Aluminum driveshaft

[S13alldayyo]

Question: does an aluminum driveshaft really make "annoying" noises while driving? Trying to chose between a steel and aluminum ds on a dd car


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[blackmags91]

what? nah..
I daily drove an s13 with a driveshaft shop aluminum and it was great. I noticed SOMETIMES when taking off slowly in first gear from a stop the link between the driveshaft and the differential flange would rattle a tiny bit, but only for a split second while the drivetrain was fully engaging.

[S13alldayyo]

Even over 60mph?


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[Sileighty_85]

I have a Drive shaft Shop aluminum DS and never noticed anything from it while driving

[S13alldayyo]

Cool! Thanks for the info guys


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[thairus]

i have a aluminum driveshaft shop one for mines, it dont make no noise at all

[pancakes562]

I got one on my S14 KA and it doesn't make any noises. I freaking love the thing (:

[CamberWear]

I know this thread is ready to be closed but I wanted to jump in while it's alive... Question is how "worth it" is it to spend close to $500 on a 1 piece aluminum driveshaft? More specifically, how does it compare to the stock KA 2 piece drive shaft as far as driveability goes..? Obviously your getting weight reduction but is it only worth getting if you're trying to build a racecar or is it a suitable mod for a daily with bolt ons? Thanks!

[fliprayzin240sx]

It might be making noise if the DS is touching the tailshaft dust collar.

[DJ 21o3]

I know this thread is ready to be closed but I wanted to jump in while it's alive... Question is how "worth it" is it to spend close to $500 on a 1 piece aluminum driveshaft? More specifically, how does it compare to the stock KA 2 piece drive shaft as far as driveability goes..? Obviously your getting weight reduction but is it only worth getting if you're trying to build a racecar or is it a suitable mod for a daily with bolt ons? Thanks!

I have no personal experience so do not accept my response unless it is supported by someone else...

I have done research on drive shafts before and it is weight reduction, snappier throttle response, and the car revs more freely I believe. People have even recommended it for stock cars.

It is 4 in the morning so I can not remember for sure everything I have read, but I know i have read enough that I will be purchasing a 1 piece aluminum shaft once I start the next stage of mods for my car next winter.

[S13alldayyo]

Il be purchasing one because of what was stated above^ and to get ride of the stock carrier bearing, mine is going bad and my whole car vibrates in the 20-30 mph range and goes away


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[TheRealSy90]

I've got solid motor and trans mounts with a welded diff and my DSS aluminum shaft resonates and is pretty loud while driving.


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[sil14zenki]

sup bryan... i'm with sileighty. i've had my drive shaft shop alumn ds for 5years and no complaints. only input i have is you may lose some torque while freeing up some hp. please correct me if i'm wrong.

[S13alldayyo]

Thought it was the other way around.


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[Kingtal0n]

What bothers me is that driveshaft will not bend in half the way the stocker will in the event of an accident. it could be the difference between life and death.

[pancakes562]

sup bryan... i'm with sileighty. i've had my drive shaft shop alumn ds for 5years and no complaints. only input i have is you may lose some torque while freeing up some hp. please correct me if i'm wrong.

I think the whole point of an aluminum drive shaft is for torque lol

[Kingtal0n]

I think the whole point of an aluminum drive shaft is for torque lol

the idea is to reduce rotating weight. Same idea as lightweight flywheel, or lighter wheels. It means more power makes it to the ground. I know I said power, but you can call that torque if you want.

the negative side to using any lightweight part, is that there is less energy stored inside rotating parts (but you JUST said that was a positive... ) It means that the engine will have to produce more torque on demand and rely less on rotating intertia stored in the parts.

Ill give you an example. Imagine your flywheel weighs 100lbs. Yes turning it will be difficult, slow, and it will take a long time to get the RPM up. But once the RPM is there, you can dump the clutch and the car will rip the tires apart because that flywheel is not stopping.

On the other hand, if the flywheel weighs 1lb, it will spin really easy. You can get that thing up to 7,000rpm in a split second if you want. but when you dump the clutch the rpm is just going to drop and the engine will stall because there is no energy stored in the flywheel.

A nice cross makes a proper car. if you are strictly drag racing then mostly lightweight parts is fine. But if the car is a daily you want it to be easy to leave stoplights, which means you probably want to keep mostly stock-weighted parts. One or two lightweight components is ok but the more you add the more finicky the car will be leaving lights.

[TheRealSy90]

Think is I'm pretty sure the driveshaft isn't turning when the clutch is in sitting at a light lol.


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[Drift_FX]

what you guys haven't mentioned too is that with most 1 pc drive shafts they come with upgraded u joints (the part most likely to break) and the are held in with snap rings, and available at most auto parts stores if you do break one.....

[Mikester]

Going back to post #1, either/or will be fine for a DD car. If it sees track duty, then score! If it's just daily driven, leave it stock. The point as mentioned is to lighten the driveline, which enables quicker accel/decel. Additionally, there is less power lost due to the fact that the hanger bearing & rubber dampner aren't there- meaning slightly more linear torque/power transfer to the wheels.

Aluminum/CS shafts will sometimes make a 'hum' due to balancing... However, don't ask me why but it works- Driveshaft Shops website says if it's too noisy, to jack up the car an rotate the shaft 180*; then re-secure it to the diff. Guess what? I'll be damned it actually works lol...

You won't notice anything out of the ordinary. As a matter of fact, I doubt you'd even be able to tell the difference ;)

[Matej]

You won't notice anything out of the ordinary. As a matter of fact, I doubt you'd even be able to tell the difference ;)
On the contrary, on a stock KA, an aluminum driveshaft and a lighter flywheel were my two favorite mods. Perhaps I just convinced myself of this, but I thought they made the car even more enjoyable than when I had a T25 on it prior to going back to NA. Nor did I experience any driveability issues.
In my opinion it provides more fun for the money than an exhaust or an intake or any other typical 'power' mod.

[zerodameaon]

I put a steel driveshaft on my car and the change in the car is quite apparent, and I am not talking about the noise it makes either, which if noise is what you are referring to then yes its not apperent. Aluminum is by comparison very quite and even better than that stock shit with a big rubber bushing and a carrier bearing to wear out.

[Matej]

By the way, one of the old Nissan trucks/SUV's comes with a driveshaft that fits the 240SX, though I forget which one. Good for anyone who wants a cheap one-piece steel driveshaft. :)

http://nissannut.com/projects/Driveshaft_rear/3.jpg

[blackej7]

I have a question. For those that have a good working aluminum driveshaft, do you see any evidence that the driveshaft was actually balanced? Any weights welded onto the ends or anything?

Just curious, thanks!

[S14DB]

Think is I'm pretty sure the driveshaft isn't turning when the clutch is in sitting at a light lol.

Exactly. There are no negatives to loosing mass after the transmission.


The pole vaulting worry is funny also. The stock DS in 2 parts for NHV. Carrier bearing soaks up a lot of vibration before it fails.
I have a question. For those that have a good working aluminum driveshaft, do you see any evidence that the driveshaft was actually balanced? Any weights welded onto the ends or anything?

Just curious, thanks!

Yes, it's harder to tell on an aluminum. A lot less has to be added or removed.

Typically just see some drilled circles or some extra/thicker welds. Look at the ends not the shaft body. They don't want to weaken the tube. You may notice the end to tube weld looks over done or thicker one side.

[pancakes562]

the idea is to reduce rotating weight. Same idea as lightweight flywheel, or lighter wheels. It means more power makes it to the ground. I know I said power, but you can call that torque if you want.

the negative side to using any lightweight part, is that there is less energy stored inside rotating parts (but you JUST said that was a positive... ) It means that the engine will have to produce more torque on demand and rely less on rotating intertia stored in the parts.

Ill give you an example. Imagine your flywheel weighs 100lbs. Yes turning it will be difficult, slow, and it will take a long time to get the RPM up. But once the RPM is there, you can dump the clutch and the car will rip the tires apart because that flywheel is not stopping.

On the other hand, if the flywheel weighs 1lb, it will spin really easy. You can get that thing up to 7,000rpm in a split second if you want. but when you dump the clutch the rpm is just going to drop and the engine will stall because there is no energy stored in the flywheel.

A nice cross makes a proper car. if you are strictly drag racing then mostly lightweight parts is fine. But if the car is a daily you want it to be easy to leave stoplights, which means you probably want to keep mostly stock-weighted parts. One or two lightweight components is ok but the more you add the more finicky the car will be leaving lights.

:l101: Point proven. I happen to run a light weight aluminum drive shaft on my KA and so far I really like it. No problems daily driving it.

[Mikester]

On the contrary, on a stock KA, an aluminum driveshaft and a lighter flywheel were my two favorite mods. Perhaps I just convinced myself of this, but I thought they made the car even more enjoyable than when I had a T25 on it prior to going back to NA. Nor did I experience any driveability issues.
In my opinion it provides more fun for the money than an exhaust or an intake or any other typical 'power' mod.

Each to their own I suppose. I fitted the aluminum DS to my stock KA before the SR swap and didn't notice anything in the way of performance. I'm sure by design there was 'something' there if that makes sense... but not at all noticeable IMHO. I did notice shifting was nicer due to the urethane tranny mount that went in, however. I could definitely understand lightening the flywhell and the DS making a noticeable difference... In my case, and from what IR OP said, he is only asking about changing the DS- WHich by itself would be negligibly noticeable- if at all.

On my current setup (Z32 tranny, aluminum DS & Nismo mount), all I can say is that it feels damned near just like the last one; with nothing noticeable in the way of driveline noise etc.

It's not a bad mod, and I hope it didn't seem like that's what I was implying. I'm just giving the opinion that an aluminum or CS DS will not affect driveability; will aide in power transfer, and will alleviate a potential point of failure (hanger bearing & dampner) from the equation... but all in all, for a DD car, there are other $300-$400 purchases that may be better bang for the buck in the way of performance.

[camo240]

I have a one piece rb20 to s13 non abs I loved it no issues. Now for sale since I need a rb25 one lol

[ixfxi]

I have a question. For those that have a good working aluminum driveshaft, do you see any evidence that the driveshaft was actually balanced? Any weights welded onto the ends or anything?

Yes, they drill and insert a rivet with a small piece of weighted metal.

[gearhead55]

the idea is to reduce rotating weight. Same idea as lightweight flywheel, or lighter wheels. It means more power makes it to the ground. I know I said power, but you can call that torque if you want.

the negative side to using any lightweight part, is that there is less energy stored inside rotating parts (but you JUST said that was a positive... ) It means that the engine will have to produce more torque on demand and rely less on rotating intertia stored in the parts.

Ill give you an example. Imagine your flywheel weighs 100lbs. Yes turning it will be difficult, slow, and it will take a long time to get the RPM up. But once the RPM is there, you can dump the clutch and the car will rip the tires apart because that flywheel is not stopping.

On the other hand, if the flywheel weighs 1lb, it will spin really easy. You can get that thing up to 7,000rpm in a split second if you want. but when you dump the clutch the rpm is just going to drop and the engine will stall because there is no energy stored in the flywheel.

A nice cross makes a proper car. if you are strictly drag racing then mostly lightweight parts is fine. But if the car is a daily you want it to be easy to leave stoplights, which means you probably want to keep mostly stock-weighted parts. One or two lightweight components is ok but the more you add the more finicky the car will be leaving lights.

I found this to be a very succinct and helpful way to describe weight reduction stuff. I had the concept worked out in my head but explaining it simply can be difficult.

Exactly. There are no negatives to loosing mass after the transmission.

Yea, but I think he was just attempting to explain what taking out rotating weight does in general, not specifically a driveshaft. The inertia of the driveshaft still applies when the clutch is engaged. Right?

