Horrible 1/4 mi. time

[240SX21]

hey fellas. &nbsp;well i just ran my 240 for the first time today. &nbsp;and i must say i was VERY dissapointed. &nbsp;i have an 89 hatchback w/ an apex dual N1 catback exhaust system, injen intake, & venom 400 control module. &nbsp;and my engine is running strong with no problems(just broke 90K miles). &nbsp;anyways, i ran it twice & both times i got a 17.6. &nbsp;a 17.6!!?? is it just me, or is this a really bad time for a semi-modded car? &nbsp;true, i have an automatic, which might lessen my time a little as compared to a stick, but i didnt think it would be that bad. &nbsp;i mean cmon, i almost ran an 18 for God's sake! &nbsp; i didnt expect to run 13's or anything, but i figured i could at least break 16's! &nbsp;it seemed like everyone else did!!! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':angry:'> &nbsp; anyways, there is more to this post than me complaining. &nbsp;can anyone give me some advice/consolement/explanation on today. &nbsp;that would be great, because i have never been dissapointed with my car until today(i do fairly good at street racing...its not like my car is slow or anything). &nbsp;i was just shocked by the fact that i couldnt get any higher than a 17.6. &nbsp;it was really strange because i seemed to be the only one who had the exact same time for both runs. &nbsp;someone please talk to me! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('>

[DSC]

Did you take your sound system out before you raced? &nbsp;
100lbs = ~0.10sec so it wouldn't matter a ton anyway (wouldn't be the reason you didn't hit 16.99)
How were you launching?
Spin tires any?
Automatics are slow.

I'm sure there are some auto-racers here than can give you tips on launching...since after launch you can start eating a cheese burger in an auto...just keep your foot to the floor.

[misnomer]

Don't feel bad man, we all can't be good drivers. . . <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'>

Seriously though, practice launching. . . n stuff. . .

[240SX21]

its funny because ive heard so many automatic jokes that they just dont seem to bother me anymore. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'> &nbsp; yea auto-drivers have told me to power brake(dunno if thats the correct term, im talking about when you press the brake & gas at the same time & let go of the brake at about 3K rpms or so). &nbsp;ive never tried that before so i didnt want to try it for the first time at the track. &nbsp;i guess that could help a little. &nbsp;but seriously though, is is THAT big a difference between autos & sticks? &nbsp;i never thought it was that big a difference, considering the fact that most real(professional) drag cars are automatic....then again, they also have 5X more HP that I do. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'> &nbsp; well if anyone else has any advice/tips/automatic jokes just let me know.

[guidot]

Have to say this: even Motor Trend calls auto's "slush-o-matics".

Power braking is good. &nbsp;Its just before brake stand, if you will. It keeps the revs of the engine up, but not enough to break the rear tires loose.
There is also a sensor you could remove (on tranny i think). &nbsp;This shifts the tranny hard and not until almost redline. &nbsp;I've been in an auto 240 with out the sensor in and it snaps your head like a V8 auto with a shift kit!
Shift the auto like a stick. &nbsp;Make it start in 1st and as you get close to the end of your powerband, push it to second, and so on. &nbsp;This could help too.
I don't know anyone with an auto anymore so I can't try these things for you, but they sound like they would work.

[wherezmytofu]

stick is 1.3-2 seconds quicker then auto <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'> ...well stock vs stock stick and auto...not a modify auto or modify stick tranny &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

[DSC]

guidot, I've heard actually shifting an auto is bad for the transmission. Dono why (maybe cauz you can't control the clutch?) but that's what I've heard.

"considering the fact that most real (professional) drag cars are automatic...."
They have specially designed transmissions, you can't really compare street stuff to racing. Besides, I think a lot of those guys use sequential transmissions of some sort, so they are still controlling when the car shifts via forward and back lever or a button, depending on how they have it setup.

