Marijuana Legalization Debate *NO PICTURES*

[aNskY]

zilvia :goyou:

[ESmorz]

and even at the current $8/pack we have here in NY, thats still WAY cheaper than any weed.

Really? Good outdoor and mid-grade indoor usually runs around $10 a gram. If you were to smoke that by yourself efficiently and not share with friends and not get retarded a g can and should go a long way.

Everything else has been covered numerous times in the other threads. Nothing new is going to come up. It should be legal, it should be taxed, politicians are looking out for special interest groups and it's own agencies... blah blah.

Who the fuck cares anymore? If you have friends you can most likely obtain weed through someone, and smoke it in your own home with no disturbances from the law. It's current state of limbo is just fine as long as you aren't trafficking. It doesn't matter to me either way since I don't smoke anymore and we all have our own minds made up and Zilvia isn't going to shed new light on anything. So is there really any need to keep these dumb ass conversations going?

[DreamN]

I doubt just because it'd be legal folks would jump on the wagon and start planting shit like crazy. It's not like folks who grow their own grow it to sell 100% of the time. For the most part it's simply their personal stash which keeps them from getting caught buying from dealers.

Besides a law could be made that a license should be had if you plan on selling it or growing a specific amount. Grow to much, you get fined. Growing to sell, you get fined.

[aNskY]

Really? Good outdoor and mid-grade indoor usually runs around $10 a gram. If you were to smoke that by yourself efficiently and not share with friends and not get retarded a g can and should go a long way.




There is no such thing as "good mid-grade". I dont smoke mids. And even a gram of good shit @ ~$20 isnt lasting nearly as long as a pack of cigarettes. (but i dont buy grams lol)



Everything else has been covered numerous times in the other threads. Nothing new is going to come up. It should be legal, it should be taxed, politicians are looking out for special interest groups and it's own agencies... blah blah.

Im not trying to "cover" anything, i just thought the other thread had some good points being brought up and people just generally having a good conversation.



Who the fuck cares anymore?

so you dont care. why the fuck did you bother clicking the thread? :keke:



If you have friends you can most likely obtain weed through someone, and smoke it in your own home with no disturbances from the law. It's current state of limbo is just fine as long as you aren't trafficking. It doesn't matter to me either way since I don't smoke anymore and we all have our own minds made up and Zilvia isn't going to shed new light on anything. So is there really any need to keep these dumb ass conversations going?

If you read the other thread you would have seen my saying "i smoke and i dont mind it being illegal, because i am responsible about it."

but fuck, it would be nice to share a joint with my friends at the bar, or smoke openly on my boat.

[aNskY]

I doubt just because it'd be legal folks would jump on the wagon and start planting shit like crazy. It's not like folks who grow their own grow it to sell 100% of the time. For the most part it's simply their personal stash which keeps them from getting caught buying from dealers.

Besides a law could be made that a license should be had if you plan on selling it or growing a specific amount. Grow to much, you get fined. Growing to sell, you get fined.


Agreed, but then you wont have to worry about the plumber or the landlord or your mom :keke: finding it.

[ESmorz]

There is no such thing as "good mid-grade".

I never said there was... Good outdoor and mid-grade. Two seperate entities.

All I'm saying is this debate goes nowhere and in circles. It always ends up with some stoner ruining the thread, and making mods crack down even harder.

[lflkajfj12123]

I never said there was... Good outdoor and mid-grade. Two seperate entities.

All I'm saying is this debate goes nowhere and in circles. It always ends up with some stoner ruining the thread, and making mods crack down even harder.

yo man i smoke like an ounce of dro in a sitting

a gram of anything is child's play

[Phlip]

If anyone messes this thread up, they will be pinked for a month and the thread immediately closed, and anyone starting one behind it will be pinked right along with them.

[lflkajfj12123]

wait is that in response to my post

because i was just adding my TWO CENTS

[Phlip]

wait is that in response to my post

because i was just adding my TWO CENTS

No, it is in response to the presence of a re-post of a thread I closed today.
If it were at you, you would be quoted, I have no qualms with letting someone know that I am talking to them.

[Wake]

so what is the debate here?
what kind of bud is worth what?
how much its gonna cost?
what the fines should be?
what?
I dont really see a direction to this thread because its a completley open ended discussion that can easily just go in circles.

should it be legal? yes
do people have to be responsible with it, just like any other controlled substance (cigs, caffeine, sugar, prescription pills)? yes
should there be penalties for abusing said drugs (such as ones already in place for numerous legal and illegal drugs)? yes
should the govt tax it? of course, if we want it to be legal we have to deal with all aspects right?

end of discussion

[aNskY]

:rolleyes: close the damn thread.... you might as well delete this sub-forum while youre at it

[S13Boosts]

lol IT WILL BE LEGAL ONE DAY NUFF SAID & of course the fucking GOV is gon tax it DUH fuck em tho!

[Wake]

man I wasnt trying to shut down the thread whatsoever, I just was lamenting the fact that it didnt seem to have a specific direction.
I would love to think we could have adult discussions like this here on zilvia, but as always theres peple that just like to blurt shit out of their asses (ahem).

aNskY, please dont think it was in any way directed at you as the OP, please just give the topic some guidelines. threads seem to go a bit smoother with everything spelled out for all the people that cant follow the general direction.

lol IT WILL BE LEGAL ONE DAY NUFF SAID & of course the fucking GOV is gon tax it DUH fuck em tho!

thanks for proving my point for me.

[aNskY]

^not you, mod doesnt feel comfortable with a little talk about legalizing weed.

i thought the other thread would give it direction

lol

[KrazyS13]

I think you can respect that, most likely PHLIP(and other mods) have seen this same discussion time, time, and again on here and it probably always ends up the same way. Someone blurting something stupid or inappropriate, or someone posting prohibited pics that gets the threads shut down.

There seems to be a shit ton of immature people on this site so topics like this will probably always end up a FAIL!

[Wake]

its just like the Michael Jackson thread, everyone has the right to share an opinion but some people just take it too far.
I am one of the first people to respect a persons position in a cnversation but if people start getting belligerent and just mouthing off like assholes I lose my patience pretty quick.
Like i said i would love to think that we could have an adult approach to these type of things but its seems like more and more loudmouth, ignorant youngins join everyday.

They are starting to grossly outnumber us if they dont already

[SexPanda]

An adult conversation on zilvia? Lol, most of the people on here are 16-18. They just aren't mature enough to carry on a conversation on such a hot button topic.

Before they can legalize marijuana, there are several variables we must consider, and several questions to ask ourselves.

The effect on the economy
The expected outrage by the "moral" majority
the overall effect on the state of our nation

How will employers take to the laws? Alcohol is legal, but you can't generally drink at work, or go to work drunk.
What kind of laws would have to be enacted to curb the inevitable abuse of the new legality? Clearly we would need some kind of minimum age, operating under the influence, and to satisfy the moral majority, probably a "stoned in public" law or two. It would almost definately be confined to the home.
How would the government regulate it, when it is all underground at the moment? It would take a few years, at least, to have legit companies start distributing the stuff.

Thats just a few to start the conversation. Trying to play the devil's advocate here...

and just a tip. If they legalize it, invest in Frito Lay.

[Wake]

An adult conversation on zilvia? Lol, most of the people on here are 16-18. They just aren't mature enough to carry on a conversation on such a hot button topic.

Before they can legalize marijuana, there are several variables we must consider, and several questions to ask ourselves.

The effect on the economy
The expected outrage by the "moral" majority
the overall effect on the state of our nation

I will definitely respond more to this when Im not so tired. and my buddy just came into town.


How will employers take to the laws? Alcohol is legal, but you can't generally drink at work, or go to work drunk.



Something quick about this..... you are legally allowed to drink on your break here in California (not sure where you are) so they will have to find some sort of one joint equivalent or something.
But I know for sure as a person with their California state card we are not allowed to drive within 6 hours of smoking. So Im sure factors like that will have to be figured in for people that operate heavy machinery or drive as part of their job.
And of course Im sure it will be at the employers discretion to piss test all job candidates, or current employees, pretty much not different from the laws now.

[handinpants]

what about mex grade

[handinpants]

i know someone on here has a bag of compressed sticks stems and seeds

[Wake]

:duh::duh:

[SexPanda]

:duh::duh:
I agree. and furthermore, concerning this thread...

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_vlPhIi5WyT8/RwWAatKUluI/AAAAAAAABi4/I2A-BdX9wWo/s320/Kevin%2BRudd%2Bdon%27t%2Bfuck%2Bit%2Bup.jpeg

[shmiddy]

like i said in the other thread:
Im totally for legalizing the drug for medical and requreational use. im behind it 110%. i think i would rather smoke pot, than get shit faced drunk. Alcohol is POISON!!!!! I hate drinking to get drunk now, I just rather have my joint and a few beers and im GOOD! lol.

What ppl also over look is the growing of hemp. Hemp growing is also illegal here in the United States. But hemp is one of the strongest fibers known to man. It’s used to make close, shoes, rope, paper, and pretty much everything. That will stop our dependency on foreign products. if we had the farmers grow hemp, jobs would shoot up cuz AMERICAN ppl, and companies can use the hemp for goods. AMERICAN goods made by AMERICANS, with AMERICAN GROWN materials.

Like I said, hemp can also make paper. So instead of cutting down a 100yr old tree to make a few 1000 sheets of paper, it takes less hemp plants to make as much paper as one tree. (I don’t know if that makes sense, im kinda stoned jkjkjk). PLUS its cheaper to manufacture....

I JUST DONT GET IT.......... it makes no scene...... just legalize it already ppl do it anyways

[shmiddy]

they even found pot in Michael Jackson's house, after he died lol can you picture that guy high?!?!

[Phlip]

^not you, mod doesnt feel comfortable with a little talk about legalizing weed.

i thought the other thread would give it direction

lol

Good job missing my point.
I would LOVE for you guys to be able to discuss the legalizing of the marireefers, in fact I am a non-smoker who argues that it should be legalized.

However.

Those describable as "stoners" and "potheads" have somehow stereotyped themselves out of the conversations describable as a "mature discussion," they would rather show off their wares -- which are STILL illegal -- instead of discussing the task at hand objectively, a whole lot more of "fuck tha po-lice, I'mma smoke til I DIE!" than "this is why I feel it should be legalized..."

Those individuals are all the fodder needed for those arguing AGAINST legalization.
... well, that and Harold and Kumar movies...


Since your head is jammed so far up your ass that you can't understand why my actions have been as they have been, I will lay it out for you.

We are a privately owned forum, we could allow ANYTHING we want, including discussion of/sharing of wares, torrents, NSFW materials, drugs, firearms, hatespeech, whatever you can name.
The problem with that is that a site of this size MUST identify themselves when they do such things -- hell, I have to do that when I register my own blog -- and that information is sent to websense and other filters, which kills our traffic, even when considering that 95% of our traffic has NOTHING to do with any of that shit. This goes not to mention that our registration is open to anyone 13 and over, which we would ALSO like to maintain.
Consideration allowed for all reasons named above, we frown on discussion of felonies and such. We ask that our members refrain from discussion of things that might land them in jail or net US a subpoena.

Please, I am a moderator, I am here to keep the order and answer questions in a specified thread in my signature, please don't make me post in this thread anymore.

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

Legalizing cannabis would do wonders for local farmers. Make it legal to possess and smoke but not to grow because it needs to be controled, just like cigs and alcohol. It doesn't take a genius to know it would help our economy by leaps and bounds.

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

Good job missing my point.
I would LOVE for you guys to be able to discuss the legalizing of the marireefers, in fact I am a non-smoker who argues that it should be legalized.

However.

Those describable as "stoners" and "potheads" have somehow stereotyped themselves out of the conversations describable as a "mature discussion," they would rather show off their wares -- which are STILL illegal -- instead of discussing the task at hand objectively, a whole lot more of "fuck tha po-lice, I'mma smoke til I DIE!" than "this is why I feel it should be legalized..."

Those individuals are all the fodder needed for those arguing AGAINST legalization.
... well, that and Harold and Kumar movies...


Since your head is jammed so far up your ass that you can't understand why my actions have been as they have been, I will lay it out for you.

We are a privately owned forum, we could allow ANYTHING we want, including discussion of/sharing of wares, torrents, NSFW materials, drugs, firearms, hatespeech, whatever you can name.
The problem with that is that a site of this size MUST identify themselves when they do such things -- hell, I have to do that when I register my own blog -- and that information is sent to websense and other filters, which kills our traffic, even when considering that 95% of our traffic has NOTHING to do with any of that shit. This goes not to mention that our registration is open to anyone 13 and over, which we would ALSO like to maintain.
Consideration allowed for all reasons named above, we frown on discussion of felonies and such. We ask that our members refrain from discussion of things that might land them in jail or net US a subpoena.

Please, I am a moderator, I am here to keep the order and answer questions in a specified thread in my signature, please don't make me post in this thread anymore.
I'm with you. It should be legal and I smoked only once in my life as a teenager. Just wasn't my thing. But the plant could produce fuel, paper, clothes, etc... It's crazy that the entire plant is illegal. Not only that but the smuggling of the plant creates danger at our borders.

[g-via]

We are a privately owned forum, we could allow ANYTHING we want, including discussion of/sharing of wares, torrents, NSFW materials, drugs, firearms, hatespeech, whatever you can name.
The problem with that is that a site of this size MUST identify themselves when they do such things -- hell, I have to do that when I register my own blog -- and that information is sent to websense and other filters, which kills our traffic, even when considering that 95% of our traffic has NOTHING to do with any of that shit. This goes not to mention that our registration is open to anyone 13 and over, which we would ALSO like to maintain.
Consideration allowed for all reasons named above, we frown on discussion of felonies and such. We ask that our members refrain from discussion of things that might land them in jail or net US a subpoena.


Solid.

I liked that post, even though I've been pinked for drug discussion.

[ninja_star]

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/4400/jesussss.gif (http://img9.imageshack.us/i/jesussss.gif/)

[SexPanda]

Damnit... I don't see this thread going to far anymore. Thanks guys.

But while its still up, I might as well add something. industrial grade hemp can only really be made from cannibus sativa, which has several uses which are fantastic, and legal. Ever pay close attention to the seeds in those bricks of bird feed? Yeah, seeds high in protein, pun unintended. Hemp seed oil is also a great source of omega fatty acids, and low in cholesterol. It also has a nice nutty taste and aroma. It also has hardly any THC in it, because the seeds don't have any in it. It mostly comes from Canada.

You can't exactly go to WalMart and buy hemp seed oil though, even though its better for you than corn oil, veggy oil, whatever. Imagine replacing all the cooking oil in fast food restaurants with healthy oil? Imagine getting delicious, low fat, low cholesterol french fries at mickyd's!

[aNskY]

Good job missing my point.
I would LOVE for you guys to be able to discuss the legalizing of the marireefers, in fact I am a non-smoker who argues that it should be legalized.

However.

Those describable as "stoners" and "potheads" have somehow stereotyped themselves out of the conversations describable as a "mature discussion," they would rather show off their wares -- which are STILL illegal -- instead of discussing the task at hand objectively, a whole lot more of "fuck tha po-lice, I'mma smoke til I DIE!" than "this is why I feel it should be legalized..."

Those individuals are all the fodder needed for those arguing AGAINST legalization.
... well, that and Harold and Kumar movies...


Since your head is jammed so far up your ass that you can't understand why my actions have been as they have been, I will lay it out for you.

We are a privately owned forum, we could allow ANYTHING we want, including discussion of/sharing of wares, torrents, NSFW materials, drugs, firearms, hatespeech, whatever you can name.
The problem with that is that a site of this size MUST identify themselves when they do such things -- hell, I have to do that when I register my own blog -- and that information is sent to websense and other filters, which kills our traffic, even when considering that 95% of our traffic has NOTHING to do with any of that shit. This goes not to mention that our registration is open to anyone 13 and over, which we would ALSO like to maintain.
Consideration allowed for all reasons named above, we frown on discussion of felonies and such. We ask that our members refrain from discussion of things that might land them in jail or net US a subpoena.

Please, I am a moderator, I am here to keep the order and answer questions in a specified thread in my signature, please don't make me post in this thread anymore.

Nah man, i got your point and i respect it. In fact i tried to just delete the thread but forgot that i am not a premie any more ..

:hide:

[S14_Kouki]

This was just like my thread that failed cause of a pic last week. Well hopefully no dumb asses will get this thread locked. From what I heard on the news just a couple days ago that legalizing cannabis in cali would make trillion's of dollars just for the state of cali (yes with a T). Now imagine on a large scale if all the state did the same.

[SexPanda]

This was just like my thread that failed cause of a pic last week. Well hopefully no dumb asses will get this thread locked. From what I heard on the news just a couple days ago that legalizing cannabis in cali would make trillion's of dollars just for the state of cali (yes with a T). Now imagine on a large scale if all the state did the same.

wait. thats alot of pot...

if I did my math correctly, which is unlikely... thats 5000 dollars worth of pot for each person each year?

[zenki.life]

would be another highly taxed item like cigarettes i would think. so the government might want to harvest said money.

[shmiddy]

why cant we have something for us, thats NOT heavily Taxxed by "the man"???????

[S14_Kouki]

^ ahahahahahahahahah cause " the man " wants as much money as he can get. And when it comes to something like weed they will tax the shit out of it cause they know alot of ppl will pay to have legal weed. And in return more and more ppl will start growing and they dont want that. I can see it becoming legal but illegal to grow in the your own home. But to that, the only thing they can use to see in someones house is flying over with infrared and that tech. they have to have a warrant to do that.

SexPanda
I dont exactly know the numbers but they said 3 trillion on the news idk how real of a number that is. Ill post up more info when I hear something.

[stinky_180]

oakland, ca already approved the marijuana business tax; a first in the entire nation

Oakland voters on Tuesday overwhelmingly approved the nation’s first ever business tax on retail marijuana sales.

According to preliminary election results, approximately 80 percent of Oakland voters approved the new tax (which appeared on the ballot as Measure F), which imposes an additional tax for “cannabis businesses” of $18 for every $1,000 of gross receipts beginning January 1, 2010.

Presently, Oakland’s medical cannabis dispensaries are taxed at the same rate as other retail sales businesses ($60 per year for the $50,000 of gross receipts, plus $1.20 for each additional $100,000).

Four dispensaries are licensed by the Oakland City Council to sell and dispense medical marijuana.

According to a financial analysis by the Oakland City Auditor, Oakland’s new cannabis business tax will generate an estimated $300,000 in additional annual tax revenue.

Representatives from the Oakland City Council, the California Nurses Association, and the dispensary community publicly advocated for the new tax, which had no formal opposition.

“The passage of this first-in-the-nation tax further legitimizes cannabis-based enterprises in Oakland and elsewhere,” NORML Executive Director Allen St. Pierre said. “These outlets are contributing to the health and welfare of their local communities, both socially and now economically. At a time when many municipalities are strapped for tax revenues and cutting public services it is likely that public officials in other cities will begin considering similar proposals.”

also i find this picture very interesting, no it does not have any pictures of weed
http://norml.org/images/legal/statelaws/usmap_states.gif

find out more information about marijuana and the law here; norml.org

[SexPanda]

wtf missouri. This state fails.

[BustedS13]

wtf missouri. This state fails.

in Columbia (GO TIGERS), if you are carrying less than an ounce and a quarter of weed (35g), they can't arrest you. they can only give you a summons. and that's a lot of pot to be carrying around.

unfortunately that's just CoMo.
oh well, at least passengers in cars can still drink beer.

edit: also, not having the "mandatory" icon on our state is a very good thing.

[aNskY]

in Columbia (GO TIGERS), if you are carrying less than an ounce and a quarter of weed (35g), they can't arrest you. they can only give you a summons. .


Same as NY only our limit is 28g. Although thats only for first offense, second time will land you in a holding cell.


whats "madatory" mean on that map? mandatory jail time? because i know florida is harsh... but that doesnt make sense in combination with other symbols in other states....

[BustedS13]

Same as NY only our limit is 28g. Although thats only for first offense, second time will land you in a holding cell.


whats "madatory" mean on that map? mandatory jail time? because i know florida is harsh... but that doesnt make sense in combination with other symbols in other states....

in como you can be caught over and over without being taken in, which is kind of cool.
although, in california, apparently it's a max fine of a hundred bucks. hmm.

but yeah, mandatory=mandatory jail time if convicted. so, in my state, you can weasel out of it, in theory.
just like speeding tickets. almost 30 tickets to date, no convictions. go me.

[SexPanda]

in como you can be caught over and over without being taken in, which is kind of cool.
although, in california, apparently it's a max fine of a hundred bucks. hmm.

but yeah, mandatory=mandatory jail time if convicted. so, in my state, you can weasel out of it, in theory.
just like speeding tickets. almost 30 tickets to date, no convictions. go me.

Yeah no mandatory is good. I don't smoke anymore. It just seems like MO doesnt care much lol.

I've never been caught with pot. Because I'm not an idiot. I would get as much as I was going to smoke at that 1 time, then use papers or rellos. No evidence, no paraphernillawafers, nothing.

Anyhow, back to the subject at hand. That is a very interesting map. Whats the tax stamp mean?

[S14_Kouki]

wtf missouri. This state fails.

florida = fail

well there getting up there with the decrim soon it will come to FL prob going to be the last state.

[yota man]

Whats the tax stamp mean?

Originally it was how they made it "illegal." You had to have a tax stamp on the bag to say that you paid your tax on your pot. However if you went to go apply for the stamp you couldn't get one and we're basically waving around a bag of pot in public incriminating yourself.

Now its just another way to add on extra time to your sentence. You wind up with possession and if your judge is a real dick tax evasion.

For more info go here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937

[SexPanda]

Originally it was how they made it "illegal." You had to have a tax stamp on the bag to say that you paid your tax on your pot. However if you went to go apply for the stamp you couldn't get one and we're basically waving around a bag of pot in public incriminating yourself.

Now its just another way to add on extra time to your sentence. You wind up with possession and if your judge is a real dick tax evasion.

For more info go here: Marihuana Tax Act of 1937 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937)

ah you see thats what I thought it meant but I figured that it was such an old law that it coundnt be it. Thanks for clarifying that.

History Channel FTW. lol

[s14unimog]

I really think the stop signs are supported by two things.

Not enough for a majority vote...

No way to identify a level of intoxication...

If enough people would support the decriminalization of Marijuana in their own states, then there MIGHT be a chance that the Federal Gov't would follow suite. The problem is that there will always be free loaders and the few that will continue to mess it up for the rest of us. When I think about a nation wide decriminalization, the first image I see, is that of a going out of business sale where everything is 80% off. The switch would be so dramatic. You would have a ton of first time users and abusers, mixed with the ones already abusing the substance. sadly, I feel the day will never come.

My dad once told me he was SURE that Marijuana would be legalized back in the 70's but at last, it never happened.

The other topic to discuss would be the "too high detector." Until someone comes up with a device that could quickly tell an arresting officer that the detained is "too high" we'll be faced with that road block as well.

My advice to all, be smart, don't abuse any substance and for the love of Christ, don't get in trouble high. You're fu*kin up the statistics!

