Rennsport: The German Car thread
 

Time for some Großdeutsche Lösung (Greater German Solution).

This is the all German thread, not just the Ultimative Auffahrt Automat thread.

Introduction:

Maybe some of you have noticed, maybe some have not, but right now there seems to be a slew of bargain priced 15-20 year old German cars out there. These once expensive luxury performance monsters are now trading for the price of a clean S14.

Yes, to the average consumer, there is much to fear regarding reliability. But for those of us who are used to rebuilding SRs, wiring up 2JZs, dealign with mystical triangles of death (rotaries) and fabbing crap to install a 5.3 Turbo junkyard motor, there really is nothing to fear.

By now, most of the problems these cars have are well documented. There are now proven procedures on how to identify, repair and avoid the issues. Many European cars suffer from failed window regulators, aged timing belts, coil-pack issues, plastic impeller water pumps and other easily remedied failures. While for a "normal" person, a failed water pump would mean thousands in dealership repair costs, most of us can fix it in an afternoon with a $50 ebay part using a steal impeller.

So with that let the German-Fest Begin.

http://automotorplex.com/wp-content/...ow-2011_38.jpg

B5 S4


Fuck yo WRX.

Anymore you can get a B5 S4 for well under 10k. A friend picked up a black/black S4 with records and a 6spd for $6,500. Craigslist specials pop up with automatics for under $5k.

Factory 265hp, 300 ft/tq and a bulletproof 6spd.

http://www.034motorsport.com/feature.../Ken_S4_01.jpg

http://gallery.hartmannwheels.com/do...tm_audi_s4.jpg

http://oi51.tinypic.com/29aqneq.jpg

http://fourtitude.com/gallery/albums...terior/001.jpg

Oh snap. R.I.P. BMW thread. This gon be good. So... I like 944's. Am I crazy? http://www.stanceworks.com/wp-conten...rsche-944.jpeg

Hell no. Back in HS I wanted a 944 bad.

There is tons of info out there about LS1 swaps to really beaf up the power.

http://www.rarecarsforsaleblog.com/w...he944ls11b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2142/5...5dd919a2_z.jpg


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1139032902.jpg

928 - Might not be the best looking car... but that noise. Amazing GT cars with Amazing interiors.

Rennsport: The German Car thread
 

http://stancewords.stanceworks.netdn...form-title.jpg


Some shots from the Luftwaffe

http://986forum.com/forums/attachmen...s-imag1640.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5504/1...1688a184_b.jpg

http://www.build-threads.com/wp-cont...55-Boxster.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...82027689_n.jpg

http://allracingcars.com/gallery/por...-986-rally.jpg

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psjtkojigy.jpg

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psxzpgm4au.jpg

I predict a rise in 944/928 prices in the near future...they may not spike like the 964 Turbos have in the last year (and the other 911's) but I imagine them following that price hike trend.

B5 S4s is such a bargain right now. Even B6 S4s are priced really well right now.

Always loved the 944 body. Very cool indeed. Another Porsche I've been looking at lately has been the 996. Was never a huge fan of the styling, but the 02-05 models have grown on me quite a bit. Plus you can find some really well kept C2s for low to mid teens.

^ 996s seem to be the only 911 series Porsche that's not moving in price. You can find decent mileage Turbos in the mid 30's.

The issues I've seen with the S4's is the turbos. If they haven't been replaced, that seems to be what is dictating the lower priced examples.

B5 S4S ARE SWEET GUYS.

Until you actually have to fucking work on them or when a turbo goes. Fuck. That.

It's only like 28 hours book time, right?

lol

It's actually not that bad. You just need to know HOW to do it. The whole front comes off and everything becomes fairly accessible. Sure it takes some extra time compared to a I4, but it's still better than a 3000GT or 300ZX.

With European cars, patients is a very important virtue.

I've looked at B5 S4's monthly for no joke 7 years, Very rarely have i ever seen "the combo" that it would take for me to actually pull the trigger. I would absolutely LOVE a Stage 3 + S4 Avant. But i don't know if i could actually buy one do to what Renegade_ewok said, because he is right. those cars suck to work on, which is why the VR6-T swap is becoming more and more popular.

A "Decent" 996TT is still in the 40's if not the 50's. Yes, cars can be had for high 30's.

