this is getting REALLY annoying now. help me * pic included for better understanding* - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

j00ni3 · 07-17-2006, 08:42 AM

hello all.. i removed my upper and side chain guides... and i STILL get the rattling WTF? ...

now i wanted to know if the lower chain guide is causing this?...

but i dont' think that's the problem ...

the thing is the rattling is only audible when the A/C is on... WTF?

and it sounds JUST like if the guides are still in there... WTF? :hammer:

so i checked my tensioner if it was still usuable and it compressed and everything .. ARG~~

so can the tensioner even tho is compresses and moves that it is causing slack in the upper chain to hit the valve cover? ... but ONLY WHEN THE A/C is on?

it seems like when there is more load on the engine, the rattling starts to appear...

can anyone HELP ME?~ ... i hate this... oh and btw ... i have a ka24de thank you ~

j00ni3 · 07-17-2006, 08:58 AM

oh and i can hear it the most with the a/c on an at around 2-3 rpm in 3rd gear... in the 30 - 40 mph range... thank you again

projectRDM · 07-17-2006, 11:27 AM

A/C would have nothing to do with the chains, your noise is somewhere else.

Sounds like the compressor clutch is loose or bent, making a noise when engaged. You're just hearing it due to resonance through the block I bet. Go out under the hood with the A/C on and unplug the compressor, see if it stops. If so, plug it in and use a stethoscope to pinpoint the noise.

j00ni3 · 07-17-2006, 12:25 PM

well... hum...

maybe... but the thing is .... will it still make the sound after i turn off the a/c? and it tends to be LOUDER under load also ..

this is what i did... i had the a/c on and then it started to make the noise so ... i turn it off and still it makes that chain guide rattle sound... ( this was under load... driving not at idle )

and sometimes i can hear it without using the a/c ... i mean like i press the clutch and play with my engine sometimes.. * i know shoot me *

like i dont' rev hard.. i just rev to like 3 - 3.5 k just to hear my new exhaust...

and i can hear the rattle kick in sometimes.. ***** btw... it doesn't rattle at idle so i can't really pinpoint the noise at idle ****

so what do you think ?

anyone ?

pleas ehelp..... aRG thank you

ivegonemad · 07-17-2006, 01:37 PM

so really the question is how do u know it is the chain guide or if it is the tensioner gone bad....if u cant hear it at idle..have u tried revving it to 3500 or something until u do heara noise....but how does it really sound though??? give more details.....

j00ni3 · 07-17-2006, 02:23 PM

it sounds just like when the chain taps on the chain guides...

just ... they are not there.. anymore

and yea.. i want to know if the tensioner is bad... will it make this sound? ...

and well... when i just rev it to 3500 it doens't make a sound but when i fluctuate the rpm's fast it starts making the sounds...

aznpoopy · 07-17-2006, 03:22 PM

is your oil low? low oil pressure will cause slack chain.

if the tensioner is bad, the chain will be slack and make rattling noises. there are actually two tensioners... number 18 is the lower chain tensioner. i've never heard of one going out, but i suppose it's possible.

btw the lower chain guide is necessary and you shouldn't remove it.

imo first step is to get a mechanic's stethoscope and pinpoint the noise.

j00ni3 · 07-17-2006, 03:37 PM

just changed the oil with 4 quarts mob 1 syn...

maybe too much oil ? will it cause noise?

and the sound is definitely coming from the top so i guess ... i should try and change that then ... but ...

btw... thanks aznpoopy

anyone else ?

aznpoopy · 07-17-2006, 03:47 PM

top front of the valve cover?

if the chain is loose and hitting the valve cover then there will be marks where it hit. take off the valve cover and check.

projectRDM · 07-17-2006, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j00ni3

well... hum...

maybe... but the thing is .... will it still make the sound after i turn off the a/c? and it tends to be LOUDER under load also ..

