I wanna discuss drifting

[ditchs14]

i recently saw this posted on FB and not really did it make me think(because i already knew about this and i agree with how japan does things) but i really wanna know why people really do build cars the way they do in the U.S and why it seems that every car built to compete seems WAY over built.

I won't put out the guys name that posted this up unless he wants me to. I'm sure he is already on Zilvia

"Checking out tons of cool drift cars in Japan, piloted by amazing drivers, including d1 and d1sl cars.... I noticed a lot of them where less modified than our local proam cars. Zero tube fronts, mechanical clutch fans, no motor swaps, stock transmissions, no tube rears, no fuel cells, no real cages, all were cusco. All of them were factory wiring harnesses, power fc were the most aggressive ecu. It was pretty interesting. They have the added benefit of having their cars come from the factory with the correct motors in them which seams to really simplify their ricing. Even the majority of their knuckle setups were not as aggressive as ours, and their cars were not super low.

What they did do is drive a LOT. Their tiny tracks don't seem to eat tires that fast ( Meihan is unbelievably small! ) and their cars are made of simple off the shelf stuff. Maybe that helps them drive more, I am not sure, but they don't seem to do the year long build up for cars that aren't top tier, it is more like bolt in your cage and move your parts over if you wreck your car.

Also, there aren't many shade tree mechanics, everyone takes their cars to shops for work, which might also keep their cars from getting too crazy.

Nakamuras car for example has less craftsmanship than literally ANY car in our series, but he drifts like an animal and is know world wide!

These are just some things I noticed on my trip.

Oh, and I can't believe Japan has any Silvia's left! This weekend at Meihan we saw so many novice drivers wreck their cars into stuff for no apparent reason! Te really good guys don't wreck even in aggressive tandem, but the novices destroyed half a dozen cars to the point they are pretty much done for the street." -A.L

[brndck]

saw the same thing on a few groupchats.

once again we see that seat time is more important than level of modification.

the american trend of "lets throw more power at it" *coughwalkerwilkersoncough* produces drivers who are dependant on their car to compensate for any mistakes they make.

watch someone who can drift fast and maintain angle in a 4ag ae86 compared to a run of the mill LS1 s13. The corolla driver will be much smoother and consistent than someone who is used to having power to save them from their mistakes.

[DJPimpFlex]

Seat time is definitely top of the list but I want it ALLLLLL. I want a super modified high hp car that I drive a lot.

[chris_240sx]

I just wish I could drive as much as it seems those guys do.

[Tempo]

Tracks aren't as close in the states for most people I assume, space to work on your car in Japan is probably scarce. Just a guess but I do agree with you OP.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk 2

[kpnasty]

the us drift scene for the most part sucks total balls. im pretty happy with the local chicago scene as the roots have not faded, and everyone works hard to keep style a priority.

one thing to take into consideration is a good portion of proam and pro drifting is on ridiculously large tracks, where everyone needs power behind them.

and as much as i hate v8 swaps, it makes total sense why you would opt for one over an asian make.

[VIPDRFT]

drift scene

:facepalm: Stop saying this.

What's to discuss? Seat time. Period. Some people enjoy building cars, and more power to them. Others just wanna slap simple mods on and drive.

[FaLKoN240]

Tracks aren't as close in the states for most people I assume, space to work on your car in Japan is probably scarce. Just a guess but I do agree with you OP.

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The tracks in Japan are pretty far from what I've seen on videos. Guys drive all day and night to get to the track they're heading to for an event.

The difference is they don't buy parts to make them a better driver, they drive MORE to make them better drivers.

[DJPimpFlex]

Half the fun for me is totally nerding out on my car. I love that shit

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I527 using Tapatalk

[Brian]

A different time...

[ManoNegra]

Seems to me that Japan builds cars to be cool but primarily to be driven.
USA builds cars to obtain e-glory and then part out.

[Matej]

It seems that in Japan the 'tracks' are more like skate parks for cars. One shows up and leaves almost whenever they want, thus it is most likely a lot cheaper, and also does not put as much pressure on drivers to make sure their car will last the day in order to get their money's worth.
That would never work here for legal and insurance reasons. Here people have to wait for the overpriced monthly/annual/whatever event that they have locally, and so the rest of the year they are overbuilding their car out of boredom and to ensure it does not break when they do get to drive it that one day a year, and trying to justify their poor financial decisions by talking to other like-minded people on the internet.

[zooopreme]

Seems to me that Japan builds cars to be cool but primarily to be driven.
USA builds cars to obtain e-glory and then part out.

