Iran launches test missiles!

[beeracing s14]

Do you think another war is inevitable or shall we stay away from it by cutting Bush's trigger happy fingers? I just want to see what you guys or how you guys feel about the scary world we live in especially another jump in gas prices is expected. I might make an essay out of this from your inputs for my English class.


http://news.aol.com/story/_a/iran-test-fires-9-missiles-to-show-might/20080709062209990001

[status:one]

Very scary stuff.

[jrbump]

http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=202166

[lflkajfj12123]

silly newb premie

thats premie land only

[jrbump]

fuck, here I go again.

I always forget that part.

[YoungGun]

Uh oh.
msglenth.

[drift freaq]

Yes cut Bush and Cheney's trigger happy fingers. I would say leave it up to the Israelis but I know what they would do if it came down to it. It would not be pretty. The whole World needs to put pressure on Iran to stop the saber rattling. Though attacking them is not the way to do it. The Israeli will do one of two things. They will either feel enough provocation to attack preemptively to stop the Iranians immediately( they have done this in the past with Iraq under Hussein) or they will let the Iranians attack them and then blow them off the map.
Lets hope cooler heads in the world can prevail, after all North Korea did the same kind of saber rattling and we managed to calm them down without a conflict.

[97KATURBOSILVIA]

^^^^^^^^^ahhhh wishful thinking koreans' are inteligent and have a large part of there GNP earned here in the states thus they kept a cool attitude so we didnt close trade aggrement. Iran on the other hand has no reason to keep a cool head with the USA and why should they we just invaded there neighbor, but as you said I could use the break in gas so lets hope there not stupid. No matter who's in office next if Iran keeps it up th UN and other countries will most likely demand action from the next USA president.

[beeracing s14]

this maybe the only war that will get my vote but not by Bush. I dont know, for some reason when he is on the helm of this political foreign crisis, 20 of Pandoras boxes come loose. At the same time i wonder how Obama's art of peacekeeping can be achieved just by being in the peacetalk table. We gotta have someone smart to handle these things. Obviously, Iran just pulled his big guns to our faces.

[RiversideS13]

no good. I learned from my exgirlfriend (persian) that Iranian does not like American.....

[beeracing s14]

doesn't like American but like being in America.... to be jewelers or gas station owners..hahaha

[BustedS13]

okay, sure. no problem.
but if we ever have proof that they're testing nuclear:

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll240/mbest80/Metallica-kill-em-all.jpg

[corriganjoshua]

http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=202166 I think this has already been covered.

[status:one]

Iran on the other hand has no reason to keep a cool head with the USA .

I think by shutting off oil to the United States it would mean they would lose their biggest buyer of crude oil and therefore lose money. right?

[ESmorz]

I think by shutting off oil to the United States it would mean they would lose their biggest buyer of crude oil and therefore lose money. right?

I'm sure China, India, or Russia would jump right on that for the right price.

[beeracing s14]

China and India are around the corner and the Arabs think they are have more potential to be the next largest crude oil buyers.

[status:one]

I'm sure China, India, or Russia would jump right on that for the right price.

China and India are around the corner and the Arabs think they are have more potential to be the next largest crude oil buyers.

Good points.. .

[Brian]

hmmmmm.

I think the world is on thin ice right now.
It is pretty sad.

:(

[downshift_sideways]

You need to see the big picture!

Us national debt is 7.7 trillion dollars.

The entire country is 43 trillion dollars in debt with banks that are collecting interests each day. If the petro dollar collapses intrests rates will rise...and it will set national bankruptcy. We'd have to switch into euro little by little. The U.S economy will be set back permanently. The U.S.have always had a firm hand on it's oil dollars.

Saddam Hussien was using euro to sell oils. The U.S. was in threat. Iraq exported about 3.3 billion barrels of oil(2003). We bought 2.5 billion (2/3rds) but we had to pay him in euros. The federal reserve can not print Euro's. So we had to sell GM's to europe for good and services for us to buy the oil.

President bush had no choice but to invade Iraq because the petro dollar was collapsing. Now that we are in control of the oil in Iraq. We needed to convert the Euro transaction back to the Dollar, because we have to fix our debt. Euro was about 17% more of the U.S. dollar in 2003.

Now the petro dollar seems to be safe..

but Iran announced that in 2006 that they were setting up it's OWN oil trading exchange and reformating it back to the Euro Dollar.

This is bad news for bush..and for the american dollar.

This is the same scenerio that happened in Iraq.

Here comes Iran.

However Iran is double the population of Iraq. and states it can have 17 million ready soldiers within 48 hours, along with European intellegence supporting them.

WW3 soon. Very soon.

Saudia arabia which has the worlds largest oil reservess..is showing intrests to converting it's currency to Euro.

The U.S. NEEDS to do something..or were doomed.

Were already in debt...

[cuddlesthesheep]

http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=202166 I think this has already been covered.


and the fact that that thread is for premium members has also been covered. Thank you for playing.

[ESmorz]

Quick!

Convert all your bank monies to Euros now.

Might not be a bad idea... ha

[downshift_sideways]

^A lot of American's are doing that, as we speak.

[ESmorz]

^A lot of American's are doing that, as we speak.

Well it only makes sense.

Sure you may take a loss, but it's better than the huge one you will take when the dollar goes Zimbabwe status.

[beeracing s14]

how can i do that?

[VAs13]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=161_1215614440

[downshift_sideways]

Check this link out.

Is shows who uses the U.S. dollars, and who uses Euro dollars also the up to date currency.

http://coinmill.com/EUR_USD.html

As mentioned in every thread about our nation.

We the people are weak, and very stupid. Lots of people don't know what the fuck is going on.

besides OMG! 240sx partts! Honda Parts! Clothes! Music! I got a good Job!

were just paying of the debt our government made..our entire lifes...then we die.

and everything is hidden from our own eyes.

I stand strong when I believe 9-11 was a government plot to invade iraq. Read what I posted before..it makes sense.

[drift freaq]

Check this link out.

Is shows who uses the U.S. dollars, and who uses Euro dollars also the up to date currency.

http://coinmill.com/EUR_USD.html

As mentioned in every thread about our nation.

We the people are weak, and very stupid. Lots of people don't know what the fuck is going on.

besides OMG! 240sx partts! Honda Parts! Clothes! Music! I got a good Job!

were just paying of the debt our government made..our entire lifes...then we die.

and everything is hidden from our own eyes.

I stand strong when I believe 9-11 was a government plot to invade iraq. Read what I posted before..it makes sense.
Anthony you know you have a negative outlook on this country as it is. Which totally discounts your statements because they are based on a anti United States bias to begin with.
Your entitled to your opinion but I feel its completely off base. Its not as simple as you try to make it out to be. If you follow the financial markets and the technology markets like I do you would not be making the statements you have made in this thread.IMO.
The money situation is down but its not as dire as that site paints it out to be. The world financial markets still follow the lead of the U.S. dollar. If you did more than just read that site you would know that. Try following the financial markets on a daily basis. I do.

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

Check this link out.

Is shows who uses the U.S. dollars, and who uses Euro dollars also the up to date currency.

http://coinmill.com/EUR_USD.html

As mentioned in every thread about our nation.

We the people are weak, and very stupid. Lots of people don't know what the fuck is going on.

besides OMG! 240sx partts! Honda Parts! Clothes! Music! I got a good Job!

were just paying of the debt our government made..our entire lifes...then we die.

and everything is hidden from our own eyes.

I stand strong when I believe 9-11 was a government plot to invade iraq. Read what I posted before..it makes sense.
you're 100% correct. And that's the exact reason why we need to drill in the US or start converting to alternative fuel.

[DohcKA]

Check this link out.

Is shows who uses the U.S. dollars, and who uses Euro dollars also the up to date currency.

http://coinmill.com/EUR_USD.html

As mentioned in every thread about our nation.

We the people are weak, and very stupid. Lots of people don't know what the fuck is going on.

besides OMG! 240sx partts! Honda Parts! Clothes! Music! I got a good Job!

were just paying of the debt our government made..our entire lifes...then we die.

and everything is hidden from our own eyes.

I stand strong when I believe 9-11 was a government plot to invade iraq. Read what I posted before..it makes sense.

thats wassup... a lot of the young dont know whats goin on... they need to open their eyes.... its all about the benjamins bro.....

you're 100% correct. And that's the exact reason why we need to drill in the US or start converting to alternative fuel.

ding ding...

[drift freaq]

^^^^^^^^^ahhhh wishful thinking koreans' are inteligent and have a large part of there GNP earned here in the states thus they kept a cool attitude so we didnt close trade aggrement. Iran on the other hand has no reason to keep a cool head with the USA and why should they we just invaded there neighbor, but as you said I could use the break in gas so lets hope there not stupid. No matter who's in office next if Iran keeps it up th UN and other countries will most likely demand action from the next USA president.

Ah your forgetting. The Korea that basis's a large part of their GNP on trade with us is South korea.
The Korea that was saber rattling and trying to launch successful continental Ballastic Missiles is North Korea like I stated. Two completely different countries. One is a democratic country the other is a Dictatorship. We do not do tons of business with North Korea we do with South Korea.

[bamaboy]

i'm not reading this whole thread right now....but we should go ahead andlaunch real missles and not hold back........it could be our 51st state

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

i'm not reading this whole thread right now....but we should go ahead andlaunch real missles and not hold back........it could be our 51st state

It's a very volatile part of the world over there. We attack them, they'll try for 100 years to pay us back x2. It'll never end. In the end, it comes down to oil that could be obsolete in as few as 10 years. There's so many types of alternative types of fuels that we are choosing not to utilize. We just need to come to the realization as a country that transportation is not worth the deaths of our troops. And I'm not saying that we'll ride bikes. We have the capability of running on corn, so why don't we?

[murda-c]

because then someone could pwn us with herbicidessss

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

because then someone could pwn us with herbicidessss
I heard that Bush is going to try to attack Alaska. He said that the Alaskans throw terror snow balls with grenades in them. Terra

[Brian]

because then someone could pwn us with herbicidessss

This comment made me want to mention something.


You know how the USA had that tomato (recall) thing recently.

Imagine how terrible it would be to poison so much of our food/water. That could happen with NO missiles or bombs.

This shit is so real....

:/

[2Slow40]

I say we just ignore them.

Why do we gotta worry about Iran having weapons? Just don't fuck with them and they (hopefully) wont fuck with us. That's what I say.

[shade]

Quick!

Convert all your bank monies to Euros now.

Might not be a bad idea... ha

I don't know if you're joking or not but I think that idea is stupid and anti-American. You're just bringing the power of the dollar down as well as our country in that process meaning that we'll start burning our Dollars like the Germans after WW1 with their Marks to cook food.

http://www.usagold.com/images/hyperinflation.jpeg
http://img.tfd.com/wiki/c/ca/Inflation-1923.jpg

[downshift_sideways]

I say we just ignore them.

Why do we gotta worry about Iran having weapons? Just don't fuck with them and they (hopefully) wont fuck with us. That's what I say.

Why ignore them? 60% of the worlds oil passes through the middle east.

They are threatening Israel. Israel are allied with us.
They attack them, we step in sadly. Israel does have it's own bombs to retaliate.

Israel already asked the U.S to stop their studies of WMD (weapons of mass destruction)before the next presidential election... they want to attack and disable their testings.

We need to take precaution to allow them to even produce WMD's.
The entire world is watching them.

I agree with you driftfreaq, I'm sure you've been watching the worlds finances before I was on earth.

You've study finances. I lean towards democracy

The U.S have always dictated what goes on in the world.

Shade: since 2003; foreign exchange from the dollar to euro has gone up by %25. It's hapening.

[ESmorz]

I don't know if you're joking or not but I think that idea is stupid and anti-American.


Of course it was a joke.

I'm way to lazy to do that.

:bow:

[shade]

Is their a clear majority of nations wanting to shutdown Iran? I don't really watch the news anymore. I mean I don't think world leaders wouldn't want a nation such as Iran to be parading around with WMDs to scare people around the globe.

But the again, it wouldn't probably matter since we're probably going to invade their country anyway. I also wouldn't be surprised if the draft is put back into effect since troop levels are at all time low.

[downshift_sideways]

^Do your research homeskillet ;)

I watch world news, new's paper and it's a hobby to know whats going on in the world I live in.

