GTiR T28 vs. S14 T28

[SHIFT_*grind*]

I broke a turbo extension stud off in the back of my stock T25 a while back, so I've been running on 4 out of 5 bolts holding the extension on. The exhaust leak is probably minimal at best, but I want everything to be right on this car so I pulled the turbo (which took forever, of course). Since A) my initial attempt at trying to get the bolt out didn't work and B) I don't want to spend all that time bolting a stock turbo back on, I'm looking at budget turbo upgrades (i.e. a Nissan T28).

I don't have much money. I'd love to get a GT2871R (or even an S15 Spec R turbo) and injectors/MAF/tune and call it a day, but I just can't spend much on the car right now. Plus I don't really need a *ton* of power; I'd be happy with better spool and just a little more area under the curve across the powerband. I've searched around on here and figured that an S14 T28 or a GTiR turbo would be fine, preferably a GTiR T28. It would give me a lot more headroom in the future to make ~300WHP, maybe a little more, where the S14 turbo wouldn't. At ~$300/piece used, I could afford either one.

Only thing is, right now, that's all I can afford. Meaning, no fuel/tuning except a Walbro 255. Will I be OK just bolting on a GTiR T28 in place of my T25 and running it at stock boost, without an injector upgrade or tune? It's an otherwise stock S13 blacktop SR, with just exhaust and an FMIC. I figure I could bolt on the S14 T28 and see some mild gains on an otherwise stock car, but I'm a little unsure about the GTiR turbo. Would I be at high risk of leaning out, even without upping the boost?

Thanks :)

[jsuh s14]

if you have a walbro 255 you should be able to maintain the gtir t28 IF running STOCK boost. and nothing more. just to be on the safe side

[jilo]

on stock injectors dont push it past 10 psi and youll be ok. keep it st 7 untill a tune and youre golden

[SHIFT_*grind*]

I thought so. Just want a little extra power now, and preferably the potential to make good power later on without pulling the turbo again.


Also, anyone want to chime in with personal experience, with a GTiR turbo on a mostly stock SR? The install looks fairly straightforward, just a few small modifications needed, so I'm not really concerned about that; more curious about how the car felt afterwards :D

[emersonLP]

I had a broken stud on my turbo and pulled it to fix it like you did. I just took it to a napa machine shop and he drilled out the broken stud and rethreaded the hole. Good as new. Cost <$20 iirc. But, by all means, upgrade! I would have if it was prudent at the time, but I had other expensive purchases to do at the time and a new turbo was way down the list.

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Really? I'll have to do that; I'd like to upgrade anyway, but if I can get the bolt drilled out for ~$20 I'd definitely do that. It's an otherwise perfect stock turbo, no shaft play or leaks or anything, and probably slightly lower mileage since it came off a 97-98 blacktop; I'm sure I get more for it if the buyer didn't have to drill a stud out of it :)

[SILVIA_KIDs14.5]

i have a gt28 on my sr its a s14 pushing a little under 300 wrhp @ 1 bar. then only upgrade for fuel injectors i have are the spec-r injectors which are 480cc and it runs rich, with out a fuel pump swap. if your swaping out the fuel pump i think you'll be fine up to a bar don't quote me on it but im sure you have stock injectors which are the 370cc, which i was running be for at a bar and still ran rich enough to smell it any way but yeah good luck
ps def get a tune before you really start to boost it up to the bar jus to be on the safe side stay around the stock 7-8lbs

[Sileighty_85]

I've ran my s14 Turbo at 1.2 bar with Stock ECU, injectors, and SR Fuel Pump with no problems when I had my PFC hooked up my injectors read only 60%ish at 1 bar I think?
Right now its 1.0bar still stock ECU and Injectors no problems,
With all my mods I smoked a FireBird TA (LS Engine) :D

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Sounds kind of scary to me :eek: I'd also be running without a tune of any kind. But at least it's good to know that an S14 T28 would be a decent budget upgrade as well, and worth the trouble/money to replace my stock T25 with.

