Bait Car; Entrapment or fair game?

[DS562]

Im currently watching the tv show "Bait Car" and everybody says that it is entrapment. so i was wondering what ST thinks.

Personally I think its %100 fair, nobody made those idiots jump in and drive off.

for those who've never watched, its a show where local Police agencies rig department owned cars with tracking systems, cameras and killswitches then leave them with open doors and keys in the ignition to wait for random asshats to steal it. once the asshat has driven off, the killswitch is actuated and they arrest the car jacker.


Opinions?

and yes i know by posting such a question in zilvia i'll be getting biased opinions but i'm still interested to know what Zilvia has to say

[s14>integra]

i don't exactly know how to explain it but i believe it's only entrapment if the cop is "egging" you on so to speak. Like if a car wants to street race you and then you race them only to find out it's a cop. It isn't entrapment if you had the intent to do it before. if you know what i mean. But i haven't seen that show. Sounds kinda cool though.

[Wake]

I know its not entrapment but they know they are playing on the opportunist mentality of "urban" people.

They never have that show out in the suburbs where i bet you some little white kid would steal the same car eventually it just might take longer due to a lower concentration of people in general.

But the bottom line is, in the end, that nobody is making anyone do anything they didnt already decide to do so it cant be entrapment.
Just goes to show if it seems to good to be true it probably is. Thats why you should only steal cars that you know arent bait, like ones in people driveways LOL

[Taniguchi_Is_#1]

it's a sting operation. last i checked, those weren't illegal (see drug/firearms sting operations; also, see Chris Hansen).

[ThatGuy]

Who really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

[ali-d1936]

if it takes car jacking sumbags off the streets i wouldnt be asking questions!! :P fair game, the people who would do it are Peices of $h!t anyway so they are just getting whats coming to them at lest your police do something about it, here in Ireland car crime is rife and Guards do next to nothing to catch them!!

[roboticnissan]

It's just. Little biased when they only go to shitty areas. I'm sure some dumb young rich kids regardless of race would think they could steal it and get a free ride and dump it.

But yes car thieves need to be dealt with.

[S14DB]

Entrapment - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrapment)

Kind of hard for a inanimate object to entrap someone.

[sidedrifts13]

I agree with thiswho really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

[Josh]

Who really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

This..

(msg length)

[Wake]

Entrapment - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrapment)

Kind of hard for a inanimate object to entrap someone.

my sentiments exactly, Whether or not the people were given the opportunity they still chose to do something illegal.
Nobody forced them to get in the car and take off, but that shit sure is funny to watch when all the doors lock and everything shuts down. The looks on the dudes faces are priceless.
I saw one where it was a fucking father and son stealing the car. Now those are some serious family values.

[KA-T_240]

Who really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

I couldnt have said it better myself.

[tricky_ab]

Who really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

THIS!!! Seriously, if you have bad intentions then you get what you deserve...

[blueshark123]

I think the show is great but feel they are getting people who are just trying to make a quick buck on the car, They probably would never steal a normal parked car without a key in it that is running lol. I dont know how to really explain it but wat im trying to say is that a actual car thief would probably not get caught doing this. Yet this is who they are trying to catch. So in the end it still doesn't benefit us

[SuicidnS13]

"Urban" people as you say, usually cant afford decent lawyers. So in turn the city gets convictions which the federal system pays the state for which incidently pays the privately owned prisons which profit off the poor who couldnt afford lawyers. The saying education is freedom is true. An educated person usually wouldnt steal the car or at worst atleast beable to afford decent attorney fees. Stay in school, quit partying so much, get decent grades and maybe they could get better jobs and not have to steal cars... or atleast have the financial backing to get away with it.

[MisawaJason]

if it's not yours, dont take the shit.

There's no honor in stealing. Work for everything that you want

[Matej]

It most likely works on dumb people who normally would not even steal a car, but when they see what they believe to be an easy opportunity, they are dumb enough to go for it in the heat of the moment.
I doubt it helps catch any 'professional' thieves.

I am not speaking against it though. Thieves and dumb people are equally terrible.

[90white240]

I think its a great way to catch dump people. Its like a fly and those sticky rope things.

[soreballz]

Fuck rigging them with cameras and GPS. Rig them with C4 and blow those theiving motherfuckers to smithereens.

That's the America I wanna live in.

[Banana_Cute]

Fuck rigging them with cameras and GPS. Rig them with C4 and blow those theiving motherfuckers to smithereens.

That's the America I wanna live in.

Sounds like the middle east to me.

[TheWolf]

"Urban" people as you say, usually cant afford decent lawyers. So in turn the city gets convictions which the federal system pays the state for which incidently pays the privately owned prisons which profit off the poor who couldnt afford lawyers. The saying education is freedom is true. An educated person usually wouldnt steal the car or at worst atleast beable to afford decent attorney fees. Stay in school, quit partying so much, get decent grades and maybe they could get better jobs and not have to steal cars... or atleast have the financial backing to get away with it.

your right.. if the world only had more PHD's..


ever hear the phrase about taking the girl out of the trailerpark?

[DUFFM4N]

Fuck rigging them with cameras and GPS. Rig them with C4 and blow those theiving motherfuckers to smithereens.

That's the America I wanna live in.



one day my son....one day :bow:

[VNG704]

Yea, the more theives off the streets, the better. But then you have to draw the line somewhere so I care if it's entrapment or not. In this situation, I think it's not.

[ericcastro]

In my opinion, its really riding the edge of entrapment.
Keys in it, unlocked, c'mon.

But I have always thought that Chris Hansen guys whole deal with the pedo's is pretty much entrapment.
They sit there and have a bunch of society regects trying to get these guys online to come over. Its not like they intercepted little susies messages.
They go in there and hunt for guys to talk to.
Its a pretty thin line, but its gonna continue cause not one of these guilty fuckers is gonna try and get a laywer to fight it, since they are guilty to begin with.

[wawazat8402]

If Chris Hansen placed someone in the perps home trying to pressure him into going, then it would be entrapment. I have no issue with police setting up opportunity for criminals to expose themselves and get caught. I also believe until the justice system creates repercussions worse than they currently are, we will fix nothing. The castle doctrine states have it right. You weed out a lot of opportunists when they realize they could die for that TV and have no legal recourse against the home owner or neighbor that shoots them.

[Banana_Cute]

Its entertainment.

And yes, about chris hansen having a 14 yr old hunt down these pedo's to lure them in is a good idea. It'll def stop em before they can really talk to a real 14 yr old.

Preventative procedure i would call it. Now and days kids have access to the internet left and right. A long side with these pedo.

Same goes with this car theft thing.

[KBanks]

Thieves deserve death. It's the first line of thought in the reasoning that certain things are acceptable when they are obviously not. Stop that shit early I say.

[soreballz]

Sounds like the middle east to me.
That's the one thing I like about the middle east. The way they handle thieves is glorious.

[ronmcdon]

Its entertainment.

And yes, about chris hansen having a 14 yr old hunt down these pedo's to lure them in is a good idea. It'll def stop em before they can really talk to a real 14 yr old.

Preventative procedure i would call it. Now and days kids have access to the internet left and right. A long side with these pedo.

Same goes with this car theft thing.

Yeah I agree with you here.

I just think it's more preventative publicity, as opposed to procedure.
It's good to send that extra message out there to tell ppl not only is is NOT okay to steal cars, do pedo shit, etc,
but that you will also get humiliated on TV.
It's trying to throw in additional stigmatization on something that's already a problem.

It just might not work for ppl who are out for desperate attention, as opposed to those who are generally interested in the crime itself.

[Banana_Cute]

That's the one thing I like about the middle east. The way they handle thieves is glorious.

Yeah dude, i heard they cut their hands if caught red handed. and the ladies are stoned to death (or atleast) if caught cheating on their husband.

[OaxKouki]

Cops put a bait car at the apts my wife works at, some kids found out it was a bait car and lit it on fire. They are now all in jail and are facing multiple felony charges.

[upsdude]

Who really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

that pretty much sums it up...wouldn't it be nice to see less threads about a stolen s14/s13?

[Gnnr]

Its not entrapment. No one forced them to commit a crime.

Additonally, to argue entrapment in court you must first admit guilt and once you do that its hard to fight your way back out.

On Chris Hansen, I've seen episodes where the setup girl talks about the actual show and the guys laugh it off and ignore the big fucking lass chance to leave clue. They're pedophiles. Period.

[xnissan240sx]

if it's not yours, dont take the shit.

There's no honor in stealing. Work for everything that you want

Couldn't agree more! Nothing better knowing that everything you own, you worked your ass off for.

[h2v7]

friend got busted by a bait car in SF

it was a heavily modded foxbody 5.0 sitting in front of a hotel running with no one inside


temptation!

[Wake]

Damn how much does it suck to go to jail for stealing a 5.slow?

[murda-c]

friend got busted by a bait car in SF

it was a heavily modded foxbody 5.0 sitting in front of a hotel running with no one inside


temptation!

did you make fun of him?

[Phlip]

Did anyone notice how EVERY one of the people (at least the ones who make it to the TV) they collar for this have some criminal history, usually involving car theft?

Also, I cannot think that it is entrapment, at least not until the cops send an undercover into the neighborhood of strangers and TELL them "man, the keys still in that Camry over there, you should GET it" and then walk off.

What's funniest, though, are the excuses they use.

she told me to move it

I was takin' it to turn it in

I was just gonna take it and park it

maaaaan, I was hopin' I could get a reward for it

Funny is how I have been watching this show for about a year consistent now, and I have only seen TWO times that the reason for the car being moved was valid.


A woman - EMPLOYED by the department that set the bait - moved the car from in IN FRONT OF HER DRIVEWAY, then got back in her car and immediately gets stopped a block away, only to find that she called the police department 3 times about a car blocking her driveway.

A gas station owner sent one of his employees to move the bait F-150 out of the middle of his fucking parking lot and into a space, bringing the keys into the store for the abandoner to get when they came.


I think the show is hilarious, personally.

[blahz36]

Cops put a bait car at the apts my wife works at, some kids found out it was a bait car and lit it on fire. They are now all in jail and are facing multiple felony charges.



:eek3: interesting..

[leung]

Who really cares if it is entrapment or not.

The world needs less thieves.

This. Plus its no different than a sting operation.

[MisawaJason]

yeah Phlip, the excuses always make me laugh.

[h2v7]

did you make fun of him?



NOOO

i was sitting shotgun!!!!!!!!



i kid i kid

no i told him he was a fucking retard and that thall shall not steal

i lightweight like foxbodys to be honest............... :yum::wan:

[VNG704]

as effective as it arguably is, cops should not be creating crimes to make arrests.

[HyperTek]

^what about those fake cop prostitutes , they put bait out there,.. not that its bad, but from a 3rd person view your still seeing prostitutes lol

[ronmcdon]

^

Lol, sounds like you speak from experience (j/k)

But yeah, nothing new here aside from making a show out of it.
Well and even that's debate-able.

[Persona]

In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense which the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit. In many jurisdictions, entrapment is a possible defense against criminal liability.

[ericcastro]

With the prostitute stings, the person pulls up to the prostitute and initiates the crime. They do not go up to people and temp them, because that would be considered entrapment.

Thats why those Chris Hansen people are a little shady in my book. They initiate the private chat and lead the person in the conversation a lot of the time.
Then they turn over the stuff to the cops. A true law enforcment agency wouldnt be able to do that themselves.

And so, leaving the keys in a running car with the door open,.... state and area depending, is considered entrapment. And the reason some states or areas dont do it.

I believe that when law enforcement starts creating crimes to get arrest, they have gone way to far. There was no crime there till they created it.

"The law describes entrapment when a person is "induced or persuaded" to commit a crime that he had no previous intent to commit."

[MisawaJason]

yeah, we can get all technical and shit, but in the end, something was taken that doesn't belong to the individual. I think it's called theft, but I could be wrong

[ericcastro]

yeah, we can get all technical and shit, but in the end, something was taken that doesn't belong to the individual. I think it's called theft, but I could be wrong

But our law runs on being technical, otherwise, without rules, we would be like, oh, mexico, lmao!

Thats why, even when guilty, police need to read you your rights before they can use anything you say in court. Thats why they cant persuade you into a crime and then throw you in jail. Thats why the John is supposed to be the one to mention money in a prostitute sting.

So letting a car sit normally, and then seeing if someone steals it is one thing, totally legal.
But leaving a car running with the keys in it and the doors unlocked and open in front of a liquor store in the ghetto,....entrapment. (cause that situation would never normally happen.)

The fact that this is even a discussion, means that the police are starting to ride that line of whats legal and whats not.
And sadly, the law also knows that people getting arrested for these crimes, are not the kind of people that know to call the ACLU and get a lawyer.

[Tantwoforty]

if i saw a running car just chillin i would probably just call the police..
maybe i would turn it off.. but is that considered a bad thing?

This one time (lol) this dude driveing a flat bed truck passd out at like 1am infront of my house while i was outside working on my car

he hit a pole, so we ran over there and the truck was in gear pushing on the pole.. the driver was passed out, so i put it in park, hit the air brakes and turned it off and called 911 for the driver..

the cops said i should have left it untill they got there but dosent that seem dangerous?
that was pretty off topic.. carry on lol

[HOOCH]

I know my buddy's 2 older brothers called a cab and when the cabbie got there he ran in the bar so the 2 took the cab and went to the gas station and bought some chew and came right back and got charged with "joyriding" cause there was no damage to the car and the keys where in it! But every state has different laws about that shit

[codyace]

"Urban" people as you say, usually cant afford decent lawyers. So in turn the city gets convictions which the federal system pays the state for which incidently pays the privately owned prisons which profit off the poor who couldnt afford lawyers. The saying education is freedom is true. An educated person usually wouldnt steal the car or at worst atleast beable to afford decent attorney fees. Stay in school, quit partying so much, get decent grades and maybe they could get better jobs and not have to steal cars... or atleast have the financial backing to get away with it.

Since when does 'geographical region/area' make any difference as to education? Just because you grew up 'ghetto' is ZERO excuse to steal, or break the law.

I hate that sort of atttitude that shows stereotype people...should they only show white kids in suburbia...would that be ok? I mean lets be serious that sort of thought process is what's wrong with racism in america...people want 'equality' in crime...

[Aki180sx]

A thief is a thief no matter the circumstances. I say fair game and they should do it more often.

[HachiTom]

they get what they deserve, you shouldn't be stealing a car in the first place.
you are taking away something that most people work their ass off to get.

[ericcastro]

I think you guys are missing the bigger picture.

Yeah, a thief is a thief and all that, they get what they deserve.



But the question was, and still remains,
Is it considered entrapment??

Most of these replies are people opinions about people, and have nothing to do with what the thread was about in the first place. It was a question of wether the law was getting away with a crime itself in the way it was catching criminals.

Im sure everyone agrees these people are shitheads. But give an inch, take a mile. Over look the law, "for the greater good", and they will keep taking. Entrapment today, some security cameras tommorow, swipe credit cards, terrorist act.

Give it 10 years and we will end up with micro ships in our arms, thousands of cameras everywhere, no rights when entering any building, and cars that govener kicks on at 77mph. lol

[codyace]

Most of these replies are people opinions about people, and have nothing to do with what the thread was about in the first place. It was a question of wether the law was getting away with a crime itself in the way it was catching criminals.

Im sure everyone agrees these people are shitheads. But give an inch, take a mile. Over look the law, "for the greater good", and they will keep taking. Entrapment today, some security cameras tommorow, swipe credit cards, terrorist act.

Give it 10 years and we will end up with micro ships in our arms, thousands of cameras everywhere, no rights when entering any building, and cars that govener kicks on at 77mph. lol


I ultimatly think Entrapment is an excuse for most people who committ the crimes. Don't steal the bait car, never become a victim of 'entrapment'...never drink and drive, never fall a victim of 'entrapment' where the cop sits a 1/4 mile down the road, etc etc etc.

Govenment boundries are one thing, but when people knowingly break the law, the fact remains that they still are breaking the law. Let be serious, we all know the 'criminal' would have done it regardless of it being rigged by the police or not...so if it happened in a non-setup scenario, he'd be a theif...but if it was the cops doing it, it's not?

[ericcastro]

I ultimatly think Entrapment is an excuse for most people who committ the crimes. Don't steal the bait car, never become a victim of 'entrapment'...never drink and drive, never fall a victim of 'entrapment' where the cop sits a 1/4 mile down the road, etc etc etc.

Govenment boundries are one thing, but when people knowingly break the law, the fact remains that they still are breaking the law. Let be serious, we all know the 'criminal' would have done it regardless of it being rigged by the police or not...so if it happened in a non-setup scenario, he'd be a theif...but if it was the cops doing it, it's not?

very true, and i agree for some of it.
A big argument with the bait cars is that a lot of teenagers get caught with the really obvious, open doors, car running ones.
They jump in to joy ride a car all spur of the moment, where had it not been dangeled in front of them, they never would have broke a window to take it.
Its that stupid teenager, dont think things through.

Like I never would have gone and stolen beer out of the back of a grocery store as a teenager, but had there been a case of beer just randomly siting on the edge of the loading dock as i skated by.......

[raz0rbladez909]

I ultimatly think Entrapment is an excuse for most people who committ the crimes. Don't steal the bait car, never become a victim of 'entrapment'...never drink and drive, never fall a victim of 'entrapment' where the cop sits a 1/4 mile down the road, etc etc etc.

Govenment boundries are one thing, but when people knowingly break the law, the fact remains that they still are breaking the law. Let be serious, we all know the 'criminal' would have done it regardless of it being rigged by the police or not...so if it happened in a non-setup scenario, he'd be a theif...but if it was the cops doing it, it's not?

Exactly, it'd be entrapment if there was an undercover cop coercing someone into stealing the car, but these people act on their own. They all know it's wrong and most of the people on this show have priors anyways. It is nobody's fault but their own; I've seen people park a car in front of a convenience store with the engine running before more often then once, and as sad as it is to say it is a realistic situation, as hard as it may be to believe that someone would leave a running car with the door open it DOES happen in real life, still doesn't give anyone the right to touch it.

I've been a victim of theft in the past, and it certainly isn't fun, so the more of these fuckers off of the streets the better. I don't care how hard your life is or how you were brought up, if you're fucked up enough to think about stealing I don't think you should even be allowed to reproduce, you will never be a positive contributor to society, just a waste of oxygen.

You can say what you want, but you will never convince me that thieves should have any rights.

[codyace]

Like I never would have gone and stolen beer out of the back of a grocery store as a teenager, but had there been a case of beer just randomly siting on the edge of the loading dock as i skated by.......

Undoubtedly the temptation would be strong...I can say at that age I'd certainly recognize that stealing was wrong, however that doesnt' mean I'd 'not' take it...it would boil down to circumstance haha.

However if I got busted, I wouldn't try to lie about it...I woulda sucked it up and taken the penalty.

[sw20>>s14]

its funny how some of you feel bad because they target "bad" neighborhoods...no need to be so liberal or PC about it...i think you guys are getting the wrong idea...albeit it is on tv now and im sure producers add a little extra to make it interesting, dont forget that those teams are ACTUAL real life task forces...

they target those regions for a reason...that being GTA is a huge problem in said area...so what better place to target heavily than where all the action is taking place?

now, if you wanted to really be liberal or PC about it, you should be asking why they always use an escalade with chrome wheels, camry with chrome, and other cars with bling wheels...THAT is where they start to unfairly target a certain racial group within the larger group of car thieves based on race, culture, tastes of said race, preferences of said race, etc...

the show is very entertaining to say the least...the excuses are golden...writers couldnt even come up with some of the BS they come up with...

what sucks and is ultimately effective about that show/sting operation in general, is that culprits are usually out on parole or on their third strike or have narcotics on them...two for one if you ask me, no one needs those types of people on the streets...i love knowing its ok to leave my car idling while i buy a pack of smokes or return a movie at a kiosk...

havent watched it yet, but i heard the show was shooting in the bay area...cant wait to catch that, lol...

[soreballz]

Eric, regardless of what you say, it's not entrapment. Nobody coaxes these people into taking the cars. A crime of opportunity is still a crime.
Now, if an undercover officer approached somebody and said, "hey man, that guy left the keys in the ignition; you should take it. Come on, it'll be easy..." then you have an entrapment situation.

[ronmcdon]

its funny how some of you feel bad because they target "bad" neighborhoods...no need to be so liberal or PC about it...i think you guys are getting the wrong idea...albeit it is on tv now and im sure producers add a little extra to make it interesting, dont forget that those teams are ACTUAL real life task forces...

they target those regions for a reason...that being GTA is a huge problem in said area...so what better place to target heavily than where all the action is taking place?

now, if you wanted to really be liberal or PC about it, you should be asking why they always use an escalade with chrome wheels, camry with chrome, and other cars with bling wheels...THAT is where they start to unfairly target a certain racial group within the larger group of car thieves based on race, culture, tastes of said race, preferences of said race, etc...

the show is very entertaining to say the least...the excuses are golden...writers couldnt even come up with some of the BS they come up with...

what sucks and is ultimately effective about that show/sting operation in general, is that culprits are usually out on parole or on their third strike or have narcotics on them...two for one if you ask me, no one needs those types of people on the streets...i love knowing its ok to leave my car idling while i buy a pack of smokes or return a movie at a kiosk...

havent watched it yet, but i heard the show was shooting in the bay area...cant wait to catch that, lol...

I personally don't care either way.

However, the show must have realistically expected some bad publicity for this reason alone.
Simple thing to do would be to set up the sting in different racial & income neighborhoods.
If nobody bothered to take the bait in 'such & such' neighborhood then at least it goes to show the cops weren't discriminating on their own behalf.

btw - what the hell is the term 'urban' ppl meant to mean anyways?!
it's almost as if to imply other groups are any less metropolitan.
It sounds a bit elitist to me.

[Imarvin240]

its better that they get caught jacking the police rigged cars and going to jail, then them steeling my car and stripping it hah i am all for the bait car and i think they should come do it in my area so i dont have to worry as much lol

[ericcastro]

Nobody coaxes these people into taking the cars.

Chrome rims on a Escalade or Camry,....in those neighborhoods,.....just sayin. :bowrofl:

Now, if an undercover officer approached somebody and said, "hey man, that guy left the keys in the ignition; you should take it. Come on, it'll be easy..." then you have an entrapment situation.
I would have thought leaving the car running with the door ajar is pretty much doing that, :rolleyes:.


And yes, its pretty shitty the police usually pick "minority" areas for their crap. Sometimes its justified, and sometimes i would really like to see a DUI stop in beverly hills on a friday night. (which I am sure is entrapment since they actually need a reason to pull you over first. thanks "national security" for fucking us all.)

[Persona]

No matter how poor or rich you are stealing is stealing, no excuses. The whole point is that when the car is running in the street with the keys in the ignition an individual has two immediate choices. Take it, or dont take it.

Taking its stealing, whether its a 88 towncar or 2004 escalade.

The individual make the choice, no MAKES or FORCES them walk to the car and take it. The know damn well what they are doing and express their content with their actions. Its exactly people like this that we need to get off the street.

[ericcastro]

The question wasn't if its stealing.

The question was if it was entrapment.


But "honey Pot" shows seem to be pretty popular.
Chris Hansen, Bait car.

I wonder how I could get a pilot made, with a prostitution sting.
But use the Tranny hookers in my hood.
But make it partialy like that show "intervention".
That way we will also have interviews with the family and friends about how ashamed they are, really destroy and embaress peoples lives. Thats pretty much what these shows are doing, right? I dont know when public humiliation became part of our judicial system.

[raz0rbladez909]

The question wasn't if its stealing.

The question was if it was entrapment.


But "honey Pot" shows seem to be pretty popular.
Chris Hansen, Bait car.

I wonder how I could get a pilot made, with a prostitution sting.
But use the Tranny hookers in my hood.
But make it partialy like that show "intervention".
That way we will also have interviews with the family and friends about how ashamed they are, really destroy and embaress peoples lives. Thats pretty much what these shows are doing, right? I dont know when public humiliation became part of our judicial system.

I wouldn't say its aired just for the humiliation factor, but it also makes other thieves think twice before stealing some random car. It is great that they air it because it is a deliberate means that they use to prevent other crimes from occuring. The thing about public humiliation is, it is usually caused by the actions of said person, have you ever been publicly humiliated before? I'm sure everyone here has at least some point in their life, the better question is, would you make that stupid mistake again? The last thing I'm concerned about is a criminals feelings, let em burn.

[Persona]

Exactly, but I was commenting as well on the excuses some tried to put in place regarding the economic climates of the crime and the temptations put in place.

[axiomatik]

No one made them open the door, get in, and drive off. Keep your hands off of other people's stuff and it's no problem.

[J3123MY]

Fuck rigging them with cameras and GPS. Rig them with C4 and blow those theiving motherfuckers to smithereens.

That's the America I wanna live in.

Sounds like the middle east to me.

That's the one thing I like about the middle east. The way they handle thieves is glorious.

Seriously????? Go live in the middle east and tell me how you like it. LOL.

Fucking stupid...America is going to shits, already. Last thing it needs is anything like the middle east.

In America, our founding fathers have really created something special. Something many American citizens do not appreciate. The constitution, the Bill of Rights, and much more. We have our courts and our justice system, I know its not perfect, but its as close to perfect as it will ever get with anything involving human beings.
Yet your stupid ass wants mobs and people blowing shit up and cutting people up. Cars driving into hospitals and schools, blowing shit up. Having women covered up and stoning them to death because of disobedience. Killing people over beliefs.

Basically, you want to send America back to the middle ages. Your a great American citizen.

I can not believe your stupid ass wants to go blowing shit up like the middle east. Fucking seriously? Go move there, see how you like it. Fuck your stupid.

[raz0rbladez909]

I can not believe your stupid ass wants to go blowing shit up like the middle east. Fucking seriously? Go move there, see how you like it. Fuck your stupid.

lol It's kinda hard to call someone stupid when you aren't even using the right context of the word.

The way I see it, thieves should have no rights, some of the lowest scum on the Earth. I don't agree with very many things in the middle east, but I'm sure they have alot less theft knowing they'd lose a limb for it.

[dRift_g0ddess]

LOL.
This show is frikken hilarious. Of course those who do get caught will consider it entrapment in their own defense, but the reality is that he/she had the freedom to make an A or B decision in that moment. Steal it, or leave it alone.

Sometimes instead of just leaving a bait car on the street with keys inside, they even use real situations- A woman pulls up to a Liquor store.. she parks & exits the car leaving it running for a quick purchase. A man walking down the street sees her exit the car and notices it still running. He waits til she's inside and swoops the bait car :nono: THAT is exactly the type of person I don't want wandering around my neighborhood..
To me this is an excellent idea.. it's entertaining & effective :)

[codyace]

Seriously????? Go live in the middle east and tell me how you like it. LOL.

Fucking stupid...America is going to shits, already. Last thing it needs is anything like the middle east.

In America, our founding fathers have really created something special. Something many American citizens do not appreciate. The constitution, the Bill of Rights, and much more. We have our courts and our justice system, I know its not perfect, but its as close to perfect as it will ever get with anything involving human beings.
Yet your stupid ass wants mobs and people blowing shit up and cutting people up. Cars driving into hospitals and schools, blowing shit up. Having women covered up and stoning them to death because of disobedience. Killing people over beliefs.

Basically, you want to send America back to the middle ages. Your a great American citizen.

I can not believe your stupid ass wants to go blowing shit up like the middle east. Fucking seriously? Go move there, see how you like it. Fuck your stupid.



I think they point they want to make, is that we need to start enforcing our laws, not letting them off with 'good conduct' shortened sentences or community service. Once people realise the risk isn't worth it, they'll probably think twice.

I mean where else in the world do people purposely get put into jail over winter so they have warmth and food? Only in America.

[codyace]

A man walking down the street sees her exit the car and notices it still running. He waits til she's inside and swoops the bait car :nono: THAT is exactly the type of person I don't want wandering around my neighborhood..
To me this is an excellent idea.. it's entertaining & effective :)

I miss living at my parents house/growing up and not worrying about even taking keys out of the car at night...

[J3123MY]

I think they point they want to make, is that we need to start enforcing our laws, not letting them off with 'good conduct' shortened sentences or community service. Once people realise the risk isn't worth it, they'll probably think twice.

I mean where else in the world do people purposely get put into jail over winter so they have warmth and food? Only in America.

Dude stealing a car is a hefty sentence. I think the sentence could be up to 10 years in state prison for california.

[The_Doctor]

I know my buddy's 2 older brothers called a cab and when the cabbie got there he ran in the bar so the 2 took the cab and went to the gas station and bought some chew and came right back and got charged with "joyriding" cause there was no damage to the car and the keys where in it! But every state has different laws about that shit

Wow, your buddy's brothers sound like idiots, because that is basically by the book car theft/joy riding.
They never got permission from the cabbie.
What if that cabbie was not at the bar due to their call?
The car being a cab also has nothing to do with the fact that they stole the car.

If a cabbie parked his car and left it running, walked 20 feet to pickup a newspaper off the street, does that mean anyone with intent to take a cab can get in and drive it to their hearts content?

lol It's kinda hard to call someone stupid when you aren't even using the right context of the word.


Really? Using a straw man argument just weakens your position.
Pointing out grammatical mistakes is an exercise in futility since this is the internet and we are all writing in the informal literary style.

This is neither a peer-reviewed document, nor an official paper that will be read by someone who will care about grammatical errors.
Next you're going to point out when anyone says "LOL" or makes any informal abbreviation. Oh wait, you put "lol" in your post. HAH

Also, grammar is not an accurate measure of intelligence.

[soreballz]

Seriously????? Go live in the middle east and tell me how you like it. LOL.

Fucking stupid...America is going to shits, already. Last thing it needs is anything like the middle east.

In America, our founding fathers have really created something special. Something many American citizens do not appreciate. The constitution, the Bill of Rights, and much more. We have our courts and our justice system, I know its not perfect, but its as close to perfect as it will ever get with anything involving human beings.
Yet your stupid ass wants mobs and people blowing shit up and cutting people up. Cars driving into hospitals and schools, blowing shit up. Having women covered up and stoning them to death because of disobedience. Killing people over beliefs.

Basically, you want to send America back to the middle ages. Your a great American citizen.

I can not believe your stupid ass wants to go blowing shit up like the middle east. Fucking seriously? Go move there, see how you like it. Fuck your stupid.
I think your tinfoil hat is keeping your brain from functioning properly, bucko.

I just think people who steal deserve death. I don't know where you got all that other shit from.
Why are you so offended? Are you a thief?

[raz0rbladez909]

Really? Using a straw man argument just weakens your position.
Pointing out grammatical mistakes is an exercise in futility since this is the internet and we are all writing in the informal literary style.

This is neither a peer-reviewed document, nor an official paper that will be read by someone who will care about grammatical errors.
Next you're going to point out when anyone says "LOL" or makes any informal abbreviation. Oh wait, you put "lol" in your post. HAH

Also, grammar is not an accurate measure of intelligence.

With all your overanalysis on my simple statement, did you ever stop to ask yourself this, do I really give a fuck what you have to say? ;) Keep thinking that one through, I'm sure you can analyze the fuck out of that one.

Please tell me oh wise one, how does it weaken my position on thieves?

[J3123MY]

I think your tinfoil hat is keeping your brain from functioning properly, bucko.

I just think people who steal deserve death. I don't know where you got all that other shit from.
Why are you so offended? Are you a thief?

Lol....?
I am not the one with the tin foil hat.

Your reasoning is stupid. You don't know where I got all that other shit from because your reasoning is stupid.

What about when a homeless man steals some food, death? A kid steals a candy bar, death? If stealing is a crime that warrants death, then pretty much any crime warrants death. Is that not extreme? Now don't get me wrong, people need to be punished for their crimes, but death? seriously?

human life > Property

[The_Doctor]

With all your overanalysis on my simple statement, did you ever stop to ask yourself this, do I really give a fuck what you have to say? ;) Keep thinking that one through, I'm sure you can analyze the fuck out of that one.


Haha, this is hilarious.
You basically just used another straw man argument, but even weaker this time.
I "overanalyze" Please elaborate how I have overanalyzed. I made no assumptions about you, I never made outlandish claims, nor personally attacked you.
Also, I was not directly targeting you, and if the was the impression you took from my statement, I apologize. I meant to display the futility of pointing out grammatical errors over an internet forum.

Tell me oh wise one, how does it weaken my position on thieves?It weakens your position because you seem to of run out of properly suited and on-subject rebuttles/points by regressing to pointing out grammatical errors. That is all I was stating.

You really need to improve your debate skills, I'm sorry to say sir, but you are not very good at it. When you start to personally attack or ridicule the other person, you have already lost the argument.

[Wake]

I wouldn't say its aired just for the humiliation factor, but it also makes other thieves think twice before stealing some random car. It is great that they air it because it is a deliberate means that they use to prevent other crimes from occuring. The thing about public humiliation is, it is usually caused by the actions of said person, have you ever been publicly humiliated before? I'm sure everyone here has at least some point in their life, the better question is, would you make that stupid mistake again? The last thing I'm concerned about is a criminals feelings, let em burn.

If you think that shows like bait car are going to stop any crimes from being committed you are ridiculously mistaken. If someone is really determine to go steal a car they are going to do I whether provided the opportunity or not. I will admit that I have done my fair share of stealing and Im not proud of it whatsoever, but the bottom line is that you dont know why these people are stealing. I have had to steal to eat numerous times, whether I was stealing something to sell or stealing the actual food itself. The cause of the theft is why I brought up where the cars are being planted.
If you go to a third world country and leave a big ass bag of rice sitting in the middle of the street. Its guaranteed to get taken. Same premise here and the cops know that. Why not plant a car in a suburban neighborhood where all the people that are old enough to drive already have cars and money? Therefore no need to steal and no basis for a show. In the end its basically TV companies profiting off the poor.
But none of that is relevant in any way to the title of this thread. Neither is what punishment thieves deserve for doing said crimes. The point in the thread is, Is it entrapment?
And the answer is, that the line is so fine that some people dont think it should be legal.

Exactly, but I was commenting as well on the excuses some tried to put in place regarding the economic climates of the crime and the temptations put in place.

Read above. How can you not question economic climate for a crime. You can point your finger at the thief all day but why not let them get caught committing actual crimes. IMO this show that police are fucking lazy. Instead of hitting the street and stopping actual crimes in progress they are spending time, manpower, and my fucking tax dollars to catch 1 fucking criminal at a time.
When was the last time a cop was actually around when you needed one? Know why they are never around? Because there are 20 of them at a time sitting in hotel rooms, and the backs of vans and cars waiting for 1 dude to fuck up by trying to get laid or paid.

Wow, your buddy's brothers sound like idiots, because that is basically by the book car theft/joy riding.
They never got permission from the cabbie.
What if that cabbie was not at the bar due to their call?
The car being a cab also has nothing to do with the fact that they stole the car.

If a cabbie parked his car and left it running, walked 20 feet to pickup a newspaper off the street, does that mean anyone with intent to take a cab can get in and drive it to their hearts content?



Really? Using a straw man argument just weakens your position.
Pointing out grammatical mistakes is an exercise in futility since this is the internet and we are all writing in the informal literary style.

This is neither a peer-reviewed document, nor an official paper that will be read by someone who will care about grammatical errors.
Next you're going to point out when anyone says "LOL" or makes any informal abbreviation. Oh wait, you put "lol" in your post. HAH

Also, grammar is not an accurate measure of intelligence.



With all your overanalysis on my simple statement, did you ever stop to ask yourself this, do I really give a fuck what you have to say? ;) Keep thinking that one through, I'm sure you can analyze the fuck out of that one.

Tell me oh wise one, how does it weaken my position on thieves?

I fyou dont give a fuck what someone has to say in response to your bullshit, then you shouldnt be on a FORUM.

fo·rum (fôrm, fr-)
n. pl. fo·rums also fo·ra (fôr, fr)
1.
a. The public square or marketplace of an ancient Roman city that was the assembly place for judicial activity and public business.
b. A public meeting place for open discussion.
c. A medium for open discussion or voicing of ideas, such as a newspaper, a radio or television program, or a website.
2. A public meeting or presentation involving a discussion usually among experts and often including audience participation.
3. A court of law; a tribunal.

BTW you just got bent over the internet by The_Doc, Twice

[raz0rbladez909]

Haha, this is hilarious.
You basically just used another straw man argument, but even weaker this time.
I "overanalyze" Please elaborate how I have overanalyzed. I made no assumptions about you, I never made outlandish claims, nor personally attacked you.
Also, I was not directly targeting you, and if the was the impression you took from my statement, I apologize. I meant to display the futility of pointing out grammatical errors over an internet forum.

It weakens your position because you seem to of run out of properly suited and on-subject rebuttles/points by regressing to pointing out grammatical errors. That is all I was stating.

You really need to improve your debate skills, I'm sorry to say sir, but you are not very good at it. When you start to personally attack or ridicule the other person, you have already lost the argument.

Did you read anything prior to when I wrote that to him? My statement wasn't a rebuttle to anything he was saying, I was in no argument with him, nor was it an attack on him. I simply pointed out that if he was going to call the guy stupid he might want to use the word in the manner he intended.

You overanalyze because I meant nothing from the statement, you have led yourself to believe that it was in an argumentative manner towards J3123MY when it wasn't. I had not been involved with his conversation with soreballz, and there was no argument to be won between them, it was a matter of personal opinons of both parties there is no winner.

[Matej]

Find a bait car, then post on Craigslist that you are selling it and potential buyers are welcome to take it for a test drive, since you have sweet theft prevention devices in it.

[The_Doctor]

Did you read anything prior to when I wrote that to him? My statement wasn't a rebuttle to anything he was saying, I was in no argument with him, nor was it an attack on him. I simply pointed out that if he was going to call the guy stupid he might want to use the word in the manner he intended.

You overanalyze because I meant nothing from the statement, you have led yourself to believe that it was in an argumentative manner towards J3123MY when it wasn't. I had not been involved with his conversation with soreballz, and there was no argument to be won between them, it was a matter of personal opinons of both parties there is no winner.

Again, I did not intend to single you out. Your response just sparked an insight that I thought would be proper to share with the community.
It was definitely off topic and I apologize for that.
I just am sick of people pointing out menial grammatical errors over the internet as an appropriate refute of their point.

[soreballz]

Lol....?
I am not the one with the tin foil hat.

Your reasoning is stupid. You don't know where I got all that other shit from because your reasoning is stupid.

What about when a homeless man steals some food, death? A kid steals a candy bar, death? If stealing is a crime that warrants death, then pretty much any crime warrants death. Is that not extreme? Now don't get me wrong, people need to be punished for their crimes, but death? seriously?

human life > Property
Ehh. You seem like the type...

My reasoning isn't stupid. You're just the sort of fellow that likes to make a fight out of everything and assume that somebody meant something more than what they said. My statement about punishments for theft in middle eastern countries was typed out exactly the way I intended it to sound. Nowhere did I mention mobs, TERRORISM, stoning women, or killing people over their beliefs.* Steal a car; car goes boom. Kills THE THIEF, not innocent women, children in schools, whatever. The thief... The criminal. The person who lives to TAKE from what other people WORK so hard to earn.

Stealing from a business is different from stealing from a person. "But what if that business is one person's life?! Waaaahhh...." Whatever. Stealing a car is far different from stealing a candy bar. "But where do you draw the line then? Waaahhh your [sic] stupid!" Fuck off. Petty theft deserves a good swift beating. Grand theft deserves something far more severe. You want something? FUCKING WORK FOR IT. Take from me, and I'll gladly take your life.


Ever been a victim of grand theft? It's pretty fucking shitty. If I was allowed to do so, I would happily execute every car thief on the planet.



* = Though, if somebody believes theft is a-okay and runs around stealing cars, then they can die in a fucking fire.


Cliffs:
C4 to blow up car thieves = cool.
Terrorism - since that is what you were implying = not cool.



Kids these days...

[codyace]

Dude stealing a car is a hefty sentence. I think the sentence could be up to 10 years in state prison for california.

So really a year and a few months, off on good behaivor with some probation.

That's the issue.


(Although that's a different topic in itself)

[mrflip69]

Who's up for a "drift" bait car? Would make for some serious lulz like that fat guy who got caught stealing someone's wheels and selling them back to the original owner!

[KOUKIboy]

Fuck thieves!!! they get what they deserve, don't care if its entrapment or not, we need more bait cars here on the US, too many damn car thieves!!! I think this a help full tool to clean our streets and make them safer...Saw the ultimate thief deterrent from Australia or New Zealand cant remember were it was from, but dude walks up to steal a car and the damn thing shout out flames!!! it was awesome...Maybe theres a you tube video???

[kenS14]

Agree with everyone theives should "die"...They should use a 240 for bait and get these theives in socal...

[ericcastro]

I think what we need is some sort of system to make a affordable tracking system.
Not many people wanna pony up a grand for one.

Not manditory for new cars of course, cause then you get into my paraniod big brother worries, but something in the $400 range would really do well.

[S14DB]

I think what we need is some sort of system to make a affordable tracking system.
Not many people wanna pony up a grand for one.

Not manditory for new cars of course, cause then you get into my paraniod big brother worries, but something in the $400 range would really do well.

You can get brand name trackers for $99.

[BlackestCoupe]

I love that show! Its fair game.

[codyace]

You can get brand name trackers for $99.

or even the cell phone/trac phones seem to work well

[Homer_Simpson]

All fair game. If the asshole has the mentality of coming up on properties that doesn't belong to them in the first place then they deserve it.

[ericcastro]

You can get brand name trackers for $99.

I thought lowjack and all that stuff was like a grand for lifetime or something.

Maybe I havent looked into it for awhile, but i would really like to put one on the race car.

[DS562]

i forgot about this thread. but really, alot of people say lowjack and similar systems are useless because highly experienced thieves can get around them with ease. but then again, how many thieves are experienced and not some hood trying to show how down he is?

[LoneStarSilvia]

I thought lowjack and all that stuff was like a grand for lifetime or something.

Maybe I havent looked into it for awhile, but i would really like to put one on the race car.



From what i heard from a local that just had his bike stolen, lojack is worthless because you have to have an officer show up before they turn the tracking system on, and we all know how timely the police can be sometimes.

[BoostSlideWayz]

you dont really have to buy lowjack.. they sell small gps items that you pay like 50 bucks for and you instantly get a program that gives you the exact location of your car on a map every 5 seconds... cheaper... and just as effective.

and the bait car is an awesome show.. nothing like seein the asshole thinking he/she just got a free car then it shut off lol

[LoneStarSilvia]

Yea I'm watching it for the first time, they've always got some bullshit excuse after gettin caught. I really wish they would figure out how to catch the "real" car thieves.