SR20DET Power Upgrade Alternatives

[Ian]

After about a year and a half of driving on a T25 SR, i've decided 250hp is just not cutting it for me anymore.

From what i've researched, there are a few turbo kits out there, as well as a few Garret bolt on turbos.

-Apex'i
-Tomei Arms
-Power Enterprises
-Greddy T67/T78 (not really what i'm looking for)
-Blitz makes a couple w/ a KKK turbo
-Garret GT series turbines, 2871R is the one that would fit my needs


i want about 300-320 whp w/ a good spool because i like drifting, i just want more power so i can do the bigger tracks well.

what other options are there?

[justinhustle]

hks gt2540

[kuramaya]

S15 Turbo, thats my plan..the T25 is suckin...I feel your pain..

[pignosecoupe]

Why go through all that hastle? Just get one of These. (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Nissan-240SX-or-Altima-Supercharger-turbo-Up-to-40HP_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33741QQitemZ799001 9230QQrdZ1) I am sure it will do the trick. :keke:

[kuramaya]

Why go through all that hastle? Just get one of These. (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Nissan-240SX-or-Altima-Supercharger-turbo-Up-to-40HP_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33741QQitemZ799001 9230QQrdZ1) I am sure it will do the trick. :keke:
thats usdm tyte yo

[theicecreamdan]

thats only good for up to 40hp, he wants more than 300

[SochBAT]

hahhaha, thats horrid.

BUILD THE INTERNALS!!! cuz then that automatically makes you a JDM tuner.

[statik]

T28 or GT28RS =]

[mjjstang]

get the gt2871r, i hear its all the hype right now. although dont think its a direct bolt on, I got it 4 months ago and am still working on adapting it. well I am very slow. but there are things u will need. is there any market for a write up on that or no?

[S14DB]

N20Lets see how many JDM ricers get pissed off that I said gas not a bigger turbo.

[statik]

get the gt2871r, i hear its all the hype right now. although dont think its a direct bolt on, I got it 4 months ago and am still working on adapting it. well I am very slow. but there are things u will need. is there any market for a write up on that or no?

thats a bit overkill for 300-320whp, not worth the longer spool up if you don't need it

[chlatboy]

Either upgrade turbo or start tearing apart the engine. I would go for the first option since its alot easier.

[Ian]

What about non GT series turbos? i can get a manifold w/ a new flange welded up easily. I dont know a whole lot outside of GT turbos but what about T3/T4 turbos? From what i understand, alot of KA-T guys use these and like them alot

[turbozxi]

Have you been living under a rock? haha j/k

There heaps of info on the various turbo upgrades on these forums and FA a T3/T4 50 trim .63 ex housing will flow more then what you want and still provide good spool up. They are relatively cheap turbos to around $500. A brief search should turn up plenty of info.

[DoriftoSlut]

What about non GT series turbos? i can get a manifold w/ a new flange welded up easily. I dont know a whole lot outside of GT turbos but what about T3/T4 turbos? From what i understand, alot of KA-T guys use these and like them alot
I have a t3/t04e .50 trim on my SR. It rules for drifting. But i want 330hp+ and the turbo is capable of 400 rwhp. Spool isn't a stock T2 size turbo but hey, that's physics.

On the plus side, peak power is at redline and it has over 3000 rpm of workable powerband. If you drop too low, shift down or you are going to slow anyways.

I like the turbo cause mine is BB, its stout, way thicker/bigger than Garrett GT2871Rs and can withstand more abuse. Plus its rebuildable. Its not "hella JDM TYTE" but i don't care, those ar just rebaged and marked-up turbos anyways.

After blowign shit up, if you can afford it, i would reccomend building your motor. Having no worries is best. You think pushing a lot of power out of a worn, tired, 11 year-old used motor is smart? Be my guest.

[Ian]

eh, well my motor has less then 50k miles on it but i'm still wary of pushing too much power out of it. I love the idea of a 350hp turbo for 500 bucks, where can i get something like this? My idea of a great turbo is at 3krpm to make the same power as i do right now, but at 7krpm make 320whp or so.

[TheSnail]

Im bicharging mine. sc14+gt35r, boost starts a 1rpm :). I will let you know how it works, out for me. Until then, I would recomend maybe a small gt25r or a s15 turbo.

[RSP13-Sideways]

If you want 300-320HP you should probably go with the HKS GT2530. This turbo is equivalent to the "DiscoPotato" and utilizes your same T25 flange.

Right now I have a HKS GT2540 comin' from Japan (gotta love the Japanese girlfriends) and I'm looking for around 350HP with this unit.

