Bought an sr20det for $200! A few questions.

[sr2086]

I posted this in the engine tech first instead of general on accident.
Ok so I just got a hell of a steal on this sr20det. I picked up everything here for 200 dollars, which you can't really see but it included transmission, flywheel, and all sorts of misc. parts. I have a few questions and probably more too come I have searched through many topics and found a lot of pictures but I'd rather my direct issues be addressed if possible. Any help is appreciated.
http://i.imgur.com/Tdzbwek.jpg


My first question is the black circle is where my oil feed line to the turbo should go correct? if so we have some problems there... and the blue circle is where my coolant line goes correct? doesn't look like anything is going there. correct me if I'm wrong please.
http://i.imgur.com/pApdlPT.jpg


When I looked at my head I saw this.. It almost looks like someone took a punch and started hitting the end of it with a hammer... they aren't very deep but I am wondering if this will affect the head? When looking through the parts I found a piston with part of the skirt missing but it doesn't look damaged anywhere else throughout the head or block..
http://i.imgur.com/l9RmpWZ.jpg

[Kingtal0n]

It was a steal, but here is what I would do. Part it out piece by piece. I see about $1000 sitting there. Then, use that money to buy a more complete engine.

transmission $250
Flywheel/clutch/plate $100
Head with springs/valves $350~
Valve cover $80-$100
Front cover, intake, exhaust manifold $100
Empty DET block that needs work $250??
CAS $100

Yeah you should be able to get $1000 back, use ebay

Worth more if you have the wiring/ecu/turbo/

GENERAL PRICES:
Here is what you would normally expect to pay from a local shop for parts:
Shortblock $500
Longblock $800
Wiring $100
ECU $100
CAS $100
T-25 turbo $150~
T-28 turbo $350~
Transmission $250
Clutch/flywheel/plate $100~
Complete engine $1800-2000

[sr2086]

I do have the ecu as well and I just looked through the bucket of parts and found a set of mahle pistons I'm running the part numbers right now to see size and what not... I would rather not sell it seeing as its already all apart I can just do a full rebuild on it and piece it together, instead of tearing apart one that I would pay 4x as much for

these are the pistons that I just found in the box of parts
http://www.cnc-motorsports.com/mahle-nis253405i12-forged-inverted-dome-pistons-86-5mm-bore.html

[Kingtal0n]

It is very difficult to properly build an SR20 in the USA. If you let mazworx do the job... then it might come out nice. Otherwise, I would just go for a complete engine and save the hassle.

I am not suggesting you tear anything apart. I am suggesting you buy a complete engine and run it as it sits. You should be able to afford one if you sell off those parts.

It actually depends upon your patience, pockets, and tools/workspace. If you have a large garage with all of the right tools and plenty of money to drop then parting together a longblock and blowing up a few rebuilt engines is fine. Because that is what it will take. Also, it will take time. Patience. You are looking at weeks of work.


Otherwise, if you are poor (like me) and just want to drive your car instead of working on it ALOT, sell all that stuff, buy a complete engine, and be driving a reliable car in two or three days of work.

[zerodameaon]

^^ Wait what? Not sure what SRs you have been building but they are not hard to build. Everything is pretty easy to get ahold of and its no more difficult than a KA.

[Kingtal0n]

Okay, there are different ways to approach the subject. Building an SR20DET is not hard, if you have the right tools of course. I doubt the op has the right tools, and the right tools will cost as much as a complete engine, if not more. I assume you've built some sr20's then? Where are they and how many miles have you got on them? Its one thing to talk, to look through an FSM and say "hey, thats not that hard..." And a completely other thing to go for it, and test it in a daily driver for 100,000 miles with no problems.

[sr2086]

I don't know why you would automatically think I don't have tools? The question at hand wasn't what I should do with this awesome deal.. I was asking about the coolant feed lines that look nonexistent and the oil feed line that looks like someone fipg'd it shut...
If you notice my name its sr2086... putting an sr20 in an 86 corrola is already a job and a half.. why would I go half ass and not build my own motor? I'm not new to the game.. just never had an sr.
Sorry if this reply came off as hostile.

[Kingtal0n]

I don't know why you would automatically think I don't have tools? The question at hand wasn't what I should do with this awesome deal.. I was asking about the coolant feed lines that look nonexistent and the oil feed line that looks like someone fipg'd it shut...
If you notice my name its sr2086... putting an sr20 in an 86 corrola is already a job and a half.. why would I go half ass and not build my own motor? I'm not new to the game.. just never had an sr.
Sorry if this reply came off as hostile.

