Chasis Wiring Help - Push Button Start/No Key

[TurboSE]

Moving on in my chasis rewiring project, I've hit another snag. Rewiring my ignition to use a toggle switch and a push-button (i.e. - no key).

Here is my first attempt at creating a wiring diagram for this project:

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n112/TurboSE1980/StartingSystem.jpg

My questions:
What size fuses do I need?
Do I need two relays on the toggle?
Is one relay enough to the starter?
Did I miss anything?
Can anything be simplified


*****I know a lot of people look at this as a security issue, but my car will either be locked in my garage or in my site, so please don't flame me.*****

Thank you very much in advance for any help or suggestions you can offer!

[JVD]

I can't remember relay pinouts or anything, but why the two relays? I'm confused.

What's the purpose of the toggle? Seems redundant. Maybe wire in a switch into your actual +12V ignition.

Also, why is there a fuse between the battery and starter?

This should be a very basic circuit to figure out. Do some more reading before you start messing with your chassis wiring.

EDIT: Is this project using part of the factory wiring?... or all from scratch?

[g6civcx]

This is doable by me, but I'm telling you right now, this is going to take a lot of time.

Circuit design is more complicated than people think.

I can help you but you have to give me some time and be patient in how you answer my questions.

[projectRDM]

If you're using high current switches and/or push buttons, you don't need relays. A 50A switch will handle the circuit fine, you'd only use a relay if you were using a low current switch, which is indeed safer, but not required.

[TurboSE]

I can't remember relay pinouts or anything, but why the two relays? I'm confused.

I've read that one relay won't handle the amps in the ACC circuit.

What's the purpose of the toggle? Seems redundant. Maybe wire in a switch into your actual +12V ignition.

Sends power to the ACC circuit to run power to the button, fuel pumps, etc

Also, why is there a fuse between the battery and starter?

I've been told it's a good safety measure to have a main fuse before the battery gives power to any of the circuits.

This should be a very basic circuit to figure out. Do some more reading before you start messing with your chassis wiring.

I thought so as well, but it turns out to be more involved than I thought.

EDIT: Is this project using part of the factory wiring?... or all from scratch?

All from scratch.

Thanks!

[TurboSE]

This is doable by me, but I'm telling you right now, this is going to take a lot of time.

Circuit design is more complicated than people think.

All the wiring has been a slow process, I have plenty of time.

I can help you but you have to give me some time and be patient in how you answer my questions.

Any help is appreciated, ask anything you'd like, I'll answer the best I can.

Thanks!

[TurboSE]

If you're using high current switches and/or push buttons, you don't need relays. A 50A switch will handle the circuit fine, you'd only use a relay if you were using a low current switch, which is indeed safer, but not required.

So I'd be better to run the same 20A switch I've been using for everything else and running the relays?

Thanks!

[g6civcx]

Any help is appreciated, ask anything you'd like, I'll answer the best I can.

That's what I like to hear.


Before we do anything. Tell me exactly how you want your system to work.

You have a switch and a push button. Tell me what you want to happen for the following conditions:


switch on, button not pushed
switch on, button pushed
switch off, button not pushed
switch off, button pushed

Do you want anything special to happen when the switch and/or button transition from one state to another? There are many special functions you can add, but it will make your circuit more complicated.

For example, we can use a bunch of relays to turn the push button into a toggle switch. Push ignition off. Push ignition off.

It's fun but it makes the circuit so complicated that I don't think it's worth the time. Let's just stick with the simple stuff.

Sometimes it's useful to run the starter without the rest of the electronics, such as priming an oil pump or a mechanical fuel pump, or to clear a flooded engine without firing the fuel injectors.


So what do you want the switch and button to do?

[projectRDM]

So I'd be better to run the same 20A switch I've been using for everything else and running the relays?

Thanks!

That is safer, yes. Even more so you could use a 1A switch to trigger a relay, a 20A switch is huge for a low current trigger. Your call though.

[TurboSE]

Before we do anything. Tell me exactly how you want your system to work.

You have a switch and a push button. Tell me what you want to happen for the following conditions:


switch on, button not pushed
switch on, button pushed
switch off, button not pushed
switch off, button pushed

Do you want anything special to happen when the switch and/or button transition from one state to another? There are many special functions you can add, but it will make your circuit more complicated.