Cats are the big bad guy on the S4, they go, they take out the turbos... and yeah..

Perfect time to upgrade the turbos and delete the cats.

VR6 is also a beast. Junkyard motors are only a few hundred bucks.



http://www.haltech.com/wp-content/up.../11/audi91.jpg

Not even a weekend.

My new lust is the BMW 135I (N54 engine) Such an awesome setup. 3Liter Inline 6 twin turbo making 300HP/300TQ in a 3400lbs 2 door coupe, Yes please, Not to mention they can be found pretty much all day for under $20,000 For a car ranging from 2008-2010. Sure it's not your $7,000 S-Chassis but i want one.
https://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m...1t2xo1_500.jpg
https://40.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l...l3do1_1280.jpg
https://40.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m...opio1_1280.jpg

Ugh, bringing back bad memories of VR-4 clutch jobs from Hell.

That Imola Yellow though....:naughty:

Also the prices of the 968s are taking off.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...tenansicht.jpg

^^^ http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/up...me-300x250.jpg
Dayum. I had no idea 968 could look so hot. Now I don't have to worry about getting rid of the 944's pop-ups while still keeping those muscular fenders. Something about the idea of having an FR Porsche just makes me hot. But I'll never be a fan of LSx swaps. A Subaru boxer in a Porsche just makes more sense to me.

Wait soooo... They make bolt-on hard tops for the 986 Boxster that resemble the Cayman!?! http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforum...omparo-201.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforum...omparo-202.jpg http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforum...zp1010004s.jpg

944 is an Inline-4. Subaru Boxers suck balls.

Some Audi 20v love.

http://www.944-20v.nl/P1000403.JPG

I think a 4.2 swap would be awesome as well.

Zientop made the original and went out of business. Several companies are now making their own versions. They cost $3-4k.

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1332758828.jpg


Another prototype.

http://i1089.photobucket.com/albums/...31B166411A.jpg

http://986forum.com/forums/boxster-r...prototype.html

Factory Hardtop

http://www.suncoastparts.com/mm5/gra...X0026mainZ.jpg

B5 S4s are cool and all but the ones you're going to find for 6500 are already beat to piss by some kid who couldnt afford to keep up on maintenance on the poor thing. Not to mention the syncro issues those transmissions always develop. I would love to rock a B6 S4 as a daily if the 4.2s didnt eat timing chain guides and it didnt cost less to swap in a 2.7tt than to do a timing repair.

Anyways, I enjoy my MK6 Golf R for what it is.

Any idea on how the 986 responds to forced induction? Dat bish needs moar powa!

i bought my b7 a4 about a month ago and i love it....but now im see those b5s and...wow beautiful

the 2 ltr turbo is real easy/fun to work on, even for a novice like myself
every car model has "common issues" but german cars have funky issues
its common on b7 a4s for the HPFP to drill right threw the cam follower causing damage to the camshaft lobe
but not to fear, its super easy to replace the cam follower, so doing that every 50k miles as a precation is smart

its also common on the e90 (and other bmw models i hear) for water to leak into the cabin under the dash onto the carpet.. that was weird the first time that happened haha

GERMAN ENGINEERING

The car i regret getting rid of. 85 euro spec 190e 2.3 16v... These cars came to the US for 86-87 only.. don't know how the 85 i had became stateside, but it was a true euro spec (minor differences that 190e fans could tell, center console, rear seats, lack of third brake light etc).
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.n...c1017d84a6ceb0
https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.n...d07cf1cf52b277

btw, the best era of DTM =)

I had a grey market 85 323i that someone ordered as a fully stripped model (manual rack, no passenger mirror, crank windows/sunroof) except that brilliant guy got the european Recaro LS factory seats (not the sports seats available in the US).

It was pretty dope but pretty useless lol

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...o/4cbd78a7.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...o/7881fadb.jpg

E30 M3s, 190e 2.5 16v EVO IIs and R32 GTRs duking it out on Macau =)

Hey guys, need your help. So, my brother has gotten his hands on an E34 M5 and has no idea what to do with it. Keeps telling me cockamamie ideas like gutting it or turboing it when he has very little mechanical knowledge about the car. How good are these cars? What would you recommend for an E34 M5 project?

