just finished my 5spd swap need help asap please

[mmaxeyjr]

Well we just finished the 5spd swap in my 1990 240sx w/ ka24E

I know this is a little lengthy but I really need some help and or information


Parts used:
-Fidanza light weight flywheel (resurfaced)
-Exedy Clutch Disc (new)
-Exedy Pressure Plate (new)
-Exedy Throw out bearing (new)
-Exedy Pilot Bushing (new)
-Slave Cylinder (new / re manned)
-SPL braided clutch line (new)
-OEM hardline (used)
-OEM master cylinder (used)
-OEM clutch pedal assembly (used)
-b&m short shifter
-3 qts. Pennzoil Syncromesh
-DOT 3 fluid for clutch
-ka transmission bought from a friend


We installed everything and got the car started and running.


The Good
- Car runs & starts
- Shifts into every gear with ease
- Our temporary wiring works minus the reverse lights


The BAD
- the shifter makes lots of noise and shakes like crazy especially in first gear
- the trans makes loud grinding noises
- my starter needs fixed b/c metal is touching metal on the flywheel at start up noise is heard pretty loudly
- Clutch grabs but the pedal isn't as stiff as I hoped it would be
- Clutch pedal squeaks when pressed in
- When first going into gear ONLY at a stop it will make a quiet squealing or whistling noise
- My head unit stopped working randomly on my way home today
- Cars timing is still off a tad but runs fairly well
- also when the clutch is pressed in, the shifter is more calm and the trans is quieter / calmer


My question is how do I fix all the bads?? Also is it okay to drive with these symptoms? It seems to drive better sometimes rather than others.

[Ceepo]

Did you check the fluid in the transmission, replace it?, also get a better clutch and the pedel may feel better, and bleed the clutch system, also it may be the throw out bearing? i am doing a manual swap myself soon but those are just some of my thoughts...

[MartyMcFly]

wow man, thats a whole host of problems.
1 - bushings?
2 - syncros
3 - dont know what to say about the starter other then try another one..just replaced mine, easy schmeasy japanesey.
4 - bleed the clutch system, problem solved
5 - goes along with bleeding possibly, or mounting harware
6 - sounds like a tranny issue
7 - This actually happened to me 2 days ago.. turned out I left a screw driver on my battery terminals and was running around town with it still on top of the battery. It kept re-setting my head unit. As for your issue, not sure, but possibly a grounding issue or short in the wiring.
8 - time to tune
9 - Im thinking either TOB issue or bushings..You used a clutch alignment tool and proper torque settings?

Not much good advice to give...this is all stuff you got to sort of dig deeper in real time for rather then looking on zilvia.net

[mmaxeyjr]

i did use the alignment tool, also the TO bearing is brand spanking new.

we impacted the flywheel and pressure plate bolts on.

i know i have to dig deeper in real life, however i was looking for some advice to see where i could start looking.

thanks

[S14DB]

Get a 75w-90 GL4 gear oil.

[alzahakar]

The BAD
- Clutch grabs but the pedal isn't as stiff as I hoped it would be
- Clutch pedal squeaks when pressed in


Grease the pedal assembly with some lithium grease. You didn't install that stupid dampener when you did the conversion, did you? If so, that may be the problem with the pedal feel.

[mmaxeyjr]

which dampener are we speaking of?

[schmauster]

it goes on the clutch line between the master and slave and gets mounted on the firewall, has a little bleeder valve on it

[mmaxeyjr]

there was a bleeder on the slave i believe... which is what we used

edit: no i dont have the dampener on then. i must just have to bleed it more.

Tomorrows TO DO list:

- change the trans fluid to a 75w90 GL-4 tomorrow (should i go any thicker in case of syncros being bad?)
- new bolts on driveshaft and crossmember
- bleed clutch until satisfactory
- tighten down shifter with gasket maker and tighten bolts down good

I'm not sure but i read on a site online that read that the viscosity for Pennzoil Syncromesh from autozone is 10w30 which is WAY TOO THIN which would cause big bad problems that i'm having...

Should I completely refrain from driving it until this stuff is done? or can i just be even more gentle than usual? i've been shifting before 3,000 rpms

[Ceepo]

I would refrain from driving till you got everything fixed, dont wanna destroy all the money's you spent... imo

[superbraut]

deleting .