[rb25_s13*CHUKI]

Fuck all i got to say is fuck........

[ronmcdon]

I don't know if you're joking or not but I think that idea is stupid and anti-American. You're just bringing the power of the dollar down as well as our country in that process meaning that we'll start burning our Dollars like the Germans after WW1 with their Marks to cook food.


Not sure if it's anti-american, but certainly not stupid. With the way the value of the US dollar dropping so fast, it's totally understandable to invest at least a portion of your savings in another currency that shows more stability than that of the dollar.

In equity trading, seldom would you invest just in one stock. Likewise, I think its also risky to have all your saving in a single currency. If I had enough saved up, I would probably consider buying some swiss francs or english pounds. Euro could be a questionable investment at the moment. It's already so expensive.

[ryguy]

Drilling for oil in the United States is all smoke and mirrors. The world's major oil companies all have leases to drill on land in the United States, including land TOUCHING the ANWR. They have held these leases and have had permission from Congress to drill for oil for in some cases 30 years. They are hoarding this land until the price is at it's pinnacle. If you want something to really be done, the best solution in my opinion is "socialized oil". If the government, at one level or another, controls production of drinking water, why not have government subsidized drilling and refining? With our current dependence on oil, it might as well be as vital as water.
http://resourcescommittee.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=389&Itemid=1

And to anybody ready to go to war with Iran, enjoy your toilet paper dollars. We can't afford to keep our global empire anymore.

By the way, we don't even import oil from Iran.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/data_publications/company_level_imports/current/import.html

[downshift_sideways]

Iran and saudia arabia own most of the worlds supply of oil.

We are barely hanging in there ..with chevron and Exxon.

http://www.powerlineblog.com/OilChart9.jpg

[ryguy]

Let me say this again.

Iran isnt even on the top 15 list of exporters to the United States.

[downshift_sideways]

^I never mentioned exporting, but thanks for re-stating that ;)

I believe Canada and Mexico is The U.S's biggest exporters last time I checked.

[drift freaq]

Drilling for oil in the United States is all smoke and mirrors. The world's major oil companies all have leases to drill on land in the United States, including land TOUCHING the ANWR. They have held these leases and have had permission from Congress to drill for oil for in some cases 30 years. They are hoarding this land until the price is at it's pinnacle. If you want something to really be done, the best solution in my opinion is "socialized oil". If the government, at one level or another, controls production of drinking water, why not have government subsidized drilling and refining? With our current dependence on oil, it might as well be as vital as water.
http://resourcescommittee.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=389&Itemid=1

And to anybody ready to go to war with Iran, enjoy your toilet paper dollars. We can't afford to keep our global empire anymore.

By the way, we don't even import oil from Iran.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/data_publications/company_level_imports/current/import.html

Sorry but socialization of any industry does not work. If you looked at China and at the Former Soviet Union you would see the problems that socialized industry creates. Look no further than the U.S. postal service if you want to see how poorly a socialized industry works. LOL

Oh and drilling in the U.S. is not smoke and mirrors , its about enviromentalists going to far and block drilling and construction of refineries. I am all for a clean enviroment but when it comes down to saving a stupid little bird for the sake of sacrifing our country? Sorry the bird loses.

Congress has not approved drilling in ANWR or the coast of California or the Eastern Seaboard all which have proven reserves that if they had started drillng ten years ago would have kept us out of the current situation. I should also add that none of you seem to be aware of or paying attention to these two facts as well.
1. The United States is severly lacking in refining capacity because we have not built a refinery in this country for almost 20 years.

2. The current costs of Oil have less to do with whats going on Iran or supplies, rather its a effect of speculation on the commodities market here in the U.S. by commodities brokers.

Now a Few things about this just to bring some of you up to speed. First off Oil is a non renewable commodity. Yet because the SEC relaxed commodity trading under the the current and previous adminstration. Oil can now be traded in SPDR's. What is a SPDR? Its a encompassing group of companies or commodities that can be bought or sold as a whole thereby diversifying ones iinvestment.

Now the problem with Oil being in a a SPDR is the fact that its grouped into a SPDR with renewable commodities i.e. soybeans, corn, etc. Now being as it is non renewable commodity it should not be that way as those are controlled by the fact of being renewable. Which means prices can be driven up on them in futures but the amount of next years crop could control the rise. Though Opec can increase production though we can increase production its not the same. There is only so much oil and growing demand. We cannot grow more oil.

Now because of these things the current commodities traders are driving the price of oil through the ceiling only in the name of profit. I have been watch these guys talk about these prices for months with glee and smiles. They don't care they are getting rich. The same thing happened in the Dot com boom. The same thing happened in the Currrently imploding Real Estate and Real Estate loan market. Mark my words Oil prices will not sustain the highs without coming plummeting down. It will happen and I hope some of these jack asses lose their shirts for the sake of their greed. Is amazing that they were not phased by Irans launching of missiles today. Normally they would have been speculating the price up by several dollars based on todays news. Of course we will see tomorrow morning. Though usually they latch on to any little event to drive the price up.

Oh and they are always willing to blame it on supply and demand because they don't want to be perceived as raping the public for their own benefit. Hmmmm kinda like how Enron and El Paso energy and half a dozen other Texas and out of state energy companies gamed the California Gas and Electric market. They all denied it to the hilt even to the Federal Government but then when Enron fell apart it all came out in the court papers. LOL.

Yup we are being played by the Commodities market and the brokers and the Bush adminstration is doing nothing about it.

We should be drilling off the coast of Santa Barbara more than we currently are. There is so much oil out there that it seeps out naturally. If you have ever gone swimming in the Ocean off Santa Barbara you get tar on your feet from the natural oil seepage. Pump that shit out man!

Oh and I should add I am all about developing alternative sources of energy though we cannot automatically just stop the use of oil. We have not made enough progress in other areas to do that yet. Also for any fool that says we should increase corn ethanol thats bullshit and an economic boondoggle! Corn ethanol production severely depletes land from food production and drives the price of food up. Both in converting land that could be used to grow food stuffs and taking feed corn that would be used to feed livestock off the market. Its pure bullshit pushed on the American people by the farm states overly strong farm lobby and the Bush adminstration using it to look politically correct.

[ryguy]

Congress has not approved drilling in ANWR or the coast of California or the Eastern Seaboard all which have proven reserves that if they had started drillng ten years ago would have kept us out of the current situation. I should also add that none of you seem to be aware of or paying attention to these two facts as well.
1. The United States is severly lacking in refining capacity because we have not built a refinery in this country for almost 20 years.

Mark my words Oil prices will not sustain the highs without coming plummeting down. It will happen and I hope some of these jack asses lose their shirts for the sake of their greed.

If you read the article from the Energy Committee, they claim there are YEARS of oil that can be legally and easily pumped from American land, but the oil companies are not pumping it. That is the purpose of the "use it or lose it" legislation that had been introduced to Congress regarding that land. We dont need to open up the wildlife reserves, there is already accessible oil that is not being utilized; I do recognize the refining capacity is not there though, I have no argument about that.

On another note, I am not in any way saying it isnt going to happen, but how do you foresee the oil bubble bursting? I know there have been articles on this but I have not read any.

[mRclARK1]

IIRC the "newest" refinery in the US is almost 30 years old actually.

I agree with about 98% of what drift freaq said. Something that really needs to get started is oil development within the US and its offshore resources. The US has the capacity to be self sufficient (or at least to a large extent) for oil and gas, but isn't for no other reasons then political ones. The number one customer of Canadian oil and gas is the US. Reserves in Canada are immense and thousands of sources haven't even been tapped yet, let alone ones that haven't been discovered.

I doubt they magically stop at the US/Canada border.

As far as oil being a non-renewable resource? I don't know. If it really is truly "fossil fuels" Well, that seems like a LOT of fossils we've gone through already. Also, many scientists out there question whether oil is actually even formed the way that is generally accepted. A russian (I think he was russian) geologist proposed a theory, after finding evidence, that oil could possibly be created right below us by geological processes within the mantle of the earth. A lot of what goes on down there is well out of our sphere of knowledge. Who knows what resources might be forming slowly 300 miles beneath our feet that will eventually find it's way up to where we can dig it out? I just can't believe how it's still so generally believed and assumed that oil is basically old dinosaurs (cause again... that's A LOT of dinosaurs) and will eventually run dry, when there's much evidence to the contrary about the nature, processes and formations of oil within earth itself.

[drift freaq]

If you read the article from the Energy Committee, they claim there are YEARS of oil that can be legally and easily pumped from American land, but the oil companies are not pumping it. That is the purpose of the "use it or lose it" legislation that had been introduced to Congress regarding that land. We dont need to open up the wildlife reserves, there is already accessible oil that is not being utilized; I do recognize the refining capacity is not there though, I have no argument about that.

On another note, I am not in any way saying it isnt going to happen, but how do you foresee the oil bubble bursting? I know there have been articles on this but I have not read any.

You read about this stuff but you do not follow markets? Markets are cyclical they go up they come down. A bubble is when there is over speculation in a particular market. Quite often these bubbles in are based on different types of speculation. You live in City that has quite a mercantile exchange you should study it.


In the Dot com boom the Internet stocks were way over valued. The Stocks were speculated up on expectations and not true earnings. In fact several of the so called darlings had no earnings and came crashing down.

In the real estate market people took out variable rate mortgages that would reset in two years to higher interest rates betting on the fact that since home values were rising they could refinance based on their increased equity. When the market leveled off people discovered they could not afford the increased interest rate because their home had not appreciated enough and they did not have enough equity to refinance at a lower rate. Defaults started to happen. you also had people that treated their homes like banks taking out 2nd or 3rd mortgages against their equity and spending it on vacations and boats or cars. When their equity did not rise it was like just spending the money and winding up with the bill afterwards.

The Oil market is usually driven by supply and demand. Now the funny thing is their is no oil shortage currently and there has not been one since the 1973 OPEC oil embargo. The shortage in 1979 was created by the oil companies to drive the prices of oil up for profits. I worked for Shell in 79 they were holding tankers off the coast just so prices would go up.
Now currently none of this is happening. In fact there is plenty of Oil and its not risen nearly as much in other parts of the World as it has in the United States. Why? Because of the commodities market speculators I outline in the previous post. That is essentially the creation of a bubble.

The Current cost of oil is not based on a Supply and demand issue its based on a speculated market issue. Therefor Oil is currently overvalued any smart economist will tell you that. It should be about $80-90 a barrel not the current $136 todays rate which I might has already come down off the high of $142 set a couple of days ago.
Now given that its only a matter of time before certain factors cause the bubble to burst. Things that could aid it would be the U.S. opening up its strategic oil reserve which is at full capacity right now and selling some on the world market.Drilling U.S. fields that are not being drilled. Taking efforts to stabilize the dollar. Citizens cutting back on driving to the point of 10% which would cause a significant reduction in the use of refined products which would cause a reduction in used oil. In the 73 crisis Americans curtailed their gas usage by almost 30% it had a profound effect on Americas consumption of oil and brought Opec to the bargaining table. If we did the same today. It would bring the commodities speculators to their knees and drive down the price of oil and gasoline. The biggest travesty of all of this has been how Bush and his administration have sat idly by doing nothing. They don't even talk about conservation.

[Omarius Maximus]

Iran's main problem is Israel. To this day, I'm absolutely dumbfounded as to why my tax dollars are used to purchase bigger tanks for the Israelis.

[Matej]

To this day, I'm absolutely dumbfounded as to why my tax dollars are used to purchase bigger tanks for the Israelis.
Sadly it's because many of the influential people in America are Jewish.


I don't know if you're joking or not but I think that idea is stupid and anti-American.
Anti-American? Maybe? But would that be your main worry if your family was about to loose everything?


Check this link out.

Is shows who uses the U.S. dollars, and who uses Euro dollars also the up to date currency.

http://coinmill.com/EUR_USD.html

As mentioned in every thread about our nation.

We the people are weak, and very stupid. Lots of people don't know what the fuck is going on.

besides OMG! 240sx partts! Honda Parts! Clothes! Music! I got a good Job!

were just paying of the debt our government made..our entire lifes...then we die.

and everything is hidden from our own eyes.

I stand strong when I believe 9-11 was a government plot to invade iraq. Read what I posted before..it makes sense.
I agree.
Though I don't think people are stupid, just ill informed. The U.S. media is very one-sided, and the government being really secretive and shady doesn't help. We don't get to hear any of the other viewpoints since America is so far away from the rest of the modern world, unless you really make an effort to search for more news to help you create an objective opinion.


