custom c pillar bar

[s14unimog]

This is made from 3/4" piping with welded 1/8" steel ends

[Jeff240sx]

This is made from 3/4" piping with welded 2/8" steel ends

I don't see any purpose to that, other than breaking things. 2/8" = 1/4", which in my opinion, isn't strong enough to be welded to a hollow pipe and maintain rigidity. Also, I know for a fact that the metal tabs resting on the ABS plastic trim, there is quite a bit of "give" before the plastic hits the metal car body.
I am not a suspension designer, but to me, you'd need solid pipe and a bit thicker tabs, resting on bare metal. Good thought though.
-Jeff

[HyperTek]

driving impressions??

[s14unimog]

ok well if you know anything about the rear seat belt then you would know that the bar isn't resting on the plastic :loco: and the end brakets are very strong so it works good. Also driving impressions are it feels a little stiffer in the rear also I noticed the back steps out easier.

[ryan hagen]

being that u have a trunk and you have a metal deck 5" below it i doubt that did anyhting, maybe a rear strut tower bar and you would be good. they put those in hatch backs cause they dont have a trunk deck lid and have extra flex.i use 3/4" pipe when i made my hatch bar and it was too flexible to make a differnce, so yours really would be too flimsy, lol, that should not make your rear step out easier, that one of those things like the "butt dyno"

[phrozen]

^ wouldnt make much difference on a s14, plus your piping isnt big or strong enough, and those end brackets look flimsy... if i were you i would have used solid steel or solid aluminum a few pounds in the back isnt goign to hurt ur car and it will help with some weight int he back

[AkiraDrift]

yeah...looks like it wouldn't do much....

[Jeff240sx]

yeah...looks like it wouldn't do much....

I'm glad someone agrees with me. Then again, they didn't just spend an hour and $11 to make it, only to post up and have me call it flimsy.
Really, I meant it as constructive criticism, and the tabs already look deformed (unless you hit them with a hammer).
-Jeff

[Var]

i heard there has to be a lot of preload on a pillar bar to make a difference..IE it has to be really hard to get it in place, so before you bolt it on it should already be pushing out on the pillars.(preload pushing out)

or it shouldn't be touching the pillars so when you bolt them in, it pulls the pillars inward.(preload pulling in)

makes enough sense right?

[s14unimog]

First of all hollow pipe is stronger then solid pipe depending on wall thickness in this case this pipe can handle more weight then a solid 3/4" pipe. And yes the ends have been preloaded when you bolt it in they were pulled twords the c pillar also the brackets are not flexing they have been made that way to follow the line of the trim. I understand some of this is constructive but a lot of you are saying shit you really don't know about. Anyways I wasn't looking for people to comment on it like this. The c pillar bar is an example of something you can do for cheap. Finally who ever said that it couldn't do something that high then your wrong too the metal deck 5" down you talk about is tack welded on anddoes nothing more than support the speaker housing. :fawk2:

[Jeff240sx]

First of all hollow pipe is stronger then solid pipe depending on wall thickness in this case this pipe can handle more weight then a solid 3/4" pipe. And yes the ends have been preloaded when you bolt it in they were pulled twords the c pillar also the brackets are not flexing they have been made that way to follow the line of the trim. I understand some of this is constructive but a lot of you are saying shit you really don't know about. Anyways I wasn't looking for people to comment on it like this. The c pillar bar is an example of something you can do for cheap. Finally who ever said that it couldn't do something that high then your wrong too the metal deck 5" down you talk about is tack welded on anddoes nothing more than support the speaker housing. :fawk2:

Nobody pissed in your cheerios man. Chill the fuck out. If you post something online, expect people to make comments about it. Show some proof that you'd preloaded the ends, show proof that your hollow pipe is stronger than a solid rod, and show how you are not an idiot by posting about the 2/8" tabs. I mean really, you want to start yelling at people for not liking you creation, and simply sit back and say you did things right with no proof.
-Jeff

[ultraprince]

that part isn't the support they are talking about. its at the bottom of the rear glass which is not just tack welded on. but i don't think that bar will be doing anything. imho.

[97DubTruck]

well now i dont understand why people say that this wouldnt do anything. they manufacture these things and sell them for 200 bucks a pop. just because you make something yourself doesn't mean it is not as strong and/or functional.

http://www.240sx.org/atlanta/images/russ2.jpg

here is a picture of a c pillar brace off one of the atl guys' car. why would a company make these if they don't do anything?

i think its a good idea.

[INeedNewTires]

im in the process of constructing one for an S13... its going to be a much simpler design, with no 'tabs' or any weak welded things on it. im basically taking a straight square steel pipe, drilling a hole through it on both sides and bolting it in. ill post a new thread when im done, but its definately worth the $7 bar at lowes. i say its good bang for the buck, even if it doesnt do a whole lot, its better than nothin.

[phrozen]

if hollow pipe is stronger then solid pipe... then how come tie rods arent hollow?

[phrozen]

the whole world should be hollow :p, everyone chill out and relieve some tension :jerkit: ... I wanna good clean fight, now touch gloves and come out punching! :spank: :fawkd:

[s14unimog]

Yeah dude your right this got way to out of control. If you like it you like it, if you don't you don't :) . Anyways I just want to add that because of the bends in the brakets there will be no flex so inturn they wont move around and my welds are nevr weak so that will be good to. But yeah I want to see pictures of others with similar stuff too. Why buy it when you can make it?




Build your on stuff and make your car unique to you
rock on!! :rawk: :rawk:

[Var]

if hollow pipe is stronger then solid pipe... then how come tie rods arent hollow?

cause tie rods are too small in diameter to have thicker walls. roll cages are hollow, a lot of sway bars are hollow, but they aren't "stronger" than solid bars. they do the job though depending on the thickness of the wall.

i'm gonna make a pillar bar out of roll cage tubing. :p

let's see if that's beefy enough to get your respect.

