RB20DET Not Starting

[nurvcom]

OK


Specs
91 240sx
Rb20det (stock)

Picked car up already swapped :( and it start a few times now it wont


All the motor will do is Crank crank crank crank and not start not even a sputter or anything

What i checked and fixxed when this started happening

1.Wire harness was all Messed up so i think i fixxed it

2. CAS was bad so replaced New Used one Tested and works on other Motor

3. ECU was good but got Another unit just in case Both ECU was checked and work perfect

4. Check all relays and fuses all bad was replaced

5. Check all Grounds on Motor and ECU and i added some more grounds

6. Check Fuel pump (255 walbro) primes and works perfect fuel PSI is OK

7. Coils and Injectors are working



you think it mite the key switch on steering column?

I cant Figure this out and driving me crazy

[nurvcom]

bump no one knows :


o and IGN chip was replaced

[240love]

vacumm leak?

[nurvcom]

vacumm leak?


i checked all vacumm lines non are unhooked

[flawlessflo3190]

ignitor grounded?

[nurvcom]

ignitor grounded?


i grounded the grounded the wire do i need to ground the ignitor case to something?

[240sxxs]

what about fuel problem.

[240love]

i checked all vacumm lines non are unhooked

there could still be something leaking.. back when i had my rb20 it wouldnt start if it had the slightest leak

[nurvcom]

what about fuel problem.


me and my friend check fuel pump it working perfect and fuel filter is clean and not clogged


No on the fuel line going to the motor

Top line on intake on RB20DET Feed
and
Bottem Line on intake on RB20DET is Return


Correct?

[240love]

did you ever disconnect the fuel lines? if you did make sure you put them back correct cause that shit happens all the time lol

[nurvcom]

ok i check fuel lines today

[nurvcom]

ok check fuel line It hook up right still not starting Took A compression test
Front 6 130psi
Front 5 130psi
Mid 4 130psi
Mid 3 130psi
Rear 2 140psi
Rear 1 140psi

ok
Pulled coils and checked them agine
each coil fires fine
and
injectors working fine cuss it floods after 5 or 6 time trying to start it
Half Mood (F#$King) Key Broke off cam so now it kinda hard to reinstall cas http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif
and it still not starting

well I think i going to fuxking give up it not whatting to work and i put so much into now i am pissed
http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/anger.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/anger.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/anger.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/anger.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/confused.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/confused.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/bash.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/bash.gif http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/bash.gif

[soon2bs13]

you have not checked the battery or starter yet?

mine was giving me issues as well. check the starter clip. the connector that is probably loose or is not making contact. i had to redo mine because it would not start at all.

i also had an odyssey battery that died on me, bought a stock one that would fit in the engine bay and i haven't had issues as of lately.

don't give up!

[nurvcom]

you have not checked the battery or starter yet?

mine was giving me issues as well. check the starter clip. the connector that is probably loose or is not making contact. i had to redo mine because it would not start at all.

i also had an odyssey battery that died on me, bought a stock one that would fit in the engine bay and i haven't had issues as of lately.

don't give up!




Ok battery is Good holding over 12.something volt and i am wearing it down recharging it to keep working on it


ok starter Clip?

Starter not loose

it crank crank cranks cranks when battery low it crank crank stop crank crank stop crank

[nurvcom]

oo and i got new spark plugs what the stock GAP? for RB20det?

[soon2bs13]

Ok battery is Good holding over 12.something volt and i am wearing it down recharging it to keep working on it


ok starter Clip?

Starter not loose

it crank crank cranks cranks when battery low it crank crank stop crank crank stop crank

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s44/luker_1987/Photo-0063.jpg

not the picture i was looking for, but it is too dark out for me to take a picture to show you. you have the bolt for the ground and the male pin for the power. the female connector is what possibly could be loose or not making a good connection, if it is on there and you have a butt connector, that could be your issue to. my butt connector was not crimped down good enough and it pulled right off.

oo and i got new spark plugs what the stock GAP? for RB20det?

i forgot what i gapped mine to. i believe it is .037 inches, but do not quote me on that :D

[nurvcom]