[ca18guy]

Might as well shift for it, being at the drag strip isn't the best for the tranny anyway so you might as well get the most out of it. And POWER BRAKE, I will almost gaurentee you will break 16's if you do, it makes that big of a difference. Also next time save the money you spent on a venom 400 and buy a real performance part &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sigh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':rolleyes:'>

[roast]

At least you went to the track. &nbsp;=) &nbsp;Good times, and yes, power brake!!!! =)

[Bbandit]

whats the altitude at the track? remember, altitude makes difference for naturally aspirated cars.. the higher the altitude the slower the motor runs because of the slightly lower atmosphere pressure..
or maybe coz its auto?!? &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'> &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>
at least you went to the track and now you have some numbers!! hehe

[DSC]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Bbandit @ May 24 2002,10:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">whats the altitude at the track? remember, altitude makes difference for naturally aspirated cars.. the higher the altitude the slower the motor runs because of the slightly lower atmosphere pressure..
or maybe coz its auto?!? <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'> <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>
at least you went to the track and now you have some numbers!! hehe</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I believe it has more to do with the lower % of oxygen per measurement of air at high altitude...

[Bbandit]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (DSC @ May 25 2002,08:31)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Bbandit @ May 24 2002,10:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">whats the altitude at the track? remember, altitude makes difference for naturally aspirated cars.. the higher the altitude the slower the motor runs because of the slightly lower atmosphere pressure..
or maybe coz its auto?!? <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'> <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>
at least you went to the track and now you have some numbers!! hehe</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I believe it has more to do with the lower % of oxygen per measurement of air at high altitude...</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
yea.. and that too.. thanks for adding &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>

[sykikchimp]

There are upgrades for Auto trannies like Performance Torque converters, and shift kits (iff they make one for the 240). &nbsp;

I used to have a 240 w/ auto tranny and it sucked. &nbsp;The problem was it always shifted too late, way out of the power curve. &nbsp;like at 6800 rpm. &nbsp;and of course it shifted too slow.

[S13Grl]

You ran 17+<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

[240SX21]

yes i did run 17+ s13grl. &nbsp; and thanks for reminding me because i almost forgot. &nbsp;i appreciate it. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':angry:'> &nbsp; as for the altitude thing, i doubt it would make that much of a difference(i was at Englishtown, btw). &nbsp;its not going to make up for 17.5 seconds. &nbsp;its kinda like the same thing about removing the sound system. &nbsp;ill worry about that once i start hitting respectable times and want to shave 10ths off of my time, but for now i just wanna hit 16! &nbsp;well i guess ill try power-braking next time, that should definetly help. &nbsp;btw, ca18guy i only spent $100 on the venom(used). &nbsp;and actually, its the most noticable upgrade i have done to my car so far. &nbsp;its a very underrated bolt-on in my opinion. &nbsp;well im going to be getting a JWT ECU soon. &nbsp;and i just got my header in yesterday(hotshot new model). &nbsp;so once i add those 2 & learn to power-brake i should be doing a little better. &nbsp;ive been considering a dry NOS kit as well. &nbsp;its a safer system(well about as safe as NOS is gonna get anyway) that hooks up through the intake, instead of mixing in directly with the fuel. &nbsp;thanks for the tips guys. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'> &nbsp; oh, and about the 1-2-Drive auto shifting thing, its really bad for your transmission. &nbsp;escpeially an old one such as mine. &nbsp;id blow it in no time.

[ibanezxguy]

man dont feel bad i have a 95 240 with an auto yeah it sucks but the price was right.. but anyways im shooting for have one of the quickest auto around augusta, ga beside drag cars. Buy the way any body know what in the hell is in an INFANITY I30 because ive got beat by 2 of them and umm &nbsp;the stomped me off the line.

[ca18guy]

IIRC a Infinity I30 is a "luxory" maxima.

[Roly]

What mph did you run?... Knowing the mph and 60' time help to see where the problem lies.

[240SX21]

Roly, i finished at an equally pathetic 78 MPH.

[Integraholic]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (DSC @ May 25 2002,01:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">guidot, I've heard actually shifting an auto is bad for the transmission. Dono why (maybe cauz you can't control the clutch?) but that's what I've heard.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Drag racing period is bad on the car. &nbsp;Also, remember to leave on the last yellow and not the green. &nbsp;You see the green, you lost the race.

[Roly]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (240SX21 @ May 25 2002,4:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Roly, i finished at an equally pathetic 78 MPH.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
ouch... i'll race u in my civic dx!.. jk, &nbsp;the auto plays a role to drivetrain loss. The quick fix would be going to a 50hp - 75hp of nitrous. &nbsp;But that'll put you in the low 16's or high 15's, but it'll put a ton of stress on your older motor. &nbsp;Look into swapping an engine in or rebuild yours and consider going boost. &nbsp;I don't think swapping auto to stick will be as cost effective as going the other route.