[Sileighty_85]

you dont really need a tune for a T28, Sure it would help but its not required
Im running No tune just stock ECU. Dont judge my knowlegde by these stupid squares its really for popularity than knowledge, or at least for some ppl. I know SR's I personally brought my SR back from Okinawa piece by piece and rebuilt it myself from the crank up with new performace parts.

[SHIFT_*grind*]

So you're running an S14 T28 at 1.2 bar, stock injectors, stock tune, and a PFC plugged in just to see what %'age your injectors are running at? Or are you tweaking things with the PFC to make sure you don't blow something up?

[Sileighty_85]

So you're running an S14 T28 at 1.2 bar, stock injectors, stock tune, and a PFC plugged in just to see what %'age your injectors are running at? Or are you tweaking things with the PFC to make sure you don't blow something up?

Yep DD is 1.Bar WOT 1.2 pulls fines no boggs or nothin. Yeah I hooked it up to check all my electronics making sure everything is good, and it was.

I will install the PFC and tune it when I install cams and a TD06 ^_^

but like i said Stock ECU and injectors.

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Update!

I was able to source a GTiR T28 for a good price. I had to put the stock T25 and shitty hard lines back on because I had to get the car running, so I had planned to take my time with the T28 and rebuild it, maybe save up and get injectors/MAF/tune before I put it on the car.

Buuuuuut, after putting the stock shit back on and finding out that I have a coolant leak at the turbo and I have to take all the stock stuff back off anyway, I'm just going to deal with leaving the car non-running for now and go ahead and put the T28 on, and leave it at stock boost.

-I have to clock the housings and cut/weld the compressor inlet pipe and wastegate actuator bracket and whatnot, so I was planning to just rebuild it as well. It's in good shape and doesn't need to be rebuilt, but it can't hurt to do it anyway while it's off the car...right? :)

-And, I'm going to be running this thing without any fuel/tune upgrade except a Walbro 255. It seems that this is ok, and no big deal, but...if it's no good, someone please tell me now. I don't want to blow up my shit. :eek3:

(also...I was thinking of upgrading to an S14 compressor housing as well...If you have one laying around you'd want to sell, let me know :D )

[emersonLP]

You should be fine, just dont turn up the boost too high until you get a tune at least. If you want to, invest in a wideband A/F gauge and you can see if you are leaning out.

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Yeah, I don't have a controller at all so it'll be completely at stock boost. A PLX is the next thing I'll be on the lookout for, I think; those don't seem to be too pricey as far as widebands go.

[SHIFT_*grind*]

So, one last thing before I stop bumping the 3 threads I have that are all somewhat related :doh:

Running a GTiR turbo with no fuel/tuning should be OK as long as I don't up the boost...I'm guessing I'll still be OK if I swap on an S14 compressor housing? Slightly larger, better spool, a little more power...and I don't have to cut and weld a bunch of shit.

Thanks for all the info guys, it's been really helpful. =D

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Also...the turbo's in good shape, doesn't need a rebuild, would it be worth it to rebuild it myself anyway? I'm not a turbo tech, but I'm of decent mechanical inclination; my friend and I swapped an RB20 into my old S13 in my driveway, from start to finish.

Would it be worth the trouble to rebuild a turbo that doesn't really need to be rebuilt, or would I be better off leaving it alone and not risking the chance of fucking something up in the process? :o

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Running a GTiR turbo with no fuel/tuning should be OK as long as I don't up the boost...I'm guessing I'll still be OK if I swap on an S14 compressor housing?

Would it be worth the trouble to rebuild a turbo that doesn't really need to be rebuilt, or would I be better off leaving it alone and not risking the chance of fucking something up in the process? :o

?

I promise I won't ask any more questions for a while :D

[Sileighty_85]

Running a GTiR turbo with no fuel/tuning should be OK as long as I don't up the boost...I'm guessing I'll still be OK if I swap on an S14 compressor housing?


Yes You should be fine even at 12 PSi, Not sure about the houseing swap.




Would it be worth the trouble to rebuild a turbo that doesn't really need to be rebuilt, or would I be better off leaving it alone and not risking the chance of fucking something up in the process? :o

well if you never rebuilt a turbo i'd leave it alone, just so you dont chnace it, practice on that T-25

?