[BustedS13]

No way to identify a level of intoxication...

saliva testing is good for 24 hours.

i'm pretty confident the main reason we have no on-the-spot method of testing is because there is no current need for one.

[Genovese.Jr]

evan if it was Legal i still wouldent pay 50dollars tax on an ounce of weed i dont think any one would

[BustedS13]

evan if it was Legal i still wouldent pay 50dollars tax on an ounce of weed i dont think any one would

an ounce of decent weed in the midwest is going to run you somewhere in the neighborhood of $300-400 while illegal. one would think it would drop substantially if legal. so it wouldn't really matter.
where are you getting $50/ounce anyway?

[Genovese.Jr]

an ounce of decent weed in the midwest is going to run you somewhere in the neighborhood of $300-400 while illegal. one would think it would drop substantially if legal. so it wouldn't really matter.
where are you getting $50/ounce anyway?

im not but they have stated that the tax on an ounce of weed will be 50-100 dollars plus what ever they charge per weight

[ESmorz]

i already pay like 150 for an ounce

I think you mean "if you were to buy an ounce".

[BustedS13]

dammit. .

[Genovese.Jr]

[quote=BustedS13;3003588]an ounce of decent weed in the midwest is going to run you somewhere in the neighborhood of $300-400 while illegal. \quote]

i cant belive they would charge that much out midwest

[ESmorz]

I'm part of the dogs.

Pay me by tomorrow or we're going to have problems.

[BustedS13]

and are you serious i would never pay that much

okay, you need to stop talking about your illicit activities. it's this kind of shit that gets these threads locked.

[Genovese.Jr]

[quote=ESmorz;3003647]I'm part of the dogs.

Pay me by tomorrow or we're going to have problems.[/quo

dick move

[s14unimog]

saliva testing is good for 24 hours.

i'm pretty confident the main reason we have no on-the-spot method of testing is because there is no current need for one.

I agree, but if the case was to be presented, I feel it would go over easier if there was a way.

I've heard of an ounce going for right at $100 but this is low of low. I really feel if it were legalized prices would drop dramatically and then the taxes wouldn't be that noticeable.

[shmiddy]

oakland, ca already approved the marijuana business tax; a first in the entire nation



also i find this picture very interesting, no it does not have any pictures of weed
http://norml.org/images/legal/statelaws/usmap_states.gif

find out more information about marijuana and the law here; norml.org


this is very freaking cool! Its good to know your state law... I didnt know that the only thing that the cops can legaily do to you for having less than 25 grams (which i think is allot to be holding on you) is 100$ fine!!!! Thats fucking awsome!!!

[Sleepy240]

...No way to identify a level of intoxication...

...The other topic to discuss would be the "too high detector." Until someone comes up with a device that could quickly tell an arresting officer that the detained is "too high" we'll be faced with that road block as well...

My assumption would be there would be no need for a "too high detector". Logic would tell me they would treat it similar to driving while under the influence of a controlled substance or medications. Where it wouldn't matter if you smoked one joint or twelve, it impares you ability to think/react which can't really be measured numerically on the spot (blood tests would require you to be taken in etc), but rather gauged by a "sobriety" test. Now they do actually make breathalyzers that can detect the amount of a substance in somebodys system but they are specifically designed for only certain a substance ((ie. Not multiple uses)(marijuana not being one of them)). It would likely qualify as operating while impaired (OWI) or operating a vehicle under the influence (OVI) as opposed to a harsh DUI.

[stinky_180]

150ounces? you must be smoking that mexican dirt shit weed.

get yourself a license, and do what you can do

[shmiddy]

150ounces? you must be smoking that mexican dirt shit weed.

get yourself a license, and do what you can do

i was thinking about the same thing lol "A FRIEND OF MINE" (not me) pays almost 6 for a oz of high grade.........

[aNskY]

i was thinking about the same thing lol "A FRIEND OF MINE" (not me) pays almost 6 for a oz of high grade.........



NYC is pricey man, drive up to westchester and you'll get the same stuff for 4.

[Wake]

and here we go again......

[stinky_180]

¿que?^

all of you should watch : Marijuana Inc: Inside America's Pot Industry

very educational, had a lot of new stuff that i didnt know.

anybody here about the fire that happened in the los padres national forest?

Date: August 15, 2009

Fire Investigators Determine Cause Of La Brea Fire

A week-long investigation by U.S. Forest Service Special Agents, Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Narcotics Unit and Fire Investigators has revealed the cause of the La Brea Fire. Investigators revealed that the La Brea Fire was started by a cooking fire in a marijuana drug trafficking operation.

The Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Narcotics Unit has confirmed that the camp at the origin of the fire was an illegal marijuana operation believed to be run by a Mexican National Drug Organization. The Narcotics Unit has been working in the area within the last month eradicating other nearby marijuana cultivation sites.

Although the La Brea Fire started more than one week ago, there is evidence that the unburned marijuana garden area has been occupied within the last several days. The Narcotics Unit has secured the camp area which was located in remote and rugged terrain. It is also believed that the suspects are still within the San Rafael Wilderness trying to leave the area on foot. Officials warn not to approach anyone who looks suspicious but to instead contact the nearest law enforcement agency.

Anyone with further information is urged to contact U.S. Forest Service, Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Department or local law enforcement agencies.

The investigation continues with cooperating agencies including Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Department, Santa Barbara County Fire Department, CalFire, and other local agencies.

The La Brea Fire Tip Line is still open, and anyone with additional information helpful to this ongoing investigation is urged to contact investigators at (805) 686-5074. Your call may remain anonymous.

The Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Department will release more information regarding the Narcotics investigation on Monday. The media contact at the Sheriff's Department is Drew Sugars, Public Information Officer, at 805.681.4192.

For media inquiries regarding the investigation of the cause and origin of the La Brea Fire, contact the U.S. Forest Service at (805) 961-5707, and an investigator will return you call.

im actually going camping here next weekend. peace of shit cartels making weed look even worse by accidentally starting a forest fire. hell, i bet they didn't even have the required campfire permit! stupid fucks

[ESmorz]

NYC is pricey man, drive up to westchester and you'll get the same stuff for 4.

Gotta pay the troll toll.

[S14_Kouki]

All you ppl STOP fucking talking about prices and how much u pay that has nothing to do with the thread you are going to get it closed again.

These are two good things to watch with alot of info Marijuana Nation on Discovery channel or Marijuana on CNBC

[SexPanda]

All you people STOP fucking talking about prices and how much u pay that has nothing to do with the thread you are going to get it closed again.
I second this. A lot of us are enjoying the conversation about the legality and what not. Lets not get this closed again because you want to whip out your Ecock and let us know how your homeeeieieeee gets "da hookupz"

[shmiddy]

does anyone think pot is more dangerous that drinking??? as far as health???

[exitspeed]

I have a question, is the plant actually illegal. form my understanding there are male and female plants. Female plants produce THC but male plants do not. Or maybe it's the other way around. Either way are the plants that don't produce THC illegal? Because the shit grows all over the place in WI. Especially in our park areas. I see the stuff all the time. In HS before I knew there was a difference between the plants I may have harvested some, dried it out and may have tried smoking it. But it was the type that didn't have THC so I may have goten a big damn headache.

Does this shit grow all over in other states?

[VROOOM]

does anyone think pot is more dangerous that drinking??? as far as health???

not at all, alot of people die every year from alcohol related illness. my co workers dad just died form psirosis(sp?) of the liver a few months ago. caused by drinking. from what ive heard no one has died directly from smoking weed.

[Sleepy240]

does anyone think pot is more dangerous that drinking??? as far as health???

Health wise I believe they are on the same level.

Cancer via smoking
Liver problems via drinking

As far as being more dangerous? Depends on the situation. The way I look at, you can have a drink and not be drunk. You can smoke some pot and not be high. Either in excess can lead to a bad resolution.

[greddy2die]

Oh man, I wish I could find the documentary that I watched a few months ago.

I believe it was called The ugly truth about Marijuana. Something along the lines of that title.

Anyway, basically the movie has alot of good information in it. If you are against pot, for it, anything I think everyone should watch it. When I find the link I will post it (if mods allow).

Basically the movie points out a few things.

*Marijuana does not cause black lung like cigs do
*If Marijuana is so bad for you like the Gov't claims, there would be pictures, documents, something proving that it gives you black lung, kills brain cells etc etc.
*Some studies have shown that marijuana does not kill brain cells but may actually stimulate the brain
*The gov't did run tests to "prove" that marijuana is bad for you, HOWEVER the test subjects were chimps. Yes, chimps DID die. BUT it was due to the fact that the scientists would hook up a mask (similar to the one at the dentist when they put you under) which would pump marijuana smoke into the chimps lungs for a consistent amount of time like 15-20 mins at a time for weeks on end until they died. Which anyone with half a brain knows that is very harmful of course. Those are the only test that I believe really show that you can die from pot.. =/

There are plenty of other interesting facts. Once I find the video I will inform you all.

[Sleepy240]

Oh man, I wish I could find the documentary that I watched a few months ago.

I believe it was called The ugly truth about Marijuana. Something along the lines of that title.

Anyway, basically the movie has alot of good information in it. If you are against pot, for it, anything I think everyone should watch it. When I find the link I will post it (if mods allow).

Basically the movie points out a few things.

*Marijuana does not cause black lung like cigs do
*If Marijuana is so bad for you like the Gov't claims, there would be pictures, documents, something proving that it gives you black lung, kills brain cells etc etc.
*Some studies have shown that marijuana does not kill brain cells but may actually stimulate the brain
*The gov't did run tests to "prove" that marijuana is bad for you, HOWEVER the test subjects were chimps. Yes, chimps DID die. BUT it was due to the fact that the scientists would hook up a mask (similar to the one at the dentist when they put you under) which would pump marijuana smoke into the chimps lungs for a consistent amount of time like 15-20 mins at a time for weeks on end until they died. Which anyone with half a brain knows that is very harmful of course. Those are the only test that I believe really show that you can die from pot.. =/

There are plenty of other interesting facts. Once I find the video I will inform you all.

Personally I'm neither for nor against the legalization. It doesn't really effect me since I don't participate in the act. The biggest problem is that alot of these "informational" films are not that. Just propaganda for one side or the other, similar to political ads. Honestly I can't decide whose worse, the Pro smokers, or the anti smokers. If you honestly believe that smoking (marijuana or cigarettes) doesn't cause problems your ill. Regardless of whether its marijuana or tobacco they BOTH contain various carcinogens which can cause cancer. The problem is with either there is no set number at which smoking becomes a problem. There is no chart that says if you smoke 10,000 cigarettes you will have cancer, or smoke 20,000 joints and you will have cancer. To me the problem lies not with the medical issues (because frankly almost everything has risks) but more with the addictive properties. Again I don't smoke, however I have quite a few friends that do. They find that marijuana is MUCH more addictive, mainly because of the feeling of "being high". Obviously my friends are just a small selection of people so there isn't much merit, but a few of them are "non smokers". Meaning they don't smoke cigarettes but will gladly smoke a joint, because smoking tobacco is "nasty". My point being here that a lot of people will smoke a joint before they ever touch a cigarette because of the huge negative aspect around tobacco, none of which exists with marijuana. Smoking a joint is considered a "social" activity, and harmless if you ask 90% of individuals. To me they are on the same level and should be treated the same, with the same warnings as tobacco products.

[greddy2die]

Im not saying that marijuana isnt bad for you and you cant get cancer from it.
Yes the physical act of smoking can give you cancer. Because well, your burning something and inhaling it.

Regarding the addictive properties, there really isnt anything to get you addicted in the marijuana. Its more of a psychological thing i think.
If you wanted to stop smoking pot, you can. Plain and simple. I have quit before, its not hard. IMO, its in the persons head that thinks its addictive.

Some people grow accustom to smoking everyday so if they just stop cold turkey they might get annoyed or aggravated, but after a week or 2 its not a big deal.

If I wanted to stop smoking right now, I could. I wont start itching like im a crackhead and stealing from people so I could go buy pot...lol

[Sleepy240]

Regarding the addictive properties, there really isnt anything to get you addicted in the marijuana. Its more of a psychological thing i think.

That is exactly my point. Nicotine is what addicts people to tobacco products. Marijuana is all about the "high". I could be wrong but I believe nicotine is considered a physical addiction. The body NEEDS nicotine to function at this point. Marijuana just has the feeling that these people still "crave". How do you determine when somebody is no longer psychologically addicted? Nicotine you can ween the body off the substance. How do you ween the body off of being "high"? Psychological addictions like physical addictions are no joke and are seriously hard to break.

If you wanted to stop smoking pot, you can. Plain and simple. I have quit before, its not hard. IMO, its in the persons head that thinks its addictive.

This statement is very false. It is definitely NOT cut and dry. What works for one does not work for all. And it is incredibly hard to break ANY addiction. And its not all a psychological addiction as I stated before.


If I wanted to stop smoking right now, I could. I wont start itching like im a crackhead and stealing from people so I could go buy pot...lol

Lastly I am no doctor or psychotherapist but to me you sound like an addict. Again I'm not saying this for confrontation but to prove a point. How many people do you know who say "oh if I wanted to I could stop doing ______ right now." I'm not saying your addicted to the point of stealing or murder but to deny your addiction is just continuing the cycle (ie. You've "quit" before).

[greddy2die]

I totally understand where your coming from and rereading my "if I wanted to stop right now I could" statement...lol that kind of was like an oxymoron. I guess I cant really try to explain it cause it will end up making me sound like an "addict".

I just, do it every so often, kind of like when I have a few beers. I dont NEED to smoke, I dont NEED to drink. Its just one of my choices in life. Is it smart or safe? No, but nothing in life is really too safe.

Marijuana is my wine...lol... There are wine tasters, they smell or, inspect the quality, then take a sip to see how it tastes..lol thats me with pot I guess.

I will not smoke anything. If its not quality, i dont even bother. Some people are smoking entirely only to get high and those are the people that give us "pot heads" a bad name. I like to smell it, check out the actual bud, see how it tastes and expands in the lungs.

To me, I would much rather smoke a joint then go out and get drunk. However, I cant go out with a few buddies a light up a joint at the bar while they drink.


I hope I explained myself alittle better.

[aNskY]

I totally understand where your coming from and rereading my "if I wanted to stop right now I could" statement...lol that kind of was like an oxymoron. I guess I cant really try to explain it cause it will end up making me sound like an "addict".

I just, do it every so often, kind of like when I have a few beers. I dont NEED to smoke, I dont NEED to drink. Its just one of my choices in life. Is it smart or safe? No, but nothing in life is really too safe.

Marijuana is my wine...lol... There are wine tasters, they smell or, inspect the quality, then take a sip to see how it tastes..lol thats me with pot I guess.

I will not smoke anything. If its not quality, i dont even bother. Some people are smoking entirely only to get high and those are the people that give us "pot heads" a bad name. I like to smell it, check out the actual bud, see how it tastes and expands in the lungs.

To me, I would much rather smoke a joint then go out and get drunk. However, I cant go out with a few buddies a light up a joint at the bar while they drink.


I hope I explained myself alittle better.


I'm with you.

I haven't smoked in a few weeks... it's not something i NEED.. just something i enjoy every so often (like a fine cigar or some nice wine like you said) :hug:

[stinky_180]

Cancer via smoking
Liver problems via drinking

really? smoking weed causes cancer. please show your sources

heres a fact for you. cannabis has been around for ages. there has not been a single case of cannabis related death, EVER. alcohol is much worse than cannabis. yea, you can have liver problems from alcohol; but its the things you do while your on alcohol that will get you killed. hell Methylenedioxymethamphetamine is much safer than alcohol, but thats off topic.

i'de also like to add that; if cannabis did cause some sort of cancer why is there proposition 215 in the first place?

Marijuana Inc: Inside America's Pot Industry

watch it

[stealthsr20]

i pay 60 an ounce for the good... the really good, Tax it and get on with it so i can not be arrested. I smoke and and clean and cook and do things around the house. never go anywhere to get hassled by the man for it....... i haven't smoked in a year or so. legalize it, i wouldn't drink or stay up like i do. i do it like i drink... don't want to go to jail for something i could kill someone over... silly for a night of fun. Not saying i would do this on weed but still not going to risk it for any means.. wanna get stoned, be responsible about it then, i don't care who says it makes them a better driver, you are still impared. i've been drinking by the way!!!!

[greddy2die]

really? smoking weed causes cancer. please show your sources

heres a fact for you. cannabis has been around for ages. there has not been a single case of cannabis related death, EVER. alcohol is much worse than cannabis. yea, you can have liver problems from alcohol; but its the things you do while your on alcohol that will get you killed. hell Methylenedioxymethamphetamine is much safer than alcohol, but thats off topic.

i'de also like to add that; if cannabis did cause some sort of cancer why is there proposition 215 in the first place?

Marijuana Inc: Inside America's Pot Industry

watch it


Smoking can cause cancer, plain and simple. Yes, smoking marijuana has never been the direct cause of death to a person. However, smoking for a long period of time (years) can cause side effects in your health in the long run. IE cancer. Its the physical act of the burning of a substance. Im sure if you grabbed a bunch of leaves from a tree, rolled them up and smoked for years and years, you would eventually develop some form of sickness.

Understand what im trying to say? Just cause you smoke pot and not cigs does not mean you are in the clear from getting cancer. It may not develop, but it still is a possibility

Also, regarding your "why is there prop 215", just cause there are states that allow medical marijuana does not mean its good or can cure people of illness. It may elevate some pain from patience or slow down a form of sickness in some cases but everyone is different.

Take for example all the drugs that are legally for sale with a prescription. Yes, they can help you but there are always side effects.

[shmiddy]

About the whole caner thing, I don’t think it’s about WHAT you are smoking; I think it has to do with how much of it you smoke. No matter what, if your burning something, no matter what, the byproducts of it are always tar and smoke and carbon monoxide (the crap that gives you cancer).Lets look at the average cigarette smoker and the average pot smoker: lets use me as an example: I smoke about ½ a pack a day of cigarettes.. Most people who are at there worse with pot smoke about 3-5 joints a day. (And that’s O.D!!! I can never see myself smoking that much pot in one day, for an extended period of time) but yet I smoke 10-15 cigarettes a day. Ppl who smoke cigarettes only, run a higher risk of cancer, than ppl who smoke pot only because they don’t smoke as much.

[shmiddy]

About the whole caner thing, I don’t think it’s about WHAT you are smoking; I think it has to do with how much of it you smoke. No matter what, if your burning something, no matter what, the byproducts of it are always tar and smoke and carbon monoxide (the crap that gives you cancer).Lets look at the average cigarette smoker and the average pot smoker: lets use me as an example: I smoke about ½ a pack a day of cigarettes.. Most people who are at there worse with pot smoke about 3-5 joints a day. (And that’s O.D!!! I can never see myself smoking that much pot in one day, for an extended period of time) but yet I smoke 10-15 cigarettes a day. Ppl who smoke cigarettes only, run a higher risk of cancer, than ppl who smoke pot only because they don’t smoke as much.

so my point was: ITS NOT THE POT THATS BAD..... its just the act of smoking that gives cancer lol

[S14_Kouki]

Marijuana is not bad for you in the solid state that it is as Marijuana. The reason ppl say it is bad and has the potential to kill is cause when you burn something it changes the chemical compound of what it is, so it can have a effect over a long period of time but there is no proof of anyone dieing because it would take to much and to long to actually kill you. But everyone has a different effect when they smoke so everyones body will react different.

There is another awesome show everyone should watch called Super High Me its a guy that studyes the effects of smoking marijuana. WATCH IT

And I do NOT believe marijuana causes cancer. I believe the chemicals they put in ciggs cause cancer.

[Sleepy240]

so my point was: ITS NOT THE POT THATS BAD..... its just the act of smoking that gives cancer lol

That doesn't make pot any less lethal. There are people who smoke cigarettes for 40 years and never develope an ounce of cancer. And there are some who smoke for 5-6 years and boom theres cancer. Theres nothing thats cut and dry when it comes to this type of issue. Thats the point.

really? smoking weed causes cancer. please show your sources

If you can honestly say you believe that if you smoked joints like cigarettes you would have absolutely no chance of developing cancer I would have to call you an ignorant person.

heres a fact for you. cannabis has been around for ages. there has not been a single case of cannabis related death, EVER. alcohol is much worse than cannabis. yea, you can have liver problems from alcohol; but its the things you do while your on alcohol that will get you killed.

Are you mentally ill?? There are thousands of accidents EVERY year that are drug related. Being "high" impares your judgement, reaction speed, and cognitive ability it is NO better than alcohol. If thats your logic than alcohol causes very little to no deaths. If alcohol influences accidents, so does marijuana.


And I do NOT believe marijuana causes cancer. I believe the chemicals they put in ciggs cause cancer.

Had to edit to add this, I can't honestly believe somebody who is even mildly educated would say something like this. Marijuana ciggarettes and tobacco ciggarettes contain MANY of the same ingredients, and that IS a FACT.

[S14_Kouki]

Had to edit to add this, I can't honestly believe somebody who is even mildly educated would say something like this. Marijuana ciggarettes and tobacco ciggarettes contain MANY of the same ingredients, and that IS a FACT.[/QUOTE]

REALLY really I have seen documentary on how both are growin and the only thing that are the same is water. im going to need to see proof to believe you.

[BostonDriftah]

YouTube - Jah Cure - Flyin' High: Explicit (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCGOEhDXwho)

the only plant on the planet that you can clearly tell from male to female is the sweet marijuana.

Just sayin.

Its the only women I love.
:lfault:

[drifting_changed_mylife]

BTW KEEP THE POT MOVIE SUGGESTIONS COMMING!!!!!! THEY ARE AWSOME!!! LOL

just saw the teaser for super high me looks funny as hell

[S14_Kouki]

ahahahahahahahahah u put up a music vid.

Super High Me is fucking super awesome and explains alot

FLorida sucks for marijuana laws im just going to copy and paste because im lazy lol


New trafficking law which carelessly lumps real drug dealers and small time offenders into the same category by creating the ridiculous judicial presumption that as few as 25 marijuana plants — one-fourth the amount the federal government considers a trafficking threshold — makes one a "drug trafficker." Florida already had the dubious honor of having the nation's harshest marijuana possession laws — less than 20 grams can land you in jail for a year and cost you $1,000. Even worse, possession of more than 20 grams is a felony. This new law puts Florida even further ahead of the draconian pack as the Sunshine State can now claim a trafficking standard 4 times as tough as the federal government's!

[BostonDriftah]

mass laws rock.
anything under 1 oz. 28 grams is a fine. of $100.

you should see the city. :dead:

In short time the laws will be reversed.

Its a hoax, that Nixon started. look into it.

they had studies and pres Nixon went ahead and made his own report and ignored the facts and made his own false report... (govt would NEVER do this, would they!?) :hide:

Its a plant it is safe. TRUST ME I KNOW>
I would rather dance with mary, that tangle with AL (cohol)
proof is in the puddin.