[240SX21]

hey roly, i have beaten civics before! &nbsp;im not that slow <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'> &nbsp;but yea, i was thinking about going nos. &nbsp;im about to put in a header & JWT ecu, so i figure if i throw in a 50 shot of nos i should be doing a lot better. &nbsp;my only concern with the nos is, how do i get a permit for it? &nbsp;ive heard countless stories of people who have had their cars taken away after being caught with nos. &nbsp;and i definetly dont want that to happen to me. &nbsp;any ideas on how to get a permit for it?

[anthony240]

let's see:

Injen intake $200
N1 Dual $500
Venom 400 $100
Hotshot Headers $300
JWT ECU $500
NOS $500

Total of $2000+, low 16s to mid 15s

Used manual tranny + parts $1200
DIY Install, mid 16s

I picked the second option, $800 less and will drop 2 seconds off the time. if you're really stuck on auto, that's all good. I switched cause I can't stand auto, boring. I'm not hating, I also have an N1 dual/Injen Intake. I think it's the N1 dual, I felt a lot of low end loss when I put it on. With those mods + 5-speed, I'm hoping for 15s, never took it to the track tho. Oh, and I also have 2 12s in the trunk <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

also, don't forget the cheaper upgrades like underdrive pulley and fan removal.

[Grant]

hey, what was the reaction time on your timeslips?

[guidot]

I dont think that shifting an auto manually is THAT bad....I wasn't suggesting a neutral drop or anything. &nbsp;I know how bad those are...ask my 82 Buick Skylark! &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'>

[gh6o6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (240SX21 @ May 25 2002,3:18)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">hey roly, i have beaten civics before! im not that slow <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'> but yea, i was thinking about going nos. im about to put in a header & JWT ecu, so i figure if i throw in a 50 shot of nos i should be doing a lot better. my only concern with the nos is, how do i get a permit for it? ive heard countless stories of people who have had their cars taken away after being caught with nos. and i definetly dont want that to happen to me. any ideas on how to get a permit for it?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
i dont think you get a permit (actually im pretty sure you cant) iirc you have to leave the bottle fully disconected

[S13Grl]

You just must have had a really bad reaction time. Launch at about 3K, you should do a lot better!

Good luck next time!

[ca18guy]

Reaction time isn't included in the final time. You can have a better final time then someone but still lose cause of reaction time, but it's not included in the time.

[S13Grl]

If it takes you a second to get off the line, then you've lost a second at the 1/4 mile mark.

[240SX21]

i dont think reaction time is the problem. &nbsp;i actually got a little jump on one of the guys i raced(who still beat me by 3 seconds). &nbsp;i just have to face facts....i need a manual transmission. &nbsp;to be honest its not just about speed. &nbsp;its just too boring to drive an auto. &nbsp;people have been telling me since i started modding my car to convert it, but inever listened. &nbsp;well, im listening now! &nbsp;im just trying to get an estimate first of how much all the parts will cost me & where's the best place to get them from. &nbsp;any suggestions?

[ca18guy]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (S13Grl @ May 28 2002,05:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">If it takes you a second to get off the line, then you've lost a second at the 1/4 mile mark.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
But the reation time isn't included in the 17.X that he ran. The time does'nt start til the rear wheel breaks the light (i believe it's the rear wheel trips the light)

[Y-49CRXsi]

Sorry bro...automatics aren't very good. The rpms just don't cut it with an auto (it will shift BEFORE the optimum time, costing you speed). Like the guy who replied before, it'd be just better to swap in a manual probably. What would be the point of putting on mods like intake/header/exhast when the automatic shifts too soon to fully utilize the power the mods create? I'm not trying to bomb on you at all, just giving some "constructive critisism" if i may. Go manual, you'll defenitly appreciate it. As for NOS/Venom/etc. , why does everyone seem to think it "kills" engines? Use it responsibly and you'll be fine...nuff said. BTW, my friend ran a 16.5 bone stock base model 90 240 fastback today at the track. That's a respectable time indeed, and you seem to be a whole second longer...that explains the automatic's weakness right there in proof. anyways, good luck with the project, however you go about it.

[rotaryknight]

TRUE! Reaction time is the time that it takes you to leave the line and DOES NOT affect your ET.