For example, we can use a bunch of relays to turn the push button into a toggle switch. Push ignition off. Push ignition off.

It's fun but it makes the circuit so complicated that I don't think it's worth the time. Let's just stick with the simple stuff.

Sometimes it's useful to run the starter without the rest of the electronics, such as priming an oil pump or a mechanical fuel pump, or to clear a flooded engine without firing the fuel injectors.


So what do you want the switch and button to do?

switch on, button not pushed - give power to everything that isn't constantly hot. Fuel pumps, headlights, etc.

switch on, button pushed - same as above, but engaging the starter motor to fire the engine.

switch off, button not pushed - only constant hot fuse panel (hazards, brake lights, etc.) will have power.

switch off, button pushed - same as above.

With the switch off, I figure the button to be useless.

This is the style of fuse/relay set-up I'm using if it helps:

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y196/FairladyZ32/S13/Standalone004.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f181/theelitestprick/100_6312.jpg

The only difference is that I am only running two "10-gang" fuse panels (1 - 12v constant, 1 - 12v ACC) and all my fuse panels, relays and distribution blocks are mounted to the firewall.

Hope this gives you a better idea what I'm shooting for.

[TurboSE]

That is safer, yes. Even more so you could use a 1A switch to trigger a relay, a 20A switch is huge for a low current trigger. Your call though.

So with the 20A switch, do I run the risk of burning up the relay? Would one 30A relay be enough to handle the load of everything that could possibly be running on the ACC side of the circuit? Brick headlights, park lights, turn signals, fuel pumps gauges etc?

[g6civcx]

switch off, button pushed - same as above.


I suggest that in this situation, pushing the button should spin the starter without any other ignition or accessories.

There are 2 reasons:

1. The wiring will be easier.

2. You can spin the starter without firing the fuel injector or ignition, like I said above.


It's not a big deal if you don't want to do it like this, but it would make it easier.

You should really have a master disconnect switch that kills all of your power.

[g6civcx]

So with the 20A switch, do I run the risk of burning up the relay? Would one 30A relay be enough to handle the load of everything that could possibly be running on the ACC side of the circuit? Brick headlights, park lights, turn signals, fuel pumps gauges etc?

Don't worry about fuses and wire gauge for now. We need to finalise the circuit schematic first.

After that it's really simple to figure out where to put fuses.

Right now we're just shooting in the dark because we don't know exactly which electronics will be used and how they will be wired up.

[TurboSE]

I suggest that in this situation, pushing the button should spin the starter without any other ignition or accessories.

There are 2 reasons:

1. The wiring will be easier.

2. You can spin the starter without firing the fuel injector or ignition, like I said above.


It's not a big deal if you don't want to do it like this, but it would make it easier.

You should really have a master disconnect switch that kills all of your power.

I'm kinda lost on the first part. Are you suggesting constant power to the push-button as well, so that I can run the starter without any other accessories? It sounds like a great idea (for clearing a flooded motor), but I thought wiring would be tougher.

I will have a master disconnect like this in the main battery cable:

http://toolmonger.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/BatterySwitch-450.jpg

[TurboSE]

Don't worry about fuses and wire gauge for now. We need to finalise the circuit schematic first.

After that it's really simple to figure out where to put fuses.

Right now we're just shooting in the dark because we don't know exactly which electronics will be used and how they will be wired up.

Here's how I have my list of electronics according to how they'll be powered (as of now):

Constant 12v+:

Ignition Toggle - 2 relays
Hazard/Turn signals - 1 toggle/1 flasher per side
Horn - 1 relay
Fan - 1 relay/with temperature switch

Switched 12v+:

Brakes
Reverse lamps
High beams - 1 relay for both (JDM Bricks)
Low beams - 1 relay for both (JDM Bricks)
Tail lamps
Park lamps/After market gauges
Fuel Pumps - 1 relay
Ignition button - 1 relay
Wipers/washer

I may have missed a component or two...if you see anything I should change or add, please let me know.

[g6civcx]

I thought wiring would be tougher.

