dual caliper hydro setup...roasting my pads!

[yitzac1990]

to start things off, here is my current setup:

GKTech rear caliper brackets for Wilwood calipers
Wilwood calipers and pads
OEM s14 rear rotors (5 lug on my s13)
EBC yellow stuff pads on OEM rear calipers
KSport hydro e-brake with a Wilwood cylinder
-3an brake line from cylinder to a "Tee", and -3an brake line to each Wilwood caliper

Bled the brakes just fine, and they were very tough to rotate, I figured because of brand new Wilwood pads. went to drive the car for the first time, and for a few miles, maybe 6 or 7, it went great. I yanked the hydro just once to test it and they locked up great. But at the next stoplight I noticed my driver side calipers smoking and I could smell that infamous brunt brake pad smell. pulled over, and let the car sit for about 10 minutes, and it went back to normal and I could drive fine again. another few miles down the road, the other side locked up this time. Pulled over, this time I cracked the bleeder screw on the wilwood to let out some pressure, and I could drive again. all good for the next like 20 miles or so. went out again on a drive, and about 10 miles later, the passenger side caliper locked up again, and this time I didnt have a wrench. about 10 minutes later, it went back to normal and I could drive again.

Anyone have any ideas why? My theory is the crappy DOT3 walmart brake fluid I used is maybe heating up and expanding in the lines? But i dont know why it would be heating up, its a completely separate system from the OEM brake lines. Should I get some DOT 5 synthetic really good brake fluid and try to re-bleed the lines with that? I have some DOT 3 Prestone High Temperature Synthetic brake fluid, would that work you think?

Thanks!

[95_S14]

This didn't need it's own thread , you spend all that money on a legit setup and become a cheap ass on the brake fluid .

[yitzac1990]

Lol I've used it before and never had any problems...

[yitzac1990]

okay so i flushed out the walmart fluid, and put in the Prestone DOT 3 high temp synthetic fluid. same exact problem......so im not sure what it could be! any ideas??

[Dillinja666]

give us more info on which calipers you are running. Also which breaks are smoking the new hydro breaks or your stockies?

[yitzac1990]

The exact calipers im running are the 120-10188:

http://www.wilwood.com/Calipers/CaliperProd.aspx?itemno=120-10188

its the hydro brakes that are locking up and smoking, because while I am driving I will periodically slightly pull the hydro just to verify the pull pressure, and when my car starts randomly slowing down and becoming harder to go, ill pull the hydro and it will be tough to pull. so I know its the hydro, which in turn are heating up the rotor, and heating up my stock caliper pads, too.

hope that makes sense.

Also, the first time this happened it was the driver side caliper that locked up and was smoking. the last 3 or 4 times have only been the passenger side. which is weird, because both calipers are on the same "circuit" of brake fluid....no proportioning valves or anything, just one line, splitting to two lines, one to each caliper.

ive emailed Wilwood about this problem, but wont hear back until Monday at the earliest because of their schedule, which is expected.

[Dillinja666]

I understand. I was curious to see if there was some sort of check valve keeping the breaks applied after you yank the handle. Which cylinder did you put on? I would be surprised if both calipers would stick so something must be leaving them applied. Have you tried disconnecting the handle from the cylinder to make sure it is not slightly applying the breaks?

[whyteboi]

I buddy of mine had the same problem. The adjustment shaft on the master was too long, hitting the handbrake, and keeping pressure on the caliper. I'd start with checking that handbrake and master. Something is not relieving pressure.

[yitzac1990]

The cylinder I am using is the 260-6087:

http://wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderProd.aspx?itemno=260-6087

I dont think its the cylinder shaft length/setting, because when i bleed the brakes the hydro isnt tough to pull at all, and it doesn't hold the brakes locked without pulling it. I can drive for some amount of time and everything will be fine, and the pressure will somehow build on its own, locking the caliper. And when the handle does start to stiffen up, it is very quick to lock the brake, almost sudden. just about 20 minutes ago it happened again, so I pulled over, cracked the bleeder on the driver side, and out came steaming brake fluid. once I did that, I was okay to drive again....

Earlier today, after I put in the synthetic stuff, I took the car out and did some e-brake pulls, at least 6 or 7 times. everything was fine, and the brakes locked up great when I pulled it, and unlocked when I released. then I was just driving down the street normal, and I could feel the car getting a bit sluggish, and the braking force exponentially got higher, so I had to pull over right away to relieve pressure.

[yitzac1990]

so, does anyone have some more info maybe? I for sure have the cylinder hooked up right, and I have seen systems plumbed the exact same way. Not sure why my setup is doing what its doing!!

[driftage240]

I buddy of mine had the same problem. The adjustment shaft on the master was too long, hitting the handbrake, and keeping pressure on the caliper. I'd start with checking that handbrake and master. Something is not relieving pressure.

took the words out of my mouth

[Breakbeat93]

I buddy of mine had the same problem. The adjustment shaft on the master was too long, hitting the handbrake, and keeping pressure on the caliper. I'd start with checking that handbrake and master. Something is not relieving pressure.

Is their slack in the handle at first, or does it immediately start braking when you pull? ^this seems like the issue to me...you probably have constant pressure on the pads which is heating everything up...this would also be the cause of the wheel being hard to spin after you installed and bled the system.

[yitzac1990]

Ok so I revisited the option of the shaft on the cylinder being slightly pushed in, like suggested. I actually went and drilled a new hole in my hydro handle itself to relocate the connection point of the shaft/linkage on the handle. this allowed the handle to fully pull the shaft out, so there is no pressure on the cylinder at rest now. I guess how I had it set up before, you'd have to see it and play with it, but I can see how I could have mistaken it for fully released when in fact it wasn't.

Drove the car 14 miles this morning to work and no lock ups. will drive it a lot this weekend to check things out. I am still using the DOT 3 high temp Prestone fluid.

On another note, the relocating of the shaft connection point on the handle allowed me less of a pull of the handle to get maximum shaft movement....if that makes sense lol. Now i dont have to pull the handle as much in order to lock the brakes. so that's awesome.

Thanks for the replies, ive been real busy with work lately, and havent had much time to explore this until last night. Will keep you all posted if anything comes up.

[cgtdream]

Ok so I revisited the option of the shaft on the cylinder being slightly pushed in, like suggested. I actually went and drilled a new hole in my hydro handle itself to relocate the connection point of the shaft/linkage on the handle. this allowed the handle to fully pull the shaft out, so there is no pressure on the cylinder at rest now. I guess how I had it set up before, you'd have to see it and play with it, but I can see how I could have mistaken it for fully released when in fact it wasn't.

Drove the car 14 miles this morning to work and no lock ups. will drive it a lot this weekend to check things out. I am still using the DOT 3 high temp Prestone fluid.

On another note, the relocating of the shaft connection point on the handle allowed me less of a pull of the handle to get maximum shaft movement....if that makes sense lol. Now i dont have to pull the handle as much in order to lock the brakes. so that's awesome.

Thanks for the replies, ive been real busy with work lately, and havent had much time to explore this until last night. Will keep you all posted if anything comes up.

Sounds like you didn't bed in your pads correctly. From what was posted in this thread so far, about how you ripped on the e-brake and such, you probably roasted your brake pads.

Anywho, here is just one, of the many guides on the internet, on what I am talking about.

Also this is just another thought to consider.

http://ebcbrakes.com/articles/how-to-bed-in-your-new-brakes-for-streeturban-driving-2/

[TheRealSy90]

He fixed it, the master cylinder wasn't releasing all the way out.