500whp SR20 build?

[nomoremrriceguy]

:picardfp: yes another one of those stereotypical "500hp build" threads, but I'd just need some very brief advice. basically I want to buy a nice 240sx with an sr20 already swapped into it and build it, car would most likely be somewhere in the 10-11k range which leaves me roughly $6,000 to build the motor. Is this sufficient to build it? Part of me says absolutely, yet the other half of me says no. I'm pretty new to 240's and sr20's and would love some input, thanks guy

[hanzbrady]

Short answer no, you could afford part of the short block of an SR built to handle 500whp comfortably.

https://www.mazworx.com/store/p/408-Mazworx-Podium-Stage-2-Short-Block-SR20-RWD.aspx

You'd still need to build the head, buy a turbo set-up, intake, ECU components, etc.

[nomoremrriceguy]

Short answer no, you could afford part of the short block of an SR built to handle 500whp comfortably.

https://www.mazworx.com/store/p/408-Mazworx-Podium-Stage-2-Short-Block-SR20-RWD.aspx

You'd still need to build the head, buy a turbo set-up, intake, ECU components, etc. why would I need to buy a whole new short block? I could just buy the pistons, rods, bearings etc and build the sr20 block and have it bored, sleeved or any other work it required?

[hanzbrady]

why would I need to buy a whole new short block? I could just buy the pistons, rods, bearings etc and build the sr20 block and have it bored, sleeved or any other work it required?

Well, that would still only take $800 off of that price tag. Even just a sleeved prepped bare SR will run you >$2000

[KAT-PWR]

Paying other people's labor means you get about half what you pay for.

Just adding up some things in a cart from Enjuku for the head rebuild and most turbo components i hit 4k easily and that wasnt including everything you'd need. And not including labor

[jedi03]

I just built mine for about 2k...my own labor and skillset of course but still...new to the engine game not possible...experience in building...possible with good deals on parts

[R3b]

I spent about 1.6k for my machine work from a really good shop and did the assembly myself, would be another couple hundred for them to do the long block. So figure out all the parts you and another 1.5-2k for full assembly motor with line hone, boreing, block hot tank/deck, crank polished, bearings cleared for block/crank, head decked, new valve guides, cleaning, dis/reassembly, and correct cam clearance.

I did ka and did everything to my bottom end and left a stock head and was at around 3k just for the longblock. I do everything on my car so I save on labor which will cost double. Im sure youll be at 3-4k depending on parts to run and where you find deals and you well over need another 3-4k in standalone mods like tranny, good topmount mani, holset turbo at least, exhaust, intercooler set, bov and wastegate, fab work, maybe intake, top feed, then more if you plan to use e85 switching lines, bigger injectors, a proper tune on a standalone, brake upgrade, driveshaft, bigger wheels/tires to grip, then gauges like boost, temp, oil pressure, and wideband.

Thats bare min and you still should do other maintenance like clean/paint the bay, money to paint the engine/covers, new sensors, maybe harness, tuck whatever you can, upgrade cooling system, new suspension, a better seat to hold you in place, maybe a cage or harness.

Its easy getting the motor to handle power but all the supporting stuff adds up.

[hanzbrady]

I spent about 1.6k for my machine work from a really good shop and did the assembly myself, would be another couple hundred for them to do the long block. So figure out all the parts you and another 1.5-2k for full assembly motor with line hone, boreing, block hot tank/deck, crank polished, bearings cleared for block/crank, head decked, new valve guides, cleaning, dis/reassembly, and correct cam clearance.

The difference here is that you had a KA built, which is cast iron and thicker than an SR20. When sleeving an SR every measurement in the block gets distorted, so instead of a simple hone (cheap process), you now have to re-size everything (much more expensive and labor intensive). A sleeved SR also has to be CNC milled to accept sleeves which again is a high cost process. Once you sleeve a block it also requires a unique decking process know as step-decking since you cant run a linear surfacer over the cast sleeves and aluminum block (this another CNC process.) Now comes the question of why sleeve, well you don't have to, if you stay stock bore size and run no timing. The SR is thin and gets hot, it warps and starts destroying itself when you force it to make power, that's why cast iron sleeves are used. That's why building a 500hp SR costs much more than a cast iron block like the KA's or 4G63's.

[R3b]

Never actually knew that was a big issue with sr blocks, im sure if OP where to just do a copy/past a normal block build without sleeving he would get a nice reliable 400-500. I havent looked much into sr truthfully. Had a buddy get 400whp stock block, MS pnp would gt281r and motor was fine, didnt beat on it but had his fun. Parted it and motor was still good. All I know is if you want major power past 500whp might as well swap and invest that extra 4k in swap materials.

I think sleeving an sr would be overkill then, might as well just do typical 2jz which im sure would cost around the same and be at the same power. Anything happens to it, buy another stock block for 2k and keep same setup/platform vs building another sleeved sr which would be double im assuming.