When cars do exibition runs they really don't care about the lights since all they want is a good ET and trap speed. So many times the drives wait till they are really ready to make thier pass.

You could sit at the line for a hour if you want and get a 3600 second reaction time and still pull a 12 sec 1/4 mile time because that is what your car runs...RT does not affect ET.

Reaction times are good to know if you car actually racing and want to improve your wins. But as far as actualy times ET, trap speed and 60 foot times are what is important. Each of these can show you were you have flaws in your driving, launching, top end, etc.

I may no have seen it but what did you run in your 60 foot times?

[240SX21]

i dunno....i kinda threw away the slips after repeatedly tearing them up in a fit of rage <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'>
but yea, Y-49CRXsi, ive realized that you(and everyone else who has been telling me to do the swap) is right. &nbsp;i NEED a manual. &nbsp;the only thing im wondering now is whether to swap my tranny, or just get a new 240. &nbsp;i really would prefer to keep mine because ive done so many things to it(not just engine, but sound, interior, exterior, etc.). &nbsp;i just made a new post inquiring on where i can get the neccessary parts. &nbsp;should i just go to a junkyard & get used parts, or should i actually order them from nissan? &nbsp;i dunno, im so confused. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'> &nbsp; all i know is im tired of my "fag-o-matic" tranny.

[matic 240sx]

ok my trunk is empty... nothing no carpet.. no tire.. i have no back seat.. i have no spoiler... i HAD a GTR front bumper.. (yes its good to have a 2 inch lower front bumpers with vents to keep front end down less drag) i have injen intake and 2.5 pipe from the cat to a dual tip muffler. I have a 97 auto. I change my oil ahead of time and use mobile one synthetic. i change my plugs and wires often. I use TEXACO 93 octane ( A MUST ) and i pulled a (last run to first run) 15.7, 16.0, 16.6 (WITH OVERDRIVE ON), 16.2, 16.0. you want the overdrive OFF why it matters i dont know... it might not on your car but it did on mine.. i dont know but it does.. well u can see once my car got warmed up it was ready to move.. to warm is BAD (running it 7 times st8), but a little warm (reg driving temp is good...) dont cut if off til after 4 or 5th run, if you was shutting it off after each run and waiting for 10 minutes and recranking that kills your time... think about it... when you frist crank your car and go down the road and hit it.. its a little sluggish.. then you hit it again and its a little better then 5 minutes down the road its a lot better... &nbsp;run once then again then again... your car doesnt have 600 hp it doesn't need to cool down after each run (dont know if you were doing that but i know honda boys always do that.. and they run 17s) trust me i tested this out..

[matic 240sx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (240SX21 @ May 26 2002,10:43)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i dunno....i kinda threw away the slips after repeatedly tearing them up in a fit of rage <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'>
but yea, Y-49CRXsi, ive realized that you(and everyone else who has been telling me to do the swap) is right. i NEED a manual. the only thing im wondering now is whether to swap my tranny, or just get a new 240. i really would prefer to keep mine because ive done so many things to it(not just engine, but sound, interior, exterior, etc.). i just made a new post inquiring on where i can get the neccessary parts. should i just go to a junkyard & get used parts, or should i actually order them from nissan? i dunno, im so confused. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'> all i know is im tired of my "fag-o-matic" tranny.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
umm... &nbsp;lets not be saying fag-o-matic anymore k <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

matic is my nickname... &nbsp;not just a handle for zilvia

[mrdirty]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (matic 240sx @ May 28 2002,10:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ok my trunk is empty... nothing no carpet.. no tire.. i have no back seat.. i have no spoiler... i HAD a GTR front bumper.. (yes its good to have a 2 inch lower front bumpers with vents to keep front end down less drag)</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Everything else being equal, the bumper w/ less frontal will will always produce less drag.
People use larger bumpers for 3 reasons:
1) Appearance
2) Good design will use a splitter, adds downforce
3) FMIC

Overdrive puts your tranny in a higher gear to help fuel mileage at the expense of acceleration.

[240SX21]

sorry matic, i was just frustrated <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'> &nbsp;keep in mind though that you have the DOHC engine correct? &nbsp;so you already have more HP than i do. &nbsp;and we have basically the same upgrades. &nbsp;i did however have my OD on, should i have turned it off? &nbsp;i figured having it on would help since its like a 5th gear.