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s44/luker_1987/Photo-0063.jpg

not the picture i was looking for, but it is too dark out for me to take a picture to show you. you have the bolt for the ground and the male pin for the power. the female connector is what possibly could be loose or not making a good connection, if it is on there and you have a butt connector, that could be your issue to. my butt connector was not crimped down good enough and it pulled right off.



i forgot what i gapped mine to. i believe it is .037 inches, but do not quote me on that :D



ok i guess it some it some kinda of signal wire to tell ECU car is starting or something
sorry if i Sound Stupid
i usally Good with cars it just this motor that got me I am a honda guy i still have a 95 RHD civic coupe with a built b18B LS swap :)



i guess your close i did a search and found tons of people on nico and here using this gap on rb20 and rb25
.032

[soon2bs13]

ok i guess it some it some kinda of signal wire to tell ECU car is starting or something
sorry if i Sound Stupid
i usally Good with cars it just this motor that got me I am a honda guy i still have a 95 RHD civic coupe with a built b18B LS swap :)



i guess your close i did a search and found tons of people on nico and here using this gap on rb20 and rb25
.032

I am not sure the correct name of it either. haha. You don't sound stupid. Had I not done this swap and had some issues, I would not have been able to help. ;-)

I am a Honda guy myself. 2002 Civic Hatch with Greddy kit and I am nearly done building another motor (K20a2):yum:

What plugs did you buy? I was told to buy the 300zx Turbo spark plugs.

[nurvcom]

well i tryed messing with starter still Crank crank crank not even a sputter or cough :(

[soon2bs13]

Crank Sensor?

My Honda's Crank Angle and Cam Sensor went out and the car wouldn't do crap...wish you had a video or if i was close enough i could look at it at least...lol

[RastaS13]

Bro it sounds like a ground. Happened to me and it took us forever to figure it out.

[nurvcom]

Bro it sounds like a ground. Happened to me and it took us forever to figure it out.

I dont know what Ground i check all ground wires and Made like 6 extra grounds for the engine and one for ecu :(



CAM sensor new Used and all injectors fires and coils fires fine

[nurvcom]

hopefully if i can get my camera working i take a video
Any new ideas on what Should i check ???
my motor is somewhat apart
Coil and plug pulled
I checked all vac
Does Fuel rail have 2 FPRs? one on each end ?
Everyone when i Got this car it ran and started only 5 time http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif
i got it with rb20det already swapped into car...

What I have Done in parts
harness repaired
new used cas other one was bad
new plugs
new used ECU

how many sensors are on the rb20det?
Would any sensor make the car not start???
all it does it crank over but no sputter or coughing at all!!!

[GSXRJJordan]

Proper gap is ~.030", so that's not the problem.

The wire you're looking for is orange with silver hash marks from the dash harness (I assume it's an S13), and goes to the ECU to give +12V whenever you're cranking the car. The car should start without it, if you pump the gas and crank it a few times, so I'm guessing that's not the problem. Anyway, check to make sure you have +12V at all the applicable pins using the wiring diagram:
http://wut2dg.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pN6f0iEVyqzrmlvY3vcj9J7d-asGt7knu18AIVifmJnfwk4fTmIqPqFBvJez2YpqjPEvTRQvcI_ xQDMUGg23y5eNPKYfP0BX3/RB20DET%20ECU%20Pinout.jpg

The pin locations are from THE BACK of the ECU harness most of the time - you can check because the '100' pins are physically larger than the rest.

[nurvcom]

Proper gap is ~.030", so that's not the problem.

The wire you're looking for is orange with silver hash marks from the dash harness (I assume it's an S13), and goes to the ECU to give +12V whenever you're cranking the car. The car should start without it, if you pump the gas and crank it a few times, so I'm guessing that's not the problem. Anyway, check to make sure you have +12V at all the applicable pins using the wiring diagram:
http://wut2dg.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pN6f0iEVyqzrmlvY3vcj9J7d-asGt7knu18AIVifmJnfwk4fTmIqPqFBvJez2YpqjPEvTRQvcI_ xQDMUGg23y5eNPKYfP0BX3/RB20DET%20ECU%20Pinout.jpg

The pin locations are from THE BACK of the ECU harness most of the time - you can check because the '100' pins are physically larger than the rest.


YA

ECU red light go's out when cranking car that should stay on? meaning that ecu stay's on

[GSXRJJordan]

YA

ECU red light go's out when cranking car that should stay on? meaning that ecu stay's on

My guess is you've got your ECU wiring wired up directly to the ignition switch, and you're using an 'Accessory' wire instead of the black/white (or black/red, depending on where you grab it) 'Ignition' wire. Use a multimeter with a probe on your "ignition-switched +12V" leads on the ECU, see if they drop to no volts while you're cranking.

[nurvcom]

My guess is you've got your ECU wiring wired up directly to the ignition switch, and you're using an 'Accessory' wire instead of the black/white (or black/red, depending on where you grab it) 'Ignition' wire. Use a multimeter with a probe on your "ignition-switched +12V" leads on the ECU, see if they drop to no volts while you're cranking.



well My multimeter stopped working :(

and check wire it looks good to my eyes Man this car is first to discourage me :(


ok i talked to the guy who use to own the car with rb20det he swapped it in

He said it was working find and all of a sudden it just died and didn't what to start and he only got it to start a few time after and i got it to start a few time to :(

[nurvcom]

U think it Could be my harness got a problem?


i tryed to change some wires and it still doesn't start only crank crank


:(


This car would start every once and wile and run but once warm it would Die :( and now it just quit ....

[GSXRJJordan]

All the information you need to diagnose the problem is in this thread.

Once you figure out where the problem is, I will try and give you some tips on how to fix it.

[omgshawn]

Have you tried retiming it?

[I build motors all day]

drop the distributor in wrong...?

[nurvcom]

ok

Here my next
thing i going to try

recheck timing
Make shur my CAS is in the right Spot !

harness i kinda confused and dont have anyone to help on that

I know My coils work Fine
I know my injectors work fine
ECU works got 2


here a question
when car is starting red light should stay on? when turning the motor over?


and white with purple wire what wire in fuse box in engine bay should i tap off of? the kid who did this swap taped off the second biggest white wire

[Yellow4g63]

Did u check the coils to see if there is constant power to them with the key on? I think it's the middle pin.

[clark]

i read all of the first page...i don't see any indication of you checking for spark.....you mentioned the injectors are firing and you have fuel PSI.

it sounds like you're not getting spark. pull a spark plug out, plug it back into a coilpack, hold the plug near the valve cover, have a friend crank the engine...

do you see an ARC???

[nurvcom]

i read all of the first page...i don't see any indication of you checking for spark.....you mentioned the injectors are firing and you have fuel PSI.

it sounds like you're not getting spark. pull a spark plug out, plug it back into a coilpack, hold the plug near the valve cover, have a friend crank the engine...

do you see an ARC???

fuel PSI is good pump it good

i pulled all my coils out and put spark plugs in them and put them on my valve cover and started turning the CAS and watch each 1 fires

[Yellow4g63]

Did u try to reverse the fuel lines?

[nurvcom]

Did u try to reverse the fuel lines?



yep tryed that No luck :(

[carcrzy920]

okay i dont mean to thread jack but is upper fuel rail feed or return. i just did my motor swap and cant remember if the feed goes to the regulator or not.

[nurvcom]

okay i dont mean to thread jack but is upper fuel rail feed or return. i just did my motor swap and cant remember if the feed goes to the regulator or not.


fEED ON TOP AND RETURN ON BOTTEM

[carcrzy920]

thanks. good luck with you rb20.

[Sheldon Rozon]

ok so im having a similar problem with my 89 rb 240. but i dont have spark. now you said you have spark and fuel well if you did then it would start or at least sputter not just crank (like mine). so my questions for you are:
when did you pull the plugs and actually check your spark?
was it during the time period that it would start sometimes?
and you said when it did randomly start it was cold cause it wouldnt start when hot, right?
have you checked the power going through your module?

so you should check spark again, and if you dont have spark anymore then its your ignition module. cause you have the symptoms and those things can go in their sleep. mines done close to the samething and im getting an ignition module in a week or 2.

but if you do have spark then run a code test with the ecu using the led on the back side of the ecu. google rb20det codes and ull get the info you need to do it. it took me 5 mins and helped me rule out and ecu problem.

[Zacho]

ok check fuel line It hook up right still not starting Took A compression test
Front 6 130psi
Front 5 130psi
Mid 4 130psi
Mid 3 130psi
Rear 2 140psi
Rear 1 140psi

Half Mood (F#$King) Key Broke off cam so now it kinda hard to reinstall cas http://www.nicoclub.com/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif
and it still not starting


am I the only one here who thinks with a broken half moon on his cam, now its not rotating the CAS and therefore, no dice?

[3v1Ls14]

will still rotate the cas, but it could be inserted one of 10 different ways. 9 of which it wont start at all.

[baube]

tried with maf un-plugged?

[J-tizzel]

Did you ever figure this out, I'm having the same problem. Got fuel and spark but it just pops when cranking.

[Cease_Super_Hicas]

Did u check for any ecu codes? Timing? Tps? Or maf

[simogu]

YA

ECU red light go's out when cranking car that should stay on? meaning that ecu stay's on
RB20, Super Charge. I pretty much have the same problem, over the course of 6 months, the car was running great, the first thing I notice was sluggish idling, then the car would just die, and would not start for about 1.5 hrs. Once started is would run then die again. same results.
I then started finding vacuum hoses blown right off there connections. I was able to get the car started, then last month then it died again. Now it won't even crank over, no lights or power. My next step is trace all connections from my ECU to motor/ignition. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[OrangeVirus1]

Make sure you coil packs aren't cracked up and arching spark on the head. I had that issue and it would never start.

[simogu]

Did you ever get your RB20 starting problem fixed? I have the same kinds of problems.

simogu

[OrangeVirus1]

Did you ever get your RB20 starting problem fixed? I have the same kinds of problems.

simogu

yeah, I found out my coils were all sorts of shitty. and my spark plugs too. I had a problem with my wiring harness too.

If you have stuff missing from your wiring harness, I am selling mine.. it's in bad condition but you can use it to fix anything you are missing.

Also I recommend replacing your coil pack harness if you haven't. I found out part of my problem was that the wiring was all cracked up and broken.. Literally when I took it off the whole thing fell apart.

[simogu]

Did u check for any ecu codes? Timing? Tps? Or maf

Don't have diagnostic, just multi-meter. Checking wiring to ignition coil, looking for cracks and possible arcing.
Any other suggestions are welcome.

Simo

[simogu]

because I have no power, I know the battery is good, just replaced it. No lights, horn, no power. My starting point is the Battery to the Starter, ground may be an issue. I will start there.
Then tracing power to ignition switch and fuse box
ECU might be a problem, I now have the Pin -out list for the ECU, I will need to verify that wiring from there, as well as test for grounding
Any advice is useful....
Thanks, SIMOGU

[OrangeVirus1]

Do you have the relays for the wiring harness?

[simogu]

I will also check my Coil Pack harness for cracks.

Thanks,
SIMOGU

[OrangeVirus1]

I will also check my Coil Pack harness for cracks.

Thanks,
SIMOGU

definitely do that. When I was having spark problems, I took my coil harness off and it literally fell apart.. the clips broke into a bunch of pieces.. the wires cracked in half...

[greenwood]

am I the only one here who thinks with a broken half moon on his cam, now its not rotating the CAS and therefore, no dice?

It will still rotate and work fine if you are sure to install it correctly. I had 2 Cas's go bad on me, shaft broke because bracket for cas was slightly bent. Car would still get spark but not enough to fire, but just enough to make me believe the cas was ok. Make sure that this is not the issue.

[greenwood]

If there are cracks on the coils, you can reseal with liquid electrical tape. The car would still run, just like shit it's highly unlikely that all coils are bad. Are the cylinders filling with fuel or not? Is your TPS adjust correctly? Have you tried swapping igniters? Where are you reading the fuel pressure from? Should be 36 at idle, 42 with no vacuum on it. Good luck.

[240drew]

sounds like MAF or grounding also check fuel pressure.

[greenwood]

No, Car would still start with maf unplugged.

[240drew]

if the maf is bad it won't start under some circumstances. Unplug and start to rule that out as an issue. And yes a car will run with maf unplugged if you don't believe me I have a video of my rb20 idling with out one

[greenwood]

thank you for confirming what I just said in my previous post.

[OrangeVirus1]

the Rb20 will start with almost nothing hooked up.

I got mine to start with just the injectors, coils, ignitor and cas..