Im doing 2jz after my ka, going to do a cd009 swap, find a dicked block locally. Build that up and swap it in with the cd009 from the ka. Just need motor mounts, driveshaft and harness. I'll already be big turbo from the ka and everything else can swap over besides injectors and manifold.

[hanzbrady]

Never actually knew that was a big issue with sr blocks, im sure if OP where to just do a copy/past a normal block build without sleeving he would get a nice reliable 400-500. I havent looked much into sr truthfully. Had a buddy get 400whp stock block, MS pnp would gt281r and motor was fine, didnt beat on it but had his fun. Parted it and motor was still good. All I know is if you want major power past 500whp might as well swap and invest that extra 4k in swap materials.

I think sleeving an sr would be overkill then, might as well just do typical 2jz which im sure would cost around the same and be at the same power. Anything happens to it, buy another stock block for 2k and keep same setup/platform vs building another sleeved sr which would be double im assuming.

Im doing 2jz after my ka, going to do a cd009 swap, find a dicked block locally. Build that up and swap it in with the cd009 from the ka. Just need motor mounts, driveshaft and harness. I'll already be big turbo from the ka and everything else can swap over besides injectors and manifold.

We don't recommend anything over 450whp on the stock sleeves, which is about where we stop recommending H-beam rods as well. While you may be able to hit 500whp on a stock bottom end because your budies sister had a cousin who did it doesn't mean it's reliable. I've seen plenty of un-sleeved SR's go make big numbers at a dyno and then blow weeks later.

Maybe I'm biased due to building primarily race engines but we'd always rather have a stout block that can always take the beating rather than have a block that can maybe take the beating, and let's face it S chassis guys abuse the absolute fuck out of everything.

And just a reference, here's my stock SR that was fully balanced and blueprinted making 400whp, but with stock internals. This engine never missed a beat, was regularly maintained, and had a good tune, but abuse and physically weak components lead to things breaking, in my case a rod bolt.

http://i1369.photobucket.com/albums/ag214/HanzB_/D6E5D424-71F0-4F36-BB8E-F745C8C1693A_zpslnibnpu1.jpg (http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/HanzB_/media/D6E5D424-71F0-4F36-BB8E-F745C8C1693A_zpslnibnpu1.jpg.html)

[R3b]

Thats nuts, glad im I stuck with ka, I feel like we are all biased to motors. I just assumed ka and sr were about the same with pros/cons but now looks like ka is clear winner for 500+ for power for pennies. OP could build exactly what I did and swap out head components and easy make 500+- for less with a clean body bad HG dual cam for under 5k vs a jankey swap from a drift taxed local for 6-8k then building that.

[nomoremrriceguy]

I should also mention, this will NOT be a drift car, it would be a daily that might see thr occasional track day. In other words this car will not be pushed to the absolute limit every time its driven

[KAT-PWR]

Thats nuts, glad im I stuck with ka, I feel like we are all biased to motors. I just assumed ka and sr were about the same with pros/cons but now looks like ka is clear winner for 500+ for power for pennies. OP could build exactly what I did and swap out head components and easy make 500+- for less with a clean body bad HG dual cam for under 5k vs a jankey swap from a drift taxed local for 6-8k then building that.

I have been learning though the ka block is more stout, numerous people have cracked the bore into the water jacket on some blocks. (Mostly upward of 6-700)

[R3b]

Yeah, ive seen that as well with the current trend of everyone switching to ka. I bought my car last year april and people laughed when I said it was ka-t and later was going to build it lol now look at everyone switching over from sr's. Swaps were stupid cheap and now are 4x the price. You bring up ka and they go "yeah they handle a good deal of power for a truck motor when built"

If I were you OP, I would look into ka if you want to build/boost 4 banger plus have money left over. Im sure you can find a stupid clean manual kouki if you look around for 4-5k semi stock or pick up a nice little rolling shell thats clean for 1k and buy a dual cam separate stupid cheap and go from there. Not sure on your mechanically inclined but building a car is really good experience if you got the time/money/tools.

If you have a budget of 15k which im assuming you have since you said pick up a car for 10-11k then 6k building the motor I would just suggest buying someone else project thats done also. Could find a v8 or jz swapped easy for 10k. Then you still got leftovers to put more power and whatever you want to make it different from last owner.

[mewantkouki]

We don't recommend anything over 450whp on the stock sleeves, which is about where we stop recommending H-beam rods as well. While you may be able to hit 500whp on a stock bottom end because your budies sister had a cousin who did it doesn't mean it's reliable. I've seen plenty of un-sleeved SR's go make big numbers at a dyno and then blow weeks later.

Maybe I'm biased due to building primarily race engines but we'd always rather have a stout block that can always take the beating rather than have a block that can maybe take the beating, and let's face it S chassis guys abuse the absolute fuck out of everything.