EDIT: Also I had a DSS steel one piece driveshaft in my RB25 S13. I didn't notice any sound, but then again I was going from SR to RB and have nothing to compare the RB with steel driveshaft to personally.

[S14DB]

Yea, but I think he was just attempting to explain what taking out rotating weight does in general, not specifically a driveshaft. The inertia of the driveshaft still applies when the clutch is engaged. Right?

No, Inertial mass is only bolted to the crank(Pulley, Flywheel). Driven Mass(DS, Axles, wheels), the lighter the better.

[bmxer882x]

By the way, one of the old Nissan trucks/SUV's comes with a driveshaft that fits the 240SX, though I forget which one. Good for anyone who wants a cheap one-piece steel driveshaft. :)

http://nissannut.com/projects/Driveshaft_rear/3.jpg

Anymore info on this? Im now quite curious if the weight is less than the stocker 2 piece

[Mikester]

No, Inertial mass is only bolted to the crank(Pulley, Flywheel). Driven Mass(DS, Axles, wheels), the lighter the better.

Actually, he is correct- this I DO have experience with as a 21 yr instruments, flight controls and navigation technician. Any rotating mass is inertial mass subject to gyroscopic precession due to Newton's laws of motion (objects in motion tend to stay in motion). With the clutch engaged, everything from the clutch to the wheels technically becomes inertial mass... which is why lightening everything from the wheels to the flywheel to the crank to the pulleys etc makes a difference in how the car responds.

Lighter is not always better- depends on the application. For instance, in drag racing, to a point, heavier is better as more mass tends to stay in a rotational state longer than a lighter one. However, I highlighted 'to a point' because there is also the work required in pushing the total mass of the car down the track- in which case, heavier is NOT better aft of the flywheel lol. This, I believe is where the differentiation as you stated between driven mass (clutch back) and inertial mass (Flywheel fwd) comes into play... but really, it's all inertial mass once put into rotation... Silly point I suppose... but being a geek, it sorta caught my attention ;)

[bmxer882x]

Anymore info on this? Im now quite curious if the weight is less than the stocker 2 piece

Ive tried searching but closest I can find is the pathfinder is 2 inches longer than the 1 piece steal or aluminum driveshafts sold by aftermarket companies. Plan on swapping diffs soon so if I could pick up a 1 piece itd be nice to do it at the same time. Im in for more info on this!

edit just realized I only quoted myself. Look 2 messages up.

[S14DB]

Actually, he is correct- this I DO have experience with as a 21 yr instruments, flight controls and navigation technician. Any rotating mass is inertial mass subject to gyroscopic precession due to Newton's laws of motion (objects in motion tend to stay in motion). With the clutch engaged, everything from the clutch to the wheels technically becomes inertial mass... which is why lightening everything from the wheels to the flywheel to the crank to the pulleys etc makes a difference in how the car responds.

Lighter is not always better- depends on the application. For instance, in drag racing, to a point, heavier is better as more mass tends to stay in a rotational state longer than a lighter one. However, I highlighted 'to a point' because there is also the work required in pushing the total mass of the car down the track- in which case, heavier is NOT better aft of the flywheel lol. This, I believe is where the differentiation as you stated between driven mass (clutch back) and inertial mass (Flywheel fwd) comes into play... but really, it's all inertial mass once put into rotation... Silly point I suppose... but being a geek, it sorta caught my attention ;)
Potential energy vs Kinetic.

Drag racers use 40lb flywheels but Carbon Fiber Driveshafts.

[Mikester]

Potential energy vs Kinetic.

Drag racers use 40lb flywheels but Carbon Fiber Driveshafts.

Yup yup... A heavy steel driveshaft initially carries exponentially more potential energy... but when in motion, a 6lbs carbon unit and other lightweight materials on the car enable the car to travel much faster- although the potentialy energy is lower, the kinetic energy all said and done is much higher; while minimizing the parasitic drag on the flywheel... Art at its finest :)

[bbliss126]

I have one in my track car and at slow speed in first gear I hear a bit of rattle sometimes but nothing that would keep me from using one in a daily driver, just my 2 cents.