Your kidding me right? First things first that motor is very expensive to maintian/own. Its probably one of the sickest inline 6's ever. s38's can be stroked to 3.8, us versions are 3.6 liters and the motors already come equipped with itbs.

If he plans to boost it he can make a shitload of power with really good driveability, but then he will have to upgrade, trans, diff, axles etc. I suggest he restores it and tastefully mods it. Please dont ruin another e34 m5.

Rennsport: The German Car thread
 

Sell it to me, buy a E36 328 and destroy that.

In 5-10 years you can expect the E34 M5s and E36 M3s to command stupid money not unlike the E30 M3.

These cars will never be cheaper then they are today.

Yeah, he's clueless and he's got some mechanic pawing at it. He's already done some servicing to the head that I don't know specifics about. They're dying to mod it but they have no vision. I'm trying to help him avoid ending up in some BMW "Doing It Wrong" thread. I suggested he just put it on bags and wheels and leave it alone.

Contradicting yourself there, man.

I like the E30gangsta's idea of mild suspension work and keep it tasteful.

^^^Are you implying that airbag suspension is "Doing It Wrong"? Why would you feel that is worse than mild suspension work? It gives you the flexibilty to be mild or extreme when you want...

I'm sure he is imply Bilstine/Koni shocks, H&R springs and all refreshed soft parts = mild suspension.

These cars handled great when new. Aggressive and firm for Hooligan driving but compliant enough to daily in comfort.

Same for performance. Accentuate the cars positive features. The luxury sport interior, the wail of the high-revving straight six and that rush of power and noise from the N/A ITB engine.

If he just wants a junkyard spec stripped Bimmers "race car" sell it, make a profit, and start with a sickly 525is. Gut and LS swap that shit.

[IMG]http://api.ning.com/files/sP2DtAjwhSOsjM8HNz6L9AG8zyDXkLTBCxvp3qt3*GI8vpnvIo CHLqsdfr192nwlbh0RY2r1ugkKuuXs2s9TzukpKNIaxkJs/DSC021691.JPG[/IMG]

Gotcha. I think we're gonna stick with the versatility provided by airbags with some legit wheels for this one. But yeah, I just recommended he improve upon the inherent N/A characteristics: Headers, open up that exhaust, possibly delete the cat & maybe change the final drive ratio while swapping to a grabbier clutch/lighter flywheel. Do you guys think there is any value in switching to the available 6spd trans for the E34 M5?

Definitely a cool thread and already subscribed.

I always have a soft spot for MB W124, especially in the station wagon body (they also came in sedan and coupe configurations). Since my high school day, seeing my friend's dad driving one really hooked me. They're now very cheap and can be obtained for as low as $2.5K for a clean, unmolested, well-maintained one, or at least that's from the local CL's down here.

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...3ef8a51041.jpg
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...0fb45c08f1.jpg
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...7474c32cdd.jpg
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...350a72c356.jpg
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...5e2e4a4589.jpg
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...e275b43f89.jpg


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Took the words right outta my mouth. ;) That to me is the cool thing about these cars...they're already stellar performers, and it's possible to add your personal touches and preferences without going overboard...or more importantly, dropping an insane amount of money on a car that didn't cost a whole lot to begin with.

Nope, an I don't care. :bowrofl:

Here is the skinny on the Rockstar.

The 986 had 3 engines. 2.5l (207hp) from 1997-1999, a 2.7l (217hp) 2000-2004 and the 3.2l (254hp) found in the Boxster S from 2000-2004.

You really can't tell the difference in the 2.5L and 2.7L. The S also has upgraded brakes, a 6spd manual which is much stronger and nicer, and a third radiator.

The engines have the IMS failure issue which I covered before. Essentially a $1,000 prevention that stops your engine from randomly grenade. Engine replacements are very expensive. They use Alusil construction and cylinders. Some engines have had cylinders crack.

I know guys with 987's, the newer generation, have had some success making big turbo numbers. It's a PITA however. Just think, where the hell you gonna put that IC?

http://www.tpcracing.com/_uploaded_f...ts8image_2.jpg

http://www.ferdinandmagazine.com/wp-...-Boxster-1.jpg

Now if you want a power-boxster, I recommend engine swapping. Plenty of neglected 986's out there, some in need of new engines. The value of these cars is solely based on the condition of the engines.