And just a reference, here's my stock SR that was fully balanced and blueprinted making 400whp, but with stock internals. This engine never missed a beat, was regularly maintained, and had a good tune, but abuse and physically weak components lead to things breaking, in my case a rod bolt.

http://i1369.photobucket.com/albums/ag214/HanzB_/D6E5D424-71F0-4F36-BB8E-F745C8C1693A_zpslnibnpu1.jpg (http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/HanzB_/media/D6E5D424-71F0-4F36-BB8E-F745C8C1693A_zpslnibnpu1.jpg.html)

Question 2: What were you doing when that happened?

I'm not going to defend the "stock bottom end 500whp SR" but I've seen quite a few cars get up there in number and last a reasonable amount of time. It all depends on how it gets driven. Drift events, and drag racing aren't exactly easy on an engine. A weekend warrior / street car will suffer much less abuse in theory.

[hanzbrady]

Question 2: What were you doing when that happened?

I'm not going to defend the "stock bottom end 500whp SR" but I've seen quite a few cars get up there in number and last a reasonable amount of time. It all depends on how it gets driven. Drift events, and drag racing aren't exactly easy on an engine. A weekend warrior / street car will suffer much less abuse in theory.

When that happened, drag racing, but the car was my daily in high school so it got a little of every treatment.

[nomoremrriceguy]

Yeah, ive seen that as well with the current trend of everyone switching to ka. I bought my car last year april and people laughed when I said it was ka-t and later was going to build it lol now look at everyone switching over from sr's. Swaps were stupid cheap and now are 4x the price. You bring up ka and they go "yeah they handle a good deal of power for a truck motor when built"

If I were you OP, I would look into ka if you want to build/boost 4 banger plus have money left over. Im sure you can find a stupid clean manual kouki if you look around for 4-5k semi stock or pick up a nice little rolling shell thats clean for 1k and buy a dual cam separate stupid cheap and go from there. Not sure on your mechanically inclined but building a car is really good experience if you got the time/money/tools.

If you have a budget of 15k which im assuming you have since you said pick up a car for 10-11k then 6k building the motor I would just suggest buying someone else project thats done also. Could find a v8 or jz swapped easy for 10k. Then you still got leftovers to put more power and whatever you want to make it different from last owner. Theres a couple cars I'm looking at getting, theres a clean 98' s14 in Socal that's sr20 swapped with forged internals and gt2871r at 330whp, he wants around 16k for it so I might have to go with that and call it a day. I've been looking on the classifieds here and whenever I search 2jz it always says it can't find results, my dream 240 would be an rb26 swapped one, however they're really rare to find and are often too expensive for a clean one.

[R3b]

Post the AD for it, no way in hell is that worth 16k, most he would get is 10-11k even if it is a built sr

[nomoremrriceguy]

Post the AD for it, no way in hell is that worth 16k, most he would get is 10-11k even if it is a built sr

http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=635366

[R3b]

Stupid clean but no way worth 16k imo, no one will have that much to spend on a kouki cash. Thats why everyone offering trades plus cash.

I see if he were to part it out, get about 4k for the sr20, work equips no more than 2-2.5k, then a rolling shell 5k for that if they really really love there oem kits.

Offer him something to see if he bites, I'd say 10k to see his lowest dollar because cars like his dont sell over night and only get sold to the right person after awhile. Which is why most high dollar build get parted out. if you want to get into 240s and 100% want to get into modding cars then that is the perfect car to start if you want to pay the money.

I still say go find a kouki, buy a used ka, build it and throw it in and making the car your own than buying prebuilt. Can easy find 240s by you

https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/cto/5801078580.html rb26dett, needs paint and some work but way better than a stock s15 sr20
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/cto/5776298740.html v8 reliablity swap and carb for mad muscle points.

Or just buy a rolling shell and do what I said or better yet do a swap than building a ka/sr just go 2jz single turbo on e85. Will get you well to 500hp. Cant always talk down these guys and score a couple grand to put else where.
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/cto/5778464873.html
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/cto/5804290127.html
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/cto/5804290127.html

[hobbs]

I wouldn't turn away a proper 1j build either - http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=636030

[jedi03]

Lol its funny how part outs happen...it does take the right person to appreciate how much labor costs...

[nomoremrriceguy]

That 1j car is sickk but I don't like the idea of buying out of state

[nomoremrriceguy]

Stupid clean but no way worth 16k imo, no one will have that much to spend on a kouki cash. Thats why everyone offering trades plus cash.

I see if he were to part it out, get about 4k for the sr20, work equips no more than 2-2.5k, then a rolling shell 5k for that if they really really love there oem kits.

