift]

i think we should all go buy guns....and shoot each other whenever. sounds like a great plan.

[theicecreamdan]

Really? There are plenty of other species that are on the list before we are.

And we're already working pretty hard on getting rid of all those brown people, what do they call them? Those people that live in the "middle east" they're called terrorists right? They scare me.

Then we can try another earthquake device somewhere in south america, they owe us money and they haven't paid up.

I sort of agree with you, but in a slightly different way. I don't believe in sending aid to third world countries, because the only solution is for some of those people to die off.

However, I did donate to Haiti, because I believe that was out of their control, unless you believe Pat Roberts and they actually had made a pact with the devil.

Yeah, and just ignore all the history that tells us WHY these places are third world countries. The only person in Haiti that made a pact with the devil was the dictator that took loans from the world bank. The devil is the first world countries that "help" third world countries for their own economic gain.

[ryguy]

Yeah, and just ignore all the history that tells us WHY these places are third world countries. The only person in Haiti that made a pact with the devil was the dictator that took loans from the world bank. The devil is the first world countries that "help" third world countries for their own economic gain.

The Pat Roberts remark was sarcastic, I guess I didnt come on strong enough with it.

Tell me, WHY are these places third world countries?

[I LUV MY S13]

I really think that society today has destroyed the basic human concept of survival of the fittest by trying to make thing equal for everyone.
I'm sure that lots of people think about this but no one would dare to bring it up or do it first in fear of being "flamed" for lack of a better word.

if it werent for this equality ALOT of us wouldnt be here, we wouldnt have the things we do have, and we wouldnt do the things we do today

[HyperTek]

I do wish we didnt have the people who have no moral values... i swear where im at, in school i always hear of the shady shit going on. People talking about robberies, stick ups etc. And its like glorified to see peoples faces light up with excitement "wow that foo is a G!!"

The bad thing is these people will reproduce, and their values get passed down thru generations.. Sure eventually these people clean up their acts, but whats done is done and you cant undue that.

I come from a old fashion family and good morals/ have a perfect clean record, and that shit just scares the shit out of me.. knowing that one day, I could get whipped out because I could have something that others might not have, or because I got rims on my ride and someone else wants em. I hate how Hood behavior is soo dam glorified. Please dont say im targeting urban media, i love me some hip hop, but too many people try to live hardcore gangster because thats what they see in movies and media. Don't forget, women love that bad boy image now too.

Wish it was just as easy as whipping them out and starting over with education but we cant do that. The only solution would be to educate from the git go... Make college tuition more affordable, dont allow people to get expelled from high schools etc.

[BustedS13]

eh, we wouldn't be shooting any Americans. plenty of room here.
i guess what i'm saying is if you televise it i'll watch

[jrbump]

Animals actions are controlled by instincts. Human beings have reason, emotion etc.

I think what the OP should do is move somewhere more in line with his ideas, Darfur, Mogadishu, Monrovia come to mind right off the bat.

Lastly I am interested in your thoughts if this solution was being considered by a society more powerful than ours, would it be ok then?

[SR240DET]

What is the most popular solution to an animal/species problem when it either outgrows its habitat, over eats and destroys its habitat or becomes a general nuisance?

We setup hunting seasons, issue hunting licenses and just find out ways to exterminate (solve) the problem.

Why cant this be done with people? I mean lots of people fit these same categorys, and we can justify killing lots and lots of animals to solve a problem so why cant it be done with people?

And please dont give me the obvious "we're the top of the food chain" crap or "we're human and they're just animals", even within humans there is a pecking order like strongest/weakest, smartest/dumbest.

Also please take this question with a grain of salt, its a hypothetical question I though about while watching the pig bomb documentary (if thats what you call it) on history or discovery.....I cant remember.


We have a solution for this and we been using it for quite some time now: ignorance, religion, and war. Take the ignorant people and teach them religion to take the fear away from death then start a war so they kill each other off,essentially, reducing the world population.

[90hatchie]

sometimes the really stupid ones will take care of themselves
like the girl from my town that fell out a window in spain taking a picture

[ronmcdon]

Ppl in the US kill themselves (and/or others) because of stupidity.
We aren't entirely immune to Darwinism, now or then.

[az_240]

Who would you hunt? You might as well join the military.

Reminds me of that It's Always Sunny episode.

[Otto347]

The bad thing is these people will reproduce, and their values get passed down thru generations.. Sure eventually these people clean up their acts, but whats done is done and you cant undue that.

The one thing that reminds me of is the Gangland program on History. The thought process of the majority of "gangsters" on that show is disturbing. And the fact that almost all the time they show these people teaching this shit to 6 and 7 year olds putting guns in their hands and dressing them up in gang colors. Fuck that, they all need to be taken out and executed shallow grave style. They have NO contribution to society other than to fuck things up then me and you end up paying for them to sit in jail for umteen years. Fuck that.

[sirfallsalot243]

I dont think we should ACTIVELY eliminate people, but I think society makes it too easy for the dumb to survive. Society prevents natural selection from taking place.

[OBEEWON]

War, disease, EVEN "natrual" disasters are man made population control. If you think there should be more, get a government job or apply to get in the Bilderburg group.

I seriously don't understand why people who suggest killing as a solution don't start with themselves????? Not even being funny.

[roninwon]

i think an easy way to start is child limitation laws saying that no couple can have more than 2 kids. that alone would cut down on population

[fckillerbee]

such a hard topic to discuss..... the words i have to use have to be really specific....

I believe in equal rights. To the extent that we are like any other species on this planet. I'm not saying we are equal to dogs, but where I have found this line is where we as humans are comparable to other animals...we breed, we have packs, we have confrontations, and we even kill our own race. Where I don't see the exception for example...is if a dog, who can show all emotions that a human has, will be put down for severely biting a human....usually because of its own situation, however, we are allowed to kill another human, put in timeout like a child, and then re-released into our pack completely capable of doing the same act.

this is where the line is...to me, not equal. So yes, if we can do this to an animal, what makes us any different than hitler killing off jews.

In Denver CO, all pitbulls were put down because they were deemed "unsafe". Now if Hitler was denver, and the jews were pitbulls, how is this any different than what we are doing now?

Iran doesn't want to comply, I would tell them the US is going to drop a bomb the size of russias bomb, and those who don't feel Iran is doing the right thing...can leave. Call me hitler, but that may just be my german coming out in me. lol.

this should be interesting!

[murda-c]

how do you decide who to kill? do you go by financial situation? education level? Health? Intelligence? "whatever as long as i'm not one of them?"

[sirfallsalot243]

i think an easy way to start is child limitation laws saying that no couple can have more than 2 kids. that alone would cut down on population

Good luck with that one. I can hear the hysteria now. "Aint nobody gonna tell me how many kids i can have! I cant support em, but god dammit, im gonna have fourteen of em!"

Then what happens when a woman gets pregnant with her 3rd? Force her to abort it? Pretty fucked up.

[fckillerbee]

how do you decide who to kill? do you go by financial situation? education level? Health? Intelligence? "whatever as long as i'm not one of them?"

benefit to society....

helping the cause...rather than being the cause?

[ronmcdon]

Thinking about this further,

I think the theory still applies somewhat.
Only instead of individual ppl,
We have social groups competing for limited resources.
In nature, it's more or less every creature for itself.
Among modern day human civilization, there are further factors & complexities.

Could be anything from corporations, governments, countries, etc.
Some cease to exist because they cannot compete.
Some dwindle in influence.
For instance, you could say the bad economy rooted out companies like Wamu that weren't prepared.
You could also say, as a country, we (the US) aren't quite to super-power we once were.

Therefore, its negligible to consider the survival of individual members of society.
We are merely a part of our society.
This is especially the case, for better or worse, in any society that promotes any welfare program.
The consequences fall on the state, more so than the individual.

The same theory applies more or less.
It's just the variables that have changed.

[spooled240]

i agree w/ this in a way.

I feel that by making welfare programs, section 8 housing and all sorts of government aid we are in a way creating a weaker human race that's dependent. In nature, it's the animals that can feed themselves and the ones that are intelligent and physically fit to stay alive. With humans, all you have to do is have 4 kids, file for welfare/unemployment and go to mcdonalds everyday.

i know welfare and unemployment is supposed to be temporary but thats rarely the case.