No. All you need is a wire from the battery, fuse, button, then starter solenoid. No relay is needed for constant on stuff.

I need this on mine because I have a mechanical fuel pump. It takes about 10-15 seconds to build fuel pressure, especially after I drain the carb prior to storage.

[g6civcx]

Ignition Toggle - 2 relays


You're going to need a lot more relays. It depends on what components you plan on being ignition switched. I'll keep forward compatibilty in mind.


Hazard/Turn signals - 1 toggle/1 flasher per side


Hazards is fine, but do you want turn signals to be constant on? It doesn't matter, but the OEM wiring cuts power to the turn signals if you pull the key. The hazards is constant on though.


Fan - 1 relay/with temperature switch


Do you want the fan to run with the ignition off?

Brakes


Do you want brakes to be constant on or switched?

High beams - 1 relay for both (JDM Bricks)
Low beams - 1 relay for both (JDM Bricks)


I recommend 1 relay for each bulb. It's more complicated but it's safer to protect each bulb with a separate fuse.

Tail lamps
Park lamps

OEM is constant on if you care.

Fuel Pumps - 1 relay


Will the ECU be controlling the fuel pump?

[TurboSE]

You're going to need a lot more relays. It depends on what components you plan on being ignition switched. I'll keep forward compatibilty in mind.

I just meant 2 to power the fuse panel, will I need more

Hazards is fine, but do you want turn signals to be constant on? It doesn't matter, but the OEM wiring cuts power to the turn signals if you pull the key. The hazards is constant on though.

I figured it would be easier to wire them both constant so I could use the turns as hazards.

Do you want the fan to run with the ignition off?

Wouldn't that be better to cool the car after it was shut off. I could run them as a switched circuit.

Do you want brakes to be constant on or switched?

They could be switched or constant I guess...might as well save space on the "switched" panel and run them as constant.

I recommend 1 relay for each bulb. It's more complicated but it's safer to protect each bulb with a separate fuse.

Not a problem.

OEM is constant on if you care.

Once again, could be constant to save space on the "switched panel".

Will the ECU be controlling the fuel pump?

I figured I could just run them with the accessory switch...I could run a fuel pump controller if need be.

[TurboSE]

Updated list:

Constant 12v+:

Hazard/Turn Signals
Horn
Brake Lamps
Tail/Park/Gauge Lamps
Ignition Button
Ignition Toggle

Switched 12v+:

Fan - 1 Relay
High Beams - 2 Relays, 1 per side
Low Beams - 2 Relays, 1 per side
Wipers/Washers
Fuel Pumps - 1 Relay per pump

[g6civcx]

What hazard button are you using? OEM?

I thought you wanted the fan relay to be constant on.

Let's make hi/lo beam, and wipers/washers constant on as well for simplicity. Do you have any objection?


I'm redoing my wiring as well and before, I had everything wired according to OEM scheme of constant on/switched.

After going through this thread though, I'm going to be moving as many accessories as possible to constant on to save relays and add simplicity.

[g6civcx]

Let's start.

What starter are you using? OEM? Aftermarket? What engine? SR/KA/V8?

[TurboSE]

What hazard button are you using? OEM?

I was just gonna use one toggle for left and one for right. Flip em both for hazards.

I thought you wanted the fan relay to be constant on.

I'm OK with that, from your response, I was thinking you wanted it to be switched.

Let's make hi/lo beam, and wipers/washers constant on as well for simplicity. Do you have any objection?

Works for me.

I'm redoing my wiring as well and before, I had everything wired according to OEM scheme of constant on/switched.

After going through this thread though, I'm going to be moving as many accessories as possible to constant on to save relays and add simplicity.

Simplicity is good, I am by no means a wiring guru and I greatly appreciate all of your help.

[TurboSE]

Let's start.

What starter are you using? OEM? Aftermarket? What engine? SR/KA/V8?

RB26 - Engine wiring will be done by McKinney Motorsports using their "universal wiring service" so there will be minimal need to worry about the ECU.

UNIVERSAL WIRING SERVICES McKinney Motorsports (http://www.mckinneymotorsports.com/servicetype/UNIVERSAL_WIRING_SERVICES)

[g6civcx]

RB26 - Engine wiring will be done by McKinney Motorsports using their "universal wiring service" so there will be minimal need to worry about the ECU.

