roll cage options/89coupe

[christopher]

Does anyone have any good links for rollcages that will fit in an 89 coupe. I am very confused about a one thing too. I have seen on other forums that most cages wont fit a car with a sunroof, I have a sunroof. Do I need to worry about this in searching for one?

I am hoping that there are cages out there in the US, I am not just looking for a JDM cage like some do. Most importantly I want it to work not just look cool. I am planning on racing this car eventually and am trying to compile my parts list. Safety equipment is very high on that list so....

Am I stuck with getting one custom fabricated? If I am I have a whole other world of questions to ask.

I have posted this in a couple of different forums hoping for more anwers, so far nothing good. Hopefully better luck here.

Thanks.

[DSC]

1st thing, read the rule book before you do anything.

Yes, if you have a sunroof, the roof sits a couple inches lower so most (if not all) prebuilt cages won't fit.
IMO, custom is better anyway and i'd spend the extra $$ to get it done right.
If your going to race the car, you'll rip all the stuff out of your roof and seal the hole where the sunroof used to be so it won't matter anyway.
If your not (w2w) racing the car, then you don't want a cage but a 4 point bar. Your risk of injury in an accident on the street is actually higher when using a full cage.

hopefully that helped, and again buy a rulebook before you do anything.

[HippoSleek]

DSC is basically right. If you are planning on w2w racing the car, there are two ways to go - start building to a rule book now or just run a bar until the time comes.

Honestly, I know there are some pre-fab 4 pt. bars, but I don't know of any bolt in cages (a la Autopower or Kirk). Even as for bars, I've seen more custom jobs on 240s than bolt ins (they fit better and you can have one and keep a sunroof). Personally, I'd get a bar now and worry about the cage later. A cage is a big expense ($1500 for custom) and a big hassle for things like getting in and out of the car. A bar is totally livable, reasonably priced, and resaleable when you upgrade.

[Zemus]

christopher, IM FROM MN, you should Instant Message me, my sn is Zemus, i can hardly find anyone from MN on the forum other than Tnord, we should talk

[240racer]

Originally posted by DSC
If your not (w2w) racing the car, then you don't want a cage but a 4 point bar. Your risk of injury in an accident on the street is actually higher when using a full cage.


Why do you think that the risk of injury is higher with a cage. I figure, if you think a cage will help on the race track, it should help on the street too. In a way, it's W2W as well.

[DSC]

Originally posted by 240racer
Why do you think that the risk of injury is higher with a cage. I figure, if you think a cage will help on the race track, it should help on the street too. In a way, it's W2W as well.

Because you don't wear a helmet driving to work, and you can smack your head on the bar...doing more harm than good.

[240racer]

I hadn't thought of that, thanks. I wonder how you could remedy that. You should put roll bar padding on anyway, probably required in most every class of racing. What about if you are running with a 4pt harness and seat, that would hold you away from the bar pretty well. I am planning on having a cage in my car and also daily driving it. I have ridden in street cars with cages and didn't feel weird about it. I guess it's just more incentive to wear a seatbelt.

[hooter]

Also, if a race cage stiffens up the chassis, then obviously, the force generated by impact has to go somewhere if its not being absorbed by deformation in the chassis. Guess where? If you are not properly belted-in in a car with proper energy dissipating measures, then it potentially gets you in a bad situation. I will never let children ride in any car of mine equipped with a cage and I make sure that anybody who doesn't know racecars knows the danger of riding in such a car.

Car manufacturers like Volvo and BMW have special crumple zones/energy dissipating regions to deal with the issue of stiffer chassis. So do F1 cars and other purpose built racers.

-Charlie

[240 2NR]

hooter- keep in mind a roll bar (and mild roll cage, anything scene in a race car probably won't get driven on the street) generally maintains cockpit rigidity while still utilizing the standard crumples zones, meaning while the car may deform, the passenger area is more intact. It should technically be safer. The tradeoff being that since it is already an intrusion to the passenger space, it poses it's own danger if left unpadded. A survivable crash could potentially be life threating if a passenger should hit the bar directly with thier head, instead of a mildly padded headliner.

Personally, I'm tempted to get a roll bar from autopower for auto-crossing, yet almost want it equally for safety and rigidity (hatchback). So even if I never spent any more time on the track, I still think it would offer a few benefits. Especially now that SUV's are catching up with passenger cars on the road, and the trunk creaks like crazy in the winter.

[CoasTek240]

Originally posted by DSC
Because you don't wear a helmet driving to work, and you can smack your head on the bar...doing more harm than good.
I wear a helmet to work all the time.
In fact the guys in white make me wear a helmet at work... I ask them why but then they always hit me so i deal with it :(

[p_action]

yes...check your rulebook on whatever class you plan on racing... because there are a lot of outlawed rollcages. I know plenty of people who have a non-SCCA approved rollcage...doesn't mean it wont work, but there are some guidelines i would follow...personally i think the cage would be one of the last "mods" before you actually hit the track..

[sykikchimp]

Originally posted by 240racer
I hadn't thought of that, thanks. I wonder how you could remedy that. You should put roll bar padding on anyway, probably required in most every class of racing. What about if you are running with a 4pt harness and seat, that would hold you away from the bar pretty well. I am planning on having a cage in my car and also daily driving it. I have ridden in street cars with cages and didn't feel weird about it. I guess it's just more incentive to wear a seatbelt.


1st. Harnesses aren't legal for street use in most states...

2nd.. don't use a 4-pt harness in any situation where you think your trusting your life to it. Either get a 5-pt for the track, or use the 3-pt stock belt for street. Without the Sub-belt for the harness, you are risking submarineing (is that even a word..?) under the lap belt. Not a good situation if you can imagine. The 4-pt's are good for auto-x, but I wouldn't use them for anything else.

[hooter]

Originally posted by 240 2NR
hooter- keep in mind a roll bar (and mild roll cage, anything scene in a race car probably won't get driven on the street) generally maintains cockpit rigidity while still utilizing the standard crumples zones, meaning while the car may deform, the passenger area is more intact. It should technically be safer. The tradeoff being that since it is already an intrusion to the passenger space, it poses it's own danger if left unpadded. A survivable crash could potentially be life threating if a passenger should hit the bar directly with thier head, instead of a mildly padded headliner.

Personally, I'm tempted to get a roll bar from autopower for auto-crossing, yet almost want it equally for safety and rigidity (hatchback). So even if I never spent any more time on the track, I still think it would offer a few benefits. Especially now that SUV's are catching up with passenger cars on the road, and the trunk creaks like crazy in the winter.

Also keep in mind that crush zones do not absorb all of the energy in the event of a crash. A significant amount will still be transmitted to the frame/chassis itself. The less it can flex or buckle, the more energy gets transmitted to the occupants. I've been inside a car with a full cage in an accident and it was pretty rough even though accident speeds were low (~25 mph or so). I also remember Mike Kojima writing about a similar observations when he got into a minor accident with the SCC project 300zx.

Racing is dangerous and despite all of our precautions, there is plenty of room for disaster to strike. Driver skill and being alert will keep you from having to test out how well your safety equipment works.

-Charlie

[sL103]

With a roll cage atleast for NHRA the tube has to be at least .134" i think mild steel. that has the be the same thickness through out the of all the tubing. I know that though i think that withe SCCA they might be alittle thinner i guess?? Not sure with cars running under 13.00 a 4 point roll bar has to be in the car. but my question is does a roll cage have to be mandrel bent and are they mandrel bent. If that is the case when i get my 240sx i will be putting in a roll cage is well. if that is the case since im taking alot of welding classes i could then fabricate one for myself since i will have all the neccessary equipment availiable to me. SO i guess the good news if that is all true then i will probably fabricate a roll cage. if all goes well i will take pics and see if i can build them. ;-)

[240 2NR]

Originally posted by hooter
Also keep in mind that crush zones do not absorb all of the energy in the event of a crash. A significant amount will still be transmitted to the frame/chassis itself. The less it can flex or buckle, the more energy gets transmitted to the occupants. I've been inside a car with a full cage in an accident and it was pretty rough even though accident speeds were low (~25 mph or so). I also remember Mike Kojima writing about a similar observations when he got into a minor accident with the SCC project 300zx.

Racing is dangerous and despite all of our precautions, there is plenty of room for disaster to strike. Driver skill and being alert will keep you from having to test out how well your safety equipment works.

-Charlie

I'm not argueing with a full race cage. Theydo make for a very rigid chassis beyond the passenger cell by tying into supports past the firewall and into the trunk. I was refering to a roll bar or mild cage that only affects the passenger zone, which will only serve to strengthen the area around the driver, while leaving crumple zones fore and aft to absorb some of the impact. I stand by this.

There is no reason for a full race cage on a street car. In fact, it's prabably illegal. However a roll bar can be used quite easily in a mixed duty autoxer daily driver. I plan to do so in the near future and see only benefits (aside for the loss of storage capacity for very large items.

[Ecco Zero]

Ok, I'm starting to get lost. Some say this is good, others say this is bad. I'm in the works of obtaining a '93 240SX Hatchback maybe with a Sunroof. Amongst other mods I intend to get a Roll Bar/Roll Cage that will allow use of the back seat. I'm guessing it will be a 6 point, I'll get racing/street seats and a 5 point cam-lock harness with Roll bar padding. But from the way it sounds this is not a good idea, can some one clarify. Is this a good idea? Thanks.

Heres a Pic of the kind of Roll bar i'm looking at.
4 Point HB Roll Bar (http://www.driftfactory.com/images/CUSC220216E.gif)
Heres a link to the page.
Drift Factory (http://www.driftfactory.com/product_info.php?products_id=1339)

[justinhustle]

nice job you dumb ass troll

over 2 yr old thread

you suck at the internet


http://www.sopranosforum.com/images/tools/troll_2.jpg

[sdtouge]

would you rather him start a new thread?

[chokudoriS13]

I was going to say I haven't seen a new post from christopher in years... Turns out its an old thread :D.