PBM v1 S13 ruca/coilover rubbing

[babowc]

I have the S13 PBM v1 adjustable rear arms and their coilovers, but I'm having problems with the S13 ruca and coilover rubbing on each other..

I put 18x10.5 on stock body with 245/35 and cranked camber quite alot.. I'm also quite low:
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2228G.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2229H.jpg
this is the only decent pic I have of my ride height and camber from behind..


anyways, the coilover collars are rubbing on the middle arch of the ruca.. is this a common problem with the v1 PBM rucas?
I can't take any pictures of this because when I lift the car, it doesn't touch, but when the suspension compresses, it touches.

I have the arch facing toward the front of the car.
I tried several different mounting methods and even swapped sides to see if I had em backwards and that was not the problem.

if I flipped them upside down with arches facing forward, it would bottom out on the frame. If I made arches face the rear of the car, it wouldn't clear at all..


I can see that if I didn't have as much camber, that I'd be able to get away with clearing the coilover, but then there would've been no point of me getting the entire rear adjustable arms!

Please let me know...

[DC Dan MAX USA]

no its not a common problem to have issues clearing our coilovers with our v1 ruca. You do seem to have excessive camber which is bad for your tire wear and needs to be corrected just because of that. Looks like you could use a quarter panel roll/pull so you dont need extreme camber to fit the 10.5J and like you said yourself you would clear the coilover with less camber.

I've got a decent amount of body work on my car just to fit 18x10+18 with -1 degree camber

what is your offset and camber?

[babowc]

So I can't run -4 camber on PBM v1 rucas?..

[babowc]

rpf1s are 18x10.5 +15 and camber was around -4 from what I remember being told by my alignment shop.

[DC Dan MAX USA]

So I can't run -4 camber on PBM v1 rucas?..

-4 is what you get when you lower the car on OEM arms. the aftermarket arms were made with correcting that problem in mind.

[babowc]

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2232A.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2233B.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2234C.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2235D.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2236E.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2237F.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2238G.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2240I.jpg
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_2241J.jpg

Here are the pics anyways..
although RUCAs are designed with correcting excess camber, many still run excessive camber to fit big wheels with -offsets under stock or even widebody.

I don't see why it would still touch the coilover.

[babowc]

with nearly 120 hits, I'm surprised noone chimed in yet.

[95Gstman]

Sorry I can't really help you with your problems as I am not running aftermarket arms on the rear suspension, but I was wondering if we could get some more pics of your car. The fitment looks nice. Also as a side note, you should have no problem running -4 of camber. I am not saying that I suggest it, but there are many people who run that much if not more and do not experience the problems you are having. I would suggestion calling PBM seeing as how you have there RUCA's and coilovers. They should be able to help you out.

[jamg]

hopefully dan and OP will be able to solve this problem.

[babowc]

thanks for the compliment..
car looks like shit in the front right now..
I did a bad job of pulling the front fenders and it turned out ugly. Along with many dings and dents all over the car, haha.

I'll get ya some pictures of it later though.

yeah I don't see why it should rub even with excess camber.

[DC Dan MAX USA]

I can see that if I didn't have as much camber, that I'd be able to get away with clearing the coilover, but then there would've been no point of me getting the entire rear adjustable arms!
So I can't run -4 camber on PBM v1 rucas?..
I don't see why it would still touch the coilover.
I don't see why it should rub even with excess camber.
I know you dont see why the old ruca cant do -4 camber but that does not change the fact that they just dont. You also appear unwilling to correct your camber so the only other option seems to be try a new set of arms.

Our V3 ruca has much more clearance around the coilover because we designed them with consideration of compatibility with other brands of coilovers. I have a set of unpainted arms here you could try for free if you want.

[babowc]

Hey Dan..
this is the picture of assembled subframe when I had it out.
I compared it to V3 rucas and like you said, there is a big difference in design.

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_1850D.jpg
btw, this picture is when I didn't have the arms adjusted correctly at the threaded parts.

i'll pm you about the unpainted arms.

[babowc]

here's another one showing straight down.
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w104/babowc/DSC_1853G.jpg

[DC Dan MAX USA]

They are on the way

[brian m]

This makes me kinda mad now. When the V1 first came out I told my bro to buy them to try them out. We installed them and they rubbed the spindle and coilover. I was told to take pictures and to email them. They told me there was nothing they could do.

Now they are on V3 to fix all the issues and there isn't even a discount for those who bought the V1, but w00tang gets a free upgrade? Damn.....

This was on a S13 with Tein HE coils.

[babowc]

Only difference between me and you would be that I'm running their entire rear suspension + coilovers and it's still rubbing.

[brian m]

Even so...the reason they even have newer versions is because they know there were issues:

The second generation of our super low ride height camber arm makes its debut and is in stock now at Parts Shop MAX USA!!!
There is a small price increase of $20 over the first generation arm making this one $200/pair.
The new MAX RUCA still features the same angled adjuster tube to clear the chassis but the similarities to gen. 1 end there.


List of improvements:


3. The new RUCA now has a larger radius uniform continuous bend throughout the arm for increased strength and even stress distribution. The larger radius makes this gen II arm compatible with more brands of coilovers on all s-chassis cars. We had to make a 90 degree notch in the tube where it connects to the bracket to accomplish this.
4. The bracket length is increased to prevent the inside of the bracket from contacting the rear knuckle during suspension travel on extra low cars.

5. The length of the tube was increased to maintain more thread contact inside the adjuster for super low cars maintaining around 1 degree of negative camber.

6. There is an arched up sweep in the arm relative to the bracket and adjuster. This provides plenty of additional clearance between the arm and the axle boot which used to rub a little on extremely low cars with the gen 1 RUCA.

[lflkajfj12123]

you're an idiot brian m

let me go to best buy and tell them i demand they give me a new version of my laptop because now mine is outdated

[brian m]

you're an idiot brian m

let me go to best buy and tell them i demand they give me a new version of my laptop because now mine is outdated


Good job on the name calling.:bowrofl:

All I'm saying is they are going to give him a set and I just wanted a discount (read: repeat customer). That's what another reputable shop does to keep their customers happy.

Our V3 ruca has much more clearance around the coilover because we designed them with consideration of compatibility with other brands of coilovers. I have a set of unpainted arms here you could try for free if you want.

Oh and by the way...the V1 isn't getting replaced because it's outdated, it's because it had flaws, which should have been seen or caught before the product went to market. It's the hardest part of product fabrication, especially if the part is advertised to work on S13, S14, S15. The fabricators can't foresee the different combo's that a customer is going to use or if the end product is being used as intended (to make camber adjustments either back to zero, or just to have the adjustability).

Let me know if Best Buy can replace a defective product...not an outdated one.

[240sxScores]

I still have V1's on my car. Had problems with the rubbing/ being really close to coilover. One even bent on me and one broke from hitting a pothole right before driving over a concrete bridge. Now im on Koni yellow rears which are pretty skinny and haven't had any problems rubbing or bending/breaking.
The one broke because it was the hollow sperical bearing end with the threads, now they have it all solid in V3 along with a design for more clearance.

[lflkajfj12123]

the product isn't defective it works perfectly fine within its limitations

the older design just can't do what the new design can

making it an OUTDATED product

pbm is NOT entitled to giving you a discount and doesn't need to do so to keep their business running

its 200 dollars for a new arm stopping being a little bitch and complaining to save a couple bucks

their arms are already priced cheap as hell for douche canoes like yourself

[LoanShark]

Wow so, I wasnt the only one with rubbing issues (and craptastic welds) with the v1. We were basically told ''too bad so sad.''

Some moron from here said I installed them wrong. How you figure? I did it exactly like their photo and every which way I could to get them to clear.

boo hoo hoo, I cut my losses and went to Battle Version.

[babowc]

That's why I made this thread..
I didn't know if anyone else had the same problems or not. Apparently many have had the same problems.

Regardless, Dan is sending me an unpainted ruca, I will install them and give ample review regarding the arm.

s0apgun, I already stated why I think it shouldn't rub, but I'll say it again.
I have entire PBM suspension setup and for me to have bought the entire setup for nearly $2000, I would expect it to at least perform without any problems.

-4 camber is not extreme, compared to what I've seen on Zilvia already.

[LoanShark]

the product isn't defective it works perfectly fine within its limitations

Which is what? Shock/springs, kts, skinny coilovers? Whats it work with? Dude up there said they wouldnt work with Tein HE and those are ancient land before double ride height adjustable times. Those are the ''skinny shakochos.'' OP is havin trouble with the same brand coilovers as the arms. Exactly what is the limitation? They made a part that dont work and we bought it on faith.

What if auto makers never did recalls on faulty parts?

[babowc]

btw.. i don't see why you guys are getting so heated.

Dan is correcting the problem..
edit: for me, at least...

I brought this up because I'm using their entire setup and it's rubbing.
I would've understood if I had used a different brand coilover and it had rubbed, since it may have not been designed with other coilovers in mind.

[lflkajfj12123]

Which is what? Shock/springs, kts, skinny coilovers? Whats it work with? Dude up there said they wouldnt work with Tein HE and those are ancient land before double ride height adjustable times. Those are the ''skinny shakochos.'' OP is havin trouble with the same brand coilovers as the arms. Exactly what is the limitation? They made a part that dont work and we bought it on faith.

What if auto makers never did recalls on faulty parts?

-4 is what you get when you lower the car on OEM arms. the aftermarket arms were made with correcting that problem in mind.

I know you dont see why the old ruca cant do -4 camber but that does not change the fact that they just dont. You also appear unwilling to correct your camber so the only other option seems to be try a new set of arms.

Our V3 ruca has much more clearance around the coilover because we designed them with consideration of compatibility with other brands of coilovers. I have a set of unpainted arms here you could try for free if you want.

read ????????????????????????? make sense now???

[LoanShark]

Im not heated. Im vexed. Im vexed like a maaafugga.

I got the v1 toe arms though. No problems there. They're the beef. It'll take ages to bend those suckas.

[stpnov73]

Is it possible that you are using an s14 ruca and not an s13? Most s13 rucas I've seen completely encircle the coilovers.

[brian m]

the product isn't defective it works perfectly fine within its limitations

the older design just can't do what the new design can

making it an OUTDATED product



So what you are saying is that the product isn't defective because it was designed to rub on the spindle and coilover? At not even full compression without a coilover, the arm shouldn't be contacting the spindle. Maybe, just maybe, that is why the newer versions are out...to correct problems that came up, not to make some new revolutionary type of arm that isn't supposed to rub.

You are right about one thing, "the older design just can't do what the new design can", which is to correct the camber while moving freely in the intended range of motion, making it defective, not outdated. I'm chaulking it up to bad design, nothing more.

The product is priced right, Dan is a good guy, I am cheap...but don't like it when something doesn't work right in the first place and get told there's nothing to be done. In the mean time, they turn around after more complaints from more customers to offer a "new and improved version" which should've been the first version. We just did their R&D for them. I don't like to bash a product or anyone, but when w00tang came here and proved to the world that the arms rubbed even on their own coilover setup, they offer him a free set of arms. oh well...

sorry w00tang for cluttering up your thread. s0ap...what's up with the anger?

[LoanShark]

Soap, you even have these? It dont matter what camber you run. You run -1, they still rub. You want -4 to fit wheels? You fucked, dun.

I had my car on a lift tryin to get them to fit. A ''lift'' is a step above jackstands. and guess what?

I'll tell you what. I contacted Alex. The end. Im just glad I wasnt the only one ''doing it wrong''

[lflkajfj12123]

not angry

the v1 arms like dan said were not intended to run excessive camber they're to be used for correcting negative camber

w00tang refuses to accept that and still wants to run -4 camber and dan being a bang up guy offers to give him a pair of the new v3 so he can run his camber with all the clearance he wants

which dan didn't have to do but did probably because w00tang has bought many of their parts and supported them (patting eachother on the back)

then you brian come in here complaining that he's getting a part hookup and you can't even get a discount for an upgrade, what kind of a slap in the face is that?

simple enough v1 WORK fine for correcting negative camber but not for running excessive camber like most of the people on zilvia want and get mad when it won't clear, as far as other rubbing issues it depends on the strut design

[brian m]

which dan didn't have to do but did probably because w00tang has bought many of their parts and supported them (patting eachother on the back)

then you brian come in here complaining that he's getting a part hookup and you can't even get a discount for an upgrade, what kind of a slap in the face is that?

simple enough v1 WORK fine for correcting negative camber but not for running excessive camber like most of the people on zilvia want and get mad when it won't clear, as far as other rubbing issues it depends on the strut design

V1 won't work fine if they rub the spindle when the suspension gets compressed, which is why it was corrected in V2. Not so simple is the fact that they put a product out there that isn't fully developed around the world, just for running their products without telling potential customers the problems they might run into.

Being a customer oriented business doesn't mean the customer pays the company to do the R&D for them and when they give the feedback, tell the customer to pay full price for the improved version, which is why a certain company gives the customer a 1 time upgrade.

s0ap...:love:

[LoanShark]

Yup, v1 are to be used with shocks and springs cause they wont clear old skinny coils and definately not the new fat coils like their own.

I remember when they first came out. They advertized the angle for more clearance and suspension geometry and whatever else for ''extra low cars''. Thats what it said.
I was like OH SHI- I NEED DIS.

Brian, we got punk'd.

[babowc]

Is it possible that you are using an s14 ruca and not an s13? Most s13 rucas I've seen completely encircle the coilovers.

btw..
PBM rucas are all "half-moon" styles.

s0apgun.. I want to run enough negative camber to fit my wheel/tire combo.. like LoanShark stated, they advertised the arms and coilovers for extra low applications. If I'm any lower from where I'm at, I'll be rubbing the shock casing, versus the collar. My car is currently pretty low too.. right about tucking a stretched 35 series tire.

[LoanShark]

Its a misunderstanding. s0ap thinks the only reason it rubs is cause we are all running -4 which would be hard in my case since the car was completely off the ground during a failed attempt to install. It rubs no matter what. End of story.
Unless you're on AGX/Sportlines. Then, they will fix your camber...without rubbing. Ooh bonus! :)

why am i so vexed? It was a (small) headache I could've did without.

[lflkajfj12123]

Its a misunderstanding. s0ap thinks the only reason it rubs is cause we are all running -4 which would be hard in my case since the car was completely off the ground during a failed attempt to install. It rubs no matter what. End of story.
Unless you're on AGX/Sportlines. Then, they will fix your camber...without rubbing. Ooh bonus! :)

why am i so vexed? It was a (small) headache I could've did without.

putting words in my mouth but k

[240sxScores]

Shouldnt they have found these issues in R&D before they decided to sell the V1's to public. Or maybe they did mock up using really skinny shocks. But they shoulda thought of other brands being thicker right. And i bought them because they were cost effective and advertised for super low cars and they were designed for cars with lots of camber right?

[DC Dan MAX USA]

nice job with the conspiracy theory guys

now settle down, dont get too ridiculous like Im not here all day long every day for the past two years servicing customers, listening and responding to their wants and needs, and constantly improving product based on those needs faster than any big company. I never claimed to have the perfect product, just trying to make a good stuff at a good price so take it easy. When it says were just a couple of drifters making parts that we want for our own cars its not marketing hype. MAX is not full of suspension engineers, it aint no damn corporation, we do learn more things as we go, we have our own ideas about the way we like things & we're not out to please everyone. If you're feeling our unique style and where we are going with things, thats great but if you're not you can buy elsewhere. No one can blame me for those things!


anyone who wishes to trade up from V1 to V3 camber arms can contact me for a reduced price

[aztek_s13]

^on your website it only lists a verII ruca and says nothing about applying to the s13 chassis. has a bunch of japanese stuff then s14,s15 and more japanese characters. is version 2 also version 3? and does this also apply to the s13 chassis? thanks

[scooby steve33]

shiiiiit i think i have brand new PBM V I and i was expecting to run tons of negative camber trying to fit a 13 inch wide wheel on a 50mm haha guess i better trade these bad boys in

[twentytwocpb]

correct me if im wrong but those look like s14 RUCAS

[nieko]

brooo they are for s13.

dont let the half moon decieve you.. lol

[scooby steve33]

haha the half moon is killing people