Precision Chassis Works has done a few EJ25 swaps.
http://www.precisionchassisworks.com...onversion.html

He is expensive, I think he said he can swap a car for a customer for ~$20k. I personally hate the EJ25.

http://www.precisionchassisworks.com...76542_orig.jpg

http://986forum.com/forums/general-d...-interest.html

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x...z/GEDC0772.jpg[/URL]

Now the much better plan is his latest efforts...

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x...ps7a381842.jpg

Thats right, 4.2 baby!

Boxster's two transmission are the Audi/VW 012 FWD 5spd Transaxle and the 01E 6spd Tranaxle. These units share the same bell housing pattern as all the Longitudinal VW/Audi engines. The 2.7TT, 1.8T, 2.8 V6, 4.2 V8 etc.

Another example:
http://www.planet-9.com/attachments/...r-img_2485.jpg


The 4.2 came in several forms. Most common will be the vanilla A6 and A8 engines. They all make around 300hp. Newer engines and specialty engines (RS6/RS8) make more power but cost considerably more. A 32v 295hp 4.2 is ~$500.

So you'll save some coin by skipping the adapter plate / clutch+flywheel issues. You'll get a cheap powerful engine and my god the noises it makes...




So my plan at this time is sell my running 2.5l for $2,500 - $3,000. Buy a 4.2l for $500, clean it up for another $500, megasquirt, long tubes... oh yeah... poor mans R8

^^^Learning new stuff everyday...Ahhh, I see...

Corbic, you bought a Boxster? I thought you picked up a 964?

I've never even had the desire to own a Boxster or Cayman...

Until Corbic's last post.

Really, nothing for the Cayman? I love the Cayman especially in S form. Cayman S Tiptronic was actually the first Porsche I had ever driven and even with the automatic trans I thought the car was damn near perfect.

Don't get me wrong, I love the style of the car. But, I'm guilty of being one of those people that feels if you're gonna buy a Porsche, you buy a 911. A bit close-minded, I know. But the heritage is just hard to ignore.

I drove a Cayman S last year, 2008 vintage iirc, and I *loved* it.

I <3 Porsches but I'll probably never buy one, at least not any time soon. I also did a porsche factory tour in Stuttgart this summer and it was incredible. I'm sold, if only my bank account would cooperate.

does someone offer a mount kit for the 4.2L v8 for the boxster?

I own a 1998 986 Boxster 2.5L and a 1985 911 Carrera 3.2L

[IMG]http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psjtkojigy.jpg[/IMG]

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...ps59qvj0my.jpg

I still have my 240sx and '05 Tacoma.

This guy has "kinda" done it.

http://www.renntech.org/forums/topic...-boxster-swap/

Wiring is the tricky part as the Porsche DME is very intrusive. It also has a god damn immobilizer wired in. I'm thinking I will need to keep the DME and MS3. :-/



I think his downfall was that he tried using the Triptronic trans (Garbage) and was not that great at wiring/fabbing. (notice the two shifters because he couldn't get it to work).

I contacted Precision Chassis Works and they have no plans of offering a kit.

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x...psc21d19d6.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x...ps2153904c.jpg

You can see how he fabled up a subframe. Doesn't look to complicated. My friends is doing some excellent work with the tig these days and he'd be the one fabricating this.

If we move forward I would document it and I'm sure he'd be interested in selling something if it's easy to replicate. The problem with projects like this is that people aren't always willing to pay for your time. (If he needs $200 in material and 15 hours to fab, would someone really pay $2k for it?)

Hey, Boxster is 80% 911! The 986 is all 911 from the Dash forward. Many of the parts in the rear are also 996 (stamped part numbers). Really, all Porsche did was flip the engine and trans, take away the back seat and give you a trunk.

With the release of the very large 991 and the AMAZING 981 twins, the Cayman is now being hailed as the new "911" and a "True drivers cars". I'm telling you. I HATED the Boxster when it came out. I was barely excepting the 993 back then and all of a sudden this fried egg water-cooled hair-dressing poor mans Porsche came out... it was the new 914 too me.

Then I drove one last year and was :facepalm: They are stupid fun to pound on. The interior, while "odd" at first is top notch quality and the noise..... on the noise. Then you get all the girls at the fast-food drive-thrus going "oh em gee, I love your car" and suddenly... its no longer that ugly.

http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/f...n-the-911.html

With the demographic changes, air-cooled cars becoming unobtainable, and the world now accepting water-cooled Porsches - Boxsters have managed to shed their negative image.