A common misconception is that only US folks build for e-fame. Japanese folks are almost the same. The difference is Japanese builds are for the builder and not for the people following. Whereas Americans do it to feel better about themselves.

[PureRush]

Why? Because America does it big. We have taken the sport of drifting and made it into our own style. And don't just point the finger at America for "Overbuilding" our drift cars. If you watch EEDC videos you can see that europe does the same exact thing. Also of you go to a local track like Adams you'll see most of the cars there are driven back home and modified like Japanese drift cars are.

[Matej]

Also of you go to a local track like Adams you'll see most of the cars there are driven back home and modified like Japanese drift cars are.
The difference is that when a person in Japan modifies a car on the cheap, there is a chance that it may still come out being cool, while an American car modded on the cheap is more prone to look like the Dorisha Thread.

[drift freaq]

Problem is partly the American "scene" ug did i just say that? Got over commercialized rather quickly. It took years for the Japan scene to be commercialized. Drifting was going on in Japan in a pretty big way in the early nineties and ran for a good ten years that way before D1 appeared. In the U.S. FD appeared within 5 years of drifting getting popular and got commercialized in a very short time.
Some people also forgot that in Japan body kits and front end swaps were actually cheaper than here for a long time. Americans technically had to spend more until the Chinese knock off crap appeared compared to their Japanese counterparts. Result if you spent less here it usually meant crap parts.
That was just the way it was.

Aya told me about how everyone in her High School would go drifting and it was not to be in the quote "club or scene".

It was because it was one of their ways of having fun. These are part of the fundamental differences between here and Japan. When I got into 240's It was not to build a drift car. Drifting was just one of the fun things I could do with the car.

Now it seems like everyone that wants a 240 wants one to drift.

As far as Americans building Garage Queens or show Queens? Well that is the American Hot Rodder ethic at heart. Americans having been doing that with their cars since the 1950's.
Did people think just because it was a Japanese car that ethic might not slip in a bit?
I grew up reading Car and Driver,Hot Rod, Road & Track, Automobile, Autoweek. Just about anything car i absorbed. So being concerned about how my car appeared became a curse. I not only wanted it to perform but to look good as well.

The problem is we go overboard and build cars that are too nice. Thing is Hot Rodder's do the same damn thing.

Get over it we are American we are not Japanese, as much as we are friends we are different. Nothing wrong with that. In fact its what makes the world great. If everyone was the same, did the same shit the same way! The world would be one fucking boring place.

[BossHogg]

The difference is that when a person in Japan modifies a car on the cheap, there is a chance that it may still come out being cool, while an American car modded on the cheap is more prone to look like the Dorisha Thread.

this. Although I did see megan racing parts on yahoo japan! NOOOOO the cancer is spreading. lol just playing around. I wonder how japan people feel about those parts though. Do they think they are junk also?

[ayuaddict]

Americans want to "be different" and do weird shit.

[drift freaq]

Americans want to "be different" and do weird shit.

you called it man.

[ditchs14]

Really what i want to know is why does everyone that drifts have to build a complete race car to slide in any kind of non pro competitive event. i feel like people dump so much money into things like tubed front ends and things like that. it looks like such a waste cuz really you don't need it. plus i feel like people spend so much money doing things like that, that it makes them more scared to tandem close together or going all out cuz they dont want to wreak the car.

plus all these overly built cars break way more then dudes with simple stuff.

btw i do realize that not everyone is doing this but it seems to be happening more.

[zenkiset]

Really what i want to know is why does everyone that drifts have to build a complete race car to slide in any kind of non pro competitive event.

ill just be honest. ill be one of these people. but its simply bc I love the building aspect of things. I can imagine that there are other people out there like me, but im also sure others have many other reasons as well.

[zooopreme]

Really what i want to know is why does everyone that drifts have to build a complete race car to slide in any kind of non pro competitive event.

Talk to a drift douche on the track. He'll talk about how limited he feels with the car, how he wants to keep it JDM but wants that V8 power so he's "building" a JZ or a RB, how many angle mods he plans on using so that he/she can reverse entry into a wall.

i feel like people dump so much money into things like tubed front ends and things like that.

Believe it or not but welding tubs was intended for performance. People weld on tubs to make room for wider wheels and meatier tires.

...then there are people that tub the fronts because they're rubbing their over sized wheels with rubber band tires.

For a 13, this is real helpful since the front inner fenders are a bit limited.

plus i feel like people spend so much money doing things like that, that it makes them more scared to tandem close together or going all out cuz they dont want to wreak the car.