The great news is that it will bolt on to your flange with no issues, ball bearing greatness.....YAY! :cool:

[turbozxi]

S15 turbo sounds perfect for you, personally think you will want more power in the end though.

[sideview_180sx]

that disco potato at 15psi was at 274hp on the SCC car with exhaust,race-cat,greddy dp, and jwt ecu. BTW are you want 300whp or flywheel hp. big difference in power gains. ka-t guys i know enjoy t3 super60. remember custom flange and dp is needed along with flange adapter for exhaust mani.

[MakotoS13]

N20Lets see how many JDM ricers get pissed off that I said gas not a bigger turbo.

this is kinda like spelling out cuss words in front of three year olds.

[statik]

that disco potato at 15psi was at 274hp on the SCC car with exhaust,race-cat,greddy dp, and jwt ecu. BTW are you want 300whp or flywheel hp. big difference in power gains. ka-t guys i know enjoy t3 super60. remember custom flange and dp is needed along with flange adapter for exhaust mani.

SCC == full of shit, Im running 18psi on the disco potato and it is well over 300hp. Enough to beat my friends Z with sport 500's(they put down about 450whp with those turbos). Granted the turbo is a bit overrated, but you can easily hit 300-330whp

[mjjstang]

thats a bit overkill for 300-320whp, not worth the longer spool up if you don't need it


eh, I forgot that maxing out the turbo is the name of the game. anyway .64 spools very nice.

[statik]

eh, I forgot that maxing out the turbo is the name of the game. anyway .64 spools very nice.

actually the name of the game is sizing the turbo for your application, he wants 300-320whp with quick spool for drifting, the gt28rs can flow 350whp and spools quite nicely

[Ian]

well put it this way, i want 320whp w/o paying 1100 for the turbo

i hear a T3/T4 w/ a .50 trim will run me <600 dollars

[khoadogg]

I have a t3/t4 .50 trim that i picked up for a custom setup but sold my car. hit me up for a great deal

[wootwoot]

Dude, thats how much the TURBO will cost you. You will then need a new manifold, down pipe, hot pipe, and a wastegate. Add all of it up and you are above the price of most gt series turbos and now have a manifold that flows worse than stock (this is dependent on which manifold you get, you want a cheaper set up so chances are you would get a log manifold which are POOP. Tubular equal length are bond!) A gt28rs honestly seems like the best turbo looking at the compressor maps. gt2871r .64 would be out of its efficency range at 300bhp and would be just starting to touch it at 300whp. a gt28rs would be providing faster spool, less top end, and would be reaching the limits of its efficency at the levels you want to push it but would still be in there.

[statik]

u gotta pay to play (mine was 989 shipped) =], or go cheap and pick up a used s15 turbo, honestly if u cant spend more than 600, thats your best bet and it will be close to what you want

[Ian]

Dude, thats how much the TURBO will cost you. You will then need a new manifold, down pipe, hot pipe, and a wastegate. Add all of it up and you are above the price of most gt series turbos and now have a manifold that flows worse than stock (this is dependent on which manifold you get, you want a cheaper set up so chances are you would get a log manifold which are POOP. Tubular equal length are bond!) A gt28rs honestly seems like the best turbo looking at the compressor maps. gt2871r .64 would be out of its efficency range at 300bhp and would be just starting to touch it at 300whp. a gt28rs would be providing faster spool, less top end, and would be reaching the limits of its efficency at the levels you want to push it but would still be in there.


Uhh, what the hell are you talking about? Do i look retarded to you? I probably make 300BHP already. I never once in my posts said that I want 300BHP. Who estimates their power anywhere else but at the wheels? I know how much turbos cost, and that's why I said, GT turbo=1100 or so, T3/T4=600 or so. Big difference, and after talking to my friend w/ a KA-T i'm pretty much decided on a T3/T4 w/ a .50 trim. Yes I know I need a new manifold, and no log manifold will flow WORSE then stock unless you forgot to cut a hole for the turbo. Most well made log manis will flow BETTER then stock because the stock manifold is RETARDED. The flange isnt even centered...so #1 has to push 3x as far as #4.

and to the guy selling the turbo, i'll PM you to see what we can do, I dont have alot of money now, but if you're willing to wait i'll more then likely be down to buy the turbo.

[Rezlo]

Im bicharging mine. sc14+gt35r, boost starts a 1rpm :). I will let you know how it works, out for me. Until then, I would recomend maybe a small gt25r or a s15 turbo.