this is what i did... i had the a/c on and then it started to make the noise so ... i turn it off and still it makes that chain guide rattle sound... ( this was under load... driving not at idle )

and sometimes i can hear it without using the a/c ... i mean like i press the clutch and play with my engine sometimes.. * i know shoot me *

like i dont' rev hard.. i just rev to like 3 - 3.5 k just to hear my new exhaust...

and i can hear the rattle kick in sometimes.. ***** btw... it doesn't rattle at idle so i can't really pinpoint the noise at idle ****

so what do you think ?

anyone ?

pleas ehelp..... aRG thank you

Directly from above: "but ONLY WHEN THE A/C is on?"

So which is it?

NIK90s13 · 07-17-2006, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aznpoopy

top front of the valve cover?

if the chain is loose and hitting the valve cover then there will be marks where it hit. take off the valve cover and check.

agreed, I was thinking the same thing. To make sure it isn't the ac compresser, pull the belt and then run the car and see what, if anything, that changes.

LA_phantom_240 · 07-17-2006, 10:14 PM

Yeah just make sure it isnt your lower tensioner or guide or youll get this..

Not fun.

j00ni3 · 07-17-2006, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R240NA

Directly from above: "but ONLY WHEN THE A/C is on?"

So which is it?

ok sorry ... i'll clear this...

it STARTS to rattle after i turn on the a/c and then the rattle dies away after i turn OFF the a/c ... but i can still hear it while shifting

aznpoopy ... i will check my valve cover this weekend to see if anything is up ...

and la phantom

hopefully it won't be but i will be checking that also thanks alot guys for the help~~~~~

props to all of you ^^

pr240sx · 07-18-2006, 08:04 AM

First
remove all belts and start your car, check for noise
add one belt at a time, start your car after. Be carefull, the water pump will not be functional, DONT overheat the car. 30 to 45 seconds of idle time is enough.

240sx AC are noisy. Its a design "flaw" Even the FSM says so. They are louder as the pressure and temps get higher.
Also, the AC belt tensioner makes some scraping noises when dirty or the bearing is worn.

j00ni3 · 07-18-2006, 03:43 PM

trust me... it's not scraping... it's TAPPING but i'll check everything thanks again ..

pr240sx · 07-18-2006, 07:04 PM

Will quote my FSM regarding AC compressor

In my 93 fsm
page HA-11 #3
A "claking" sound may occasionally be heard during refrigerant charge......etc

If your car do NOT make the sound a idle with AC off, I am sure that your chains and guides are ok.

j00ni3 · 07-18-2006, 07:29 PM

but with the a/c off i do hear it at times so ... but thanks for that heads up ... and btw... i have a 95 hehe

thanks again

LA_phantom_240 · 07-22-2006, 03:27 PM

...ever figure it out?

Nizzan4u2nv · 07-23-2006, 02:05 AM

Hmm, I have a similar problem that ive been lazy to look into. After I took the top guides out, I have a clanking/knocking under certain loads. I remember not being able to move the tensioner when I took the guides out so I figure its that. I guess I should stop being lazy and check my valve cover for marks.

pr240sx · 07-23-2006, 02:33 PM

Could be an accesory bearing going bad
Try to start your car without the belts and check. Keep adding belts until the noise is heard
Wach out coolant temp!!

S13Eye · 07-23-2006, 03:42 PM

My friend's S13 with a KADE was exhibiting the exact same symptoms. It turned out to be rod knock. It kicked the bucket while i was driving it up a bridge (under load). The #4 rod exited through the oil pan, while the cap took the scenic route through the side of the block

We found the connecting rod at the side of the road where it blew up. Those are pieces of the engine block next to the rod. Anyway, make sure its not rod knock, so you can still salvage some parts of your motor.

undercoverdjay · 07-24-2006, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S13Eye

The #4 rod exited through the oil pan, while the cap took the scenic route through the side of the block.