I was going to make the case for grassroot folks but their cars are beat to shit and they are either sponsored or they just don't give a damn so they run cheap parts. So never mind.

plus all these overly built cars break way more then dudes with simple stuff.

I think you care way too much. Unless another person's business messes with your progression, why bother?

On the other side of things, people feel they are upgrading and making things better than what Nissan provided. That being said, I agree with your statement. I think suspension and brakes are about the only thing I find wrong with the S-Chassis. I wish the brakes were better and I wish the car came with a lowered stance and control arm adjustability to match

[brndck]

As far as Americans building Garage Queens or show Queens? Well that is the American Hot Rodder ethic at heart. Americans having been doing that with their cars since the 1950's.
Did people think just because it was a Japanese car that ethic might not slip in a bit?
I grew up reading Car and Driver,Hot Rod, Road & Track, Automobile, Autoweek. Just about anything car i absorbed. So being concerned about how my car appeared became a curse. I not only wanted it to perform but to look good as well.

The problem is we go overboard and build cars that are too nice. Thing is Hot Rodder's do the same damn thing.


Dave I've really gotta disagree with you here. If people were building "nice" drift cars I wouldn't complain. People build shitboxes, with extremely low cost/quality parts, and then say "oh it's just my drift missile" or "oh it's a drift car who cares how it looks". Outside of Chicago, some Texas dudes, and getnuts lab (and a few other small pockets) people are NOT building nice drift cars.

Americans quickly become obsessed with the "too much is never enough" school of thought. IMO, more power will not make you a better drifter. Seat time will. More parts will not make you a better drifter. Having a wisefab kit that does 138 degrees of angle and a twin turbo LS1 doesn't make you a good drifter. It WILL allow you to easily compensate for a sloppy driving style though.

[Jfitzg38]

Dave I've really gotta disagree with you here. If people were building "nice" drift cars I wouldn't complain. People build shitboxes, with extremely low cost/quality parts, and then say "oh it's just my drift missile" or "oh it's a drift car who cares how it looks". Outside of Chicago, some Texas dudes, and getnuts lab (and a few other small pockets) people are NOT building nice drift cars.

Americans quickly become obsessed with the "too much is never enough" school of thought. IMO, more power will not make you a better drifter. Seat time will. More parts will not make you a better drifter. Having a wisefab kit that does 138 degrees of angle and a twin turbo LS1 doesn't make you a good drifter. It WILL allow you to easily compensate for a sloppy driving style though.

Perfect :thumbup: ^^he knows...

[DJPimpFlex]

Dave I've really gotta disagree with you here. If people were building "nice" drift cars I wouldn't complain. People build shitboxes, with extremely low cost/quality parts, and then say "oh it's just my drift missile" or "oh it's a drift car who cares how it looks". Outside of Chicago, some Texas dudes, and getnuts lab (and a few other small pockets) people are NOT building nice drift cars.

Americans quickly become obsessed with the "too much is never enough" school of thought. IMO, more power will not make you a better drifter. Seat time will. More parts will not make you a better drifter. Having a wisefab kit that does 138 degrees of angle and a twin turbo LS1 doesn't make you a good drifter. It WILL allow you to easily compensate for a sloppy driving style though.



There are good builds everywhere you go. There are a lot more bad ones though.

[brndck]

There are good builds everywhere you go. There are a lot more bad ones though.

This is true, but the OVERALL "style" of American drifting is shitboxes.

[drift freaq]

Dave I've really gotta disagree with you here. If people were building "nice" drift cars I wouldn't complain. People build shitboxes, with extremely low cost/quality parts, and then say "oh it's just my drift missile" or "oh it's a drift car who cares how it looks". Outside of Chicago, some Texas dudes, and getnuts lab (and a few other small pockets) people are NOT building nice drift cars.

Americans quickly become obsessed with the "too much is never enough" school of thought. IMO, more power will not make you a better drifter. Seat time will. More parts will not make you a better drifter. Having a wisefab kit that does 138 degrees of angle and a twin turbo LS1 doesn't make you a good drifter. It WILL allow you to easily compensate for a sloppy driving style though.

Ok fair enough, I was talking more about the way Americans usually approach car builds in general and not so much the current generation of drift kids. It used to be back in the 2001-2005 people really did build fairly nice drift cars. Indeed your right socal has turned into drift missile central. I don't disagree with you about the obsession over power or the though about more parts except most of these drift missile kids can't really afford it. Oh and I could not agree more about seat time being more important.

The funny thing today is the fact that kids buy these cars and try to go drifting before the really learn how to drive a fast line in the first place. When I started out we practiced road course style driving in the mountains and whatnot . The drifting came after learning how to drive fast.
If you don't know how to drive a fast line? I can pretty much say you won't be able to drift a fast line. Learning about fast lines and apex's is important.