[S13Grl]

Rotaryknight,

I didn't know that RT and ET are not related at all. &nbsp;And so if you sit at the light and spin out for half a second or more, your ET will still be what it's supposed to?

[nrcooled]

To explain overdrive:
-the tranny shifts earlier
-it always wants to upshift
-more hesitant to downshift
-conserves gas, no acceleration

All of these things IMO are bad if you are going for time. &nbsp;And 5th gear makes no difference if your trap speed is 78mph <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'> &nbsp; Even if you ran a trap speed worthy of a 5th gear you wouldn't want to use it anyway because of the low ratio of the gear its self would kill you acceleration

Just my .02

[rotaryknight]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (S13Grl @ May 28 2002,11:29)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Rotaryknight,

I didn't know that RT and ET are not related at all. And so if you sit at the light and spin out for half a second or more, your ET will still be what it's supposed to?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Well, most people don't have the power to sit in one place and spin. &nbsp;What usually happens is wheel hop and they still end up crossing the line and triggering the time. &nbsp;So in those cases ET will be affected. Simply because they had a bad launch.

If someone has a line lock and does a burn out yea they won't move. &nbsp;Or if they are bouncing off a two step same deal.

[matic 240sx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mrdirty @ May 27 2002,11:55)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (matic 240sx @ May 28 2002,10:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ok my trunk is empty... nothing no carpet.. no tire.. i have no back seat.. i have no spoiler... i HAD a GTR front bumper.. (yes its good to have a 2 inch lower front bumpers with vents to keep front end down less drag)</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Everything else being equal, the bumper w/ less frontal will will always produce less drag.
People use larger bumpers for 3 reasons:
1) Appearance
2) Good design will use a splitter, adds downforce
3) FMIC

Overdrive puts your tranny in a higher gear to help fuel mileage at the expense of acceleration.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
there is a difference genius... &nbsp;you need vents from to keep your front of your car down.. blocking the vents off would be good for a 2 1/2 inch lowered car. &nbsp;so yes a lower front bumper helps. &nbsp;dont believe me search it and pick up an issue of car and driver 1998 july (or was it june or august?) where they test cars for drag... &nbsp;if you dont have vents on a car the front once floored raises up... since our cars dont have 600 hp we dont need the weight to move to the back of the vehicle for traction... &nbsp;so yes its helps to lower the car and have vents.. to keep the drag OVER the car NOT UNDER.

splitters can be added to any bumper..

im not trying to flame your or something but you needed to know and im telling u...

and yes keep overdrive off.. &nbsp;and only have about 1/4 of gas.. and yes im dohc... keep working on that car <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

[mrdirty]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (matic 240sx @ May 28 2002,2:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mrdirty @ May 27 2002,11:55)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (matic 240sx @ May 28 2002,10:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ok my trunk is empty... nothing no carpet.. no tire.. i have no back seat.. i have no spoiler... i HAD a GTR front bumper.. (yes its good to have a 2 inch lower front bumpers with vents to keep front end down less drag)</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Everything else being equal, the bumper w/ less frontal will will always produce less drag.
People use larger bumpers for 3 reasons:
1) Appearance
2) Good design will use a splitter, adds downforce
3) FMIC

Overdrive puts your tranny in a higher gear to help fuel mileage at the expense of acceleration.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
there is a difference genius... you need vents from to keep your front of your car down.. blocking the vents off would be good for a 2 1/2 inch lowered car. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
What's w/ the attitude? I don't even know what you're saying here?!? I'd love to see some proof that your specific bumper is giving you better times, but I don't really care.

It seems like everyone has a brilliant theory these days with no f'ing way to begin proving it. Tell u what, this is a FORUM, where people voice OPINIONS; if you can't handle that w/out childish name calling then GET LOST.

Seriously, what exactly is your problem aside from the english language?

[rotaryknight]

Uh guys...I think at the level most of our cars are at a bumper is not gonna help or hurt. &nbsp;Unless the bumper weighs 500 lbs or something <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hehe.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hehe:'> .

True aerodynamics and fluidynamics do play an important function but not at this level. &nbsp;The wing on my FD was wind tunnel tested blah blah and proven to increase downforce etc by KnighSports...but not till the car hit 100-120 mph.