Out with the Fugly!

These are some eBay headlights, $1,000. Owner has a lot of work into the car, including the vintage styled carbon-fiber hood, wheels, bumpers etc.

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1363573767.jpg

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1363573840.jpg

Clear Headlights, 997 GT3 styled bumper and side skirts.

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTA2NlgxNj...y!w~~60_57.JPG

Another,
http://i.imgur.com/um0dwrK.jpg

996 GT3 bumper, sides and seats even.
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1360264597.jpg

996.2 Headlights and Turbo Bumper
http://galleryplus.ebayimg.com/ws/we.../1000x1000.jpg

another,
http://www.daggie.be/gfx/cars/projec.../gr8/front.jpg

Aftermarket GTR bumper
http://www.gruppetwo.com/wp-content/...012/11/170.jpg

Wide Body
http://scrapedcrusaders.files.wordpr...01465257_o.jpg

OMG... 997 GT3 Front and what looks like wider rears on a 986...
http://farm8.static.flickr.com/7267/...0138172c8e.jpg

http://www.vividracing.com/catalog/i...t3frontend.jpg

$2,800+ lights + paint
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NzgzWDgwMA...cuQ~~60_57.JPG

Yeah, the last 2 years have been unreal for air cooled cars in terms of pricing.

As for the Boxster/Cayman, I've heard from quite a few well-informed sources that those cars were specifically handicapped by Porsche to prevent them from out-doing the 911. As I'm sure you're aware, the biggest issue that the 911 has always faced in development is also it's most renown trademark...the rear mounted engine. And from what I've gathered, a lot of aftermarket companies are having GREAT success with the Boxster/Cayman after re-doing the suspension.

Headlights are stupid expensive. The updated halogen clears go for ~$600 used. HID's are nearly $2k.

Luckily there is a poverty spec solution for those with the fried-egg lights.
http://986forum.com/forums/general-d...e-ambered.html

Using a routing tool set to 1mm you can grind away the orange amber. You'll then need to sand, cut and polish the plastic.

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1409860201.jpg

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1409860441.jpg

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1409860460.jpg

You then just replace the corner reflectors with clear ones, carbon fiber, smoked etc.

This is true. The suspension is fine on the Box/Man, but its the engines that handicap them.

With the 986/996 Generation you had the 2.7 200hp Boxster and the 3.2 250hp Boxster S. The Base 911 received the larger, more powerful 300hp 3.4l engine and later a 3.6 with 320hp.

Even today, a base Cayman is 275hp while a 911 is 350hp, the Cayman S is 325hp to the 911S's 400hp. The Cayman GTS is 340 to the 911 GTS's 430hp.

Porsche makes sure that they don't step on each others toes.

That is actually not an outrageous price for headlights, if anything it is cheap for a Porsche.

If you want the Boxter just for the nameplate sake of owning a (poor woman's) Porsche, that is understandable.

However, you can buy a mid-engined car that looks the same, is 1000lbs lighter, costs less to purchase and maintain, has near-perfect handling from the factory, and is easier and cheaper to mod/swap:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Toyota_MR2.jpg


My favourite. <3
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._vr_silver.jpg

...yeah, no. Go start a "shit-box" thread if you want to talk about the MRS. :picardfp:

I have driven them. There is no comparison. It's like saying "why buy a S4 when you can get a WRX".

The MRS is also 10x more ugly. It's like some god awful Chinese knock-off.

I see your SL and raise you a 560.

http://germancarsforsaleblog.com/wp-...60SEC-Wald.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6225/6...ceab04f0_z.jpg

4.2 Swapped A4 B5.

http://breakoutmotorsports.com/files...36226273_n.jpg

B5's will go down as one of the best Audi shiluttes of all time I believe. Truly a car ahead of its time. Hard to believe they are 20 years old.

https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2893/...4001ec66_s.jpgB5 by _dpod_, on Flickr

http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/i...cupra_lip1.jpg

https://flic.kr/p/cyoYSq

https://flic.kr/p/cPNgrq

https://flic.kr/p/oqfqne

https://flic.kr/p/fQzD7D

https://flic.kr/p/8xwJ8z

https://flic.kr/p/ikoF4y

Boxster is growing on me. So slow though.