Haha, I like how you put that

But honestly yeah, Id check for oil leaks, and keep a close eye on oil level

tre · 07-24-2006, 09:08 AM

if its at idle its timing chain (replace your chain tensioners)
If its all the time, Good chance its rod knock :P

Id- · 07-24-2006, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S13Eye

My friend's S13 with a KADE was exhibiting the exact same symptoms. It turned out to be rod knock. It kicked the bucket while i was driving it up a bridge (under load). The #4 rod exited through the oil pan, while the cap took the scenic route through the side of the block

We found the connecting rod at the side of the road where it blew up. Those are pieces of the engine block next to the rod. Anyway, make sure its not rod knock, so you can still salvage some parts of your motor.

Yeah I was about to say; I think its a spun bearing or something.

07-17-2006, 08:42 AM	#1
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	this is getting REALLY annoying now. help me * pic included for better understanding* hello all.. i removed my upper and side chain guides... and i STILL get the rattling WTF? ... now i wanted to know if the lower chain guide is causing this?... but i dont' think that's the problem ... the thing is the rattling is only audible when the A/C is on... WTF? and it sounds JUST like if the guides are still in there... WTF? :hammer: so i checked my tensioner if it was still usuable and it compressed and everything .. ARG~~ so can the tensioner even tho is compresses and moves that it is causing slack in the upper chain to hit the valve cover? ... but ONLY WHEN THE A/C is on? it seems like when there is more load on the engine, the rattling starts to appear... can anyone HELP ME?~ ... i hate this... oh and btw ... i have a ka24de thank you ~ __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~ driver's side window button fix

07-17-2006, 08:58 AM	#2
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	oh and i can hear it the most with the a/c on an at around 2-3 rpm in 3rd gear... in the 30 - 40 mph range... thank you again __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~ driver's side window button fix

07-17-2006, 02:23 PM	#6
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	it sounds just like when the chain taps on the chain guides... just ... they are not there.. anymore and yea.. i want to know if the tensioner is bad... will it make this sound? ... and well... when i just rev it to 3500 it doens't make a sound but when i fluctuate the rpm's fast it starts making the sounds... __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~ driver's side window button fix

07-17-2006, 03:37 PM	#8
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	just changed the oil with 4 quarts mob 1 syn... maybe too much oil ? will it cause noise? and the sound is definitely coming from the top so i guess ... i should try and change that then ... but ... btw... thanks aznpoopy anyone else ? __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~ driver's side window button fix

07-18-2006, 03:43 PM	#15
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	trust me... it's not scraping... it's TAPPING but i'll check everything thanks again .. __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~ driver's side window button fix

07-17-2006, 11:27 AM	#3
projectRDM Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Atlanta Age: 47 Posts: 13,812 Trader Rating: (12) Feedback Score: 12 reviews	A/C would have nothing to do with the chains, your noise is somewhere else. Sounds like the compressor clutch is loose or bent, making a noise when engaged. You're just hearing it due to resonance through the block I bet. Go out under the hood with the A/C on and unplug the compressor, see if it stops. If so, plug it in and use a stethoscope to pinpoint the noise.

07-17-2006, 12:25 PM	#4
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	well... hum... maybe... but the thing is .... will it still make the sound after i turn off the a/c? and it tends to be LOUDER under load also .. this is what i did... i had the a/c on and then it started to make the noise so ... i turn it off and still it makes that chain guide rattle sound... ( this was under load... driving not at idle ) and sometimes i can hear it without using the a/c ... i mean like i press the clutch and play with my engine sometimes.. * i know shoot me * like i dont' rev hard.. i just rev to like 3 - 3.5 k just to hear my new exhaust... and i can hear the rattle kick in sometimes.. *** btw... it doesn't rattle at idle so i can't really pinpoint the noise at idle so what do you think ? anyone ? pleas ehelp..... aRG thank you __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~** driver's side window button fix

07-17-2006, 01:37 PM	#5
ivegonemad Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: hawthorne Posts: 30 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	so really the question is how do u know it is the chain guide or if it is the tensioner gone bad....if u cant hear it at idle..have u tried revving it to 3500 or something until u do heara noise....but how does it really sound though??? give more details.....