I say we just ignore them.

Why do we gotta worry about Iran having weapons? Just don't fuck with them and they (hopefully) wont fuck with us. That's what I say.
I agree with this as well.
Is Iran attacking America? No. So why is everyone so worried about it? It should only be your problem once Iran threatens America. Stop living in frear.
If America didn't mess with anyone in the first place, people wouldn't have a reason to hate it. Do you constantly hear about Norway for example? No, no one has a reason to hate it, nothing happens there, they worry about their own problems, and it has one of the highest living standards in the world.
Executing Saddam was so pointless, it was mainly only done to make people feel better about the war. Freeing the Iraqi people? Yes he was a terrible person, but the average Iraqi's life sucks now compared to how it was before the war. Iraq is a wild country, it needed tough leadership to keep it in check. If Saddam was in charge, Iraq and Iran would be occupied with each other. Let the middle east sort out its own problems, only step in if they become a threat to your own country.
It makes me so mad how the government thinks how they're the rightful owners of all the world's resources or something. They assume they have the right to build military bases on other people's lands, and when a country refuses they make them look like an enemy of world peace, while obviously the government only uses world safety as a cover for its selfish gains and an excuse to build up arms and defenses because they're constantly paranoid and afraid of everyone.


Sorry, I was trying really hard to stay away from this thread, I have so many things to vent, it's tough keeping them bottled up.

[TheWolf]

Do you think another war is inevitable or shall we stay away from it by cutting Bush's trigger happy fingers? I just want to see what you guys or how you guys feel about the scary world we live in especially another jump in gas prices is expected. I might make an essay out of this from your inputs for my English class.


http://news.aol.com/story/_a/iran-test-fires-9-missiles-to-show-might/20080709062209990001


I believe this post was about missles.... not exporting petrolium. Does anyone actually know what these things are?? These things are like model rockets gone bad.

People act like Iran is testing ICBM's and getting good results. The sharam3 is basically a North Korean Derivative of the SCUD except with liquid propelant. Second they only have 15 engine for them reportedly and have test fired 5. None so far have been considered successful. Basically the problem is this. This missile requires the projectile to do short low orbit. When the projectile leaves the rocket, it doesn't spin like a riffled bullet but instead tumbles. This leads to damage on re-entry (control fins fly off) and the projectiles error ratio skyrockets. If everything goes to plan and it does spin, these things are accurate enough to drop a 2000lb conventional bomb within a 2km radius guesstimate zone. If they tumble like most test have shown. They end up wherever. This tumbling was the reason most patriots could not get hits during the first gulf war because they were erratic. The new pac3 which is now 1/5th the size and 3x as agile make that look like shooting fish in a barrel.

"If kmart was a weapons dealer. They'd sell the scud missle. See it's kinda like the smart bomb except you fire it out of the trunk of your car... then run home and turn on cnn to see where it landed." - Sam Kinison

[YoungGun]

LOL at the advertising in this thread.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b304/cruizer123/imgad.jpg

[LeftNutOfGowd]

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg246/rborroel21/funpics39-21thumbnail.jpg

..........DONE and DONE

[DohcKA]

you really gotta research a lot of ish yourself because a lot of the major corps who own the oil companies also own most of what is aired on tv.... we live in a controlled environment.... there is no way that they are not hiding anything from us because they only want us to believe what we seee

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

you really gotta research a lot of ish yourself because a lot of the major corps who own the oil companies also own most of what is aired on tv.... we live in a controlled environment.... there is no way that they are not hiding anything from us because they only want us to believe what we seee

and that's why the internet is so important. I honestly believe that GWB would have been known in a different way than he's known today. Even McCain has the "old republican ways" of thinking. He makes a statement, is recorded saying it, then when he's asked a question about the statement he says that he never said that. That's the old way of thinking. That's why the internet is so important because the internet cannot be controlled.
Damn, someone needs to photoshop a picture of a monster and on the bottom is says "the internet cannot be controlled". Do it Zilvilians.

[Gnnr]

The Current cost of oil is not based on a Supply and demand issue its based on a speculated market issue. Therefor Oil is currently overvalued any smart economist will tell you that. It should be about $80-90 a barrel not the current $136 todays rate which I might has already come down off the high of $142 set a couple of days ago.

But isn't the fact that the dollar is worth less, so it takes more dollars to buy the same barrel at the same price the real problem? On top of that, the same barrel hasn't stayed the same price.

[SlideWell]

By the way, we don't even import oil from Iran.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/data_publications/company_level_imports/current/import.html

Bingo mssglgth

[downshift_sideways]

Laser Defense PWNS!

(if you guy's havent seen this..cool watch)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=nVxZ9IHTH2E

[Farzam]

Most of my family lives in Iran...I just hope they're safe if anything goes down.

I've never had a problem over there with being from America

People are always like "whoa that's so cool"

[flip3d]

Move away from the coast and pray that our ballistic missile system works.

[drift-it]

I heard that our second biggest importers to the us of oil is canada besides what we produce. Maybe not. I want an electric drift car.

[downshift_sideways]

Fuck gas and electric cars..

I'm buying one of these bad boys. Fuck the bullshit::
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s115/dybombom/Running_Horse.jpg


That's whatsup.

[2Slow40]

Fuck gas and electric cars..

I'm buying one of these bad boys. Fuck the bullshit::
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s115/dybombom/Running_Horse.jpg


That's whatsup.

Lower that and get some shoes with a better offset, shit'll look reaaaal nice.

[SimpleS14]

WW3 is on the horizon...i always had thoughts that it would start in the middle east. I guess I better get ready for a draft or hope I get to schooling (MBA) so I don't get drafted ha

I've never had a problem over there with being from America

People are always like "whoa that's so cool"

I think there is more to it then just being from America. Looks and your behavior factor in as well.

[canuckster240]

its funny how people have a problem with another nation that is not US friendly having technology or weapons, yet the US has the most weapons in the world and is the one that uses those weapons the most, hell even the most nuclear armed nation on earth and the only nation on earth to have obliterated a civilian population with nuclear arms.

The US and israel are constantly provoking iran, iran has a right to defend itself.

The US and israel are nothing but warmongers.

Also Israel is the only country in the region armed to their teeth with latest American weaponry and weaponry of their own.... and the only confirmed country with nuclear weapons in the region. Israel is also the most violent and aggressive in the region by constantly suppressing a native people, having been imposed by western colonial powers.. and despite international criticism (which is just a game) continues to occupy and malign the region with funds from the west most specifically now the United States (billions upon billions of free dollars 'aid')

And what do you expect? Bad mouth them like "baaad iran baaad baad" and then threaten them, threaten them.... threaten them some more, put sanctions on them, talk shit about them, provoke them, poke them, take away their rights, call them names, prevent them from progressing without the mighty american dollar overseer (eg; developing technology by themselves not taking from the US, its own systems, etc... in this case eg; nuclear energy technology).

THEN AGAIN threaten them, threaten to invade them, provoke them, make such statements as "we will obliterate them" (israelis said this), uuuuuuuh yeah DUMB ASS, they'll want to defend themselves. "Pre-emptive" is more of abullshit newage newspeak of "we'll fuck em up and invade regardless of what anyone says" what rubbish.

[DohcKA]

haha neg rep me all you want for a weak post im not stress... all this is just the internet to me... if you didnt like my opinion or what i had to say... then so be it... it doesnt hurt me much besides now i get some neg rep... yes.. i score

[bamaboy]

It's a very volatile part of the world over there. We attack them, they'll try for 100 years to pay us back x2. It'll never end. In the end, it comes down to oil that could be obsolete in as few as 10 years. There's so many types of alternative types of fuels that we are choosing not to utilize. We just need to come to the realization as a country that transportation is not worth the deaths of our troops. And I'm not saying that we'll ride bikes. We have the capability of running on corn, so why don't we?


not trying to start an e-fight to see who's cock is bigger but you have several misinformed statements here.
1. Oil will never be obsolete.....sorry, that just isn't going to happen. Biggest reason is we will never run out of it, no matter what some people may think.
2. Our country does not have the ability to run on corn, hence the reason for the rising food prices, added importing of material (corn) to make ethanol, rising corn prices due to speculation very similar to crude oil, and the fact that the land, infrastructure, and availability of vehicles capable of using the ethanol, are all so scarce.

America's energy policy dicatating that we have to use a certain amount of corn based ethanol by a certain year is both foolish and irresponsible. Our country always puts the carriage before the horse.

So, try that arguement again.

[iluvpandas4]

All this information I keep finding and learning about US oil companies jacking up our oil prices for profit and controlling the US just makes me mad. I mean I've done the research and from what I've found I believe it but when I try to spread the word no one wants to listen because it's not what the "news" tells them on TV. Just because the news is telling them we need to invade here or there, they buy it all up and say we need to for the oil. People really need to stop being ignorant in this country or else we'll come crashing down. All this news really just depresses me because when I learn about and want to spread it no one seems to want to listen, which makes me hopeless for this country's future.

[sillyvia13]

http://a695.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/102/l_e27f7874d309dd58c375a3bb5d5dcf2e.jpg
Slide or DIE.... in IRAN!
whenever, whatever happens...I Gonna make it rain on dem hoes. qouted from a zilvia member...lol...

We as a people of USA got stuck in front of the boob tube for too long! I am GUILTY OF IT MYSELF! and things gone undetected for to long...
911, or rights, our water (flouride), list goes on... The Govt cares about us. oh wait I meant! about $$$... they wanna bank and let us FREE people break OUR BACK TO CARRY THEM!
Enough is enough.

[sillyvia13]

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg246/rborroel21/funpics39-21thumbnail.jpg

..........DONE and DONE
This might be accurate.???
Never know with US? USA.

[cgtdream]

its funny how people have a problem with another nation that is not US friendly having technology or weapons, yet the US has the most weapons in the world and is the one that uses those weapons the most, hell even the most nuclear armed nation on earth and the only nation on earth to have obliterated a civilian population with nuclear arms.

The US and israel are constantly provoking iran, iran has a right to defend itself.

The US and israel are nothing but warmongers.

Also Israel is the only country in the region armed to their teeth with latest American weaponry and weaponry of their own.... and the only confirmed country with nuclear weapons in the region. Israel is also the most violent and aggressive in the region by constantly suppressing a native people, having been imposed by western colonial powers.. and despite international criticism (which is just a game) continues to occupy and malign the region with funds from the west most specifically now the United States (billions upon billions of free dollars 'aid')

And what do you expect? Bad mouth them like "baaad iran baaad baad" and then threaten them, threaten them.... threaten them some more, put sanctions on them, talk shit about them, provoke them, poke them, take away their rights, call them names, prevent them from progressing without the mighty american dollar overseer (eg; developing technology by themselves not taking from the US, its own systems, etc... in this case eg; nuclear energy technology).

THEN AGAIN threaten them, threaten to invade them, provoke them, make such statements as "we will obliterate them" (israelis said this), uuuuuuuh yeah DUMB ASS, they'll want to defend themselves. "Pre-emptive" is more of abullshit newage newspeak of "we'll fuck em up and invade regardless of what anyone says" what rubbish.

THANK YOU SIR!!!!

Isreal started this whole cockshow because they realized that IRAN is going to become a REAL power in the middle-east..even if it isnt much of a power, it is more substantial than what they are now..and isreal and bush know that...nukes? Where is the proof? News networks can gloat all day about the possibilities, yet no solid evidence(and even if there is, still no threats for the north korea..? only more money and aid that is just goign to get abused to a regime that hates us even more and is more than willing to attack americans?)...North korea has evidence for weeks and years, yet no plans of attack for them..even with the huge troop inplacement on the border...Oil...that has been convered enough already, im not giving myself carpel tunnel trying to type all of what there is to say on that..need proof...start with reading EVERYTHING on the first site i list

http://www.rokdrop.com = just a good read even if you disagree with what i have to say (lots of info on korea)

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-30.htm = read last paragraph

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,133899,00.html = who started this cockshow first again?

Basically we also must remember that Iran and Isreal hate each other...Isreal knows it cant fight iran by itself, and wants to drag us into the fray, but do we really need to fight on another front? Ionno, my worries lie there....

[cgtdream]

and that's why the internet is so important. I honestly believe that GWB would have been known in a different way than he's known today. Even McCain has the "old republican ways" of thinking. He makes a statement, is recorded saying it, then when he's asked a question about the statement he says that he never said that. That's the old way of thinking. That's why the internet is so important because the internet cannot be controlled.
Damn, someone needs to photoshop a picture of a monster and on the bottom is says "the internet cannot be controlled". Do it Zilvilians.

Btw they are trying to control the Internets....sad but true....

[sillyvia13]

Btw they are trying to control the Internets....sad but true....

trying...they are...
but it is like trying to clean up a ghetto, with a push broom...aint gonna happen.
look at ron paul, most favorite on web, most money from troops. and he is outta of race. why? oh yeah... this game is fixed.
We are controlled. some what.

[canuckster240]

lol I laugh now at all those who were emotional over clinton/obama race, now that true colors have shown they are practically sleeping in bed with one another.

http://www.changethethought.com/obama/24x36/jpeg_previews/obama_24x36_5e.jpg

American naive public = 0
The elite that control the world n yer moniez = 1

You've all been punked hahaha... sadly.

http://appraisalnewsonline.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/punked.jpg

Obama was THE most loudest supporter of Israel EVER, as seen in the latest kissing ass with clinton at the last AIPAC meet.

Obama was the first also to threaten to bomb pakistan unless it 'changes'. So make that another country the US will invade in the to do list.

We're all actors on a world stage.

[sillyvia13]

^ funny you say actors//
I been telling people I think obama is a actor...he is so fake.
and mccain is half dead...I think he is dead pastey white...the probly radio control him from that cave in Colorado...
I am so happy to see the world slowly waking up to this! YIPPIE!
I have been called many things for seeing this before others...but shits real

[canuckster240]

Here is more liberation soon coming to a theater near you (eg; cnn, fox, etc.. oh wait they dont show this): Iran: The Iraq sequel related to the afghanistan prequel and the post-sequel triology pakistan:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v707/calpouya/Iraq/qaaa.jpg

Yeah I'd be pretty pissed too if some random stranger from a thousand of thousands of miles away messed with my country, bombed it, etc... raped my women and children, pissed on my religious institutes, burned my religious books, did skull graphity, played heavy metal music while acting like murderous idiots enjoying killing, stole my property (eg; oil), burned my land, destroyed my infrastructure, culture, civilization, etc... too

http://www.islamicmediacity.com/cms_files/news_images/1213021900.jpg

So yeah and by the way:

http://buntnessel.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/slowmogenocidebmp.jpg

^It's even less now, the israelis have subjugated and occupied more of the muslim and christian arab lands.

Also don't forget the attempted invasion and occupation right here:

http://media.npr.org/programs/morning/features/2007/may/six_days_war/mapafter.jpg


That should put some historical perspective into all this repetitive warmongering of israel and america and why everyone is pissed at both other than of course the supportive and naive American civilians who believe whatever the tube says.

[downshift_sideways]

Funny thing..is that this entire thread is old news.

But I'm glad a lot of members are learning about whats going on...and how it affects us one way or another.

[hassanbakar123]

this is what money does


Free Palestine

[cgtdream]

I was just thinking the samething downshift....
There are more and more americans that are wiser than we would think on our own, and this thread proves it...not thinking big-headedly or nothing, just an observation, that americans are somewhat becoming wiser to the world...even if its still just a minority of us.....

[canuckster240]

Here's another I found, back and forth struggle with the occupation:

http://apjp.org/storage/palestine_olmert_plan_maps.jpg

http://www.quakerpi.org/QAction/Loss-of-Palestinian-Land-mapcard.jpg

as stated before its a back and forth thing, theres tons of new settlements israel has forcefully built since so this in itself again is out of date, its a big joke... but very sadistic.

Historically the jews were actually welcomed by the local arabs muslim and christian alike, but factually there was little to no jewish present as they most migrated across europe, russia, etc... and even prior to world war 1, the zionist movement began an exodus of jews from russia into palestine by the thousands, slowly but slowly, then took advantage of the circumstances of the holocaust and exploited the situation with the aid of the british and french and ultimately americans... and the 'league of nations' which is nothing but a masonic charade for the new world order.

[TravisSW]

Sorry, I don't have anything really constructive to add here except:

While reading this thread, I saw this ad:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/Paranoia2MB/zilviaadlol.jpg

HAHAHAHA

[downshift_sideways]

Just an update.

Iran launched more missles dispite being under the worlds eye.

They have missles capable of hitting Israel from their firing locations.

This is a bluff game right now.

U.S. says they will not hesistate to support and aid our allies.

Iran shoots missles to show they will continue expanding their capabilities of longitude and distance of missles.

Israel are conducting flight operations showing that they will take out all research facilities if any forms of attack are made.

No news from russia yet...All we know is that they are supporting Iran's research.

[canuckster240]

This just in, the US bombed the crap out of some place you didn't even know. The US launched bombs, rockets, missiles, whatever.

Wow... okay.

[fliprayzin240sx]

Ah fuck, and im getting deployed...YES great time to be in fucking IRAQ this time of year!!! Hopefully my wife wont be watching the news anytime soon...

[Koopa Troopa]

Score, I'll be in Iraq again this Spring. Shit yeah! Fuck you Iran!

[Edgar]

I'm totally like anti-war because of our economy right about now, but honestly if these mothafu^*@$ got some shit going we need to be like "bitch, put them away or we are going Compton on your asses"

Period

No need for this kind of shit right about now.

[beeracing s14]

im completely out of the service. with my 2 discharge papers from active duty and reserves. But I may have to volunteer my ass back if this shit poses a threat to this nation. I wonder if ill get a new GI Bill again?

[canuckster240]

lol all the comments above are hilarious. You guys talk about Iran as the boogie man, then you yourself are hypocritically ironic talking about how armed to the teeth and rage filled for war you are.

YEAAH LETS BOMB IRAN YAA YAAA YAAAAAAAA (#@#)((#@)(##!!!!!

Retarded.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/26/world/middleeast/26baghdad.html?fta=y

Oh wait 8 civilians were killed by US soldiers? Who cares, they are just some iraqis riiiiiiiight lets defend mother russia i mean usa. What's also ironic is how the US 'defends' itself by bombing the crap out of, attacking other continents/countries and no one ever fights in the US, other than of course when you had your own in fighting amongst yourselves historically; the civil war.

I'm sure we're next down the line eventually, but we have our own traitors in canada who are selling canada to the US.

[canuckster240]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwwMF6biCJU

[canuckster240]

Nothing but animals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SDfG0WQyqg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoJHTuP7Lh0


If you want a ticket to hell, be my guest

If you are people with any consciousness you would not fight for the US, if you are going there because you are 'broke' you are nothing but a low life who can't get a real job and instead resorts to being a murderer and in some cases thief or rapist for money.

[Mi Beardo es Loco]

well think about Iran. Saddam drove right through Iran, so we had to step in and calm the wave and stomped Iraq's "army." If Iraq could do what they did to Iran then the Iranian war won't last long. Then again, Afghanistan is becoming more and more of a threat since the prison break. We might want to pay more attention to Afghan sands than Iranian.

[fliprayzin240sx]

Eh, I see every reason for Iran to be pissed off. We pretty much got them surrounded from both sides and everybody else around are allied with us. The problem lies in what each side thinks the other is going to do. We think that if Iran gets nukes, itll fuck up Israel. Iran thinks we want to go in and take their oil (we probably do), and waiting for an excuse to do so. But either way its a fucking stalemate. I dont think Irans stupid enough to nuke Israel on a whim, they need a pretty big reason to do so. Now if Israel decides to go in and attack Iran, thats gonna be the opening for this shit. I think we should make sure Israel does NOT do anything fucking stupid. If they attack the nuke plants, we're gonna get sucked into it. Iran will attack Israel and probably do a pre-emptive strikes against our bases in Iraq, Afghanistan, Qatar, Kuwait, and UAE, which will pull us into a war with IRAN. If Iran attacks our bases in Qatar, Kuwait and UAE, now everybodys gonna gang up on Iran. Russia will more than likely side with Iran since they support them with weapons, China too and World War III has officially began...

Shits better than Days of our Lives in premise and I get a front row seat in Balad!!!

PS: Im sick and tired of some people in here making the military the fucking scapegoat for this shit. I'm going out there to do my job. Yes its a fucking job (Satellite Communications, I could make more outside but I like my job, thanks. Its not always about money...). What I do is no fucking different to what you guys do in your cushy jobs. Dont gimme that crap how Im in the military so I fucking support murder and rape bullshit. If you wanna play that BS, well who the fuck do you think funds us?!?! You pay taxes dont you??? We have no control over the politics that sent us there...you wanna blame somebody, blame the people who chose to let this whole shinanigan happen...

[raz0rbladez909]

If you are people with any consciousness you would not fight for the US, if you are going there because you are 'broke' you are nothing but a low life who can't get a real job and instead resorts to being a murderer and in some cases thief or rapist for money.

You have a lot of nerve to go out and call people low lifes by making assumptions about them by the job they do, did i have a job before i joined, you're damn right i did. I joined because i wanted to do more than average joe on a daily basis, will you ever work on a multi million dollar aircraft ever? I highly doubt it; and don't try to make it seem like we have no consciousness about fighting for our country, you see some videos online and its like you are so pursuadable its rediculous. Calling people murderers/theifs/rapists is a bold accusation especially one made by someone who just goes by what he reads or hears online, I don't go to your job and smack the broom out of your hand. ;) BTW Canada is right along side us down at our bases so save your anti-America bullshit for somewhere else.

[canuckster240]

All I'm saying is, you are trying to escape the bullet and blame someone else, when in fact you are very much a part of the formula. It's like saying I didn't kill, it was the gun I held that killed.

You very much are responsible for all that's being done and have no excuses for it, you are in fact the primary connection, to the acts. You are the executor. No matter what, if someone tells you do such and such, you are the sole responsible one for choosing the choice of executing the action. You can not say well our government, our commanders, our so and sos made us do it. You chose to do it, you chose to be in the army as well. It is not conscription or mandatory or forced upon you. It was and is your sole choice.

Sorry to say the one who's brainwashed about reality is not me because I 'read something on the internet' (that's quite an assumption in itself), rather I am informed of the facts. You are a low life, if you consciously accept this war and all it's sub-actions, consciously.

Yes there are murders, massacres, rapes, killings, theft, destruction, setups, coverups, torture, the whole shabang. I could make a whole list of shit for you. Of course you'd try to excuse yourself by talking about how baaad the rest of the world is.

I just showed you ONE video of soldiers enjoying themselves destroying a mosque. May they be cursed for being such animals, yup I said it. Low lifes. But who cares? It's a mosque. Right? It's them not 'us'.

And lastly, you are being quite hypocritical, armed to the teeth and hungry for a fight. You are the very thing you accuse others of (who are actually only defending themselves). Iran has every right to defend itself. And so does the rest of the world. The US thinks it has the right to do whatever it pleases because "wez got zee gunz".

[ericcastro]

WHO FUCKING CARES !!!

Are we the only country that can have any sort of modern weapontry??

Of course other countries are showing a little bark. We went after a terrorist and decided to take over an entire country, throw it into a social war it will never recover from, and dont answer to anyone. So of course they are trying to show a little power and scare us a touch.

I fucking would!!!

The US policy on shit is similar to a pirates code of conduct. Do what ever you want, take what you want, kill who stand in your way.

I can't believe we would have the odasity to think we have the corner market on weapons technology!

[90hatchie]

oh man barrys gonna have a ball on canuckster
most of the admins and mod's here are in the military

[mRclARK1]

I still don't really see anything much happening here. Iran won't make a first strike, they know that would be suicide, and several of their allies would likely not follow them on that one. Israel won't pre-emptive strike without a very good reason.

Yes, they have struck first in the past. But the situation was very different. Ships were blocked from entering the Suez Canal by Egypt and cutting of significant shipments to Israel. Egypt also had massed 100,000+ troops and several armored divisions at the border with Israel, with Syria and Jordan doing the same, all coinciding with large contributions of troops and loans of equipment from other nations such as Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Tunisia, Morocco and Algeria. Only a total moron would not see what was coming. Also, after the conflict (The Six Day War) the US put siginificant diplomatic pressure on Israel to return much of the occupied land they seized after winning (quite handily) the conflict. So don't think the US invariably ALWAYS backs Israel.

While some missle test may get things a little jumpy, I don't see Israel striking until either Iran fires first, or an attack is obviously and undeniably imminent.

Oil doesn't even really factor into it as very little of the oil exported from Iran ends up in the US in the first place. I actually think a small part of the reasoning behind Bush wanting to lift the ban on offshore drilling is to deflect the accusations of any military action (if it became necessary) being about securing Iranian oil resources. Not to mention, and military action would very likely only involve airstrikes on targeted facilities and areas, not a complete occupation. It's not necessary or wanted for the reasons at hand.

oh man barrys gonna have a ball on canuckster
most of the admins and mod's here are in the military

I'll be the one to say that's not likely since it wouldn't do any good. Once you've run into a few people like that, you realize realize you're just wasting your breath. He's entitled to his opinion.

Others of us are entitled to think it's completely bias and wrong.

He's basically displaying the attitude a lot of Canadians have (not a majority, but enough) that anything American is inherently evil and can't come up with more then a few youtube videos (Like most things on youtube, with no context at all really) of bad apples within the American military and insults to back anything they say up. I'm not saying shit like he's talking about never happens, but unlike people like him, most people see it as the exception and not the rule.

[2Slow40]

Is it possible for the American people to stop the government from going to war with another country? Can we vote or do something to actually make the government stop?

Say the President comes on and says "Iran attack so and so, we're going to war." Can the American people say "No we're not."

[sillyvia13]

Is it possible for the American people to stop the government from going to war with another country? Can we vote or do something to actually make the government stop?

Say the President comes on and says "Iran attack so and so, we're going to war." Can the American people say "No we're not."

thats whats supposed to happen. reps are speaking for the people, but how many people talk to reps.

f'd in the a.

[beeracing s14]

China cant join Iran...Walmart will close their doors on them. LOL!

[raz0rbladez909]

All I'm saying is, you are trying to escape the bullet and blame someone else, when in fact you are very much a part of the formula. It's like saying I didn't kill, it was the gun I held that killed.

You very much are responsible for all that's being done and have no excuses for it, you are in fact the primary connection, to the acts. You are the executor. No matter what, if someone tells you do such and such, you are the sole responsible one for choosing the choice of executing the action. You can not say well our government, our commanders, our so and sos made us do it. You chose to do it, you chose to be in the army as well. It is not conscription or mandatory or forced upon you. It was and is your sole choice.

Sorry to say the one who's brainwashed about reality is not me because I 'read something on the internet' (that's quite an assumption in itself), rather I am informed of the facts. You are a low life, if you consciously accept this war and all it's sub-actions, consciously.

Yes there are murders, massacres, rapes, killings, theft, destruction, setups, coverups, torture, the whole shabang. I could make a whole list of shit for you. Of course you'd try to excuse yourself by talking about how baaad the rest of the world is.

I just showed you ONE video of soldiers enjoying themselves destroying a mosque. May they be cursed for being such animals, yup I said it. Low lifes. But who cares? It's a mosque. Right? It's them not 'us'.

And lastly, you are being quite hypocritical, armed to the teeth and hungry for a fight. You are the very thing you accuse others of (who are actually only defending themselves). Iran has every right to defend itself. And so does the rest of the world. The US thinks it has the right to do whatever it pleases because "wez got zee gunz".

Who the fuck am i blaming genius? You hold yourself so high and mighty in saying that everyone in the military is a bad apple, all you have done this entire time is generalize. You can fuckin bitch and moan all you want about what has happened but you can't put that shit on me, I haven't raped, pillaged or plundered anyone or anything in my line of duty. Hell my birds do SAR, Vertrep, SPECWAR, and humanitarian aid as well, and I'm sure you have no idea what those are. Don't go spouting off bullshit about people you don't know, thats like me saying all Canadians are douchebags like you when I know that is far from the truth. You're so smug about yourself and putting blame on people you don't know, I work my ass off and get paid probably half as much as you for twice the amount of hours. I swore to defend my country against all enemies foreign and domestic, and you know what i plan to uphold that promise. Yeah some fools out there will be like "I quit" but all you are doing is taking the easy way out, then they bad mouth the country they served for because they stuck them in the sandbox for longer then they were told when they joined. We'll whoop de doo "What better way to make myself look good then by badmouthing my own country in public for my own gain." It happens so often its rediculous, "We know the truth about 911." what fucking truth, some shit some conspiracy theorists told you. Because the first people I'm sure they would tell is some basic Army Infantry dudes (no offense if anyone out there is Army) who hold no security clearance :rolleyes: :rolleyes: If anything like that was true it would've been leaked out long ago, why would Osama take credit for something he didn't do?
Use some common sense, your opinions are still biased and I'm sure nothing will change that because of you being a douchebag and all. It will be a funny day when the U.S. saves your ass and you start talking about how great the U.S. is. You will do nothing but bitch and moan in your next post and I will laugh about it once again, until then go fuck yourself.

[canuckster240]

lol osama never admited in doing 911, it was pakistan's busharaf government that hinted at that, and the US sent ISI (paki secret service) money.

The only video where osama 'admitted' or whatever was that fake ass video. That was the sole real 'proof' that made the united states and it's citizens and military up in arms for going into afghanistan. More than half of the world knows it was a bullshit fake video, and any idiot who can't distinguish between a brown sikh guy, indian hindi guy, muslim guy will fall for an actor like that just as some people can't distinguish between black people's different faces. The guy in the video looks nothing like frickin osama, it's a fake. That was the proof for beginning this whole 'war on terror' and going into afghanistan.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/osamatape.html

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/osamatape2.html

http://911blimp.net/vid_fakeOsamaVideo.shtml

It's a fucken fake and a lie.

Just as the 20 'terrorists' of the initial hijackers list were not even on the plane and were found later alive and clueless around the world, their passports were stolen.

Just as a bunch of PASSPORTS were found in the RUBBLE of WTC buildings, when human bodies couldn't! Like holy crap!

Just as WEAPONS OF MASSSSSSS DESTRUCTION was a big fucken lie fed to everyone

Just as Iraq was blamed for 911 after the wmd lie ailed (biggest LOL of all)

Just as Saddam was made out this big bad evil man when ironically he used to be a CIA asset in the past but used and backstabbed (lol too)

And the list goes on... you do the math.

You are pointlessly waging wars and creating more wars and chaos in the world. Basically CREATING problems and conflicts and then offering oneself as the solution and peace loving problem solver. Yeah.. instigate and entice a few countries make them react want to defend themselves and then go see see THEY ARE SO violent... then pre-emptively 'defend' yourself ahem attack whoever you want.

Bombing/attacking iran, and probably pakistan as obama is already fired up about, the future is bright.... so bright it'll blow up.

Sad man... sad. You're not fighting for justice or morality or anything, you're just deluding yourself, and you're definetely not defending your country you're making more people who will HATE you, not love you or respect you. The US has lost every shrink of respect left. The only ones who respect the US are the ones traitourously working for the US as spies, puppets, etc... in foreign countries.

[raz0rbladez909]

:keke: Man it seems like all you can do is provide this propaganda bullshit that we've all seen over and over and over again, let me ask you this, have you ever been fired upon, put in harms way, or even been in the Persian Gulf? What now you think Saddam was a good guy in some way? Yeah I'm sure you think so a guy that kills 5,000 innocent civilians in the town of Halabja with mustard gas and nerve agents and seriously maims or injures up to 10,000 more yeah put that guy on a pedestal. Do you have any clue how chemical or nerve agents work on your body? Yet again I'm sure you don't because you're a liberal, a fucking pansy who speaks not on actual knowledge but on these little bullshit internet websites that teach him his sudden knowledge. But to you hes probably "Not as bad as the Americans." Right, thanks again for the entertainment, keepin me laughing the entire time bitch, what is it that you do for a living anyways?

[canuckster240]

Quite frankly the US has killed more civilians than the CIA asset Sadam ever could have. Don't forget those magical chemical weapons were zipped in from the US of A, helped and made possible. And of course the intel on attacking iran and kuwait was supplied and approved of by none other than the US.

[raz0rbladez909]

dude they found him right under our noses, who would've thought, oh yeah about your Daniel Anderson dude, if you are actually dumb enough to take what an E-1 deserter in the Army says seriously....then wow just wow, preach on man preach on I'm just glad you have so much first hand knowledge to share with us.:keke: :keke: :keke:
http://www.thepeoplescube.com/images/Obama_Osama_Yeswecan.jpg

[raz0rbladez909]

Quite frankly the US has killed more civilians than the CIA asset Sadam ever could have. Don't forget those magical chemical weapons were zipped in from the US of A, helped and made possible. And of course the intel on attacking iran and kuwait was supplied and approved of by none other than the US.

WRONG those chemical weapons were bought off of companies in West Germany, and not to mention you seem to have no knowledge of Saddams history, just shit talking about America, what about all of the mass genocide in the country, fuck you make this dude out to be a saint when he was more along the lines of Hitler, who is probably another idol of yours

[canuckster240]

http://masbury.files.wordpress.com/2007/03/rumsfeld-saddam.jpg

mmhmm

It's like who is naive? History just keeps repeating itself. Nothing has really changed in the last 30 or so years with US foreign policy. Especially since reagen. The same players, same families are in american politics in the game.

The reason the US installed Sadam into power was that the US was afraid of 'islamization' of Iraq, and of course Iran. So they used him and put him into power and the butt i mean bath party lol. He was considered a 'modern', moderate and secular fellow. That's exactly what he was, far away from Islam. He then set on his own goals, nationalized oil to his own pocket disagreeing with ex-colonial oil companies, didn't go too well though, and soon afterwards after 'expiring' with usefulness, the US plot used him, abused him, and backstabbed as expected. The US killed two birds with one stone, iran and iraq.

Seems to be just history repeating itslef.

I imagine the same shit would happen with karzai if many years down the line he pulled of similar stunts. Karzai is another example of a US trained and supplied asset (puppet) placed in power. Nothing new here.

[sillyvia13]

:keke: Man it seems like all you can do is provide this propaganda bullshit that we've all seen over and over and over again, let me ask you this, have you ever been fired upon, put in harms way, or even been in the Persian Gulf? What now you think Saddam was a good guy in some way? Yeah I'm sure you think so a guy that kills 5,000 innocent civilians in the town of Halabja with mustard gas and nerve agents and seriously maims or injures up to 10,000 more yeah put that guy on a pedestal. Do you have any clue how chemical or nerve agents work on your body? Yet again I'm sure you don't because you're a liberal, a fucking pansy who speaks not on actual knowledge but on these little bullshit internet websites that teach him his sudden knowledge. But to you hes probably "Not as bad as the Americans." Right, thanks again for the entertainment, keepin me laughing the entire time bitch, what is it that you do for a living anyways?


Whoa...relax guys.
friends here ...REMEMBER.
some info on chemical warfare.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium#Health_considerations
What we have been using on Iraq for a long long time...
not only are they having issues with it...
Our Vets have been affected too. it was put in the bullets to be more powerful, very dense metal, I think I read 60% more dense than lead.
Every bullet fired is a toxic mess of death.

I am sure on 1 thing... I Think...
We are all unhappy with the way things are run.
You and I need to make change...Our kids are not even being taught anything anymore. Well thay can skate ramps real good, and do sweet bunny hops... I seen a group of kids in the grocery store today (19-20ish)
getting ready for the beach...they acted like 6 year olds running in store saying I can feel the fizzy in my belly, it's close...(looking for soda) THIS IS OUR FUTURE!? lol...
I am in fear. Truley.
This whole thing stinks...good ole US of A. F'd in the A.
But we have 2 great people running for pres.
a thugged out gangsta...and a radio controlled mccain, I got $5000 says he is dead. white as a ghost and he shakes and studddders, cant answer questions...but he's cool. he wife likes cars.
:stupid: :jerkit: :bs: :down: :x: :rant2: :spank: :wtf: :fawk: :drama:
thats about sums it up.
End Rant.

FIAT MONEY! google it.

[warpd]

All I have to say is I hope that one day some of you will grow up and understand the sacrifice that those in the military have made in the past as well as the present. You bitch about the U.S. like it's some far away evil empire, like fucking Mordor or something, and don't even realize that everything you have, everything you have around you is because you are an American. You have no national pride, its just sad and it will probably be the downfall of this country. It reminds me of yuppie upper class white guilt liberals who bitch about how the U.S. stole land from Indians but don't even realize the life they live, their shopping malls their hybrid cars, their iPhones, their soy mocha latte frappachinos, and fucking myspace are a direct result of those events. If you hate the U.S so much give all the land, education and everything else you benefited from as an American back and go JDM dorift your car in fucking France where gas is $8 gallon instead of $4 and you couldn't even afford a license. Love it or leave it.

[canuckster240]

^Hello NAZI party. Sounds like history repeating itself.

You realize this symbol:

http://www.numismaticnews.net/flipside/content/binary/cm1916b.jpg

represents fascism and is what the US is, very similar to NAZI germany. Homeland security, spying, ultra nationalism/patriotism, military pre-emptive strikes, accusation of a minority as some super evil (today muslims, before russians and before that jews).

You'll find it all over, subliminally right in front of you:

http://tunisia.usembassy.gov/uploads/images/KKlJsjABnpKLqouIlyGTRw/HBB7.JPG


http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/mattqatsi/Fascism_Motivational.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8qPXK8RKDI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OSuWCIYi7T4

[warpd]

Your a fucking idiot. That symbol is a Roman symbol of authority and unity. Much like most of the symbols in our government were based on Greco-Roman culture, decor, and architecture that were popular at the time the country was created. Jesus you have a conspiracy theory for everything.

Yea we are just like the Nazi's who committed systematic genocide of millions of people.:mrmeph:

It's not like thousands of American and CANADIAN troops paid the ultimate sacrifice to stop them or anything. Every American on here should be pissed at this douchenozzle.

http://osiris.blog.lemonde.fr/files/2007/05/american-cemetery-007.1178086517.jpg

[F]ar from being the Great Satan, I would say that we are the Great Protector. We have sent men and women from the armed forces of the United States to other parts of the world throughout the past century to put down oppression. We defeated Fascism. We defeated Communism. We saved Europe in World War I and World War II. We were willing to do it, glad to do it. We went to Korea. We went to Vietnam. All in the interest of preserving the rights of people. And when all those conflicts were over, what did we do? Did we stay and conquer? Did we say, "Okay, we defeated Germany. Now Germany belongs to us? We defeated Japan, so Japan belongs to us"? No. What did we do? We built them up. We gave them democratic systems which they have embraced totally to their soul. And did we ask for any land? No, the only land we ever asked for was enough land to bury our dead. And that is the kind of nation we are.-Colin Powell

[canuckster240]

^http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism) <- Learn to read, cause "fuck you" is ignorant, I don't want to be fucked by you, I'm not gay, I'm actually quite conservative.

Just facts actually. While on the other hand most of the other posts were emotional diahera vs anything critical of the US, it's military, it's foreign policy, it's government, history and current state. Might as well go and state something stupid like "we americans are gonna invade/bomb/rule canada too" I love Canada, you will never take us alive lol. Even though traitors are working very hard at selling Canada to the US blah.

Vive la France hahaha. Whatever happened to freedom fries and hating the French, suddenly Sarkozy made the US love France again.

Sigh, in the words of George dubya, "either you're with us or the terrorists." Sad world man.

[PhilthyS13]

^http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism) <- Learn to read, cause "fuck you" is ignorant, I don't want to be fucked by you, I'm not gay, I'm actually quite conservative.

Just facts actually. While on the other hand most of the other posts were emotional diahera vs anything critical of the US, it's military, it's foreign policy, it's government, history and current state. Might as well go and state something stupid like "we americans are gonna invade/bomb/rule canada too" I love Canada, you will never take us alive lol. Even though traitors are working very hard at selling Canada to the US blah.

Vive la France hahaha. Whatever happened to freedom fries and hating the French, suddenly Sarkozy made the US love France again.

Sigh, in the words of George dubya, "either you're with us or the terrorists." Sad world man.

Anyone who cites Wikipedia in a serious conversation is a moron. ANYONE can go on there and change what it says. Please, please, please: if you are in school, avoid an F and don't cite Wikipedia as an authority on anything.

That being said, it's no wonder you think that the US and National Socialism have anything in common simply based upon our foreign policy (which Canada supports by sending troops to fight the war on terror). National Socialism's primary goal was anti-semitism. How on earth is our government's foreign policy anti-semitic if we are the biggest supporter of Israel? In many cases, our support of Israel is why many Islamic governments/ngos fight us. Fuck the oil - groups like Al Queda are waging terror against the west because of our support for Israel and the Coalition presence in Saudi Arabia in Desert Storm.

And as far as your statement: "Homeland security, spying, ultra nationalism/patriotism, military pre-emptive strikes, accusation of a minority as some super evil (today muslims, before russians and before that jews)."

WTF are you babbling about? Again with the Jews! When was it the policy of the US government to demonize Jews? It also wasn't Russians - it was the Soviets, who are not necessarily Russian - Stalin was from Georgia. The Soviets were no angels themselves [I suggest reading The Commissar Vanishes by David King - don't worry, it's a picture book]. If you knew what you were talking about, you would have said Native Americans, because our government did have some pretty screwed up policies towards them in the past. But so did Canada and Australia. [Funny - all former English colonies]

ANYWAY, most people aren't happy about stuff like wiretaps, domestic spying, etc., but it's no different than the Cold War. Things go in waves between more freedoms and less, just like the government goes from left to right, Clinton to Bush, etc. We can't all be leftists. Or rightists. That's how democracy works.

I don't know what problem you have with the US, but why do you have to go on an American Forum and US bash? If it's such an issue for you, stick to Canadian forums. I'm tired of your jingoism.

Opinions are like assholes; everyone's got one. And yours stinks.

[canuckster240]

I think you are uneducated, go pick a fucken book up and read up on what fascism is, that wiki is just for your internet education right here right now as most of you are clueless as to what fascism even is, clearly, thinking its only nazi germany. Fascism has nothing to do with jews specifically, but, with fascism there is always someone to undermine. Obviously you have no clue what your emotional patriotic rumbling is leading you on about.

[cgtdream]

Canuckster you really are one weird piece of work. You can take those tin foil hat theories and shove em' up your arse....

What kind of a person are you, to sit down and talk noise about the military. Reason why ppl say "dont blame the soldiers, blame the commander in charge", is of course we joined knowing full and well that we could be sent to fight wars. Fuk ppl up, cause damage, and blow things up. But what we didnt realize was that the intentions of those above us, would lead us to do things that are apart from what we belive in, or who we really are. We joined under the premise of protecting our nation, and while you sit in your comfy ass chair, typing your nice little rants of how evil military members are, you need to realize that america needs ppl to protect it. And thats what we do...or at least what we thought we would be "USED" for. There are some vile ppl in this world who would like nothing more than to strike at america like nobodies business...and guess what, if we didnt have a military, if we were all like you, we would be done for, along time ago...

If our president wants to incite wars, ignore the public outcries to send the troops home, thats not our fault....if we protect each other in a country where everybody is seemingly out to kill us, because we were sent there by that president that seemingly wants to incite wars, then you best belive that its either us or them....

None of use wants to be shot at...none of us wants to be away from our families, in a place where the majority hates us....finds some excuse to belittle us.....but we do it, or we JOINED, because we thought it was the right thing to do...we wanted to contribute to our country even if it was to go to school, or just to get that money....we are doing something for something that fags like you are too scared to do....are too unwilling to do...ppl like you....

Now am i bashing the troops. NO...they are doing what they think is right..Am i bashing the president...I want to and its even easier to do, but its even deeper than that....

WHO DO I BLAME>>>>the freakin ignorant, and arrogant AMERICANS, who dont understand that crap...you whine and complain at the wrong ppl, backed with your FACTS, and books, yet when it comes down to the real deal, ya know, enforcing your rights as a citizen and doing something as a member of our country, something producitve, you come up short...what can you say you have done for america lately besides bash our troops....wrote your congressman? raise money for a cause? chit help the victims of katrina???? WHAT THE HELL HAVE YOU DONE???

Before you dare talk chit about the american military, like you are some foreigner who had his house ran over or kids killed by the american military, shut the fuk up, and do somehting to help out america....

Btw mods if this post is offensive then feel free to delete it.....just got too worked up......end :rant:

[Antihero983]

my .02 on the oil bit.

people bitch about gas prices and say we need alternative fuel (and i agree) but what about the oil we use to put INTO our cars? every 3K (well most of us) change the oil in our cars. thats a shit ton of oil used per year on that end. why not work on something to lubricate the engine other than oil?

and im done. ok back to the pissing match.

[Omarius Maximus]

Canuckster you really are one weird piece of work. You can take those tin foil hat theories and shove em' up your arse....

What kind of a person are you, to sit down and talk noise about the military. Reason why ppl say "dont blame the soldiers, blame the commander in charge", is of course we joined knowing full and well that we could be sent to fight wars. Fuk ppl up, cause damage, and blow things up. But what we didnt realize was that the intentions of those above us, would lead us to do things that are apart from what we belive in, or who we really are. We joined under the premise of protecting our nation, and while you sit in your comfy ass chair, typing your nice little rants of how evil military members are, you need to realize that america needs ppl to protect it. And thats what we do...or at least what we thought we would be "USED" for. There are some vile ppl in this world who would like nothing more than to strike at america like nobodies business...and guess what, if we didnt have a military, if we were all like you, we would be done for, along time ago...

If our president wants to incite wars, ignore the public outcries to send the troops home, thats not our fault....if we protect each other in a country where everybody is seemingly out to kill us, because we were sent there by that president that seemingly wants to incite wars, then you best belive that its either us or them....

None of use wants to be shot at...none of us wants to be away from our families, in a place where the majority hates us....finds some excuse to belittle us.....but we do it, or we JOINED, because we thought it was the right thing to do...we wanted to contribute to our country even if it was to go to school, or just to get that money....we are doing something for something that fags like you are too scared to do....are too unwilling to do...ppl like you....

Now am i bashing the troops. NO...they are doing what they think is right..Am i bashing the president...I want to and its even easier to do, but its even deeper than that....

WHO DO I BLAME>>>>the freakin ignorant, and arrogant AMERICANS, who dont understand that crap...you whine and complain at the wrong ppl, backed with your FACTS, and books, yet when it comes down to the real deal, ya know, enforcing your rights as a citizen and doing something as a member of our country, something producitve, you come up short...what can you say you have done for america lately besides bash our troops....wrote your congressman? raise money for a cause? chit help the victims of katrina???? WHAT THE HELL HAVE YOU DONE???

Before you dare talk chit about the american military, like you are some foreigner who had his house ran over or kids killed by the american military, shut the fuk up, and do somehting to help out america....

Btw mods if this post is offensive then feel free to delete it.....just got too worked up......end :rant:

His name is Canuckster for a reason, genius. He couldn't care less about us murricans.

What's the civilian death toll in Iraq now? I'm pretty sure at this point, we're making Saddam look like a saint.

[stiizy]

my .02 on the oil bit.

people bitch about gas prices and say we need alternative fuel (and i agree) but what about the oil we use to put INTO our cars? every 3K (well most of us) change the oil in our cars. thats a shit ton of oil used per year on that end. why not work on something to lubricate the engine other than oil?

and im done. ok back to the pissing match.


Agreed we should make Vaseline lube engines mixed with a lil bit of KY haah:keke::keke::keke:

But seriously Red has a good point

[Antihero983]

I think we all just need to relax. Iran has missiles. So what? We do too.

Why can we have them but others can't?

[sillyvia13]

His name is Canuckster for a reason, genius. He couldn't care less about us murricans.

What's the civilian death toll in Iraq now? I'm pretty sure at this point, we're making Saddam look like a saint.

your not even kidding...
and Canuckster...you may live in Canada...but we are all Fucked the same...
spp.gov North America is a business bro. your a slave to a business, JUST LIKE ME!
:rawk:

[canuckster240]

Yeah but I don't wana be a slave lol. I don't want my voice silenced either and I don't want to be a sheep lemming like everyone else... just because the tube and mr president said something.

All this continuing fluff talks about how America is free, and how this is a 'battle for freedom' blabla is all just luff and in fact quite the opposite. We are moving towards less freedoms, less happiness, more chaos, more destruction, more hate, more problems.

And the fact that creating problems to begin with and then offering solutions is very... how should I say... not good.

[canuckster240]

Canuckster you really are one weird piece of work. You can take those tin foil hat theories and shove em' up your arse....

What kind of a person are you, to sit down and talk noise about the military. Reason why ppl say "dont blame the soldiers, blame the commander in charge", is of course we joined knowing full and well that we could be sent to fight wars. Fuk ppl up, cause damage, and blow things up. But what we didnt realize was that the intentions of those above us, would lead us to do things that are apart from what we belive in, or who we really are. We joined under the premise of protecting our nation, and while you sit in your comfy ass chair, typing your nice little rants of how evil military members are, you need to realize that america needs ppl to protect it. And thats what we do...or at least what we thought we would be "USED" for. There are some vile ppl in this world who would like nothing more than to strike at america like nobodies business...and guess what, if we didnt have a military, if we were all like you, we would be done for, along time ago...

If our president wants to incite wars, ignore the public outcries to send the troops home, thats not our fault....if we protect each other in a country where everybody is seemingly out to kill us, because we were sent there by that president that seemingly wants to incite wars, then you best belive that its either us or them....

None of use wants to be shot at...none of us wants to be away from our families, in a place where the majority hates us....finds some excuse to belittle us.....but we do it, or we JOINED, because we thought it was the right thing to do...we wanted to contribute to our country even if it was to go to school, or just to get that money....we are doing something for something that fags like you are too scared to do....are too unwilling to do...ppl like you....

Now am i bashing the troops. NO...they are doing what they think is right..Am i bashing the president...I want to and its even easier to do, but its even deeper than that....

WHO DO I BLAME>>>>the freakin ignorant, and arrogant AMERICANS, who dont understand that crap...you whine and complain at the wrong ppl, backed with your FACTS, and books, yet when it comes down to the real deal, ya know, enforcing your rights as a citizen and doing something as a member of our country, something producitve, you come up short...what can you say you have done for america lately besides bash our troops....wrote your congressman? raise money for a cause? chit help the victims of katrina???? WHAT THE HELL HAVE YOU DONE???

Before you dare talk chit about the american military, like you are some foreigner who had his house ran over or kids killed by the american military, shut the fuk up, and do somehting to help out america....

Btw mods if this post is offensive then feel free to delete it.....just got too worked up......end :rant:


So what's your logic then? I you are told and proven that the actions you are doing are doing more damage to YOURSELF and your country and you know you are lied to, deceived. Why not revolt at your 'commanders'.

Isn't it somewhere in the american constitution that people should rise up and revolt in case of a corrupt government? Something along those lines?

You are destroying your own country by your own hands, creating hatred and enemies because of the destruction you are causing and your own country's greed.

Simple arithmetic, be good to people, they'll be good to you, be bad to people, they'll be bad to you. That's the reason people have beef with the US. Not all Americans are bad duh, that's very stupid to say, naive yes, but not bad.

Pretty much everything you were told to fight for was a set of big huge fat lies, followed by more lies, fueled by more lies and supplemented by more continuing lies. So you're not fighting for yourself or 'your country', you're just being foolish having tainted hands with blood of others, making people hate you for what you are doing to their home lands, to their cultures, their people, and so on.

[ThatGuy]

Hey canuckster240, I mean a_ahmed, errrrr...

Oops, did I let the cat out of the bag?

No one wanted to hear your conspiracy BS under your old screen name, so you got pissed off and disrespected people in their Reps.

Now, not only does no one want to listen to your new screen name, but you've violated the terms of Zilvia by even creating it.

First and foremost, Zilvia is a Car Community. If you want to discuss politics or your outlook on America, you're going to have to do it elsewhere, because I'm permanately Banning both your screen names now.

For those that are left, I suggest conducting yourselves in a mature, reasonable manner. Remember, this is a car forum, where we are kind enough to allow you to discuss topics not relating to the Nissan S and Z Chassis. We can revoke that privelage if it becomes a problem to monitor.

[sillyvia13]

ouch.
f'd in the a

[raz0rbladez909]

For those that are left, I suggest conducting yourselves in a mature, reasonable manner. Remember, this is a car forum, where we are kind enough to allow you to discuss topics not relating to the Nissan S and Z Chassis. We can revoke that privelage if it becomes a problem to monitor.

Thanks, ThatGuy I tried not to get riled up by the dude, but I can't stand when people talk down upon our country or our military.

[downshift_sideways]

Undercover Ninja Barry! w00t! :bow:

[mRclARK1]

Hey canuckster240, I mean a_ahmed, errrrr...

Oops, did I let the cat out of the bag?

No one wanted to hear your conspiracy BS under your old screen name, so you got pissed off and disrespected people in their Reps.

Now, not only does no one want to listen to your new screen name, but you've violated the terms of Zilvia by even creating it.

First and foremost, Zilvia is a Car Community. If you want to discuss politics or your outlook on America, you're going to have to do it elsewhere, because I'm permanately Banning both your screen names now.

For those that are left, I suggest conducting yourselves in a mature, reasonable manner. Remember, this is a car forum, where we are kind enough to allow you to discuss topics not relating to the Nissan S and Z Chassis. We can revoke that privelage if it becomes a problem to monitor.

I had a suspicion...

The sad thing is, a decent amount of people in Canada buy into all that bullshit. I deal with anti-American shit all the time... :-/

[PhilthyS13]

I think you are uneducated, go pick a fucken book up and read up on what fascism is, that wiki is just for your internet education right here right now as most of you are clueless as to what fascism even is, clearly, thinking its only nazi germany. Fascism has nothing to do with jews specifically, but, with fascism there is always someone to undermine. Obviously you have no clue what your emotional patriotic rumbling is leading you on about.


Whew, I am so glad this guy is gone. Otherwise, I'd have to get into the differences between fascism, communism, socialism, Italian fascism, Francoism, Stalinism, and National Socialism/Nationalsozialist (subjects which I have read many books about) - and that would just put everyone to sleep.

Pity, because it would have been great to actually use my history degree for once...

[ThatGuy]

If it means that much to you, send him an email.

[mRclARK1]

I'll just say it's a good thing me and him are on opposite sides of the country. lolz

jk.

[beeracing s14]

cant we just all get along? lets get some iranian singles here. damn! i keep seeing this Ad.. lets us all give it a try. haha

[Icy13]

^^ You have to admire the ironic humor of automatic ad services.

I think the best summary of this forum could be that Bush is gone in 6 months (remember, lame duck period people). After that, for better or for worse, people will hopefully have a different outlook on this country. Deserved or not, Bush cannot do anything right and there is no way any act of contrition can be preformed or accepted. There is a truly tragic story that can be told here, if you want to be generous (and who is to say that Bush doesn't deserve generosity) of a man caught up in the times, incorrect information, and obsessive advisers. Sadly, even with them gone (Rumsfeld is gone, people, and many sources hold him to be responsible for the shit America faces now) Bush's name is associated with the situation and all that is evil in this country.

While I am usually quite proud to maintain that I hated Bush before it was popular (and I am a Texan), I feel that such a simple statement is truely too brief to encompass the situation. I, and many others domestically and internationally, laugh at the many blunders of president Bush, but he is the President of the united states and he is not a fool.

I am not really sure how this post will paint me in terms of political leaning, but given the rising popularity of Bush bashing, I have found it neccessary to reevaluate my rhetoric on the matter. Does anyone else remember when making fun of Bush was only for 'commies and queers'? As inaccurate as that statement was at that time so to is the blame we place on him now. This is not to try to appologize for the man, but simply to point out that blanket statments like "911 was a conspiracy" or "we in the military are doing more than you can do sitting on your asses in comfy chairs" are EQUALLY pointless. You are calling each other names and that simply isnt going to convince anyone (although I understand that wasnt really the point)

I had several posts I wanted to respond to in this thread, but I feel that keeping it simple will be best:

Never quote FOX news as support. No one regards FOX as anything but a textbook case of bias (it actually appears in high school government books as such)

Neither China nor Russia in any way exemplify socialized business. This comes down to a basic, and I will admit, confusing mixture of terms arising from late 19th and early 20th century political thought as to how to solve what is called the "social question." The "social question" can be described by comparing the absolute existance of material wealth and resources in the world with the level of injustice and inequality. I am not attempting to suggest a solution to this problem, but merely to point out that it is the basis of ALL political debate and thought since the industrial revolution made it truely possible to create enough material wealth (food for example) to satisfy the needs of every person in the world. Now, it is not at all as simple as saying just feed everyone, that needs to be clear, but it also needs to be clear that the question is a valid one as to why people still starve in a world where we do, technically, have much more food than we need to satiate every person alive every day sustainably. Alright, can of worms from here on out, but if you want more information I would love to suggest books or topics on the matter (guess what I am studying in school :) )

Philthys13 I would be very interested to hear your breakdown on those topics (seriously, I love hearing other peoples opinions on these matters especially from other points of view (vis. History major)). However, either we start our own thread or pm me and we can talk on aim or something because this thread is so far from the topic of Iranian missles it really has gone from funny, to not funny, back full circle to shere hillarity.

Alright, the quick response box is beyond full by now, so I will finish there.

Oh, quick p.s. If someone wants to look into what "socializing" a business means read about the Scandanavian states or Germany (sort of, it's actually a different category of system in scholorly thought but it will provide some scope). Keywords: Social Democracy and Christian Democracy

Oh, and I appologize if there is bad spelling. I think spell check is on the fritz :(

[beeracing s14]

anyone else want to put their closing arguments?

[racepar1]

Thanks, ThatGuy I tried not to get riled up by the dude, but I can't stand when people talk down upon our country or our military.

Our country is effed up and if we all realize it we can make it better! Our political system is a fucking joke! It was designed to work 200 years ago when the majority of the population was un-educated! I mean electoral votes! Gimme a fucking break! If the popular vote won elections then we would have never had president douche, errr..... I mean bush, in office and our gas prices would be $2.00/gallon less. Let's all get off the high horse and admit that we have some problems!

[cotbu]

Our country is effed up and if we all realize it we can make it better! Our political system is a fucking joke! It was designed to work 200 years ago when the majority of the population was un-educated! I mean electoral votes! Gimme a fucking break! If the popular vote won elections then we would have never had president douche, errr..... I mean bush, in office and our gas prices would be $2.00/gallon less. Let's all get off the high horse and admit that we have some problems!
I was thinking the exact same thing just a few post up, that's f'ing awsome!!

[flip3d]

Lol.. I wanna throw my 2 cents in too.


This war is just Cheney showing off his power. End.


If he doesn't go to jail after this term, theres something seriously wrong with our society.

[warpd]

Our country is effed up and if we all realize it we can make it better! Our political system is a fucking joke! It was designed to work 200 years ago when the majority of the population was un-educated! I mean electoral votes! Gimme a fucking break! If the popular vote won elections then we would have never had president douche, errr..... I mean bush, in office and our gas prices would be $2.00/gallon less. Let's all get off the high horse and admit that we have some problems!

I got news for you the majority of our population is still uneducated. Most people don't vote anyways.

[beeracing s14]

I think our present govt. officials will face war crimes like the nazis after the war.

[Tenchuu]

there is one aspect that most people overlook. after large wars the economy picks up, also the US is in process of tearing itself apart and the one way to untie people is with a common enemy. (think al gore and the global warming swindle)

basically although it would cost us millions and millions of human life, the US could benefit from another huge war.

I realize that some won't agree, and i am not encouraging this by any means, but i am sure someone has though of this before.

[rubelcon]

This war is just Cheney showing off his power. End.


If he doesn't go to jail after this term, theres something seriously wrong with our society.

Absofrigginlutely.

[fliprayzin240sx]

I got news for you the majority of our population is still uneducated. Most people don't vote anyways.

Its not really because alot of us are uneducated, just alot more dont give a flying fuck. As long as they got a job, shelter, afford to buy what they need...like Alfred E Neuman said:

http://blog.kir.com/archives/images/alfred_e_neuman.jpg

Also, alot of people stopped voting because they got too comfortable. Comfortable with how things are/were. Now, its getting to the point that people do want to vote cuz of how fucked up some things are, but alot of people are getting into a different mentality. Mentality that i wont fucking matter what they say...

[!Zar!]

Damn, missles will straight fuck negus up.

I'm glad Barack Obama is going to be my main negus.

Bill Clinton is my old negus.

[lflkajfj12123]

Bill Clinton is so smoooooth

http://nixonisinhell.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/billclintonpresident.jpg

[Koopa Troopa]

basically although it would cost us millions and millions of human life, the US could benefit from another huge war.

Us as in US/ coalition forces or them? Did you just type the first number that came to your mind? How poorly trained and equipped do you think our country is?

[warpd]

Its not really because alot of us are uneducated, just alot more dont give a flying fuck. As long as they got a job, shelter, afford to buy what they need...like Alfred E Neuman said:

http://blog.kir.com/archives/images/alfred_e_neuman.jpg

Also, alot of people stopped voting because they got too comfortable. Comfortable with how things are/were. Now, its getting to the point that people do want to vote cuz of how fucked up some things are, but alot of people are getting into a different mentality. Mentality that i wont fucking matter what they say...

I disagree the majority of people in the U.S. are not that intelligent, especially when it comes to matters pertaining to their government. Which is sad because our type of government relies heavily on voters being informed about the issues and the candidates. People in this country vote for candidates like its a high school popularity contest. They may know how to work their iPOD, know their way around Myspace, and be able to play on expert in Guitar Hero but that does not make them intelligent, it makes them tech savvy. Just watch Jay Leno do street interviews he asks people simple things like who is the Speaker of the House, Vice President, Sec. Def etc. and they are dumbfounded. These are also the same people who have the loudest opinions but they basically talk out of their ass, similar to alot of people who post on here.

[warpd]

I think our present govt. officials will face war crimes like the nazis after the war.

Riiight...:loco:

[SlideWell]

im half white, half iranian.
what i have to say is....
what can you expect. god help us.

[SR240DET]

I always like to throw this in there; do any of you know that the constitution doesn’t mention democracy? Why is that? Can anybody answer? If you look up the difference between a Democracy and a Republic, then you will see why. Actually, I will go ahead and look it up for you.

Republic vs. Democracy
Rule by Law vs. Rule by Majority
Just after the completion and signing of the Constitution, in reply to a woman's inquiry as to the type of government the Founders had created, Benjamin Franklin said, "A Republic, if you can keep it."
Not only have we failed to keep it, most don't even know what it is.
A Republic is representative government ruled by law (the Constitution). A democracy is direct government ruled by the majority (mob rule). A Republic recognizes the inalienable rights of individuals while democracies are only concerned with group wants or needs (the public good).
Lawmaking is a slow, deliberate process in our Constitutional Republic requiring approval from the three banches of government, the Supreme Court and individual jurors (jury-nullification). Lawmaking in our unlawful democracy occurs rapidly requiring approval from the whim of the majority as determined by polls and/or voter referendums. A good example of democracy in action is a lynch mob. A more recent example was the failure of the US Senate to uphold their oath "to do impartial justice" and remove bill clinton from office. Those Senators should be removed themselves, for failure to uphold their oath and for aiding and abetting a known criminal.
Democracies always self-destruct when the non-productive majority realizes that it can vote itself handouts from the productive minority by electing the candidate promising the most benefits from the public treasury. To maintain their power, these candidates must adopt an ever-increasing tax and spend policy to satisfy the ever-increasing desires of the majority. As taxes increase, incentive to produce decreases, causing many of the once productive to drop out and join the non-productive. When there are no longer enough producers to fund the legitimate functions of government and the socialist programs, the democracy will collapse, always to be followed by a Dictatorship.
Even though nearly every politician, teacher, journalist and citizen believes that our Founders created a democracy, it is absolutely not true. The Founders knew full well the differences between a Republic and a Democracy and they repeatedly and emphatically said that they had founded a republic.
Article IV Section 4, of the Constitution "guarantees to every state in this union a Republican form of government".... Conversely, the word Democracy is not mentioned even once in the Constitution. Madison warned us of the dangers of democracies with these words,
"Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths...",
"We may define a republic to be ... a government which derives all its powers directly or indirectly from the great body of the people, and is administered by persons holding their offices during pleasure for a limited period, or during good behavior. It is essential to such a government that it be derived from the great body of the society, not from an inconsiderable proportion or a favored class of it; otherwise a handful of tyrannical nobles, exercising their oppressions by a delegation of their powers, might aspire to the rank of republicans and claim for their government the honorable title of republic." James Madison, Federalist No. 10, (1787)
"A wise man will not leave the right to the mercy of chance, nor wish it to prevail through the power of the majority. There is but little virtue in the action of masses of men." Henry David Thoreau (1817-1862)
Our military training manuals used to contain the correct definitions of Democracy and Republic. The following comes from Training Manual No. 2000-25 published by the War Department, November 30, 1928.
DEMOCRACY:
· A government of the masses.
· Authority derived through mass meeting or any other form of "direct" expression.
· Results in mobocracy.
· Attitude toward property is communistic--negating property rights.
· Attitude toward law is that the will of the majority shall regulate, whether is be based upon deliberation or governed by passion, prejudice, and impulse, without restraint or regard to consequences.
· Results in demogogism, license, agitation, discontent, anarchy.
REPUBLIC:
· Authority is derived through the election by the people of public officials best fitted to represent them.
· Attitude toward law is the administration of justice in accord with fixed principles and established evidence, with a strict regard to consequences.
· A greater number of citizens and extent of territory may be brought within its compass.
· Avoids the dangerous extreme of either tyranny or mobocracy.
· Results in statesmanship, liberty, reason, justice, contentment, and progress.
· Is the "standard form" of government throughout the world.
The manuals containing these definitions were ordered destroyed without explanation about the same time that President Franklin D. Roosevelt made private ownership of our lawful money (US Minted Gold Coins) illegal. Shortly after the people turned in their $20 gold coins, the price was increased from $20 per ounce to $35 per ounce. Almost overnight F.D.R., the most popular president this century (elected 4 times) looted almost half of this nation's wealth, while convincing the people that it was for their own good. Many of F.D.R.'s policies were suggested by his right hand man, Harry Hopkins, who said,
"Tax and Tax, Spend and Spend, Elect and Elect, because the people are too damn dumb to know the difference".


if this is true then, why are the politicians preaching democracy? I don’t want any of that.

Ancient Rome is a good way to tell the future of America, cause you know, history repeats itself. Did you know Ancient Rome rise as a Republic, and fell as a Democracy.

Learn the difference between Democracy and Republic! They are not the same nor are they similar.

[warpd]

Unfortunately there is a whole generation of people (welfare class) who are learning to depend on the government to supply them with their needs. They are basically learning they can vote themselves more money by electing politicians who expand the federal government and its social programs. Certain politicians are only too happy to do so because by the people depending on the government in turn the government has more control over the lives of its citizens. It's like a father that pays for everything but don't piss him off because he can yank everything you own away at his whim. Its killing the ideals that formed the U.S., primarily self reliance and independence. Look at Katrina in LA you have thousands of people (again primarily lower class recipients of social programs like public housing, welfare etc.) asking why the Federal government didn't save them. Guess what the government is not your daddy and its not supposed to be. Meanwhile the whole midwest floods, farmers lose everything they have but you don't hear them bitching about the Federal government not saving their asses. As fickle as the American public is as soon as their is any type of direct representative/popular vote system put in place this country is fucked.

[Icy13]

^^^

Alright, time for a mighty handed statement, prepare yourselves:

Really, you have been warned, no bitching about it later:

So basically, warpd, you are saying that it is the poor's fault that they couldn't fucking look after themselves and they deserve the punishment they got (act of god, w/e) They need to get up off their lazy asses and get out from under their fathers shadow. Because blaming the losers/victims really worked out great in history, remember the Versailles treaty thing? No, not that one, the one at the end of WWI, the one generally regarded to have caused WWII? Yea that one.

But no, if those stupid germans had just got of their fat lazy asses and paid back the world for all the damage they caused in WWI, which was all their fault, then we would all have been alot better off. It doesnt really matter that the german economy did not produce enough wealth to approach the payments demanded by the allies nor does it matter that had they paid all the reparations they would have been paying till 1985. But oh well, those fucking lazy bastards.

Oh, and how about that depression? Those stupid bastards selling apples on the street, why dont they get a fucking job? go out and make themselves better. Everything was the government fault, fuck the government, it isnt like the fact that the government refusing to interact with the polity is a major contributing factor of the depression and everything.

Oh, and those damn Europeans, they have it so easy. They all live on the dole right? They get paid to be alive and daddy government takes care of everything. Ofcourse, the fact that the government is composed of those same people and indeed the system is much more open to popular influence has nothing to do with anything regarding the success of the swedish nation or anything. When was the last time Sweden was having an economic crisis or going to war with someone or being generally hated? But no, those fucking lazy bastards set up that daddy government system and now they are all being looked after by... someone... i mean it cant be a Swede, that would just make sense since it is the swedish govt, but no, they are all lazy bastards. Oh, and the fact that they dont have a dole but rather unemployment payments for people displaced by changes in industry or other uncontrolable factors, and again these payments only come while you are retraining for another profession...

but oh, now they are forcing people into professions they dont want, how monstorous! But wait, doesnt america do that too? But we do it by telling you you are stupid and poor and why the fuck did you let this happen? It's all your fault that corporate decided someone in south america could do the telemarking now... How could you not plan for that? Go fucking suck it up, you should have seen that fucking hurricane while you were working those three minimum wage jobs just to make ends meet. Get a fucking job, you damn underemployed bastards!

***************************

Applause for anyone who reads that to the end. Read is as a sarcastic rant written in stream of conciousness. Try to pick out what is sarcastic and what isnt, it shouldnt be that hard.

Enjoy!

[warpd]

^^^

Alright, time for a mighty handed statement, prepare yourselves:

Really, you have been warned, no bitching about it later:

So basically, warpd, you are saying that it is the poor's fault that they couldn't fucking look after themselves and they deserve the punishment they got (act of god, w/e) They need to get up off their lazy asses and get out from under their fathers shadow. Because blaming the losers/victims really worked out great in history, remember the Versailles treaty thing? No, not that one, the one at the end of WWI, the one generally regarded to have caused WWII? Yea that one.

But no, if those stupid germans had just got of their fat lazy asses and paid back the world for all the damage they caused in WWI, which was all their fault, then we would all have been alot better off. It doesnt really matter that the german economy did not produce enough wealth to approach the payments demanded by the allies nor does it matter that had they paid all the reparations they would have been paying till 1985. But oh well, those fucking lazy bastards.

Oh, and how about that depression? Those stupid bastards selling apples on the street, why dont they get a fucking job? go out and make themselves better. Everything was the government fault, fuck the government, it isnt like the fact that the government refusing to interact with the polity is a major contributing factor of the depression and everything.

Oh, and those damn Europeans, they have it so easy. They all live on the dole right? They get paid to be alive and daddy government takes care of everything. Ofcourse, the fact that the government is composed of those same people and indeed the system is much more open to popular influence has nothing to do with anything regarding the success of the swedish nation or anything. When was the last time Sweden was having an economic crisis or going to war with someone or being generally hated? But no, those fucking lazy bastards set up that daddy government system and now they are all being looked after by... someone... i mean it cant be a Swede, that would just make sense since it is the swedish govt, but no, they are all lazy bastards. Oh, and the fact that they dont have a dole but rather unemployment payments for people displaced by changes in industry or other uncontrolable factors, and again these payments only come while you are retraining for another profession...

but oh, now they are forcing people into professions they dont want, how monstorous! But wait, doesnt america do that too? But we do it by telling you you are stupid and poor and why the fuck did you let this happen? It's all your fault that corporate decided someone in south america could do the telemarking now... How could you not plan for that? Go fucking suck it up, you should have seen that fucking hurricane while you were working those three minimum wage jobs just to make ends meet. Get a fucking job, you damn underemployed bastards!

***************************

Applause for anyone who reads that to the end. Read is as a sarcastic rant written in stream of conciousness. Try to pick out what is sarcastic and what isnt, it shouldnt be that hard.

Enjoy!

Ok that was a little unintelligible but if I get the gist of what you are trying to say it sounds to me like you are a socialist. Thats fine and dandy if thats what you want out of your government, making your decisions for you and generally more control over your lives. However you have to understand that is contrary to everything our founding fathers believed and everything they fought for and the principles this country was founded on. Self reliance etc. I never said Katrina was the poor's fault, it was a natural disaster, shit happens.It was their reaction and ill handling of that disaster that I cast doubt on. That was the whole point of my previous post.