You own a proper dial bore gauge? A deck plate? A tig welder? micrometers? professional torque wrenches? Then go for it.

I bet you skip the micrometer and bore gauge and use only plastigauge. I bet you skip the tig welder and use a helicoil and rely on chinese plumbing. You probably do own a torque wrench, though.

I also bet you build the engine, and it doesnt last 2000 miles. It spins a bearing because it was assembled somewhere unclean or the bearings are egg shaped. Sorry if this post seems hostile, I have seen this happen again and again for 10 years.

[sr2086]

You own a proper dial bore gauge? A deck plate? A tig welder? micrometers? professional torque wrenches? Then go for it.

Yes.
Also, the block has already been redone.. just ready for reassembly.

Here are some pictures of the set of pistons I found laying in the box of parts.
http://i.imgur.com/5WQP9uM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/82RD9SD.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/hoaEcWc.jpg

[sr2086]

You own a proper dial bore gauge? A deck plate? A tig welder? micrometers? professional torque wrenches? Then go for it.

I bet you skip the micrometer and bore gauge and use only plastigauge. I bet you skip the tig welder and use a helicoil and rely on chinese plumbing. You probably do own a torque wrench, though.

I also bet you build the engine, and it doesnt last 2000 miles. It spins a bearing because it was assembled somewhere unclean or the bearings are egg shaped. Sorry if this post seems hostile, I have seen this happen again and again for 10 years.

You seem to know a lot but have still failed to answer my questions. I appreciate your negativity and ignorance though.
Remember when you had 3 posts? Is this payback for the elder that tried to shit on you?

[Kingtal0n]

You seem to know a lot but have still failed to answer my questions. I appreciate your negativity and ignorance though.
Remember when you had 3 posts? Is this payback for the elder that tried to shit on you?

If you actually own those tools then I dont see the problem. Measure the block, measure your parts, and put it together. If you measure the block right, And the parts right, I can almost guarantee it was done wrong. For instance, to bore the block, you would want a deck plate put down with head studs, torqued to spec, right? SO if that was done, then you must ALSO know the torque spec that was used WHEN it was done. You also need the hardware. (seeing how you just bought the engine, you probably have no clue how tight the studs were, or even if studs were used at all... not to mention you probably dont know if a torque plate was used). See what I am saying? I was trying to save you the hassle/headache of failure after failure.

I am fully in support of properly building the engine. But if you have that knowledge and experience, which is what it takes, more than just fancy tools; the skill to use those tools plays a role. Then you do not need ANYBODYS HELP from any FORUM. You are not going to get sound advice here in this place. Zilvia is the last place I would ask for help building an engine, any engine.

[sr2086]

I am not asking anyone to build my engine nor how to build my engine, I AM however asking if those are my coolant and oil lines or if they change within year. I don't know why you are SO assured that everything that was previously done to this was done wrong... they couldn't have taken it to a shop? That must be unheard of I mean since I'm new to this forum it must mean whoever I got it from didn't have any clue what they were doing. I just wish you would stop worrying about the build and answer the questions since you seem to know so much.

[Kingtal0n]

Ill try to help with the block. That looks like a fail JB weld attempt. Is that JB weld, sir? Someone probably stripped the oil threads, tried to fix it with JB weld, and failed, possibly sending metal shaving into the oil passages which permanently ruins the block and all future attempts at rebuilding it. The forged pistons looks to me like the previous owner ruined the engine due to oil shaving, figured he would "fix" the engine by rebuilding it with forged pistons, (might as well) and failed again due to the same metal shavings. I have a feeling if you attempt to build that block you will have the same exact issue. Spun bearings due to metal shaving in the oil passages.

Seen it before.

And it probably clogged the passages in the head that lead to the area over the cams as well. I would get rid of that block/head. No sense taking the chance, since its not hard to source another redtop that hasnt been ruined.

furthermore, I dont see coolant passages for the turbo, but I could be blind. I believe you have a naturally aspirated engine that was converted. At first I wasnt so sure because you have coilpacks on the engine and I assume a #62 ecu. But nevertheless, the block doesn't lie. Unless I am not seeing it correctly. Check for piston oil squirters, I thought N/A engines didnt have them. But I dont know anything about N/A sr20 engines ive never even seen one. It looks like it has the turbo oil return. I must not be seeing it right, there should be two coolant passages for turbo water lines. They dont move per year. Also, it has a CAS which Is a turbo engine thing. So it must be a DET... Hmmm did somebody JB weld the coolant passages shut?!