[stinky_180]

Its a plant it is safe. TRUST ME I KNOW>



It's Just a Plant - a children’s book about marijuana (http://itsjustaplant.com/)

lol

i'de still like to see your sources


Annual Causes of Death in the United States (http://drugwarfacts.org/cms/?q=node/30)
Tobacco 435,000
Poor Diet and Physical Inactivity 365,000
Alcohol 85,000
Microbial Agents 75,000
Toxic Agents 55,000
Motor Vehicle Crashes 26,347
Adverse Reactions to Prescription Drugs 32,000
Suicide 30,622
Incidents Involving Firearms 29,000
Homicide 20,308
Sexual Behaviors 20,000
All Illicit Drug Use, Direct and Indirect 17,000
Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drugs Such As Aspirin 7,600
Marijuana 0

[greddy2die]

Ok, here is the documentary I was looking for earlier that I wanted to show you guys.

Its called:

THE UNION: The business behind getting high.

The Union (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9077214414651731007#)

Check it out and let me know. Positive or Negative details

[stinky_180]

saw it, has so much good information in it. positive and negative. no where does it say a single person has died from cannabis, smoking or edibles; not a single case.

[Sleepy240]

saw it, has so much good information in it. positive and negative. no where does it say a single person has died from cannabis, smoking or edibles; not a single case.

People dont die from smoking cigarretes, they die from the effects it causes. Just like alcohol, there are far more alcohol related ACCIDENTS then people who die from consuming too much alcohol. Sure it happens but not nearly as much as the accidents. And marijuana would fall into this catagory from what I can see from the in the chart VV

"All Illicit Drug Use, Direct and Indirect 17,000"

Otherwise it would be like separating the deaths from Beer vs. Liquour. Just a waste of time and energy. Marijuana is an illicit drug.


And to back up earlier talking about the harmful ingredients in both tobacco and marijuana... A study conducted by Berkeley on carcinogenic substances.

1) Marijuana contains tar when smoked just like cigarettes. The only difference is the amount, if a person were to smoke just the bud of the marijuana they would consume roughly 33% of the amount of tar.

(This means marijuana STILL contains TAR just like tobacco)

2) Marijuana smokers do not smoke anywhere near as much as tobacco smokers, due to the psychoactive effects of cannabis. However over time the need or dependancy on the drug increases and larger quantities are consumed similiar to that of tobacco products.

I don't feel like copying and pasting everything but they also found some benefits that I believe were stated earlier...

12) Cannabis, unlike tobacco, does not cause any narrowing of the small air passageways in the lungs. In fact my actually help clear the lungs.

22) Only one case of lung cancer has ever been successfully linked to marijuana use.

[BostonDriftah]

bringing back to 1990's

YouTube - Cypress Hill - I Wanna Get High (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_V5YvDyn3YE)

Pick it .
pack it .
fire it up .

come along.

:mepoke:

Nixon, Marijuana, and the Shafer Commission (http://www.csdp.org/news/news/nixon.htm)

^ info on this War on plant. think if someone made roses illegal. shit is stupid.

if you feel the need to over dose on any drug. FEEL FREE its your life bro's/ Enjoy it any way YOU SEE FIT. dont let one man guide your journey/ life.

This is a interest time we live in. No one has respect for each others LIBERTIES! if no one is harmed... then no crime has taking place.

[Sleepy240]

This is a interest time we live in. No one has respect for each others LIBERTIES! if no one is harmed... then no crime has taking place.

R U SRS? You wanna talk about Liberties and then say if nobody is harmed theres no crime? :naw:

[BostonDriftah]

R U SRS? You wanna talk about Liberties and then say if nobody is harmed theres no crime? :naw:

Yes that is correct.

do you see anything wrong with that?

What Liberty does me smoking a plant take from you?
I dont see any that come to mind.

but If I smoke a plant YOU think I should be sent to jail? or fined, and or punished.

Open your mind.
Our world is not to be controlled by one man to another simply.
thats our downfall... trying to control shit.

Let it be. Nature will take its course.
Naturally.

[Sleepy240]

Yes that is correct.

do you see anything wrong with that?

What Liberty does me smoking a plant take from you?
I dont see any that come to mind.

but If I smoke a plant YOU think I should be sent to jail? or fined, and or punished.

Open your mind.
Our world is not to be controlled by one man to another simply.
thats our downfall... trying to control shit.

Let it be. Nature will take its course.
Naturally.

I see alot wrong with "that". You can't be selective when it comes to these things, laws are in place to protect people and OUR liberties. Most of which you seem to take for granted. Am I saying that Marijuana being criminalized is great? No! Do I care if it gets legalized? No! But saying "no harm no foul" is just plain retarded. If you wanna smoke in your house have at enjoy yourself. The second you step outside your door being "high" and get behind the wheel of a motor vehicle thats another story. By the way "one man" does not control anything. Lets not turn this into a conspiracy thread.

[S14_Kouki]

That doc The Union was great just plain great I just got done watching it and I was amazed on how much info there was. I can honestly say I learned alot of stuff I did not know. Thank u for sharing that with us. I wish we could some how publicly broadcast that to ever tv in the united states.

Sleepy240

If u still think marijuana causes cancer watch The Union

Now can you share the link were cancer was linked to marijuana use.

[greddy2die]

That doc The Union was great just plain great I just got done watching it and I was amazed on how much info there was. I can honestly say I learned alot of stuff I did not know. Thank u for sharing that with us. I wish we could some how publicly broadcast that to ever tv in the united states.

Sleepy240

If u still think marijuana causes cancer watch The Union

Now can you share the link were cancer was linked to marijuana use.


Yeah its a pretty good documentary with a great amount of information.

And regarding Sleepy240's comments, im sure he is fully aware that Marijuana does not directly cause cancer. Its the long term effect of physically smoking that causes cancer.

Your buring a material thats turning into ash/smoke/tar. Eventually that all adds up and can possibly have bad side effects.

[S14_Kouki]

Yes that is right ^ but like the doc said if it really did have a bad affect on ppl the gov would be advertising that and flaunting around like its the best thing ever. But after everything is said and done there is no proof.

[Sleepy240]

Yes that is right ^ but like the doc said if it really did have a bad affect on ppl the gov would be advertising that and flaunting around like its the best thing ever. But after everything is said and done there is no proof.

Trust me I fully understand what your trying to say. But if you think smoking a joint doesn't have any of the negative effects that smoking a cigarrete does you are sadly mistaken. The doses are smaller, just because you smoke pot does not mean your going to develope cancer. Thats not what I am trying to say. I have seen "The Union" documentry, and "Super High Me" (if you don't consider that film to be total garbage). There are TONS of misconceptions about marijuana, and sadly most of them come from the people who actually use the substance.

[Future240]

All the talk about smoke, what if you vaporie it? What are the harmful/beneficial effects then? Just a curiosity.

I always thought marijuana should be legal, but should be regulated something like alcohol is. Can't smoke and drive, no smoking it in public, on the job etc.

Companies could sell MJ cigs that range from beer power to everclear power. A new word is created to have a politically correct way to say high and that becomes a new charge DWH.

People would go crazy fora few years but once the paradigm shifted it would be ok.

[greddy2die]

Trust me I fully understand what your trying to say. But if you think smoking a joint doesn't have any of the negative effects that smoking a cigarrete does you are sadly mistaken. The doses are smaller, just because you smoke pot does not mean your going to develope cancer. Thats not what I am trying to say. I have seen "The Union" documentry, and "Super High Me" (if you don't consider that film to be total garbage). There are TONS of misconceptions about marijuana, and sadly most of them come from the people who actually use the substance.


Yeah, I have Super High Me, and while I chuckled a couple times, its not a movie you would want to watch to get good facts regarding marijuana. He probably just did it to smoke pot for a month straight for money and be in a movie.

[S14_Kouki]

Trust me I fully understand what your trying to say. But if you think smoking a joint doesn't have any of the negative effects that smoking a cigarrete does you are sadly mistaken. The doses are smaller, just because you smoke pot does not mean your going to develope cancer. Thats not what I am trying to say. I have seen "The Union" documentry, and "Super High Me" (if you don't consider that film to be total garbage). There are TONS of misconceptions about marijuana, and sadly most of them come from the people who actually use the substance.

Yes im sure there are "so called" misconceptions about marijuana but I have yet to see proof..... The film The Union and other fact show marijuana can cause better and faster brain cell regrowth. There are no facts that marijuana smoke causes cancers. Yes I understand the smoke from marijuana might and I emphasize the word might be harmful unlike cigg smoke. At the end of this all ciggs kill many many more ppl proven unlike marijuana smoke. And the movie Super High Me is about what marijuana smoke does over a period of time the movie proves the point it does not have any effect on the body. Well...... except he can guess numbers easier lol.

Now as future240 brought up what if you smoke with a vaporizer what effects does that have??? Because it is smokeless smoke

[Wake]

I still dont understand why it should be illegal and alchohol and cigs arent.

and I really dont see any logical reasoning being presented here.

No matter how you cut it alcohol and cigs cause waaaaaaaaay more deaths, say "illicit drugs" all you want but the fact is marijuana has never directly caused a death.
Bad judgment maybe which resulted in a accident but I feel that is still grossly overshadowed by the amount of alchy related deaths. but we are still allowed to go out and get plastered and hop behind the wheel which puts everyone on the road at risk. Im not saying that weed doesnt cause people to drive stupidly but I know way more people that are mor cautious while driving high because they get paranoid. I personally love driving high and have never had an accident or even really a close call while doing so. I however NEVER drink and drive because judgment is far more impaired and Im am just plain scared because of how far off center I feel.

now you can compare the factors such as body weight, eating habits for the day, amount drank/smoked in what amount of time, personal tolerance to said substances, and the bottom line is that weed doesnt affect ANYONE as strongly as alcohol. If you sit down and smoke a joint and sit down and take a shot of 80 proof, i guarantee that you will be more fucked up from the alcohol.
Say what you want but there is no legit reason that alchy should be legal and weed shouldnt. period

oh and just to be clear I do have a LEGIT cannabis card for a LEGIT reason and I honestly would not be able to make it more than a few days without smoking, you may call that dependency or addiction, but I have quit smoking weed numerous times (for extended periods of time) and I have been trying to quit cigs since high school with no luck for more than a week or 2.

If anyone wants to know my reason for having a cannabis card I have no problems sharing that as well.

[Sleepy240]

I still dont understand why it should be illegal and alchohol and cigs arent.

I whole heartedly agree, I don't see any reason why it SHOULD be illegal. I'm not arguing for it to stay illegal either.


No matter how you cut it alcohol and cigs cause waaaaaaaaay more deaths, say "illicit drugs" all you want but the fact is marijuana has never directly caused a death.

I can tell you for a fact since the drug is ILLEGAL it is not easy to keep track of actual figures. Its easy to keep track of alcohol and tobacco related incidents since these are LEGAL.

Bad judgment maybe which resulted in a accident but I feel that is still grossly overshadowed by the amount of alchy related deaths. but we are still allowed to go out and get plastered and hop behind the wheel which puts everyone on the road at risk. Im not saying that weed doesnt cause people to drive stupidly but I know way more people that are mor cautious while driving high because they get paranoid. I personally love driving high and have never had an accident or even really a close call while doing so. I however NEVER drink and drive because judgment is far more impaired and Im am just plain scared because of how far off center I feel.

You can't possibly judge what effects somebody more either alcohol or weed. You can't tell me what works for me or what will make more or less impared.

now you can compare the factors such as body weight, eating habits for the day, amount drank/smoked in what amount of time, personal tolerance to said substances, and the bottom line is that weed doesnt affect ANYONE as strongly as alcohol. If you sit down and smoke a joint and sit down and take a shot of 80 proof, i guarantee that you will be more fucked up from the alcohol.
Say what you want but there is no legit reason that alchy should be legal and weed shouldnt. period

Again this goes to my previous statement there is NO WAY you can tell me what will have a greater effect. You cannot guarantee anything. I have stated above that I agree it should be legalized though for the pure benefit of profit.

oh and just to be clear I do have a LEGIT cannabis card for a LEGIT reason and I honestly would not be able to make it more than a few days without smoking, you may call that dependency or addiction, but I have quit smoking weed numerous times (for extended periods of time) and I have been trying to quit cigs since high school with no luck for more than a week or 2.

If anyone wants to know my reason for having a cannabis card I have no problems sharing that as well.

Thats fine, but you haven't actually "quit" if you come back to smoking. Also I would definitely consider that a "dependency", regardless of whether its legal or not.

[S14_Kouki]

Yes sleepy240 you are right I also said it. You cant tell the effects on someone cause like alcohol everyones body reacts different. But I have never never smoked got behind the wheel and said im way to high to drive. Unlike very sad but tru I have got behind the wheel after drinking and said I should not be driving.

But one of the big truths is the government does not want to legalize because allll these years they have been saying brainwashing the american people that marijuana is really bad will kill you this and that. Now if they legalize people will ask questions like, Why would u legalize something that is so bad for us were u lieing this whole time?? They the higher power people dont want us regular people asking questions. When we catch the government in a lie that is not good on there part even tho we already no the government lies to us everyday. Marijuana is a multi billion $ business and its so stupid for the government to pass up this opportunity.

[Sleepy240]

But one of the big truths is the government does not want to legalize because allll these years they have been saying brainwashing the american people that marijuana is really bad will kill you this and that. Now if they legalize people will ask questions like, Why would u legalize something that is so bad for us were u lieing this whole time?? They the higher power people dont want us regular people asking questions. When we catch the government in a lie that is not good on there part even tho we already no the government lies to us everyday. Marijuana is a multi billion $ business and its so stupid for the government to pass up this opportunity.

I can see quite a few reasons as to WHY the government does not want to legalize it. One of them NOT being because they were "lying" for all these years.

#1 - Controlling the substance
Controlling the Marijuana traffic will be very difficult in the beginning. Basically you make it almost impossible to deciefer (sp?) what is LEGAL (controlled) Marijuana and what is something that you purchased from a street corner (which could contain anything, specifically something NOT controlled by the governments legalization)
#2 - How much is too much?
You have to face the facts that with drugs come crime. That is a proven fact, even if legalized the initial problems will be obvious. The government would have to control the total amount of the substance (to try and stop abuse), especially EARLY in the legalizations life. Too much and it will just be sitting around. All though I realize this is kind of a foreign concept but it is very possible depending on the price.
#3 - Cost?
Where does the government choose to buy its initial amount of Marijuana? It does not just grow over night. Obviously they are not going to buy from cartels and the like. Does leave it to Joe Schmoe in Nebraska growing some? Do you pardon the individuals who were breaking previous laws by growing this while it was illegal?

These are just 3 off the top of my head...

[BostonDriftah]

I see alot wrong with "that". You can't be selective when it comes to these things, laws are in place to protect people and OUR liberties. Most of which you seem to take for granted. Am I saying that Marijuana being criminalized is great? No! Do I care if it gets legalized? No! But saying "no harm no foul" is just plain retarded. If you wanna smoke in your house have at enjoy yourself. The second you step outside your door being "high" and get behind the wheel of a motor vehicle thats another story. By the way "one man" does not control anything. Lets not turn this into a conspiracy thread.

Laws dont protect your liberties young blood. they remove them.
ie patriot act....


the CONSTITUTION IS YOUR LIBERTY.
but you knew that.

being all 23 yrs old and super smart and a ZILVIA spokes person.

try this site when you look for info instead of letting your lil mind cook some shit up.
google.com

YouTube - Bob Marley - Smoke Two Joints (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeoxoM_9nH8)

oh and Sleepy240.
your going to far.

reread all your replies...
cuz I DIDNT! lol

[Sleepy240]

Laws dont protect your liberties young blood. they remove them.
ie patriot act....


the CONSTITUTION IS YOUR LIBERTY.
but you knew that.

being all 23 yrs old and super smart and a ZILVIA spokes person.

try this site when you look for info instead of letting your lil mind cook some shit up.
google.com

YouTube - Bob Marley - Smoke Two Joints (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeoxoM_9nH8)

oh and Sleepy240.
your going to far.

reread all your replies...
cuz I DIDNT! lol


Feel free to go another country that as more Liberties and a non "controlling" government. I may only be 23 years of age. I serve to protect this country and OUR freedoms. Whether you enjoy it or not nobody is keeping you here, feel free to leave if you don't enjoy the liberties we have. Has the patriot act actually effected you? Have you lost any of your liberties? Because you can't smoke Marijuana your anti-government?

[S14_Kouki]

Your #1 statement : You are talking about the government cant control who you buy from you say theres a good chance of someone putting something in your weed. Im pretty sure 95% of ppl know the person they are getting it from. I have never bought something off of a street corner thats just plan stupid and not safe. So your person you know you have prob knowin for awhile so there not going to try and fuck you over cause there goes there business and friendship.

Your #2 Statement : Well it is a proven fact that when Oakland, CA passed there marijuana tax law the crime rate went down. Reason they have a lot less people buying off the street and now buying in a controlled place. And not to mention alot less ppl staying out of our court systems and jails for more room for real criminals.

Your #3 Statement : Buy there initial amount of Marijuana. Well I dont have the exact anwser to that. But where do the legal medical marijuana places buy from?? Im sure the government will buy from there sources. And they will not hire Joe Schmoe to grow. This is where our point of job opportunity come into play. The government will have there own big grow houses with there ppl they hire to grow just like someone grows large amounts of flowers there will be a place controlled by the gonvernment that grows large amounts of marijuana. IDK what they would do about the ppl that are in jail now.

[Sleepy240]

Your #1 statement : You are talking about the government cant control who you buy from you say theres a good chance of someone putting something in your weed. Im pretty sure 95% of ppl know the person they are getting it from. I have never bought something off of a street corner thats just plan stupid and not safe. So your person you know you have prob knowin for awhile so there not going to try and fuck you over cause there goes there business and friendship.

Your #2 Statement : Well it is a proven fact that when Oakland, CA passed there marijuana tax law the crime rate went down. Reason they have a lot less people buying off the street and now buying in a controlled place. And not to mention alot less ppl staying out of our court systems and jails for more room for real criminals.

Your #3 Statement : Buy there initial amount of Marijuana. Well I dont have the exact anwser to that. But where do the legal medical marijuana places buy from?? Im sure the government will buy from there sources. And they will not hire Joe Schmoe to grow. This is where our point of job opportunity come into play. The government will have there own big grow houses with there ppl they hire to grow just like someone grows large amounts of flowers there will be a place controlled by the gonvernment that grows large amounts of marijuana. IDK what they would do about the ppl that are in jail now.

My point for reason #1 is that buying from somebody "you know" would NOT be legal. It would still be ILLEGAL because the government is not getting the profit from that sale. So how do you distinguish between some "street" marijuana and the government taxed marijuana? The reason for the numbers going down in your example #2 is that the drug is still for sale on the street. For instance somebody who is ADDICTED to the drug but cannot afford to buy it what do they do?? Steal it, or buy it from a source not sanctioned by the government. The government would CONTROL the pricing aspect just like that of ciggarettes. And to #3, I am unsure as to how the government procures its resources now but I'm sure that these sources cannot supply the ENTIRE country with the demand.

[deolio]

^no one respond. it's going to get this shit locked guaranteed.

[S14_Kouki]

give me a min iv been busy

[joefresh]

I have been a MMJ patient for almost 3years, I get legal buds no hassle...I doubt Marijuana will ever be more legal than it is now, sure it might be legalized nationwide but not for everyone, it will probably still be considered a prescription drug. any questions i can probably answer I have been doing this for a while now

[S14_Kouki]

There is really no way to distinguish between the two you are right. But if the government does not charge over street value, shit or even if they charge 5$ less then street value ppl will buy thur the government just to save money. That would be the smart thing to do. I really dont think anyone is addicted to marijuana. Why are ppl addicted to ciggs?? because of the nicotine thats why they make nicotine gum, patches, nasal spray ect ect to stop the addiction. I personally got laid off almost 3 months ago that was the last day I smoked. So I can clean my system and get a good job. I have not had any pot fitts, yelling, kicking ppls asses nothing im doing just fine.
In my book, smoke > drink

You contradict yourself you say if someone has no money to buy it they will steal it, OR BUY it from someone else. How can they buy it if they dont have money?? Like I said if the government was smart they would price there stuff just under street prices then that person would go to the government instead of the streets. And lets face it theres always going to be ppl, scum might I say that is going to steal no matter the price no matter if they have money or not thats just life.

And I am unsure how the government gets there stuff now and no it would not be enough. Buttttt thats why there will be job opportunity's because bigger and bigger marijuana cultivation company's will open so they will grow to meet the needs of the smokers. Just like tobacco company's grow more and more tobacco to keep up with the growing need same with corn, tomato's, wheat, ect ect

[joefresh]

I am addicted to marijuana, however i medicate with about 3g. per day. It really just depends it helps me live a functional life, however i know some people that are not medical patients, smoke recreationally and are total wastoids...I have never met anyone rob or steal for some bud, that is insane imo. FAct is if Gov regulation and taxation stepped in the prices would probably fall for medical dispenciaries and drug dealers would continue selling heroin and shit like that. If you know anyting about the "street" you would know Quantity is how you profit and nobody buys pounds of herb on the corner...also the Gov would just grow Marijuana like they already do along with many other drugs

[S14_Kouki]

^^ Well I guess there are ppl addicted that proves me wrong on that theory lol. Plus that 3g's can go fast depending on how much you smoke in one sitting and what you smoke with. But dont tell us that cause this shit will get closed.

[Sleepy240]

There is really no way to distinguish between the two you are right. But if the government does not charge over street value, shit or even if they charge 5$ less then street value ppl will buy thur the government just to save money.

To be honest the government only sees in $$$ with a topic like these. From my basic understanding to undercut the "street" prices the government would basically be taking a loss on this investment. On top of that IT WILL be taxed. Hell people freaked out when they increased the prices/taxes on ciggarettes, imagine Marijuana??

You contradict yourself you say if someone has no money to buy it they will steal it, OR BUY it from someone else. How can they buy it if they dont have money?? Like I said if the government was smart they would price there stuff just under street prices then that person would go to the government instead of the streets. And lets face it theres always going to be ppl, scum might I say that is going to steal no matter the price no matter if they have money or not thats just life.

Some of these relates to the previous paragraph but I totally agree there will always be scum. The problem is its a well known fact that DRUGS (in general) lead to an increase in crime. Sadly I don't view marijuana as a seperate "drug" its included in that catagory. People are killed over the drugs everyday and thats undeniable. Blah blah I know its not DIRECTLY because of marijuana but it happens.

And I am unsure how the government gets there stuff now and no it would not be enough. Buttttt thats why there will be job opportunity's because bigger and bigger marijuana cultivation company's will open so they will grow to meet the needs of the smokers. Just like tobacco company's grow more and more tobacco to keep up with the growing need same with corn, tomato's, wheat, ect ect

I would imagine they would purchase the quantities needed from OUT of country. I could see marijuana "farms" being nothing but a huge disaster. I understand some exist but not nearly to this magnitude. They would practically require military personal to secure it, to prevent thefts etc. Over time perhaps they could grow large quantities here but frankly most of the US is not mature enough for something like this.

If you know anyting about the "street" you would know Quantity is how you profit and nobody buys pounds of herb on the corner

I understand this, and this is my entire point. Nothing is going to stop the "street" dealing. The dealers really are not the ones profiting. Sure they may make thousands, but its the suppliers who sell LARGE quantities that are then devied out to the gangs/dealers etc. That is where the money is.

