Rocket arm fell off and broken shim!!

[jlmillionaire]

Hey guys ,I was doing a oil pressure test making sure I was getting oil to the head. I did a second test just to make sure things were cherry, next thing I know I hear a noise and a shim flew past my face at this point I'm like what the fuck now!! So I look and the rocket arm fell off and I found one shim and it broke . Yes i will look for the other shim as well. My question is why did this happen I have ras . Did I put the shims In incorrectly ? I'm also running Tomei 260 . Another question I have is what size shims do I get I went on frsport and there are many to choose from. Please help me out guys thanks.👍

[hanzbrady]

The only time I had a shim spit out was when I had the clearances set wrong, rocker arm stoppers are useless and cause more problems than they actually solve, to fix it you'll have to measure your rocker contact patch for how level it is and if it needs to be moved +/- order the corresponding shim

[jlmillionaire]

Also will I be able to get my motor at tdc with the rocket arm off? And there's not a stock size shim .

[hanzbrady]

Also will I be able to get my motor at tdc with the rocket arm off? And there's not a stock size shim .

Shims wear down and must be replaced with a properly sized one, and you could.

[jlmillionaire]

I might as well replace them all , could it be as easy as going with the stock size for all and be good to go ? I'm just a little shaky on the measuring

[cotbu]

This should never happen when cranking, unless they were installed wrong. If this really happened you should go over all your work. Part out 6mo tops even if it's parked for 5mo

[jlmillionaire]

Yes I believe that's what happened I must of put them on the wrong side . However I did put the correct shims with the corresponding rocker arms and there also in there correct place. Yes I will double check everything . So as far as getting all new shims with hydraulic lifters with out having to measure.

[Kis4Kouki]

You are going to need measurements to find out what shim to use. In order to measure clearances your going to need a feeler gauge.
Im pretty sure 260 lift needs a re shim or other work to your valve train to complement the cams.
If you are talking about tomei 256 pon cams then you dont need anything.
This link will help you fill in the blanks i missed. http://http://www.nicoclub.com/archives/how-to-build-a-9000-rpm-sr20det-head.html
Side note. if this is your first time doing any valve train work i high recommend you take it to somebody that knows what there doing. there are a lot of measurements that need to be taken and it can get tedious and frustrating.
Its worth the extra money in the long run or else you are going to have problems especially when that engine starts to rev up high.

[jlmillionaire]

Ok sounds like a plan my uncle owns a transmission shop in gonn see if I can get it down there if he can help.

[Kis4Kouki]

Sweet yeah he should have a feeler gauge and some insight.
Sr valve trains are tricky. The first sr20 i bought the guy tried rebuilding it.
Unfortunately it always had problems up top and at the time i didn't really know enough about valve trains or how meticulous you have to be when building or installing new parts.
Let me know when you get everything set up n runnin

[derass]

Im pretty sure 260 lift needs a re shim or other work to your valve train to complement the cams.
If you are talking about tomei 256 pon cams then you dont need anything.

Aside from upgraded springs, no additional work or parts are required to use Tomei 260's.

[Kis4Kouki]

The 256 are the ones were no additional parts are required.
Tomei apparently made 2 types of 260.
Solid types which need springs, retainers, solid lifters and etc.
And lash type which say they don't need anything but it's highly
recommended to upgrade springs

[jlmillionaire]

I have the lash type 260 , now that the rocket arm fell off and shim broke and might have to re shim everything I should of just done the solid setup. Well hopefully it's just the two shims I have to replace and I will be posting pictures soon , of how I had the shims installed .

[jlmillionaire]

I'm going to do the dual guide conversion then call it a day

[wurley]

Did you bleed the lifters? I dont see how hla's could let the rocker/shims come off only while cracking, they should adjust a bit even if yours shims were all wrong; which shouldnt be a problem because I think all oem shims are the same size?

Anyone know the difference between lash and solid cams, and would it be dumb to run lash cams with solid lifters? Ive read a bit about this, but people have mixed opinions; some says it's fine, others say it will break rockers.

[hanzbrady]

I'm going to do the dual guide conversion then call it a day

You still have to measure the guides to level the rockers. They all come in 3mm but will require grinding to level the rocker contact patch.

[hanzbrady]

Did you bleed the lifters? I dont see how hla's could let the rocker/shims come off only while cracking, they should adjust a bit even if yours shims were all wrong; which shouldnt be a problem because I think all oem shims are the same size?

Anyone know the difference between lash and solid cams, and would it be dumb to run lash cams with solid lifters? Ive read a bit about this, but people have mixed opinions; some says it's fine, others say it will break rockers.

I've had this happen simply by hand turning an engine during assembly, if they're installed incorrectly they will find a way out. All shims start the same size, but they don't wear evenly, also they could possibly be ground during assembly to compensate for variations in valve tip height. As for the solid vs lash cam debate, they have different lobe profiles designed to be used with their corresponding lifter type. Mixing and matching is asking for trouble.