Offer him something to see if he bites, I'd say 10k to see his lowest dollar because cars like his dont sell over night and only get sold to the right person after awhile. Which is why most high dollar build get parted out. if you want to get into 240s and 100% want to get into modding cars then that is the perfect car to start if you want to pay the money.

I still say go find a kouki, buy a used ka, build it and throw it in and making the car your own than buying prebuilt. Can easy find 240s by you

https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/cto/5801078580.html rb26dett, needs paint and some work but way better than a stock s15 sr20
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/cto/5776298740.html v8 reliablity swap and carb for mad muscle points.

Or just buy a rolling shell and do what I said or better yet do a swap than building a ka/sr just go 2jz single turbo on e85. Will get you well to 500hp. Cant always talk down these guys and score a couple grand to put else where.
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/cto/5778464873.html
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/cto/5804290127.html
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/cto/5804290127.html

I messaged him and he said he'd take 14k for it, but the bumper needs to be repainted because there's damage, the wing needs new clear coat and the a/c needs to be recharged. having that said, it's one of the only clean 240's in california i've found with an sr20 with forged internals

[hobbs]

That 1j car is sickk but I don't like the idea of buying out of state

I wouldnt be worried about buying a car out of state.

[nomoremrriceguy]

I wouldnt be worried about buying a car out of state. im in california so theres no way im gonna drive that thing across the country. I was thinking to just fly out there check it out and if it's good have him ship it back to me or something. either way i think that red 240 is a cleaner car, on the other hand I would love to find a 240 with a running rb26 or a 2j

[mewantkouki]

19 years old
Wants rb or jz powered s14
8 posts

This should be enough to dead this thread.

[R3b]

Can vouch for the dude, he is by me. Always has stupid clean cars, dont know what the fuck he does. Flips them all day. That car is your moneys worth. Im sure he will knock down 1k if fly out and pay for the shipping.

Up to you man, end of the day is your decision. Just better stick with it, not for the faint of heart and not like the videos you see on youtube or stance hardparked boys on insta.

[mewantkouki]

Honest advice, I'd build my own car. Don't buy somebody else's project unless you're confident in their ability or personally know them / the car. You'll learn 100X more, and appreciate the time and effort that goes into putting something like that together.

[nomoremrriceguy]

19 years old
Wants rb or jz powered s14
8 posts

This should be enough to dead this thread. I don't see why not, I've had my fair share of fast cars, I've owned sti's, m3's, s4's, I just sold my 400 whp 335i, I had turbo'd s2k. An rb or 2j powered 240 is a car on my bucket list. I flip cars, I've owned 7 or so cars in the last couple years

[mr_eh]

here's how I made 501whp with an sr20

>> fuel
Twin Walbro 255lph
RC Engineering 1000cc Injectors
Aeromotive Fuel Pressure Regulator
Greddy Fuel Rail

>> go slow
Full Race Turbo Kit
Gen 2 SR RWD Prostreet Twinscroll T4 Manifold
Gen 2 SR RWD 3.0in. Downpipe
Tial 44mm Wastegate x 2
Garrett GT35r 1.06 a/r
Optional FR S13 240SX/Silvia FMIC
Tial 50 mm BOV
Built By Pride Performance Engine Components:
SR20DET
Bored .20 Over
JE 2618 T6 Forged Pistons
Manley Turbo Tuff I-Beam Rods
Tomei Wrist Pins
Nismo Billet Crank
Nismo high Tencil Bearing Cap Bolts
Timken main and thrust bearings
ARP Head Studs
3 Angle Valve Job by JGY Customs
Greddy Rocker Arm Stoppers
Brian Crower Springs/Guides/Retainers
Greddy Intake Manifold
Greddy Oil Pan
Nismo Coil packs
HKS Step 2 264/272 Cams
Nissan Sr20det Full Gasket Set
Greddy Cam Gears
Cosworth Head Gasket
HKS Hi-Power Exhaust
Ebay TB port matched
ATI Super Damper Harmonic Crank Pulley
Greddy Oil Relocation Kit
Greddy Sandwich Plate
AMS? Catch Can

>> cooling
3"x 6" Turbo Flex Section
Flexlite Fans 14" Fans x 2
Koyo Radiator End Flow Setup
Setrab Oil Cooler/B&M 11x8 1.5 inch 1/2 " npt

>> drivetrain
Mazworx SRVG Adapter Kit
Mazworx Z32 Transmission - Cleaned/Inspected/Machined For Adapter Plate + replaced with brand new synchros(was grinding 3rd to 4th)
Mazworx Scatter Shield
Exedy Ceramic Triple Plate
Os Giken Rear 1.5 way Diff

>> electronics
APEXi Power Fuel Commander
APEXi Turbo Timer
AEM Tru Boost Gauge +30psi sensor :X
AEM Oil Pressure Gauge
AEM Uego
S13 SR Harness

good.
fucking.
luck.