Just change fuel pump, later on my car runs rough

[monkey7]

I'm about to check it tomorrow, but I was wondering if any one ran into the problems I had?

My fuel pump gave out on me, so 2 days later I replace it with one I got at Pep boys. After the install it kind of shaked for a bit, then ran well. 8hrs later, I drive home from work which is 50 miles going at 65 to 75 mph. A block away from my house, it started to run rough. Then idle low and was about to die. It started to smell like gas from the exhaust, so I shut it down. But I didn't see any smoke. Any clues?

I guess my 89 ka24e is just getting old? But damn, I just changed the spark plugs, cap and rotor, fuel filter, master cylinder, water pump, thermostat before I had to replace the fuel pump.

Any helpful advice would be appreciated.
thanks!

[Dream240]

I just upgraded my s14 pump to the Walbro pump, and there's one thing you have to recheck. If you're smelling fuel then you don't have a good seal on the pump. I'm sure the access panel is located in the trunk, pop that back open, and unscrew the plastic locking ring. Then check the rubber seal that sits between the fuel tank opening and the plastic pump unit(I forget what it's called) with the 3 hoses connected to it. Basically it's the only rubber piece that sits in that area. It could be hard to notice because it normally will sit inside the ring and as you pull the pump assembly out, it will just stay put. Maybe yours isn't set right, or maybe it fell into the tank and you didn't even notice. You'll see what I mean when you pull it apart.

Note: you do no need to remove the fuel pump assembly all together!!

The reason I think this is your problem is because of the smell, also that rubber seal provides the vaccumm needed for the pump to work properly, so yeah it would sputter like that if your fuel tank pressure is bad.

Try this and let me know.

[monkey7]

I think your right. Cause that rubber ring expanded and we cut it to fit. I didn't think so much that just a little gap can do much to the vaccumm. So I will check it out and get a new one.

thanks

[Dream240]

I think your right. Cause that rubber ring expanded and we cut it to fit. I didn't think so much that just a little gap can do much to the vaccumm. So I will check it out and get a new one.

thanks

:confused: Whoa whoa, you cut it? WHY GOD WHY? it expanded? You mean it came out and when you tried to put it back it didn't seem to fit?

So you decided to cut it? Cut it how? Expanded how? That's molded rubber if it expands it's still going to retain it's shape! it'll just APPEAR not to fit. Mine did the same thing a few minutes playing with it and it popped right in!!

Get that fixed!! PRONTO! You can have serious problems with inhaling the fumes while driving, get all high, slam into another car and not even realize it!!

Dude just a piece of advice, NEVER cut, burn, weld, stretch, twist, or eat a seal that goes anywhere on your car. They're all there to provide a 100% pressurized seal, if it's cut even in the smallest way, it'll fail to do it's job.

[monkey7]

mmmm, gasket seal. hee hee hee

Yea, I cut it to fit. I just got another one from the dealer. So I will put it on and see if it runs good.

[Dream240]

Yeah it should fit perfect.

Just wondering, how come you went with stock replacement?

And how much did you pay for the new pump?

[monkey7]

I bought it for 120, I know I could have went walbro. But I needed one right away before they tow my car. It was in the streets.

But now what sucks, its blowing white smoke that smells like gas and it idles like crap. I just changed the spark plugs cause the others were fouled (black/carbon?). I also put the new gasket on, it works but I have a new problem.

Maybe the car leaned out cause of fuel problems in the beginning. I dunno, do you have any thoughts.

[Dream240]

:duh: Man you just can't get a brake!

Well, the first thing I would say to do is drive it around again a little see if you can still smell gas, if you can, then maybe you sliced or tore one of the hoses back there in the fuel pump area while you were working on it? Check your fuel filter to see if you're leaking around there.

Are you sure you put ALL the connections on correctly? Every hose back properly and the electrical connection is properly and securely fastened?

Double check all those. Cause I'm sure it wasn't driving like this before you replaced the pump. Also what brand is it? The pump I mean.

Is the car still sputtering at idle?

[monkey7]

I checked everything twice. Its still strange. The pump, I still have the box I dunno the brand off the top of my head, but is sounds like its still running. I'm going to play with it tomorrow.

But your right, it was running like a champ before all this.

Hey thanks for the support! I owe you one. Are you in the Bay Area?

[Dream240]

Yeah, I work up here and drive back to So Cali on the weekends. 430 miles of sheer boredom. I try to only travel down twice a month cause I just can't handle the drive by myself every Friday.

