Vertex S14 Bumper Copy Is Out!!

[initial s14]

HERE IS THE LINK.....

http://www.importfan.com/product.asp?3=4399


THEY SAY IT WILL RUN FOR JUST 250 EACH.... THEY ARE STILL DOIN A MASSIVE PRODUCTION..... SO HOLD YOUR HORSES !!:eek:

[SilviaDriver]

wow..thats Fucked up.

i will always hate importfan..hope they burn to hell

and i will always run to Chris for all my Vertex needs:D

[initial s14]

is importfan bad? how? in what way ? do they sell crappy stuff made out of crappy material? info please........:eek:

[SilviaDriver]

Originally posted by initial s14
is importfan bad? how? in what way ? do they sell crappy stuff made out of crappy material? info please........:eek:

yes. they suck balls. they make cheap knock offs. that dont fit right. they suck

im SURE there are others that agree with me.

[zero.counter]

Any takers? Truthfully, does anyone have any real world experience with the blue class aeroparts from GTP? I mean not hearsay, actual proven ownership. Any pics if you do/had?

[SilviaDriver]

just a lil thing they like to throw out as crap.

ImportFan says their "blue class" is high durable FIBERGLASS right?

look at the pics.

http://www.importfan.com/gtp/fake/real_23.jpg
http://www.importfan.com/gtp/fake/real_24.jpg

THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT CAN BE FIBERGLASS!!! thats freaken Urethane

wat IM GUESSING is..they advertise the pic saying "yes this fiberglass..its the blue class..buy buy buy..our fiberglass is that strong"

then people buy..and realize its not that strong.

i dunno. my post had no point..but those pics advertise something that isnt true.

[boro240]

i will hate importfan for the rest of my life.

[wherezmytofu]

who are they trying to pass that too as fiberglass?

[KoukiS14]

I wonder if the rest of their stuff is urethane. Urethane > fiberglass.

[initial s14]

those guys looked like they are standing on a bench than a bumper..... who knows it maybe a bumper shaped bench.:cool:

[Dousan_PG]

BOOO I GODDAMN HATE ****ING COMPANIES THAT SURVIVE ON OTHER PEOPLES HARD WORK AND ENERGY AND TIME

I HOPE CHRIS AND T & E VERTEX SLAP THOSE FUCKERS WITH A LAWSUIT!!!! ARGH!!

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by dousan36
BOOO I GODDAMN HATE ****ING COMPANIES THAT SURVIVE ON OTHER PEOPLES HARD WORK AND ENERGY AND TIME

I HOPE CHRIS AND T & E VERTEX SLAP THOSE FUCKERS WITH A LAWSUIT!!!! ARGH!!
Unfortunately, they (VIS and other companies) probably don't have some type of patent on those kits. The Importfan people feel they can, just like others, give consumers the choice in styles while not paying the inflated price which most unknowingly associate with quality. Example, the sam's club soda compared to coca cola, the 99 cent value meal originally developed to bring in the masses by Wendys (may Dave's soul rest in peace) and then everyone followed and so on.

Microsoft thrived and conquered using the same technique used by incorporating other technologies into their own (a.k.a. assimilating) and making profit after some modifications and then copyrighting. Its just the american business model, common sense.

If their sh1t stinks then so be it. In some cases the old cliche, "You get what you pay for", does not necessarily apply .
If VIS wants to follow a good example, they should mold after Amazon.com's current, "I am gonna copy protect everything I can", attitude.

Something to think about, and no I am not the devils advocate, just regurgitating what I have learned. It's good to be wise.

[Freeject]

I dont know much about bumpers, but that seems to be a DAMNED strong bumper. Id take one just so I'd have a bumper that could survive a weekend at the track.

[Dousan_PG]

Vertex is hand laid fiberglass!
have you seen hand laid fiberglass when it breaks?

that vis/gtp is molded. have you seen molded fiberglass when it breaks?

i'd take hand laid ANYDAY Over molded. quality is KEY

as far as copying, im sure T&E will take some action. im sure chris is aware too. sounds like he deals w/ T&E often and personally.

as far as bumper taking that abuse, yeah its not new or anything, lots of japanese companies do that. but with their own style. anyone can do it

[NiteKids]

Yep so now everyone will be running around with bummper very simular to mine while I paid muy more for something nicer but everyone will think it's the cheap shiz

[toreno]

Dont believe he Picture of that Bumper flexing like that. Its fake as F^cK. Yes their fiberglass is layered with that gel coating as you can tell, and it is flexible, but no way in hell can it hold up 2 people and flex liek that. My bro has a set of s15 fenders from importfan, they dont fit correctly, and the gel coating is cracking everywhere.

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by dousan36
Vertex is hand laid fiberglass!
have you seen hand laid fiberglass when it breaks?

that vis/gtp is molded. have you seen molded fiberglass when it breaks?

i'd take hand laid ANYDAY Over molded. quality is KEY

as far as copying, im sure T&E will take some action. im sure chris is aware too. sounds like he deals w/ T&E often and personally.

as far as bumper taking that abuse, yeah its not new or anything, lots of japanese companies do that. but with their own style. anyone can do it
The real question is LOOKS or FUNCTIONALITY. It all boils down to that again. You should know that if it is used for drifting or any activity where the possibility of crashing is high, then what the material is made out of does not matter. Cracked/broken is Cracked/broken right? Just zip-tie the biotch as the saying goes. If you are a show car person, then you know that it breaking is minimal in that you won't be daily driving the car and the risk, as I said, is nill.
I mean, if show is the case, is someone going to crawl under the car to see the vertex, abflug, or do-luck label? When you drift into a wall at 35-55mph is it going to matter how the thing cracked?

Just some more info to open eyes with.

Frozen, homemade, or Pizza-Hut, doesen't matter...still gonna exit out the same way.

BTW, I have seen both when they break. I figured that i should not have been doing what I did to break the bumpers in the first place. Then I would not need to ask myself that question.

[zero.counter]

I, in no way, wish to ever purchase aero part from import fan. I have my sources and don't want them opinionated. I just want to bring a point to the table.

Aaron, no offense man.

[DRFT]

You guys want to know another thing about imprt fan?...They are making a copy of the oem kouki bumper for R/PS13~!! dammit....just go to the 89-94 section of 240s and you'll see it:rolleyes:

[Dousan_PG]

dood
im NOT talking about drifting!!
daily driving. last time i check parking lots had big dips, so do driveways, speedbumps, freeway construction, etc.

cheap fiberglass WONT last long and most people's cars are lowered. many japanse body kits hang low too


for your pizza example:

yeah but pizza hut doesnt copy domino's packaging and labeling

importfan and vertex make bumpers
but the first one copies (exact) vertex's.

think about that.

[SilviaDriver]

Originally posted by dousan36

as far as copying, im sure T&E will take some action. im sure chris is aware too. sounds like he deals w/ T&E often and personally.


Chris is aware of it. i sent it to him and he told me he already knows. hope Chris beats the **** outta them!

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by dousan36
dood
im NOT talking about drifting!!
daily driving. last time i check parking lots had big dips, so do driveways, speedbumps, freeway construction, etc.


No sh1t sherlock, for some odd reason, I have never had that problem with some of the knock-off kits I have owned in the past.


cheap fiberglass WONT last long and most people's cars are lowered. many japanse body kits hang low too


You got me there vato. I love slamming hard all the time.


yeah but pizza hut does copy domino's packaging and labeling


Actually, Dominos has the edges cut off the box in a hexagon shape. Pizza hut is straight square.


importfan and vertex make bumpers
but the first one copies (exact) vertex's.
think about that.

Imitation is the best form of flattery, or in this case, duplication. Vertex should take that as a complement.


:)

[Dousan_PG]

the pizza thing, i edited my post..if you see, i mistyped. hehe..fast typer but inaccurate and cant spell. d'oh

yes compliment. sure take their money! Ueno doesnt need it anyways! Im sure he's grateful for that and very happy to be losing the US market to copies.

[KiDyNomiTe]

Originally posted by NiteKids
Yep so now everyone will be running around with bummper very simular to mine while I paid muy more for something nicer but everyone will think it's the cheap shiz

So true, but thats life, you think you got top quality next thing you know someone makes some cheap *** product and can't tell the difference.

No more uniqueness for you.

Thats why stock owns, never have to worry about people thinking its a cheap knock off. Only thing that sucks about stock is fmic fitting, but with a little cutting lots of things will fit :D.

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by dousan36
the pizza thing, i edited my post..if you see, i mistyped. hehe..fast typer but inaccurate and cant spell. d'oh

yes compliment. sure take their money! Ueno doesnt need it anyways! Im sure he's grateful for that and very happy to be losing the US market to copies.
Spoken like a true soldier.

I am assuming that you have either some personal ties to this Chris fellow, or they (vertex or other companies) are sponsoring or have sponsored you at some point in time. Explaining the fact that you are dead bent against anything but spending on the most expensive from that company.

I tip my hat off to you, in that you are true to them as a customer, friend, acquantance or whatever. That is an admirable quality not found in many.

Unfortunately, it does nothing to change my personal experience or the other I know in the past with some of the "Knock-Offs" products. I have used the Wyvern Kit for the S14 (Kouki) and one other quality kit and found no difference, still got scratched up and I sold as is a year ago. I just cannot find many differences.

BTW, I use Linux (Red-Hat, at work and home), sometimes with KDE Desktop, that doesen't mean that it sucks because microsoft had the pretty desktop first does it? J/K :p

[NiteKids]

You guys can't forget though even in Japan this type of stuff happens all the time.

Smaller companies copy other companies bodykits over there and sell them for less. Thats also why so many of their kits look almost exactly the same.

[wherezmytofu]

Originally posted by initial s14
those guys looked like they are standing on a bench than a bumper..... who knows it maybe a bumper shaped bench.:cool: :rofl:

[toreno]

what the hell is that guy doing reading a paper while standing on the Bmper? Is he pretending to stay calm, because the bumper is gonna break any moment now??????

[initial s14]

This from GTP (importfan.com)


Installation of Aerodynamics
All aerodynamic are manufactured with 100% fiberglass. Due to the material used in production, the body kits will NOT be a direct bolt-on. These body kits may require prepping, sanding, shaving, filling gaps, or other extensive body work. These modifications may include removal or cutting of the reinforcement bars. By complying with our policies, customer understands the procedure and possible difficulty in installing the body kit. We HIGHLY recommend that a professional body shop with fiberglass body kit experience perform the installation. Refunds will not be issued due to poor fitment of the body kit. If fitment is off by extreme margins, a refund will be considered.

[initial s14]

Actually, its either they are standing on a brick bumper bench or they are hanging via wires.......:axe:

[toreno]

When I bought a GOUND DESIGNS 2000 Black Widow kit for my accord like 3 years ago it had perfect fitment, all I needed to do was drill holes. Thats what I hear about good companies. The only preping done to fiberglass should be sanding it for paint to stick on the bumper. Also brands such as Wings West and Bomex has no problems with fitment. It all depends on quality.



HAHA Hanging from wires... what is this "The Matrix??"

[RenovaS13]

From my personal exprience, I have seen GTP's fiberglass they are really cheap quility, a decent fiberglass bumper usually use 4oz of fiberglass but GTP's I dont think it's close to 2oz. Be carefull guys.

PS. I'll try post some GTP's product to show you guys how BAD their product is.

[drift into a curb]

I didn't know NiteKids supports GTP

http://www.importfan.com/images/products/catalog/240sx_95_98/240sx_95_b_gtp_type_nsmo_style_rb_01.jpg
http://www.importfan.com/images/products/catalog/240sx_95_98/240sx_95_b_gtp_type_nsmo_style_rb_03.jpg

http://www.importfan.com/product.asp?0=0&1=0&3=3798

They used a grip of your pictures lol. Anyhow, the best is to spread word of the cheap quality GTP. I used to know the owners of importfan way back when they got started, but I don't think it's the same owners now. But hey, someone should buy it and show the fitment problems. Give evidence to people believe price can be substituted by quality lol.

[initial s14]

nitekids kits are 100% GTP ?..........hey ! can i stand on it too and see if it breaks?:hammer:

[boro240]

they use EVERYONES pictures. they use pictures from the ACTUAL manufacturer, and use them for their knock-off **** as well. they also used a pic of Sams S13, photoshopped the hood, and tried to sell it off as one of theirs (when his was a sunny stiling, IIRC). they have horrible buisness practices and morals. even if they can "legally" (which i doubt) get away with using other people designs and selling them, they still get 0 respect from me (and many other people). i have no affiliation with any of the companies they steal (yes its STEALING, not flattery) from, i just have morals, and a little thing called ethics.

[ruf]

I have no affiliation with Chris at SpeedAlliance. I chat with him on occasion. He is a straight-up guy busting his *** to bring in the PREMIER brand of Japanese aerokit into the US. I would think that would deserve respect. Frankly I won't even touch Vertex. It's so exclusive that the market is tiny. Imitation may be the highest form of flattery, but not when they are tricking customers into buying crap. GTP/ImportFan is an unscrupulous company that uses picture of anything and everything besides their own product to basically lie about the fitment of their parts. Very hard working and reputable builders have been ripped off by having pics of their cars used to sell GTP blue crap. Hell, even NiteKids was ripped. That's sad.

As for personal experience with GTP blue crap, it sucks. It is not urethane. The fitment is horrible. Do not take it into a shop unless they are your friends or they will turn you away, it's just too much work to get it to fit. If they do, you will end up paying more than if you would've paid for the properly fitting original. And they will not be your friends for long. I felt bad for the guy that bought it.

Knockoffs are one thing. A good quality knockoff is tolerable, even though slightly unethical. A bad knockoff is unacceptable as it cheats the customer. A bad knockoff using deceptive advertising with original parts is borderline illegal (bait and switch). I'm very surprised that GTP/ImportFan is still in operation given the number of cease and desist letters and lawsuits against them.

[NiteKids]

Wow you making me miss my old wheels. I sure didn't miss the offset of those things though.

Yeah I do currently have GTP rear skirts on my car. Something temporary untill I slap on the full friends aero kits on my car. Damn that brand name friends sounds so gay! :hammer:

[ruf]

Originally posted by initial s14
This from GTP (importfan.com)


Installation of Aerodynamics
All aerodynamic are manufactured with 100% fiberglass. Due to the material used in production, the body kits will NOT be a direct bolt-on. These body kits may require prepping, sanding, shaving, filling gaps, or other extensive body work. These modifications may include removal or cutting of the reinforcement bars. By complying with our policies, customer understands the procedure and possible difficulty in installing the body kit. We HIGHLY recommend that a professional body shop with fiberglass body kit experience perform the installation. Refunds will not be issued due to poor fitment of the body kit. If fitment is off by extreme margins, a refund will be considered.

The fitment will be off by extreme margins and your refund will be "considered". HAHAHAHA! And good luck finding a "professional" body shop that will touch the 1/2" gaps, non-fitting headlight seams, lack of mounting tabs or holes, not to mention the horrific finish on the gelcoat that takes forever to prep.

Ask anyone that has bought a Vertex or GP Sports bumper. Pre-drilled. Ready to paint. Bolts on. Seams are perfect.

[NiteKids]

Here's my experience w/ a:

GTP "Zeel Style bumper" VS. Friends aero front bumper

Both painted at PJ bonofcio

1. Prep work:
Had to be sanded down alot to be made smooth and many chips had to be filled in. PJ commented "wow this is a peice of ****!"
VS.
Little to maybe no prep work at all.

2. Overall paintlook:
Smooth...well some parts and kinda wavy like ocean in others
VS.
very glossy, smooth and oem looking

3. Install:
Drilling holes that never seem to be in the right mounting points. Bad fillament causing you to rub the bumper on your fender and scraching it in the process. Impossible to mount byyourself. Lots of cussing!
VS.
Predrilled holes already in the right spots. Installed it myself. Perfect fit. Fit like a glove. WOW! I still had a little assitance from JDMRICE aka richard.

4. material
Britle heavy fiberglass that cannot flex much at all that would break on impact
vs.
thin flexiable almost urathane like fiberglass that can takealot of abuse. I run that thing into the ground a few times already at dips which are unavoidable. Only missing a bit of paint.

[SimpleS14]

Originally posted by NiteKids
Something temporary untill I slap on the full friends aero kits on my car. Damn that brand name friends sounds so gay! :hammer:

HAHAHAHAHA!!!! so do you have a picture of this Full Friends aero kit?

[SilviaDriver]

the thing i DONT understand is..they use and steal other companies pictures..and LABEL them as theirs!! if i didnt know any better thats considered stealing. same with using peopels photos w/o their consent no? and if i didnt know any better again..stealing is against the law! y hasnt any REAL action taken place!? if there was some sort of forum i could fill out to shut down GTP..id be first on the list. yes i hate them that much.

[NiteKids]

Well my current front bumper is teh friend front bumper. I still need teh sideskirts and rear bumper. It basicially your stand japanese clean sides and rear bumper. Just very expensive.

[NiteKids]

Here is an image of one of their ads from DRIFT TONGOKU. I have the full kouki kit ad pic on my work computer.

http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/320000-320999/320418_63_full.jpg

OMG Look at that logo! Geez it's embarassing to tell people the brand of my front bumper.

[initial s14]

that is the most ****ed up name you can ever give your company that makes bumpers...... i would give a name FRIENDS if i happen to be owning a BOBA JUICE STORE.....:bash:

[SimpleS14]

not bad NiteKids....the logo does look gay...however the aero kit is nice...and simliar to Vertex. :coolugh:

[mbmbmb23]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by NiteKids
Yep so now everyone will be running around with bummper very simular to mine while I paid muy more for something nicer but everyone will think it's the cheap shiz
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------





If you sport the official stickers that came with the kit you can keep your "street cred" :)




-m

[NiteKids]

Originally posted by mbmbmb23
If you sport the official stickers that came with the kit you can keep your "street cred" :)




-m

That would be a negatory on that one captain.

http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/320000-320999/320418_64_full.jpg

[old_s13]

http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/320000-320999/320418_64_full.jpg

-- FRIENDS --
How many of us have them....
-- FRIENDS --
Ones we can depend on....
-- FRIENDS --
Before we go any further, lets be....
-- FRIENDS --

:)

Listen guys, I dont like ImportFan. Why? Because their site back in the day was ghetto. Now, its just organized ghetto.. and a mix of trend to add to their tom-foolery. I look at sites like that in disgust. I look at companies like VIS and barf because they steal pictures of nice kits like Do-Luck and advertise them as their own product. That is just rubbish.

What else, you ask? Back in the day, they would list my products (yeah, that ****ty site ClearCorners.Com) and list MY products as if they were theirs. Of course, people started e-mailing them wondering why the images had a "clearcorners.com" watermark on there, and in the long-run their scheme did nothing more than generate business and free advertisement for us.

I say booooooooooooooo to companies like that. I dont care if there are places that can undercut pricing. ANYTIME prices are cut, quality is usually sacrificed. This will ALWAYS be the case.

- Mike

[saga240]

yes the real thing rules..

real bomex 240sx front bumper..
1.8 years of abuse.. scraped and bumper many things.. just small dents but held together well

fake bomex mr2 front bumper..
.7 year of use.. scraped and hit fewer times.. barely hit a tire.. cracked bottom lip quarter panel, and a gaping hole by the corner lights.. also dented my fender..


ugh just buy real when you can.. itll make your life easier

[Dousan_PG]

zero.counter...what ruf said hahahahahah
i dont know chris personally either but i know he is a top notch businses, ive met him before and he was suepr cool. he's bringing in the real deal, and i respect that. iwish more peoplewould either produce their own or import the proper.

i am sorta sponsored by one cmopany or get a lot of help from others and some i get knock off parts on my car. but the quality is tip top. its not cheap its not bad fitment. eah there is that FINE line but if i had the choice of a cheap knockoff or spending 3 times the money on the quality real thing, i'd spend the money and never regret. there's also that certain pride you have when you own the REAL thing.

some guy can roll around on his model 5 knockoffs
but when i stop next to him w/ the real Advan Model 5, i guarantee he'll wish he had mine.

knockoffs i can live with but not cheap ones (crap wheels, crap body kits etc)

nitekids: in japan NO that's wrong. they are SIMILAR but not exactly same. they are TWEAKED. like your bumper. looks like vertex to the untrained eye but its TWEAKED. there's a difference. yeah maybe a fine line and a grey area but its nto a EXACT copy...as this company is doing

and nitekids, i have another one ill scan up for you. the KOUKI FRIENDS ad...full page review/ad/writeup..whatever

ill get it for you look. its pretty hot.

[ZodiacSR]

This is not so great news for us true Vertex owners out there. I hope no one thinks my Vertex kit is a GTP. :mad:

Whats going to be worse is if we start seeing these kits on Hondas. :bash:

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by ruf
I have no affiliation with Chris at SpeedAlliance. I chat with him on occasion. He is a straight-up guy busting his *** to bring ...blah blah blah
I guess I should have elaborated on my comments some to better understand my angle. Look, unfortunately knock-offs, so to speak, are abundant in anything and everything we do. My point is that just because it is a copy, does not mean that those "Real" racer/poser/show guys, the ones who have money to spend on things like that instead of more pressing things like mortgages, college tuition and expenses, maintenance of cars and such.

I don't (fortunately) live with my parents anymore (since I was 17) and have somewhat grown up and have other responsibilities to take care of. I have used some cheaper prods and they work great (the dollar store was my inception into the frugal delights of life). Because some of you guys believe in the Japanese Drifter heros and their heritage for having quality stuff (???) is good for you. But alot of guys/girls coming to this board lack the funds that some of you guys have and have other responsibilities besides expensive hobbies and pipe dreams. To automatically shoot them off to you all's contact seems like a bad business practice. Let them experience for themselves or at least tell them that there are other possibilities besides GTP/VIS or let them feel that there is hope for alternatives. It sounds almost monopolizing to hear the comments concerning Quality vs. Economy.
We have all learned at one point in time that there can be no substitute for certain items, hence the coke analogy to sam's club soda.

BTW, Ruff (little character w/ banana) where is the site that you were going to put up. I asked for you to post an IP address since your domain is not up yet but never got a response.

Nitekids, that friends kit thing was hilarious. Thanks for sub-conciously trying to offset the tension being created here with your antics.

Douson or san I mean, you did not respond to the analogy of the Linux/Microsoft situation gave you. hey are similar in origin of argument.

Boro guy, *sigh* again we meet on the battlefields of the zilvia forum. The stealing, morals, and ethics theme you were attempting to convey was useless as an argument at best. The fact is american law dictates sound judgements in cases. Whether you think it is morally right or wrong is not the way the judicial system works (Checks and balances). Thsi particular case in point, there are most likely no patents around so they have no case. Other wise that computer that you are typing on (no doubt a close IBM-Compatible) would be up for litigation since IBM was the original proprieter of the "IBM PC" which started the whole Home PC era on a roll. SO I guess the computer you are using is considered a stolen idea, so your morals and ethics should have kicked in by now.

Anyways, I am at the library (summer session II finals) and will continue this chat when I go into work later tonight.

Have a nice day! :)

[Dousan_PG]

i dont know anythign about microsoft/linux or anything..im totally clueless therefore cant respond. i am not computer person. i mean, c'mon, look at our website (in sig) hahahaha..i have enough problems w/ HTML and windowsXP

the age and living free. dont give me that crap. i've been livng away from my parents since 18 and been since and im 24 now and have supported myself 100% and doing excellent. great job full benifits, 401k all that crap that goes with it. i travel overseas 2 times a year and go all over the stat of cali and sometimes further. to me, if you cant afford it, save your money. im a big believe in saving to get the best. :) blah blah blah..whatever.



yeah nitekids kits is friends.if you noticed on some old posts i alaways ask him 'cant we be FRIENDS?" no one got it but now u can understand. nitekids, i think your bumper is GAY hahahaha..when i look at your car i think VW. hahahahahahahaha..;)

[boro240]

Originally posted by zero.counter
Boro guy, *sigh* again we meet on the battlefields of the zilvia forum. The stealing, morals, and ethics theme you were attempting to convey was useless as an argument at best. The fact is american law dictates sound judgements in cases. Whether you think it is morally right or wrong is not the way the judicial system works (Checks and balances). Thsi particular case in point, there are most likely no patents around so they have no case. Other wise that computer that you are typing on (no doubt a close IBM-Compatible) would be up for litigation since IBM was the original proprieter of the "IBM PC" which started the whole Home PC era on a roll. SO I guess the computer you are using is considered a stolen idea, so your morals and ethics should have kicked in by now.
you assume i own a PC (ok yeah i do, but still! lol). like i said in my post, although it may be LEGAL, i still dont morally like it. and in reference to the computer thing, as far as i know, what IBM did was 100% legal(and maybe im being hypocritical, but really i dont care that much about it). but at ANY rate, youre comparing apples to oranges. on one side, you have a product that is copied IDENTICALLY and slapped with another name on it, your computer reference is not. that would be like me taking windows, copying all the sourse code, and changing the name to Curtains (or whatever). not the same thing.

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by boro240
you assume i own a PC (ok yeah i do, but still! lol). like i said in my post, although it may be LEGAL, i still dont morally like it. and in reference to the computer thing, as far as i know, what IBM did was 100% legal(and maybe im being hypocritical, but really i dont care that much about it). but at ANY rate, youre comparing apples to oranges. on one side, you have a product that is copied IDENTICALLY and slapped with another name on it, your computer reference is not. that would be like me taking windows, copying all the sourse code, and changing the name to Curtains (or whatever). not the same thing.
Tisk tisk my dear hawaiian neighbor. On the contrary, the basic principle is the same. Taking something, copying it and making some mulah off of it (besides, apples to oranges in your case coconuts to pineapples right?) Without the correct copyrights, its just not possible to back anything up.
I never said IBM did anything wrong, I said that many companies like Tandy, compaq, dell, packard bell, hewlitt packard, and others copied IBMs schematics and platform (x86) to make money. The reference to windows and source code within does not apply, windows has patents and copyrights to the source, so it won't happen without a legal battle. What you would be referring to would be the Linux derivitives from Unix and thats why no-one likes unix, its patented (solaris and SCO that is). Its over, I am tired, so my point has been made. If its not understood, then I feel for ya. :)

Sorry for getting off track everyone. If anyone wishes to take this matter elsewhere then PM me or whateva..

[boro240]

yes ill just go back to my grass shack, drink some pineapple juice, and do the hula.

[zero.counter]

Originally posted by boro240
yes ill just go back to my grass shack, drink some pineapple juice, and do the hula.
Damn, I am sorry man. But when you wrote that, I haven't laughed that hard since the Star Wars Kid 2.0 Remix came out. No offense man.

[boosteds14]

haha, from a spectators point of view, this is ****ing funny!!!:D

Keep of the good work guys, I like entertainment.;)




As for the subject, ya it sucks that GTP has to copy someones else idea to make money. I can understand how Chris at Speed Alliance must feel about it because I know I am ****ed. I sell Vertex kits also, and today a customer called and asked if I carried the GTP VERTEX kit. I laughed, had about an Hour Conversation about 240s and said no but at the same time was ****ed because I didnt not know anything about this until the customer told me about the topic on Zilvia.net.

But Oh well, that is business. And everbody is out to make money one way or another. It really comes down to the old saying "You get what you pay for"

Thank You

Jeff

[KiDyNomiTe]

Theres a lot of f'd up company names in Japan, I've seen some of those Friends stuff in a mag, don't remember which or whose mag, but nice stuff, but ya logo is a bit flaming:rolleyes:

People are gonna look at you funny when they ask what kit you own:D

[RBS14]

I can't believe there is even a discussion about this! It is STEALING!! end of story. I hope GTP's wharehouse blows up with the owners in it! What they are doing is so morally and ethically wrong it isn't even funny. i hope they die and go to hell! I have the utmost respect for people like chris, trying to make it by bringing the highest quality stuff over here for true car enthusiasts. Keep it up! ALWAYS remember that you get what you pay for! Fu*c GTP!!! Eat Cocks and die!

[RBS14]

Originally posted by KiDyNomiTe
People are gonna look at you funny when they ask what kit you own:D

People will look at you even funnier when you tell them you have a Hippo Sleek kit...

[boosteds14]

hahah, man i wanted to say that but didnt want to put it that blunt. thats awesome.

:bowdown:

[boro240]

http://mortalkombat.metropoliglobal.com/Jaxfr.jpg

[initial s14]

guys ! i dont think GTP cares about **** you say coz they know ,,,, at evey 1 240sx enthusiast who hates them is equal to 50 civics/ integs/ eclipse owners out there will ...... will keep their business a success...oh well........ vertex will never be JDM again...:(

[NiteKids]

Vertex is definetly a nice company but how come no body triped this hard when bomex, veilside, etc. were being copied? What makes Vertex so special to you guys? It is simply another Japanese brand which is now available state side. You knew it was gonna happen. GP Sports was is being copied too now. I don't hear anyone making as big as a deal of it as they did w/ vertex?

[drift into a curb]

Probably cuz at that time, you were one of the people sporting the copies NiteKids. LOL well people have put up a fight about the copies of the Bomex, Veilside, C-Westin, and the others. But some Americans don't seem to care to do things at an expense of quality if the price is right. If you've been in the car scene for long enough, you'd notice people would note their car as Authentic Veilside or Genuine [insert brand name here]. Even on my friends GS400, he has a Win Racing bumper, but the Black Widow company takes it and bastardized the kit, so all he can do is say he has the original. I seriously think 90% of the Americans aren't up to date as you guys on who makes what kit or even cares where their parts come from. All they want to know is what is trendy and can they get it for a low price.

[RBS14]

I didn't trip at all when the other companies were being copied because i didn't know about it. Fu*c those damn companies too. Every day i wake up and slap myself upside the head for buying Tenzo rims! (a great example of a knockoff company) I can't believe i actually paid money for the pieces of sh!t!!:bash: Now its all i can do to keep myself from throwing them off a cliff. Sorry, i digress...

Anyone wanna buy an awesome set of rims?? :goyou: u know you want that +42mm offset!

[ruf]

Originally posted by zero.counter
I guess I should have elaborated on my comments some to better understand my angle. Look, unfortunately knock-offs, so to speak, are abundant in anything and everything we do. My point is that just because it is a copy, does not mean that those "Real" racer/poser/show guys, the ones who have money to spend on things like that instead of more pressing things like mortgages, college tuition and expenses, maintenance of cars and such.

I don't (fortunately) live with my parents anymore (since I was 17) and have somewhat grown up and have other responsibilities to take care of. I have used some cheaper prods and they work great (the dollar store was my inception into the frugal delights of life). Because some of you guys believe in the Japanese Drifter heros and their heritage for having quality stuff (???) is good for you. But alot of guys/girls coming to this board lack the funds that some of you guys have and have other responsibilities besides expensive hobbies and pipe dreams. To automatically shoot them off to you all's contact seems like a bad business practice. Let them experience for themselves or at least tell them that there are other possibilities besides GTP/VIS or let them feel that there is hope for alternatives. It sounds almost monopolizing to hear the comments concerning Quality vs. Economy.
We have all learned at one point in time that there can be no substitute for certain items, hence the coke analogy to sam's club soda.

BTW, Ruff (little character w/ banana) where is the site that you were going to put up. I asked for you to post an IP address since your domain is not up yet but never got a response.

Nitekids, that friends kit thing was hilarious. Thanks for sub-conciously trying to offset the tension being created here with your antics.

Douson or san I mean, you did not respond to the analogy of the Linux/Microsoft situation gave you. hey are similar in origin of argument.

Boro guy, *sigh* again we meet on the battlefields of the zilvia forum. The stealing, morals, and ethics theme you were attempting to convey was useless as an argument at best. The fact is american law dictates sound judgements in cases. Whether you think it is morally right or wrong is not the way the judicial system works (Checks and balances). Thsi particular case in point, there are most likely no patents around so they have no case. Other wise that computer that you are typing on (no doubt a close IBM-Compatible) would be up for litigation since IBM was the original proprieter of the "IBM PC" which started the whole Home PC era on a roll. SO I guess the computer you are using is considered a stolen idea, so your morals and ethics should have kicked in by now.

Anyways, I am at the library (summer session II finals) and will continue this chat when I go into work later tonight.

Have a nice day! :)
It's got nothing to do with price. It's got nothing to do with "drift heroes". I buy and sell quality products regardless of price or trendiness. If a US company could come out with a quality aerokit that fit well, that would be great. I just don't see why someone can't. The other thing is why can't someone come up with a DIFFERENT design that looks good? Why do you have to copy? It's not like engineering where there are very limited "correct" answers. It's aesthetics, and it's completely wide open given that you have the artistic talent. As for my website. I'll give the same lazy response I always do. It's going up this week etc etc. Along with shipping product and coordinating incoming shipments, I try to work a regular job and enjoy my "spare time". Just did a track day yesterday at TWS.

[chrisngo]

Alright all...

DAMN! this thread is looooooooooooong.

Well I just spoke with Import Fan. I need to speak with Ted. I do not want customers that want the real VERTEX kit to be led into buying a knock off VertX.

My little rant and rave is next.

Basically, all the guys that buy the real stuff are in their mid 20's or older.

Take Dousan And Ruf. They are about my age (25) and they have been "in the scene" for, i'm guessing, well over 8 years. What does all this mean? It means they have been there and done that, just as I have. They have matured with the industry and they can spot companies/manufacturers that are in it to continue the growth of the industry. They know who is out to make a quick buck and who do not care about the people they sell to. This is why I promote quality. I mean, yeah I do promote OBX short shifters, but hey, I use it on my own car and I have not had an issue with it. I like my customers to be happy. I want to become friends with my customers. They are not just customers in my eyes.

When this industry and drift scene begins to mature, you will see the knock off companies fading into the back drop. You already see this with the Honda crowd. Everyone want's JDM for their civics and preludes. That will also happen with the 240 market. People will be more willing to pay for a quality part.

I will give everyone an example of a mture industry.
HARLEY DAVIDSON

The demographic of most harley owners are older and more mature. Their incomes have a broad range though. But regardless of the income, the majority are willing to pay top dollar for genuine parts and accessories offered by Harley Davidson.

The same will be said about the drift scene and import car scene. BMW owners would be another example.

When I was 16 (9 years ago) with my Slammed toyota truck, I had $1200 (rims only) black 5Zigens Div-3's. You see, I was willing to put out $ for JDM parts. Why? Because I wanted to be unique and I wanted a quality part. I really don't think anyone would pay that for 16" wheels today....hehe.

Anyways...with education and a large stock pile, VERTEX will stick around in the U.S. for a long time.

It's good to see all you guys sticking to high quality parts.

BTW...just because they stand on a bumper doesnt mean it's not going to break on impact. It's actaully even more prone to crack since it's so thick.

thanks all...I will keep you all updated!
Chris

[Dousan_PG]

Thanks for hopping on and posting what's going on, chris. please keep us updated

see you at the meet end of this money! :)

peace,
aaron