[toointoxicated62]

you need to change your tranny fluid thats way too thin, and bleed the clutch better and play with the adjustment on the clutch cylinder which is behind the clutch pedal

[mmaxeyjr]

thanks guys i just picked up some lucas gear oil which is a viscosity of 80w90 which should be plenty thick. I've used lucas oil products before and they seem like they carry pretty good stuff so hopefully that will make it a little better.

i will grease up the pedal a little bit with white lithium, also i will go over each bolt and make sure they are tight.

also i am going to bleed the clutch more

i will repost with the results tonight

[dubmasterdee]

bleed the clutch.. i wouldn't use penzoil (not much of a fan)... you went at to mt? if so... you gotta make sure you remove the adapter and install the pilot bushing... grease up the pedal.. and yea... after doing that.... keep us updated on what is still going wrong

[mmaxeyjr]

yep the pilot bushing is replaced with the MT one which came in the exedy clutch kit. was a pain to take out the old one and put the new in but it went smooth after that.

i'm going to adjust the clutch pedal also maybe that'll help, b/c the clutch engages near the very top rather than closer to the floor


edit:
I have another question. When I go to start my car it starts up fine however there is a loud metal on metal sounding grind when it starts
But after its started the noise is gone. What could this be? how can i fix it?
It seems like it is probably the starter teeth hitting the flywheel teeth? Why would it do this? How can I fix it?

thanks

[Jonnie Fraz]

edit:
I have another question. When I go to start my car it starts up fine however there is a loud metal on metal sounding grind when it starts
But after its started the noise is gone. What could this be? how can i fix it?
It seems like it is probably the starter teeth hitting the flywheel teeth? Why would it do this? How can I fix it?

thanks

Just a question...Did you install the manual cover plate between the trans and the block? I only ask because you did not mention it. It sounds like the starter is misaligned, but I did not think there was any play to adjust it. Maybe the starter has a bad bearing?

[1slowS13]

The BAD
- the shifter makes lots of noise and shakes like crazy especially in first gear - yes, thicker gear oil! that pennzoil stuff is thin like motor oil. make sure everything was installed right, and inspected for faults, like the pivot ball in your bellhousing, clutch fork and carrier. sometimes the carrier can get worn down that it shakes because there is too much play. bad transmission mounts might play into the shaking as well.
- the trans makes loud grinding noises - make sure you install the throw out bearing and pilot bushing in correctly! its really easy to damage them depending how you install them unto the carrier.
- my starter needs fixed b/c metal is touching metal on the flywheel at start up noise is heard pretty loudly - so its grinding when you start your car?
- Clutch grabs but the pedal isn't as stiff as I hoped it would be - bleed, bleed, and bleed. still got the clutch dampner?
- Clutch pedal squeaks when pressed in - thats most likely the return spring needing lubrication
- When first going into gear ONLY at a stop it will make a quiet squealing or whistling noise - do you still have the oem rubber boot that covers the shifter hole?
- My head unit stopped working randomly on my way home today - most likely not related to your 5 speed swap.
- also when the clutch is pressed in, the shifter is more calm and the trans is quieter / calmer

[mmaxeyjr]

the dampener is gone i believe. i do still have the oem rubber boot that covers the shifter. the one that goes on the shifter itself the smaller circle is ripped but it is still attached.
the pivot ball is brand new and screwed in tightly
the pilot bushing was a pain to put in, it was a really tight fit however we tapped it in with a rubber mallet.

no the cover isnt on between the block and the trans, that wouldnt be the cause of any problems though.?

[seto_s14]

clutch pedal pressed, no whirring/noise = bad throw out bearing

[mmaxeyjr]

clutch pedal pressed, no whirring/noise = bad throw out bearing

how could that be if its brand new? it was still sealed in the bag

well today we did what i said i was going to above ^^

it definately drives way way better than it did,
however theres a grinding noise in the transmission whenever downshifting, also when idling you can hear a slight rattle noise in the trans but then if i push in the clutch the sound quickly goes away, but comes back when clutch pedal is brought back to the top.

the started problem is a pain so we didnt mess with it too much. teeth are worn on the back on the flywheel but it's not extremely bad theres still plenty of meat left...

Maybe just needs broken in real good? (other than starter thing)

Or maybe i have bad syncros / bad tranny :cry:

[theslows13]

there WILL be a noticeable noise from the trans/whirring. its called NISMO MOTOR/TRANS mounts. mine is def noticeable. and is louder when clutch is engaged.

ill take a look tomorrow night or something

[mmaxeyjr]

so where are my supposedly $50 trans mounts? -_- wouldnt have one of these problems then haha

[drift freaq]

ok this thread is full of a lot of fail and misinformation. For all you idiots that are telling him his trans oil is to thin that's that just pure ignorance.
You can run straight 30w engine oil and the trans will shift smoother than running gear oil( you just need to change it out every year or so because its a detergent oil).
Its a old SCCA racing trick and a lot of trans shops know about it as well. So stop telling this guy that thin trans oil is causing his gear grinds.