[brndck]

Absolute truth, Dave! /\/\/\/\

[!Zar!]

That's because most people miss the whole point about drifting and that's to have fun.

Most are either like, 'fuck yeah, I'm going to go and crash my car into a wall, because it's SICK!'

Some are like, 'I can't drift because I need more parts to compensate due to lack of track time.'

While a bunch of other are like, 'I don't want to drift unless it's ProAM, because I want to be pro!'

[ditchs14]

That's because most people miss the whole point about drifting and that's to have fun.

Most are either like, 'fuck yeah, I'm going to go and crash my car into a wall, because it's SICK!'

Some are like, 'I can't drift because I need more parts to compensate due to lack of track time.'

While a bunch of other are like, 'I don't want to drift unless it's ProAM, because I want to be pro!'

http://img.pandawhale.com/31464-Terminator-T2-thumbs-up-gif-HJB5.gif
I was so waiting for you to post zar.

that really is the whole point behind drifting is to have fun and (to me anyway) is to look cool/good while doing it. I feel like Chicago has had this on lock for a long time. I wish people would follow the same process of how they build cars.

[Corbic]

that really is the whole point behind drifting is to have fun

But for some people having fun is pulling out your dicks to see who's is bigger.

At the end of the day, that is exactly what Drift Freaq is talking about. American's have always been competitive by nature. It's what's driven us for the last 250 years. This spills over into an automotive "arms race" in which people are always wanting more. The internet has amplified this 50 fold as you look at 5000whp 8-second car builds all day long and you want that too.

American S-chasis fans are also at a disadvantage. Our stock cars are garbage these days. It's so hard and incredibly expensive to get a garbage car into respectable shape.

When is the last time any of you have seen a car like this on a used dealer lot for $3,500?

http://car-pricenet.com/img/attachments/64/18164_large.jpg

Lastly; as DF was saying about the commercialization of drifting.

Go watch any of the videos and interviews from the Japanese old farts; I recall both Kei Miura and Nakai commenting on how when their were younger there was no internet or video games. Kids did not have cellphones or facebook, so you went out and met up and street raced. This was how you had a good time in the late 80's and early 90's. Eventually the cops would crack down and the next generation would become obsessed with technology and social media.

Personally, I can relate. When I was in HS the big thing was to go meet up. Yes, lots of garbage cars and riced out hondas or mustangs. However, that was what you did on a friday or saturday night. Meet up at the Miejer, catch a movie, shoot pool, go bowling, then after midnight race around, do burnouts and be dumb. Good ol' small town America. That's changed.

Around 2005 cops stop giving out warnings and started charging people with wreck-less driving. Facebook also came out and the "Scene" has completely died. This round of HS kids no longer does car meets or hooligan shit. They'd rather smoke weed and play call of duty while shit talking on facebook. I'm sure their hasn't been a parking lot fight in 10 years now :duh:

I'm sure most of the country is the same. I hear stories about street racing in Cali, blocking off whole streets and what not. FNF was the zenith of everything and it's been downhill since.

As far as building race cars - AMEN. Going 1-2 a year, wasting $400 in tires, $300 in gas, $300 in registration just seem stupid. The events are always poorly organized. I just did a PCA DE event out at VIR. OMFG - MIND BLOWN. That was some top shelf shit, 3 day event, instructors, 25 minute seasons, 4 seasons a day. :eek2:

I've been thinking of picking up an FRS, some wheels with stickies and just doing DE stuff from now on. 10x the fun, real driving and oh yeah, I'm not terrified of hitting the wall and having a bad day.

[BoostSlideWayz]

Personally this post is how ive always thought about drifting.

I like just trying to get the most out of the factory engine, trans, and other components ...

i dont like all the crazy swaps, the outrageous chassis work, the huge amounts of power. Its just all over compensating for the lack of skill... Im not trying to say m skilled because i know i have little to no skill compared to others. But im just tired of seeing so many people instantly look to just swapping in a V8 or some other cop out to make power.

What i love about Japan and their style, is just taking any engine or stock car and making it perform amazingly..

Thats why the cars i have, i dont intend on swaping some different motor in to make power.. i like to actually make the factory engine perform to its best ability.

[!Zar!]

News flash: Stock 240's in Japan are more expensive than in America.