The SC14 is a nice idea for that, trust me been there done that, use an eaton M60 or M90 with a T66, the M90 and T66 combo works real well if you do it right, problem with the SC14 is that they blow the seals out when the turbo starts to give a 5+psi blower inlet presure.

[Ian]

go crazy and hook it up w/ the thumper if you're gonna have FI to spool your FI lol.

Turbonetics Thumper series=T105=the size of my big korean head

[wootwoot]

You need to read my post again and slap yourself. No where did I say anything about you wanting 300bhp, I was using that as a reference for the turbo since you will barely be pushing it past that. Thats also how compressor maps read. Go look at a stock manifold compared to a log, stock IS better. It isnt all about even pulses, flow matters too and when every port throws its exhaust straight into a 90 then it has to turn another sharp 90 that is not flow. Maybe the flange isnt centered to help with the pulses, trying to get them to meet up at the same time. Now shut up. You are retarted, you had to start a post about what turbo you need when you researched it and made up your own mind anyway. Is this just showing off that you will soon have a better car? This thread never needed to be made. You could have looked at the many threads that allready existed, or just went to some vendors sites and looked what they had to offer. Fuck man, you could have called these vendors and asked for their advice, a professionals. Not a bunch of dudes who sit online all day out of boredom. So shut it you retard

[statik]

You need to read my post again and slap yourself. No where did I say anything about you wanting 300bhp, I was using that as a reference for the turbo since you will barely be pushing it past that. Thats also how compressor maps read. Go look at a stock manifold compared to a log, stock IS better. It isnt all about even pulses, flow matters too and when every port throws its exhaust straight into a 90 then it has to turn another sharp 90 that is not flow. Maybe the flange isnt centered to help with the pulses, trying to get them to meet up at the same time. Now shut up. You are retarted, you had to start a post about what turbo you need when you researched it and made up your own mind anyway. Is this just showing off that you will soon have a better car? This thread never needed to be made. You could have looked at the many threads that allready existed, or just went to some vendors sites and looked what they had to offer. Fuck man, you could have called these vendors and asked for their advice, a professionals. Not a bunch of dudes who sit online all day out of boredom. So shut it you retard

ahh you can really tell today is monday =D

[wootwoot]

my shower is broken too >=O

My first post was not talking down to him at all, then he insulted me. That makes me not happy.

[Ian]

your post was more or less irrelevant to what we're talking about in this thread. also, i did research. There are no turbo kits that are in my price range, that use a low-price turbo. I dont want a kit, because that usually costs more money. That's why i asked around to see what other options there are. I happen to have a friend w/ a KA-T running a T3/T4. Sue me for striking up conversation with him and discovering that his big ass turbo happens to be half the price of the smaller GT2871R and make more power. This happened after i made the thread. So now my thread is evolving into T3/T4 options. Which one i should use, what to do for manifold, what injectors i need, fuel management etc.

Carry on.

[bummertime]

:cool: Dude you need my rb26dett that will help with yor need for speed-Runnin 10.237 @ 147.58 mph down here in PUERTO RICO!!! NIGGA!!! :hyper: :eek2: :whip:

[Chin180sx]

Ok I need to straighten some of the theory's that are floating around here....

1st. Stock manifold was designed to flow like equal length manifold. If you have ever seen one off the car you know that 1 and 4 are connect and 2 and 3 are and there is a devider between them. This helps flow more exaust smooth than them than a log manifold.

2nd. A gt2871r .64a/r will flow 360rwhp (read:414flywheel) all day with the correct additions to the turbo (intakemanifold, cams) I have seen as high as 380rwhp on the turbo. the 86 is good for over 400rwhp on stock manifold! and this is only at 18psi. The turbo itself is good for over 20.

Honestly no matter what turbo you choose your are not going to hit over 320rwhp on stock intake manifold and cams. It seems to be the point at which both are of no use. Without upgrading either you will hit the point of dimmishing returns where your dollar to hp ratio will fall drasticly

Yes GT turbos are expensive, but the ablity to out perform most older turbos on a t2 flange shows that newer technology is better. Hell back in the day all you could get was a fullrace manifold on a SC50 or SC61 to make 400. now there are plenty of people doing it on stock manifold making bolting everything up much easier and much more sleeper.

I have a GT3071r on 17psi it did 360rwhp, and this is just at the begining of where the turbo becomes efficent. I have till about 24psi (where the efficency falls off) On a stock manifold with external wastegate. Some race gas will yeild me well over 400rwhp on a .64a/r turbine housing. Translation 400hp with virtually no lag.