[Var]

This is made from 3/4" piping with welded 1/8" steel ends


how did you measure from hole to hole?. I want to know how much slack you left at each end so there would be preload when you tightened it down. How many tries before you got it to the right length?

[s14unimog]

I constructed one from wood first this way I could be 100% sure when I made the real one. but mine is a little different incase you can't tell it has bends in it so it goes over the rear speaker lid not where some one's head is gunna be.

[Var]

i got a s13 hatch with no back seats so i'm not worried about that. how much slack did you leave on each side for the bolts to pull on?

[s14unimog]

about a 1/2"

[240 2NR]

I did something similar in my S13 fastback and found it to be a good improvement. The seatbelt anchor points face down rather than in, so by being in the same plane I only needed a flat bar to span between them, so I used 1" flat bar stock, roughly 1/8" thick. I reinforced it with a 1" square tube bar. The 1" flat stock fit inside the square bar stock across the inside diagonal, with tack welds in the middle to keep it from rattling and triangular braces at the end tabs. The flat bar then extends just far enough with a hole drilled at each end to fit the seatbelt mounting points (no more rear seatbelts though).

The setup is very rigid and I even used it as a ghetto harness bar at an autocross, though I think it's probably stong enough to hold provided I don't hit someone head on at like 80mph.

I'll try to post pics. Since it's a hatchback with considerably less rigitity than a coupe, it seems to make a big difference in quieting the rattles from the hatch gaskets, particularly when turning into driveways. How much it strengthens the chassis is probably debatable. I've also got a rstb.

[Var]

I did something similar in my S13 fastback and found it to be a good improvement. The seatbelt anchor points face down rather than in, so by being in the same plane I only needed a flat bar to span between them, so I used 1" flat bar stock, roughly 1/8" thick. I reinforced it with a 1" square tube bar. The 1" flat stock fit inside the square bar stock across the inside diagonal, with tack welds in the middle to keep it from rattling and triangular braces at the end tabs. The flat bar then extends just far enough with a hole drilled at each end to fit the seatbelt mounting points (no more rear seatbelts though).

The setup is very rigid and I even used it as a ghetto harness bar at an autocross, though I think it's probably stong enough to hold provided I don't hit someone head on at like 80mph.

I'll try to post pics. Since it's a hatchback with considerably less rigitity than a coupe, it seems to make a big difference in quieting the rattles from the hatch gaskets, particularly when turning into driveways. How much it strengthens the chassis is probably debatable. I've also got a rstb.

hell ya. please post pics so i can try to emulate your design. I got a cp-racing rear triangle strut bar and a roll cage lol but when it comes to me and bars, the more the better.

[INeedNewTires]

man, westbourgoupimp, your gonna love my setup when you see it. its triangulated both from the floor (like the CP racing bar) as well as to that seatbelt bar mounted up top. its like 2 bars and the floor all triangulated together, it whoops some ass. Ill post pics when im done but you might wanna try and fab somethin up yourself. I was also able to retain the seatbelts by just getting alonger bolt with the same thread pitch.

[Bone]

Metallurgy 101: Hollow tubing when compared to solid tubing(both made with the same material) is stronger. Solid tubing has 2 edges to bend hollow tubing has 4 edges to bend. I know it sounds like BS but it's not. Now for the proof. Take a 20 ft piece of carbon steel rod and a 20 ft piece of carbon steel pipe (at least a 3/8 inch wall do to length) both pieces having the same O.D. generally 1 or 2 inch is fine. Place them on a flat level surface above a level floor. Let about 4 ft be attached to lets say a table with clamps. Now measure the difference in height from the floor. The solid stock will be closer. That is a simple way of telling the stress/strength difference first hand. I just wanted to clear that rumor up. I am certified in metallurgy by the way.

[Var]

stronger is a vague term. hotchkis suspension has an article about hollow vs solid sway bars and they admit even though they make em hollow, solid ones are stronger.

[LanceS13]

Metallurgy 101: Hollow tubing when compared to solid tubing(both made with the same material) is stronger. Solid tubing has 2 edges to bend hollow tubing has 4 edges to bend. I know it sounds like BS but it's not. Now for the proof. Take a 20 ft piece of carbon steel rod and a 20 ft piece of carbon steel pipe (at least a 3/8 inch wall do to length) both pieces having the same O.D. generally 1 or 2 inch is fine. Place them on a flat level surface above a level floor. Let about 4 ft be attached to lets say a table with clamps. Now measure the difference in height from the floor. The solid stock will be closer. That is a simple way of telling the stress/strength difference first hand. I just wanted to clear that rumor up. I am certified in metallurgy by the way.

But how much of the extra deflection is attributed to just the weight difference?

[ryan hagen]

Metallurgy 101: Hollow tubing when compared to solid tubing(both made with the same material) is stronger. Solid tubing has 2 edges to bend hollow tubing has 4 edges to bend. I know it sounds like BS but it's not. Now for the proof. Take a 20 ft piece of carbon steel rod and a 20 ft piece of carbon steel pipe (at least a 3/8 inch wall do to length) both pieces having the same O.D. generally 1 or 2 inch is fine. Place them on a flat level surface above a level floor. Let about 4 ft be attached to lets say a table with clamps. Now measure the difference in height from the floor. The solid stock will be closer. That is a simple way of telling the stress/strength difference first hand. I just wanted to clear that rumor up. I am certified in metallurgy by the way.


alot of that is the solid rod has to support its extra weight, the hollow one is lighter, in a short span u wouldnt have as much arch. but the hollow would be stiffer yes but the fatique probally wouldnt be the same?