[dert420sx]

i've never condoned the systematic slaughter of animals just because they encroached onto human territory or their numbers exceeded our comfort level.
it's not ours in the first place. animals will just do what comes instictively, like search for food. humans are the only ones with rational thought and should be held to higher morals.

but again as mentioned, HOW do you choose who goes and who stays?
and maybe most importantly, WHO gets to choose? a man or woman? a white/black/asian/latino/etc. person?
by doing so, you are ultimately playing god and controlling other people's destinies for them.

there was mention of contribution to society. should that necessarily mean money? what about people who were born with disabilities that was completely out of their control? don't they have just as much of a chance to try to live a productive life as someone with all their parts intact/functioning?

why do you look at the splinter in your brother's eye, and not notice the beam which is in your own eye?

[fckillerbee]

i've never condoned the systematic slaughter of animals just because they encroached onto human territory or their numbers exceeded our comfort level.
it's not ours in the first place. animals will just do what comes instictively, like search for food. humans are the only ones with rational thought and should be held to higher morals.

but again as mentioned, HOW do you choose who goes and who stays?
and maybe most importantly, WHO gets to choose? a man or woman? a white/black/asian/latino/etc. person?
by doing so, you are ultimately playing god and controlling other people's destinies for them.

there was mention of contribution to society. should that necessarily mean money? what about people who were born with disabilities that was completely out of their control? don't they have just as much of a chance to try to live a productive life as someone with all their parts intact/functioning?

why do you look at the splinter in your brother's eye, and not notice the beam which is in your own eye?

very well put. I second this post!

[OBEEWON]

i agree w/ this in a way.

I feel that by making welfare programs, section 8 housing and all sorts of government aid we are in a way creating a weaker human race that's dependent. In nature, it's the animals that can feed themselves and the ones that are intelligent and physically fit to stay alive. With humans, all you have to do is have 4 kids, file for welfare/unemployment and go to mcdonalds everyday.

i know welfare and unemployment is supposed to be temporary but thats rarely the case.


^^Smart dude. You are absolutely right.

Just one correction. Welfare is designed to keep you in your place. It actually has built in penalizations for moving upward that cut you off before you get your feet under you, so you in effect fall right back down.

[amdnivram]

i've never condoned the systematic slaughter of animals just because they encroached onto human territory or their numbers exceeded our comfort level.
it's not ours in the first place. animals will just do what comes instictively, like search for food. humans are the only ones with rational thought and should be held to higher morals.

but again as mentioned, HOW do you choose who goes and who stays?
and maybe most importantly, WHO gets to choose? a man or woman? a white/black/asian/latino/etc. person?
by doing so, you are ultimately playing god and controlling other people's destinies for them.

there was mention of contribution to society. should that necessarily mean money? what about people who were born with disabilities that was completely out of their control? don't they have just as much of a chance to try to live a productive life as someone with all their parts intact/functioning?

why do you look at the splinter in your brother's eye, and not notice the beam which is in your own eye?
I think that because we are humans we want to see ourselves as more than just a mere animal. We create beliefs which connect us and make us closer to a god. This makes most people believe that because they are close to or made in the image of a creator that we can claim this world as ours to use as we see fit. Even without that same belief other variations which derive from what we see as rationality gives us this pedestal that as a species we stand on. And if this is the case, and we value moral and rational being more than those who live off of instinct. Can we then say that those who are mentally challenged and therefore cannot themselves be rational or hold a similar moral code if any are worth the same value as a immoral animal. Therefore they would be subhuman? I dont believe there is such a existing superiority based on either of these. Without considering these, the only reason why i see not killing others is so that they don't kill me. An agreement among species in which we agree to coexist. I dont do it because its immoral or any other reason. Its just convenient not to have to worry.

[spooled240]

^^Smart dude. You are absolutely right.

Just one correction. Welfare is designed to keep you in your place. It actually has built in penalizations for moving upward that cut you off before you get your feet under you, so you in effect fall right back down.

true, but that place that welfare keeps people in is not sustainable. Look at the animals that we take care of. We give them food everyday so they don't have to hunt and they sit on their ass all day getting fat lol. If they were just released in the wild one day just like if welfare and other government assistance was cut off from certain people, they would probably die.

Nature is cruel, the concept of survival of the fittest is cruel. Certain people would starve to death if we didn't help them out and I know I couldn't watch people starve and die right in front of me. I think we as humans try to be humane so we have programs that help each other out...but that comes with consequences, like an astronomical deficit lol

[ryguy]

i've never condoned the systematic slaughter of animals just because they encroached onto human territory or their numbers exceeded our comfort level.

The idea behind opening up the hunting quota on certain populations is because there is a natural ebb and flow of populations of animals when they consume all the food in their habitat, and a large population dies off regardless. At least this way, we get delicious deer jerky out of the deal.

[Otto347]

I dont think we should ACTIVELY eliminate people, but I think society makes it too easy for the dumb to survive. Society prevents natural selection from taking place.

Yup, I agree 100% Back in the day dumb people knew they were dumb and ugly people knew they were ugly. Not like today were you are told that just because you are dumb and ugly doesnt mean you cant do what everyone else is doing. Bullshit..........

i think an easy way to start is child limitation laws saying that no couple can have more than 2 kids. that alone would cut down on population

Bingo! this is a great start. Not as barbaric as what I suggested but more pc.

[HyperTek]

heres a start.. get rid of illegals and censor the media.. Too many dumbfucks are influenced by the media.. clean that shit up.. People see how blasting somebody in a movie is cool, girls being slutty and sleeping around etc.. Clean up the media. Its gonna be hard because the media is in it to make money though.

[SimpleSexy180]

Media?! Shadow government

[fckillerbee]

oh god how the media fucks things up....mass panic of the swine flu...O...M...G...the common cold has killed more people...makes you understand why the gov would hide aliens lol....mayan calender...end of the world...AAAAAHHHHHH.... dumb humans and their petty little brains.

[HalveBlue]

heres a start.. get rid of illegals and censor the media.. Too many dumbfucks are influenced by the media.. clean that shit up.. People see how blasting somebody in a movie is cool, girls being slutty and sleeping around etc.. Clean up the media. Its gonna be hard because the media is in it to make money though.

Plus there's that one thing...

Damn, what's it called again...oh, yeah, that's right, Freedom of the Press.

That's it.

[ronmcdon]

It's hard for me to tell if Hypertek is being sarcastic or not, lmao.
A lot of it is quote-worthy material no question.

Is censorship always bad?
Our economy prob wouldn't have suffered as much, had not the media made the fuss it did back in '08.
Hype about swine flu is more inconsequential.
You don't have to buy it if you don't want to, and nobody else is going to suffer as a result.

I've always wondered if we do infact have complete Freedom of Speech.
I think existing legal & economic factors have some indirect effect of censorship.
Legally, 'Slander & Libel' would be one form of censorship imo.

[I LUV MY S13]

i think an easy way to start is child limitation laws saying that no couple can have more than 2 kids. that alone would cut down on population

my professor in global studies brought up today that the US is actually depopulating right now, the average couple is having i think 1.62 children..i dont remember the exact number i have to dig through my notes but it was well under 2..which is necessary to populate

[fckillerbee]

my professor in global studies brought up today that the US is actually depopulating right now, the average couple is having i think 1.62 children..i dont remember the exact number i have to dig through my notes but it was well under 2..which is necessary to populate

maybe all the gays? lol jk. don't worry...we have china to populate the world. what are they up to now? 2/3rds population of the world?

[fckillerbee]

It's hard for me to tell if Hypertek is being sarcastic or not, lmao.
A lot of it is quote-worthy material no question.

Is censorship always bad?
Our economy prob wouldn't have suffered as much, had not the media made the fuss it did back in '08.
Hype about swine flu is more inconsequential.
You don't have to buy it if you don't want to, and nobody else is going to suffer as a result.