UNIVERSAL WIRING SERVICES McKinney Motorsports (http://www.mckinneymotorsports.com/servicetype/UNIVERSAL_WIRING_SERVICES)

Do we have an RB26 FSM floating around somewhere? I'd like to see how the factory wires the starter. We can just duplicate and adjust as needed.

Can you find out the following information?:

1. On just about any starter, you have a solenoid and you have a power lead. You connect the power lead straight to the battery. When the solenoid sees current, it pulls power from the battery and cranks the starter.

This is pretty much every starter.

Is the RB26 the same or is there some weird stuff going on with this starter?

If so, how many amps max does the factory rate the starter motor and solenoid?

2. Does the ECU also need a lead that tells the ECU when you're cranking the engine? If so, how many amps is this circuit rated for?


Knowing these things will help me figure out what kind of wire gauges and fuse ratings will be appropriate.

[g6civcx]

Wire gauge and fuse size are one of those things that must be just right.

Too small a fuse and you'll constantly be blowing out the fuse. Too big a fuse and you won't adequately protect the component and wiring.

Same with wiring. Too small a wire will add resistance and overheat. Too big a wire, other than cost and weight, will tend to break component by its sheer size and weight.

At some point the wire becomes too big and will put physical stress on the component. It's like attaching a boat anchor to something.

[punxva]

Index of /FSM/rb (http://www.nicoclub.com/FSM/rb/)

the FSMs are in there just to help him help you. subscribed, i'm looking into this route for my track car as well. Good luck hope this helps

[JVD]

Ugh... do me a favor and buy a bunch of high current rated switches.

If g6civcx makes you a diagram there's gonna be about 4000 relays.

I dunno about you guys, but I rewired my chassis for the sake of simplicity. Almost everything was controlled with just switches and fuses. Never had a problem. Made for extremely simple wiring as well.

That's just me though. If you're gonna do all these relays you may as well just stick with stock wiring. No point in tearing it all out. Just take out the shit you don't need.

[g6civcx]

Ugh... do me a favor and buy a bunch of high current rated switches.

It depends on how the accessories are triggered. If you're supplying current straight to a bunch of components, even a high-rated switch may not be enough.

If g6civcx makes you a diagram there's gonna be about 4000 relays.

I dunno about you guys, but I rewired my chassis for the sake of simplicity. Almost everything was controlled with just switches and fuses. Never had a problem. Made for extremely simple wiring as well.

That's just me though. If you're gonna do all these relays you may as well just stick with stock wiring. No point in tearing it all out. Just take out the shit you don't need.

I don't know where you're coming from. Have you not been following anything? I just told him to eliminate a bunch of unnecessary relays and wire them to be constant on with a switch.

[g6civcx]

I was just gonna use one toggle for left and one for right. Flip em both for hazards.

This is an interesting idea. You can then have both signals out of synch. It will drive people nuts :)

[TurboSE]

Do we have an RB26 FSM floating around somewhere? I'd like to see how the factory wires the starter. We can just duplicate and adjust as needed.

Can you find out the following information?:

1. On just about any starter, you have a solenoid and you have a power lead. You connect the power lead straight to the battery. When the solenoid sees current, it pulls power from the battery and cranks the starter.

This is pretty much every starter.

Is the RB26 the same or is there some weird stuff going on with this starter?

If so, how many amps max does the factory rate the starter motor and solenoid?

I have the FSM as a PDF. It shows what you stated above, a battery lead and a "trigger". I'm still looking for the amp ratings for the starter motor and solenoid.

2. Does the ECU also need a lead that tells the ECU when you're cranking the engine? If so, how many amps is this circuit rated for?

Knowing these things will help me figure out what kind of wire gauges and fuse ratings will be appropriate.

I am also looking for this info, if you'd be willing to check out the FSM, if you have time...I could email it to you. I think I may no be looking in the right place. If you'd like to give it a look, PM me your email and I'll send it. You've been a great help man, I really appreciate it!

[TurboSE]

Wire gauge and fuse size are one of those things that must be just right.

Too small a fuse and you'll constantly be blowing out the fuse. Too big a fuse and you won't adequately protect the component and wiring.