Oh and for the fool that said no whirring noise equals a bad throwout bearing its actually the opposite you dumb fuck.
The more whirring noise you hear when you step on the clutch pedal the worse shape your throwout bearing is in.!


Plus by the OP's last post there is a possibility he installed a trans that might have already had syncro issues and other problems as well.

Oh and truth be told I have seen people run the automatic engine backing plate without a problem. The only issue with it is its two piece instead of one piece and if you don't bolt up the bottom part your flywheel is exposed to road grime and whatnot.

Now that we have some of the bullshit aside, I have a question for the OP. How does your clutch pedal feel? If you have air in the system and your clutch is not fully engaging you indeed will get grinding noises on downshifts or upshifts.

Though judging by you saying you have noise while the car is idling the question to you is does it change when you step on the clutch pedal? like go away? If it does then its quite possible your input shaft main bearing on your trans is not in good shape. I have seen this with used trans before its not uncommon.


Oh and Nismo motor mounts and trans mounts are not stiff enough to transmit more noise! If you think you're getting more noise from them? Then you have other problems in your drivetrain, because on a good drivetrain they do not transmit any noise and are quite smooth.

[mmaxeyjr]

well i did get the transmission from a friend that had it in his car but then took it out bc he went SR. He said trans was good however I dont know for sure.

[CrimsonRockett]

Another note, the shifter rattle, what version of the B&M shifter do you have?

V1 is known for its rattling(I have the exact same problem).

V2, problem fixed. Very quiet.(Friend has V2 with zero problems).

The grinding noise during start up, I have the exact same problem as well.

I swapped out the starter thinking it was misaligned or something.

Nope.

Different starter. Same issues.

I had work the next day. So, I didn't think much of it.

It has now been over 8 months since my 5-speed swap. Besides a failed clutch master and slave(both were over 18 years old...original ones pulled from an S13), nothing has given me problems.

The noise is still there, but my car starts up pretty fast. So, I barely have to turn the key to make the car start. Don't give it enough time to make the noise.

[mmaxeyjr]

the shifter rattle is fixed. grinding noise during start up is my biggest concern right now. b/c i dont want my starter to eat my flywheel and i dont want to have to replace my starter at this point in time.

[theslows13]

ah shit. i forgot you didnt get those mounts yet. friend of mine did. got you two confused.

and YES a fucking higher durometer mount will transmit more buzzes/rattles etc to the cabin. youre stupid to think otherwise. soft mounts absorb the little shit. nismos are a GOOD amount firmer. its not "omg fucking noise" bad, but its def noticable.

[mmaxeyjr]

alright now everything is fixed minus a little ratlle. but my main focus now is that everytime i start my car, there is a metal on metal grind / ping noise then after the car is started up and idling the noise goes away.
it has to be starter on flywheel teeth contact correct?
could it be b/c the lightweight flywheel? it's still an oem starter though.
starts right up. should i just not worry about it?

[S14DB]

Put a little molly on the Starter teeth. Just rub a dab over the face of the gear as it is retracted in the case when off. Also, try and pull the starter away from the block as you tighten.

[mmaxeyjr]

you mean shimmy it? put a few washers in between the trans and starter to separate it?

[Slacker_221]

I am doing the 5 speed swap this weekend to my 93 240sx and will I was wondering if two transmissions are the same length or will I need to extend the drive shaft?

[mmaxeyjr]

you need the 5spd driveshaft. you can NOT use your automatic driveshaft unless you get the 5spd parts off of a 5spd driveshaft. but you might as well just get a 5spd driveshaft which is longer than the auto i believe.

[Slacker_221]

Ok what 5spd parts will I need for the driveshaft? Is the spleen different?

[Suislider4Life]

you said every thing was fixed as far as clutch/tranny problems. I'm having that same problem right now. what'd u do to fix it?

[proconcept23]

i did close to the same thing as you did with the 5spd swap...the b&m shifter is always gonna be kinda loud at high rpms in first gear because its a lot more direct and stiff than the stock one. an aftermarket clutch and flywheel will cause a sort of a whirring/grinding noise when you let off the gas. this is completely normal. also, did you remember to put the rubber gasket between your shifter and tranny?? that would cause a crapload of noise if you forgot it...

[mmaxeyjr]

i put black RTV in between the shifter plate and the tranny