07-17-2006, 03:22 PM	#7
aznpoopy Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: New Jersey Age: 40 Posts: 5,013 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	is your oil low? low oil pressure will cause slack chain. if the tensioner is bad, the chain will be slack and make rattling noises. there are actually two tensioners... number 18 is the lower chain tensioner. i've never heard of one going out, but i suppose it's possible. btw the lower chain guide is necessary and you shouldn't remove it. imo first step is to get a mechanic's stethoscope and pinpoint the noise.

07-17-2006, 03:47 PM	#9
aznpoopy Post Whore! Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: New Jersey Age: 40 Posts: 5,013 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	top front of the valve cover? if the chain is loose and hitting the valve cover then there will be marks where it hit. take off the valve cover and check.

07-17-2006, 10:14 PM	#12
LA_phantom_240 Nissanaholic! Join Date: May 2005 Location: Louisiana. LA is for Louisiana. L.A. is Los Angeles. Age: 33 Posts: 2,315 Trader Rating: (2) Feedback Score: 2 reviews	Yeah just make sure it isnt your lower tensioner or guide or youll get this.. Not fun.

07-18-2006, 08:04 AM	#14
pr240sx Zilvia Addict Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 627 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	First remove all belts and start your car, check for noise add one belt at a time, start your car after. Be carefull, the water pump will not be functional, DONT overheat the car. 30 to 45 seconds of idle time is enough. 240sx AC are noisy. Its a design "flaw" Even the FSM says so. They are louder as the pressure and temps get higher. Also, the AC belt tensioner makes some scraping noises when dirty or the bearing is worn.

07-18-2006, 07:04 PM	#16
pr240sx Zilvia Addict Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 627 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Will quote my FSM regarding AC compressor In my 93 fsm page HA-11 #3 A "claking" sound may occasionally be heard during refrigerant charge......etc If your car do NOT make the sound a idle with AC off, I am sure that your chains and guides are ok.

07-18-2006, 07:29 PM	#17
j00ni3 Zilvia Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC.... 브롱동~ Posts: 273 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	but with the a/c off i do hear it at times so ... but thanks for that heads up ... and btw... i have a 95 hehe thanks again __________________ 빨리 달리자... 싫으면 말고~ driver's side window button fix

07-23-2006, 02:05 AM	#19
Nizzan4u2nv Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: San Diego Age: 36 Posts: 1,226 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	Hmm, I have a similar problem that ive been lazy to look into. After I took the top guides out, I have a clanking/knocking under certain loads. I remember not being able to move the tensioner when I took the guides out so I figure its that. I guess I should stop being lazy and check my valve cover for marks. __________________

07-23-2006, 02:33 PM	#20
pr240sx Zilvia Addict Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 627 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Could be an accesory bearing going bad Try to start your car without the belts and check. Keep adding belts until the noise is heard Wach out coolant temp!!

07-23-2006, 03:42 PM	#21
S13Eye Zilvia Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Los Angeles Age: 36 Posts: 190 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	My friend's S13 with a KADE was exhibiting the exact same symptoms. It turned out to be rod knock. It kicked the bucket while i was driving it up a bridge (under load). The #4 rod exited through the oil pan, while the cap took the scenic route through the side of the block We found the connecting rod at the side of the road where it blew up. Those are pieces of the engine block next to the rod. Anyway, make sure its not rod knock, so you can still salvage some parts of your motor.

07-24-2006, 09:08 AM	#23
tre Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 544 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	if its at idle its timing chain (replace your chain tensioners) If its all the time, Good chance its rod knock :P __________________ I didn't buy an Audi because it is a Great Car, but for more of a reason to be an asshole.

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