The Audi V8 swap sold me on the idea of getting one.

Snipped all the pictures because I never want to see any of them again.

If you showed up at my shop in any of those cars with a briefcase full of cash and asked me to build you a car, I would direct you elsewhere- with the sole exception of the GT3 kit.

Make it handle, make it fast, just don't do any of that crap- it'll make you look like a douche.

Audis (with the exception of the R8 and the S8) are cars that I like the looks of but have zero interest in owning. I drive my cars- I have no interest in driving an Audi.

My ultimate German car build list:
-Semaphore Beetle, stock. For the occasional cruise and just to enjoy the well-engineered simplicity.
-'54 356 coupe outlaw with 1883 and sand-cast 40PIIs. Slightly lowered over stock 16" wheels, turbo rings, in a period color. Great lines.
-LWB, long-hood 911 T Targa with a coupe roof, 964 bonded glass, SC suspension with low-friction components, FCM dampers, a 2.8L short-stroke high-butterfly (you could talk me into slide valves...). Glacier white. Aluminum decklid and license panel. 'Glass and balsa hood. Carbon doors. Fixed quarters. '68 window frames so I get aluminum construction with wing windows. Removable trunk cross-brace. Door "wedges" to stiffen structure. Haven't decided on wheels yet but probably replica Campagnolos.
-951, late, 17x9 BBS LMs. Aggressive fitment.
-964 C2 with all the RS seam-welding, FCM suspension, bronze TE37s, low but usable. Lightweight non-Porsche calipers, floating rotors, 993RS front uprights, various and sundry 993 and RS parts. Roll bar, pair o' GT3 seats. Black over dark green.
-993 GT2 RS, bone stock but fully refreshed. Black on black.
-968 Cup
-Ruf CTR. Yellow over black. Stock.

I want a 964 Turbo bad, but I can't afford that type of project car at the current moment. :(

So you have a problem with a Turbo Bumper or 996.2 headlights on a Boxster....

But your totally cool with this abomination.



You want a long good targa, so you can convert it to a 964 coupe?

You want a 911T with a 2.2, but then want replace it with a de-stroked 911SC 3.0 engine?

Your worried about "side valves" but make no mention of dual plugs... And 911SC "suspension", say what?

I used to be a service advisor for MB. This was my last Mercedes. 2006 S600.

493hp, 590 tq of Twin turbo V12 goodness.

The grey shit box behind it was a 400E I had for a while.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.n...80160021_o.jpg

S600 is an awesome car when it's properly taken care of with a large bank account. I'm a Mercedes tech and I often see the v12s barely limping in and many times they leave on a tow truck because they can't afford to maintain or repair them. More often a bad coil but at $1200

On a side note. The non turbo v12 sounds amazing with equal length headers
http://carbuying.jalopnik.com/how-to...nda-1611782156

The Pagani Zonda V12 is based on it, no?

Rennsport: The German Car thread
 

Based yes. Changes to it of course

Btw this is the video I was referring to
http://youtu.be/oN8pHJ3sQ0Q

There is one with hail damage and a salvage title for $7k, locally... Fuuuuuuck :naughty:

Someone needs to put this shit in a 240.

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...pso7r28uf9.png

That's a hell of a deal

Search eBay. Thats the going rate.

http://m.quickmeme.com/img/e8/e85f8d...c6a8c85cf8.jpg

Yeah I did. And was surprised. Other techs in the shop are in disbelief as well.

More Boxstars for that KA240 guy...

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1eiflb0e.jpg

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psevaflg13.jpg

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...pstabeha0t.jpg

Modern 911 Fun

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psu6rgjzep.jpg

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...pspr3tjxgp.jpg

Vintage Awesomeness

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psdsyhnhhi.jpg


http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...ps5aksdwu5.jpg

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psid19zgcs.jpg

Titanium

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...psfsimchzq.jpg

On the seventh day he rested, so that on the eighth day he could make the 935....

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/...ps4kiodl0v.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-u6yTH3-AKF...0/IMG_2924.JPG

http://dedeporsche.files.wordpress.c...che-935-41.jpg

http://dedeporsche.files.wordpress.c...935-_apr80.jpg

http://dedeporsche.files.wordpress.c...sche-935-4.jpg

The manifolds are glowing!!!!