So if the guy is running 16 sec 1/4 miles he's not even hittin 100 mph. &nbsp;It's not a big factor yet. &nbsp;He's not going fast enough yet to cause lift conditions....from what i know...correct me if wrong.

His trap speed is prob only like 80 mph anyways.

[240SX21]

wow this is the biggest post ive ever started! &nbsp;and i have people arguing with each other! &nbsp;i feel special! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'> &nbsp; seriously though, i understand what youre saying about the bumper and i have to agree with rotaryknight....things like bumpers & weight decreases and what not dont really matter until you start breaking really fast times & every microsecond counts. &nbsp;one more question about overdrive though, is it ok to drive with it OFF all the time? &nbsp;or should i only turn it off when im running the 1/4?

[matic 240sx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mrdirty @ May 27 2002,4:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (matic 240sx @ May 28 2002,2:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mrdirty @ May 27 2002,11:55)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (matic 240sx @ May 28 2002,10:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ok my trunk is empty... nothing no carpet.. no tire.. i have no back seat.. i have no spoiler... i HAD a GTR front bumper.. (yes its good to have a 2 inch lower front bumpers with vents to keep front end down less drag)</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Everything else being equal, the bumper w/ less frontal will will always produce less drag.
People use larger bumpers for 3 reasons:
1) Appearance
2) Good design will use a splitter, adds downforce
3) FMIC

Overdrive puts your tranny in a higher gear to help fuel mileage at the expense of acceleration.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
there is a difference genius... you need vents from to keep your front of your car down.. blocking the vents off would be good for a 2 1/2 inch lowered car. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
What's w/ the attitude? I don't even know what you're saying here?!? I'd love to see some proof that your specific bumper is giving you better times, but I don't really care.

It seems like everyone has a brilliant theory these days with no f'ing way to begin proving it. Tell u what, this is a FORUM, where people voice OPINIONS; if you can't handle that w/out childish name calling then GET LOST.

Seriously, what exactly is your problem aside from the english language?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
right &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/hmmm.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':hmmm:'>

sorry i cant bez typinz good nough 4 you boss

sorry little boy your just confusing two differnet forms of drag


<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>

i know your new and you want to sound real smart but no one cares so calm down.. &nbsp;and it wasn't an opinion it was a fact.

[mrdirty]

What are the 2 different forms of drag?

Just curious, because there's only 1 type of drag and I thought maybe you stumbled onto something revolutionary...

Dumbass...

[nrcooled]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (mrdirty @ May 28 2002,9:54)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What are the 2 different forms of drag?

Just curious, because there's only 1 type of drag and I thought maybe you stumbled onto something revolutionary...

Dumbass...</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I think he is refering to your style of dress

[240SX21]

cant we all just get along?! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'> &nbsp; i just wanted to know why my car was slow! &nbsp;thats all! &nbsp;lol <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

[matic 240sx]

lol, calm down... &nbsp;

a car has different drag in different areas all the time...

im not saying your wrong or something im just saying something different. &nbsp;I never said my bumper made my car a 1/2 second faster. &nbsp;i know what you mean when you say less frontal. &nbsp;but you need vents in the lower front bumper and a bigger front bumper to keep less air from going under the car.

when you are driving the air has to go somewhere it can't just sit there... &nbsp;when air comes towards your car it slows down and becomes compressed molecules then has to go somewhere... &nbsp;around the sides, over the top, or under the car... &nbsp;you want less to go under the car this creates a lower pressure area under the car, effectively providing downforce... &nbsp;when you have front air dams, they let even less air pass under the car. &nbsp;and again i didn't say that this helped me a great deal.. i MAYBE gained a mph at the track. &nbsp;i was just letting him know everything i had done at the time. &nbsp;yes most cars do get a better top speed (1-4 mph faster wow, if the car is highly aerodynamic more like 5-15) when taped off but i promise you the person driving it is scared as hell around 100 mph... &nbsp;the car will have to much lift. &nbsp;in other words i know what your saying but you have to have downforce unless your crazy... &nbsp;so when you have downforce in the front of the car it keeps mostly flat when off the line giving you traction and LESS DRAG which is good. &nbsp;and as i said... maybe its good for a mph in the 1/4... &nbsp;i wasn't worried about my aerodynamics as someone said.. &nbsp;i just didnt like the stock front.. . but anywho.. who cares <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':p'>