[S14_Kouki]

Yes you are right the government does only see in $$ thats why alot of things in the US will never work. Because the government wants there money first before anyone else gets to benefit. And sadly but yes I myself agree that there is no way that the government will charge less then the streets. But I am right on that would be the smart thing to do in that situation charge less then the streets. Thats the only way ppl will buy from the government rather then the streets.

Im sure they would purchase the quantities from somewhere else just because of outsourcing. It would plain out be cheaper to have some other country grow and buy it from them rather then spend the extra money to do it our selfs. Just like you said the government only see's $$ and thats why half this country is jobless fucking outsourcing.

and I quote " frankly most of the US is not mature enough for something like this." I totally believe this too.

Idk how much they would tax but I do know this. Right now the marijuana tax in Oakland it is $18 for every $1000 that a medical marijuana business makes and thats not that bad at all imo.

Now I dont think its fair that there are state's that you just get a ticket for anything under 28g's or so. But here in FL I go to court or jail and have to take a drug class for having 1g. That is not fair to me, how about if you get cought u have a ticket that you have to pay that way its still tech illegal but our courts and jails will have alot less ppl and the government still gets money.

[Dalton918]

gov. would never take a loss, that's business bruh.

Say you want to buy a hotel room and the room is 300$.

Now go to that same hotel and rent 50 rooms, its not going to be 15 grand, you woould get a discount

Supply and demand is very simple economics.

[Sleepy240]

gov. would never take a loss, that's business bruh.

Say you want to buy a hotel room and the room is 300$.

Now go to that same hotel and rent 50 rooms, its not going to be 15 grand, you woould get a discount

Supply and demand is very simple economics.

I have to disagree with you there on all your points. There is such a thing as "acceptable" losses. If it promotes or grows your business over time. Your a business for long term success not short term profits (ESPECIALLY a GOVERNMENT). And to the hotel comment alot of places do BULK discounts because they are already making considerable margins, it looks like they are cutting you a deal while still making plenty. Supply and demand is simple economics that you don't seem to grasp...

[HalveBlue]

Whatever. Nothing would happen if they legalized pot. Nothing.

Well, actually, they'd probably have less people caught up in the legal system - which, IMHO, would be a good thing.

Pot has been decriminalized in the Netherlands for decades now and they don't have any problems.

The streets aren't dirty or littered with drug corpses.

There aren't gangs shooting it out in the streets.

And people aren't breaking into cars to pawn shit to get their fix.

Consumption is a personal choice, and it shouldn't be up to the government to decide what you can and can't put in your body.

Peace.

[S14_Kouki]

There are actually alot of places in the world that marijuana is decriminalized and they are doing good. Yes that would be a totally good thing that our court/jail systems would not be over flowing with simple marijuana charges. But if ppl keep getting in trouble that means the government will keep making money. Shit theres over 700000 people in our jails for marijuana. Just think if all those ppl were out how much tax money we could save not having to pay for new jails/inmate clothes/inmate food ect ect . Yes I love the fact we are a "free country" but yet we still have ppl watching us telling us what we cant do.

[drift_limo]

Ok, here is the documentary I was looking for earlier that I wanted to show you guys.

Its called:

THE UNION: The business behind getting high.

The Union (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9077214414651731007#)

Check it out and let me know. Positive or Negative details

i was just about to say ...


it will never be fully legalized in the US. like amsterdam . i like the fact they you need to get approved from a DR. better then goin to the store and buyin a sack.

But at the same time DR.'s dont like that because they dont like patients growin their own medicine, unlike gettin your loratabs,somas or zanex ect. ..

sucks .. but oh well

btw if anybody goes on HULU there is a documentary about Jack Herer. I would advice to watch it.

[BustedS13]

it will never be fully legalized in the US. like amsterdam .
it's not "fully legalized" in Amsterdam.

[drift_limo]

it's not "fully legalized" in Amsterdam.

that is true .. right now the goverment is bust'n coffee shops all over the place not only in Amsterdam but also spain

but its more legal then what it is here in the U.S

[JesusFreakDrifter]

theres money to be made in sending people to jail...i do agree that the decriminilization of marijuana should take place, its a complete waste of my tax dollars...period.. im in florida, and i know that less than 20 or so grams is 100 dollar fine, one of my neighbors had a run in, but didnt have his i.d. so he spent the night in the clink....from my research vaporizers are a lil bit safer cuz there is no smoking involved....but breathing in steam isnt safe either...smoking aint safe, however if u CHOOSE to, then excuse me while i light my spliff!

LEGALIZE IT!!!

in all honesty i would rather someone smoke cannibus, than cigs...and if america legalized it, i wouldnt smoke it, just like any connoissuer there should be limits to anything...keep ur intoxication off the streets where you will be in danger to yourself and others...thats what i agree with.. be safe

[BTP]

theres money to be made in sending people to jail...i do agree that the decriminilization of marijuana should take place, its a complete waste of my tax dollars...period.. im in florida, and i know that less than 20 or so grams is 100 dollar fine, one of my neighbors had a run in, but didnt have his i.d. so he spent the night in the clink....from my research vaporizers are a lil bit safer cuz there is no smoking involved....but breathing in steam isnt safe either...smoking aint safe, however if u CHOOSE to, then excuse me while i light my spliff!

LEGALIZE IT!!!

in all honesty i would rather someone smoke cannibus, than cigs...and if america legalized it, i wouldnt smoke it, just like any connoissuer there should be limits to anything...keep ur intoxication off the streets where you will be in danger to yourself and others...thats what i agree with.. be safe
:werd::D:D:D:D:D:Dwe all need to smoke a blunt the world would be a better place.

[S14_Kouki]

[QUOTE=JesusFreakDrifter;3038238 im in florida, and i know that less than 20 or so grams is 100 dollar fine, one of my neighbors had a run in, but didnt have his i.d. [/QUOTE]


Where do you get this info?? I also live in FL and if the cop catch you with anything you are going to jail then to court. What ID because you can only have a medical marijuana Id in the 13 or so states that are pro medical marijuana.

[Sleepy240]

theres money to be made in sending people to jail...i do agree that the decriminilization of marijuana should take place, its a complete waste of my tax dollars...period.. im in florida, and i know that less than 20 or so grams is 100 dollar fine, one of my neighbors had a run in, but didnt have his i.d. so he spent the night in the clink....from my research vaporizers are a lil bit safer cuz there is no smoking involved....but breathing in steam isnt safe either...smoking aint safe, however if u CHOOSE to, then excuse me while i light my spliff!

LEGALIZE IT!!!

in all honesty i would rather someone smoke cannibus, than cigs...and if america legalized it, i wouldnt smoke it, just like any connoissuer there should be limits to anything...keep ur intoxication off the streets where you will be in danger to yourself and others...thats what i agree with.. be safe

Let us break it down here. Sure there is money to made with people in prison. To be honest I still haven't seen a solid reason to have Marijuana decriminalized. I don't see how its a waste of tax dollars though? The fines create more capital. I do not live in Florida but from my understanding it is CRIMINAL to carry any amount of marijuana in Florida, whether one gram or a kilo.

"LEGALIZE IT!!!" -> No.

Lets be frank here again, this is kind of attitude that does nothing but HURT the people who are actually Pro-Marijuana. The people who have no real argument but insist on being involved in things they do not understand. I would 110% rather have the person next to me smoking a cigarette than a joint. You have NO IDEA how the individual will actually act when they are "high". You do realize not everybody just gets all giggly and happy? Some people get aggressive and/or paranoid?

keep ur intoxication off the streets where you will be in danger to yourself and others

Only statement I agree with in your entire horribly spelled paragraph of vomit.

[JesusFreakDrifter]

Where do you get this info?? I also live in FL and if the cop catch you with anything you are going to jail then to court. What ID because you can only have a medical marijuana Id in the 13 or so states that are pro medical marijuana.

experience,,,where are u,? in fort lauderdale it is cut throat but, yea, my peoples been telling me about the fines....there cats smoking in the parks all day...but these are more urban areas, not sure about suburbs...like coral springs and parkland....they may have a zero tolerance deal or something lol


and Sleepy240, there is a lot i can say, but wont, i'll just say this tho....the money wasted jailing teens with a with nickel bag of herb could be spent actually finding pedophiles, and serial killers and rapists...i absolutely do not care wat you choose to do to yourself, that is ur choice..smoke...dont smoke...watever...however i would rather see marijuana accepted in and used in the many ways that it has to offer...and it does..then hear about another disclaimer (ie)**has ur loved one suffered or died from taking our AMERICAN DRUG ADMINSTRATION approved product** i know wat people are capable of...but yes u are right under the influence might be a different story...but that isnt just marijuana...thats codeine, thats zanex, thats zoloft, high blood pressure medicine, ADD medication...excuse me but these are all products that cause many disturbing side effects not related to someones already natural statis...i rather someone smoking marijuana around me and have the possibility of doing something stupid (in reality i dont chill with such persons) than taking depression medication and turning suicidal and distant...(i.e. cannabis is being used in research as a cure to depression/ cancer regression/ asthma/ insomnia/ sleep apnia/hypertension.. i can keep going if u want...)the only reason the research isnt as extensive is because it isnt being funded...who in the world working at the CDC or FDA, ADA or cancer research institute wants to hear that something can actually cure these diseases, with little to no effort at all...i'll go ahead and answer that for you. for a country with no moral to begin with...*scoff* please!! the product is going to continually be smoked, sold, worn, and people are going to go to jail because of it...in all honesty thats just the major reason it isnt legal yet, more money is to be made jailing folk then serving them lol

last i checked on ocala sheriffs offices, an inmate was booked on less than 20grams of canibus, with no set bail amount, he was prolly out the next day
like i told u this same story happened to someone i know

however i will agree, i just read wat i wrote yesterday and yea it was vomit. :rofl::D, but if ur ready to get serious then i will too...bless

[S14_Kouki]

Lets be frank here again, this is kind of attitude that does nothing but HURT the people who are actually Pro-Marijuana. The people who have no real argument but insist on being involved in things they do not understand. I would 110% rather have the person next to me smoking a cigarette than a joint. You have NO IDEA how the individual will actually act when they are "high". You do realize not everybody just gets all giggly and happy? Some people get aggressive and/or paranoid?



From when this thread was started I was 110% for decrem/legalize of marijuana. But from watching The Union and hearing other peoples opinions I have changed my mind. I still think it should be illegal BUT I think that they should not have as harsh punishments going to jail/court for having alittle weed is fucking stupid plan out. How about they give out a ticket if you have under a set amount, anything over that amount then you have to go to court or something. I am 110% with you when I dont want some random ppl smoking next to me because yes everyone acts a different way when they are high but on that note we drink next to random ppl every day/night and alcohol effects ppl harder then pot does.

[S14_Kouki]

experience,,,where are u,? in fort lauderdale it is cut throat but, yea, my peoples been telling me about the fines....there cats smoking in the parks all day...but these are more urban areas, not sure about suburbs...like coral springs and parkland....they may have a zero tolerance deal or something lol


Im in Tampa ill have to check into this.

[Wake]

I am 110% with you when I dont want some random ppl smoking next to me because yes everyone acts a different way when they are high but on that note we drink next to random ppl every day/night and alcohol effects ppl harder then pot does.

So please explain why weed should be illegal and alcohol should not.
This statement is contradictory to your earlier statement of....

I still think it should be illegal BUT I think that they should not have as harsh punishments going to jail/court for having alittle weed is fucking stupid plan out.


and....

How about they give out a ticket if you have under a set amount, anything over that amount then you have to go to court or something.

They already do that here in California, the point is that the punishment of being put on probation for a minimum of 2 years for said amounts (of weed) is a waste of California state resources.
Another reason the city of Oakland is trying to recoup by charging taxes.

Especially when the people that are getting caught (growing or distributing) are generally 20-35 college type people and are usually working toward a better means of living or higher education (no pun intended). They are not these mafioso Mexicans or fucking al qaeda terrorists they try to portray in those anti- drug commercials. I have had numerous probation officers tell me (when I was on probation with them) that they dont care about weed in urine test and they wish that they would take if off the offense list. they consider it a waste of time to have to hunt down non-criminals for dirty tests.
As a result a lot of probation officers dont even register it as a dirty test. Its not even worth the paperwork.

sorry to pick apart your statement.
I have a tendency to do that when Im ....

[S14_Kouki]

So please explain why weed should be illegal and alcohol should not.
This statement is contradictory to your earlier statement of....




and....



They already do that here in California, the point is that the punishment of being put on probation for a minimum of 2 years for said amounts (of weed) is a waste of California state resources.
Another reason the city of Oakland is trying to recoup by charging taxes.

Especially when the people that are getting caught (growing or distributing) are generally 20-35 college type people and are usually working toward a better means of living or higher education (no pun intended). They are not these mafioso Mexicans or fucking al qaeda terrorists they try to portray in those anti- drug commercials. I have had numerous probation officers tell me (when I was on probation with them) that they dont care about weed in urine test and they wish that they would take if off the offense list. they consider it a waste of time to have to hunt down non-criminals for dirty tests.
As a result a lot of probation officers dont even register it as a dirty test. Its not even worth the paperwork.

sorry to pick apart your statement.
I have a tendency to do that when Im ....

It was a point for sleepy240 man to think about. He does not want to stand next to ppl smoking but we will stand next to ppl drinking IMO the only ppl I want to stand next to if it be drinking or smoking is hot chicks. The only reason alcohol is legal and marijuana is illegal is because the profit that alcohol brings in same thing with tobacco. Thats what I think idk the real facts and if someone does post them up. The reason I think it would be a bad idea if weed was legal is everything would go to shit and ppl would take advantage.


I think it should be illegal (thats the only way to controll weed) along the lines of speeding is illegal or boating w/o a lifevest is illegal. So just a simple non traffic violation ticket.


So you are saying if you get cought in cali then you get a ticket and automatic 2 years of probation??

PS sorry ill answer your next questions tomm im fucking tired and not thinking right.

[drftmark]

I think it should be illegal (thats the only way to controll weed) along the lines of speeding is illegal or boating w/o a lifevest is illegal. So just a simple non traffic violation ticket.


obviously it is NOT the way to control weed...

you can't.

People are gonna do what the people want to do.

Declaration of Independence 1776, Thomas Jefferson, check it out some time

[BustedS13]

i think marijuana should be illegal because hemp farming would threaten the paper industry.

LOL OH WAIT

[ThatGuy]

Anybody ever gotten "secondhand" or "contact" drunk?

[S14_Kouki]

obviously it is NOT the way to control weed...

you can't.

People are gonna do what the people want to do.

Declaration of Independence 1776, Thomas Jefferson, check it out some time

Yes ppl are going to do what they want to do I never said they weren't. But if you make it legal the government has no way to controll/over see whats going on. Its just easyer for them to arrest ppl.





i think marijuana should be illegal because hemp farming would threaten the paper industry.

LOL OH WAIT

Hemp and weed are kinda two different things. You can grow hemp without there being weed. Hemp would not only save us billions of $$$$ it would also save use billions on trees. Did u know all of our for fathers in the Free Mason society smoked weed and grew hemp.

[JesusFreakDrifter]

Anybody ever gotten "secondhand" or "contact" drunk?

now thats a real comment, i respect that, because u can get it in ur system just by contact lol...isnt there a certain type of bagel that also leaves "traces" of wat appears to be thc in ur bloodstream....

hey in all honesty, the laws are changing rather quickly, kind of like the rastafarians wanting it to be legalized...it is in a sense for them, because its used in religious practice...i think it was passed on '03, they can't traffic it, they can't haVE it shipped, or get caught with it in a wrong venue i guess, but they can grow it and smoke it without being penalized

[ESmorz]

Anybody ever gotten "secondhand" or "contact" drunk?

Have you ever experienced a contact high? I haven't.

I sure as hell know what it feels like to be high and I hang out with a lot of stoners, hell I even hang out with them when they are hotboxing a car... nothing.

Shit's bogus.

[ThatGuy]

While most of the THC is indeed absorbed by the smoker's lungs, some is still exhaled and can be taken in by someone close to them at the time. No it is not as strong, and the amounts are not as high as the person actually smoking. Most likely not even enough to pop on a Urinalysis.

However, I have never heard of anyone getting a DUI/DWI because they sat next to someone who was doing shots of Patron. :D

[Sleepy240]

Have you ever experienced a contact high? I haven't.

I sure as hell know what it feels like to be high and I hang out with a lot of stoners, hell I even hang out with them when they are hotboxing a car... nothing.

Shit's bogus.

I have to disagree with you here. There are plenty of cases of "secondhand" highs, especially in the situation you describe as "hotboxing" a car. Google might help you out a little bit with your arguement. But have you ever got drunk by being around somebody consuming alcohol? Cause I sure as hell have not.

The people you are describing and "hanging out" with are exactly the reason marijuana will never be legalized. "Hotboxing" a car certainly is not giving you any credibility. It is the people who ABUSE the substance that ruin it for everyone else. I do not smoke and won't, but for the people who do you can thank your fellow "potheads" for giving everyone a bad name.

And back to the Hemp thing. As somebody else said Hemp does not automatically mean marijuana is involved. And sure there is tons of money to be had but is it more than whats with paper? I doubt it, trees are available NOW, Hemp takes an investment for down the road. The government sees dollar signs, but they don't care about the dollar signs if they are twenty years down the road.

[BustedS13]

However, I have never heard of anyone getting a DUI/DWI because they sat next to someone who was doing shots of Patron. :D

valid, but i've heard of people getting cancer because they sat next to someone smoking cigarettes.

edit: i'll go ahead and say that there's no solid evidence of secondhand smoke causing cancer, and that smoking isn't the only way you can get cancer. but i'd really like to hear a solid, logical explanation of why tobacco is legal and marijuana isn't, based on health concern or public safety.

gonna go a little liberal here, bear with me.
the tobacco companies are the face of evil in America. they stay in business because they addict people to their product and their lobbyists hand out the most money.
when smoking bans started enjoying a little popularity in America, the tobacco companies realized they needed a new product that could be covertly consumed in places where smoking is banned, for the enjoyment of the addicted populace. in comes snus, which was never marketed here before, and, in fact, has now been banned in most of the EU.
and then they act like dealers. every magazine i open has a Camel ad in it with a coupon for a free tin of snus with any tobacco purchase. and for the past year or better, every time i go to a large event in the city (fourth of july fair, Taste St. Louis, St. Patrick's day parade, etc etc etc), there are two tents set up: one for Camel and one for Skoal. the Camel tent gives anyone over 18 TWO free tins of Snus for walking in with a valid ID. the Skoal tent does the same with their snus product and Skoal Bandits. first one's free, isn't that the saying?
anyway, tobacco is the devil and it's legal. if the concern is people getting contact highs... i've never experienced one, and that could easily be controlled.

[SexPanda]

I am addicted to tobacco. Its bad, you get the cold shivers, sweats, your on edge... if you havent had a puff in a day or 2. So I agree, tobacco is the devil. It kills, no doubt about it. Im sure if I smoked as much weed as I have tobacco, however, I'd be brain dead long before lung cancer killed me lol.

I guarantee it will be legal one day... Its just a matter of time.

[S14_Kouki]

And back to the Hemp thing. As somebody else said Hemp does not automatically mean marijuana is involved. And sure there is tons of money to be had but is it more than whats with paper? I doubt it, trees are available NOW, Hemp takes an investment for down the road. The government sees dollar signs, but they don't care about the dollar signs if they are twenty years down the road.

^False^

Im pretty sure Hemp would put the paper companys out of business. Because 1 hemp grows alot lot more faster then trees so it replenishes its self faster then trees. 2 It will be alot less harmful to the environment because you can have a hemp farm to produce all the hemp you want without cutting down millions and millions of trees to make the same amount of hemp paper.

[JesusFreakDrifter]

i could've sworn there was some sort of school house rock type of cartoon about that very thing,,, where a company was built and paid for its product, but in the end the raw material to make the product became scarce, and it drove the co outta business, it was pretty good too

[Sleepy240]

^False^

Im pretty sure Hemp would put the paper companys out of business. Because 1 hemp grows alot lot more faster then trees so it replenishes its self faster then trees. 2 It will be alot less harmful to the environment because you can have a hemp farm to produce all the hemp you want without cutting down millions and millions of trees to make the same amount of hemp paper.

I think you missed my point. The United States can continue to cut down trees RIGHT NOW. They can't just pop up Hemp farms overnight. It takes time, capital, and employees. And to be totally honest I would not see it putting PAPER out of business, unless of course they stopped using wood to build thing and started using Hemp. Paper isn't just made from raw trees, the leftovers from production of lumber are also used as an example. Hemp has little uses at the moment to the market, you don't see a large demand for Hemp clothing, or Hemp paper for that matter. Hemp products haven't taken off because frankly they are not worth the cost IMO. I mean hell they have existed for MANY years.

[S14_Kouki]

They do continue to cut down trees everyday and thats not cool. It would not be to hard to start major hemp farms now considering that the fallowing states already grow hemp VT, HI, ND, MT, MN, IL, VA, NM, CA, AR, KY, MD, WV. 1 acre of hemp is equal to 4.1 acres of trees and hemp plastic panels impact strength is 10 times stronger then steel says popular mechanics. I did some more research on hemp. IMO hemp would be 1000 times better then trees

[Sleepy240]

They do continue to cut down trees everyday and thats not cool. It would not be to hard to start major hemp farms now considering that the fallowing states already grow hemp VT, HI, ND, MT, MN, IL, VA, NM, CA, AR, KY, MD, WV. 1 acre of hemp is equal to 4.1 acres of trees and hemp plastic panels impact strength is 10 times stronger then steel says popular mechanics. I did some more research on hemp. IMO hemp would be 1000 times better then trees

Why is cutting down trees not cool? It is a necessity at this point for the entire world not just the United States. Like I said unless you plan on building houses of a hemp, logging will always be a business. With the logging comes the paper making among other things. They remove trees not just for paper though, what about creating land for expansion, the house YOU live in is for all intensive perposes built on land harvested from trees! Think about it. So your logic is we should stop cutting down trees to grow Hemp to create an alternate paper, clothings, and plastic panels? What about all the NEW factories that would have to built to process these materials? What about all the people who have jobs that would be lost with the removal of paper companies? Even as a new company Hemp processing plants would not be dumb. Most of the paper employees would have been there for a substantial amount of time, think they will get a job at the Hemp plant for the same wage? I severly doubt it. I completely agree that in the long run Hemp probably makes more sense, but just because something makes sense does NOT mean it will work.

[drftmark]

I am addicted to tobacco. Its bad, you get the cold shivers, sweats, your on edge... if you havent had a puff in a day or 2. So I agree, tobacco is the devil. It kills, no doubt about it. Im sure if I smoked as much weed as I have tobacco, however, I'd be brain dead long before lung cancer killed me lol.

I guarantee it will be legal one day... Its just a matter of time.


you would not be brain dead.

some of the smartest most successful people in the world smoke marijuana and their brains are fine along with everyone else.

[Sleepy240]

you would not be brain dead.

some of the smartest most successful people in the world smoke marijuana and their brains are fine along with everyone else.

The problem with this arguement is that the successful are FAR out weighed by the NON successful. Along with some of the "smartest most successful people" are some of the dumbest most un-successful people. You also don't differentiate between the habitual smokers and the people who HAVE smoked. To me there is a large difference between somebody who smokes once a month and somebody who smokes everyday (to go along with your super successful people). Any honest debate with successful versus un-successful is a waste of time because whats "successful" to you may not be the same to me. Also if you really wanted to prove your point post a list of names with the quantity or frequency with which they smoke.

[greddy2die]

you would not be brain dead.

some of the smartest most successful people in the world smoke marijuana and their brains are fine along with everyone else.


Just as Sleepy240 stated, just because there are successful people that do smoke, does not mean anything.

Over many years of consumption it could lead to some kind of memory loss, paranoia and other side effects (i know there are worse side effects im just not going to list them, you get the point).

Their have been studies that have shown though that marijuana can in SOME cases stimulate the brain. However, like many have said before, EVERYONE is different. I smoke and I relax, play guitar, write some songs, play xbox or work on my car. Just because I can be productive in life while I have smoked marijuana doesnt mean Joe Smoe next to me will be the same

[S14_Kouki]

Why is cutting down trees not cool? It is a necessity at this point for the entire world not just the United States. Like I said unless you plan on building houses of a hemp, logging will always be a business. With the logging comes the paper making among other things. They remove trees not just for paper though, what about creating land for expansion, the house YOU live in is for all intensive perposes built on land harvested from trees! Think about it. So your logic is we should stop cutting down trees to grow Hemp to create an alternate paper, clothings, and plastic panels? What about all the NEW factories that would have to built to process these materials? What about all the people who have jobs that would be lost with the removal of paper companies? Even as a new company Hemp processing plants would not be dumb. Most of the paper employees would have been there for a substantial amount of time, think they will get a job at the Hemp plant for the same wage? I severly doubt it. I completely agree that in the long run Hemp probably makes more sense, but just because something makes sense does NOT mean it will work.


Yes, not everything will work and yes I do think it is bad for how much we are cutting down trees. I personally live in a cement house only the wood is a roof frame and a couple other things. There are tons of things hemp can be used for then besides those 3 things. We can open alot of hemp factories and still keep lumber factories. I think we should just start going towards something else something smarter.

[Sleepy240]

Yes, not everything will work and yes I do think it is bad for how much we are cutting down trees. I personally live in a cement house only the wood is a roof frame and a couple other things. There are tons of things hemp can be used for then besides those 3 things. We can open alot of hemp factories and still keep lumber factories. I think we should just start going towards something else something smarter.

You have not really answered the question though. What is wrong with cutting down the trees? It has been done for HUNDREDS of years. And if your house is made of cement than you must live somewhere weird. Everywhere I have ever seen used lumber to frame the walls, especially the interior, and the roofs, with the exception of metal studs in office buildings and the like. My main thing was even if your house is infact made of cement the land it is built on was likely a forest at one time. Luckily we were able to harvest the trees and create land for expansion giving you a place to live. There are TONS of things the lumber is used for besides just lumber and paper. To be 100% honest I really do not see a whole lot of benefits to growing hemp vs harvesting trees.

[Sleepy240]

smoke weed everyday!!

Fail... Did mommy forget to lock the computer while she walked away?

Comments like this are the reason marijuana has such a negative stereotype.

[drftmark]

The problem with this arguement is that the successful are FAR out weighed by the NON successful. Along with some of the "smartest most successful people" are some of the dumbest most un-successful people. You also don't differentiate between the habitual smokers and the people who HAVE smoked. To me there is a large difference between somebody who smokes once a month and somebody who smokes everyday (to go along with your super successful people). Any honest debate with successful versus un-successful is a waste of time because whats "successful" to you may not be the same to me. Also if you really wanted to prove your point post a list of names with the quantity or frequency with which they smoke.


The fact that there are numerous "dumbest most un-successful people" should just be known. Just because they are dumb and un-successful does not mean that marijuana made them this way. There are dumb people in the world no matter what.

I am not saying that the "successful people" are successful BECAUSE they smoked pot. It is not like it made them successful. I was just merely saying that you can smoke pot and be successful, and not fall in the social stigma category of "pot heads" all being brain dead no bodies as many people portray them to be.

I hate to clutter the thread with this long list, but here you go. I did not make this it is a post from another forum. Also it would be very hard to get people to disclose how much they smoked and how often.... because it is illegal...

• Abbie Hoffman
• Abraham Lincoln. On a Hohner box cover but disputed.
• Al Gore.
• Aldous Huxley
• Aleister Crowley
• Alexander Dumas
• Alice B. Toklas
• Allen Ginsberg. Poet.
• Alexis Korner. Musician.
• Andy Warhol. Artist.
• Annita Roddock. Founder 'The Body Shop'.
• Anjelica Huston. Hollywood actress. Jack Nicholson's girlfriend for 17 years. Pro-drug statements by her in Peter McWilliams book, 'Ain't Nobody's Business if You Do: The Absurdity of Consensual Crimes in Our Free Country'.
• Arthur Conan Doyle. Author, creator 'Sherlock Holmes'.
• Aswad. Musicians.
• Beatles.
• Bill Clinton.
• Bill Gates. Not confirmed, just very strongly hinted at in the Playboy interview
• Bill Murray Arrested for possession
• Bob Denver.
• Bob Dylan. Poet, singer, song writer.
• Bob Marley. Poet, singer, song writer.
• The Bishop of Monmouth.
• Brian Eno. Singer, song writer. Signed 'Independent' list.
• Boy George.
• Brad Pitt
• British Lords & MP's - too many to list .
• Buddy Rich.
• Cab Calloway. Jazz musician.
• Carl Sagan. Author.
• Caroline Coon. Artist, founder 'Release', manager of the Clash.
• Carl Segan . Author.
• Carlos Santana. Musician, guitarist.
• Carrie Fischer.
• Cary Grant.
• Cary Mullis. Nobel Laurate, Biology
• Charles Beaudelaire
• Charles Dickens. Claims but no evdience.
• Cheech Marin.
• Chris Armstrong. Footballer, tested positive.
• Chris Conrad.
• Chris Farley. 60's singer.
• Chris Rock.
• Conan O'Brian.
• Count Basie. Jazz legend.
• Dame Ruth Runsiman. Author; Police Federation Report (March 2000) advising liberlization.
• Dave Gilmour . Musician ; Pink Floyd.
• Dave 'Tinki Winky' Thompson - TV personality (UK); the Tellie Tubbie that was sacked.
• Diego Rivera.
• Dion Fortune.
• Dioscorides.
• Dizzy Gillespie.
• Douglas Adams. Author.
• Dr Francis Crick. Nobel Prize winner.
• Dr Lester Grinspoon.
• Dr Mark Porter. TV doctor who says cannabis is not more harmful than alcohol.
• Dr Anne Biezanek (authoress)
• Dr R.D.Laing.
• Dr John Marks
• Dr W.B. O'Shaugnessy.
• Drew Barrymore.
• Duke Ellington.
• Eddie Ellison. Ex head of Scotland Yard Drug Squad.
• Edgar Allen Poe. Author, multi-drug user.
• Elvis Presley. Singer, FBI informer.
• Emperor Liu Chi-nu.
• Emperor Shen-Nung.
• Ernest Hemmingway. Author.
• Errol Flynn.
• Fela Kuti. Musician. Afro/jazz king.
• Felix Dennis. Publisher.
• Fitz Hugh Ludlow.
• Fran Healey. Musician; Travis.
• Francis Ford Coppella.
• Francis Rabelais.
• Francis Wilkinson. Ex Chief Constable of Gwent Police.
• Fredreich Nietzshe.
• Ganesh - Hindu God.
• Gary Johnson.
• Gene Krupa.
• George Clinton. Ex President's brother.
• George W Bush. Possibly the greatest living hypocrite.
• George Gurdjieff.
• George Melly. Jazz musician (early sponsor of Legalise Cannabis Campaign, Uk).
• George Michael. Singer.
• George Washington.
• George Soros.
• Gerard de Nerval.
• Gilberto Gil. Brazilian musical icon.
• The Greatful Dead.
• Hasan I-Sabah.
• Heinrich Khunrath.
• Helen Petrova Blavatsky.
• Henri Michaux.
• Herman Hesse.
• Hiero the Second.
• Howard Marks. Author, cannabis smuggller.
• Howard Stern, Admitted it on the radio.
• Hua T'o.
• Hunter S. Thompson. Smoked weed and snorted coke with George Bush.
• Ian Botham. Convicted Cricket legend.
• Irvine Welsh.
• Kurt Cobain.
• Jabir Ibn el-Hayyan.
• Jack Herer. Author 'The Emporor Wears No Cloths'
• Jack Kerouac. Author ' On the Road'.
• Jack Nicholson. Film actor.
• Jackie Gleason.
• Jackson Pollock.
• Jane Fonda. Actress.
• James Brown. Singer, song writer.
• Janis Joplin. Singer, song writer.
• Jesse 0Ventura.
• Jerry Lee Lewis. Musician, song writer.
• Jimmy Dorsey.
• Jimmy Hendrix. Rock guitarist, singe, song writer
• Jim Morrison. Musician, songwriter; The Doors.
• Joan of Arc. Accused of using 'witch herbs' (another name for cannabis).
• Joan Rivers.
• Joe Strummer. Musician, singer, songer writer; The Clash.
• John Belushi.
• John Denver.
• John F Kennedy. Popular US president (assassinated).
• John Keats. Poet.
• John Lennon. Musician, song writer; The Beatles.
• John Le Mesurier. Tried it but said it's not for him.
• Johnny Cash.
• John Peel. DJ, BBC broadcaster.
• John Sinclair.
• Judge John L. Kane. Chief Judge from the US District Court
• Julie Christie. Actress.
• Jules Verne.
• John Wayne. 'I tried it once but it didn't do anything to me.'
• Kelsey Grammar.
• Ken Livingston. Mayor of London - supports decriminalisation but does not smoke or support the use of recreational drugs.
• Kirk Douglas. Actor.
• Kurt Cobain.
• Larry Adler. Harmonica player and
friend of George Gershwin. May have written a song about it.
• Lenny Bruce. Comedian.
• Lewis Carroll. Author 'Alice in Wonderland'.
• Linda St Clair
• Little Richard. Musician.
• Lord Avebury.
• Lord Byron. Poet.
• Lord Deedes.
• Lord Tony Gifford. QC, civil rights lawyer.
• Louis Armstrong. 'Oh what a wonderful world'.
• Louis Hebert.
• Mark Thomas . Comedian.
• Marlon Brando. Actor.
• Martin Sheen.
• Mary Shelly. Author 'Frankinstein'.
• Mary Tyler Moore.
• Megan Fox
• Mick Jagger. Singer, song writer, The Rolling Stones.
• Michael Mansfield QC. Lawyer.
• Jade Jagger.
• JC 100. Fastest rapper in the west.
• JT Moore. Legendary white rasta guitarist.
• Mike Tyson.
• Miles Davis. Jazz/rock drummer.
• Mo Mowlan. Genuine honest politician.
• Modigliani. Sculptor.
• Montgomery Clift. Mentioned in his biography.
• Neil Diamond.
• Nick Hornby. Author.
• Niel Young. Musician.
• Norman Mailer. Author.
• Oasis. Rock band.
• Oliver Stone.
• Oscar Wilde. Poet.
• Pablo Picasso. Artist.
• Pancho Villa. Mexican bandit revolutionary.
• Paul Flynn. Uk Member of Parliament.
• Paul McCartney. Musician, song writer; The Beatles.
• Paul Simon. Musician, song writer.
• Pharoahs of Egypt. Traces in body samples.
• Phil Donohue.
• Phil Tufnell. Former test cricketer, now media celeb.
• Peter Fonda. Actor; 'Easy Rider'.
• Peter Sellers. Actor, comedian.
• Peter Tosh. Musician.
• Philip K. Dick. Science fiction author.
• Pierre Burton.
• Pierre Elliot Trudeau.
• Pink Floyd; Syd Barret and Roger Waters.
• Prince Charles. Heir to the Throne. Quoted while visiting a hospital; 'I understand cannabis is good for medical use' .
• Prince William.
• Prince Harry.
• Pythagoras.
• Queen Arnegunde.
• Queen Victoria. Used it for medical purposes.
• Ram Dass.
• Ray Charles. Musician.
• Rev Kenneth Leech.
• Richard Branson. 'Virgin'. Entreprenur.
• Richard Feynman, Nobel Prize Laureate physicist, founder of quantum electrodynamics.
• Richard Prior.
• Richard Wilson. Actor; 'One Foot in the Grave'.
• Rimbaud. Author.
• Robert Burns. Mentioned it in a poem.
• Robert 'King' Carter. Grower.
• Robert Anton Wilson. Author.
• Robert Mitchum. Jailed 90 days for possession of marijuana, 1949.
• Roger McGough. 60's liverpool poet.
• Rolling Stones. Rock band.
• Ronnie Scot. Jazz club owner, musician, busted on stage 1958, at his club in Soho, London.
• S Club 7. 'Super clean' pop band, busted in Soho, very embarrassing.
• Salvador Dali. Artist.
• Samuel Beckett.
• Samuel Taylor Coleridge. Poet.
• Shen Nung. One of the fathers of Chinese medicine. 2700 B.C .
• Sinead O'Connor. Singer.
• Sidi-Hidi.
• Sigmun Freud. Shrink.
• Sonny Bono.
• Super Furry Animals. Welsh band who wrote a song about Howard Marks.
• Stephen King.
• Sting/Gordon Sumners.
• Tariq Ali. Activist Writer.
• Tenessee Williams. Author.
• Terence McKenna. Author.
• Terry Gilliam. Actor, comedian;Monty Python.
• The Who. Rock band.
• Thelonius Monk.
• Thomas Jefferson.
• Timothy Leary.
• Tom Lehrer.
• Top Tories. Senior members of the shadow cabinet.
• Tony Elliot. Publisher, 'Time Out.
• Tracy Blevins. Artist.
• Tuppy Gore.
• UB40. Band.
• Victor Hugo.
• Vincent Van Gogh. Artist.
• Walt Disney. Cartoonist.
• Walter Benjamin.
• Whitney Houstonn. Busted at Hawaii airport but ran away.
• William Burroughs. Author, poet, artist.
• Will Self. Author. Did smack on Blairs plane.
• William Shakespeare. Playwright.
• William Straw. UK Home Sec Jack Straw's son. Cautioned for supplying undercover journalists in pub 'shocker'.
• Willie Nelson.
• Winston Churchill. British Prime Minister, poet, artist & multi drug user.
• Woody Harrelson. Actor. Features in a book on growing medical marijuana .
• Zoroaster. Persian prophet.

[Sleepy240]

The fact that there are numerous "dumbest most un-successful people" should just be known. Just because they are dumb and un-successful does not mean that marijuana made them this way. There are dumb people in the world no matter what.

I am not saying that the "successful people" are successful BECAUSE they smoked pot. It is not like it made them successful. I was just merely saying that you can smoke pot and be successful, and not fall in the social stigma category of "pot heads" all being brain dead no bodies as many people portray them to be.

I hate to clutter the thread with this long list, but here you go. I did not make this it is a post from another forum. Also it would be very hard to get people to disclose how much they smoked and how often.... because it is illegal...

I am not going to bother quoting the list because that is a waste of time. So basically you have posted a bunch of vomit that means nothing? I am very confused as to your point of this list. If your point is just disprove the stigma that has already been done, the only reason the stigma exsists is because there are FAR MORE unsuccessful marijuana smokers than "successful" marijuana smokers. I think we have already established that just because you smoke marijuana you are not a "pot head". Also I can easily go copy and paste a list of successful people with marijuana and I am VERY (100% confident) you find more successful NON smokers than smokers. And to be 100% clear I don't feel this list is a good way to convey your point since I just skimmed the list, it included people who have "eluded" to smoking before, and people are just plain a bad example. I would thoroughly suggest you read a list before you just copy and paste it from a forum. Also some of your list would definitely QUALIFY into the "Pot head" stigma among other addictions (just as an example Bob Marley & Kurt Cobain).

[ESmorz]

The people you are describing and "hanging out" with are exactly the reason marijuana will never be legalized. "Hotboxing" a car certainly is not giving you any credibility. It is the people who ABUSE the substance that ruin it for everyone else. I do not smoke and won't, but for the people who do you can thank your fellow "potheads" for giving everyone a bad name.


I don't care what other teenagers do.

They aren't giving me a bad name, they are contributing to a stereotype that holds a lot of merit. Such is life.

I'm just saying, I have never in my life felt any different from being around people smoking.

[Sleepy240]

I don't care what other teenagers do.

They aren't giving me a bad name, they are contributing to a stereotype that holds a lot of merit. Such is life.

I'm just saying, I have never in my life felt any different from being around people smoking.

Thats where you are VERY wrong. You should care what other teenagers do, because they are what lead to problems. It is the same with cars, in a respect. Because some jackass teenager wants to do donuts in a parking lot all the Imports get cracked down on, its simple cause and effect. When a bunch of kids get high and do something stupid guess what? It makes everybody who smokes look that much worse. Everytime a street racing punk kills somebody it makes ALL of us look bad. I hope you can see the correlation here. And thats great that YOU have never gotten a secondary high, does that mean it does not or could not happen? I am sure YOU do not have cancer, but does that mean cancer does not exist? The answer to both questions is NO.

[ESmorz]

Thats where you are VERY wrong. You should care what other teenagers do, because they are what lead to problems.


I gave up on humanity in 5th grade at the San Juan Capistrano Mission.

[drftmark]

I am not going to bother quoting the list because that is a waste of time. So basically you have posted a bunch of vomit that means nothing? I am very confused as to your point of this list. If your point is just disprove the stigma that has already been done, the only reason the stigma exsists is because there are FAR MORE unsuccessful marijuana smokers than "successful" marijuana smokers. I think we have already established that just because you smoke marijuana you are not a "pot head". Also I can easily go copy and paste a list of successful people with marijuana and I am VERY (100% confident) you find more successful NON smokers than smokers. And to be 100% clear I don't feel this list is a good way to convey your point since I just skimmed the list, it included people who have "eluded" to smoking before, and people are just plain a bad example. I would thoroughly suggest you read a list before you just copy and paste it from a forum. Also some of your list would definitely QUALIFY into the "Pot head" stigma among other addictions (just as an example Bob Marley & Kurt Cobain).

??? The only reason I posted it a list is because you requested one... and then your entire response is about how stupid posting that list was??? :goyou:


what is YOUR reason... YOU, the guy with the extremely drug related avatar, YOUR personal reason why you think marijuana should be illegal. I am just curious because you seem really die hard about this.

[Sleepy240]

??? The only reason I posted it a list is because you requested one... and then your entire response is about how stupid posting that list was??? :goyou:


what is YOUR reason... YOU, the guy with the extremely drug related avatar, YOUR personal reason why you think marijuana should be illegal. I am just curious because you seem really die hard about this.

The last sentence requesting the list was sarcasm because as I stated above the list is pointless. For now on I will finish my sarcastic sentences with "(sarcasm)". Good job though... :ddog:

Also could you explain how my avatar is drug related? That I am very interested in. I have various feelings as to why marijuana should be illegal and I'll gladly give you a couple...

#1 Maturity - There are NOT enough mature people to deal with this substance. If Marijuana is legalized it WILL be abused just like alcohol (You can quote me on that). And frankly I feel the same about alcohol, people not being mature enough. I think 21 is way to young people don't take it seriously nor understand the consequences that come along with it.

#2 Too much? - How do you determine when somebody has had too much? Sure there have been no cases of overdosing due to Marijuana but how many joints before you cannot drive safely? How many bong hits till you do something harmful? See my point here

#3 Controlled Substance - If it is infact legalized how will it be monitored and controlled? How do you determine from the governments "pot" and the "pot" you purchase off the street? The only "pot" that would be legal is that the government is profiting from.

These are just 3 quick ones off the top of my head I can gladly provide more if you would like?

[drftmark]

The last sentence requesting the list was sarcasm because as I stated above the list is pointless. For now on I will finish my sarcastic sentences with "(sarcasm)". Good job though... :ddog:

Also could you explain how my avatar is drug related? That I am very interested in. I have various feelings as to why marijuana should be illegal and I'll gladly give you a couple...

#1 Maturity - There are NOT enough mature people to deal with this substance. If Marijuana is legalized it WILL be abused just like alcohol (You can quote me on that). And frankly I feel the same about alcohol, people not being mature enough. I think 21 is way to young people don't take it seriously nor understand the consequences that come along with it.

#2 Too much? - How do you determine when somebody has had too much? Sure there have been no cases of overdosing due to Marijuana but how many joints before you cannot drive safely? How many bong hits till you do something harmful? See my point here

#3 Controlled Substance - If it is infact legalized how will it be monitored and controlled? How do you determine from the governments "pot" and the "pot" you purchase off the street? The only "pot" that would be legal is that the government is profiting from.

These are just 3 quick ones off the top of my head I can gladly provide more if you would like?

It looks like your avatar is from Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, but if it is not then my mistake.

your #1 seems like a lost cause. People drink and smoke weed in high school way before their legal age limit comes even with all these current laws in place. Making mistakes is part of growing up.

#2 Everything can be abused. People over eat and eat unhealthy all the time. Alcohol prohibition didn't work, weed is just at a disadvantage because the users get chilled out and don't want to go out shooting like mobsters. Would you want the government telling you what you can and cannot eat? I understand your point about it not being safe to drive, it would be nice if a method was developed to combat this.

#3, coffee shops could be setup that has a tax on what they sell. Even if it was just sales tax, a shop would still be selling and bringing in revenue. It is way more convenient than dealing with a drug dealer. Just look at how crowded all the Amsterdam shops are.

I mean honestly, one should be able to sit in their house and smoke and not worry about getting busted.

[S14_Kouki]

You have not really answered the question though. What is wrong with cutting down the trees? It has been done for HUNDREDS of years. And if your house is made of cement than you must live somewhere weird. Everywhere I have ever seen used lumber to frame the walls, especially the interior, and the roofs, with the exception of metal studs in office buildings and the like. My main thing was even if your house is infact made of cement the land it is built on was likely a forest at one time. Luckily we were able to harvest the trees and create land for expansion giving you a place to live. There are TONS of things the lumber is used for besides just lumber and paper. To be 100% honest I really do not see a whole lot of benefits to growing hemp vs harvesting trees.


lol sorry I thought I did. I just see If we keep cutting down trees at the rate we are doing now in about 30 more years pretty much all the trees will be gone, not even to talk about how many forest will be gone. Soooo since there is something like Hemp that can really help us out why dont we take advantage of that resource right?? Im not a tree hugger but I do care about or environment.

[S14_Kouki]

I think 21 is way to young people don't take it seriously nor understand the consequences that come along with it.


If this is what you think then can you tell me what age and Can you honestly tell me you never drank before the age of 21?? I hope you are not contradicting yourself



Also if you really wanted to prove your point post a list of names with the quantity or frequency with which they smoke.

He gave you a list and you are flaming him for it. Im sure that list goes on and on with alot more big name ppl we dont know about.

[Dalton918]

Sleepy 240 you sound like a lot of people from the early 1900's making thier arguments for prohibition.

Guess what happened people still drank and crime rose to an all time high.
Pot is pretty m uch the same except it's lasted longer, in 100 yearss nobody will give a shit and people will buy it at walmart while refilling prescriptions, the side effects of which will probably cause them more than pot ever could.

[Sleepy240]

#1 seems like a lost cause. People drink and smoke weed in high school way before their legal age limit comes even with all these current laws in place. Making mistakes is part of growing up.

#2 Everything can be abused. People over eat and eat unhealthy all the time. Alcohol prohibition didn't work, weed is just at a disadvantage because the users get chilled out and don't want to go out shooting like mobsters. Would you want the government telling you what you can and cannot eat? I understand your point about it not being safe to drive, it would be nice if a method was developed to combat this.

#3, coffee shops could be setup that has a tax on what they sell. Even if it was just sales tax, a shop would still be selling and bringing in revenue. It is way more convenient than dealing with a drug dealer. Just look at how crowded all the Amsterdam shops are.

I mean honestly, one should be able to sit in their house and smoke and not worry about getting busted.

I agree with you about a lot of things here. Firstly about the kids in high school. This is where the whole stigma begins. When kids do things like smoke pot, and get drunk problems arise. I do have a personal hatred for underage drinking and the same goes for illegal drugs. Making mistakes that effect yourself are one thing, making mistakes that HURT or effect other individuals ARE an ISSUE. That is NOT JUST part of "growing up". On the second one, how does your over eating effect me, what benefit would the government have from restricting what you eat? I think your kinda stretching for that point. But I do agree that until there is some method of determining how much is too much it WILL NOT be legalized. And on number three I do agree about the taxing my point is just that the government only legalizes the product that THEY in fact profit from. They would still nail people for "illegal" drug use (IE the marijuana would have some specific tag to it or something similar).

If this is what you think then can you tell me what age and Can you honestly tell me you never drank before the age of 21?? I hope you are not contradicting yourself

Let me start by saying I did not touch an OUNCE of alcohol before the age of 21. Part of it being the way I was raised, the other part being that I have seen the effects alcohol can have on a minor. I was actually HIT by an underage drunken driver. Guess what it sucks, he had no regard for life, his own or others, and ABUSED the substance. 3 Years later when he turned 21, guess who got into another accident? The SAME DAMN KID. Tell me that is mature? I know I am generalizing but honestly people really don't understand the respect they need to show to drinking (underage or not).

He gave you a list and you are flaming him for it. Im sure that list goes on and on with alot more big name ppl we dont know about.

Like I said it was sarcasm because ANY LIST will not show how frequently or how much an individual smokes. "OMG Bill Clinton smoked a joint and he was a president!! WEED FTMFW!!111!!", like he even admitted just because one smokes pot does not make them successful, just like not smoking does not make you successful. My point being that there is no link to pot being positive or negative in that aspect.

Sleepy 240 you sound like a lot of people from the early 1900's making thier arguments for prohibition.

Guess what happened people still drank and crime rose to an all time high.
Pot is pretty m uch the same except it's lasted longer, in 100 yearss nobody will give a shit and people will buy it at walmart while refilling prescriptions, the side effects of which will probably cause them more than pot ever could.

Before I even respond, PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD USE EITHER SPELL CHECK OR JUST RE-READ YOUR POST BEFORE CLICKING THE DAMN BUTTON! I am not arguing for prohibition since marijuana is ALREADY illegal. Frankly I do not care if its legalized, I just do not see it happening. And I have to disagree with your last statement about people buying pot at Wal-Mart and side effects of it being illegal.

[CrimsonRockett]

smoke weed everyday!!

I second that!, you gotta ask your self a question WHO doesnt smoke DANK? & IT WILL BE LEGAL.:cool:

Again, "comments like this are the reason marijuana has such a negative stereotype."

It's nothing personal, but stupid comments like that end up getting these threads locked.

People want to have a legitimate conversation about this topic.

Not just "yeah man, smoke weed every day!".

If that's all you're going to say/post, do us all a favor and refrain from posting all together.

This isn't the first time you've been warned.

[S14_Kouki]

Let me start by saying I did not touch an OUNCE of alcohol before the age of 21. Part of it being the way I was raised, the other part being that I have seen the effects alcohol can have on a minor. I was actually HIT by an underage drunken driver. Guess what it sucks, he had no regard for life, his own or others, and ABUSED the substance. 3 Years later when he turned 21, guess who got into another accident? The SAME DAMN KID. Tell me that is mature? I know I am generalizing but honestly people really don't understand the respect they need to show to drinking (underage or not).


Like I said it was sarcasm because ANY LIST will not show how frequently or how much an individual smokes. "OMG Bill Clinton smoked a joint and he was a president!! WEED FTMFW!!111!!", like he even admitted just because one smokes pot does not make them successful, just like not smoking does not make you successful. My point being that there is no link to pot being positive or negative in that aspect.




Well then thats good, I really just wanted to see your response. How would you feel right now if they lets say jumped the age up to 25 would us over 21 get grandfathered in or would it become illegal for us to drink?? And yes I do feel every person under 21 even alot of ppl over 21 dont fully know the responsibility of drinking.


Dont be sarcastic if you cant handle getting a anwser. Even if they smoked weed even once that still means they did.




Again, "comments like this are the reason marijuana has such a negative stereotype."

It's nothing personal, but stupid comments like that end up getting these threads locked.

People want to have a legitimate conversation about this topic.

Not just "yeah man, smoke weed every day!".

If that's all you're going to say/post, do us all a favor and refrain from posting all together.

This isn't the first time you've been warned.


THANK you for saying somethings to these idiots

Lets not have this thread closed

[Phlip]

I smoked quite a bit in high school and college -- not to mention college subsidizing itself without loans, scholarships or grants -- with a minor "problem," and I have smoked ONCE since school, and I consider myself a NON smoker, since school was 8+ years ago.
You folks' argument is on some bullshit...

Is anyone talking paper, fuel, lotion or anything else born from legalization?
Is anyone doing anything more than the "smoke weed e'ey day!" argument?
Does anyone enter bother entering academic arguments for legalization?

NO!!!

and that is why I hate potheads.

[SexPanda]

true story.

Hemp lotion is amazing. Like cocoabutter on coke.

[drift_limo]

Again, "comments like this are the reason marijuana has such a negative stereotype."

It's nothing personal, but stupid comments like that end up getting these threads locked.

People want to have a legitimate conversation about this topic.

Not just "yeah man, smoke weed every day!".

If that's all you're going to say/post, do us all a favor and refrain from posting all together.

This isn't the first time you've been warned.

Seriously

I was a dumb kid at one point and used to think like that. till i got smart about it.

[Genovese.Jr]

put this on 420 forms or some shit like that

[drftmark]

I smoked quite a bit in high school and college -- not to mention college subsidizing itself without loans, scholarships or grants -- with a minor "problem," and I have smoked ONCE since school, and I consider myself a NON smoker, since school was 8+ years ago.
You folks' argument is on some bullshit...

Is anyone talking paper, fuel, lotion or anything else born from legalization?
Is anyone doing anything more than the "smoke weed e'ey day!" argument?
Does anyone enter bother entering academic arguments for legalization?

NO!!!

and that is why I hate potheads.

Paper was brought up earlier.

It would be hard to talk about making fuel and lotion when no one here really has any experience with producing biomass fuel or lotion. I think most people's argument is based on their freedom and right to consume and the fuel/lotion/cooking oil/paper/etc etc etc are just reallllyyyyy good perks that could go along with legalization.

Besides, the hemp that would need to be grown for the biomass fuel makes very poor quality marijuana. It would just have to be a good ole' big country farm with a lot of land full of hemp that would be worthless to smoke.

I saw this thread more as a "smoker's" right to be able to smoke rather than a discussion about the huge industrial benefits. Alas, it is good that you brought that up, it is just more reasons to have it legalized.

[Phlip]

I think most people's argument is based on their freedom and right to consume and the fuel/lotion/cooking oil/paper/etc etc etc are just reallllyyyyy good perks that could go along with legalization.


I saw this thread more as a "smoker's" right to be able to smoke rather than a discussion about the huge industrial benefits. Alas, it is good that you brought that up, it is just more reasons to have it legalized.
See, and therein lies the reasons that potheads and their ilk will not effectively argue their points, the neglect of attention to things that MIGHT help their argument.
Again, I do not smoke and never will again, but I am one of the ones who very mush believes that it SHOULD be legalized. The benefits that would come WITH the legalization -- the aforementioned paper, (perhaps) biofuels, paper, fibers for cloth/rope and such and all the jobs it would would create -- seem to be ignored while people (usually high) argue until they're blue in the face about how their "right" to smoke is being revoked by nazis or something similar.
How about arming yourselves with good information so as to argue these things intelligently?
Want some links?
Sure you do, here:

5 Things Corporate Media Doesn't Want You to Know About Cannabis (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/142815/5_things_the_corporate_media_don%27t_want_you_to_k now_about_cannabis/)

Over 100 Million Americans Have Smoked Marijuana -- And It's Still Illegal? (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/142556/over_100_million_americans_have_smoked_marijuana_--_and_it%27s_still_illegal_/)

Smoking Marijuana Does Not Cause Lung Cancer (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/142271/smoking_marijuana_does_not_cause_lung_cancer/)

More Evidence That Marijuana Prevents Cancer (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/142121/more_evidence_that_marijuana_prevents_cancer/)

Campus Hypocrisy: Marijuana Is Safer, But Students Are Pushed to More Dangerous Booze (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/142077/campus_hypocrisy%3A_marijuana_is_safer%2C_but_stud ents_are_pushed_to_more_dangerous_booze/)

The Shocking Benefits of Legalizing Pot (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/141781/the_shocking_benefits_of_legalizing_pot/)

NBC, CBS, ABC, & FOX Happy to Profit from Marijuana, as Long as Nobody Talks About Legalizing It (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/141773/nbc%2C_cbs%2C_abc%2C_%26_fox_happy_to_profit_from_ marijuana%2C_as_long_as_nobody_talks_about_legaliz ing_it/)


I selected only a few of the stories from a site I frequent, but if you would like to do some more reading (which I am sure most will not, simply asking in a red-eyed haze "can you gimme a cliffs?") then click here (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/) and read more.

[S13Boosts]

Again, "comments like this are the reason marijuana has such a negative stereotype."

It's nothing personal, but stupid comments like that end up getting these threads locked.

People want to have a legitimate conversation about this topic.

Not just "yeah man, smoke weed every day!".

If that's all you're going to say/post, do us all a favor and refrain from posting all together.

This isn't the first time you've been warned.


It just sounds like people are crying and bitching about this topic in the thread..if you dont smoke bud or hate it for what ever reason just quit it gtfo this thread,thats just it, I WORK personally in the medical indus....so thats all im saying and mm will be LEGAL.

[Sleepy240]

It just sounds like people are crying and bitching about this topic in the thread..if you dont smoke bud or hate it for what ever reason just quit it gtfo this thread,thats just it, I WORK personally in the medical indus....so thats all im saying and mm will be LEGAL.

Perhaps you should read the entire thread before you chime in. Also I think by "mm" you meant Medical Marijuana, and it is legal simply for that reason its MEDICAL. Regardless of whether you work in the "medical indus" (not sure what you really mean by that) I don't forsee it being legalized anytime in the near future.

[drftmark]

Perhaps you should read the entire thread before you chime in. Also I think by "mm" you meant Medical Marijuana, and it is legal simply for that reason its MEDICAL. Regardless of whether you work in the "medical indus" (not sure what you really mean by that) I don't forsee it being legalized anytime in the near future.

I think he meant medical industry? Maybe? I read somewhere that if we could grow hemp that America could be energy independent.

PHLIP posted some good articles

[Sleepy240]

Yeah I know he meant the Medical Industry, but just because your in the medical industry does not mean you have some kind of "inside" information! I think energy independent would be a stretch, it would require quite some time before it would get to that point. Like I said before I see the biggest problem being the time needed to change everything over. Like most industries sadly they end up being out sourced nowadays, the last thing we need is to start to grow this miracle crop Hemp and then manufacture it overseas. I mean initially obviously that would not be the idea, but that was never the goal with alot of American industry. I do see lots of benefits to growing Hemp, I don't see the same benefits for legalizing marijuana though.

[S13Boosts]

Economy is bad = NEED MONEY= MM+TAX = legalization of marijuana...


simple as that.

[Sleepy240]

Economy is bad = NEED MONEY= MM+TAX = legalization of marijuana...


simple as that.

I think you need to get a grasp on economics before you go and make some jackass statement like the above. Like I said before Medical Marijuana is just that, its MEDICAL. Its not for recreational use like you seem to believe.

[S13Boosts]

I think you need to get a grasp on economics before you go and make some jackass statement like the above. Like I said before Medical Marijuana is just that, its MEDICAL. Its not for recreational use like you seem to believe.


Either way the government will try and make some money out of it, its all about the MONEY.

[CrimsonRockett]

It just sounds like people are crying and bitching about this topic in the thread..if you dont smoke bud or hate it for what ever reason just quit it gtfo this thread,thats just it, I WORK personally in the medical indus....so thats all im saying and mm will be LEGAL.

Yeah, let people cry and bitch about the topic at hand.

They're stating their opinion about the topic rather than just saying "yeeeh, smoke weed every day" like I said in my previous post(which was exactly what you were doing).

I've smoked it before(long time ago) and see the pros/cons to it. I don't have a problem with the government finally legalizing it because there's other things out there that are actually worse for you and still perfectly legal, but when you come in here posting comments like that, they annoy the fuck out of me.

It's like comparing a cheap S-chassis owner to an S-chassis owner who actually gives a shit about his car. The cheap S-chassis owners make the entire community look bad by giving us that stupid ass stereotype.

People who say "smoke weed every day!" and "fuck the police" annoy me.

Random: GF and I were at Six Flags on Goliath. Dumb ass wanna-be gangster looking idiot pulls one out and starts smoking on our way up. Then, out of nowhere, yells out "fuck the police!".

You know what the funny part was? Idiot was thrown out of the park not even 1 hour after it had opened.

Oh, the laughs we had.

[ESmorz]

It's way too tense in here for a Marijuana thread.

You all need to relax.

7GqSsgRtXmE


I'm all for experimental legislation. Why not legalize it for a year or two in a sense on a probationary period? If the country or state gets Reefer Madness, everyone is dying of lung cancer, and the dudes in the cubicles next to smokers keep getting a contact high and can't get their work done because they eat Peggy's lunch even though it was obviously marked "Peggy's lunch"... Repeal the shit out of it and it will be like it never happened and we can go back to the black market and all that good stuff.

[S14_Kouki]

Is anyone talking paper, fuel, lotion or anything else born from legalization?
Is anyone doing anything more than the "smoke weed e'ey day!" argument?
Does anyone enter bother entering academic arguments for legalization?

NO!!!

and that is why I hate potheads.

Yes I actually wrote alot about how hemp (about 1 or 2 pages back) can help us and how marijuana can indeed help us alot. So lets not start saying everyone here is just saying lets get high.

[S14_Kouki]

Either way the government will try and make some money out of it, its all about the MONEY.

The government already makes money off of medical marijuana sales in Oakland,CA. They already have a tax system set up medical marijuana facilities will have to pay 18$ to every 1000$ they make. And yes that has already started.

[S13Boosts]

Yeah, let people cry and bitch about the topic at hand.

They're stating their opinion about the topic rather than just saying "yeeeh, smoke weed every day" like I said in my previous post(which was exactly what you were doing).

I've smoked it before(long time ago) and see the pros/cons to it. I don't have a problem with the government finally legalizing it because there's other things out there that are actually worse for you and still perfectly legal, but when you come in here posting comments like that, they annoy the fuck out of me.

It's like comparing a cheap S-chassis owner to an S-chassis owner who actually gives a shit about his car. The cheap S-chassis owners make the entire community look bad by giving us that stupid ass stereotype.

People who say "smoke weed every day!" and "fuck the police" annoy me.

Random: GF and I were at Six Flags on Goliath. Dumb ass wanna-be gangster looking idiot pulls one out and starts smoking on our way up. Then, out of nowhere, yells out "fuck the police!".

You know what the funny part was? Idiot was thrown out of the park not even 1 hour after it had opened.

Oh, the laughs we had.

I get what ur saying but i never POSTED A POST saying SMOKE WEED ALL DAY????? is that what you tryn say?? like you said everybodys posting there own opinions..everybody is just getting butt hurt in this thread,its mostly people that are aganist canbis.

[CrimsonRockett]

I get what ur saying but i never POSTED A POST saying SMOKE WEED ALL DAY????? is that what you tryn say?? like you said everybodys posting there own opinions..everybody is just getting butt hurt in this thread,its mostly people that are aganist canbis.

Read below.

lol IT WILL BE LEGAL ONE DAY NUFF SAID & of course the fucking GOV is gon tax it DUH fuck em tho!

Immature post.

The deleted posts:

Let me do a quick POLL, WHO SMOKE BUD HERE?

Why does this matter? We're trying to carry an adult conversation and you come in here with that.

It just sounds like people are crying and bitching about this topic in the thread..if you dont smoke bud or hate it for what ever reason just quit it gtfo this thread,thats just it, I WORK personally in the medical indus....so thats all im saying and mm will be LEGAL.

Again, having a conversation, debating and stating opinions is the whole point of this thread.


smoke weed everyday!!


I second that!, you gotta ask your self a question WHO doesnt smoke DANK? & IT WILL BE LEGAL.


YOU didn't say it, but you sure as hell agreed to it.

Again, immature posts do nothing but get threads like this locked.

If all you're going to say is "fuck the govt", "IT WILL BE LEGAL", and "quit crying/bitching", you're not helping with the argument...at all. People who have this type of mindset are the reason why I would prefer them NOT to make it legal.

There's more than one side to every story. You never once bothered saying WHY it should be legal.

You should try that next time.
#/f/../images/smilies/cool.gif

[DALAZ_68]

this thread is spiraling down a crap factory road...


personally i used to smoke this, legally, had a perscription card ...pretty much for back pain and my shoulder after having Orthoscopic surgery...

its helped a good deal...but buying was annoying...the smell was annoying...the affects were annoying...i never drove while under the influence...fuck that

all im sayin is, if it becomes legal, i hope its strict as fuck to help avoid injury to others, I.E. restrictive licenses, heavy tax...

and heavier penalties to those who are caught buying from non perscribing sources...and im talking jail time...

that is my opinion

[I LUV MY S13]

damn i cant remember where i read this but at one point in time marijuana was almost 90% of the worlds paper/medical source..

oh and marijuana hasnt been proven to kill braincells it just impares your judgement and makes you temporarily stupid..

[S13Boosts]

Read below.



Immature post.

The deleted posts:



Why does this matter? We're trying to carry an adult conversation and you come in here with that.



Again, having a conversation, debating and stating opinions is the whole point of this thread.




YOU didn't say it, but you sure as hell agreed to it.

Again, immature posts do nothing but get threads like this locked.

If all you're going to say is "fuck the govt", "IT WILL BE LEGAL", and "quit crying/bitching", you're not helping with the argument...at all. People who have this type of mindset are the reason why I would prefer them NOT to make it legal.

There's more than one side to every story. You never once bothered saying WHY it should be legal.

You should try that next time.
#/f/../images/smilies/cool.gif


oh i got chu bro, but i say we close this thread i say everybody just wait till it gets legal LOL than we can discuss.

[DALAZ_68]

damn i cant remember where i read this but at one point in time marijuana was almost 90% of the worlds paper/medical source..


so were other, harsher, deadlier drugs

fuck once our culture believe perpously shoving a tape worm down ur throat was a GREAT way to loose wait...

and you know what history repeats itself

Tapeworm Diet (http://www.tapewormdiet.net/)

and so on with marijuana


oh and marijuana hasnt been proven to kill braincells it just impares your judgement and makes you temporarily stupid..


G...i wonder why its currently illegal...

[I LUV MY S13]

G...i wonder why its currently illegal...

because ppl abuse it and make stupid decisions:-/

[DALAZ_68]

because ppl abuse it and make stupid decisions:-/


human nature at its finest...

[Sleepy240]

oh i got chu bro, but i say we close this thread i say everybody just wait till it gets legal LOL than we can discuss.

Seriously are you mentally retarded? :tweak:

People abusing it and not being MATURE about the substance IS what is stopping it from being legalized IMO. Like has been stated there are tons of benefits from the hemp, and medicinal marijuana does have positives.

[BustedS13]

let's get back on track.

http://www.norml.org/images/pdf_file.gif (http://www.norml.org/pdf_files/NORML_decriminalization_talking_points.pdf) TALKING POINT #1:
Decriminalizing marijuana frees up police resources to deal with more serious crimes. (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3381#point1)

TALKING POINT #2:
Far more harm is caused by the criminal prohibition of marijuana than by the use of marijuana itself. (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3381#point2)

TALKING POINT #3:
Decriminalization does not lead to greater marijuana use. (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3381#point3)

TALKING POINT #4:
Criminal laws prohibiting marijuana possession do not deter marijuana use. (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3381#point4)

TALKING POINT #1: Decriminalizing marijuana frees up police resources to deal with more serious crimes.

60,000 individuals are behind bars for marijuana offenses at a cost to taxpayers of $1.2 billion per year.
REFERENCE: Marijuana Arrests and Incarceration in the United States. 1999. The Federation of American Scientists' Drug Policy Analysis Bulletin.

Taxpayers annually spend between $7.5 billion and $10 billion arresting and prosecuting individuals for marijuana violations. Almost 90 percent of these arrests are for marijuana possession only.
REFERENCE: NORML. 1997. Still Crazy After All These Years: Marijuana Prohibition 1937-1997 (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4428): A report prepared by the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws (NORML) on the occasion of the Sixtieth anniversary of the adoption of the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937. Washington, DC; Federal Bureau of Investigation's combined Uniform Crime Reports: Crime in the United States (1990-2000): Table: Arrest for Drug Abuse Violations. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington, DC.

The state of California saved nearly $1 billion dollars from 1976 to 1985 by decriminalizing the personal possession of one ounce of marijuana, according to a study of the state justice department budget.
REFERENCE: M. Aldrich and T. Mikuriya. 1988. Savings in California marijuana law enforcement costs attributable to the Moscone Act of 1976 (http://www.lindesmith.org/library/aldrich.html). (http://www.lindesmith.org/library/aldrich.html) Journal of Psychoactive Drugs 20: 75-81.

New Mexico's 2001 state-commissioned Drug Policy Advisory Group determined that marijuana decriminalization "will result in greater availability of resources to respond to more serious crimes without any increased risks to public safety."
REFERENCE: New Mexico Governor's Drug Policy Advisory Group. 2001. Report and Recommendations to the Governor's Office (http://www.governor.state.nm.us/drug_policy/drug_policy.htm). (http://www.governor.state.nm.us/drug_policy/drug_policy.htm) State Capitol: Santa Fe.

Marijuana arrests have more than doubled since 1991, while adult use of the drug has remained stable. During this same period, the number of arrests for cocaine and heroin fell by approximately 33 percent.
REFERENCE: Bureau of Justice Statistics. 2000. Drugs and Crime Facts. Table: Number of Arrests by Drug Type, 1982-99. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington, DC; U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. 1996. National Household Survey on Drug Abuse: Main Findings (1990- 1999). DHHS Printing Office: Rockville, MD.

Police arrest more Americans per year on marijuana charges than the total number of arrestees for all violent crimes combined, including murder, rape, robbery and aggravated assault.
REFERENCE: Federal Bureau of Investigation. 2001. Uniform Crime Report: Crime in the United States, 2000. Table 29: Total estimated arrests in the United States, 2000. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington, DC.

Marijuana violations constitute the fifth most common criminal offense in the United States.
REFERENCE: Bureau of Justice Statistics. 2000. Drugs and Crime Facts. Table: Estimated totals of top 7 arrest offenses, United States, 1999. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington, DC.

More than 734,000 individuals were arrested on marijuana charges in 2000. Eighty-eight percent of those arrested were charged with marijuana possession only.
REFERENCE: Federal Bureau of Investigation. 2001. Uniform Crime Report Crime in the United States, 2000. Table: Arrest for Drug Abuse Violations. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington, DC.

Almost 5 million Americans have been arrested for marijuana since 1992. That's more than the entire populations of Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont, Washington DC and Wyoming combined.
REFERENCE. Federal Bureau of Investigation. Uniform Crime Reports: Crime in the United States (1993-2000). Table: Arrest for Drug Abuse Violations. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington, DC.


TALKING POINT #2: Far more harm is caused by the criminal prohibition of marijuana than by the use of marijuana itself.

According to editors of the prestigious Lancet British medical journal: "The smoking of cannabis, even long-term, is not harmful to health. ... It would be reasonable to judge cannabis as less of a threat ... than alcohol or tobacco."
REFERENCE: Deglamorising Cannabis (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3476). 1995. The Lancet 346: 1241. Editorial. November 14, 1998. The Lancet.

According to a 1999 federally commissioned report by the National Academy of Sciences Institute of Medicine (IOM), "Except for the harms associated with smoking, the adverse effects of marijuana use are within the range tolerated for other medications."
REFERENCE: National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine (IOM). 1999. Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base (http://www.nap.edu/readingroom/books/marimed/). (http://www.nap.edu/readingroom/books/marimed/) National Academy Press: Washington, DC, 5.

The National Academy of Sciences further found, "There is no conclusive evidence that the drug effects of marijuana are causally linked to the subsequent abuse of other illicit drugs."
REFERENCE: National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine (IOM). 1999. Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base (http://www.nap.edu/readingroom/books/marimed/). (http://www.nap.edu/readingroom/books/marimed/) National Academy Press: Washington, DC, 6.

More than 76 million Americans have admittedly tried marijuana. The overwhelming majority of these users did not go on to become regular marijuana users, try other illicit drugs, or suffer any deleterious effects to their health.
REFERENCE: Combined data from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. 1996. National Household Survey on Drug Abuse: Main Findings 1994. Rockville, MD and 1995. National Household Survey on Drug Abuse: Population Estimates 1994; Deglamorising Cannabis (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3476). 1995. The Lancet 346: 1241. Sydney Morning Herald, February 18, 1997.

According to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, 35 percent of adults admit to having tried marijuana. Of these, only 5 percent have used marijuana in the past year, and only 3 percent have used marijuana in the past month.
REFERENCE: U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. 2000. National Household Survey on Drug Abuse. Table G.9. Percentages Reporting Lifetime, Past Year, and Past Month Use of Illicit Drugs Among Persons Aged 26 or Older: 1999. DHHS Printing Office: Rockville, MD.

According to former U.S. President Jimmy Carter: "Penalties against drug use should not be more damaging to an individual than the use of the drug itself. Nowhere is this more clear than in the laws against the possession of marijuana in private for personal use."
REFERENCE: President Jimmy Carter: Message to Congress, August 2, 1977.

Convicted marijuana offenders are denied federal financial student aid, welfare and food stamps, and may be removed from public housing. Other non-drug violations do not carry such penalties. In many states, convicted marijuana offenders are automatically stripped of their driving privileges, even if the offense is not driving related.
REFERENCE: Section 483, Subsection F of the Higher Education Act of 1998; Amendment 4935 to the Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Reconciliation Act of 1996; U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics. 1992. Drugs, Crime, and the Justice System. U.S. Department of Justice: Washington DC; NORML's State Guide to Marijuana Penalties. (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4516)

Under federal law, possessing a single marijuana cigarette or less is punishable by up to one year in prison and a $10,000 fine, the same penalty as possession of small amounts of heroin, cocaine or crack.
REFERENCE: J. Morgan and L. Zimmer. 1997. Marijuana Myths, Marijuana Facts: A Review of the Scientific Evidence. The Lindesmith Center: New York, 42.

In several states, marijuana offenders may receive maximum sentences of life in prison.
REFERENCE: NORML's State Guide to Marijuana Penalties. (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4516)

A recent national study found that blacks are arrested for marijuana offenses at higher rates than whites in 90 percent of 700 U.S. counties investigated. In 64 percent of these counties, the black arrest rate for marijuana violations was more than twice the arrest rate for whites.
REFERENCE: J. Gettman. 2000. United States Marijuana Arrests, Part Two: Racial Differences in Drug Arrests (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4443). (http://www.norml.org/facts/arrestreport/racereport/index.html) The NORML Foundation: Washington, DC.


TALKING POINT #3: Decriminalization does not lead to greater marijuana use.

Government studies conclude that marijuana decriminalization has had virtually no effect on either marijuana use or beliefs and related attitudes about marijuana among American young people in those states that have enacted such a policy.
REFERENCE: L. Johnson et al. 1981. Marijuana Decriminalization: The Impact on Youth 1975-1980. Monitoring the Future, Occasional Paper Series: Paper No. 13. Institute for Social Research, University of Michigan.

Citizens who live under decriminalization laws consume marijuana at rates less than or comparable to those who live in regions where the possession of marijuana remains a criminal offense.
REFERENCE: E. Single et al. 2000. The Impact of Cannabis Decriminalization in Australia and the United States. Journal of Public Health Policy 21: 157-186.

There is no evidence that marijuana decriminalization affects either the choice or frequency of use of drugs, either legal (such as alcohol) or illegal (such as marijuana and cocaine).
REFERENCE: C. Thies and C. Register. 1993. Decriminalization of marijuana and demand for alcohol, marijuana and cocaine. The Social Sciences Journal 30: 385-399.

States and regions that have maintained the strictest criminal penalties for marijuana possession have experienced the largest proportionate increase in use.
REFERENCE: Connecticut Law Review Commission. 1997. Drug Policy in Connecticut and Strategy Options: Report to the Judiciary Committee of the Connecticut Assembly. (http://www.cga.state.ct.us/lrc/DrugPolicy/DrugPolicyRpt2.htm) State Capitol: Hartford.

Rates of hard drug use (illicit drugs other than marijuana) among emergency room patients are substantially higher in states that have not decriminalized marijuana use. Experts speculate that this is because the lack of decriminalization may encourage the greater use of drugs that are even more dangerous than marijuana.
REFERENCE: K. Model. 1993. The effect of marijuana decriminalization on hospital emergency room episodes: 1975-1978. Journal of the American Statistical Association 88: 737-747 as cited by the National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine. Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base (http://www.nap.edu/readingroom/books/marimed/), 103.


TALKING POINT #4: Criminal laws prohibiting marijuana possession do not deter marijuana use.

Marijuana use remains consistent despite a high level of enforcement, and there is no detectable relationship between changes in enforcement and levels of marijuana use over time.
REFERENCE: J. Morgan and L. Zimmer. 1997. Marijuana Myths, Marijuana Facts: A Review of the Scientific Evidence (https://banqa.uaqa.com/norml/catalog/BOK002.html). The Lindesmith Center: New York, 46.

Marijuana users believe that their behavior will go undetected; thus fear of arrest is usually not a factor in people's decisions whether or not to use it.
REFERENCE: Canadian Centre on Substance Abuse National Working Group on Addictions. 1998. Cannabis Control in Canada: Options Regarding Possession. (http://www.ccsa.ca/docs/cafinal2.htm) Ottawa.

Marijuana laws have no "specific" deterrent impact on drug taking behavior. Studies show that marijuana offenders continue to use marijuana after their conviction at rates equal to those prior to their arrest. No relation between the actual or perceived severity of their previous sentence and subsequent use has been found.
REFERENCE: P. Erickson. 1980. Cannabis Criminals: The Social Effects of Punishment on Drug Users (http://www.drugtext.org/books/erickson/default.htm). (http://www.drugtext.org/books/erickson/default.htm) Addiction Research Foundation: Toronto.

In surveys, most individuals cite health concerns and family responsibilities rather than legal concerns as their primary reasons for ceasing (or never initiating) marijuana use.
REFERENCE: National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine (IOM). 1982. Marijuana and Health. National Academy Press: Washington, DC.

A California police officer's study concluded, "The reduction in penalties for possession of marijuana for personal use does not appear to [be] a factor in people's decision to use or not use the drug."
REFERENCE: California State Office of Narcotics and Drug Abuse. 1977. A First Report on the Impact of California's New Marijuana Law. State Capitol: Sacramento.


Link: Marijuana Decriminalization Talking Points - NORML (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3381)

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

let's get back on track......

that's exactly right. I think the decriminalization of "marijuana" will happen similar to the end of prohibition. The decision will eventually be up to the state. Some states will legalize it completely and it will eventually catch on. Even local municipalities will start to not enforce it even though their state may be a "no smoke" state.

But lets get this right. The reason why I'm for the legalization of cannabis is NOT so teenagers could get high! It's so cancer patients wouldn't have to go through their excruciating pain. So there could be advances in paper and fuel alternatives.

[S14_Kouki]

that's exactly right. I think the decriminalization of "marijuana" will happen similar to the end of prohibition. The decision will eventually be up to the state. Some states will legalize it completely and it will eventually catch on. Even local municipalities will start to not enforce it even though their state may be a "no smoke" state.

But lets get this right. The reason why I'm for the legalization of cannabis is NOT so teenagers could get high! It's so cancer patients wouldn't have to go through their excruciating pain. So there could be advances in paper and fuel alternatives.

^This is what im saying^ But marijuana can help alot more then just cancer patients and hemp can be used for alot more then just paper.

[iHeartTheTouge]

I dont think we will see marijuana being legalized anytime soon. I think most people still immediately associate marijuana with crime, hippies, degenerates, and hard drugs like heroin. I hope we can see more states getting MM atleast in the next decade. I've had insomnia for as long as I can remember. I'd go a day or two without sleep sometimes. The usual would be 2-3 hours of sleep a night, but after smoking a little before bed, I fall asleep pretty quick and am well rested in the morning.

[SochBAT]

See why I love Busted's responses? They're almost ALWAYS dead-on.

For fuck sakes people, if you're defending the legalization of marijuana as a medicinal help, back it up.

The increased production of hemp would help us out notably. Hemp rope, clothing, fucking textiles up the wazoo. Durable as shit, and cheap as dirt.

Well, not really, but compared to other materials, then yea.

[BustedS13]

See why I love Busted's responses? They're almost ALWAYS dead-on.

<3 u

did you know that marijuana is America's #1 cash crop? Cannabis brings in more annually than corn and wheat combined, and the vast majority of it isn't being taxed at any point in the process. Imagine how great it would be for the US economy if marijuana was legalized.

Oaksterdam News Network - America’s #1 Cash Crop: Cannabis (http://www.oaksterdamnews.net/content/view/269/10021/)

yeah, it's from "oaksterdam news". oh well.

[Touge Noob S13]

I dont think we will see marijuana being legalized anytime soon. I think most people still immediately associate marijuana with crime, hippies, degenerates, and hard drugs like heroin.


I see it that way.

[S14_Kouki]

I dont think we will see marijuana being legalized anytime soon. I think most people still immediately associate marijuana with crime, hippies, degenerates, and hard drugs like heroin.

This is because the majority of the population are narrow minded people who do as they are told and dont ask question and look away from facts because they think the government knows all and does nothing but good.

[S14_Kouki]

<3 u

did you know that marijuana is America's #1 cash crop? Cannabis brings in more annually than corn and wheat combined, and the vast majority of it isn't being taxed at any point in the process. Imagine how great it would be for the US economy if marijuana was legalized.

Oaksterdam News Network - America’s #1 Cash Crop: Cannabis (http://www.oaksterdamnews.net/content/view/269/10021/)

yeah, it's from "oaksterdam news". oh well.

I knew this and its just another reason why we need to legalize

[Touge Noob S13]

This is because the majority of the population are narrow minded people who do as they are told and dont ask question and look away from facts because they think the government knows all and does nothing but good.


I think its trashy, alot of other people view it as a dirty trashy habit as well.

[S14_Kouki]

I think its trashy, alot of other people view it as a dirty trashy habit as well.

Stupid closed minded people

[BustedS13]

I think its trashy, alot of other people view it as a dirty trashy habit as well.

and yet we live in a country/world where it's legal to smoke glamorous cigarettes and slam a decadent 40 of malt liquor.

[Touge Noob S13]

Stupid closed minded people


Im guessing that you are a stoner, correct?

[yota man]

Im guessing that you are a stoner, correct?

Ok so here we get to see the other side of the non-legalization party (for lack of a better word).

I personally feel it should be legalized but I'm not going to get into that now.

HOWEVER I have been reading this with as little of a bias as I could. I always try to be able to listen to all sides of a story and then make my own choices. I feel that people like Sleepy240 and Philip and others have made well thought out posts and good points for either side.

Then there have been people making dumb posts about smoking and finally we get the other side making ignorant posts.

Please like Crimson said if you are going to bring up any point either side here please back them up with facts. Touge Noob all you have done here is try to stir up an argument. You have brought no facts to the table just your opinions and tried to attack people in here who don't agree with you. I hope for the sake of this threads continuation of being a well thought out discussion and a good read that you are just ignored and stop posting in here.

[SochBAT]

You know whats funny about people that bash on potheads? They never see the other side of the spectrum.

There the shit-lazy pothead that is a fucking veggie, being a waste of space.

Then there's the guy who's troubled with seizures that needs it to quell the pain.

I can't, to be quite honest, think of the opposite spectrums of smoking cigarettes and alcohol. I'm not calling anyone out, but it'd be nice to shed some light on the "lesser evils."

[yota man]

Well with the way things are going with cigs it may not be too long before they end up banned/prohibited/illegal. I know it will never actually happen with tobacco being a huge industry and it would pretty much ruin the farming economy in my state, but things are starting to head in that direction.

Why a Ban on Flavored Cigarettes and Outdoor Smoking Will Backfire | DrugReporter | AlterNet (http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/142899/why_a_ban_on_flavored_cigarettes_and_outdoor_smoki ng_will_backfire/)

Cliffnotes: In June congress hand the regulation of cigs over to FDA. FDA decides to place a ban on "flavored" cigarettes including cloves. FDA is also planning to possibly place menthol cigarettes into that category.

But back to the subject at hand.

[drift_limo]

I think its trashy, alot of other people view it as a dirty trashy habit as well.

Its just the way people are brought up about the subject.


Stupid closed minded people

thats society in itself...

and yet we live in a country/world where it's legal to smoke glamorous cigarettes and slam a decadent 40 of malt liquor.

thats answers itself

See why I love Busted's responses? They're almost ALWAYS dead-on.

For fuck sakes people, if you're defending the legalization of marijuana as a medicinal help, back it up.

The increased production of hemp would help us out notably. Hemp rope, clothing, fucking textiles up the wazoo. Durable as shit, and cheap as dirt.

Well, not really, but compared to other materials, then yea.

but the sad thing if you look at this thread or people that smoke they dont look at it that way, they just see the fact that you can be around your friends in the circle hittin the waterpipe, and people wonder y it has a bad name...

[BustedS13]

but the sad thing if you look at this thread or people that smoke they dont look at it that way, they just see the fact that you can be around your friends in the circle hittin the waterpipe, and people wonder y it has a bad name...

right, people see how they can personally benefit from something. it's like when you look at california auto laws and only think about how you can get busted for an SR.
i really don't see what your point is.

[S14_Kouki]

Im guessing that you are a stoner, correct?

I use to be, I have been smoke free for 4 months now. Im trying to find a perfect job and im not letting smoking get in the way.


I feel that people like Sleepy240 and Philip and others have made well thought out posts and good points for either side.


You should read all posts before you post.

[yota man]

You should read all posts before you post.

Well I was actually trying to stick up for you when some one was trying to just start an argument for no reason. Guess I won't do that again.

And I'm not exactly sure why you were telling me to read all posts but I can assure that I have.

[shmiddy]

why is everyone getting all worked up about a PLANT?!?! what has pot ever done you you? (the naysayers) can someone tell me how pot has harmed YOU?? honestly the reason i say "you", is because i should have the RIGHT to make the decision whats good for me and whats not. if i wanna smoke a lb of pot a day, i should be able to. just like no one gets in trouble for smokeing 2 packs a day or eating mcdonalds 3 times a day.

WHY DO YOU HATE POT SO MUCH?!?!? LEAVE MARY JANE ALONE!! SHES DONE NOTHING WRONG!!! WHAT HAS SHE DONE TO YOU??

[greddy2die]

People are worked up because alot of people have come to realize that it shouldnt be illegal.

I dont know if marijuana will become legal to be able to smoke in a bar or outside of your house just to do it like people do with alcohol. I personally would love it, however I wont hold my breath. Its not that big a deal to me.

However, I do think that HEMP should be legal to grow in the United States. To change laws now and allow hemp to be legal to grow so that paper, ropes, medicine, clothing, shoes etc etc will make all the naysayers in the country wonder wtf they were fighting for and why the hell did there oh so wonderful government all of a sudden go against what they have fighting to keep illegal all these years.

To me, its just like the war in Afghanistan, our men and women are still there fighting, dying, for what? Doesnt the US only have control of 20% of the country? Please correct me if im wrong, i dont want people to think im giving false info..lol. Anyway, if the government were to pull al lthe troops out now, it would make our country look weak and other foreign leaders might hold that against us. (again, thats what I believe is going on in our leaders heads)

Im not sure if that came out the way i would have liked to..lol im horrible at explaining things

[shmiddy]

People are worked up because alot of people have come to realize that it shouldnt be illegal.

I dont know if marijuana will become legal to be able to smoke in a bar or outside of your house just to do it like people do with alcohol. I personally would love it, however I wont hold my breath. Its not that big a deal to me.

However, I do think that HEMP should be legal to grow in the United States. To change laws now and allow hemp to be legal to grow so that paper, ropes, medicine, clothing, shoes etc etc will make all the naysayers in the country wonder wtf they were fighting for and why the hell did there oh so wonderful government all of a sudden go against what they have fighting to keep illegal all these years.

To me, its just like the war in Afghanistan, our men and women are still there fighting, dying, for what? Doesnt the US only have control of 20% of the country? Please correct me if im wrong, i dont want people to think im giving false info..lol. Anyway, if the government were to pull al lthe troops out now, it would make our country look weak and other foreign leaders might hold that against us. (again, thats what I believe is going on in our leaders heads)

Im not sure if that came out the way i would have liked to..lol im horrible at explaining things

i agree!!! i think hemp would do the usa WONDERS. think about it.. american ppl making prosucts made from american grown product (hemp) that means more jobs for americans and also we wont need as much bull shit from other contrys like china. also sweatshops will deminish (at least i hope/think)

also hemp is good for our enviroment!!! insted of cutting down an irreplaceable, 100 year old tree to make papper... we can use hemp and save the enviroment! NOW ANYONE WHOS AGAINST NOT SAVING TREES SHOULLD BE SHOT lol

[S14_Kouki]

Well I was actually trying to stick up for you when some one was trying to just start an argument for no reason. Guess I won't do that again.

And I'm not exactly sure why you were telling me to read all posts but I can assure that I have.

Well thank you, but the only reason I posted it was because you said Philip like he had alot to do with this thread. He only has 3 posts in this hole thread yea he help but I dont think as much as other ppl here.


i agree!!! i think hemp would do the usa WONDERS. think about it.. american ppl making prosucts made from american grown product (hemp) that means more jobs for americans and also we wont need as much bull shit from other contrys like china. also sweatshops will deminish (at least i hope/think)

also hemp is good for our enviroment!!! insted of cutting down an irreplaceable, 100 year old tree to make papper... we can use hemp and save the enviroment! NOW ANYONE WHOS AGAINST NOT SAVING TREES SHOULLD BE SHOT lol

Like I said before this would be great if we could grow hemp. 1 acre of hemp is = 4 acres of trees. It is plan out stupid we are not growing hemp right now

[greddy2die]

I totally agree that its ridiculous that we cant grow hemp in the states.

It would reduce cutting tree's significantly I think. It wouldn't stop it 100% obviously due to homes/buildings and other stuff needing wood. But it would make a nice dent in the logging industry I believe.

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

Damn hippies and their Mary Jane....and their Knights In Satans Service...And their hippidy doo dop music radio

Y'all need Jesus

[yota man]

Well thank you, but the only reason I posted it was because you said Philip like he had alot to do with this thread. He only has 3 posts in this hole thread yea he help but I dont think as much as other ppl here.


I used his posts because it was, as I believe, a great example of actually using sources and information to back up what you are saying in your post. I know you have been very vocal in this thread and have provided lots of info and I have enjoyed reading your responses also. It was just that his post stuck out in my head as an good easy to find example.

[S14_Kouki]

I totally agree that its ridiculous that we cant grow hemp in the states.

It would reduce cutting tree's significantly I think. It wouldn't stop it 100% obviously due to homes/buildings and other stuff needing wood. But it would make a nice dent in the logging industry I believe.

Well VT, HI, ND, MT, MN, IL, VA, NM, CA, AR, KY, MD, WV all grow hemp its just marketed enough. So there is a start it just needs to get alot bigger alot faster.


Damn hippies and their Mary Jane....and their Knights In Satans Service...And their hippidy doo dop music radio

Y'all need Jesus


Yes yes I do need him



I used his posts because it was, as I believe, a great example of actually using sources and information to back up what you are saying in your post. I know you have been very vocal in this thread and have provided lots of info and I have enjoyed reading your responses also. It was just that his post stuck out in my head as an good easy to find example.

Ok cool I just needed stuff cleared up and I am sorry. So lets all get back on topic and share great info that can one day help us in our cause.

[Sleepy240]

why is everyone getting all worked up about a PLANT?!?! what has pot ever done you you? (the naysayers) can someone tell me how pot has harmed YOU?? honestly the reason i say "you", is because i should have the RIGHT to make the decision whats good for me and whats not. if i wanna smoke a lb of pot a day, i should be able to. just like no one gets in trouble for smokeing 2 packs a day or eating mcdonalds 3 times a day.

WHY DO YOU HATE POT SO MUCH?!?!? LEAVE MARY JANE ALONE!! SHES DONE NOTHING WRONG!!! WHAT HAS SHE DONE TO YOU??