So you did pull the pump out of the tank and check all the connections? Did you use new fuel hose for the connection from the pump to the bracket? Was the hose bulged or cracked at all? If the hoses look even a little worn, replace them!! The other thing is see if the pick up net (the piece connected to the bottom of the pump) is set right. If it's folded or kinked down there then it'll really affect fuel flow. When I did mine I had to twist and turn the assembly in the tank to get the pick up net to go in straight. It's a real tight fit for it.

Other than that, does it still blow white smoke? Did you drive it around and still no change in it's performance and idle? hmmm.....

[sykikchimp]

White smoke is usually coolant... Gas is black, and oil is blue.

Check you coolant, and look for chocolate milk, and oil slicks. If you see anything, drain your oil, and look for water.

find water, then your head gasket is blown. If the car leaned out, and detonated, it could have easily blown the headgasket.

[monkey7]

Wow my luck sucks with this car. But its ok. The coolant resevoir is funky chocolate milk color. But not the coolant in the radiator is still green. I check the oil inside the engine for globs of junk, but it looks fine. I did a compression check: 1-120 2-150 3-150 4-150, whats stange is cylinder one's spark plug was wet, not black like the others. Its smell like gas but it did not evaporate that quickly. So maybe I have water mixed in also. Junk!



But all I can assume that its broke. Maybe I can change the head gasket. It might be a learning experience thats not fun. hee hee hee

thanks dream240, sykikchimp

[Dream240]

White smoke is usually coolant... Gas is black, and oil is blue.

Check you coolant, and look for chocolate milk, and oil slicks. If you see anything, drain your oil, and look for water.

find water, then your head gasket is blown. If the car leaned out, and detonated, it could have easily blown the headgasket.

I didn't think about that. But yeah, since your fuel pump replacement went south, with the gasket issues, causing you to run lean, thus blowing the head gasket? OUCH!!! :duh:

Makes sense though, and the wetness you found on the No. 1 spark plug is most likely moisture(water). Moisture, that's bad....umkay....

So I would completely drain the oil at this point and check for water deposits, and after it's drained, replace the head gasket?!

Honestly though isn't it funny how one little rubber piece (fuel tank gasket) that seems so insignificant can cause so much damage?

[monkey7]

Wow, I know now not to mess with gaskets. At least it got me home so I can start on diognostic/repairs.

Whats strange is that today (saturday/17) I ran the car for about 10 to 15 min, The car idle fine, but the engine shook hard when I reved it at 3000 with plenty of white smoke that smelled like fuel.

I took the radiator cap off to see if there was air bubbles comming out, but it just overflowed a bit. Next to that, the temp guage remained at the same when it was working fine, around the 1/4 to 1/2 way mark. Checked if there was any electricity sent to the spark plugs and it was fine.

But damn white smoke. Thats junk! Time to get a fsm cause the chilton is kind of general.

[Dream240]

Wow, I know now not to mess with gaskets. At least it got me home so I can start on diognostic/repairs.

Whats strange is that today (saturday/17) I ran the car for about 10 to 15 min, The car idle fine, but the engine shook hard when I reved it at 3000 with plenty of white smoke that smelled like fuel.

I took the radiator cap off to see if there was air bubbles comming out, but it just overflowed a bit. Next to that, the temp guage remained at the same when it was working fine, around the 1/4 to 1/2 way mark. Checked if there was any electricity sent to the spark plugs and it was fine.

But damn white smoke. Thats junk! Time to get a fsm cause the chilton is kind of general.

The hard shake is probably that cylinder that's not firing correctly. I'm still betting it's your head gasket. Did you drain the oil and look for water deposits? Any bubble looking shapes in your oil is.....water!! That's a very definite sign of head gasket issues.

[monkey7]

I'm gonna check on that during the week, I'll drain the oil and check for water. I have been reading up on how to do a head gasket. I'm pushing myself to do it for experience. But lazy cause its my day off. I'll I want to do is relax.

I read the fsm for a 93 dohc and the chilton for my car, I'm also looking at purchasing a fsm for my car (89 sohc) cause its more specific for my car.

Do you think I should return the fuel pump I have and go walbro (my car is all stock though/so its kind of useless/maybe)? I feel like I can't trust the one I have? But then again its working.

