SR20DET vs 3sgte [Archive] - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

drift freaq

08-14-2003, 10:44 PM

if you really want some amunition look at the bore and stroke of the 3sGTe. If I am correct its not nearly as perfect as the SR bore and stroke meaning the SR can out rev it. the SR bore and stroke are 86mmX86mm meaning with rocker stoppers and heavy duty valve springs and cams your looking at a 9k engine! You can also throw larger injectors onto a SR direct bolt on. the kouki S14 SR came with 440 injectors as did the S15 SR. You can also put a HKS GT3037and GTsr turbo's on a stock SR manifold which is a 400 hp plus turbo's. Yes the stock SR bottom can handle it. timing chains last longer than timing belts. ya timing belts may be smoother but I can tell you there are a awful lot racecar engines in the world with timing chains. In the long run timing chains are less matinence. timing belts need to be replaced every 60-80 thousand miles or your engine goes boom. Seen it so don't argue !!
Look at this way guys , In Japan custom car builders use more SR's than 3sgte's . Bigger aftermarket support for the SR as well . Don't get me wrong the 3sgte is a damn good engine but I think your mr2 friend has a serious case of my car is better than your car and needs to grow up. 2nd and 3rd gen MR2's rock! 240sx/200sx/180sx/silvia's rock!! Different engines , different cars each has its pro's and cons.
I happen to like both but I think a ****ing match over the two engines is just that a ****ing match. give it up. Tell your friend he has a good engine and car but you prefer the SR and thats your choice. Walk away if he can't respect that he needs to grow up period!!:eek: :bash: ;) :bow:

fooddude

08-15-2003, 03:52 AM

10000000 times easier to work on SR powered FR than the MR2 jungle-gym.

kidinthehall

08-15-2003, 10:40 AM

what difference does it make what engine is "better"? line up, stomp his ***, end game? If you put enough money in anything you can make up for just about any engineering flaws.....

curbsurfer

08-15-2003, 06:45 PM

3sgte intake manifolds suck. some mr2 guys get 30+ HP from an intake manifold upgrade.

the stock turbos are bigger but they are just as crappy as t25.

the engine also has to breath thru a 2x2" hole on the AFM. upgrading the AFM is a pain as you either need a VPC or standalone. whereas sr20, all you need is a AFC and 300zx mafs which is more common than a HKS VPC which I think is discontinued.

Buzzbomber

08-16-2003, 10:00 AM

Let me put it this way. i own an mr2, and the other car i am currently looking for is...a silvia! its pretty freakin even. a guy on the mr2 message boards is putting down 515 RWHP on stock internals. but this SR is capable of that too i believe. at least close.

see, i had this debate once about a year ago, and i just decided, hell, ill get both cars. :D

SR240SXT

08-16-2003, 10:24 AM

Originally posted by curbsurfer

the stock turbos are bigger but they are just as crappy as t25.

what the hell are you talking about, CT26s are good for a stock turbo. My bro has a 91 MR2 turbo and runs like 15 lbs on the stock turbo with the stock intercooler and a 50 shot - its rediculously fast.

Buzzbomber

08-16-2003, 10:52 AM

they are good, but not great. its VERY difficult to get 300 RWHP from a CT26. ill say impossible on a stock CT26 without nitrous.

however, the cars are already fast as is, and can run around a 13.0 ET if mods are done right.

DudeYourSoOOJDM

08-16-2003, 06:10 PM

what the hell are you talking about

What he's talking about is that although it's a bit bigger...its not all that and a bag of chips.

You see....Curbsurfer happens to be a out of the Closet toyota fanatic.....

The kind that puts 4AGZE's into corollas, 2JZGTE's into MKIII's, and a 1JZ into an S13.....can you say 250SX? he can.....

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 11:35 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by drift freaq
if you really want some amunition look at the bore and stroke of the 3sGTe. If I am correct its not nearly as perfect as the SR bore and stroke meaning the SR can out rev it. the SR bore and stroke are 86mmX86mm meaning with rocker stoppers and heavy duty valve springs and cams your looking at a 9k engine! You can also throw larger injectors onto a SR direct bolt on. the kouki S14 SR came with 440 injectors as did the S15 SR. You can also put a HKS GT3037and GTsr turbo's on a stock SR manifold which is a 400 hp plus turbo's. Yes the stock SR bottom can handle it. timing chains last longer than timing belts. ya timing belts may be smoother but I can tell you there are a awful lot racecar engines in the world with timing chains. In the long run timing chains are less matinence. timing belts need to be replaced every 60-80 thousand miles or your engine goes boom. Seen it so don't argue !![/QUOTE

Dear sir,

You are sorely mis-informed, as much of your information is inaccurate.

1.) The bore and stroke on the 3SGTE is also square, meaning it is 86mm x 86mm. The head of the 3SGTE was built by Yamaha, for racing applications and is definately stronger than the SR20DET head. There is a member on our boards by the name of Jeff Burke, who revs to 9800 rpm, albeit not on a stock drivetrain. Typically, the stock 3SGTE revs to 8000 rpm happily.

2.) The injectors on the 3SGTE are 440cc.

3.) The block has been proven to outlast the SR20. There are several people on the MR2 board running over 500whp on a stock, unopened motor.

4.) Timing chains? Pretty irrelevant. They both perform the same function, one just needs to be replaced a bit sooner. If you're lazy, that's not the engine's problem.

* As a final point to my argument, I'd like to point out that Jeff Fazio is running low 12s in the quarter, on an unopened 3SGTE with over 200,000 miles. He is shooting for 11s, as well.

DudeYourSoOOJDM

08-17-2003, 12:01 PM

As said earlier.....

The motors may be comparable but the cars are a totally different story.....

Build your car, Drive it, dont worry about anything else

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 12:16 PM

Originally posted by Hypersh1ft240
As said earlier.....

The motors may be comparable but the cars are a totally different story.....

Build your car, Drive it, dont worry about anything else

Agreed.

I was just addressing certain inaccuracies.

DudeYourSoOOJDM

08-17-2003, 12:21 PM

And you're right.

The onejayz we have also says Yamaha on it....

When your timing chain rattles...IT SUCKS

When you break a timing belt, from being lazy...IT REALLY SUCKS

Phase 2 is making a pretty powerful STOCK block SR powered car right now...I think 520 on high boost?

that says alot for any motor if it can go 200k....let alone racing it

drift freaq

08-17-2003, 02:09 PM

quote JDMsw20.....
[Dear sir,

You are sorely mis-informed, as much of your information is inaccurate.

1.) The bore and stroke on the 3SGTE is also square, meaning it is 86mm x 86mm. The head of the 3SGTE was built by Yamaha, for racing applications and is definately stronger than the SR20DET head. There is a member on our boards by the name of Jeff Burke, who revs to 9800 rpm, albeit not on a stock drivetrain. Typically, the stock 3SGTE revs to 8000 rpm happily.

2.) The injectors on the 3SGTE are 440cc.

3.) The block has been proven to outlast the SR20. There are several people on the MR2 board running over 500whp on a stock, unopened motor.

4.) Timing chains? Pretty irrelevant. They both perform the same function, one just needs to be replaced a bit sooner. If you're lazy, that's not the engine's problem.

* As a final point to my argument, I'd like to point out that Jeff Fazio is running low 12s in the quarter, on an unopened 3SGTE with over 200,000 miles. He is shooting for 11s, as well.
]
and so we have a blatant MR2 loving newbie flaming away on our hands. I did not state I was correct. Interesting how he missed the IF!!!!!!!
It is interesting though, last night at a wedding of a friend I was talking to a MKIV supra owner. He is going to run a SR over a 3sgte in place of his 2Jze because it was lighter and could produce more HP easier than the 3sgte hmmm and this is coming from a dyed in the wool Supra tuner!
so what if your head was built by Yamaha. oh its stronger? hmm heads don't need to be strong thats the bottom ends job. Heads need to flow and the SR head does. You do not want to start even going down the road of who builds what heads and so forth because Both Nissan and Honda have always built proven race engines and Toyota is late to that game and Always relied on Yamaha . gee I wonder why.
SR blocks as well most all Nissan blocks have proven to be near bullet proof. If a SR had a problem its not block related its in the fact that from the factory the engine comes with a very shallow oil pan with a close pick up meaning it can be damaged easily. This is easily fixed with a Greddy Oil pan . Timing chains have nothing to do with being lazy. Its called lower matinence and I would take that anyday of the week because it allows me to think about more import things in life and my car, not lazy . Intelligent!!! period:mrmeph:

Oh ya stock SR's rev to 8k too!! chump. I did not have the bore and stroke for the 3sgte so crucify me for being wrong:mrmeph:
lets raise a flag for Jeff Fazio :rolleyes:
drag racing a MR2 hahahhahahhahhaha brillaint use of a great grip car hahahhahahhahahhaha.
dude go back to the MR2 boards were you belong. don't come here picking fights for the sake of it. I made a mistake but your misinformation is just as bad so lose the attitude.
OH ya if you want to know why I flamed you like this its because you are being mr I am so defiant smarty pants .

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 02:15 PM

Originally posted by drift freaq
and so we have a blatant MR2 loving newbie flaming away on our hands. I did not state I was correct.
It is interesting though, last night at a wedding of a friend I was talking to a MKIV supra owner. He is going to run a SR over a 3sgte in place of his 2Jze because it was lighter and could produce more HP easier than the 3sgte hmmm and this is coming from a dyed in the wool Supra tuner
so what if your head was built by Yamaha. oh its stronger? hmm heads don't need to be strong thats the bottom ends job. Heads need to flow and the SR head does. You do not want to start even going down the road of who builds what heads and so forth because Both Nissan and Honda have always built proven race engines and Toyota is late to that game and Always relied on Yamaha . gee I wonder why.
SR blocks as well most all Nissan blocks have proven to be near bullet proof. If a SR had a problem its not block related its in the fact that from the factory the engine comes with a very shallow oil pan with a close pick up meaning it can be damaged easily. This is easily fixed with a Greddy Oil pan . Timing chains have nothing to do with being lazy. Its called lower matinence and I would take that anyday of the week because it allows me to think about more import things in life and my car, not lazy . Intelligent!!! period:mrmeph:

Typical, starting a flame war because you're wrong.

GT500 Supras run 3SGTEs in them for better weight distribution, not SR20s. Go look it up.

Your comment about heads not needing to be built needs no response, you clearly show us your ignorance with that statement. It's people who think that way that start bending valves and breaking lifters.

Again, Toyota has a very strong race presence. Your comments are biased and completely baseless.

Toyota relying on Yamaha? I don't think so. Yamaha sourced the head for the 3SGTE, that's it. Yamaha has continually proven that their work is top-notch in racing--as can be seen with the Taurus SHO v6, which was made by Yamaha (a very good motor!).

I don't have anything against the SR20DET, I even like the engine. I was simply correcting your mistakes.

I just think it's sad that you resort to name-calling, and defamation when you feel challenged. It really says a lot about this message board.

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 02:21 PM

To add, since I forgot:

Your comment about the block being bulletproof: Yes, it is bulletproof. It is also aluminum, which is prone to flexing at higher horsepower levels; as opposed to a cast iron block which WILL NOT FLEX.

There are only a few subtle differences between the engines:

* SR20DET is an aluminum block, as opposed to the 3SGTE's cast iron.
* The 3SGTE has piston oil squirters, the SR20 does not.
* The 3SGTE has a wide valve angle, and does not use rockers, rather a direct lift system.
* The 3SGTE's pistons are bevelled for clearance.

According to all the research I've done, these engineering differences make the 3SGTE better suited for holding power.

I'm not trying to say the SR20DET is a bad engine, I'm simply trying to lend a devil's advocate approach to the argument. The majority of you seem mature enough to handle some friendly argumentation. However, some do not.

curbsurfer

08-17-2003, 02:27 PM

drift freaq says "I did not state I was correct"

haha, what is that? so your saying your wrong, then?
dude, you need to chill out. you sound like you overcompensating for something.

of course an MR2 guy thinks his 3sgte is better, of course a 240 guy thinks his sr20 is better

and for your friend that is putting an sr20 in a supra. i say good luck on getting that car to move. he is better off turboing the n/a than putting a 4 cylinder in one of those pigs(3500lbs). those cars need 6cylinders to move them.
the jgtc supras you see with those engines are in there only because of weight and because they are limited to 500hp. they would rather save a little weight and put more money in the engine to make 500hp. those cars are also tube frame and are under 3000lbs. so i hope your freind isnt trying to be like one of them.

drift freaq

08-17-2003, 02:29 PM

quote JDMsw20 once again...[Typical, starting a flame war because you're wrong.

GT500 Supras run 3SGTEs in them for better weight distribution, not SR20s. Go look it up.

Your comment about heads not needing to be built needs no response, you clearly show us your ignorance with that statement. It's people who think that way that start bending valves and breaking lifters.]

Again, Toyota has a very strong race presence. Your comments are biased and completely baseless.

Toyota relying on Yamaha? I don't think so. Yamaha sourced the head for the 3SGTE, that's it. Yamaha has continually proven that their work is top-notch in racing.

I don't have anything against the SR20DET, I even like the engine. I was simply correcting your mistakes.

I just think it's sad that you resort to name-calling, and defamation when you feel challenged. It really says a lot about this message board.}

look first off I happen to know why the Supra guys run the 3sgte you seemed to have missed the point in my comment. The tuner was picking the SR over the 3sgte for its performance value and yes he was doing it for weight. You seem to take a lot of things out of context and read into what people are saying.
As far as heads being built . I am again totally aware heads need to be built but !!!! and a big one at that is, you were talking about stock heads vs stock heads . I was commenting on the fact that Toyota uses Yamaha for their perfomance engine heads and the fact that Nissan and Honda have always built great performance engine heads in house and never had to rely on a third party for their heads.
This has always been this way since the 1960's .
ya I called you a :mrmeph: and your response to me proved I was right.
You come on here immediatly start trying to prove people wrong you miss the point in my comment that I said IF!! I was wrong but the way you went about telling me I made a mistake was as bad or worse than what I did. Why because you posted misinformation about the SR as well . Two wrongs do not make a right.
second you read a awful lot into what I said and completely misinterpreted my points.
Look , I have been tuning and playing with Japanese cars since the late 70's . I know a awful lot about what to do and how to do it.
It's funny how you think yourself so smart that you read stuff into my statements that were not even there.
Oh so you can't stand being called something you maybe when you act that way. well I am sorry and excuse me. I call them like I see them and you need to grow up if it bothers you.

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by drift freaq

lets raise a flag for Jeff Fazio :rolleyes:
drag racing a MR2 hahahhahahhahhaha brillaint use of a great grip car hahahhahahhahahhaha.

Do you realize what you're saying? The very thing that makes a drag car a good drag car is "grip." You need to hook up the tires in order to put the power down. This makes the MR2 a very very good drag car. MR2 60' are close to those of AWD cars, because of the engine on the rear axles.

Stock GenIII MR2s are capable of high 12s, that seems pretty good to me.

Just because the car was designed to grip, doesn't mean that it has to "TACKLE THE TWISTIES." People can do with their cars what they want.

Originally posted by drift freaq

I made a mistake but your misinformation is just as bad so lose the attitude.

My misinformation? I challenge you to prove me wrong with empirical data.

curbsurfer

08-17-2003, 02:34 PM

who are you talking to?

i never said sr20's are put in toyota jgtc cars. now you are reading too much into what i am saying.

if your such a great tuner from the 70's and you know so much more than me, why dont you show us some great cars with your name on it?

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 02:35 PM

I'm not going to bother quoting "drift freaq," because our conversations are so long.

Of course I signed up to your board. What's the point in debating if you're not going to have someone from the other camp?

Your posts seem very defensive. I'm simply trying to provide arguments... if you can't reply to them in a grown-up, calm manner, then please don't.

The 3SGTE is based on the 503E, which is a racing engine. Toyota contracted Yamaha to design the head for the 3SGTE. The head is based on a motorcyle engine design, so it goes without saying that it's a strong revving motor. I don't know about you, but I think that was a good call.

I don't see how your implied incompetence of Toyota makes the SR20DET 'better'?

I would like someone else to chime in, since there is no real substance to drift freaq's argument.

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 02:38 PM

curbsurfer, I believe he was talking to me. :)

curbsurfer

08-17-2003, 02:43 PM

this thread reminds me of the flame wars on supraforums a couple years ago. it was 2jzgte vs. rb26dett. it went nowhere then and it is going nowhere now.

this is entertaining though so lets keep it coming.

RedRoof2

08-17-2003, 03:09 PM

okay, i just thought I'd drop by. Yeah i'm a deuce owner and I absolutely LOVE the SR20 as well. I just see a lot of glowing inaccuracies and the start of a really stupid flame war about two great motors.

BOTH motors have their strongpoints and weak points, IMO.
The SR20 has a shallow oil pan, pump cavitation issues, less efficient valvetrain design and the potential for bore distortion under higher pressures.
It also has a kickass head port design, great revvability and of course, less weight to carry around.

The USDM 3sgte is handicapped by an over-aggressive ECU, crappy airflow meter, semi-tempermental headgaskets at higher power levels, stock hyperutectic pistons that love to break ringlands at the slightest hint of detonation and of course, the "jungle gym" engine bay situation as described before. We also have coolant flow issues on the exhaust side of the head, the tendency to warp exahust manifolds on earlier models and of course, the need to change a timing belt every 60k. [though the engine is non-interference]. 3SGTE's also have a strong bottom end, decent port design, excellent valvetrain design and the ability to make a CRAPLOAD of power when built and tuned correctly, without the need for sleeves.

We can argue these points day in and out, but in the end, both motors are excellent at what they do, or they wouldn't be the head to head competitors that they are. If I had a 240, I'd stuff an SR20 under the hood, no questions asked. I have an MR2 - i'm glad it came with a 3sgte.
For those people who want to do hybrids - Supras with SR20's, more power to you if you can make it work, but i'm not going to take it as God's Truth just because someone owns a supra and does custom work. Honestly, there are a great deal of Supra drivers with their heads shoved FAR up their asses. Anybody who's been to Supraforums.com knows that already.
Let's stop fooling ourselves - the MR2 and 240 communities are probably two of the most unique import communities out there.
We have rare motors and rare cars but we appreciate our ownership of said cars BECAUSE of that rarity.

Bench race all you want, but when you look at the top HP production 4-cylinders out there, the 3SGTE and SR20DET are BOTH on top of the list.

JDMSW20

08-17-2003, 03:15 PM

Thank you for a very informative, mature post, Redroof. :)

RedRoof2

08-17-2003, 03:19 PM

no prob ;) 240 and MR2 communites oughta be banding together.

we're the only turbo-4 2WD import communities left...

Xlr8Mr2

08-17-2003, 04:36 PM

Yah both engines are very good. This debate is a good one, with each side have pros/cons but in the end, i say we all just have fun tuning and driving the **** outta our cars

HAPPY BOOSTING;)

Sircnay

08-17-2003, 04:37 PM

WTF? The SR20DET and the 3sgte are both incredibly awesome engines. Both totally kick *** among the 4 cylinders. These two engines are put into two cars which are in my opinion the best sport compact turbo 4's coming out of Japan. I mean these two cars can be kick *** auto-x cars, kick *** road racing cars, or kick *** drag cars. These two cars are the last cars that to have been riced out. Albeit the 240 is catching the cancer quicker than the MR2. Both of these cars are so freaking awesome it's ridiculous. Everyone who has an MR2 turbo should own a SR20DET powered 240sx. Everyone who has a SR20DET powered 240sx should own a MR2 turbo. These two cars are fairly equal when it comes to performance. In the end it should be a coin toss if you have to choose between the two.

And drift freaq quit being an :mrmeph:

Jsquared

08-17-2003, 09:17 PM

first off, I love both engines (and the cars they go in), and I'm a member on MR2faq boards (although I haven't been there in like a year :D). I was also about 2 weeks away from owning an MR2 turbo until I found my coupe chassis for a steal.

JDMSW20, if you're going to "call people out" and be anal retentive about details, I see it as my duty to correct you on a certain point: SR20s do have oil squirters for the pistons. And the SR is a bit stronger, I've seen all sorts of MkIIs blow head gaskets even on the stock turbo, and the GenIII swap wouldn't be so popular if the US-market engine had a stronger head :D Also, SRs don't need to be sleeved for high boost, as you implied.

now that i've defended the SR20DET, I will make concessions to the 3S-GTE. I really really dislike the valvetrain setup on the SR, and nothing can touch a mid-engined layout :D

misnomer

08-17-2003, 10:41 PM

yay redroof! You kick ***!

Anyhow, the rest of y'all need to quit ****ing at each other. We've got guests over from the MR2 boards and you are making us look bad :P

I honestly have nothing to add without throwing the KA24 into the argument. . .

Just, stop naming people and their fast cars. Anybody can make any car fast on pretty much any engine. We know there are fast cars on both sides. We don't need to tally up which side has more ('cause it would be the SR, given it's higher popularity ;p). Do what you do and stop caring so much about what the other doods are doing.

Sircnay

08-17-2003, 10:59 PM

Yeah, I love both cars, owned both cars. I will own both car similtaneously someday. All other Japanese I4 should bow down to us.

H-dogg

08-18-2003, 03:12 AM

i own a mr2 and driven a sr20 240 and i gotta say that they are both good engines. they have their pro and cons to them. i would hope sometime in the future i will own a sr to have some fun.

TonyC

08-18-2003, 03:57 AM

Just to comment on the oil squirters... SR20DETs do have them. USDM SR20DEs do not. I'm not sure about JDM SR20DEs or the SR20VE. Hell, I'm sure KA24s have oil squirters.

fdesalvo

08-18-2003, 10:27 AM

Guys,

I'm visiting from the MR2 camp and wanted to support an obvious fact posted by people on both sides of this issue.

Ask yourselves why you are here posting in this forum. The answer is that you love your car, you love tuning your car, and you love driving your car. Guess what? So do guys on the LS1, Mustang, and other boards accross the net. Isn't it possible to discuss the differences in our engines and not allow the discussion to degrade into name-calling? It's time we embrace the differences which make our cars unique among the homogenized, mass-produced cookie-cutters out there. The MR2 and the 240 represent what many consider to be the last true sport coupes out there.

I love my MR2 and I love the fact that I rarely see them on the road-unlike civics and accords, etc...You should love the fact that not every car on the road is a 240 and that your car is unique as well. Our differences in opinion make us unique and special.

Peace to my fellow enthusiasts,

~F
MEtallic Blue 93na

DudeYourSoOOJDM

08-18-2003, 11:29 AM

And can we leave it at that.

Comparisons are good....but Flames are STUPID.

I love both cars and both motors, I respect what you can do with both motors, that's all ya need.

RedRoof2

08-18-2003, 03:43 PM

Tuna

08-18-2003, 10:19 PM

Originally posted by James
So what MR2 boards are all y'all coming from?
Or just link the thread that is pointing to this one...i.e.
"3SGTE vs. baby jesus' chariot" (typical 240 owners:rolleyes: )

:D

here's the thread http://www.board.mr2faq.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=162511 :D

back on topic:...like most of the other mr2 owners have already stated, both motors rock!....me and my brother have had these arguments before as well...he used to own a 91 Sentra SE-R (he was planning to swap out the sr20de for a sr20det)...and i own a 93 MR2 Turbo...i think both motors are great and i'd LOVE to own a 240 with a sr20det swapped into it...the 3sgte and sr20det as well as the MR2 and the 240 are both very comparable...very equal competition...i obviously prefer the mr2 (otherwise why would i own one) but i cant honestly say either one of these cars/engines is the clear cut better of the two....and as far as this forum....mad props...you guys seem 99% free of the egotistical "my car is the best car ever made" kind of people *cough*supraforums.com*cough*...your forum and our forum are alike in this way...mr2 people in general are very cool people...of course we both have our bad apples but that's a given (we just had a problem with one of our members posting a vid of an mr2 beating a firebird on the ls1 forums, which was a stupid thing to do but also they replied like children in the "domestics own imports" and "no replacement for displacement" style that i see from many closed-minded domestic lovers)....

abridged version of this post: mr2's and 240's rock...3sgte's and sr20det's rock...http://board.mr2faq.com and http://www.zilvia.net rock...so let's party! http://www.mr2ownersclub.com/images/smilies/beerchug.gif

saga240

08-19-2003, 01:48 AM

yes both groups are very cool! so keep the peace and lets just have fun..

both cars are great, i know so! hah

:)

Sircnay

08-19-2003, 11:24 AM

Who's bringing the chips and drinks?!

bobmr2

08-19-2003, 01:39 PM

props to everyone.. very mature way of handling a good debate.. makes me proud to own an import...

Both cars kick ***, and we need to all band together to show the riceboyz what a true sport compact is!!!!!!:D

Jsquared

08-19-2003, 08:08 PM

yeah, hope i didn't come off like a prick in my post :D like i said, i was a week or two away from owning an MR2 turbo before i found a steal on my '92 coupe (dead KA, got it CHEAP in good shape). one day i will have a house with the entire first floor as a garage, with an MR2 turbo, my S13, an FD, and a 914/6, at least. :boink: and i'm a member of the mr2board forums (and rx7club), just haven't been there in a long time since i've been spending so much time with my S13.

Sabertooth

08-26-2003, 03:48 PM

Where's drift freaq's rebuttal?

old_s13

08-26-2003, 05:41 PM

I think you guys are retarded.

Dont come on a NISSAN forum and expect people to like the Toyota motor more, that wont happen. Dont diss the Toyota motor and expect Toyota enthusiasts to NOT say anything. And last but not least, dont take everything you hear on these forums seriously. Dont let ONE person speak for the community.

I am both a Toyota and NISSAN enthusiast, I have always appreciated the vehicles being produced by BOTH manufacturers. When push comes to shove, I will take a NISSAN.. its just my default choice, I've always had a thing for NISSAN vehicles. But that is not to say Toyota is not good, or that their cars arent good (some better, some worse).

There are SO many things to take into consideration when comparing cars and motors, etc.. like HOW MUCH the cars cost? MR-2 turbos are not cheap cars, neither are the parts or the insurance on these vehicles. I wouldnt be surprised if the MR-2 has better parts here and there, but to think.. the turbo 240's are also very worth competetors, considering they cost a lot less.

So why talk ****? Dont expect NISSAN guys to know EVERYTHING about Toyotas. Thats the same reason I didnt expect that Toyota enthusiast to know that the SR20DET (and KA24DE) come stock with oil squirters.

Dont hate -- appreciate.

drift freaq

08-26-2003, 06:11 PM

quote from sabertooth the rabble rouser :D J/K[Where's drift freaq's rebuttal?]

my rebuttal is this I bowed out of this thread awhile back because I had made my point. I made one mistake which I admitted. What I disliked was how the MR2 owners were so vehemently claiming there cars and engines were superior. Like old_s13 said, I don't dislike Toyota's I do have a preference towards Nissan. This a Nissan board you don't see me coming over to the MR2 boards and trying to flame bait like the MR2 guys were doing here.
This really makes the MR2 crowd look a lot worse than the 240 crowd IMHO.
I actually happen to like MR2's . I have experience behind the seat of driving one they are a blast. I have friends that own MR2's .
I do not try to tell them their engine sucks and they do not do that to me about the SR.
The MR2 guys who got into this thread and started the war would do best to own up. I don't think they are willing to. oh well.
Thing is like I stated before Nissan has always been Japans premier sports car company. Toyota and the other companies have always been playing catch up. Its a known fact plain and simple.
Ask anyone from Japan( yes I have a lot of Japanese friends including my girlfriend).
That point seemed to be lost on a lot of you. If you think I am an asshole you do not know me and you should not judge. It would be to funny to watch you eat your words if you ever actually met me.
oh and by the way guys the S13 hatch and Mr2 are both sports cars not sport compacts. Sport Compacts are FF cars not FR cars IMHO.

rps13 SR

08-28-2003, 09:45 PM

i just want to add that the 3sgte's head flows more air to the number 3 cylinder and mr2s have problems in rainy dayss... hehe

i have a sr powered 240sx.. and my brother has a mr2 turbo.. i love both cars.. but i chose the 240 cause i like the fact that you can drift with it... drift a mr2 is hard but no impossible.. 240sx with lsd is made to drift...

other thing.. red top sr20det make 5 hp more than 91 mr2 turbo's
sr20det pushes 7psi vs 3sgte 10-13 to acheive the 200 mark... and the sr20 does that with a smaller turbo...

but i still love both.. just that i have more knowlege of cars than my bro so i just make fun of his car cause i dont have it.. but truthfully i love his car.. midengines looks a lot better than 240sx no matter what... but thats my opinion

240SX714

08-29-2003, 01:36 AM

Let's compare the car: 240s have 4 seats, Mr2 haves 2! end of discussion muuuuuuhahahahha! I'm trying to cheer every1 up. My dad's camry has 5 seats -----> the beast!

saga240

08-29-2003, 03:23 AM

Mr2 + 3sgte = legal

240sx + Sr20det = NOT LEGAL

end of discussion

lol

tougebear

08-29-2003, 12:20 PM

Originally posted by saga240
Mr2 + 3sgte = legal

240sx + Sr20det = NOT LEGAL

end of discussion

lol

MR2 + Gen 3 3S-GTE = illegal

andrave

08-29-2003, 04:57 PM

**** both engines, everyone knows the ka24E owns all.

right?

right????

Sircnay

08-29-2003, 05:52 PM

Oh, whatever we all know that the stock for stock the B13 is soooo much better than both engines because it makes more power per liter..... or something like that. But I'm not going to research it or look it up because it's a B13, the little brother of the H22. So therefore I am right. So shut up.

mmdb

08-30-2003, 05:10 PM

Don't forget the interlocking rear diff on the lower MR2's. I saw some guy plow through a crowd because of it. No one was injured only a few bangs up here 'n there. MR2 is also a 2 seater. Other than that it's a great platform because of the chassis layout. Would make a great track car.

The mid engine layout can be a pain and you gotta drop the engine to work on it. But you start off with a car that already has the turbo. Like someone mentioned earlier ring lands are not fun to replace with it's your only car. Oh final thing: insurance classifys the mr2 as a sports coupe so insurance will be pretty pricey for those of you with ticket such as myself.

As for the 240 i found it to be more practical to do road racing, casual driving, and more room to store stuff. Only problem is starting off with the ka24de. Also the engine bay has a grip load of room to work in. Minor drawback is the slush box shifter feel. But a BM short shifter fixes it up extremely well.

Off the topic: a bit ironic that the supra relies on a 4 cyclinder to power itself through a track.

hmooblis

08-30-2003, 10:22 PM

did the celica come with 3s engine? what years?
how bout we put the 3s in to the s13....hahaha:mrmeph: s

89s132b

08-31-2003, 08:21 AM

Originally posted by Sircnay
Oh, whatever we all know that the stock for stock the B13 is soooo much better than both engines because it makes more power per liter..... or something like that. But I'm not going to research it or look it up because it's a B13, the little brother of the H22. So therefore I am right. So shut up.

Come'on. Let's not taint this dicsussion by bringing up Honduhs. And what is a b13? Maybe you meant b16 or b18?

All in all, this thread has really enlightend me about MR2's. I know about the stregths and weaknesses of the SR20det cause I have one. I knew very little of the 3sgte. Now I know a little - thanks

:D

DudeYourSoOOJDM

08-31-2003, 09:49 AM

a bit ironic that the supra relies on a 4 cyclinder to power itself through a track.

Dont be ignorant.

JGTC has hp restraints.

WOuldn't you rather have a lighter car with a smaller motor that makes the 300hp that is your limit? not to mention better weight balance?

Sircnay

08-31-2003, 04:41 PM

Whoops, my bad with the typos. Trying to use the num pad... =\

Tuna

09-27-2003, 10:35 PM

sorry about being so late reposting in this thread....i had it bookmarked and just stumbled upon it again....just to clear things up.....the 3sgte does not run 10-13psi stock....it only runs 7.5 psi to make the 200hp mark but depending on the weather it's up to around 10 or 11 at times...but in normal weather it runs about .52 bars according to my boost guage :).....and you don't need to drop the engine to do engine work...in fact most engine work can be done with the motor still in....i think that's a common myth that people read about but it's not really true...it's a little cramped to work on a turbo but other than that it's no harder to work on than a front engine car...you're just leaning over the side in the back instead of leaning over the front :)....and i don't think most of us mr2 people came over flaming....a couple may have but like somebody said, don't let 1 person speak for the community :)....love your 240's guys!!!