Do a t3/t4 but I did the math when I was deiciding a turbo and it wasnt worth getting such old technology and spending so much on it when it was more cost efficent to do a newer series turbo on a SR.

But hey what the hell do I know....

[Ian]

i understand what you're saying, but when i can get the turbo, manifold, injectors and wastegate for less then the price of a similar GT turbo, i can easily forget about that 400rpm of spool time that i'm giving up for similar power.

[S14DB]

i understand what you're saying, but when i can get the turbo, manifold, injectors and wastegate for less then the price of a similar GT turbo, i can easily forget about that 400rpm of spool time that i'm giving up for similar power.
:rolleyes: more like 1,000-1,500rpm and a non-linear spool.

[turbozxi]

www.boostfed.com sells the t3/t04e .50 trim for $610 shipped if you were still after a place to buy from.

[wootwoot]

turbo= 610(shipped)
manifold=250 for a crappy ass log manifold that flows like poo
downpipe=200-300 depending if you buy one with with the manifold as a kit or are forced to get it made
hot pipe=100-250 same as above.
external wastegate=50-250 bucks. you're pretty cheap so you might get one off ebay
injectors=300-550 for a set
assorted lines you will need=100-250

I forgot, that adds up to the price of a GT series turbo...Did you forget about some of that other stuff ?

[BobbyBoy]

I was considering the same thing a while back, either T3/T4 or Ball bearing. Needless to say I went with an S15 turbo and am quite happy with the results. I have been in a non BB equiped turbo car, and it just didn't feel the same. Sure, nice BB turbos cost a bit more, but a quicker spool time better suits this motor. Anyways by the time you add all the support mods needed to make more power the right way, ie (injectors, ecu, MAF, Tuning, FMIC, Headgasket, possibly cams and intake manifold) you might as well pony up another $500 or so on a turbo thats worth it.

People need to learn to stop half assing their shit. If your gonna pay money to upgrade, do it right. If your scrounging around money with barely enough to add more power to your car, you need to rethink your priorities, or be patient enough to earn enough to do it right. Blowing motors gets expensive, and so does replacing shitty quality parts.

[bob marley]

Ok I need to straighten some of the theory's that are floating around here....

1st. Stock manifold was designed to flow like equal length manifold. If you have ever seen one off the car you know that 1 and 4 are connect and 2 and 3 are and there is a devider between them. This helps flow more exaust smooth than them than a log manifold.

2nd. A gt2871r .64a/r will flow 360rwhp (read:414flywheel) all day with the correct additions to the turbo (intakemanifold, cams) I have seen as high as 380rwhp on the turbo. the 86 is good for over 400rwhp on stock manifold! and this is only at 18psi. The turbo itself is good for over 20.

Honestly no matter what turbo you choose your are not going to hit over 320rwhp on stock intake manifold and cams. It seems to be the point at which both are of no use. Without upgrading either you will hit the point of dimmishing returns where your dollar to hp ratio will fall drasticly

Yes GT turbos are expensive, but the ablity to out perform most older turbos on a t2 flange shows that newer technology is better. Hell back in the day all you could get was a fullrace manifold on a SC50 or SC61 to make 400. now there are plenty of people doing it on stock manifold making bolting everything up much easier and much more sleeper.

I have a GT3071r on 17psi it did 360rwhp, and this is just at the begining of where the turbo becomes efficent. I have till about 24psi (where the efficency falls off) On a stock manifold with external wastegate. Some race gas will yeild me well over 400rwhp on a .64a/r turbine housing. Translation 400hp with virtually no lag.

Do a t3/t4 but I did the math when I was deiciding a turbo and it wasnt worth getting such old technology and spending so much on it when it was more cost efficent to do a newer series turbo on a SR.

But hey what the hell do I know....

I was about to post this, but you saved me some time. The transient response of ball-bearing turbochargers is usually less than that of journal/thrust bearing turbos of equal size. From what I've seen, ball-bearing turbos really shine between gears when the turbo has to spool again. Therefore, it would probably be the best option (if only looking at performance). The price of a GT series turbo is very very close to getting a new T3/whatever, manifold, and fabricating/modifying your downpipe, hotpipe, etc. The only benefit I can see of going the t3 route based on what you are looking for is if you plan on breaking turbos. Ball-Bearing turbos can't be rebuilt, so at best, you're probably looking at a new cartridge which is almost as much as the turbo itself. Relatively speaking, t3's are cheap to rebuild and even buying a new one is cheaper than the ball-bearing cartridge. If you're going ball-bearing, I'd suggest gt2871r .64 a/r because it offers similar spool to the s15 turbo with much more top end available (I think almost 380 was the most I've seen). If you find a cheap s15 turbo in good condition, then, with some better cams and intake manifold, it should make around 300 whp. Cams and Intake manifold are definitely worthwhile upgrades. Also, tuning is very important whatever route you decide to go.