Seriously, if there is anything i can do to help, let me know. I will bend over backwards for people Ive never met, thats just what I do. I just want to help you avoid mistakes that Ive made.

[zerodameaon]

Okay, there are different ways to approach the subject. Building an SR20DET is not hard, if you have the right tools of course. I doubt the op has the right tools, and the right tools will cost as much as a complete engine, if not more. I assume you've built some sr20's then? Where are they and how many miles have you got on them? Its one thing to talk, to look through an FSM and say "hey, thats not that hard..." And a completely other thing to go for it, and test it in a daily driver for 100,000 miles with no problems.

So by your logic any engine is hard to build, not just the SR in the US vs Japan. By your wording you make it sound as if you are talking about the supply of parts and what not, not buying the equipment to build one in your garage. Hell that would be hard in Japan as well because the equipment is expensive anywhere. Also I know of a few SRs beyond the one I help with that were assembled in garages that have not had a single issue in the last few years since completion. Me and a friend put one together and its at 25k and still kickin like a OEM build. That was after a complete engine went out on him 3k after swap. Seller advertised engine with only 50,000km.
If you have built any other engine you can figure out a SR/KA/RB etc. as long as you can read.

As for coolant lines they should all be the same for the series of engine you have, IIRC they only changed when they went to S14 or 15 or other chassis. S13 SRs take coolant from the passenger side of the engine and run it around the back of the engine and into the turbo and not from that blue circled spot. If they are removed and in the pile of parts they would not be present in the picture. As for oil feed take a closer picture of it, JB weld to fix the threads would not explain why it is completely filled in.

[Sileighty_85]

You own a proper dial bore gauge? A deck plate? A tig welder? micrometers? professional torque wrenches? Then go for it.

I bet you skip the micrometer and bore gauge and use only plastigauge. I bet you skip the tig welder and use a helicoil and rely on chinese plumbing. You probably do own a torque wrench, though.

I also bet you build the engine, and it doesnt last 2000 miles. It spins a bearing because it was assembled somewhere unclean or the bearings are egg shaped. Sorry if this post seems hostile, I have seen this happen again and again for 10 years.

I know this sounds crazy but there is actually these shops Called "Machine Shops" that's ran by professionals that have these tools.

I used plasti guage for my bearings. 5 years of drifting, 40K Miles, and 10+ 400 mile trips above 2,600 RPM's and my SR is just fine.

Weird....



OP that block looks to be a DE block someone tried to convert to DET

Look to see if the cylinders have oil squirters, If not then its def a DE block.

[EsChassisLove]

I've never seen S13 SR DET pistons with valve notches. Correct me if I'm wrong but those go to the SR20DE? Higher comp?

[fliprayzin240sx]

I know this sounds crazy but there is actually these shops Called "Machine Shops" that's ran by professionals that have these tools.

I used plasti guage for my bearings. 5 years of drifting, 40K Miles, and 10+ 400 mile trips above 2,600 RPM's and my SR is just fine.

Weird....



OP that block looks to be a DE block someone tried to convert to DET

Look to see if the cylinders have oil squirters, If not then its def a DE block.

Lies, there is no such thing called "Machine Shop". Those sounds like some imaginary shit you've made up. KingTalon seriously need to stop using bathsalts.

[mr.nismo.]

I think he has a de block that PO tried to turn into det block. It's in pieces. PO probably bought the block and head and tried the conversion and it was too hard for him so he sold it to the OP. that oil drain looks like it has jb weld. I'm not too sure though

[casperiv]

That doesn't look like a DET at all. The block and pistons look like they are both from a DE engine and the weirdness of the block looks like someone was trying to be a garage engineer and make a DET from a DE. I almost wonder if they were trying to make a DET head to a DE block...

[Kingtal0n]

I know this sounds crazy but there is actually these shops Called "Machine Shops" that's ran by professionals that have these tools.

I used plasti guage for my bearings. 5 years of drifting, 40K Miles, and 10+ 400 mile trips above 2,600 RPM's and my SR is just fine.

Weird....



OP that block looks to be a DE block someone tried to convert to DET

Look to see if the cylinders have oil squirters, If not then its def a DE block.

Sometimes you get lucky. It happened to me- Ive slapped a few together without measuring anything and they ran fine when I was 19 years old. Others, not so good. Same goes for machine shops, I've had bottom ends put together that were ok but the machine shop screwed something else up, leaving behind metal shaving for instance. Or leaving something loose like the two bolts at the front of the head. Heck, one machine shop bled all of the lifters full of air and actually told me to my face after I showed him the FSM where it says they need to be full of oil, not air, that it was "standard practice" and that "priming the engine" would fill the lifters.

