100 octain street legal gas!!

[pinoydrifter]

Hello, I read about blue thunder 100 octain street legal gas, and wanted to know if anyone has tried it. If so.... do you feel a vast improvement over 91 octain? And is it worth $5.00 a gallon? Thanks for the help- cheers:cool:

[Yoshi]

do a search on "octane" and other such keywords. There was a big discussion a while back about octane ratings and how they do and do not help your car's performance.

GENERALLY speaking. Having an octane rating above the point where your engine knocks/pings will not help you car's performance, and certainly will not be worth $5/gal.

See if you can find the thread, it was pretty long as I recall, and had some very good info and details about why people use race gas, and for what applications.

[Yoshi]

Originally posted by James
Race gas can be bought at certain gas stations around most larger cities- has been for decades.
You don't understand that higher octane will do absolutely freaking nothing to improve performance on your car.
Unless:
it was an 1970's domestic running HORRIBLY to begin with or you have ADVANCED THE TIMING to make a slight increase in power using the higher octane.
Dang, glad me and YOSHI are on tonight to clear all misinformation/rumor about the "gas/octane" topics.

***Yoshi highfives James!***
***Yoshi sez: "Jesus I'm a dork"***
hahaha :D

[Jeff240sx]

You're getting had, hard, if you pay $5.00 for 100 octane.
There is a station in my LITTLE TINY TOWN, it's a Speedway, with 100 octane fuel for $2.99 a gallon. And yea, it's what I'm gonna use before I go to the strip.
Also, the higher the octane, the less the fuel consumption. There is a point of diminishing returns when you think about it that way. 100 octane will never make such a vast improvement in gas mileage to justify the extra cash... but 91 or 93 octane might. It does for me.
-Jeff

[Roly]

Phillip's 76 used to sell 96 octane at the pump in Baltimore called Race GT. There's a Shell that sell expired Av-gas at the pump here in Miami.

[Phlip]

And at any rate NONE of the 100 octanes you can buy are street legal, have you noticed that the nozzle is larger than the one in your tank? You either spill a lot or pump really slowly. Personally (Jeff, I told you this) I do the 100 octane av gas and take it to the strip and sell it, they charge 5.00/gallon for the same thing there...

[pinoydrifter]

Go to www.76.com click on products and services, then click on race gas.... scroll all the way down and read what it says! They make 100 octain street legal gas. Also they don't sell it at a pump. It comes in a large can. cheers-:D

[infamous240]

WOW there is lot of misinformation in this thread. Any car that uses a knock sensor to advance/retard ignition timing on the fly WILL see very good gains running race gas. Better quality gas = more timing. Supras see gains upward of 40 hp just by running race gas! You can usually run more boost as well, as long as you aren't out of the efficiency range of the turbo.

Legality = Leaded race gas is illegal for street use, unleaded is perfectly legal in most cities. Leaded race gas is usually higher octane but it will coat your O2 sensor, running the car for a while afterwards will usually clean it up.

[Jeff240sx]

Originally posted by infamous240
WOW there is lot of misinformation in this thread. Any car that uses a knock sensor to advance/retard ignition timing on the fly WILL see very good gains running race gas. Better quality gas = more timing. Supras see gains upward of 40 hp just by running race gas! You can usually run more boost as well, as long as you aren't out of the efficiency range of the turbo.

Legality = Leaded race gas is illegal for street use, unleaded is perfectly legal in most cities. Leaded race gas is usually higher octane but it will coat your O2 sensor, running the car for a while afterwards will usually clean it up.

I'm fairly sick of seeing people from BMW-land, Supra-land, Chevy-land, and others comming onto Zilvia, not knowing a damn thing about the KA motor, and saying that we're wrong because something worked on another motor. And don't go around Pointedly accusing people of misinformation.
The KA uses a knock sensor more as a diagnostic tool, rather than tuning. First, the KA doesn't advance the timing ever. It retards it. Running worse gasoline will cause the knock sensor to make the ECU retard the timing, thereby losing power, but higher octane won't cause an advanced timing. Also, the ECU goes into a closed loop mode, neglecting the knock sensor in the upper rpms (forgot where, but 5k or 5.5k rpm).
Anyway.. I'm glad the Supra gets 40hp running race gas. The KA doesn't. Not ALL cars with a knock sensor will.
Street legal doesn't mean that you can fill your tank with 100 octane. The pump nozzle is larger, and even at the tracks, the nozzle is too large to fit into the tank. At the track, they only sell you gas if you have a container to put it in, and like 5 gallons at a time. Street legal was the wrong word to use here... but it's impossible to fill your tank from the race-gas pump.
-Jeff

[Phlip]

Originally posted by Jeff240sx
I'm fairly sick of seeing people from BMW-land, Supra-land, Chevy-land, and others comming onto Zilvia, not knowing a damn thing about the KA motor, and saying that we're wrong because something worked on another motor. And don't go around Pointedly accusing people of misinformation.
The KA uses a knock sensor more as a diagnostic tool, rather than tuning. First, the KA doesn't advance the timing ever. It retards it. Running worse gasoline will cause the knock sensor to make the ECU retard the timing, thereby losing power, but higher octane won't cause an advanced timing. Also, the ECU goes into a closed loop mode, neglecting the knock sensor in the upper rpms (forgot where, but 5k or 5.5k rpm).
Anyway.. I'm glad the Supra gets 40hp running race gas. The KA doesn't. Not ALL cars with a knock sensor will.
Street legal doesn't mean that you can fill your tank with 100 octane. The pump nozzle is larger, and even at the tracks, the nozzle is too large to fit into the tank. At the track, they only sell you gas if you have a container to put it in, and like 5 gallons at a time. Street legal was the wrong word to use here... but it's impossible to fill your tank from the race-gas pump.
-Jeff
Amen

[infamous240]

Originally posted by Jeff240sx
I'm fairly sick of seeing people from BMW-land, Supra-land, Chevy-land, and others comming onto Zilvia, not knowing a damn thing about the KA motor, and saying that we're wrong because something worked on another motor. And don't go around Pointedly accusing people of misinformation.
The KA uses a knock sensor more as a diagnostic tool, rather than tuning. First, the KA doesn't advance the timing ever. It retards it. Running worse gasoline will cause the knock sensor to make the ECU retard the timing, thereby losing power, but higher octane won't cause an advanced timing. Also, the ECU goes into a closed loop mode, neglecting the knock sensor in the upper rpms (forgot where, but 5k or 5.5k rpm).
Anyway.. I'm glad the Supra gets 40hp running race gas. The KA doesn't. Not ALL cars with a knock sensor will.
Street legal doesn't mean that you can fill your tank with 100 octane. The pump nozzle is larger, and even at the tracks, the nozzle is too large to fit into the tank. At the track, they only sell you gas if you have a container to put it in, and like 5 gallons at a time. Street legal was the wrong word to use here... but it's impossible to fill your tank from the race-gas pump.
-Jeff


You want some cheese with that whine? :rolleyes: He never said he has a KA, and I never said a KA would benefit from race gas. Reading comprehension owns you. I said cars that use the knock sensor to ADVANCE/RETARD the timing. I thought that was pretty simple to understand. Get it now? At no point did I say "Every car with a knock sensor will make more power with race gas." Learn how to read.

It's pretty funny, but I've filled my car up numerous times with race gas WITHOT THE USE of a funnel because the nozzle actually fits. I didnt dispute that fact with you guys, because maybe where you live the nozzle is a different size. Here it isn't, at least not for unleaded race gas. Street legal is the term that was used, and after reading it again I believe that is what was meant. They are saying race gas isn't street legal (emissions related). I'm saying that the unleaded race gas is legal in my area. It's not impossible (at least in my area) to fill up with unleaded race gas directly from the pump, impossible is an absolute. If somebody does something just once, it's not impossible. People in my area pump race gas directly into their gas tank straigt from the pump.Therefore it isn't impossible, and it is legal.

I'm saying that the people spreading misinformation in this thread are wrong because their facts are INCORRECT. You want more misinformation spread throughout the 240 community? You don't think that you can learn anything from owners of other cars that you can use on your mighty KA? :bowdown: to Jeff240sx and his high post count. :rolleyes:

[pinoydrifter]

LOL..... I think someone just got told!!!:p :p

[Phlip]

Originally posted by infamous240
:bowdown: to Jeff240sx and his high post count. :rolleyes:
No actually bow down to the fact that time and time again he has proven that he knows what the hell he is talking about and always comes with more than just a facefull of personal opinion and "well the supra guys are..." every time...

[Jeff240sx]

Originally posted by infamous240

You want some cheese with that whine?
I had cheese with my Wheatables. It was Brie, and wonderful. Thanks.
I said that cars use the knock sensor to ADVANCE/RETARD the timing. I thought that was pretty simple to understand. Get it now?
Yea, I get it. You're still wrong, because the KA still doesn't advance the timing, ever. It only retards.
At no point did I say "Every car with a knock sensor will make more power with race gas." Learn how to read.
Great! And I just let people know that even though race gas makes power on a Supra, it doesn't with the KA.

To that whole middle paragraph: I tried sympathizing with you on the fact that "Illegal" was the wrong word to use. Also, in my area, and many others, the race gas nozzle is larger, like the diesel nozzles. Therefore, in FL (as far as I know, and at every gas station I've been to in FL) you cannot fill your tank with race gas, and it's impossible.

I'm saying that the people spreading misinformation in this thread are wrong because their facts are INCORRECT. You want more misinformation spread throughout the 240 community? You don't think that you can learn anything from owners of other cars that you can use on your mighty KA?
Bring up a specific instance of misinformation? Since you seem to be so picky on word choice, I won't say that your post was full of misinformation, but rather your incorrect-to-the-application statements passed as fact. Sure, we could all learn things from owners of other cars that we can use in the KA or SR application. It's done damn near every day. Take the turbo, for instance. It was used in aviation before the KA, or SR, or even the 2JZ. Nearly every engine is built using a tried-and-true method derived from other, previous engines. And aftermarket tuners take another step towards assimilation. But, in this one case, it doesn't transfer.
Cheers!
-Jeff

[pinoydrifter]

Jeff, you seem to know a lot about are cars.Thanks for all the info- Cheers!

[boosteds14]

i didnt read all the posts but higher octane gas is a safety barrier for detonation.

i use Sunoco 94 octane for up to 18psi and when i feel in the mood to boost more, Sunoco 104 octane UNLEADED for 26-28psi

if you intend to use high octane fuel, make sure it is UNLEADED or you will be replacing O2 sensors like underwear.

[Jim96SC2]

You change your underwear? What a concept. I should try that.

[litlespic]

Supras might gain 40hp from advancing the timing and did you forget to mention that most supras that will even come close to running race gas are turbo.. and will be able to run more timing/boost with more octane..??!?!!?!!? Im with jeff.. not becuase he is the almight but becaues he shot me down the first time I came in here with my turboford knowledge but lack of ka credibility..

This is the way I always look at octane.. you run the lowest grade you can get away with.. if your car pings with 87 run some 89.. if it still pings move up.. the lowest grade will burn the fastest.. so some say more hp's.. and that is what were all after isnt it??? I have always heard octane as being the ability to not combust with more temperature.. deisel fuel.. 40 something right?? doesnt need a spark.. just ignites with its 19.1compression and a fat turbo..lol.. race gas will let turbo's make more boost - hotter air.. with out ping... it will let you advance the timing.. if your knock sensor on 50,000 dollar cars doesnt do it for you...

The only reason I hear race gas is ilegal is becuase it is not TAXED... if the gas isnt taxed it is "off road" gas meant not driving ont he street.. if they are taxing the 100octane use it, advance the timing/boost and go..

[aeontony]

Or maybe it's back on topic, I dunno..

On the topic of knock sensors, does the SR knock sensor advance and retard? Or does it retard only as well? Thanks..

[infamous240]

At what point did ANYONE ask if race gas would help a KA specifically? You mean to tell me that people aren't using SR20DET's, RB25DET's, CA18DET's along with other motors in 240s?:rolleyes: Also, who are you to say what word the other poster should have used? Looks like they meant the word illegal, as that's what they typed.Or can you read minds as well? Oh, I know, you meant that race gas isn't supposed to be used on the street because the nozzle is bigger.

You said that it's IMPOSSIBLE to fill with race gas directly from the pump. Impossibly means that NOBODY ANYWHERE AT ANY TIME can do it. You were wrong. I've done it many times. That was MISINFORMATION. Want more instances of misinformation? Okay, here you go...

You don't understand that higher octane will do absolutely freaking nothing to improve performance on your car.
Unless:
it was an 1970's domestic running HORRIBLY to begin with or you have ADVANCED THE TIMING to make a slight increase in power using the higher octane.

and...

And at any rate NONE of the 100 octanes you can buy are street legal, have you noticed that the nozzle is larger than the one in your tank?

and...

Street legal doesn't mean that you can fill your tank with 100 octane. The pump nozzle is larger, and even at the tracks, the nozzle is too large to fit into the tank. At the track, they only sell you gas if you have a container to put it in, and like 5 gallons at a time. Street legal was the wrong word to use here... but it's impossible to fill your tank from the race-gas pump.

and...

No, you're the one spreading mis-information
Your reply has nothing to do with 240's since the KA ECU doesn't advance timing- right, so your WHOLE reply has no relevance to our cars. I find it funny actually- you come on here and start making accusations and showing off your automotive performance knowledge just to get shot down.
Supra's?!? Yeah, even if they can make 40hp by changing gas

and....

We were doing fine before you showed up.
All you've accomplished is spread a rumor that the KA can make mAD hoRSEpoWer yo, running race gas because supra's can do it.
I'm glad Jeff240sx was here to correct you.
:confused:




Looks like a pretty long list to me. I'm sure you'll continue to argue that I was wrong, in spite of the fact that nobody other than you specifically mentioned the KA. Duh, I know the KA doesn't advance the timing based off knock readings. Thank you, master of the obvious! Are you also going to point out other stimulating facts like it has four cylinders? :rolleyes:


I didn't realize I was on a KA only board.:(

[Jeff240sx]

Originally posted by infamous240
At what point did ANYONE ask if race gas would help a KA specifically?
I'm sure you'll continue to argue that I was wrong, in spite of the fact that nobody other than you specifically mentioned the KA.
I didn't realize I was on a KA only board. :(

Allrighty then. Since you are so swift to accuse me of not reading, how about I do the same to you. Go through, and read every post on this board for the past 2 years. Then you'll know why we are talking about a KA.
Who started this topic? Pinoydrifter. Who mentioned an SR, CA, RB motor? Nobody.
So, Pinoy started the topic, we answered Pinoy's application-specific question. His mod list reads as follows: "93 240 with aem short ram, hotshots header, greedy sp exhaust, plugs +wires, a 85 shot of NOS, and tein he coilovers," and since the HotShot headers were only available for the KA out of all those engines, he has a KA. That was taken from this post: http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18901 . Mabey if YOU would have read, then we wouldn't be argueing.
So, how about you just stop posting, because you are just proving yourself wrong.
You are so into pointing out incorrect words that are used. I corrected the "illegal" part for the sake of removing misinformation (which you are a fan of removing also,) and now you ask me "who I am to correct other people?" Yea? Then who the hell are you to correct me? Also, I can admit that I was wrong by saying "impossible," when it should have read "in many gas stations, their race-gas nozzle is larger."
Can you admit that other than those 2 words are the only thing that you are arguing for? Can you admit that for the KA application, we were correct and you weren't? Grow up and drop it. If you are going to bring in the RB knock sensor usage, I'll delete the post due to thread-hijacking. This is a KA specific question, and it has been answered. Drop it.
-Jeff

[infamous240]

ROFL! That's too funny. Good argument genius! "You are wrong, because you are new here and haven't read every post for the past year." Too funny. You were so quick to jump down my throat and wrongly so, and now you say I should have known what motor he has. HAHA!

[Jeff240sx]

Originally posted by infamous240
ROFL! That's too funny. Good argument genius! "You are wrong, because you are new here and haven't read every post for the past year." Too funny. You were so quick to jump down my throat and wrongly so, and now you say I should have known what motor he has. HAHA!

HOW THE HELL WAS I WRONG!?!?! Point it out? The guy has a KA, we answered for the KA, you brought up a damn Supra trick, and it doesn't work. Now you're ****ed at me for telling you that, and have no further business posting in this thread.
I have also added another paragraph to my last responce, 2 posts up.
-Jeff

[Yoshi]

Jeff, I know you're personally involved in this arguement, so it's a lil different, but shouldn't this guy's ridiculous factor be outweighted by your super mod status by now?

Seriously, It seems like he had valid points, as obviously you do, but his reply was slightly off topic, and most of this arguement since then is stemming from misunderstandings about the original question as it pertains to Pinoydrifter... too many tangents and now it's just gone too far, time for a lock ;)

[Dousan_PG]

thanks for the knowledge jeff240sx, james, yoshi!! you guys rule!

[ruf]

Everyone that has posted in this thread is retarded.

Oh wait...

[Phlip]

Originally posted by ruf
Everyone that has posted in this thread is retarded.

Oh wait...
Oh wait is right, only ONE is really retarded due to one simple rule...

http://uctf.org/ARGUING.JPG
ONE of us has been arguing based on personal opinion and newbie embarrasment, everyone else has done their part, including the moderator, who I can't IMAGINE why he hasn't locked this yet...

[pinoydrifter]

Dear everyone,
I don't know how to lock this!! Also thank you to those who responded in a positive manner. This website is for us to help each other out.... not to bite each others heads off!! I have said it once and I will say it again.... CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG?:D

[pinoydrifter]

Dear everyone,
I don't know how to lock this!! Also thank you to those who responded in a positive manner. This website is for us to help each other out.... not to bite each others heads off!! I have said it once and I will say it again.... CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG?:D

[Jeff240sx]

Ehh. I usually let people that have a problem with me post away, because it seems like the right thing to do.
Anyway, he hasn't posted in a long time, so I'm gonna lock it now.
-Jeff