I promise I won't ask any more questions for a while :D

[tougekid]

damn, any updates??? im doing the gtir upgrade as well. ive also got greddy ultimte ,525 injecters, fuel reg., and upgraded acuater in the mail.
sould be on in the next 2 wks.

[godzilla_753]

yeah, shift grind you def need to update this, im doing the same thing
how did this turn out, how much boost with what tuning etc
let us know bro

[sunnys14]

I'm running a gti-r turbo with s14 compressor on my KA. Feels great!

[tougekid]

do you guys running the gtir turbo have a part number??
not sure abot mine.
the part number is 466541-9001.
i have a .80 compresser side and .64 hot side.
is this correct for the gtir??
i looked it up on garrett and it said it was a BB turbo. the only problem is, it doesn't look anything like what it showed, and A/R on the comp. side is only.64 on the garrett site.
any help would help. thanks.

i know i need pics but @ work right now.

[SHIFT_*grind*]

The turbo feels great. Untuned, 10 psi, no fuel upgrades but a Walbro 255. Lags a little more, but pulls a lot harder up top than the stocker.

Look at the GTiR compressor housing I have for sale here (http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=178422). That's what your GTiR compressor should look like.

I'll post more later, I'm leaving work right now though.

[((sr)) kelly]

I've ran my s14 Turbo at 1.2 bar with Stock ECU, injectors, and SR Fuel Pump with no problems when I had my PFC hooked up my injectors read only 60%ish at 1 bar I think?
Right now its 1.0bar still stock ECU and Injectors no problems,
With all my mods I smoked a FireBird TA (LS Engine) :D



so you still have the 370cc???

i call BS if you do..


did no one else catch this?????


60 % duty cycle on the 370cc is like 7 psi on a t28... 1 bar is more then double that... where you shifting at 4500 or something?

[SHIFT_*grind*]

I caught it, and don't really believe it, but he insists. *shrug*

GTiR T28 part number is 14411-54C00. Turbine A/R is .86, compressor A/R is .60 (T3 Super 60 housing). It's a journal bearing turbo, NOT ball bearing. If Garrett's site is telling you it's a BB turbo, you're looking at the wrong turbo.

466541-9001
No idea what number that is.

I'm running the turbo at 10 lbs with an HKS actuator. I don't dare go over 10 until I get myself some injectors, AFM and a tune. Lag is more pronounced in the low end, and transient response isn't the best, but it still spools fairly early; I'd say I have full boost by 3500RPM at the very latest. It's hard to tell because the revs go by pretty quick once it hits.

I'm also using an S14 T28 compressor housing, which you should definitely do if you're considering this swap. Makes it easier to fit onto the RWD SR platform, and is good for a few more horses as well.

If you're putting this in place of your T25, you will need:

-New wastegate actuator, or you need to modify the GTiR actuator bracket (i.e. cut and weld). I went with an HKS actuator obviously. Make sure you get one with a T28 bracket; the T25 bracket can work (I'm using one), but you have to modify it to make it fit a T28 comp housing.
-T25-->T28 adapter plates, from somewhere like Enjuku or phase2. $110. OR, you can source an S14/15 compressor inlet pipe, and then get your compressor outlet cut and welded so it comes straight up instead of at a 45* angle.
-Braided lines (Circuit Sport or Taka). I have Takas. Technically, you don't need them, but trust me when I say you don't even want to fucking TRY using the stock lines. Fuck.
-Clocking of the turbine housing. You can probably do this yourself.
-Clocking of the compressor housing. If you swap to an S14 T28 housing, that pretty much takes care of this step.
-If you're using the S14 T28 comp housing, you have to switch out the adapter plate on the center section. You will need a pair of big, strong, magic snap ring pliers, and 2 extra hands.


If you need any help or info on the swap, lemme know, I'll tell you what I can. :)

[tougekid]

thanks for the info! after much debate, and endless searching, the shop and i have concluded its a gt2854r. got it from a freind of mine. he just got it off a gtir and sent it to garrett to get a rebuild. never really paying attention to the turbo, lucky me!! ive already got the CS lines and gt fittings on the way.