[Dream240]

I'm gonna check on that during the week, I'll drain the oil and check for water. I have been reading up on how to do a head gasket. I'm pushing myself to do it for experience. But lazy cause its my day off. I'll I want to do is relax.

I read the fsm for a 93 dohc and the chilton for my car, I'm also looking at purchasing a fsm for my car (89 sohc) cause its more specific for my car.

Do you think I should return the fuel pump I have and go walbro (my car is all stock though/so its kind of useless/maybe)? I feel like I can't trust the one I have? But then again its working.

Honestly, why not? I mean are you ever going to upgrade to an SR20 or turbo KA? If so you're going to need it, and why waste 120 bucks on something that's not going to resell for that. I picked up a Walbro on eBay for 85.00 plus 10.00 shipping!! Cheaper and better!!

This of course is my opinion, I feel that going with the best possible is always choice #1.

Here's a link to an auction: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2474386617&category=33555&sspagename=WDVW

There you go buy it now and save!!

Also, the only thing I should tell you is you aget a very slight hum from the fuel pump, just because it's a racing pump meant for turbos. That little sucker pumps 255 lph!! So it's gonna make some noise. It's very minimal though, I only hear it when my car is at idle and the radio is off with the windows rolled up. No biggie!

But yeah let me know if you find anything in your oil!!

Good luck with the job.

[monkey7]

Good looking out, I was seen this pump for $115 + shipping at various sites. I just e-mailed him asking if there is any cons for running it on a stock motor for now. And maybe down the line, my ka is going turbo. You read my mine!

I'll keep you updated, I will try to document this thing for my own. Just in case I mess up, I can look back.

[Dream240]

Good looking out, I was seen this pump for $115 + shipping at various sites. I just e-mailed him asking if there is any cons for running it on a stock motor for now. And maybe down the line, my ka is going turbo. You read my mine!

I'll keep you updated, I will try to document this thing for my own. Just in case I mess up, I can look back.

Wel to answer your question, not it will not hurt your engine or any other component of your car IF installed properly!! :)

And let me just add, that this pump made a hell of a difference to my cars performance and gas mileage. I used to get this lag in 1st & 2nd gears when I would slam the pedal, now it just pulls hard and steady through the band.

My thinking is this: Since I have alot of upgrades, CAI, header, high flow cat, exhaust, upgraded ignition; I have increased my air flow - both intake and exhaust, but I've done nothing to my fuel delivery. So with all that air but the same amount of fuel at the same fuel pressure = leaning out.

I've also got an OBX Fuel pressure regulator that I still need to install because I want to increase my fuel pressure about 20 psi and see if that helps even more.

So, basically you will be fine, and you will also be adding that extra insurance to your engine of PLENTY of fuel to meet any future needs!!

Good luck on the repairs hope it fixes your problem.

[hurleyboi514]

if your intake manifold gasket is bad, it will leak water into the first cylinder. i changed my intake manifold to a 95 with the emissions removed and i creased the gasket on it, and it was pouring water into the first cyinder b/c the water jacket is right there. so, i cut that part off and used RTV and now its fine. but at the time, it seemed just like a head gasket problem...

[monkey7]

thanks hurleyboi514, i'll check that out!

[Dream240]

if your intake manifold gasket is bad, it will leak water into the first cylinder. i changed my intake manifold to a 95 with the emissions removed and i creased the gasket on it, and it was pouring water into the first cyinder b/c the water jacket is right there. so, i cut that part off and used RTV and now its fine. but at the time, it seemed just like a head gasket problem...

I had to replace my upper intake manifold altogether once because where the upper radiator hose connects to it, there's a little pipe that hangs off the upper hose connection. And there's a small coolant hose attached to that. Damn metal piece had a Shi*ty welding job and just broke off!! ARGGHHH!!
That job was something I don't care to do again!! One thing to note with bad intake manifold gaskets is you will definitely get a vaccumm leak problem and very erratic idle. The idle will jump around from 250 to 750. It might do this periodically or all the time, varies with the severity of the leak. So if you've got idling issues, then that's a definite place to start! Good tip Hurleyboi.

Oh also just remember if you DO remove the upper manifold, get brand new manifold gaskets (two of them total) and make sure you label EVERY hose, wire, various other connection that attaches to your fuel rail, manifold, block etc. Color code them if you have to, trust me you don't want to accidently reverse to vaccumm hoses, I did it...engine light+shuttering engine+Nissan dealer visit to fix = not fun. :duh: