c72c

as for feeling a difference, I can tell on a few, but they've also been on different cars, so they're not completely compareable.

just to add... This is where personal opinion comes in. I have HEs on my 14 and love em. I wouldn't want anything softer, even on the roads here. They are a little bouncy when I adjust the dampening tigher, but that's to be expected. Then again, I also fit some jeep springs on stock struts on my tempo back home.

and i'll sneak this in for those who complain about stiff suspension

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5pecialist

I'd add "as long as it keep my tire in contact with the pavement". You could weld your frame to the suspension arms, but every little bump is going to bounce you up off the pavement & reduce the time your tires are applying force LOL

Corbic

On the same side, lock step.

Corbic

Last time i checked, Koni 2817 are $1,800 a piece and only a cartridge. I would truly hope they are "better" then those "garbage $1,000 complete coilover sets"

Actually my response directly goes towards the OPs comments/questions. He asked what we look for and if their is a difference in budget coilovers. Your comments about wanting to use expensive pro-am set ups are the ones out of line with the context of this thread, and really 98% of the users on this forum.

So you agree that for the Average driver, the cost of the high-end coilovers would be lost on them as they don't have the skill to take full advantage of the more costly set-up? Thus, reinforcing the reason inexpensive options exist and why people are comparing and asking about them?

If I'm looking to buy a Honda Fit becuase I want a cheap reliable car that gets good gasmileage, but I ask if it's sportier then a Yaris... do you really need to say both are garbage and that a ZR1 is a better car? If we truly cared about Club/Spec racing, we would be looking at cars that are competitive (or required) in their prospective series. Thanks to the SCCA, the 240SX is not that competitive.

So are you saying you sell coilovers that you feel are inferior and are openly ragging on them, or are you just a salesman for Koni/JRZ and I should take your comments as nothing but defensive seller dribble?

It does not take a Marketing Major to realize how popular the entry-level coilovers are with import owners and it doesn't take a Business Major to realize that people want to maximize their return on a $1,000 investment. Sure, Ksport are garbage... ok, but are they better or worse then Megan? Someone asking about Ksports and how to install them is not going to try and figure out what Koni's he needs, cut up the stock shock bodies, buy a set of ground control collars and camber plates and then try and dial that stuff in, all so he can slam his car on 18inch wheels.

As for if I could tell Megan's from JRZ... are you telling me that only a professional driver with years of experience could notice the difference an that any lay-man would fail to pick up on the subtle difference to which set-up actual rides and handles better?

Def

I'm growing tired of this... as it's obvious you have very little experience with this and are just trying to win an internet argument. It's difficult to debate something when someone has very little familiarity to even know when they are making ridiciulously incorrect statements. But I'll give it another quick go...

I thought you said there was little difference between the same damper type, just valving and shim stacks? So which is it? I used extreme examples to prove that you don't know what you're talking about... There are more subtle differences even at lower price points.


I think my response does as well. There *IS* a difference with nicer stuff. In fact, that doesn't really follow along with the price, as a set of Koni yellows *IS* a better performing damper than pretty much anything you'll find "preassembled" for an S chassis under $1500. A set of those shocks/struts costs about $500-600. Do the math.


If you just want something to slam your car for hard parking at Wal-Mart with your "bros" why do you even care how "good" the dampers are? I'm assuming the OP and others interested in that question are not just posers, and might actually like to drive their cars. I'm addressing my responses accordingly. It doesn't take much track experience to tell what a good damper is, but the person talking about how "stiff" they feel on the street probably wouldn't know the first thing about what a good damper feels like. Would you like to put any other words in my mouth?


I don't sell anything I've mentioned in this thread - thanks for proving you again don't have a clue, and trying to "win the internet argument." If you don't like the truth, then I suggest you just ignore my posts, because I tell it like it is.

I do like how you talk about installing Koni yellows is something truly difficult though. If you're letting a 30-60 min install for the front struts stop you, then you just aren't cut out for this hobby.

I'm not a professional driver and I can tell the difference between a Megan and JRZ, so if that doesn't answer your "hypothetical" question trying to put words in my mouth then I can't help you.


So can we get beyond this simple "I just figured out what a coilover is" type exchange?


For the people looking for good info and not some keyboard warrior wasting bandwidth, check out my first post. It lays it out pretty well on what you can get at difference price points that have large differences in their performance groups.

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S13 Hatch - Goes around tracks quickly
DEFSPORT

Corbic

So with all your experience and vast knowledge which clearly dwarf mine (presume much?), then what is better.

Ksport or Megan.

Def

They're about the same. I'd go option C and get some Koni yellows and piece together a coilover setup for less than the cost of both of them.


...and there is no presumption on my part, your responses detail your lack of knowledge/experience about this topic very clearly.

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S13 Hatch - Goes around tracks quickly
DEFSPORT

Corbic

About the same is not the same. Which is better? But clearly, your response shows a lack of detailed experience with them.

!Zar!

To answer this thread title, yes.

But, don't forget setup is extremely important when getting coilovers.

Buying them, and slapping them on isn't going to do much for you.

Setting preload, droop, rebound/,bound, spring, and ride hight all affect how your coilovers perform.

