woo hoo ran the KA-t

[Evil S14]

i went to the track tonite and was very pleased

heres what i have

97 240sx
KA24det stock internals
Garrett T3/TO4E 60 trim compressor, .63 ar turbine
PWR Front Mount IC
TiAL 38 mm WG open dump
370cc injectors
Hacked MAF
3 inch exhaust all wthe way turbo back
Apexi n1 dual

6psi, no LSD
2.0 60'
[email protected] mph

open diff on 195/55 tires on stock steelies
full interior including spare tire

:boink:

[Mugen13]

nice time. your car must be a total sleeper w/ your steelies. :)

isn't that faster than a SR @ 6psi? how much did you spend on your setup?

[orion::S14]

Originally posted by Evil S14
...Hacked MAF


Cool. Another sucessful Hacked-MAF...

What size piping do you use, and what is your timing set at???

- Brian

[orion::S14]

Originally posted by Mugen13
isn't that faster than a SR @ 6psi???

HAHAHAHAHA!!!! YES!

Redtop SR @ stock boost is ~210 crank HP...that's maybe 185rwhp, which translates into mid-14s at 97-98mph I'd guess. Even with a FMIC, DP, exhaust, etc...at stock boost (7psi), you probably won't see more then 210-215rwhp.

This KA-T setup @ 6psi is closer to 225rwhp based on my dynos @ 6psi, and that trap speed.

Later - Brian

[Zemus]

How much did that whole setup cost you, it wound wonderful, Was their alot of turbo lag?

[kandyflip445]

Ok, this is just to see if I'm absorbing info I've been lookin up right. Wouldn't that turbo get close to full boost around ~3500-4000RPM? If that's wrong could you tell me why? Trying to learn a little until I go buy Max. Boost.

Great #'s man. I think I'm gonna look up some stuff on Hacked MAF's unless you and orion or ace would like to share.:bowdown:

[s14xman]

wow thats fast!!

[Evil S14]

Orion, i looked to ur website to inspire me for the hacked MAF, i used a 16 hauhe aluminezed 3 inch pipe, it's ID was ~2.75 and im still running rich

the turbo is a little laggy, you can tell on my runs if u watch because you can see my car just lurch, its not a very linear acceleration, and full boost does come on between 3500-4000 depending on the gear

[orion::S14]

My turbo (basically the same as his, except with a 57-trim) gets 8psi by 3200...

It's sick to gain an extra 90ft/lbs from 2800 to 3200 as boost hits!!!

Later - Brian

[Evil S14]

oh and i was running timing at 18 degrees, seems a little high but im only at 6 psi

[orion::S14]

2.75" was a little on the lean side for me...i.e. 13:1 A/F. You probably have a boost leak if it is in fact rich - Pressure test the intercooler/intake maifold with an air compressor.

And from my experience, 18* timing is fine for 6psi...

Later - Brian

[AceInHole]

nice!!

hacked MAF owns :D

Only problem is: lately I've been running 6psi, and getting +90% airflow.... so I think I may have to move away from the hacked MAF.

this didn't start untill I had the s13 cams in.... but I thought Orion had JWT cams (more aggressive cams?)

so... I may be moving to a z32 MAF or just go MAP by next season....

[Evil S14]

Originally posted by orion::S14
2.75" was a little on the lean side for me...i.e. 13:1 A/F. You probably have a boost leak if it is in fact rich - Pressure test the intercooler/intake maifold with an air compressor.

And from my experience, 18* timing is fine for 6psi...

Later - Brian

i didnt actually use anything accurate to measure the ID, but im sure i have a boost leak

what size piping did u use, and whered u get it

[Zemus]

How much was your setip what kind of fuel contrller you useing (or is that what you mean by hacked MAF) Im going to turbo my KA but i just need some info first

[Evil S14]

id say complete setup was ~$2300 but everything was brand spanking new (besides the 370 injectors)

i am running a completely stock ecu with no sort of fuel management

the hacked MAFS is just taking the mafs and cutting the plastic rube out and putting it into a bigger diameter tube, go to www.ka24development.com for more info, it only works on s14 MAFS though

[orion::S14]

AceInHole -

I was running '92 cams (240/248) until last week, and now I have another S13 (248) exhaust cam in my intake spot, moved over 4 teeth (to emmulate the Nissan Motorsports cam set, 248/248).