Well lets start with the obvious, there is no reason to post your crappy excuse for a paragraph in BOLD. There happen to lots of reasons to get "worked up" about this plant. Number one being that it is ILLEGAL! Right now nothing that you say changes that fact. Any drug that IMPARES your cognitive ability is harmful, each individual has a different reaction to the substance. You should have the right to decide what is good for you, is eating McDonalds illegal? No, so have at it. If that is your argument you might as well legalize crack cocaine, and crystal meth. How does that harm you? Nobody here to the best of my knowledge "hates pot", and "mary jane" doesn't exactly help your cause. To be honest you pretty much just sound like a kid who wants to get high. Toke up champ.

People are worked up because alot of people have come to realize that it shouldnt be illegal.

Sadly I must be in the minority who still don't believe the legalization.

I dont know if marijuana will become legal to be able to smoke in a bar or outside of your house just to do it like people do with alcohol. I personally would love it, however I wont hold my breath. Its not that big a deal to me.

I don't for see marijuana ever being legalized in the social aspect. Because of the chances of secondary highs and the like. Me drinking alcohol does not get you drunk. I also agree where this is not a big point and honestly has no bearing on whether its legalized or not.

However, I do think that HEMP should be legal to grow in the United States. To change laws now and allow hemp to be legal to grow so that paper, ropes, medicine, clothing, shoes etc etc will make all the naysayers in the country wonder wtf they were fighting for and why the hell did there oh so wonderful government all of a sudden go against what they have fighting to keep illegal all these years.

I agree as before that Hemp should probably be legal to grow. The problem is 99% of America is not mature enough to just grow hemp, number one. People, not just our government only see dollars. People immediately see the benefits of producing something illegal. As I said before Hemp in theory is a good prospect but the capital required simply for starting up these businesses are very large. They would have create NEW factories with NEW equipment to manufacture these new goods. Not to mention removing jobs in the logging, paper, and forestry industries. And if you are close minded enough as to why we are over there then I do feel bad for you. This thread is about marijuana not the War on Terrorism.

i agree!!! i think hemp would do the usa WONDERS. think about it.. american ppl making prosucts made from american grown product (hemp) that means more jobs for americans and also we wont need as much bull shit from other contrys like china. also sweatshops will deminish (at least i hope/think)

Spell check is your friend. American people make plenty of "prosucts" here IN America. Hemp would create jobs, and eliminate other jobs. It would also create an even greater potential for greed, extortion, and crime, in my opinion. Hemp is not going to cure outsourcing, and buying products from other nations. The fact is it until we cut our costs (which will not happen) things will continue to be cheaper elsewhere, most importantly labor. Sweatshops will not diminish as I said. Us growing hemp will not stop us from importing clothes, shoes, and paper, even things hemp creating.

also hemp is good for our enviroment!!! insted of cutting down an irreplaceable, 100 year old tree to make papper... we can use hemp and save the enviroment! NOW ANYONE WHOS AGAINST NOT SAVING TREES SHOULLD BE SHOT lol

Hemp is has tons of pros as have been stated. To start here with your bullshit slinging, trees are 100% replaceable. They take time to mature and grow but are entirely replaceable. America is one of the key proponents for "Tree Farms". Most people are close minded and don't see that most logging companies are actually quite responsible. Basically "Tree Farms" are exactly as they sound, large plots of land with trees grown specifically for harvesting. They use mathematical equations to figure out how many trees they actually need to produce homes, how much area they have, and how much time it takes. In California alone they have 3.5 Million ACRES of Tree Farms. Please see below...

http://z.hubpages.com/u/1387327_f520.jpg

So by your logic I am against saving trees, so please shoot me.

[drftmark]

YouTube - THC effects on Tumor Brain Cells, Normal Brain Cells (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OqSRfzqwWA)

^ short 20 sec video about THC effects on tumor brain cells over a 20 hour period.



This "contact high" and "second hand high" idea cracks me up. You would have to be in veryyyyy odd/ideal/extreme conditions for anyone to be effected.

[drift_limo]

this thread makes me giggle.

[Touge Noob S13]

[quote=yota man;3053651 Touge Noob all you have done here is try to stir up an argument.[/quote]


Listen Im not a "BAN ANYTHING MARIJUANA" guy. I am completly down for the use of hemp as paper and stuff as well as the use of it for medical reasons. What I dont like is how S14 Kouki and the rest of the "church of Timothy Leary and latter day stoners" is preaching to us about its other uses when they cleary do not really care for these uses. They really only care about the desire to get high with no trouble from the law. The "marijuana for other uses" argument would hold better ground if it was being defended by someone who does not use marijuana, not ex-stoners and such.

[Dalton918]

Can anyone name one way that smoking pot is worse than getting drunk?

(Besides it being illegal, we all get it.)

[murda-c]

Can anyone name one way that smoking pot is worse than getting drunk?

(Besides it being illegal, we all get it.)

It neuters the American fighting spirit.

[drftmark]

Listen Im not a "BAN ANYTHING MARIJUANA" guy. I am completly down for the use of hemp as paper and stuff as well as the use of it for medical reasons. What I dont like is how S14 Kouki and the rest of the "church of Timothy Leary and latter day stoners" is preaching to us about its other uses when they cleary do not really care for these uses. They really only care about the desire to get high with no trouble from the law. The "marijuana for other uses" argument would hold better ground if it was being defended by someone who does not use marijuana, not ex-stoners and such.

How does the person's care level discredit any information about the "other uses?" If it benefits society with its many uses and people get high(like they are already doing), then who the fuck cares.

If everyone is already getting high on the reg, then the only people missing out are the people who want to keep it illegal when they could have access to all of the "other uses."

Getting high doesn't need an industrialized background... everything else to do with weed does. Period. SO WAKE UP and BENEFIT FROM IT.

The information is out there if you want to find it since you are not an "ex-stoner" and you can defend it since your judgment must be soooo better because you haven't smoked pot. :bowrofl: :goyou:

[shmiddy]

ok sleepy240 you make a good argument,

But what do you say about ppl whose lives are pretty much ruined because they enjoy pot. Do you agree with at least decriminalizing it??? I mean, common!!!! Take the stick out your ass and let ppl enjoy some pot!!! SHIT!!!!

[shmiddy]

oh and sleepy240, im not to sure if you said this before but my question to you is: have you every smoked pot??? do u know what it is to be high? because if you have, then you should know how harmless it is... at least it is to me..

[Phlip]

How does the person's care level discredit any information about the "other uses?" If it benefits society with its many uses and people get high(like they are already doing), then who the fuck cares.

If everyone is already getting high on the reg, then the only people missing out are the people who want to keep it illegal when they could have access to all of the "other uses."

Getting high doesn't need an industrialized background... everything else to do with weed does. Period. SO WAKE UP and BENEFIT FROM IT.

The information is out there if you want to find it since you are not an "ex-stoner" and you can defend it since your judgment must be soooo better because you haven't smoked pot. :bowrofl: :goyou:
I will speak specifically to the bolded part...

The stoner/pothead type is the one who numbs the argument for those whose interests in legalization/decriminalization are actually earnest. Think of it like this. I am a non-smoker who argues FOR, legalization, but I so so with a level of objectivity that sees it that I do not need to beat on a drum, yell, or otherwise peacock my beliefs. I come armed with good information.
I am not the one who is being heard. Instead, who you (not you specifically, don't take it personally) DO hear, on the other hand is the guys yelling "SMOKE WEED EVERY DAY," or that offer half-assed arguments amounting to not much more than "man, people are gonna smoke ANYWAY, why not make it legal?" Being thrown into the lot with the dregs of society, even if you share a common interest -- but with differing reasoning -- REALLY cripples any argument, no matter how effective. Need an example? Look how quickly the last thread got closed, and how this one has remained barely above going the same direction. For the record, I have ZERO faith in one of the aforementioned stoners/potheads to drop in and ruin the whole situation and everyone who actually DID want to participate in an actual discussion will again miss the time where a douche canoe such as could be repped DEEP into the red.

[drftmark]

Phlip, I understand what you are talking about retards adding their 2 cents hurting an arguement, but this was an issue having to do with the authenticity of facts.

TougeNoobs13 was talking to S14 Kouki who hasn't made any of the "get high til I muthafuckin dieeeeee" comments, when he, like you, also came in armed with good information. Then TougeNoobs13 tries to say that the information he is saying isn't holding any ground just because he smokes/smoked? That is preposterous.

why don't you bring the rep back?

[S14_Kouki]

Listen Im not a "BAN ANYTHING MARIJUANA" guy. I am completly down for the use of hemp as paper and stuff as well as the use of it for medical reasons. What I dont like is how S14 Kouki and the rest of the "church of Timothy Leary and latter day stoners" is preaching to us about its other uses when they cleary do not really care for these uses. They really only care about the desire to get high with no trouble from the law. The "marijuana for other uses" argument would hold better ground if it was being defended by someone who does not use marijuana, not ex-stoners and such.

Cool story bro. I have stated that marijuana helps re-grow brain cells, iv talked about the medical issues, iv talked and talked about how hemp can help use in so many ways. But my BIG argument is how marijuana CAN help our economy with extra money and jobs think about the extra billions of $$$ we can get think about the thousands of jobs that will open up.

PS I have not smoked for awhile and I dont plan on smoking for a very long time. So I really dont care to just legalize so I cant get in trouble.


ok sleepy240 you make a good argument,

But what do you say about ppl whose lives are pretty much ruined because they enjoy pot. Do you agree with at least decriminalizing it??? I mean, common!!!! Take the stick out your ass and let ppl enjoy some pot!!! SHIT!!!!

You will never win talking to sleepy240 iv tryed it for the past 6 pages. Sleepy240 has alot of good info but its always is to oppose our info

Phlip, I understand what you are talking about retards adding their 2 cents hurting an arguement, but this was an issue having to do with the authenticity of facts.

TougeNoobs13 was talking to S14 Kouki who hasn't made any of the "get high til I muthafuckin dieeeeee" comments, when he, like you, also came in armed with good information. Then TougeNoobs13 tries to say that the information he is saying isn't holding any ground just because he smokes/smoked? That is preposterous.

why don't you bring the rep back?

Thank you, I knew there was someone out there to back me up :bigok:

[Sleepy240]

You will never win talking to sleepy240 iv tryed it for the past 6 pages. Sleepy240 has alot of good info but its always is to oppose our info

I appreciate what you are saying but sadly this isn't about winning or losing. This about putting information out there so each individual can make their own informed decision. Sadly most people already have their minds made up. Up until this thread I can honestly tell you I had not even contemplated hemp as a resource. And I suppose I could mention all of your information is too oppose mine :wiggle:

oh and sleepy240, im not to sure if you said this before but my question to you is: have you every smoked pot??? do u know what it is to be high? because if you have, then you should know how harmless it is... at least it is to me..

To be totally honest, yes I have smoked pot before. Back when I was young and immature (about 6 years ago). I do know what it was like to be high and frankly I personally did not enjoy it. I am living proof that not everybody "loves being high". Paranoia is one of the things I experienced and it definitely caused some problems. The key to your post is that to YOU nothing has ever happened. Also if you decriminalize marijuana what drugs are next? If we are going by the motto that a lot of Pro-Smokers use, "How does me smoking harm you?". Well then legalize crystal meth, crank, speed, cocaine, and PCP.

[HalveBlue]

Yes.

I am for legalizing all drugs.

Seriously.

This country has forgotten the basic principle of personal choice - as well as personal responsibility.

Give me one good reason why I shouldn't be allowed to choose what I do or do not ingest?

[shmiddy]

To be totally honest, yes I have smoked pot before. Back when I was young and immature (about 6 years ago). I do know what it was like to be high and frankly I personally did not enjoy it. I am living proof that not everybody "loves being high". Paranoia is one of the things I experienced and it definitely caused some problems. The key to your post is that to YOU nothing has ever happened. Also if you decriminalize marijuana what drugs are next? If we are going by the motto that a lot of Pro-Smokers use, "How does me smoking harm you?". Well then legalize crystal meth, crank, speed, cocaine, and PCP.

Dude your 23........ So you’re telling me that you smoked pot back when you were 16-17?!?!? imo that’s way to young... WAY TO YOUNG.. when you learn to use the drug at a age that you can be semi-responsible, and at a age that you can actually enjoy pot, its a totally different thing... the reason you got all paranoid is because you were to young and the fear of being caught, period. as you grow up and actually look into the drug and its laws you don’t become as paranoid (still kinda paranoid but not as much) and you can finally ENJOY pot for what it really is: a plant.

I think your "what next" point is WAY out of line. Just because you decriminalize pot doesn’t mean that all drugs should be. Pot is in another spectrum compared to meth, coke, or heroin; and you can’t disagree with me on that. im sure you feel that pot is less harmful that any of the other drugs we have mentioned. I believe us as Americans are not stupid, and it sounds ludicrous to imagine that we would let drugs like crack, coke, meth, heroin, or even acid legal.

proff:
crack=
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_9Fmme1Fqdb4/SOCZbTRLTNI/AAAAAAAAA_c/QAd2xig1aEY/s400/crackhead.jpg
heroin:
http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/8465893/2/istockphoto_8465893-heroin-addict.jpg
meth:
http://s3.amazonaws.com/contestant_response/49c85a04494c8_markowitz_06_jpg.jpg

is all worse than pot

pot:
http://www.moviemarketingmadness.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/pineapple-express-poster-franco.jpg

lol

[Phlip]

Phlip, I understand what you are talking about retards adding their 2 cents hurting an arguement, but this was an issue having to do with the authenticity of facts.

TougeNoobs13 was talking to S14 Kouki who hasn't made any of the "get high til I muthafuckin dieeeeee" comments, when he, like you, also came in armed with good information. Then TougeNoobs13 tries to say that the information he is saying isn't holding any ground just because he smokes/smoked? That is preposterous.

why don't you bring the rep back?

It never has anything to do with the authenticity of the facts, any more than it causes people to turn a deaf ear to them. If you deny that fact, you're lying to yourself. "Bad associations spoil useful habits" goes the saying and it applies to this argument.

I am not pointing fingers at people who smoke for having invalid arguments, so long as their argument comes rooted in fact free of the "It's my RIGHT to smoke if I want to," which is largely the same argument as the other retards described. One should be able to separate an argument based in fact from those based on the immature continued assertion that they should just be allowed to smoke, what does it hurt?, lest they find themselves on the wrong side of what could be a mature discussion and undermine their own agenda.
This is not to say that a casual smoker cannot fashion an intelligent argument about the task at hand, I have a couple of childhood friends with Masters Degrees -- one from an Ivy League school -- who smoke regularly with people in a similar mind state to themselves, but for every one of those I encounter, I come across FIVE of the dude who was in court last year on ANOTHER possession charge saying "I don't care how many tickets they give me, I'mma smoke til I DIE!"
I will allow you but ONE guess which of these groups speaks loudest and most frequently.

Rep is not coming back because stupid people fucked it up and it is not my place to bring it back.

[Sleepy240]

Dude your 23........ So you’re telling me that you smoked pot back when you were 16-17?!?!? imo that’s way to young... WAY TO YOUNG.. when you learn to use the drug at a age that you can be semi-responsible, and at a age that you can actually enjoy pot, its a totally different thing... the reason you got all paranoid is because you were to young and the fear of being caught, period. as you grow up and actually look into the drug and its laws you don’t become as paranoid (still kinda paranoid but not as much) and you can finally ENJOY pot for what it really is: a plant.

I think your "what next" point is WAY out of line. Just because you decriminalize pot doesn’t mean that all drugs should be. Pot is in another spectrum compared to meth, coke, or heroin; and you can’t disagree with me on that. im sure you feel that pot is less harmful that any of the other drugs we have mentioned. I believe us as Americans are not stupid, and it sounds ludicrous to imagine that we would let drugs like crack, coke, meth, heroin, or even acid legal.l

You cannot tell me what is too young or too old. In my opinion you are TOO old to me smoking pot. It is something teenagers do when they are young and rebellious. There is NO such thing as "responsible" illegal drug use, end of story. I still have friends who get paranoia when they smoke, and some of them are older than I. My point is totally in line, you want to legalize an illegal drug with the reasoning that it only hurts the user. Meth, heroin, and coke hurt the user, they do not hurt me at all. Personally I feel as though marijuana is just as destructive, people make poor decisions, and it affects the way some people act. Some people become depressed or dependent, some people move onto heavier drugs all because they want that "high". If you think its ludicrous to legalize the other ILLEGAL drugs, then guess what, marijuana is on that list that will not be legalized. And if you really believe that Americans are that smart, then making these drugs legal should be fine, since in your mind most Americans will be smart enough to make the decision not to use these drugs and only use the non-harmful marijuana.

[shmiddy]

i give up lol

[shmiddy]

Im tired of typing lol we should have this conversation in person over a few beers and a fat ass blunt! Im sure I can change your mind then.

[drftmark]

Rep is not coming back because stupid people fucked it up and it is not my place to bring it back.

You do what you need to do to get to that place... It's the climbbbbbbbbbbb yaaaehhh yaaehheheehaahaa :snoop:


You cannot tell me what is too young or too old. In my opinion you are TOO old to me smoking pot. It is something teenagers do when they are young and rebellious. There is NO such thing as "responsible" illegal drug use, end of story. I still have friends who get paranoia when they smoke, and some of them are older than I. My point is totally in line, you want to legalize an illegal drug with the reasoning that it only hurts the user. Meth, heroin, and coke hurt the user, they do not hurt me at all. Personally I feel as though marijuana is just as destructive, people make poor decisions, and it affects the way some people act. Some people become depressed or dependent, some people move onto heavier drugs all because they want that "high". If you think its ludicrous to legalize the other ILLEGAL drugs, then guess what, marijuana is on that list that will not be legalized. And if you really believe that Americans are that smart, then making these drugs legal should be fine, since in your mind most Americans will be smart enough to make the decision not to use these drugs and only use the non-harmful marijuana.

Do you at least think marijuana should be DECRIMINALIZED? Get people out of jail rotting away for nothing, save NINE BILLION DOLLARS(of our money!) in criminal court costs, and free up the police force from a huge percentage of their workload.

You can't and tell me that you think weed is doing more damage to them than jail, cause that would be ridiculousssss.

[Dalton918]

The key to your post is that to YOU nothing has ever happened. Also if you decriminalize marijuana what drugs are next? If we are going by the motto that a lot of Pro-Smokers use, "How does me smoking harm you?". Well then legalize crystal meth, crank, speed, cocaine, and PCP.



People high on pot won't rob your house or kill you for five bucks so they can get there next fix.

Me smoking does not harm you and it also deos not harm me more than ciggaretes, alochol, or just about any prescrition drug, how many people have you heard of OD on pot?

[S14_Kouki]

You cannot tell me what is too young or too old. In my opinion you are TOO old to me smoking pot. It is something teenagers do when they are young and rebellious. There is NO such thing as "responsible" illegal drug use, end of story. I still have friends who get paranoia when they smoke, and some of them are older than I. My point is totally in line, you want to legalize an illegal drug with the reasoning that it only hurts the user. Meth, heroin, and coke hurt the user, they do not hurt me at all. Personally I feel as though marijuana is just as destructive, people make poor decisions, and it affects the way some people act. Some people become depressed or dependent, some people move onto heavier drugs all because they want that "high". If you think its ludicrous to legalize the other ILLEGAL drugs, then guess what, marijuana is on that list that will not be legalized. And if you really believe that Americans are that smart, then making these drugs legal should be fine, since in your mind most Americans will be smart enough to make the decision not to use these drugs and only use the non-harmful marijuana.

Why cant we tell you whats to young or old??? You have told us what is to young a couple times in this thread. Why cant you be responsible with marijuana?? If you dont smoke and drive and if you dont put anyone in danger is that not being responsible?? Whats YOUR definition on being responible then??? And any other drug needs to be destroyed.

[Sleepy240]

Why cant we tell you whats to young or old??? You have told us what is to young a couple times in this thread. Why cant you be responsible with marijuana?? If you dont smoke and drive and if you dont put anyone in danger is that not being responsible?? What YOUR definition on being responible then??? And any other drug needs to be destroyed.

Your taking my response out of context to be honest. The age thing really applied to me responding by how can he tell me my reaction to being "high" would be any different from being young or old. The answer is there no way he can tell me. Sure you can responsible with marijuana, but you can also be responsible with cocaine or meth by that reasoning, as long as you don't drive. To me responsibility in this aspect would be OBEYING THE LAW and not using illegal substances.

People high on pot won't rob your house or kill you for five bucks so they can get there next fix.

Me smoking does not harm you and it also deos not harm me more than ciggaretes, alochol, or just about any prescrition drug, how many people have you heard of OD on pot?

You have no idea what people are able to do, high or not. Just because nobody has robbed you for their next fix does not mean it doesn't happen. Nope I have not heard of an OD on pot but how does that effect me? Just because its a drug that you "can't" overdose on does not make that any better of a drug. So since you can't OD on it you can just consume a ridiculous amount of that substance? How is that more mature than somebody who smokes crack? Its not and thats the bottom line.

Do you at least think marijuana should be DECRIMINALIZED? Get people out of jail rotting away for nothing, save NINE BILLION DOLLARS(of our money!) in criminal court costs, and free up the police force from a huge percentage of their workload.

You can't and tell me that you think weed is doing more damage to them than jail, cause that would be ridiculousssss.

As I have stated before I see little to no initial benefits to decriminalizing marijuana. Hemp makes alot of sense down the road but right off the bat, not so much. The people in prison are not rotting away for nothing, they ARE BREAKING THE LAW. Even if you "think" it should be legalized, it IS NOT. Thats not a good argument as to why it should be decriminalized. Just because somebody thinks they speed limit should be 85 does not mean it should be legal, your still breaking a law, yet they will waste time and money fighting tickets, and arguing with police officers. If you really wanted to relieve some of the police workload people would stop being JACKASSES, and follow the rules laid forth. If you want marijuana legalized you need to DO something about it, talk to somebody (local and state legistlation). Also none of these individuals in prison now would be released they would still have to serve their sentences. The only point I do agree with is the amount of dollars that could be saved. Now remember this out of total drug arrests marijuana accounted for nearly 50% of them. To me that says there is clearly a larger issue with marijuana usage than any other drug, and that police are clearly DOING their job. It is not like they specifically target marijuana users, its just they have a much larger amount than any other drug.

[S14_Kouki]

Your taking my response out of context to be honest. The age thing really applied to me responding by how can he tell me my reaction to being "high" would be any different from being young or old. The answer is there no way he can tell me. Sure you can responsible with marijuana, but you can also be responsible with cocaine or meth by that reasoning, as long as you don't drive. To me responsibility in this aspect would be OBEYING THE LAW and not using illegal substances.


Responsibility to you would be OBEYING THE LAW right. Well if marijuana was legal, then we would all be OBEYING THE LAW because there would be NO law against it, soooo we would all be in YOUR words responsible right???

P.S. I just found out TODAY that my dad that has been in a lawsuit against Tampa General Hospital for malpractice. He can no longer use his right hand BECAUSE of the hospital and he IS using marijuana to help him with pain and to relax. Something he CAN get in trouble for because there is NO medical marijuana in FL, so I dont want to see him get arrested for something that is helping him.