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Def

If you want a detailed response. I owned K-Sports for ~4 years and put about 1.5k track miles on them. It was obvious they did not have the same damping force for the same positioning of the "knob," and they were a balancing act between poor and really poor low speed rebound damping, and too much compression/rebound at higher shaft speeds. I eventually got them "sorta ok" with lots of testing and keeping a log book on suspension settings. The car was never settled over bumps and it was difficult to go beyond 9/10ths at the track because hitting slight undulations at different angles just made the car react very differently in the same corner lap to lap. They also suffered from damper fade as they got hot.

I've ridden in a couple of cars with Megans - they are just as bad as the K-Sports and feel remarkably similar(no low speed rebound, non-digressive valving so too much high speed damping). The Megan tracks are even worse - felt like the same damping, or even more high speed damping without anymore low end(that's bad), and ridiculously high spring rates. It generally skittered over anything and felt like it'd be slow when trying to put down fast lap times. Hardly a confidence inspiring "track" suspension.

Short story - they both suck. Koni yellows are probably cheaper with some minor work for the end user and will give vastly better results.


That good enough for you?

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S13 Hatch - Goes around tracks quickly
DEFSPORT

ManoNegra

How are the roads where you drive like?
I've done quite a bit of street and freeway driving on HEs here in Socal
and at high speeds I found them to be decent
at moderate speeds I couldn't look out my rear view mirror since the shaking of the mirror gives me a headache (I'm not joking)
at low speeds going over cracks and uneven roads felt like driving on train tracks

What other coilovers have you ridden on to compare?

az_240

As mentioned earlier how a coilover rides depends on how it is setup and what else you have on the car.

Example... if you have polyurethane bushings in the uprights/LCAs it will be a shitty bouncy ride at low/medium speed once the grease dries up.

So one guy might have Ksports on stock bushings that feel decent while another guy has Megans that ride like shit because he has dried up bushings that bind.

Kinda off topic but has anyone figured out how to get the Koni setup to go lower?

slider2828

You know what.... Seriously... Yes there is a difference.... Will the OP notice NO.... Because he doesn't have the experience driving in different setups, so whatever you tell him he can hear it, but it will NEVER transfer into realistic feel...

Its like doing multiplication... YOu can tell him to memorize it, and it won't mean shit.... He will have to learn how to apply it to see that its useful....

So in the end... get something cheap.... Wear it out... Then go to something else.... Nothing wrong with that... Suspension settings is a learning experience... Its ok, get megans or stance, just none of that non name ebay stuff.....

OP just try something, there is nothing wrong with getting not the best suspenion, but try something.... done.

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Turn and Burn!

supervenom

I have found that when the difference in price between units is $200-$300, the differences are not very noticeable. It is when yu try out the very high end set-ups that you feel a bigger difference. Unless your building a D1 car, Megans or K-Sports are fine. Dollar for dollar that is...

raz0rbladez909

We'll I appreciate your input and consider it constructive criticism in a way, because in fact you are correct that I don't have so much experience driving many different setups, because honestly i'd be wasting alot of coin trying to compare each of them and set them all up the same. But that doesn't mean I can't learn a thing or two from someone else, simply from them answering a question. My main goal in asking this question was more along the lines of why people buy the brands they buy, and what they look for in them since in fact there is little difference in the lower end coilover realm, as well as I wanted some more experienced peoples input on what they find to be a good setup. Like DEF for example, gave a good outside view that i'd never thought to hear of anyone on Zilvia mention koni shocks with an aftermarket spring, which is something i'd like to look into. I'm no expert and not going to pretend to be, which is why I have asked, and I have gained some knowledge from this post and figured it'd be able to help others when it comes to more than just hardparking these cars. Because like mentioned before 98% of people on here do

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2004 Corvette Z06 / 1971 240z

Def

You can drop them in the housings slightly, but that's still probably not enough for most people here with the ride heights they run.

There might be a shorter Koni that'll fit in the housing that'd be worth looking into.

Or you could just get some 8610's in veilside180sx's housings up front and something like Koni yellows in the rear. Bolt-in setup, and you can go VERY low on the front housings. My tire is hard up against my strut tower and I still have plenty of travel on my 8611's up front.

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S13 Hatch - Goes around tracks quickly
DEFSPORT

slider2828

I completely agree with you, but in the end, EVERYONE's driving style is different. What suits one person may not suit the other. Suspension feel is going to be different from car to car, such as weight, height, balance, other suspension modification. There are just WAYYYY to many factors to say one is better than another on any car.

Def's koni with custom housings been talked about for like 3 years now? Its not new at all and there is a thread dedicated to this custom suspension for awhile now. But seriously how are you going to know the difference if you have nothing to compare it except other people's word.

All I am saying is get out there and drive, until you have an idea of where you want your car to be and feel. Also ride in different cars and it will give you a perspective on where you want it to be.....

Ride alongs on the track with racers or very very experienced car drivers will give you can idea on where you want to be.... A good S2000 driver with a well setup car is what I think a 240sx should feel like... Not tail happy, but super balanced where over speeding into the corner and the car will automatically scrub speed and all that good stuff....

More experience will give you a better perspective in the end.... Right now S2000CR is where I want the S chassis to be. Granted I was riding with an S2k Cup car driver, still it was a great experience.... Also E30's are sick tooo...

By no means am I criticizing you, but rather just giving people view point about how comparing suspensions is just going to just wasted time.... Like another thread said, get something that you can afford that has reasonable quality.... If you can't drop 1600 into a suspension but rather 8-900 then get MR's.... If you can save up to 1500 or 1600 then Def or KW's are great....

The driver makes the car faster....

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Turn and Burn!