I've always wondered if we do infact have complete Freedom of Speech.
I think existing legal & economic factors have some indirect effect of censorship.
Legally, 'Slander & Libel' would be one form of censorship imo.

freedom of speech....goes hand in hand with grain of salt....I still can't yell bomb on a plane. lol

[OBEEWON]

The media is already censored by the government. FCC controls what is and isn't said. That's why you can hear about a stupid snowstorm 24/7 and not hear anything about people dying in Haiti or Thailand.

Like how do WE as normal citizens know that Iran is a Nuclear power? We have to believe what we are told..

Morality is what seperates us from animals. Once we lose that and kill each other we've debased our humanity.

[amdnivram]

The media is already censored by the government. FCC controls what is and isn't said. That's why you can hear about a stupid snowstorm 24/7 and not hear anything about people dying in Haiti.

Morality is what seperates us from animals. Once we lose that and kill each other we've debased our humanity.


This argument is pretty much what i was talking about lol, morality cant be used to seperate us from animals as a species since as a whole we do not share one uniform idea of this. SOme of us dont bother killing others because its inconvenient and not because of some moral code.

[InlineS13]

All that is non-viable in nature invariably perishes. We humans have transgressed the law of natural selection. Not only have we supported inferior life-forms, we have encouraged their propagation.

[ryguy]

my professor in global studies brought up today that the US is actually depopulating right now, the average couple is having i think 1.62 children..i dont remember the exact number i have to dig through my notes but it was well under 2..which is necessary to populate

Fertility rate to sustain a population is roughly 2.1, due to the fact that a percentage of the population will never reproduce, and some children will not live long enough to reproduce.

U.S. fertility rate was 2.05 in 2009, and has actually been on the rise in recent years (09 was a down year). 2008 actually had a fertility rate of 2.1. Our birth rate is still much higher than European nations.

[Otto347]

We humans have transgressed the law of natural selection. Not only have we supported inferior life-forms, we have encouraged their propagation.

:bigok::bigok::bigok::bigok: that's basically it.

[ronmcdon]

This argument is pretty much what i was talking about lol, morality cant be used to seperate us from animals as a species since as a whole we do not share one uniform idea of this. SOme of us dont bother killing others because its inconvenient and not because of some moral code.

Yes, this I would very much agree with.
Ppl have different values, and to an extent also differing views morals.

Even if somehow 'morals' make is special,
Are humans really 'better' than fellow animals?
I don't know how you would measure that.
More intelligent with certain tasks & abilities most likely.
More capable of cooperating/exploiting with members of the same (and select other) species perhaps.

Personally I don't really think we are all that different from wild animals.
In the end, were all looking to pursue the same goals: survive, eat, mate, maybe dominate the pecking order.
Civilization just offers more distractions presents ways for us to 'beat around the bush' a lot more.
Not that I think that's so terrible really.

[theicecreamdan]

All that is non-viable in nature invariably perishes. We humans have transgressed the law of natural selection. Not only have we supported inferior life-forms, we have encouraged their propagation.

Define what you mean by "inferior life forms."

[Otto347]

"inferior life forms."Really? Do you have to ask that? How many "reality" tv shows glorify being a complete and total moron, money hungry bitch, spoiled brat or other type of useless fuck?

[sirfallsalot243]

Define what you mean by "inferior life forms."

We could start with "snooki" and "the situation."














And finish with the rest of New Jersey. :rofl:

[thisisastickup]

I know I couldn't watch people starve and die right in front of me.
I definitely could. Can't feed yourself? Too fucking bad.

[jspaeth]

my professor in global studies brought up today that the US is actually depopulating right now, the average couple is having i think 1.62 children..i dont remember the exact number i have to dig through my notes but it was well under 2..which is necessary to populate


An important part of this would be to see WHO is having the kids.

My guess is that the people having more kids are PRECISELY the ones who should NOT be having them....poor, uneducated people.

Ironically, the ones who CAN afford them (educated, stable income) are probably having less.

However, there is of course the middle ground, where the act of having kids in and of itself effects your financial status.

Bottom line:

Having kids if you can't afford them is the best way to stay poor.

[slothonaleash]

Make it socially acceptable to be homosexual. 10% more babies not being born can't be bad.

[slothonaleash]

I definitely could. Can't feed yourself? Too fucking bad.

Man you so haaaaard

[RNGWLD]

What is the most popular solution to an animal/species problem when it either outgrows its habitat, over eats and destroys its habitat or becomes a general nuisance?

We setup hunting seasons, issue hunting licenses and just find out ways to exterminate (solve) the problem.

Why cant this be done with people? I mean lots of people fit these same categorys, and we can justify killing lots and lots of animals to solve a problem so why cant it be done with people?



:tweak:You are right. Its a great idea! WHY CANT IT BE DONE? IT WOULD SOLVE ALL WORLD PROBLEMS! I wonder what you are? White? Black? Asian? Hispanic? Atheist? Muslim? Protestant? Male? Female? Gay?

because whatever you are, some other group considers YOU AND YOUR KIND "the problem"

So yes, its a genius idea. I wonder why NO ONE in history has EVER considered it before!

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

JEWS/GYPSIES/COMMUNISTS/SLAVS/ NON ARYANS ARE THE PROBLEM!!

http://img.slate.com/media/1/123125/2158911/2159086/2159087/070221_CL_HitlerEX.jpg

NO, EVIL CAPITALIST PIGS/UNRULY UKRANIAN/EVERYONE I THINK DISAGREES WITH ME IS TEH PROBLEM!!

http://www.georgianbiography.com/images/stalin.jpg

YOU FOOLS! ITS MUSLIM BOSNIAKS AND CROATS WHO ARE TEH PROBLEM!!

http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/images/milosevic-photo.jpg

INFIDEL NOOBS! ITS ALL YOU WESTERN INFIDELS WHO ARE TEH PROBLEM!!!

http://loatay.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/osama-bin-laden.jpg

AND THE ARMENIANS, DON'T FORGET THEY ARE THE PROBLEM!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Mehmet_Talat_Pasha.jpg/225px-Mehmet_Talat_Pasha.jpg

STUPID WHITE MEN! IT BE TUTSIS WHO BE TEH PROBLEM! OMGZORS11!!!!

http://www.wehaitians.com/rwan_1.jpg


GET THE POINT, GENIUS?


For everyone who says "inferior human beings(according to my definition of inferior) are teh problem", you are in good company with the exemplary human beings pictured above. Way to go, you superior uber human beings, you

[bornslippy73]

Unfortunately where we live, in this country or anywhere else there will always be people with opinions that may appear irrational to say the least. Sure, let natural selection take its course on others or we can help/send aid to others. Or we can go "hunting" on certain people.

I agree with just about all the replies here, but the most important concern is as individuals we should not stop living and bettering ourselves. Stay focused on what you need to do for yourself. Stay driven to accomplish your goals. Surprisingly your success does help others indirectly. If you still you are not doing enough for the greater good then you can always volunteer.

[ronmcdon]

^^^

no need for the hostility.
my impression was the OP was prompting a discussion,
not making a statement.

[Bubbles]

We could start with "snooki" and "the situation."




I like the situation.

[Otto347]

my impression was the OP was prompting a discussion,
not making a statement.

Thank you.......

[Otto347]

GET THE POINT, GENIUS?


Also please take this question with a grain of salt, its a hypothetical question I though about while watching the pig bomb documentary (if thats what you call it) on history or discovery.....I cant remember.

Obviously every single other person in the thread got this except you. Genius? Not really, you on the other hand...................lol never mind :kiss: Also I wasn't pointing the finger at any particular race/religion GENIUS

[victorw210]

my mom works for a company that houses feeds and generally does everything for mentally retarded adults or adults with other development issues. Its rediculous how much help these people need to live.Many of them cant walk, feed themselves,or eat soolid food or even take care of hygeine by themselves or dress themselves.One time a lady she was taking care of almost died because she no joke fell face first into her soup and almost drowned because she could not pull her own head out of her bowl of soup.I think it is stupid to keep these kinds of people alive.It may sound horrible but people that cant take care of even basic things to survive like eating food given to them have already been choosen by nature to die.I dont really consider them human beings there more like a plant that just sits there and u have to give water and light and it provides almost nothing and would die without you.

[roninwon]

^^^dude you went a little too far. it was not their choice to be born that way and cause we as humans have a natural caring instinct we provide for them no matter the burden. you mom doesn't have to work at that place it was her choice.

[Bubbles]

Not like today were you are told that just because you are dumb and ugly doesnt mean you cant do what everyone else is doing.


Why ugly?

Ugly people don't deserve to have basic rights?


Maybe not modeling but ugly people can't change the fact they were born ugly.

[tsx1racer04]

my mom works for a company that houses feeds and generally does everything for mentally retarded adults or adults with other development issues. Its rediculous how much help these people need to live.Many of them cant walk, feed themselves,or eat soolid food or even take care of hygeine by themselves or dress themselves.One time a lady she was taking care of almost died because she no joke fell face first into her soup and almost drowned because she could not pull her own head out of her bowl of soup.I think it is stupid to keep these kinds of people alive.It may sound horrible but people that cant take care of even basic things to survive like eating food given to them have already been choosen by nature to die.I dont really consider them human beings there more like a plant that just sits there and u have to give water and light and it provides almost nothing and would die without you.


Well, I hope the rest of the world doesn't think this at all. However, if you were in their shoes, I am 100% sure you would want someone like your mother's help.

Oh yeah, to answer the OP's question. I think world famine would probably be the most logical choice in controlling the population.

[Otto347]

Why ugly?

Ugly people don't deserve to have basic rights?


Maybe not modeling but ugly people can't change the fact they were born ugly.
Maybe the ugly people was a little off track. Maybe more along the lines of fat people?

[sirfallsalot243]

There should be no more life sentences to prison.

If theyre bad enough to lock up forever, theyre bad enough to euthanize.

[theicecreamdan]

I just wonder where everybody's assumptions are before I ask more questions. This whole idea is ridiculous, it hasn't worked out well for anybody in the past, and its not going to be the answer any time in the future.

Really? Do you have to ask that? How many "reality" tv shows glorify being a complete and total moron, money hungry bitch, spoiled brat or other type of useless fuck?

Prove to me that being a moron, money hungry, bitchy, spoiled or "useless" are genetic traits.
Since you can't do that you can't show that we are producing "inferior" life forms.

Every problem that anybody has complained about in this thread is a social problem, and we all contribute to them. If you don't like The Situation and Snooki; then you have already contributed to their existence by knowing who they are.

If you think we shouldn't take care of the ill, then hand your mom the loaded gun, and start filling out her unemployment paperwork.

We don't do shit like this because enough people realize that when humans start playing god things don't go as planned.

[amdnivram]

I just wonder where everybody's assumptions are before I ask more questions. This whole idea is ridiculous, it hasn't worked out well for anybody in the past, and its not going to be the answer any time in the future.



Prove to me that being a moron, money hungry, bitchy, spoiled or "useless" are genetic traits.
Since you can't do that you can't show that we are producing "inferior" life forms.

Every problem that anybody has complained about in this thread is a social problem, and we all contribute to them. If you don't like The Situation and Snooki; then you have already contributed to their existence by knowing who they are.

If you think we shouldn't take care of the ill, then hand your mom the loaded gun, and start filling out her unemployment paperwork.

We don't do shit like this because enough people realize that when humans start playing god things don't go as planned.

what do you mean "if" we start playing god. Thats all we've been doing as a species. We've increased our life span to the point where we are still alive even after we can tend to ourselves. All we do is play god, we are just setting limits that state how far we can let things go. There are some cases in which people become useless because they cannot care for themselves. We are not producing inferior life forms, but we are promoting stupidity and other traits that weight us down as a species. We allow people who normally would be dead because of their inferior traits which include being a moron and etc, to continue living only because they can use the crutch called technology and society. Personally i wouldn't want to live unless i can sustain myself, i don't want to fool myself in thinking that i should be allowed to live as long as i want even if that means being carried through life. Through none of this was i talking about financial struggles since most are people who are completely able.

[theicecreamdan]

So lets kill off all the non-productive people and put a ban on all technology that improves our quality of life. Just so we can be more "sustainable".

For the most part we aren't playing God at all. We might as well be playing compared to God if you think that designing technology is Godplay. I'm talking about the main idea of this thread, the idea that we can pass judgement on ______ group of people. The fats, the gays, the stupids, the blacks, the jews.

[amdnivram]

So lets kill off all the non-productive people and put a ban on all technology that improves our quality of life. Just so we can be more "sustainable".

For the most part we aren't playing God at all. We might as well be playing compared to God if you think that designing technology is Godplay. I'm talking about the main idea of this thread, the idea that we can pass judgement on ______ group of people. The fats, the gays, the stupids, the blacks, the jews.

im not saying that we should stop using technology but that if we are already taking these steps, going further cannot be argued against. I don't think we can pass judgment based on race or sexual preference, but if the individual isn't productive why not? I know its harsh but i don't see the justification in helping people who in no way can help themselves. If there was a possibility of being able to acquire help and benefit by it while learning to become productive and self sustainable then sure, unfortunately this is not the case.

[HalveBlue]

im not saying that we should stop using technology but that if we are already taking these steps, going further cannot be argued against. I don't think we can pass judgment based on race or sexual preference, but if the individual isn't productive why not? I know its harsh but i don't see the justification in helping people who in no way can help themselves. If there was a possibility of being able to acquire help and benefit by it while learning to become productive and self sustainable then sure, unfortunately this is not the case.

There are several logical faults in your arguments.

1. Self-sufficiency is a farce. We live in a stratified society, which by definition means that we're all dependent on each other. This is a good thing. If we were all self-sufficient, the majority of your time would be spend trying to feed yourself. Our specialized economy has enabled us to allocated resources more efficiently, allowing us to focus on increasing our standard of living and quality of life.

2. Define productivity. It's not as simple as saying you're either productive or not. What about people that get laid off from work because of bad decision made by their employers, or other factors wholly independent of themselves? What about people that are injured or sick?

3. Almost every organism has a self-preservation instinct. Most people don't act kindly towards efforts to terminate their lives. In systems where individuals or segments of the population are severely disenfranchised there tends to be a lot of turbulence. For example, if someone doesn't have enough money to afford food, chances are they aren't going to sit there timidly and accept their fate. No, they're probably going to steal, lie, and cheat in order to eat. Taken to a large enough scale you'll have situations like the what happened in 18th century France.

"Let them eat cake!"

[amdnivram]

^^^^^

1.By self sufficient i meant able to live without the constant help of others, now being the dependency that we display within our society is completely different. We depend on others to provide services and products, we exchange either for what we need. Th group im referring to is that which cannot do either. They have nothing to give and therefore should not receive anything in return. Being completely dependent without being useful in anyway should not be something that's encouraged. By supporting them all we are doing is opening our arms to the production of defective people within our society.

2.alright well by productive i mean the possibility of being able to produce something beneficial to him/herself or whatever society they are in. Anything they can offer in return for what they need to have a decent living.

3. Now a direct action doesn't have to be used in order to weed out those not able. Giving a helpful tap to those able and just down would encourage them to become productive and have something to offer. Those who cannot advance with that slight tap should not be given further help or a crutch. IF they have to resort to stealing because they are not willing then they deserve no pitty. I am not taking into class struggles into consideration because the ability to leave would be there. Yes there will be a struggle to overcome that, but if they are willing i do not see why its not possible. If they want to give up and have someone support them then they are expecting to have everything handed to them.

From personal experience, my childhood was one in which my family lived in a small quarter with one bathroom and a living room/kitchen. We did not have much money or a form of transportation.In a household of 5 people its not easy to feed all of them and buy any luxuries. Never have my parents asked for aid from the government and now they own a 500k house, 3 cars bought new within the last 6 years, and a nice amount waiting for their retirement. I guess you can say we were in poverty, but with initiative they quickly moved the hell out of there and became productive. If this was possible i don't see why other cannot do the same, nothing played a role in their success besides their will and hard work. So if people cannot work hard enough then in poverty is where they belong and i don't see why other should have the burden of pulling them out.



( now i hope no one asks what i mean by a decent living, or what benefits one could provide to society because if that's the case, this topic is something over ones head.- this isn't directed towards anyone, just saying )

[SlideWell]

i believe birth control is the 1st step in population control. i think people should have to be approved to have a child or two.

[Silviaoneday]

i believe birth control is the 1st step in population control. i think people should have to be approved to have a child or two.


LOL hell ya asian status!!

1. I do agree in some form of welfare. The ones who DESERVE it are the hard working families that hit bad times and need something to fall back on. The ones who don't deserve welfare are the ones driving Yukons on 22's,section 8 homes, the ones who sell drugs,do drugs. As a previous business owner I watched those kind of people come in and try and purchase cigarettes,alcohol with their EBT then drive off in a new car.

2. Healthcare, I do agree in healthcare, OBAMACARE NO! You have people out there who are in need of healthcare but don't meet the prerequisites: race,children,citizenship, we know what I'm refering to. Prime example college kid living on his own, takes responsibilty for his own bills, no job, but parents make to much money, trust me I know Ive been there. That student deserves it more then a lot of the people who receive these benefits.

3. Education, how can we cut education? There is not a logical answer for this, but then again we have a president who reads a telepromter to 6th graders:duh:

To sum it up, people are getting tired of working there buts off paying there taxes, abiding by the law while others abuse the law, rape the U.S. for benefits and live a better life. Anyone who knows how it is to work hard in life probably wont disagree with that statement. The ones who will are the people who soly rely on the government for help instead going out there and working like everyone else.

4. The war, yes the war we are fighting now costs a lot of money. Being there now with the situation here in America may not be the best, but it's what we have to do. There has been way to many acts of terrorism as we know just in the past few months. With these other countries developing nuclear weapons, should show us as America what their intentions are. We need to protect our own people and provide for them!!!

[jspaeth]

1. I do agree in some form of welfare. The ones who DESERVE it are the hard working families that hit bad times and need something to fall back on. The ones who don't deserve welfare are the ones driving Yukons on 22's,section 8 homes, the ones who sell drugs,do drugs. As a previous business owner I watched those kind of people come in and try and purchase cigarettes,alcohol with their EBT then drive off in a new car!

THIS is what pisses most people (including me off)....that there seem to be so many people just using/taking advantage of the system.

What a fucking joke our country is becoming....we penalize hard work and success with high taxes so that scumbags and trash can freeload.

[Otto347]

What a fucking joke our country is becoming....we penalize hard work and success with high taxes so that scumbags and trash can freeload.

And yet another good point.

[90hatchie]

i think u should be limited to how many kids you have based on ur income

[RNGWLD]

Obviously every single other person in the thread got this except you. Genius? Not really, you on the other hand...................lol never mind :kiss: Also I wasn't pointing the finger at any particular race/religion GENIUS


Dude,

just the fact that you simply ask "um, hypothetically speaking, I don't understand why we can't exterminate people that are a problem like we exterminate animals", in this day and age, merits that response. Wanna know something funny? just the fact that you posted that question on a friggin car forum would make some people think that you are part of "everything thats wrong with the world."

You asked a hypothetical question, and I gave a straight up answer. I even threw in illustrations with captions even a 6th grader could understand, so hopefully anyone with a couple of brain cells would understand how fucking ironic history is....

Hell, just by reading through this thread is enough to confirm my point. A lot of people can't stop talking about "inferior life forms", "letting the not-self sufficient fend off by themselves", all the way up to "hey lets kill off the kids with down syndrome". (And unsurprisingly, it wasn't long before someone threw in "Zomg Obamacare socialist communism eeeevillll 1111!!!) Im just pointing out that every time you point your fingers at someone and say "hey these people are the problem they are not awesome like me!!", some one else is looking right at you and saying the same shit.

[Otto347]

blah blah blah.....blah blah blah

what was that, didn't quite hear you?

[0100]

I really think that society today has destroyed the basic human concept of survival of the fittest by trying to make thing equal for everyone.
I'm sure that lots of people think about this but no one would dare to bring it up or do it first in fear of being "flamed" for lack of a better word.

This is the first time I looked into this sub forum, because I am really not into politics and shit, because it enrages me, no seriously, like I may end up in prison for life because of it... but anyways.

I agree 100%.

I look at our society and it's pathetic. Survival of the fittest is [was] in place for a reason. The weak, dumb, etc die off. That is GOOD for society. That is the way it suppose to work. The strong and smart live on and procreate with better odds of creating a smart strong offspring. Natural selection. Very Very important in evolution.

I was at the grocery store the other day and an obese man about 40 who couldn't even walk, had to use a motorized cart with an O2 tank on the back, was going about buying food with no fear.

Can you imagine if this was the wild (no motorized cart, no O2, no van with wheelchair lift, no wheelchair accessed government paid house, no food stamps, no welfare check). The 400lb blob of a "man" who can barely breath on his own, never mine walk, would have been hunted and eaten by humans or what not in seconds.

Instead he goes about living like a dumb blob of a human, procreating if he wishes. Creating more dumb weak blobs. Blobs that will be protected by our very own society.

Blobs are just one example, I could give plenty more examples of "humans" that wouldn't last a day if we truly did live in a survival of the fittest society.

This is why I hate politics, our government and taxes. I have to bust my ass and pay taxes for a system that rewards the weak and stupid.

[0100]

I just wonder where everybody's assumptions are before I ask more questions. This whole idea is ridiculous, it hasn't worked out well for anybody in the past, and its not going to be the answer any time in the future.



Prove to me that being a moron, money hungry, bitchy, spoiled or "useless" are genetic traits.
Since you can't do that you can't show that we are producing "inferior" life forms.

Every problem that anybody has complained about in this thread is a social problem, and we all contribute to them. If you don't like The Situation and Snooki; then you have already contributed to their existence by knowing who they are.

If you think we shouldn't take care of the ill, then hand your mom the loaded gun, and start filling out her unemployment paperwork.

We don't do shit like this because enough people realize that when humans start playing god things don't go as planned.

I guess I will chime in and say I am not saying gun them down, but we really do have lots of people living (if you want to call it that) because of our advances in medical technology. Yes it's fine if that person can now (after receiving out advanced medical help) contribute positively in our society, and go on living. I'm all for it, but someone in bed not even in their right mind is a complete waste. I already told my wife if I ever end up like that pull the plug. We are not meant to live like that. I put my dog down, and I can tell you right now I loved her more than anything. I would put myself down before that old girl.

I get MR pt's a lot and when they get sick, they get really sick. Advance MR pt's really can't do anything for themselves and these pt are 30, 40, 50 years old. Again they can't do much of anything for themselves and they made it to 50 years old. How is that even possible, because of the society we live in, that's how.

I am not trying to sound cruel but these people wouldn't have made it that long in a survival of the fittest society. It's designed to cut out the weak before they can procreate. I am honestly not saying this stuff to sound like a psycho monster. The system is there for a very good reason "scientifically speaking".

Elderly portion of the population is another part of the system. They paid their dues and that is why the society should (and does in the wild) protect them just as they do the babies. Babies and elderly are protected in the wild by their pack or what not, they don't however protect a weak, sick or deformed baby. It's en-grained that it would only bring the pack down.



Prove to me that being a moron, money hungry, bitchy, spoiled or "useless" are genetic traits.
Since you can't do that you can't show that we are producing "inferior" life forms.

Moron and useless could definitely be genetic traits. Taken to the extreme an advanced MR person is both those.

Let just say scientifically speaking. don't bring in anything moral or what is right or wrong. Not saying it's right.

Say our society had a test at birth like the APGAR test we have now, but on a more extreme level. If the baby passes he/she lives, if the baby fails it gets terminated.

Then at every birth day you take a test specifically designed to weed out the weak(physically, mentally, creatively).

Say 2000 years ago we started that, which society do you think would be more advanced? Our current society or the tested society. Answer honestly.

My answer is the tested society. I really do believe that. Not that I test my two sons on their birthday and kill them if they fail. BUT I am always trying to advance them because it is my job as a parent. Will some low life who doesn't even want to work, put as much effort into educating their child(advancing the society) as I do, probably not but who knows. My oldest son at 2 years 10 months, is light years ahead of kids in his same age group. I am always challenging him mentally and physically and the best part is he doesn't even know it. Because everything I do with him is like a game. Like Ninja Warrior. He loves playing ninja warrior but doesn't realize the course he has fun playing on is creating awesome dexterity and strength. Building his skateboard is fun to him but not even 3 and knowing what the bearings are and why the wheels need them, and why they need to be cleaned and oiled, is an education on friction and mechanics. We don't just mindlessly put the skateboard together, we talk about it and what each part does and why it is there. May god strike me down he can tell me what food has a little protein, a lot of protein, sugar. Again we don't just mindlessly sit there and eat a snack. I am not some crazy drill Sargent either. I am actually one of the silliest dudes you will ever meet, and that is why I think they learn so much from me. Kids learn for song and games. Sorry went off on a tangent, but the point is.... A society of mentally and physically strong people are going to want their off springs to advance the best they can. Versus someone who is mentally and physically weak will most likely not have as much drive and/or ability to advance their off spring. I said most likely as I don't have time to research it, and really don't want to waste any more of my time to prove my point.

[murda-c]

Does this mean that if any of you were to lose your job and then a few months later become a high level quadriplegic you would refuse help if you couldn't afford it?

[0100]

Does this mean that if any of you were to lose your job and then a few months later become a high level quadriplegic you would refuse help if you couldn't afford it?

In the survival of the fittest society you would never be asked for that help weather you wanted it or not.

People are trying to turn this into a moral question it's a scientific question.

[amdnivram]

Dude,

just the fact that you simply ask "um, hypothetically speaking, I don't understand why we can't exterminate people that are a problem like we exterminate animals", in this day and age, merits that response. Wanna know something funny? just the fact that you posted that question on a friggin car forum would make some people think that you are part of "everything thats wrong with the world."

You asked a hypothetical question, and I gave a straight up answer. I even threw in illustrations with captions even a 6th grader could understand, so hopefully anyone with a couple of brain cells would understand how fucking ironic history is....

Hell, just by reading through this thread is enough to confirm my point. A lot of people can't stop talking about "inferior life forms", "letting the not-self sufficient fend off by themselves", all the way up to "hey lets kill off the kids with down syndrome". (And unsurprisingly, it wasn't long before someone threw in "Zomg Obamacare socialist communism eeeevillll 1111!!!) Im just pointing out that every time you point your fingers at someone and say "hey these people are the problem they are not awesome like me!!", some one else is looking right at you and saying the same shit.

even if it does become a moral questions, morality has never been uniform. As horrible as it may seem i see nothing wrong with refusing to help those who can help themselves, but choose not to. And to comment on RNGWLD, i just don't thin your getting what everyone else is talking about. I'm sure that in the past the " inferior beings" were strictly race and sexuality bound. From what i've read and what my interpretation of the question was, has nothing to do with race or sexuality. It is addressing a issue that transcends this and belong to no specific area. your trying to argue against something was was never mentioned to begin with. We are not looking for what some prejudice individuals would say, so unless we are a leach on society i dont see how any of us would qualify for that. If some upper class indivudual said that im inferior because of my race and social/economic status i would have to ask why. I am not poor,and i do provide some sort of beneficial product to society and therefore by just using logic it would no longer become an argument based on facts. No one here is taking an extreme view to this and saying that race,sexual preference, gender, or class would be the determining factor as to what is an inferior life form. Any arguments using these illogical points are obvious not valid and born out of pure stupidity. In the end its just a logic that providing everything that one needs for success will just make them weak minded and heavily dependent on other just to survive. Its not about being better than someone else, its about the amount of effort you put into being where you are that makes this an argument. No matter how hard the situation at one point there has been a chance to move on.

[datboibrad]

so whats being said is we should be ok with the idea of Genocide? we send how many troops to different nations fighting the exact same ideology? i mean i could be way off base or reading to much into this thread, but it sounds quite hypocritical.

but i do agree and have come across many a fellow while catering to the public that this earth would be better off without.

[amdnivram]

yeah its all hypothetical, but i am cold-hearted and its not genocide if your acts are not directly causing death. All i'm talking about the the refusal to continuously help people for long spans of time, if this causes the weak to not survive then so be it. Everyone should have a chance to get help, but not if they are solely dependent on it and have no intentions of moving on and bettering themselves.

[OBEEWON]

Survival of the fittest only works with animals. We have to ability to reason, use morality, empathy etc. I doubt anyone here could survive on thier own in the true sense of natrual selection. I bet most on here can't even cook a meal, much less plant and harvest.

[OBEEWON]

This argument is pretty much what i was talking about lol, morality cant be used to seperate us from animals as a species since as a whole we do not share one uniform idea of this. SOme of us dont bother killing others because its inconvenient and not because of some moral code.

Just because there is not a census does not mean that morality is mute. There are lots of "opinions" on morality but bias aside humanity knows the general bounds. This is law comes from. It's not a coincidence that all countries have similar laws i.e. - murder, kidnapping, rape, etc. so that argument is not really valid.

Otherwise no one would have stopped Hitler.

[OBEEWON]

:tweak:You are right. Its a great idea! WHY CANT IT BE DONE? IT WOULD SOLVE ALL WORLD PROBLEMS! I wonder what you are? White? Black? Asian? Hispanic? Atheist? Muslim? Protestant? Male? Female? Gay?

because whatever you are, some other group considers YOU AND YOUR KIND "the problem"

So yes, its a genius idea. I wonder why NO ONE in history has EVER considered it before!

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

JEWS/GYPSIES/COMMUNISTS/SLAVS/ NON ARYANS ARE THE PROBLEM!!

http://img.slate.com/media/1/123125/2158911/2159086/2159087/070221_CL_HitlerEX.jpg

NO, EVIL CAPITALIST PIGS/UNRULY UKRANIAN/EVERYONE I THINK DISAGREES WITH ME IS TEH PROBLEM!!

http://www.georgianbiography.com/images/stalin.jpg

YOU FOOLS! ITS MUSLIM BOSNIAKS AND CROATS WHO ARE TEH PROBLEM!!

http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/images/milosevic-photo.jpg

INFIDEL NOOBS! ITS ALL YOU WESTERN INFIDELS WHO ARE TEH PROBLEM!!!

http://loatay.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/osama-bin-laden.jpg

AND THE ARMENIANS, DON'T FORGET THEY ARE THE PROBLEM!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Mehmet_Talat_Pasha.jpg/225px-Mehmet_Talat_Pasha.jpg

STUPID WHITE MEN! IT BE TUTSIS WHO BE TEH PROBLEM! OMGZORS11!!!!

http://www.wehaitians.com/rwan_1.jpg


GET THE POINT, GENIUS?


For everyone who says "inferior human beings(according to my definition of inferior) are teh problem", you are in good company with the exemplary human beings pictured above. Way to go, you superior uber human beings, you

Summed up,

Cosign

[amdnivram]

Just because there is not a census does not mean that morality is mute. There are lots of "opinions" on morality but bias aside humanity knows the general bounds. This is law comes from. It's not a coincidence that all countries have similar laws i.e. - murder, kidnapping, rape, etc. so that argument is not really valid.

Otherwise no one would have stopped Hitler.

It can also be argued that the only reason why the general bounds for morality exist is only because it is the most convenient thing to do. Not because they empathize for others but because it would be much easier to live without having to worry about being murdered or stolen from. I'm sure that in come cases morality can come to play, but because we don't all share a uniform idea of it the possibility of ulterior motives is completely justified and true for some cases.

[jspaeth]

Survival of the fittest only works with animals. We have to ability to reason, use morality, empathy etc. I doubt anyone here could survive on thier own in the true sense of natrual selection. I bet most on here can't even cook a meal, much less plant and harvest.

Although most of could not "survive on our own", the reason society and standard of living increases, is because different people provide different goods and services (specialization) that COLLECTIVELY makes us better.

Even with complete anarchy, people would survive, because they could HELP each other.

What you are NOT getting, is that there are A LOT of people out there that don't do JACK shit to give back. Their contribution to society is NET NEGATIVE.

I can't grow food or do heart surgery or run a mile very fast, but there are a lot of other things I can do that people are willing to pay me for in our society in exchange for giving me food, housing, etc.

People that just sit around like lumps on a log collecting from the government and then buy drugs or rims for their cars that they bought from their "tax credits" (how can you get a credit for taxes you never payed?) deserve to be CUT OFF. They don't contribute anything.

[0100]

^+1

OBEEWON we are animals (homo sapiens), and survival of the fittest does and is working with us animals, just not in the effect it suppose to be. We can never get rid of it 100%, but we are pretty damn close with our society, and all it's doing is hurting us as a whole.

OBEEWON & RNGWLD, you guys are missing the point. It has absolutely nothing to do with race, color, or creed. Nothing.

I am not saying not to help out your fellow man, just don't spoon feed him. If you give a man a fish.... Even in the wild animals will help each other out, just look at an ant colony. The animals in the wild however know when enough help is enough.

[ronmcdon]

For those who contribute less,
there's some degree of responsibility that also falls on our government.
The government gives questionable incentives.
If people can take advantage of certain things, they simply will.
I.e., you make it convenient for ppl to leech, they probably will consider it.

If you want to encourage ppl to be a bit more self-sufficient (within modern day society),
simply reward productivity, and not complacency.
you don't have to go to rash measures like genocide.
you don't even have to punish ppl.

there's also a lot to be said about the dismal efficiency & effectiveness of our public system,
but that's another can of worms.

[Otto347]

If people can take advantage of certain things, they simply will.
I.e., you make it convenient for ppl to leech, they probably will consider it.

Thats the damn truth. I have a co worker that does this multiple times on a daily basis. Ignores the rules, fucks around, texts on his phone, sits in the bathroom for 30 god damn minutes but then again the owner of the company is a fucking pussy and nothing is ever done about it so it gets worse. That type of shit gets me fucking livid, not to mention this kid is 21 and guess what? His girlfriend is pregnant and they are having a kid in another few months. I just see what a worthless fuck this guy is and he is breeding? We can solve this problem right now, allthough my way is a bit harsh and would involve a gun and shallow hole DO NOT LET USELESS FUCKS BREED! Oh if only I was aroung in another 200 years to see if Idiocracy will come true one day.....................

I like 0100s idea about the test, youre born, you test, you fail, you die. You pass you live. Just like the good ol Spartans! lol

[jspaeth]

I am not saying not to help out your fellow man, just don't spoon feed him. If you give a man a fish.... Even in the wild animals will help each other out, just look at an ant colony. The animals in the wild however know when enough help is enough.

Personally, I have NO problem giving to CERTAIN groups of people, without expecting ANYTHING from those people:

Handicapped people
Mentally challenged
Wounded veterans
Giving loans (need to be repaid) to people going through a rough time.


What I DO have a HUGE problem with is the handout society we've created in which people feel that it is their RIGHT to healthcare, having a nice house, etc.

Generally speaking, the people that i fell need to "go" are the ones who ARE physically and capable of learning a skill or doing something (ANYTHING, like digging a ditch, carrying something around, filing a woman's nails, ANYTHING) to earn their keep, but they are instead just GIVEN things without having to pay back.


EDIT: And I do not mean to say that in a bad way. Any job, no matter how "medial" is a contribution to society. If someone is willing to pay for something or trade their goods/services for it, it is valuable.

Being able to paint pictures that no one will buy or being the best basketball player in your neighborhood are NOT considered valuable according to my definition. If someone will buy the pictures or higher you to play basketball, then you become valuable.

[OBEEWON]

I cannot agree that we are animals. That is just plain incorrect.

I do not like/agree with those who "take advantage of the government" and survive on freebee's. But the funny thing is even those free loaders provide stimulus to the country. Thier existence is not 100% parasitic. If they ceased to exist there would be massive reprocussions.

I would argue big wigs in financial institutions take more advantage of the government and are responsible for upsetting the symbiotic balance of society more so than welfare recipients. Welfare has never caused a country to decline.

There are just too many things not being factored in, and too many assumptions being made. If everyone started from the same blocks then these arguements would be valid.

No one is in the position to determine who lives and dies. Just because one doesn't believe in something does not mean it does not exist. Morality is real. Humanity is real. There are boundries to living.

If you don't want something done to you, don't do it to someone else. If we could do this there would be no issues.


The more government present the more societal problems permiate communities. Less government = more personal responsibility. Government encourages apathy and blame. Government tells you it's not your fault you are an idiot, so we will fix it for you.

Example: No child left behind sounds good, but it in fact makes for less qualified graduates.

[jspaeth]

I do not like/agree with those who "take advantage of the government" and survive on freebee's. But the funny thing is even those free loaders provide stimulus to the country. Thier existence is not 100% parasitic. If they ceased to exist there would be massive reprocussions. Welfare has never caused a country to decline.

I disagree, because the money that pays for these people comes out of someone else's pocket, someone who would be also spend the money and put it back into the economy.

YES, the freeloaders are parasitic.


The more government present the more societal problems permiate communities. Less government = more personal responsibility. Government encourages apathy and blame. Government tells you it's not your fault you are an idiot, so we will fix it for you.

Example: No child left behind sounds good, but it in fact makes for less qualified graduates.

This part is true.

[RNGWLD]

what was that, didn't quite hear you?

My bad. I forgot who I was talking too. Im sorry I didn't include big pictures with captions this time:jerkit: I'll try to include more colorful illustrations next time

^+1

OBEEWON & RNGWLD, you guys are missing the point. It has absolutely nothing to do with race, color, or creed. Nothing.

I am not saying not to help out your fellow man, just don't spoon feed him. If you give a man a fish.... Even in the wild animals will help each other out, just look at an ant colony. The animals in the wild however know when enough help is enough.

I just think its funny to hear so many people bitch about "survival of the fittest" and advocate social Darwinism taken to such an extreme as to encourage social eugenics as if "they" were all that. On a freaking online car forum.

Just the simple fact that you have a luxury such as a car, that most of us use more like a toy/recreational vehicle, and that you have the time and means to go into an online forum to talk about how cool your ride is, puts you amongst some of the most pampered and privileged % of the world's population. Something tells me that all these tough guys talking about survival of the fittest and wiping out "the weak" would shit their pants if they stepped outside the safety boundaries of their little enclosed world in America.

Its easy to say "cant make a living? too bad!" when you live in a country where you actually can make a pretty decent living by being a hardworker and where the government provides you with safety. Its real easy to feel entitled and superior because "your hard work got you where you are", when you live under conditions where this is basically guaranteed and the system is set up to help you. In comparison to other parts of the world, we are spoon fed and babied.

And no, for all the aspiring Mengeles, its not just a scientific question. This shit was discussed and taken seriously like back in the 19th/early 20th century, when people actually took seriously the arguments being presented here about the need to separate the strong for the weak, the "useful" from the "not useful".

Do you think Hitler just burst into the scene and said "hi ppl lets murder all the mentally handicapped/gypsies/jews/inferior beings!" ? No. He, and the hundreds of scientists and doctors which helped perpetrate the Genocide where the logical outcome of decades and decades of intellectual and scientific views which advocated eugenics and questioned whether "superior" human beings had more rights than "inferior" ones. If you read their letters/papers/arguments, they are frightengly similar to some of the comments posted by some people here. In other words, nothing said by these people on the subject is either original, new, or particularly smart. This shit went out of style like a hundred years ago. Please get with the fucking times.

[OBEEWON]

Again I agree^^

I disagree, because the money that pays for these people comes out of someone else's pocket, someone who would be also spend the money and put it back into the economy.

YES, the freeloaders are parasitic.



No argument that "freeloaders" have a drain on our country. But thier stimulus cannot be denied. If the money came from peoples taxes (pockets) and stayed in the welfare system I could agree. But a dollar stays in a welfare recipients household much faster than any other community. It is spent and put into the economy right away. They recieve vouchers and subsidized living, not cash.

Aside from that the US has the most wealthy "poor" in the whole world.



Time on AFDC
---------------------------
Less than 7 months 19.0%
7 to 12 months 15.2
One to two years 19.3
Two to five years 26.9
Over five years 19.6

Number of children
-------------------
One 43.2%
Two 30.7
Three 15.8
Four or more 10.3

Age of Mother
------------------
Teenager 7.6%
20 - 29 47.9
30 - 39 32.7
40 or older 11.8

Status of Father 1973 1992
-------------------------------------
Divorced or separated 46.5% 28.6
Deceased 5.0 1.6
Unemployed or Disabled 14.3 9.0
Not married to mother 31.5 55.3
Other or Unknown 2.7 5.5

Interesting link to some welfare myths.

https://www.msu.edu/user/skourtes/myths.html

[HalveBlue]

My bad. I forgot who I was talking too. Im sorry I didn't include big pictures with captions this time:jerkit: I'll try to include more colorful illustrations next time



I just think its funny to hear so many people bitch about "survival of the fittest" and advocate social Darwinism taken to such an extreme as to encourage social eugenics as if "they" were all that. On a freaking online car forum.

Just the simple fact that you have a luxury such as a car, that most of us use more like a toy/recreational vehicle, and that you have the time and means to go into an online forum to talk about how cool your ride is, puts you amongst some of the most pampered and privileged % of the world's population. Something tells me that all these tough guys talking about survival of the fittest and wiping out "the weak" would shit their pants if they stepped outside the safety boundaries of their little enclosed world in America.

Its easy to say "cant make a living? too bad!" when you live in a country where you actually can make a pretty decent living by being a hardworker and where the government provides you with safety. Its real easy to feel entitled and superior because "your hard work got you where you are", when you live under conditions where this is basically guaranteed and the system is set up to help you. In comparison to other parts of the world, we are spoon fed and babied.

And no, for all the aspiring Mengeles, its not just a scientific question. This shit was discussed and taken seriously like back in the 19th/early 20th century, when people actually took seriously the arguments being presented here about the need to separate the strong for the weak, the "useful" from the "not useful".

Do you think Hitler just burst into the scene and said "hi ppl lets murder all the mentally handicapped/gypsies/jews/inferior beings!" ? No. He, and the hundreds of scientists and doctors which helped perpetrate the Genocide where the logical outcome of decades and decades of intellectual and scientific views which advocated eugenics and questioned whether "superior" human beings had more rights than "inferior" ones. If you read their letters/papers/arguments, they are frightengly similar to some of the comments posted by some people here. In other words, nothing said by these people on the subject is either original, new, or particularly smart. This shit went out of style like a hundred years ago. Please get with the fucking times.

God I wish we still had the rep system. +1,000,000 imaginary rep points to you my friend.

There will be free loaders in any system, even without welfare. You think they didn't have beggars in ancient times?

Consider it parasitic drag, if you will. There may be ways to reduce it, but it's impossible to get rid off.

The welfare system should be a way for people to get back on their feet and to support those that aren't capable of taking care of themselves.

This thread is dominated by anecdotes and conjecture - I have yet to see any data proving the existence of these supposed masses of Cadillac driving welfare recipients.

For what it's worth, from my experience - based on several years of community outreach work - most welfare recipients are single mothers. There's also a lot of people who receive government assistance (like food stamps) but still hold down a job - they're called the working poor and their numbers have been increasing in the last several years. Then there's the physically or mentally handicapped person that receives aid. Lastly there's your typical alcoholic/drug addict.

The overwhelming majority of those receiving government aid fall into one of the above situations, or even a combination of them.

But I guess it's easier to simply point the finger and write off all these people as social parasites.

Quite frankly, I'd rather have a system that aids those in need - with the off chance that some will abuse the system - than one in which corporations are given corporate welfare in the form of tax breaks and subsidies.

[Otto347]

My bad. I forgot who I was talking too. Im sorry I didn't include big pictures with captions this time:jerkit: I'll try to include more colorful illustrations next time

Nah its cool, I donts needs thems :) You know I can appreciate what you are writing and you have some valid points but when you come in here and start acting like a fucking blow hard then I just skip over what you say/write. Try keeping this a discussion and stop being a fucking dickhole.

[raz0rbladez909]

Honestly I don't see why we keep murderers/dangerous criminals and people

on death row alive, we really do it to ourselves. What purpose does a

man/woman serving a life sentence in jail have? Imagine the cost per day to

feed, clothe, clean and shelter these "people" I can't begin to wonder the

amount we spend annually just in the U.S. alone, if you fucked up bad

enough to get life in prison it's not like you're some great person that

contributes great things to society. And I'm sorry if any of you have family

members in this situation but it sucks for them, should've thought about the

dumb shit you did before you did it. Cost each and every one of the

taxpayers in this country every single day. I don't believe in just wiping out

weak or stupid people, they usually tend to do it themselves, but I wouldn't

think twice about getting rid of murderers, child mollesters, and all those

other fuck ups.

[Otto347]

People would say thats inhumane. Fuck those lifers. You fucked up, time to die.

Only problem I see with that is people who are wrongly accused or are really innocent. There are a few, but habitual offenders.....a bullet is cheaper than feeding and taking care of them for years and years.

[theicecreamdan]

Its a lot better to make the mistake of keeping them alive than to kill the wrong person.

[sirfallsalot243]

If youre gonna keep a lifer alive and incarcerated until he dies, he should have to generate the money that it costs to keep him alive. Every inmate should be BRINGING IN money for the system, not taking away from it.

I mean, shit, youre in jail. Youve got nothing but time. Might as well put these guys to work. We have work programs in place now in jails, but its all optional. Put these fuckers to work for 8 hrs a day.

Thats the only solution I can think of to the argument above me, about killing the wrong person. Its a shame that it takes so long to finally kill a REAL murderer, but youre right.. it'd be fucked up if an innocent person got the axe.

I still think life sentences should be done away with though. When someone is facing the death penalty and its pretty obvious theyre guilty, its almost always an option to "plead guilty" to get life in prison instead. Fuck that. Try them, convict them, and sentence them to what they deserve. You take a life? We'll take yours. Eye for an eye.

[raz0rbladez909]

Its a lot better to make the mistake of keeping them alive than to kill the wrong person.

I didn't mean every possible person, but the cases that are clear cut i.e. child mollesters, murderers, rapists, that have plenty of evidence against them really should be dropped on the spot.

[ronmcdon]

slave labor could be a cost-effective alternative to out-sourcing to another country.
I know I'd rather have an American felon for tech support, than "Bob" from India.

I executed properly, our prisons would be a gold-mine of cheap labor.
I know it's been done before, but consider the possibilities if were orchestrated by a cost-effect private co.!
Imagine something like GM building a plant inside Folsom prison, lol

[fckillerbee]

I haven't been in this thread...but imagine a inmate threatening a customer of tech support cause they just don't get it....mmmm...might be bad...however...constructiong jobs would be wonderful!!!!

[Otto347]

slave labor could be a cost-effective alternative to out-sourcing to another country.
I know I'd rather have an American felon for tech support, than "Bob" from India.

Can you imagine if inmates worked at call centers lol that would be fucking awesome!

[HalveBlue]

Can you imagine if inmates worked at call centers lol that would be fucking awesome!

Too late!

INMATE JOBS. - Free Online Library (http://www.thefreelibrary.com/INMATE+JOBS-a082786968)

[prodigyJJ]

I agree with the above argument involving inmates and the prison system. I LOATHE the term inmate rights. <----That's bullshit.

Another argument to point out is our government. I'll be the first to say that since Clinton our nation has been jacked up. Deregulation, a lack of transparency, and no accountability have really helped create this beast of a deficit. I think that politicians are the ones that shold be highest on the chopping block. Let's make it survival of the fittest for all elective jobs in the United States government. Why can we have yearly evaluations of our political leaders? If they fail to be as productive within said year, then we simply fire them, and get someone else in. Of course this will probably take a lot of time and effort at first to cycle through all of the idiots, cheaters, and liars (Obama being the top of that particular list), but eventually we will find people that can EFFECTIVELY function within their position. It pisses me off the more that I think about it that our supposed leaders don't have to worry about foreclosures, pay cuts, lost benefits, or even losing their jobs, but they are the ones that orchestrated this situation the our whole world is dealing with now.

Let's as people apply social darwinism as it relates to a person's worth to our politicians. I believe we would fix frivolousness almost instantly with our country's spending.