Same with wiring. Too small a wire will add resistance and overheat. Too big a wire, other than cost and weight, will tend to break component by its sheer size and weight.

At some point the wire becomes too big and will put physical stress on the component. It's like attaching a boat anchor to something.

I got a "used" painless kit from my neighbor, it was never installed, but the fuse boxis busted so I'm just using the wires...most are 14AWG I believe.

[g6civcx]

A quick Google search found this:

43 B/Y Ignition Switch (START Signal)

I don't know how much I trust random links on the Internet though.

[TurboSE]

Index of /FSM/rb (http://www.nicoclub.com/FSM/rb/)

the FSMs are in there just to help him help you. subscribed, i'm looking into this route for my track car as well. Good luck hope this helps


Thanks a lot!

[TurboSE]

This is an interesting idea. You can then have both signals out of synch. It will drive people nuts :)

Screw 'em! LOL!

[TurboSE]

A quick Google search found this:



I don't know how much I trust random links on the Internet though.


Just found the pin-out for the ECU...

43 - IGNITION SWITCH START SIGNAL
45 - IGNITION SWITCH (IGN)

[g6civcx]

Okay, I'm using the R32 RB26 FSM. I'm assuming that this is your engine.

For the starter lead, the factory does not use a fuse and runs the power cable straight from the battery to the starter. You can do the same, or you can use a fuse if you want.

Use the biggest wire gauge you can without feeling like you'll break the stud off of the starter.

I use a 200A fuse and 2AWG wire on my starter, but that's on a V8 truck starter. So use your judgement.

The starter solenoid can take up to 30A. So make sure you push button is rated for at least 30A. And use a thick wire, like 10AWG or something like that.



(battery +) --------- (optional 200A fuse) ---------- (starter power lead)

(battery +) --------- (30A fuse) --------- (30A or higher push button) -------------- (starter solenoid)


This will be enough to spin the starter but not enough to start the car because you'll need a bunch of other wires to power the ECU and ignition/injectors/etc.

[g6civcx]

I also recommend you go all out with grounding, especially since you'll probably have very sensitive electronics. This is the results I've found after working with a lot of engineers:

http://zilvia.net/f/tech-talk/276002-battery-reloc-wire-gauge-question.html#post3005652

[g6civcx]

This is what I have for now. The fuel pump is messing me up because the Skyline fuel pump control is really complicated. I'm not sure how much of that you will be reusing. Will the fuel pump be on all the time or will the pump be controlled by that messy OEM control unit?

http://nguyenconsult.com/zilvia/wire/wire1.jpg

[TurboSE]

Okay, I'm using the R32 RB26 FSM. I'm assuming that this is your engine.

Yep, it's an R32 motor.

For the starter lead, the factory does not use a fuse and runs the power cable straight from the battery to the starter. You can do the same, or you can use a fuse if you want.

I had planned to run a fuse for safety reasons

Use the biggest wire gauge you can without feeling like you'll break the stud off of the starter.

I use a 200A fuse and 2AWG wire on my starter, but that's on a V8 truck starter. So use your judgement.

I was thinking 2AWG or 4AWG...I'll check and see what the starter lug will hold safely.


The starter solenoid can take up to 30A. So make sure you push button is rated for at least 30A. And use a thick wire, like 10AWG or something like that.

(battery +) --------- (optional 200A fuse) ---------- (starter power lead)

(battery +) --------- (30A fuse) --------- (30A or higher push button) -------------- (starter solenoid)


This will be enough to spin the starter but not enough to start the car because you'll need a bunch of other wires to power the ECU and ignition/injectors/etc.

[TurboSE]

I also recommend you go all out with grounding, especially since you'll probably have very sensitive electronics. This is the results I've found after working with a lot of engineers:

http://zilvia.net/f/tech-talk/276002-battery-reloc-wire-gauge-question.html#post3005652

I planned on having multiple grounding points, so as not to leave anything to chance.

[TurboSE]

This is what I have for now. The fuel pump is messing me up because the Skyline fuel pump control is really complicated. I'm not sure how much of that you will be reusing. Will the fuel pump be on all the time or will the pump be controlled by that messy OEM control unit?