Most machine shops in America can not be trusted, sorry to say it. Trying to help the op avoid getting one of those nasty machine shops and making a mistake.


Lies, there is no such thing called "Machine Shop". Those sounds like some imaginary shit you've made up. KingTalon seriously need to stop using bathsalts.

I wrapped up some soap that looked like fudge and labeled it fudge and mailed it to a friend. I hope she takes a bite, then has something to come hurt me about.

[sr2086]

Most machine shops in America can not be trusted, sorry to say it. Trying to help the op avoid getting one of those nasty machine shops and making a mistake.

Please, Almighty One, come put my block together.

[sr2086]

Ok so here is the verdict it looks like the oil squirters ARE indeed nonexistent.
http://i.imgur.com/ty9SSby.jpg
Now my question here is can this DE block still be used? The oil squirters are just used to cool down the overall piston temp correct? so if I run say those forged pistons for instance it should be fine?



As for those pistons I posted a picture of those are sr20det pistons the part number on them matches the DET part number when I looked it up.

The previous owner that had this had it for 3 years and never put it together. The owner before him had it and it was running but it deff had some detonation... big time.

[zerodameaon]

If you are concerned you can always pick up another block, it is not going to be astronomically priced because SRs are everywhere.

[codyace]

You can certainly use that, no worries on the squirters at all. If the rest of the bottom end looks good, you can fab you own feed/return lines without issue.

With that said by the time you make sure it's all ok to use, and to work, you may be better off selling parts and getting a DET block that is known good.

[SupaDoopa]

Proof is in the pudding. You ended up with a DE block that like Cody said can be used with enough custom fab and know how. You may be better off selling the block locally to some Sentra kids building for boost and locating a nice block somewhere either on Zilvia or a local drift forum. There are a lot of morons out there selling things that look like they fit the part but are slightly off or damaged.

[babowc]

Sometimes you get lucky. It happened to me- Ive slapped a few together without measuring anything and they ran fine when I was 19 years old. Others, not so good. Same goes for machine shops, I've had bottom ends put together that were ok but the machine shop screwed something else up, leaving behind metal shaving for instance. Or leaving something loose like the two bolts at the front of the head. Heck, one machine shop bled all of the lifters full of air and actually told me to my face after I showed him the FSM where it says they need to be full of oil, not air, that it was "standard practice" and that "priming the engine" would fill the lifters.

Most machine shops in America can not be trusted, sorry to say it. Trying to help the op avoid getting one of those nasty machine shops and making a mistake.




I wrapped up some soap that looked like fudge and labeled it fudge and mailed it to a friend. I hope she takes a bite, then has something to come hurt me about.

Jesus Christ.
Shut the fuck up.

OP, I'd follow the recommendations and source a different longblock. At the minimum, you'll make money by selling off those pieces.

[Kingtal0n]

Jesus Christ.
Shut the fuck up.

OP, I'd follow the recommendations and source a different longblock. At the minimum, you'll make money by selling off those pieces.

How is that different from my advice from 3 weeks ago

It was a steal, but here is what I would do. Part it out piece by piece. I see about $1000 sitting there. Then, use that money to buy a more complete engine.




seriously, you just told yourself to stfu. good job coming in 3 weeks late and copying my advice.

[babowc]

How is that different from my advice from 3 weeks ago





seriously, you just told yourself to stfu. good job coming in 3 weeks late and copying my advice.

Shut the fuck up please.

[Kingtal0n]

shut the fuck up please.

umadbrah? Umad?

[!Zar!]

Reading this thread makes me feel like I feel back into the early 2000's or something.

SR parts can be found anywhere.

They can be rebuilt anywhere.

Shit's just an engine. Nothing special.

[ultimateforce]

Haha, yes only Mazworx has cracked the code of assembling a SR20. It is still a mystery to everyone else.

[Mikester]

Haha, yes only Mazworx has cracked the code of assembling a SR20. It is still a mystery to everyone else.

^^Yup...

For those who are not aware:

It's because there is only one sensei and one apprentice per generation that Mazworx keeps locked up in their on-site bell tower. If you even TRY to call Mazworx to ask how to build an SR yourself; the last thing you will ever see is the cold stare of the ninja they will send to kill you. Some things are better left a mystery...

:bow: