DIY electronic boost gauge+

[Mosaic]

Hi all:
good to be here, discovered the forum while browsing about boost gauges today.

I am a fellow nissan owner...got 3 of em...Ad van, wingroad rider, Xtrail GT - sr20VET. I am an engineer and avid DIY guy.

Since there is much discussion on boost gauges etc i wanted to ask for some comments on a possible new boost gauge product I have on the drawing board and partially prototyped. I am thinking of offering it as a DIY kit etc. eventually.

Ok...here are the details:

1) Vacuum to 15psi or vacuum to 30psi boost (switchable)
2) Lean/rich narrow band a/f display for tuning or open/closed loop monitoring. This is a dynamic display in that the gauge auto corrects for boost when displaying lean/rich conditions. Boost rich is richer than vacuum rich. This function is critical for the lean/boost trip below.
User preset boost trip point for the following.
3) Boost trip light and aux sender ( can run a relay for water injection, wastegate etc) Can be used as a boost limiter. Add a switch for scramble boost!
4) Lean-boost trip light and chatterproof (hysteresis) aux sender( Can run a relay to activate injectors, alarm or wastegate etc.)
5) Smart turbo timer aux. relay driver, timer countdown from last boost trip to minimize idle cooldown. On Dial amber LED when active.
6) Electronic Delta pressure blow off controller to allow your regular Blow off to operate with no leakage and operate faster. OR add a larger solenoid valve to replace your Blow off and have It fully Activate even B4 u hit vacuum. Giving much faster spool after gear shift and less shock to your turbo and faster times.
7) Uses cat5e data grade cabling for sensor accuracy in an electrically noisy environment.
http://forums.trinituner.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_cool.gif Has no A/D errors or slow sampling, offers instantaneous display and responses.
9) Preferential Autodim circuitry for Vacuum & backlight, boost can't be missed.
10) Backlit : blue,red,green,yellow options.
11) Sealed remote precision electronic sensor requires no mounting, just connect to vac/boost tubing. Sensor lights up when powered.
12) Cat5e wiring harness offers connectivity to engine sensors (map/o2) both in engine bay and under dash.


Gauge is 3.25 inch dia by 1.5" deep. Will bolt onto a regular 2 1/16 or 2 5/8 gauge cup. Do you guys like the feature set? While its about 80mm, it replaces quite a few other devices, and is easy to see from a distance. uses full size LEDs for display. The boost LEDs are colour coded by range, green for Vac, then yellow and red for hi boost. The boost trip is bright blue and the lean/boost trip is a flashing Red.

Here is a faceplate pic:
http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/6264/faceplatesans.png

Thanks for reading, any comments appreciated.

[Lozer]

and how much would this do it all device run a person?

[theslows13]

carry on good sir. i like this idea

[repda916]

you a DIY or an inventor?:bowdown:
good shit my man.

[Psychomoongoose]

This sounds insane. I want one? Can I?

A solenoid instead of a BOV???? Wowzers, sounds insane. Has this ever been employed on a vehicle before? Really sounds really cool. Cant wate to see a prototype of this setup.

Best 1st post :bowrofl:

[Mosaic]

I figure price would be about $200 USD for an assembled, tested, warrantied unit.
Perhaps $125 for the complete DIY kit.

But I am not a seller yet so let's not make this a commercial category posting.

It's more about meeting the needs of turbo people. Especially street performance vehicles.
Having built turbo cars since 1998, I figured us consumers needed a gauge that satisfies a lot of our needs in one device, rather than have to spring $$ for several and have mounting and space constraints.
There is another version of this device which actually does MAF interception for A/F performance control in open loop. But, some territories won't tolerate tampering with the fueling of a vehicle because of strict emission laws. Therefore that feature was pulled.

I have transferred that feature to another gizmo which won't be for those strict emission territories. That gizmo would simulate narrow band oxygen sensors for both pre & post cat, to cause the ECU not to fight the MAF correction while in closed loop. Thus you get full control of your a/f ratios for better performance. Just don't drive to California, or be in the EU.:cops:

The blow off controller is an amazing feature given the fact that it will outperform a blow off valued at several hundred dollars. That alone justifies the device price. :naughtyd: Basically it works with the boost sensor to determine when to blow off. Once the processor has decided to blow off, it will also calculate how long the valve is to be opened for based on the boost pressure being vented. Once blow off is complete it will shut off the solenoid , so you get zero leakage and high sensitivity whereas a reg. blowoff must compromise between leakage and sensitivity with its spring loading. This has the benefit of allowing Mass Air Flow sensor vehicles to use vented blow off with no chance of leaning out due to vacuum leakage afterward.

Ain't electronics wonderful?:wavey: BTW I use near mil-spec parts in the product.

[eh?]

$200 for a boost gauge? Is there a boost controller too?
The aem tru boost is only $275.
I don't think any cares about narrow band display, it's pointless.

[Mosaic]

did u read the features? It can limit boost.
Also it can save ur engine with the lean boost trip alarm, by venting boost if detected. That's whats good about the oxygen sensor capability... This will protect your engine where others like the one you mentioned won't. If u get an injector failure...stiction...blockage, or a fuel pump defect or even your fuel filter plugging up from bad gas.....a regular Boost gauge/controller will let your engine incinerate.....

I have seen enough guys burn up their motors for the want of a little protection...even guys with expensive ems...they tweak until they go 2 far. This product lets u tweak and defends any mistakes.

The o2 display serves another purpose as well....if ur sensor is going bad....the display will show the lack of oscillation.If you have idle probs...the display will show u if its a lean or rich prob and when its fixed. The narrow band is good for quite a lot....you just have to understand its limitations. Not everyone can afford a wideband setup.

Hope this helps.

[eh?]

What do you mean by boost limiter?
You can have boost cut with a $25 hobbs switch if you wanted to.
You say you're an engineer how hard can it be for you to integrate proportional and integral logic for real boost control?

[Mosaic]

The matter of proportional logic and duty cycle solenoid action to do progressive boost control is well established. You oversimplify by speaking of a hobb's pressure switch. Your Hobb's pressure switch can't be dynamically preset unless you have it on a rig supplying gauged pressure. The hobb's switch also would not have the response time or characteristics of an electronically driven solenoid. Nor does the hobb's switch do anything about lean boost conditions, or carry ANY visual indicators for the driver.

If u observe the name of the product, you won't see boost controller. What u see is something else as this product does not directly compete with boost controllers. I am an engineer and have been one for 21 years, no need to question that.

By comparing this product with the AEM product I fear you do not understand the market niche where this product fits. No AEM product offers what this does as a complete package. This is also cheaper and more effective than trying to simulate all the features by purchasing multiple devices. If this product's features don't suit you, that's fine, it will suit others.

I reiterate the key points:

Two boost gauges in one...vac to 15 and vac to 30psi.
Narrow band Rich/ Lean indicator with customised response for Vacuum and for boosted conditions
Turbotimer
Boost TRIP and LEAN BOOST TRIPS with auxiliary outputs
BOV controller.

This product stands on its own feature set, there isn't another like it.

BTW the AEM product price ranges from 289 thru 450 as far as I can see, it is a 2-1/16" device and has tiny single color leds, no back lighting, and so on. It attempts to show u boost with a 2 digit readout, which is hard to read while driving as u have to focus on it to read it. Have a look at what 80 mm Elect. boost gauges go for before u compare $$$.

I hope that clears up any misunderstandings

[SlideKing92]

Don't hate on his thread Eh? this sounds like a cool idea

keep up the good work my man

[eh?]

I'm just giving you my opinion as you've explicitly asked for comments.

Why not integrate P&I controls? solenoids can be had for only $25usd retail. There are no DIY electric boost controllers on the market.

Just something to think about.

[Mosaic]

I would be pleased to design such a controller Eh? ...I think the solenoids which would stand up to under hood temps & fuel require viton seals and go for a bit more than $25, more like 35 to 40.

let me know what features u think are important in a DIY boost controller and what kind of price point to aim for.

[Mosaic]

bump...anyone else got a comment or suggestion.

Is having a boost controller feature of hi importance?

[Mosaic]

Ok... no thoughts on the last question, how about....Is the ability to tune the BOV e-control blow off duration and blow off sensitivity ( How sensitive to manifold Pressure change) worth say...$10 bux to the value of the device as opposed to being factory set?

The advantage to tuning blow off duration is matching the solenoid's orifice to your application. A smaller orifice can then have a longer duration etc, or if u increase boost or intake piping diameter u might want to increase the base blow off duration etc. The device proportionally operates the solenoid based on boost level so u're tweaking the base duration.

Sensitivity governs how the bov triggers, by tweaking sensitivity in your application u can have really snappy pre vacuum BOV action and reduce any possibility of despooling your turbo. Too much sensitivity could mean it blows off when u lessen the accelerator position as opposed to lifting off it. Too little means u get no better perf. than a mechanical blowoff.

[kaishakunin]

Ok... no thoughts on the last question, how about....Is the ability to tune the BOV e-control blow off duration and blow off sensitivity ( How sensitive to manifold Pressure change) worth say...$10 bux to the value of the device as opposed to being factory set?

The advantage to tuning blow off duration is matching the solenoid's orifice to your application. A smaller orifice can then have a longer duration etc, or if u increase boost or intake piping diameter u might want to increase the base blow off duration etc. The device proportionally operates the solenoid based on boost level so u're tweaking the base duration.

Sensitivity governs how the bov triggers, by tweaking sensitivity in your application u can have really snappy pre vacuum BOV action and reduce any possibility of despooling your turbo. Too much sensitivity could mean it blows off when u lessen the accelerator position as opposed to lifting off it. Too little means u get no better perf. than a mechanical blowoff.
I think a boost control feature is a nice optional feature, personally i would rather have the ability to tune the BOV.

[Mosaic]

I'm inclined that way myself since there are many boost controllers around, the BOV e-control has not been really explored yet, and the cabin tunable solenoid solution is actually more cost effective than a hi quality mechanical solution.

[Mosaic]

For those who considered this a worthy project I attach a pic of an assembled 80mm unit. It's been road tested and is going on an Evo-X for DYNO/throttle response benefits. The boost LEDs are red. The yellow backlight was used to match my car's other gauges, but any color backlight can be used. The superbright LEDs used are visible in direct sunlight. The Tuning adjustments are on the back as once it's tuned you don't need to touch it. There is a scramble button option for those who like to play pole position between streetlights. The built in BOV/CBV controller delivers improved throttle response after shifts - gets your boost up faster- make power faster- get a faster finish.

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/9973/gauge0psi.jpg