[mechanicalmoron]

Really what i want to know is why does everyone that drifts have to build a complete race car to slide in any kind of non pro competitive event. i feel like people dump so much money into things like tubed front ends and things like that. it looks like such a waste cuz really you don't need it. plus i feel like people spend so much money doing things like that, that it makes them more scared to tandem close together or going all out cuz they dont want to wreak the car.

plus all these overly built cars break way more then dudes with simple stuff.

btw i do realize that not everyone is doing this but it seems to be happening more.

When people put work into their cars, they value and respect them.

How horrible?

[tricky_ab]

That's because most people miss the whole point about drifting and that's to have fun.

Most are either like, 'fuck yeah, I'm going to go and crash my car into a wall, because it's SICK!'

Some are like, 'I can't drift because I need more parts to compensate due to lack of track time.'

While a bunch of other are like, 'I don't want to drift unless it's ProAM, because I want to be pro!'

This sums it up for me rather well.

this. Although I did see megan racing parts on yahoo japan! NOOOOO the cancer is spreading. lol just playing around. I wonder how japan people feel about those parts though. Do they think they are junk also?

If I were you, I would not look (I don't know if you can read Japanese or not) at any Drift Tengoku or Option/Option 2 magazines from Japan. They have full page colour ads. It's nothing new to see them have the whole back page spread. They also seem to be in the "new parts" section monthly.

Megan sales must be doing well world wide, because they sponsor the crap out of various D1SL/Drift muscle cars. They also advertise at the smaller drift events.

Stick your head in the sand, and forget about it...

[Nissansota240]

Most are either like, 'fuck yeah, I'm going to go and crash my car into a wall, because it's SICK!

At one event I witnessed a dude doing donuts around a cone with every revolution tracking out farther towrads the wall, till maybe the 10th or so pass finally smashed his rear end and quarter into the k rail. Then later he proceeded to let every know about his sick wall tap he did.

WTF is the sense in that shit.

[Corbic]

At one event I witnessed a dude doing donuts around a cone with every revolution tracking out farther towrads the wall, till maybe the 10th or so pass finally smashed his rear end and quarter into the k rail. Then later he proceeded to let every know about his sick wall tap he did.

WTF is the sense in that shit.

Because Drift Mizzall brah why you gotta be hatn? U like hallaween in Sanfran - bag full of dicks.

[ayuaddict]

News flash: Stock 240's in Japan are more expensive than in America.

I see what you did there.

[brndck]

Because Drift Mizzall brah why you gotta be hatn? U like hallaween in Sanfran - bag full of dicks.

:bowrofl: truth.

[sleepyS14se]

Seems to me that Japan builds cars to be cool but primarily to be driven.
USA builds cars to obtain e-glory and then part out.

^ this is a very accurate statement, I agree with this. Seems like almost half the threads you see start off with someone who is dumping money into a s chassis and once ya get tired of reading, You end skipping to the last page and BAMM there is a photo of some other car and the OP explains they are now parting it out and please check out their FS thread

A common misconception is that only US folks build for e-fame. Japanese folks are almost the same. The difference is Japanese builds are for the builder and not for the people following. Whereas Americans do it to feel better about themselves.

We do mod the cars to feel better about ourselves but at the same time you have others who do it strictly for the attention from online viewers and what not.

The difference is that when a person in Japan modifies a car on the cheap, there is a chance that it may still come out being cool, while an American car modded on the cheap is more prone to look like the Dorisha Thread.

i hate to have to ask this but what the hell is dorisha??!

(i have a s14 and do not know all of the nissan lingo yet, i still suffer from honda on the brain)

[xoxide]

i hate to have to ask this but what the hell is dorisha??!

(i have a s14 and do not know all of the nissan lingo yet, i still suffer from honda on the brain)
A worse trend than hellaflush...

Go look at the thread, its pretty much the atrocity of bozo styling.

[ayuaddict]

White kids think "dorisha" means S13 on 15" wheels.

or something.

[xoxide]

White kids think "dorisha" means S13 on 15" wheels.

or something.
hahahahahaha

[Nissansota240]

So I came across this the other day, figured I'd share it on here. Also, most of MN drift community has never heard or even seen this dude drive. But its pretty hard to watch this video, dudes pretty full of himself.

P2BDY3jGwd8

[chris_240sx]

^
There is already a thread about that kid/video.

http://zilvia.net/f/off-topic-chat/542188-what-s-wrong-kids-these-days-must-watch.html

[Nissansota240]

^
There is already a thread about that kid/video.

http://zilvia.net/f/off-topic-chat/542188-what-s-wrong-kids-these-days-must-watch.html

Bet it would blow your mind to know that I posted that video before that tread was created.




http://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Denzel-Washington-Boom-Gif.gif

Boom!