I'd bet my MAF is maxed now...the top end is loads better, even with my 2.5" exhaust.

Evil S14 -

I'm using 3" exhaust tubing with insert to shim it down to 2.75" ID...

Later - Brian

[Evil S14]

so i take it u just used a afc to richen it out a little since the ID is the same as mine?

[95Blue240sx]

Originally posted by AceInHole
nice!!

hacked MAF owns :D

Only problem is: lately I've been running 6psi, and getting +90% airflow.... so I think I may have to move away from the hacked MAF.

this didn't start untill I had the s13 cams in.... but I thought Orion had JWT cams (more aggressive cams?)

so... I may be moving to a z32 MAF or just go MAP by next season....

how are you going to go MAP? powerhouseracing.com started carrying the MAP system. from what ive read on the Mkiv.com its a new alternative to the VPC, and is only 4 wires. the are going to be releasing it soon with base maps, cross your fingers so they make one for the KA. and can run off a wideband, FJO preferred. thats the route i want to get eventually. sound good? bad?

on another note, if i ran the same setup, but instead of the hacked maf, using a cobra maf, should i see about the same numbers? would this be a wiser way to go? what is the cobra maf good till? thanks

bj

[steve shadows]

Originally posted by orion::S14
HAHAHAHAHA!!!! YES!

Redtop SR @ stock boost is ~210 crank HP...that's maybe 185rwhp, which translates into mid-14s at 97-98mph I'd guess. Even with a FMIC, DP, exhaust, etc...at stock boost (7psi), you probably won't see more then 210-215rwhp.

This KA-T setup @ 6psi is closer to 225rwhp based on my dynos @ 6psi, and that trap speed.

Later - Brian

riiiiiiiiight...hmm ok

well lets see :coolugh: the sr20det has an 8.5:1 compression ratio the ka24de has a 9.5:1 compression ratio.

The sr20det is internally gated pos garrett t25 or t28 turbo with a horridly inefficent compresor map where the hp drops off imediatly after about 6k rpm.

The kat project you have is externally gated, custom manifold and much much more effecient 60 trim compressor wheel with .63 exaust ar for even less exst temp and more potential boost.

the to4e/t3 is a totally different breed compared to a t25.

of course you made more power:hammer: because you have a higher compression ratio, greater displacement and a much more efficent turbo.

a 60 trim compressor wheel in that housing is 100 times better than the stock sr20det t25 compressor wheel.

A better comparison would be an sr20det stock with the boost turned up to 1 bar....

-steve :bow:

[Evil S14]

true, but i spent less money on my ka24det than i would a swap, but this battle will never end

BTW s14 ka24de doenst have 9.5:1 compression

[orion::S14]

Evil S14 -

No AFC...I just run race gas when I want to push it real hard...that is, until I get my wideband next week, and tune it a little with fuel pressure.



Originally posted by rpsports
...of course you made more power:hammer: because you have a higher compression ratio, greater displacement and a much more efficent turbo.

Exactly my point!!!!!

I didn't mean to make that an "SR vs KA" post...but I emphatically pointed out that a 2.4 liter with more static compression and a bigger, more efficiemnt turbo makes more power than an SR, given the same boost.

"isn't that faster than a SR @ 6psi?" - I answered that question, with facts. I didn't bash your SR, I didn't call it JDM-hype, etc...

We weren't looking for a comparison...in fact, nobody asked for one.

Later - Brian

[orion::S14]

Originally posted by Evil S14
BTW s14 ka24de doenst have 9.5:1 compression...