I wasn't planning to reuse any of the original Skyline wiring as I'll be running external Bosch 044 pumps and a fuel cell. I had planned to run them constantly.

[TurboSE]

http://nguyenconsult.com/zilvia/wire/wire1.jpg

I hate to be a stickler, but I just want to make sure I have all the connections right in my head. I added a few black dots to show where the wires split, could you just check and make sure I got em all right?

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n112/TurboSE1980/gcivic6xwiring.jpg

Also, just to clarify, on the push-button... the 30A fuse attaches to one post, the 30 pin on the relay and the starter solinoid attach to the other...correct?

[g6civcx]

Your dots are correct.

I don't know how many amps the fuel pump should be fused for. Can you check with the manufacturer?

[TurboSE]

Also, just to clarify, on the push-button... the 30A fuse attaches to one post, the 30 pin on the relay and the starter solinoid attach to the other...correct?

[TurboSE]

Your dots are correct.

I don't know how many amps the fuel pump should be fused for. Can you check with the manufacturer?

I emailed the guys at expressfuelpumps...I'll try and catch them on AIM tomorrow

[g6civcx]

the 30A fuse attaches to one post, the 30 pin on the relay and the starter solinoid attach to the other...correct?

Yes, I'm sorry about that. I'm going to install some better software so we can do better wiring.

[TurboSE]

Yes, I'm sorry about that. I'm going to install some better software so we can do better wiring.

No problem man, what kind of software are you installing...my diagrams could use some help!

[TurboSE]

can I run multiple fuel pumps from one relay? I'd imagine that depends on the amp-draw of the pumps themselves...

[g6civcx]

can I run multiple fuel pumps from one relay? I'd imagine that depends on the amp-draw of the pumps themselves...

Yes. You need one big fuse before the relay, and then smaller fuses, one before each pump.

Of course assuming the relay can handle the load of all the pumps running at once.

[g6civcx]

No problem man, what kind of software are you installing...my diagrams could use some help!

Right now the only thing I have is Visio. Wish I had something more hardcore.

[TurboSE]

Right now the only thing I have is Visio. Wish I had something more hardcore.

I'm stuck using paint :(

[TurboSE]

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n112/TurboSE1980/gcivic6xwiring.jpg


As it's shown here, with the fuel pump grounded before the switch, wouldn't that make the pump run constantly even with the switch off?

[g6civcx]

As it's shown here, with the fuel pump grounded before the switch, wouldn't that make the pump run constantly even with the switch off?

No, the switch grounds the fuel pump relay. The fuel pump doesn't get power until you turn on the switch.

I like to run my relays with ground triggered switches. The switches supply the relays with ground instead of current.

This is just my preference for safety. You can run with current triggered switches by placing the switch between the fuse and the relay, but doing it this way places more stress on the system if you have a short.

[TurboSE]

No, the switch grounds the fuel pump relay. The fuel pump doesn't get power until you turn on the switch.

I like to run my relays with ground triggered switches. The switches supply the relays with ground instead of current.

This is just my preference for safety. You can run with current triggered switches by placing the switch between the fuse and the relay, but doing it this way places more stress on the system if you have a short.

Good deal, don't know why I didn't see that. Still waiting on the specs for those Bosch pumps....thanks again!

[GSXRJJordan]

Wow, this thread got out of control! lol ~

I do wiring projects specifically like you're taking on professionally, and most recently did Conrad Grunewald's 2010 Camaro for SEMA/Formula D. G6civcx has taken you down all the correct steps, although I can tell by some of your responses that you're not quite comfortable enough to do this yourself - g6 and I can help you, but it's very difficult to troubleshoot over the internet.

I'll try and pick out things that I spotted on my first read-through:
1) Starter solenoid does not need a relay or a fuse, I can't think of a single OEM setup that uses one - I haven't measured the amp draw (don't feel like burning out a multimeter) but for a RB-series motor you should be fine with a 30A momentary switch. I do believe you'd blow a 30A fuse, but since it's only cranking for a couple seconds, the mom switch will be fine. 12ga wire is what's used from the factory.

