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View Full Version : Stop Breathing! You're endangering human health.


RJF
04-17-2009, 02:13 PM
This is assinine!

Greenhouse gases pose health hazard, EPA says - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/science/04/17/greenhouse.gas.hazard.epa/index.html?iref=newssearch)

aznpoopy
04-17-2009, 02:23 PM
which parts of the article do you believe are asinine?

RJF
04-17-2009, 02:29 PM
which parts of the article do you believe are asinine?

The whole thing. To believe that carbon dioxide is a pollutant and that humans can have any affect on climate is junk science.

The earth has been here millions of years and will be here millions more.

murda-c
04-17-2009, 02:30 PM
I think humans can affect climate, but i mean, i still run a test pipe because i'm a dick.

LongGrain
04-17-2009, 02:41 PM
i'm convinced you are an idiot.

mRclARK1
04-17-2009, 04:00 PM
Can we affect the climate? I think so.

Are we affecting it to the degree they claim? No, and many scientists think this way as well.

Just a little example of how DUMB some supposedly educated people can be though... In a discussion about global warming in one of my classes, a (IIRC) PhD student said "ALL CO2 emissions of any kind should be banned. Period."

Someone asked him about natural ones, and he said "Those as well, we should try to stop or control them as much as possible I think." blah blah blah

He didn't get it when me and a few other people told him to stop breathing.

Yes, you expel CO2. Lots of it and trees and plant life REQUIRE it to survive. You'd be amazed the amount of people who do not know this and just believe blindly it's the complete deadly poison to everything that it's made out to be. It's almost as bad as Dihydrogen monoxide...

LongGrain
04-17-2009, 04:07 PM
of course plants need C02 to respirate and create oxygen. but with the deforestation thats going on and the amount of CO2 being dumped into the atmosphere by industries and transportation there arent enough trees to absorb all of the C02, that has created a huge surplus of C02 which IS a greenhouse gas and is causing ill effects on the environment

If you dont think that human can impact the environment enough to change the climate you are an idiot. Climates are very delicate balances, it does not take much to disturb them.

aznpoopy
04-17-2009, 04:12 PM
The whole thing. To believe that carbon dioxide is a pollutant and that humans can have any affect on climate is junk science.

The earth has been here millions of years and will be here millions more.

on a macro scale it's not proven. that doesn't mean it's junk science. it means it's unknown.

on a micro scale you are completely and utterly wrong. just try visiting beijing for a week or two.

the only reason this article is asinine is because it tells us that these gasses in high concentration are hazardous to health, as if this is some grand revelation everyone has been waiting for. it's old knowledge; just a bunch of scare tactics.

ThatGuy
04-17-2009, 04:24 PM
It's all the terrorists fault. The gases expelled from people blowing themselves up are much worse than cars. Blame them!


Anybody have the numbers for the amount of destructive gases expelled from a NASCAR event? Let alone 43 high performance cars driving 500 miles in one spot, but all the cheering fans, their RVs, BBQ grills, and redneck beer farts must be harmful to the Earth. When will we start cracking down on them?

Both of these answers are completely ridiculous. If you take me serious, please run head first into a brick wall. Repeat as often as necessary.

Matej
04-17-2009, 04:26 PM
They should ban fertilizer.

I am tired of breathing it in when I go outside.

mRclARK1
04-17-2009, 04:40 PM
of course plants need C02 to respirate and create oxygen. but with the deforestation thats going on and the amount of CO2 being dumped into the atmosphere by industries and transportation there arent enough trees to absorb all of the C02, that has created a huge surplus of C02 which IS a greenhouse gas and is causing ill effects on the environment

If you dont think that human can impact the environment enough to change the climate you are an idiot. Climates are very delicate balances, it does not take much to disturb them.

Re-read my post. I never said it was not poisonous in large amounts. I agree deforestation is a huge problem. I've visited the amazon many times, and have seen entire areas cleared... It needs to be changed.

I think humanity can impact the environment, I just don't believe we have to the point that the global warming science claims, and as I said so do MANY other people and scientists (Climate experts, physicists, chemists etc... There's MANY out there and I know of a few at the university I attend)

You're calling me an idiot? I know the difference between the 0 key and the O key.

It's CO2. Not C02. What is C zero 2????

LongGrain
04-17-2009, 04:47 PM
Re-read my post. I never said it was not poisonous in large amounts. I agree deforestation is a huge problem. I've visited the amazon many times, and have seen entire areas cleared... It needs to be changed.

I think humanity can impact the environment, I just don't believe we have to the point that the global warming science claims, and as I said so do MANY other people and scientists (Climate experts, physicists, chemists etc... There's MANY out there and I know of a few at the university I attend)

You're calling me an idiot? I know the difference between the 0 key and the O key.

It's CO2. Not C02. What is C zero 2????

sorry i wasnt paying attention to how i was typing C OH 2

of course i know what C OH 2 is, i'm majoring in environmental sciences..

my post was not directed at you...

iwishiwas-all*
04-17-2009, 04:50 PM
this is NOT a cap on green house gases. all they are doing is setting a minimum MPG for cars. This is just a nice way of saying it because CO2 emissions are a direct function of MPG.

bla bla bla. thats all they are doing.
this is not about co2, its about cars, believe me.

S14DB
04-17-2009, 04:54 PM
OMG I just farted the Dem's are going to kick down my door and label my butt a gross polluter!

Matej
04-17-2009, 04:55 PM
What I do not understand is the individuals who actually seem to be fighting against reducing pollution.

Of course it may not be as bad as some say, but would it not still be nice to have cleaner air?

I admit the whole cleaner movement seems to be led by radicals who appear a little too extreme, which is only working against them, as I am tired of hearing them too. I believe there are more subtle actions that can be taken, without turning into hippies, or without ridiculous environment Nazi laws being enforced. However, that would take a more complicated solution, and it seems to be easier to just pass these burdens onto the people.

mRclARK1
04-17-2009, 04:56 PM
sorry i wasnt paying attention to how i was typing C OH 2

of course i know what C OH 2 is, i'm majoring in environmental sciences..

my post was not directed at you...

No worries. My apologies. I'm kind of on edge today... lolz

S13shaka
04-17-2009, 05:00 PM
The whole thing. To believe that carbon dioxide is a pollutant and that humans can have any affect on climate is junk science.

The earth has been here millions of years and will be here millions more.


yeah you know because the industrial revolution happened in 10 million BC

ThatGuy
04-17-2009, 05:05 PM
You want clean air? Move out of Cah-Lee-Ahh-For-Nee-Ahh and all the "major cities" across the US.

Seriously, they purposely burn the underbrush in the woods all over the coast here in NC. The air is still crystal clear, and but for the occasional "campfire smell" there is no "detriment" to the environment. Hell, the "campfire smell" is pretty nice every now and then. :ddog:

Big Cities are causing all this crap. If you can't see the sky for all the damn buildings, then there is a problem. Too many people in one area = BAD.

iwishiwas-all*
04-17-2009, 05:15 PM
yeah you know because the industrial revolution happened in 10 million BC



hahahahahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahaa.

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

hold on,

hahhahhahahahahahaahhaahhaha

lflkajfj12123
04-17-2009, 06:58 PM
http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/4839/troq.jpg

SexPanda
04-17-2009, 07:07 PM
meh, so what if we fuck up the environment... Live it up now, hopefully in a hundred years we'll have fucked up so bad that we will all die, and earth can start fresh. Im not too concerned. I'll be dead before this shit goes down, and the world will keep on turning. The universe will still be there, and if you believe in any religion, we'll be in heaven fucking their environment up too! lol

lflkajfj12123
04-17-2009, 07:19 PM
yeah you do that

make your children suffer

or are you one of the assholes that walk around with a cold shoulder and will never reproduce because there's no point anyways

EVERYONE IS FUCKED

flip3d
04-17-2009, 07:26 PM
RJF always starting shit :)

SR240DET
04-18-2009, 02:17 AM
Carbon is the world's best friend
By Wendell Krossa

A protest against carbon/CO2 cap and trade or tax proposals.

This summary is being sent to politicians, media outlets, scientists, and others across the world. It is a protest against the madness of anti-carbon thought and policies.

The Basic Science of Carbon/CO2: a brief summary
(Why are we trying to limit- cap and trade, tax- the basis of all life?)

All life is built from carbon. All life depends on carbon for its existence and functioning.

“All living things, starting at the cellular level which is common to all life, is based on carbon compounds, including the DNA that carry the gene sequences of the genetic codes. Of the trillions of cells in the human body, there is not one of them that is not made of 'carbon'"

(see article by Bob Brinsmead- The Vindication of Carbon- at Worldview 21 (http://www.bobbrinsmead.com). We subsist almost entirely on carbon dioxide. “The food used by all living things, to grow and to live, is carbon dioxide…food is carbon dioxide…the food of all plants and animals is carbon dioxide”

http://www.bydesign.com/fossilfuels/greening_benefits/miracle.htm

Everything is made of carbon and fueled by carbon. All things need carbon to grow and reproduce.

There is only one source of carbon for all life- CO2 in the atmosphere. Plants absorb CO2 from the atmosphere (“they consume almost entirely carbon dioxide for food”- (b y D e s i g n (http://www.bydesign.com)) and process it into carbohydrates for the animal kingdom. We get our food from this chain of CO2/carbon processing.


“The only gateway through which carbon can enter the food chain to enable the biosphere to exist is through the carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. There is no other way. It all starts with CO2 in the atmosphere. The entire chain of life starts with plants absorbing this entirely natural, colorless, odorless, absolutely non-toxic aerial gas called CO2…more than 90 % of the dry matter of plants is simply processed CO2. Whether it is a cow eating grass or humans eating cows, all are eating- and being fuelled- by processed CO2” (Brinsmead, The Vindication of Carbon).

Recent levels of CO2 in the atmosphere have been unprecedented and dangerously low. Plant growth shuts down at 200 ppm (parts per million in the atmosphere). Plant life is stressed and unhealthy at such low levels. Life evolved over the past 500 million years at levels of CO2 that were on average a more healthy 1500 ppm (see paleo-climate graphs at sites such as Geocraft.com). A dangerous upper limit of CO2 in the atmosphere would be from 5,000 to 10,000 ppm CO2 and Health (http://www.theroadtoemmaus.org/RdLb/11Phl/Sci/CO2&Health.html)

We are in no danger of approaching these high levels. Our atmosphere is currently “CO2 deprived”.

Plants and crops are healthier at higher levels of CO2 than are currently present in our atmosphere (now 386 ppm). They produce significantly more biomass, and are able to cope better with such natural vagaries as drought, heat, and cold http://uddebatt.com/2008/04/01/the-wonderful-benefits-of-CO2/ .

“More CO2 makes plants more resistant to extreme weather conditions…and this expands the habitat of many plants…and enhances agricultural productivity…and helps tropical rainforests” (National Policy Analysis #334: Carbon Dioxide is Good for the Environment - April 2001 (http://www.nationalcenter.org/NPA334.html) ).

Animals also survive better with more plant life. The small increase in CO2 over the past century has significantly greened the earth and this has increased populations in the animal kingdom. It has also enhanced the impacts of the Green Revolution with notably increased crop production which has helped to feed the poor.

Higher levels of CO2 in the atmosphere are more normal and natural.

Current world average temperatures are also abnormally low. Higher temperatures on an ice-free earth (a warmer earth) are more normal and natural (see paleo-climate graphs at Geocraft.com). We are in one of earth’s infrequent and abnormally cold ice-age eras (the past two million years). A warmer earth would be better for all life.

CO2 is not a pollutant but is a rare gas (1 molecule to every 3,000 molecules of the atmosphere) that is the essential food of all life. “All plants and animals are growing and living on a rare gas” (b y D e s i g n (http://www.bydesign.com)). And while there are other potential pollutants associated with fossil fuel use, CO2 and carbon are not among them.

CO2 does not cause dangerous global warming. Rising levels of CO2 follow warming periods and do not precede or cause warming periods. See the Vostok Ice Core research at CO2 Science (http://www.co2science.org/articles/V6/N26/EDIT.php) . Oceans, which hold 90 times the CO2 that is in the atmosphere, release CO2 as they warm and this increases atmospheric CO2 levels. The CO2 increases tend to lag behind warming periods by about 800 years.

CO2 is a tiny part of the greenhouse gases and the greenhouse effect ( Global Warming:A Chilling Perspective (http://geocraft.com/WVFossils/ice_ages.html) ). The warming effect of CO2 gets lost among other much larger natural climate drivers. Human emissions of CO2 are even tinier (1 part per 100,000 parts of the atmosphere) and a human fingerprint causing warming is even more lost among natural influences. The human contribution to climate warming, if it were statistically detectable, would amount to nothing more than “a fart in a hurricane”. Natural climate drivers with strong, clear correlations to warming/cooling periods include cosmic rays (see Henrik Svensmark’s The Chilling Stars), solar flare cycles, related cloud cover, ocean current decadal oscillations (changing current patterns), earth’s 100,000 year wobble, and others.

CO2 levels have been as high as 7,000 ppm in the past and no dangerous global warming occurred. During the Late Ordovician Period (some 400 million years ago) CO2 levels were 4,400 ppm and Earth was as cold as it is now. Note also that Earth has been cooling since 2002 despite the fact that CO2 emissions have been increasing. “There is no valid correlation between CO2 emissions and global warming”, concludes geophysicist Norm Kalmanovitch.

Therefore, there is no scientific reason for us to worry about contributing to increasing CO2 levels. We do not need to reduce our carbon footprint. We do not need to reduce CO2 levels in the atmosphere or decarbonize our economies. As the 31,000 plus scientists who signed the Protest Petition have stated,

“There is no convincing scientific evidence that human release of carbon dioxide, methane, or other greenhouse gases is causing or will, in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating of the Earth’s atmosphere and disruption of the Earth’s climate. Moreover, there is substantial scientific evidence that increases in atmospheric carbon dioxide produce many beneficial effects upon the natural plant and animal environments of the Earth”
( Global Warming Petition Project (http://www.petitionproject.org/) ).

To demonize carbon/CO2, as environmentalists have done, is to demonize life itself. This is ridiculous hysteria and entirely unscientific.

The only way to fully understand this anti-carbon movement is to recognize that it is ideologically-driven extremism now gone utterly mad. Its real goal is to slow, halt, and even reverse economic growth and development and it uses carbon as a proxy to fight growth and the human enterprise. But the Green movement in demonizing carbon has become anti-green, anti-life, and anti-nature.

Wendell Krossa [email protected]

YouTube - Scare (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvLt3nU14W4&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - Professor Fred Singer on Climate Change Pt 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnFfkwmg1K4&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - NOT EVIL JUST WRONG (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHMOEVRysWE&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - 35 Inconvenient Truths: Part 1/2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuHoTCsB3Vw&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - 35 Inconvenient Truths: Part 2/2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4gKy2GUoEw&feature=player_embedded)

Im with RJF. Open-minded people tend to see things for what they really are.

theicecreamdan
04-18-2009, 10:27 AM
The whole thing. To believe that carbon dioxide is a pollutant and that humans can have any affect on climate is junk science.

The earth has been here millions of years and will be here millions more.

WHen you think about HOW MANY of us there are (A lot more than 6 billion) and consider the fact that the earth could probably support somewhere in the 10,000 range of humans as "hunter gatherers" which is what we have been for several million years. Yeah I know we can effect the climate to the extent we do.

To the people that don't believe in science, what do you believe in? There's hardly another side on global climate change. Its happening, we are causing it. Nobody really knows whats going to happen when the climate does shift, but its probably going to be drastic and global society is going to change.

Matej
04-18-2009, 12:03 PM
YouTube - Scare (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvLt3nU14W4&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - Professor Fred Singer on Climate Change Pt 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnFfkwmg1K4&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - NOT EVIL JUST WRONG (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHMOEVRysWE&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - 35 Inconvenient Truths: Part 1/2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuHoTCsB3Vw&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - 35 Inconvenient Truths: Part 2/2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4gKy2GUoEw&feature=player_embedded)

Im with RJF. Open-minded people tend to see things for what they really are.
Haha, wow.

LongGrain
04-18-2009, 12:12 PM
WHen you think about HOW MANY of us there are (A lot more than 6 billion) and consider the fact that the earth could probably support somewhere in the 10,000 range of humans as "hunter gatherers" which is what we have been for several million years. Yeah I know we can effect the climate to the extent we do.

To the people that don't believe in science, what do you believe in? There's hardly another side on global climate change. Its happening, we are causing it. Nobody really knows whats going to happen when the climate does shift, but its probably going to be drastic and global society is going to change.

glad to see that not everyone is retarded.

SexPanda
04-18-2009, 01:38 PM
yeah you do that

make your children suffer

or are you one of the assholes that walk around with a cold shoulder and will never reproduce because there's no point anyways

EVERYONE IS FUCKED

lol it was a joke... prolly should have put jk in there somewhere in retrospect... Meh.

I try to do my part. I buy recycled stuff, I recycle cans, I dont throw trash out of my car at night even when I know there is no one around. RJF, I respect you views on most of the issues... But I can't deny that the climate is changing. Is it our fault? No one really knows for sure. Im sure we have sped things up... but it all was bound to happen anyhow. we're a strong species... We'll adapt to the change. It will suck, but if we can live through an iceage or two with fur coats and spears... we'll be fine.

lflkajfj12123
04-18-2009, 01:45 PM
its okay

i was just joking too haha

ESmorz
04-18-2009, 03:52 PM
or are you one of the assholes that walk around with a cold shoulder and will never reproduce because there's no point anyways

EVERYONE IS FUCKED

Yes

and

Yes

B82tuNuICTc

theicecreamdan
04-18-2009, 08:18 PM
"The gases -- carbon dioxide, methane, nitrous oxide, hydrofluorocarbons, perfluorocarbons and sulfur hexafluoride"

Only one of those is a product of breathing, another one comes out when we fart. So breathing isn't the danger to our health.

There's little doubt that humans will survive the change we're headed for. But I'm pretty happy with the way things are, and if it takes little changes in everybody's every day life then I'm willing to sacrifice.

To the people that refuse to change, change is going to happen, you might want to practice.

Matej
04-18-2009, 09:36 PM
To the people that refuse to change, change is going to happen, you might want to practice.
No, let them become extinct.

Although then they will probably get bailed out, like all the idiot homeowners, which will once again be completely unfair to the people who have been making sacrifices and doing things right.

napaKAliboog
04-19-2009, 10:07 PM
Contrails are starting to look funny nowadays...