[DoriftoSlut]

You guys act like Turbonetics doesn't make a BB T3/T4.

Also, factor something else in... the Garrett GT series turbos aren't rebuildable. Garret does not sell any of the parts seperately... not even to whole-salers/dealrs/distributers. So if you overheat your turbo, run high boost for a long period of time, basically work your motor, you now have a $1200 paperweight. Throw it away.

Oh and a T2-sized center shaft and bearings are much smaller than a t3 sized one.

Sure "technology" (aka someone's idea) allows t2-sized housings to fit larger wheels on a smaller shaft and hail it at king of response and power... but at what cost? Everything has its downside and a Garrett GT-series turbine's downside is its durablity.

Just evaluate the ups/downs of each setup.

Oh yeah if you want response... T3 turbine housings come in .48 ar also.

[Ian]

and being rebuildable, saying that i buy a used T3/T4 w/ a non ball-bearing cartrige, i can rebuild it w/ a ball bearing center section right?

and modifying my downpipe may not be necessary as i can get a turbo outlet made cant i?

[DoriftoSlut]

and being rebuildable, saying that i buy a used T3/T4 w/ a non ball-bearing cartrige, i can rebuild it w/ a ball bearing center section right?

and modifying my downpipe may not be necessary as i can get a turbo outlet made cant i?
I am not sure about being rebuildable with ball bearings going into a non ball bearing cartridge. That would be cool if it were true!

And yes, ~$100 or so for a shop to make a turbo elbow to meet up with your current down pipe.

[Chin180sx]

forgot to add...not all turbos are built the same....XS power turbo's are different then true t3/t04e 50trim with a stage 3 housing and a 48a/r.....So even if you go non BB get a turbo from a reliable source and not just some rebuild....
Reliable sources include
Precision Turbo
Cheapturbo.com

[RSP13-Sideways]

I was considering the same thing a while back, either T3/T4 or Ball bearing. Needless to say I went with an S15 turbo and am quite happy with the results. I have been in a non BB equiped turbo car, and it just didn't feel the same. Sure, nice BB turbos cost a bit more, but a quicker spool time better suits this motor. Anyways by the time you add all the support mods needed to make more power the right way, ie (injectors, ecu, MAF, Tuning, FMIC, Headgasket, possibly cams and intake manifold) you might as well pony up another $500 or so on a turbo thats worth it.

People need to learn to stop half assing their shit. If your gonna pay money to upgrade, do it right. If your scrounging around money with barely enough to add more power to your car, you need to rethink your priorities, or be patient enough to earn enough to do it right. Blowing motors gets expensive, and so does replacing shitty quality parts.


Sooooo true. I was one of those "Half Assers" then I just ponied up, got all the support mods done while running my T25. Now I have a GT2540 on order and it should be the greatest thing since sliced bread.

For godsakes man, just get a HKS GT2530 or GT2540, you can get a used one for around $700-$1000 if you cannot afford a brand new one $1500. Used turbos are kinda iffy, but you never know.

[wootwoot]

Or you can not get an HKS and get a Garrett unit which is cheaper but practically identical =)

[BobbyBoy]

Or you can not get an HKS and get a Garrett unit which is cheaper but practically identical =)

Thats true for new turbos, but you are more apt to find used HKS turbos for an SR being sold on EBay or Yahoo Japan, than straight up Garrett Turbos.

[DoriftoSlut]

The destroyed Garrett GT T2-housing turbo is a damn expensive paperweight, and the HKS turbo is a GODDAMN expensive paperweight.. with a tyte logo.

THEY ARE THE SAME. And they are both NOT rebuildable. I recall 4 weeks ago a dude on Freshalloy asking what to do to rebuild his brand new Garrett 3071 or whatever it was. "Um.. clean it real good... put it on your desk."

[wootwoot]

Someone in the area kept pushing a rx7 really hard (like 450whp, pump gas) which is a bad idea for a rotary that you want to be reliable. The guy must have some serious money though, he blew 3 engines, each time sending the apex seals into the turbo causing their destruction......WTF

[Ian]

yeah since my money is not expendable, i'd rather not risk it all on a non rebuildable turbo

T3/T4 it is