[jlmillionaire]

Did you bleed the lifters? I dont see how hla's could let the rocker/shims come off only while cracking, they should adjust a bit even if yours shims were all wrong; which shouldnt be a problem because I think all oem shims are the same size?

Anyone know the difference between lash and solid cams, and would it be dumb to run lash cams with solid lifters? Ive read a bit about this, but people have mixed opinions; some says it's fine, others say it will break rockers.

hey yes i bleed all the lifters , i stuck each one in a vice depressed them then stuck them in oil pushing them up and down till there was no air bubbles

[jlmillionaire]

Hey guys upon further inspection I believe I installed the guides on the wrong side on the intake cam and noticed that two others were broken as well.im really worried about the debris and chunks from the guides . I don't want to do a full rebuild at the moment . I'm going to remove the pan and clean the hell out of it. I also have some photos http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s610/joshlawler82/2468B020-C3C5-4531-B27D-0C9FE78DAD7B_zpsioswva2l.jpg (http://s1308.photobucket.com/user/joshlawler82/media/2468B020-C3C5-4531-B27D-0C9FE78DAD7B_zpsioswva2l.jpg.html)http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s610/joshlawler82/AB12EA53-FDD3-45FE-8032-460AC44713D0_zpsueoqrynx.jpg (http://s1308.photobucket.com/user/joshlawler82/media/AB12EA53-FDD3-45FE-8032-460AC44713D0_zpsueoqrynx.jpg.html)http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s610/joshlawler82/194012C1-C0C6-4B93-A3B6-80B2C9F51A0C_zpsggbh1jym.jpg (http://s1308.photobucket.com/user/joshlawler82/media/194012C1-C0C6-4B93-A3B6-80B2C9F51A0C_zpsggbh1jym.jpg.html)

[cotbu]

This is important stuff, so that being said. The fsm and interwebs has all the info you need. You just need comprehensive skills to use them. Now reshimming is a different story. So hope you don't have to do that.

You have to know for a fact that these shims and guides came from that cylinder, minimum. If you installed springs, retainers and or valves I'd reshim or at least pull up the blueprint. Also would do it for aggressive cams or cams with shifty ramps. I never ever had a problem with Tomei cams solid or lash type.

Cleaning you need to run that engine. And then change the filter and oil then if you like clean the pan, don't forget inside the pickup.

[Mcflurry]

I'm not sure why people are saying SR heads are difficult to rebuild, possibly because they have little experience outside Nissan motors? Given your current knowledge I think you'd find rebuilding an SR head with an FSM or Gregorys manual very simple, certainly much more than others.

If you've ever used a feeler gauge before and feel comfortable removing your cams, you could consider solid lifters and be done with HLA's. Having solid lifters does require maintenance however...

Could someone tell me what they consider an easy head to rebuild?

[jedi03]

Isuzu and hint diesel heads...cake...I just did my Sr full down all the way back up...I thought it was straight forward, and in some ways easier than my b16 I did back in the day...I vaguely remember doing my 1st Gen mr2 motor but couldn't say either way...

[cotbu]

Not that the head is difficult to build, just the people attempting to build them, seem to screw up somehow. Like guides on the wrong side.

[jedi03]

Lol happens all the time regardless of engine...just need to mark stuff as its pulled off and measure during reassembly
..

[Mcflurry]

Yep, doesn't matter if you've been building engines for 20 years.. if you don't mark things or take photos, you're bound to make a mistake similar to this.

[cotbu]

I use valve cover bolts instead of stud/nut combo and I always put each bolt back into the same hole. That's a bit excessive but it's now practice. When you walk into a shop and your engine is spread all across the bench, you don't want to here I build these engines all the time. From me, it's yeah I've done it before. And I charge a dollar for the zip lock bags.

[jlmillionaire]

Yes the big mistake I made here is not taking photos of the shims, I took photos of everything else and labeled each component to corresponding bank. Just another setback I will get it rite.

[jlmillionaire]

On the bright side i will be doing dual rocker arm conversion and I'm bringing the car to my uncles shop after I get back from my honeymoon!!

[zombiewolf513]

What's a 'rocket arm' ?

[jlmillionaire]

A rocket arm is a spell check fix haha to I didn't even realize that till now

[jedi03]

Haven't you seen mega man?

[cotbu]

Your not running dual rocker arms anyway, it would be a dual guide conversion. Just saying.

[Kingtal0n]

Yes I believe that's what happened I must of put them on the wrong side . However I did put the correct shims with the corresponding rocker arms and there also in there correct place. Yes I will double check everything . So as far as getting all new shims with hydraulic lifters with out having to measure.

guides to the left,

shims on the right.

If you put them backwards, it will break the guides and throw rockers. I did this also almost 15 years ago, broke every guide on one side of the engine.