Because one turbo is never enough...

http://www.stanleyku.com/thekucars/w...yno-flames.jpg

I get it, you own Porsches. I've lived them for 9 years.

I want a long-hood targa because the targa is a stiffer base. Add coupe roof and you end up with a stiffer car than a standard coupe- plus targas are less expensive to begin with. Abomination? Hardly.

Bonding in the glass results in a car that's 15% stiffer, and that's on the 964 chassis- there are likely better gains to be had from bonding the windows into a tired long-hood.

You spend much time behind the wheel of a 2.2 T? 2.0 T? I have. Even the cases need money spent to be any good. I would start with a '69-71 car because I actually like the MFI and CIS 2.4 T's for what they are.

Destroked 911SC? That's not how you build a proper 2.8. You build a proper 2.8 by using a 930/02 (or /52, /53, /54) case with a 2.2S crank. Mahle pistons and cylinders, proper RSR space cam in the MFI pump, etc. You can do it a number of ways, but that way results in a reliable zinger of an engine. I left out twin-plug because it's just something that's a given in a performance air-cooled build.

The other option would be a 2.5 short-stroke on Webers, built from a virgin 7R.

I'm not worried about slide valves, I just like the thought and, from what I've driven, they're not nearly as racy as people make them sound. I drove a customer's 2.8L slide-valve and it was torquey and tractable.

I also oversimplified the suspension- SC crossmember, SC-style struts with 3.5" spacing (probably optional as I'd likely run adapters and Wilwoods), SC control arms machined to keep rear strut angle at early car spec, Carrera spring plates, etc. The big thing with the cars is trying to get the suspension to work with as little friction as possible.

'72 oil tank position would be a must, while I'm at it.

It's funny, all of that for a car with an engine in the wrong damn place.

Since you are dreaming of a compete kit bash, it just seems more logical to start with a tired and discarded 2.7 or SC car.

While on that subject, I really wish someone would offer 911 bodies like Dynacorn does with some of the Muscle Cars.

Air-cooled cars are quickly vanishing from HPDE/DE Days because they are just to expensive to destroy.

Last PCA event I went too at VIR had 100+ cars and only 3 air coolers.

It is more logical to start with a tired or discarded '74-'83 car, as they're not anywhere near as desirable. However, my car choices tend to err on the side of illogical- plus, I like annoying purists and chopping up a long-hood targa.

There was a company in Germany offering complete 911 bodies for sale. $80k or so, if I remember correctly. That might have been euros. When I find the link I'll post it.

We frequently sell cars for our clients because the clients are simply too scared that the car will get damaged and will be devalued.

Since there are a few Benz service guy's here, How are doing the repairs on the V12 cars for your typical DIY car guy/wrench? I can't imagine beyond a few "speciality" tools it's that hard to repair anything.

Mainly basic wrenching, hard part would be getting your hands on an SDS. It's our scan tool. I'm sure like other systems out there you can get an aftermarket solution although it will most likely leave parts out. Most aftermarket scanners(snap on, Marco etc )I've seen arent able to get the licensing for many of the modules and details

We use a snap on verus pro and have good but limited data from the major European manufactures. The closest thing you can get to a factory scan tool is the autologic I believe. Can do everything a factory tool can including programming I believe. Your talking tens of thousands for the tool and yearly licensing for each manufacture.

Edit: I'm out here in the hamptons and everybody has a 70s merc or 911. My favorite I've been privileged to drive was a 06 Turbo s with a 6 speed and minor mods so much fun.

Old Porsches are one of the few cars where a clean specimen can be equally as appreciated as one covered in outrageous bodywork, without automatically being written off as an embarrassing boy racer creation. It probably helps that they usually look really cool.

http://matejblahut.com/irony/media/a...e/unloadme.jpg

The big issue with working the v-12's, and pretty much any modern Benz is the sheer cost of the parts. There are not that many cars made, so an aftermarket option may not be there, and if it is the $1200 v12 coil pack from Mercedes might still be $800 from an aftermarket source. Also look up Mercedes ABC suspension systems.

It has been my dream for a few years now to put a v12 from 01-02 Mercedes in my 240. The dream started when I watched the video posted earlier.

The bitch of it would be the engine management, although I think there are aftermarket companies that make v12 ecu's.