the brake swap thread
 

Alright, looking to get a collection of all the popular "brake swaps" for the s-chassis. A place where everyone can comment on how certain swaps feel and for what power levels the brakes are good for. This is for all swaps, either from other cars, or aftermarket (willwood) calipers with hardware/rotor setups that work. Also including front/rear balanced setups and pictures to show wheel clearance (and for those of us who like that minimal caliper>wheel clearance). i did a search, but all the information is spread out, i thought it would be nice to have it all in one place.

First off, lets get technical and describe how a brake system works, and get a basis for upgrading. For those in for a read: http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/Win...principle.html

This is how our brake system works, and how we must look at upgrading it. The brake pedal/brake booster offers a leverage advantage of force on the master cylinder. With this, and the principles of hydraulic fluids, we are able to put tremendous forces on the brake pads. Simply put, the larger the caliper pistons, the more force you can output on the pads (given the same size master cylinder). With the same point, the larger a master cylinder bore, the greater input force is required to have the same output. It is generally recommended to go to a larger master cylinder if you upgrade the brakes, to get rid of that "soft" feeling in the pedal.

Master Cylinder Options:
stock bmc bore is 15/16".

1. Z32: so far the only BMC I know that is direct replacement. Either 1" or 1 1/16" bore.

1. Z32/skyline gtst brakes
-front calipers: bolt on
-rear calipers: bolt on
-z32 rotors/pads (26 or 30mm depending on caliper in the front). have 5 lug or redrill to 4 lug if needed
-brake lines: lots of variations of swap brake lines are available online
special notes: z33 track rotors can be used in front with an adapter plate, z32 2+2 ebrake lines supposedly reach stock location with rerouting, can also use extensions found on ebay or make some yourself like this:
http://t3.gstatic.com/imagesq=tbn:AN...qRRLU0eUzPuqig


2. Evo/sti brembo brakes
Front: 04 STi Brembo calipers / Evo rotors
Rear: 04 STi Brembo calipers / Evo rotors
Brake lines: Brembo brake lines for STi Brembos
notes: rear caliper/ebrake. brembo calipers on your z32 setup:
#/f/tech-talk/93748-...ml#post1342840
note about sti rears:
#/f/tech-talk/93748-...ml#post2057367

front calipers need adapter bracket:
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/3...ture0588ln.jpg
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/3...racket1fs0.jpg

mounted picture (17" wheel)
http://www.driftclub-il.com/johnc/Ni...s/brakes11.jpg

3. sentra se-r vspec brembo fronts
-work well with z32 rear
-bolt right up to front
-sentra rotors redrilled

anyone with different brake setups, post what you got, pics, how it feels. lets try to keep the general chat to a min and post up brake setups!

Since when has it been required to use Z32/GTST rear knuckles for rear Z32 calipers on a S13/14?

i was under the impression they were, as when i was new to s-chassis thats what everyone told me. did some googling, fixed the error. thanks atutt

Q45 fronts, S13 rear. Direct bolt on, uses S13/S14 brake lines. Stock BMC can be used.

Redrill to 4 lug if needed.

Could a person also do the Altima larger rotor on the S13 rear to gain a little more rear braking? Like is it worth it?

#/f/archive-faqs/291...-calipers.html

^ I don't see how upgrading to a bigger rotor increases braking ability. The only thing I can think of is quicker heat dissipation. The caliper stays the same (weak single piston, that continues to do the same thing, being weak. ) the only way you can make it better is with a good pad compound, and that's the limit of that set up. Looks like a waste of time to me. The dual z32 rear piston caliper will do a far better job even on a tiny rotor.




P.S. I am not a expert on brakes. Just saying whats on my mind =P

If you had read the entire thing, you would have found this:

If anything, that is an ALTERNATIVE TO/CHEAPER THAN the z32 rears. And more street oriented might I add.

I did read it. Which is why I said it looks like a pointless upgrade no matter how cheap it costs. You're better off sticking with the stock rotor and upgraded pads.

I did the altima rear rotors with z31 carrier and stock rear calipers, i didn't do it to improve braking, just did it cause stock rotors look tiny inside 18's...

i had a z31 carrier on a parts car lying around and i needed new rotors anyways... it probably ain't worth it to go out of the way to do it.



...moral of the story, save up for mustang rotors and dual z32 calipers.

besides the fact that larger rotors = better heat dissipation (if both are the same type, ie. vented, solid etc.) and all the frictional/physics stuff like that, a larger rotor will give you more leverage on the hub to slow the wheel down.

think like a lever, the further from the pivot the easier it is to lift/move a load. now apply this to the wheel. the pivot is the hub with the tread on the tire being the "handle" of the lever. it puts tremendous stress on any brakes, but with a larger rotor, that force is reduced allowing it to stop easier.

now of course this only applies to situations that maintain identical pad contact areas. the best part of bigger rotors is you can use bigger pads, increasing contact area and greatly improving braking

................