[projectRDM]

If you're putting this in place of your T25, you will need:

-New wastegate actuator, or you need to modify the GTiR actuator bracket (i.e. cut and weld). I went with an HKS actuator obviously. Make sure you get one with a T28 bracket; the T25 bracket can work (I'm using one), but you have to modify it to make it fit a T28 comp housing.
-T25-->T28 adapter plates, from somewhere like Enjuku or phase2. $110. OR, you can source an S14/15 compressor inlet pipe, and then get your compressor outlet cut and welded so it comes straight up instead of at a 45* angle.
-Braided lines (Circuit Sport or Taka). I have Takas. Technically, you don't need them, but trust me when I say you don't even want to fucking TRY using the stock lines. Fuck.
-Clocking of the turbine housing. You can probably do this yourself.
-Clocking of the compressor housing. If you swap to an S14 T28 housing, that pretty much takes care of this step.
-If you're using the S14 T28 comp housing, you have to switch out the adapter plate on the center section. You will need a pair of big, strong, magic snap ring pliers, and 2 extra hands.


If you need any help or info on the swap, lemme know, I'll tell you what I can. :)

Strange I never saw this thread, but I concur with all the above. I had to do it with my KA using all the SSA bottom mount stuff. If the S14 T28 wasn't BB I would have picked it in a second, way easier to just bolt on and go then to modify everything.

[steve shadows]

I caught it, and don't really believe it, but he insists. *shrug*

GTiR T28 part number is 14411-54C00. Turbine A/R is .86, compressor A/R is .60 (T3 Super 60 housing). It's a journal bearing turbo, NOT ball bearing. If Garrett's site is telling you it's a BB turbo, you're looking at the wrong turbo.



Yes it is a Journal Bearing Turbo.

In fact I am pretty sure the S14 and GTIR Comp Wheels are the same.

The housings may be slightly different, don't quote me.

Most of the GT28R turbo are the same wheels. The Disco Potato just uses a Super 60 Wheel (which isnt much better than the gt2860R -S15 Turbo).

I would just save towards a GT2871R .64.

Of all the bottom mount turbos I have driven this was my favorite. I have tracked almost all of them :2f2f:

[SHIFT_*grind*]

The housings may be slightly different, don't quote me.

GTiR uses a T3 Super 60 comp housing. S14 T28 uses a T04B housing, which is a slight improvement and also makes the turbo swap a little easier.

[timtiminy]

So what is up with this Turbo?:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Hi-Flowed-Garrett-T28-Turbo-4-S14-S15-200SX-SR20DET-HKS_W0QQitemZ120230844606QQihZ002QQcategoryZ72478Q QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[SHIFT_*grind*]

Um, well...it's a T28 of some type. Judging from the A/Rs (0.60 comp, 0.64 exhaust), this OMG HI-FLOED TERBO WIFF MASSIV INTAKE is probably a run of the mill, factory S14 T28. But who knows.

Refer here for more info: http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=157306

[Sileighty_85]

Its been awhile since ive looked at this this thread

so you still have the 370cc???

Yeah Im still running the 370's -o-


i call BS if you do..


did no one else catch this?????


60 % duty cycle on the 370cc is like 7 psi on a t28... 1 bar is more then double that... where you shifting at 4500 or something?


Well I retract my statement on the 60% when I was reading it i was trying to read my boost gauge, drive, shift, and read the Power FC at the same time so I might have glanced at it at the wrong time.
I dont have the PFC hooked up cuz it Knocks real bad without a tune.

But I have still been running the T-28 with Stock ECU and 370cc Injectors @ .9 Bar all the way to Red Line without any problems

I rarely ever go WOT.

[chibo]

I ran a GTiR turbo on a blacktop S13 motor. Everything was stock except the turbo, intercooler, walbro 255, turbo elbow, downpipe, test pipe, and exhaust... I ran it at 12psi and never had an issue but I didn't know shit about cars at the time and the engine came with the turbo already on it.