Despite what the Chiltons says, it is a 9.5:1 compression ratio for all years of the S-chassis KA24DE.

Later - Brian

[AceInHole]

Originally posted by 95Blue240sx
how are you going to go MAP? powerhouseracing.com started carrying the MAP system. from what ive read on the Mkiv.com its a new alternative to the VPC, and is only 4 wires. the are going to be releasing it soon with base maps, cross your fingers so they make one for the KA. and can run off a wideband, FJO preferred. thats the route i want to get eventually. sound good? bad?
wow... looking at that thing, it's pretty impressive!! I might look into that more now... it even has a feature to learn off the stock MAF to get a baseline.
Originally I was gonna use a VPC for a different car, and convert it to KA MAF output using the S-AFC.

on another note, if i ran the same setup, but instead of the hacked maf, using a cobra maf, should i see about the same numbers? would this be a wiser way to go? what is the cobra maf good till? thanks

bj
Using a different MAF isn't really MAF hacking. The point of hacking the MAF is to keep the stock curve, and change it linearly. Using a different MAF will end up with a completely different airflow/ voltage curve, so it won't really work without more intensive fuel tuning.

[Evil S14]

Originally posted by orion::S14
Despite what the Chiltons says, it is a 9.5:1 compression ratio for all years of the S-chassis KA24DE.

Later - Brian

no shit, i was always under the impression that the s14 ones had lower compression, like 8.6:1, i couldve sworn i saw it on here

well thats misinformation for ya

[AceInHole]

late model SOHC's had 8.6:1

[SittinOnDubsWGW]

I was very impressed to see your run, good job on the KA-T.

I'll probably see ya around more with Grant and whatnot.

Now to fix the problem of me being slow...

[rednerd]

2.0 60' w/o lsd == BAD ASS!

[andrave]

dude those are very very good times.
what clutch do you have?

[SilviaDriver]

wat manifold

[KiDyNomiTe]

You get rid of your old rims?

Lets keep in mind he is like a freak drag racer :p , pulled out some good times on his stock KA.

Glad to see everything is working out good. You need to start making trips to Chicago again next year:bow:

[Evil S14]

its true, im no greaser from FA, but im pretty good, i hit a 15.3 in my s14 with just an n1 dual

ill post the slip tonite

my clutch is a spec stage 3 6 puck, i think its freaking great and hasnt blown up on me yet :p

i have a revhard manifold which i hate because its soooo close to my brake MC, i might get a JGS goming up soon

and the 2.0 60' was on kumho all season tires too :boink:

[SilviaDriver]

cant u juss relocate ur MC?

[AceInHole]

wow.... I did a 2.6 with a VLSD and 245 wide Goodyears, but that was my first and only time at a dragstrip....

cant u juss relocate ur MC?
simply put: no.

[Evil S14]

timeslip time

http://portfolio.iu.edu/jrjimene/Timeslip137.JPG

[matlock]

Awesome times, your setup sounds pretty cool. I am going to turbo my KA over the winter months I think.

[KiDyNomiTe]

Have fun freezing, its colder up there than it is here, and I don't wanna do anything to my car this winter.

[whateverjames]

dam. nice 60ft time. especially with the open diff :bowdown:

[SilviaSR20DET]

Nice job on the turbo setup, makes me want to turbo my car too! How many miles do you have on your car right now? Also how long have you driven the car with this turbo setup? Do you have any problems at all?

[Evil S14]

ive had the turbo on for ~5000 miles now, and my car has 94,000 miles, the only problem i have run into is it consumes alot of oil, and mobil 1 15w 50 isnt cheap. i did a compression test and it was 190 across the board, and it still burns oil. I can't figure it out

[rednerd]

How much is a lot? If you rev the thing to redline all the time you may be pressurizing the crankcase and blowing it out the breather. Of course it doens't take much of an oil leak to consume quite a bit of oil....

Ohh yah, and a compression test will really only tell you when some is very very wrong with an engine. I have a friend who had an old small block that used to run 0 psi of oil pressure at idle, but still had perfectly good compression.

Either way KA's are a dime a dozen. I think it is pretty impressive that your home brew turbo setup runs better than a lot of peoples badly tuned SR's. (I like the SR, I'm just stating a fact.) Props.

[240silvia]

Originally posted by Mugen13
nice time. your car must be a total sleeper w/ your steelies. :)

isn't that faster than a SR @ 6psi? how much did you spend on your setup?



Yes, his setup is faster than the STOCK SR at 6psi, but if you put all of his stuff on the SR, it would either be about the same or faster. SR has a higher redline of 7800 so it would let you run out the turbo a little more. No guys, I'm not downing the KA-Ts, but, you can't expect the T-25 that's on the stock SRs to keep up with the T3 that's on his car.

Great job though man, really nice time!

[Evil S14]

i know it has to do with the crankcase a little bit, because i cant find a breather filter that has a big enough inlet for it, all i see is all the little honda ones, can somone tell me where to find one for our size crankcase brether?!?

i hate to turn this thread into a sr vs ka again, because i liek the sr too, i thinkits down to preference, because i spent as much money as it would take to put an sr in my car, and if i wanted a rebuild it would probably cost as much as a turbo upgrade with an intercooler on a sr20, i like my fat ass torque cruve better than a high revving engine:p

[Jeff240sx]

Ok. One more time. No SR v. KA posts. You SR people are so hell-bent to defend your motor at all costs, you start sniveling about how "the KA has a bigger turbo, and better manifold, and larger displacement, and IF my SR had all this, it'd be faster". Yea? IF Grandma had balls, she'd be Grandpa, wouldn't she? An appropriately sized turbo on a KA will make more power at the same psi than an appropriately sized turbo on the SR. T28 at 15psi on SR ~280rwhp. T3/4 on KA at 15psi ~350rwhp. Its in displacement and the fact that while it's considered an unfair comparison because the SR uses a stock manifold and KA uses a custom one, KA uses a bigger turbo, better fuel system, ect. Yea? That's the only way to get a manifold! The engine is 20% larger than an SR, so it needs a larger turbo.
Hell. Even FreshAlloy had Greaser's SR at some boost level vs. Dennis from UH's KA-T at the same psi (15-ish). Dennis made 30-80 more rwhp from 3000-6800 rpm. The SR came in at 6900-7200 to top Dennis. Greaser said it was the most fair comparison he's seen to date, the graphs were overlayed, and yet there was 5 pages of SR people "nya nya nya unfair. larger, blah blah blah." So. Can we stop a senseless KA v. SR thread from happening and realize that it's all in the way that the engine works. It's called not creating an argument over little things, and accepting something as fact, as opposed to making "what ifs" and "but that one." Watch, and repeat after me.
The SR is superior in a highest horsepower application (non-nitroused) to a KA-T. Scott at Secret Services in Tampa/St. Pete has a s13 stock bottom end making 539rwhp. I love that car :)
-Jeff

[Jeff240sx]

Oh yea.. don't forget. Evil S14 has some sort of freak engine, or freak foot or something. He's the one that ran a 15.3 (right?) on a bone-stock 240sx with exhaust. Glad your turbo is up and running! Post some pics, and please don't use Image Station. I have yet to sign up for that place.. and probably won't.
-Jeff

[Evil S14]

good point, heres the thread if anyone wants to see it

http://forums.freshalloy.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB9&Number=386583&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1

and ill get pics up soon!

[240silvia]

If it came off like that, I didn't mean to "defend" the SR. Just like Evil said, it comes down to preference. I think that the KA has just as much potential as the SR. My KA had 190K miles on it, so I opted to go with the SR. Didn't mean to make a KA vs. SR post again.

[steve shadows]

the best 60ft ive layed down with an open diff was a 1.89 on drag radials.

thats very good for khumos tho...

-steve