Ok I gotta say it...
By increasing the master cylinder diameter, while lessening pedal travel, the amount of force needed to create the same amount of force in the brake calipers increases. So increasing the bmc size should only be done in proportion to the increase in total caliper piston diameter.

your right, i was thinking about it backwards. its been a while since i've gone over the calculations. good eye, not trying to spread false information

After a little investigation,

Ive read that the SE-R SpecV Brembos use a 300x22mm disc rotor. Now Ive searched and have seen that the R33 GTR Brembos rear AND 03-05 Evo's rear use the same size rotor. Now would I be able to use those rotors on the SE-R calipers in the front in an S14?

Im guessing yes?

you have to look at hat offset as well, which is generally different between a front/rear rotor. im pretty sure the evos use a drum ebrake too which is going to mean they are deeper to the hub mounting point. easiest/best way would probably just have some sentra rotors redrilled but who knows the rears might work! i'm not familiar with the r33 brembo rear setup either, but i could see it being drum e-brake like the r32

cheaper option to buying the full front wilwood big brake kit:

1. wilwood forged superlite internal 4 piston calipers:
Wilwood High-Performance Disc Brakes - Forged Superlite Internal Calipers

2. z33 track rotors + adapter bracket (make your own, or can find online).

after some research, the z33 rotors are 12.76" diameter, and 1.18" thick. this would mean you want one of the calipers that has a rotor max thickness of 1.25 in the link above. the only other decision needing to be made is what you want your overall piston area to be.

install guide (from willwood): http://www.wilwood.com/Pdf/howtostor...ke_Install.pdf
brake lines: p/n 220-9199 from willwood. http://www.wilwood.com/LineKits/Line...temno=220-9199 or you could buy a 1/8-27 npt fitting to -3 adapter and use any brake line you wish that corresponds


these pics belong to WISH ONE and i hope he doesnt mind me sharing:
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...h/IMG_4879.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...h/IMG_4876.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...h/28ae19c6.jpg

What about lines?

a 1/8-27 npt fitting is used to go into the caliper. an adapter from 1/8-27 > -3 can be purchased. line info posted above


will be updating with more technical things in the near future

I LOVE my current setup. It feels very balanced.

Front Calipers - Q45
Rear Calipers - Stock S13 with Z31 bracket with 2003 Altima rear rotors.
Master cylinder - Z31 TT

mine, i love it
i dont really like my rear set up which is Sti + Z32 rotors, im thinking about a special order. IDC! lol dont mind the harness, i will be tucking it, and tubs!

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7003/6...066c0ef740.jpg
IMG_3142 by d_2jzgte, on Flickr

^^^sti brembos in the front right? what dont you like about the rears? feels unbiased? and what size is the wheel (im gonna guess 17")

Brilliant Florida
except what do you plan to do about the fact that rear R33 and Evo rotors
are designed to house a e-brake assembly?

or even if they did bolt on, what makes you think they've be the right offset to the caliper?

Heading in the right direction but not quite there

CodyAce knows what's up:
http://www.codyace.com/albums/album4...all2.sized.jpg

http://www.codyace.com/albums/album4...all1.sized.jpg

^details? trying to get all the info in one place. also, that caliper doesnt look like its mounted in the stock caliper mounts...looks a bit low?

yes Sti fronts and rears +17/16 BMC and yes those are 17's
Sti rear rotors are thicker than Z32's


i want to get another S chassis just so i can slap on some project muahahahaha



oh and that wilwood set up looks good

This is purely to serve as a mild brake upgrade on my S14 until I decide to put more money into it. Currently have 2001 Q45 rotors and calipers up front with Hawk HPS pads, then out back I have the Z31 caliper bracket with 2003 Altima rear rotors and Hawk HPS pad in the stock S14 calipers. So far it's been good enough to take the 60-0 distance from 143 feet down to 119 feet.

i'll be installing my wilwood superlite/z33 brembo setup this weekend, upgrading from a z32 setup. around spring i plan to upgrade to the 2 piece wilwood rotors also.

Defsport / Skullworks Budget Baller Wilwood FSL Kit

also if you care to learn more about the nuances of the Evo/STi Brembo caliper swap search under my username
I know I've posted a good deal of information on the swap

i've actually read about that def/skullworks brake setup, but could never find any info. thanks mano!