2) The Skyline fuel pump control is not necessary (as the OP said), but if the 044 is the pump I'm thinking of (comparable to Aeromotive A1000) you want them fused at 30A each, which means separate relays for both (unless you use an unusually large relay, and large enough wire to feed it). Bosch should publish the amp draw (and recommended fuse size) for it's pump.

3) Space and routing will become a concern at some point. Running a 150A or 200A car-audio fuse between your battery and any fusebox/distribution block (preferably before the wire hits anything that can rub it) will keep fires out of your car. The alternator should be separately fused, but can be connected to the battery though the starter if you like. Be careful that the alternator is on the same side of the battery cutoff switch as the battery (the opposite side of your fusebox) otherwise the engine/electronics will continue to operate with the cutoff switch off, via the alternator if the engine's on.

4) Be mindful of whether the fuse boxes or their are grounded by anything they're mounted to. Also, wire loom goes a long way to a car looking good, and needs to be thought about before actual assembly for a good execution.

5) GROUNDS ~ your grounds need to be the same wire size as your primary wire, and as short as possible on large-current items. It goes without saying that ground quality matters - good grounds keep electrical systems efficient and wires cool.

I'll try and peek in here over the next couple days and help out where I can.

[g6civcx]

1) Starter solenoid does not need a relay or a fuse, I can't think of a single OEM setup that uses one

Nissan fuses the starter solenoid and ignition power for 30A communally so I'm just trying to be consistent. I figure 30A is no worse than factory.

[TurboSE]

Wow, this thread got out of control! lol ~

I do wiring projects specifically like you're taking on professionally, and most recently did Conrad Grunewald's 2010 Camaro for SEMA/Formula D. G6civcx has taken you down all the correct steps, although I can tell by some of your responses that you're not quite comfortable enough to do this yourself - g6 and I can help you, but it's very difficult to troubleshoot over the internet.

I'll try and pick out things that I spotted on my first read-through:
1) Starter solenoid does not need a relay or a fuse, I can't think of a single OEM setup that uses one - I haven't measured the amp draw (don't feel like burning out a multimeter) but for a RB-series motor you should be fine with a 30A momentary switch. I do believe you'd blow a 30A fuse, but since it's only cranking for a couple seconds, the mom switch will be fine. 12ga wire is what's used from the factory.

2) The Skyline fuel pump control is not necessary (as the OP said), but if the 044 is the pump I'm thinking of (comparable to Aeromotive A1000) you want them fused at 30A each, which means separate relays for both (unless you use an unusually large relay, and large enough wire to feed it). Bosch should publish the amp draw (and recommended fuse size) for it's pump.

3) Space and routing will become a concern at some point. Running a 150A or 200A car-audio fuse between your battery and any fusebox/distribution block (preferably before the wire hits anything that can rub it) will keep fires out of your car. The alternator should be separately fused, but can be connected to the battery though the starter if you like. Be careful that the alternator is on the same side of the battery cutoff switch as the battery (the opposite side of your fusebox) otherwise the engine/electronics will continue to operate with the cutoff switch off, via the alternator if the engine's on.

4) Be mindful of whether the fuse boxes or their are grounded by anything they're mounted to. Also, wire loom goes a long way to a car looking good, and needs to be thought about before actual assembly for a good execution.

5) GROUNDS ~ your grounds need to be the same wire size as your primary wire, and as short as possible on large-current items. It goes without saying that ground quality matters - good grounds keep electrical systems efficient and wires cool.

I'll try and peek in here over the next couple days and help out where I can.

thanks a lot for chiming in, I'm not confidant enough to do this on my own without some opinions and advice, so I really appreciate people like you and g6civcx helping me out. Thanks again, and feel free to offer any other advice you may have.

[g6civcx]

You also need to protect the wire just as much as the electronics. If the wire shorts to ground, the fuse needs to blow or you'll have a car fire.

[GSXRJJordan]

Nissan fuses the starter solenoid and ignition power for 30A communally so I'm just trying to be consistent. I figure 30A is no worse than factory.

Yeah that's true for most Nissans, 30A would be fine. Good ops.

[TurboSE]

I finally found out that the Bosch 044's have a max amp draw of 15.5A.

[TurboSE]

I think I have everything figured out to this point, where do we go from here?